**MERGED** John Cena Thread - Heel Turn, Matches, Etc. (Keep it in here!!)

[wrestlingfan]

So what I can show you 1000 videos of how over Eugene was! CENA WAS MAGICALLY PUSHED TO THE TOP with a steady diet of shoved in your face. Cena is more well known BECAUSE he was pushed as a business decision. He's a product. My god you Cena fans just don't get it.

Yes he was pushed as a business decision. No guy gets pushed to the top if they're not over with the crowd, one way or another.

Eugene was a comedy character.

 

[Swarles Barkley]

Besides his match vs Rock last year when was the last time he lost clean in a one on one match?

And during Austin's run as top dog (let's say 1998-2002), how often did he lose clean? How often did Hogan lose clean during his run (1984-1993)? I can think of Hogan losing to Warrior at WrestleMania VI and Austin losing to Mankind at SummerSlam 1999 in the Triple Threat with Triple H. (I know Austin lost to Triple H at No Mercy in 1999, but I don't remember if he lost clean or not.)Also, Cena has lost to Punk how many times recently? And I'd say Cena lost clean to Punk at Money in the Bank and SummerSlam in 2011. But top guys just don't lose clean and Cena is the top guy, and not losing clean isn't anything new.

 

[Jaffa]

And I'd say Cena lost clean to Punk at Money in the Bank and SummerSlam in 2011. But top guys just don't lose clean and Cena is the top guy, and not losing clean isn't anything new.

Clotheslining a distracting Johnny Ace then walking into a GTS is not clean and neither is having your foot under the rope during a pin. Fact of the matter Cena losing clean is such a rare occasion I would say it doesn't even happen on a yearly basis.

 

[Kylewait89]

It is crazy because people say Cena holds all of these younger, "better" guys back. Yet he sold a loss to The Rock, what people wanted to see. He sold losses to The Miz, to Dolph, to CM Punk, yet he is holding other guys back.

Maybe I am taking crazy pills but it seems like he does well enough to put other guys over but some get hurt, some just don't pan out for the company. Pretty sure Cena definitely did his duty in laying down for Punk when Punk blew up. He is nothing but a professional about how he conducts business, and he gets rewarded for it, what is wrong with that?

 

[Kylewait89]

Clotheslining a distracting Johnny Ace then walking into a GTS is not clean and neither is having your foot under the rope during a pin. Fact of the matter Cena losing clean is such a rare occasion I would say it doesn't even happen on a yearly basis.

So first it is that he doesn't help other guys and when given information that he lost to this or that guy it is that he doesn't lose cleanly. He helps put guys over by laying down his entire 2012. His only big win was Lesnar. Give him a break.

 

[Kylewait89]

Also to show how out of touch the WWE is: They cannot book a heel at all. They treat the secondary belts as jokes. They have two guys who can talk and are decent in the ring with Wade and Antonio. But Antonio loses clean to Orton and then after Wade beats Orton he loses to Sheamus and they hardly make a dent in the Rumble. Wade was in for a bit....

One of those two could have been in at the end. It is almost as if the WWE is willing to mortgage its future just so Cena, Orton, Sheamus and the Ryback's of world keep winning. At this point I am almost wondering why the WWE even has heels.

I mean Wade or Antonio could feud with Cena later but instead get a win here and there but are treated as cannon fodder for the top guys.

Yeah because Ryback has been around forever right? How about CM Punk, is he a few years from being done? DZ? All of these guys do what they are supposed to and get rewarded for it. The Miz gets face time, Cesaro who might work, Wade Barrett will be in the WHC scene this year. Sheamus will probably get turned back to a heel this year as well as Orton not really having a side. Complain about other guys not doing the work necessary. Look at The Shield, they are being booked correctly right now. And did Wade not just lose to a new guy? You cannot complain about one guy not getting a shot when he is helping another get over.

 

[Jaffa]

So first it is that he doesn't help other guys and when given information that he lost to this or that guy it is that he doesn't lose cleanly. He helps put guys over by laying down his entire 2012. His only big win was Lesnar. Give him a break.

Mmm those words you put in my mouth are tasty my point was that he rarely loses clean I never said a dam word about him putting guys over but since you went there I do have a few thoughts. It is however only losing not putting a guy over when Cena dominates a match and only loses it at the end to a screwy finish. In my opinion the only person he actually put over was Lesnar and that was because he got his arse handed to him the whole match. I would not call it putting over someone when you lose because a small woman pushed you off a ladder. I would not call it putting someone over when the match finishes in a draw because of a bridging german suplex. I would not call it putting someone over in a WWE title match because The Big Show attacked you or The Shield attacking you or when Punk covers Big Show after you hit your finisher on him.

 

[dukes07]

Yeah because Ryback has been around forever right? How about CM Punk, is he a few years from being done? DZ? All of these guys do what they are supposed to and get rewarded for it. The Miz gets face time, Cesaro who might work, Wade Barrett will be in the WHC scene this year. Sheamus will probably get turned back to a heel this year as well as Orton not really having a side. Complain about other guys not doing the work necessary. Look at The Shield, they are being booked correctly right now. And did Wade not just lose to a new guy? You cannot complain about one guy not getting a shot when he is helping another get over.

When I mentioned Ryback I meant to say the faces of the WWE in general. As for Barrett he was in the title scene over two years ago and got manhandled by Cena and later Orton.

My point is that this whole, you need to earn your stripes is nonsense. If you have a guy who is charismatic or has skills then use him. They sometimes do that....However, I am struggling to recall (and I may be wrong) when the last time a heel has had a major impact. If they go on a winning streak it is dismantled fairly quickly. If something interesting happens it is aborted relatively quickly.

The booking of the Shield is relatively mediocre. They do the same thing over and over and their promos have not really changed. It is almost as if WWE is unsure (like the Nexus) of what to do next. Perhaps they fear giving them that big angle of taking out a Cena. Or maybe it is indeed a slow burn and it will pan out...But what big angle has the WWE done that's really panned out in the last few years?

And when these guys do indeed turn heel as you say....They immediately get booked as cowards. Sheamus should have been a monster heel but wasn't. Bryan worked his ass off to be a great heel and it was through him and the fans that he got over. Vince showed up on TV and promptly buried his ass. Then he was buried at WM but the fans turned on what happened. Thankfully they helped make Bryan. And thankfully it seems that VKM has allowed it to continue. You can have all the heels you want but they need to be booked strong. WWE rarely does that. So instead we get face v. face main events at WM and the vast majority left in the Rumble at the end. At this point I am beginning to wonder why the WWE even has heels.

 

[rge2010]

I really hope it is not a long title run; Trips was awful in 03 and they had to bring in Goldberg instead of trying to get new guys built up. especially after the Booker T fiasco. They will have to turn people heel for him to feud with, like they did with Punk. Eventually they are going to run out of people for him to feud with too.

I don't think Cena winning will lead to great things but you never know.

You make out like bringing in Goldberg was a forced decision? Goldberg WAS WCW! He was the main man!

Plenty of people Cena can fued with after The Rock....Ryback, Brock Lesnar, Randy Orton (been a few years), Big E Langston (when he's ready), Wade Barrett...even a returning Mark Henry.

 

[Marshyishere]

I have watched Cena right from the beginning and have been a fan of his work since the beginning. Anyone who discounts the amount of effor and hard work he has put in to get to the position he is in is an idiot. Yes, he is a teachers pet and has been given a lot of opportunity, but at the time he was the only star showing any promise for the future. That is why we have had such a poor lineup for the last 3 years and why WWE is currently employing so many part timers. I appreciate everything Cena was and has been up until now.

Unfortunately I do agree that his whole act is becoming stale and his promos are becoming more over the top and cringe-worthy by the day.

I would love to see a Cena heel turn and a new persona taken on, possibly with the shield by his side? If the WWE doesn't agree, maybe he should be "injured" at elimination Chamber and be out of action for 2 - 3 months...and by out of action, I mean, not even getting a mention on TV. He could make a return at a later ppv and finally get his chance to challenge the rock for the title at the next event.

I could see a move like this winning over a lot more fans then he currently has as most fans will cheer the return of any superstar. Let him win and drop the title before beating the undertaker at wrestlemania 30.

 

[Sphinx333]

ever since wrestlemania 21 Cena has been virtually unstoppable...every year since then has been a Cena year..i am soo sick of Cena.. give other people the spotlight that deserve it. and cena squashing cody last night on another note was friggen ******ed. i hate that smug look that cena has for most of his opponents, like they are nothing. let me tell you guys something. i have been in training for 4 months and i guarantee that if i were ever to step in the ring with Cena i would make him look like a joke with the wrestling skill that i posess.

 

[dukes07]

You make out like bringing in Goldberg was a forced decision? Goldberg WAS WCW! He was the main man!

Plenty of people Cena can fued with after The Rock....Ryback, Brock Lesnar, Randy Orton (been a few years), Big E Langston (when he's ready), Wade Barrett...even a returning Mark Henry.

I never said it was a forced decision but who was left in WWE? The conspiracy theory (and I slightly subscribe to this) is that they trotted out WCW guys to put Trips over. Goldberg was brought in to make money. But after Steiner, you had Booker and then Nash and then Goldberg for the year. All WCW guys, all beaten by Trips.

 

[dukes07]

I have watched Cena right from the beginning and have been a fan of his work since the beginning. Anyone who discounts the amount of effor and hard work he has put in to get to the position he is in is an idiot. Yes, he is a teachers pet and has been given a lot of opportunity, but at the time he was the only star showing any promise for the future. That is why we have had such a poor lineup for the last 3 years and why WWE is currently employing so many part timers. I appreciate everything Cena was and has been up until now.

Unfortunately I do agree that his whole act is becoming stale and his promos are becoming more over the top and cringe-worthy by the day.

I would love to see a Cena heel turn and a new persona taken on, possibly with the shield by his side? If the WWE doesn't agree, maybe he should be "injured" at elimination Chamber and be out of action for 2 - 3 months...and by out of action, I mean, not even getting a mention on TV. He could make a return at a later ppv and finally get his chance to challenge the rock for the title at the next event.

I could see a move like this winning over a lot more fans then he currently has as most fans will cheer the return of any superstar. Let him win and drop the title before beating the undertaker at wrestlemania 30.

Part of the problem is that WWE rarely pulls the trigger in creating a new guy. A fallacy that has impacted wrestling for years. But WWE has fallen into a rut. They fall back on Cena rather than taking chances more often than not.

 

[rge2010]

I never said it was a forced decision but who was left in WWE? The conspiracy theory (and I slightly subscribe to this) is that they trotted out WCW guys to put Trips over. Goldberg was brought in to make money. But after Steiner, you had Booker and then Nash and then Goldberg for the year. All WCW guys, all beaten by Trips.

Goldberg got the better of Triple twice in all fairness. Triple H also put over HBK numerous times, Taker and Hogan also had the better of him in the previous year. The following year Benoit was to prosper from Triple H. And the year after that Batista.

Triple H has had some good runs in WWE but has also put people over...

 

[dukes07]

Goldberg got the better of Triple twice in all fairness. Triple H also put over HBK numerous times, Taker and Hogan also had the better of him in the previous year. The following year Benoit was to prosper from Triple H. And the year after that Batista.

Triple H has had some good runs in WWE but has also put people over...

Granted I am only in 02 WWF/E right now. But from what I have seen Trips dominates Foley, Austin, Jericho, Angle, the Radicalz, Tazz (when he was ECW champ) and so many others.

I mean he put over established guys. Hogan for the title was a mess of run-ins too. As for Benoit they threw in HBK when it was unnecessary. Also, Trips and HBK are best friends so of course he is going to put him over.

Oops: As for Goldberg, Trips beat him in their first match. Sure it was with a sledgehammer but it still kills momentum.

 

[GutCheck21]

Cena doesn't need 2013 to be his year, he had last year and the year before that etc.... He didn't even need to hold the WWE Championship to be in WWE PPV main event every time it seemed like. Vince just force feeds us Cena and we have no choice to eat it. Give somebody else 2013 .

I just hope when Cena wins the WWE championship, he drops the belt to someone else. Do we need another boring title run by cena?? No we don't. That being said I'll like to see him drop it to the likes of Brock, Bryan, Jericho if he stays or a up and coming star. This way it will let someone else a chance to have the spot light and give us something FRESH. It won't hurt cena at all, he will still be in main event at PPV or close out Raw.

 

[Moneyinc]

In every other thread I see people talking about Cena. Cena fans insist that the majority loves Cena, and Cena critics insist the opposite.

I love what the WWE is doing right now with their talent BESIDES Cena. I just want to end this debate and show the Cena lovers how many people actually don't like him.

It is time to do a poll.

The people who say "you are in the minority if you don't like Cena" must live in a box seriously. Anyone who knows anything about the History of the WWE can see Cena's shortcomings in the ring and on the mic. He is the top money maker? Fine? That is huge in part because anyone under about 15 years old is going to like his corny ass, which is a huge part of the viewing audience.

 

[#hamler]

What does your poll prove? The percentage of internet fans like or dislike Cena? You're forgetting that we're nothing compared to the casual fans. Internet fans are the minority bud. Otherwise, why the hell else would Cena's merchandise sell like crazy? If you're asking who here likes Cena, I do. It's certainly not something to be ashamed of. He's a hell of a talent that's managed to rise to the top and stay on the top despite the hate he gets from the small percentage of fans that are somehow the most vocal.

 

[AndThat'sTheBottomLine]

I'm in between when it comes to Cena. I respect him immensely for his work in the Make-A-Wish foundation. As a person outside the ring, I have huge amounts of respect for him. But as a character in the ring, he's become stale. He's corny, childish, boring, and downright moronic at times. But he is WWE's cash cow and he makes a shit ton of money from the child, woman, and even some of the male demographic. As long as that is a fact, he will always remain on top until he eventually retires. I respect the love he has for the business and the fact that he has always been there even though it might be because he's a shitty movie star. But he loves the business and he does love the people whether they love him or hate him. I hate him as a character but I love him as a person.

 

[HellBoundPower]

2013 will definitely be the year of Cena (much to my chagrin). 2012 flat out sucked for Cena, and 2013 will be WWE's way of making it up to him and giving him one last HUGE run at top. With rumors running rampant that Cena is beat up and doesn't have much left in the tank when it comes to full time competition, I think WWE is going to give him that one last huge run before scaling him back. Cena is still WWE's biggest full time star, and WWE is going to take advantage of that while they still have time. He's going to win the title at Wrestlemania from The Rock, and he's going to hold the title as long as his body can hold up before losing it and putting someone over.

WWE is trying as hard as they can to make a new star, but no one seems to stick. Punk doesn't hack it as a top face, Orton is unreliable, Sheamus isn't over enough, etc. I think 2013 will be WWE buying time with Cena while looking for someone to take the reigns. While people like me that don't like Cena will be cringing every time he goes over, it's the best business move for WWE while they try to make the new star to take his place.

 

[HellBoundPower]

I'm assuming that this post is about the WWE character John Cena, and not the real man. Because I respect John Cena the person for his contribution to the business, his dedication, his charity work, and his work ethic. He's a good man.

That being said, when it comes to the character, I hate him and I always have. I know that a lot of people that don't like him are accused of trying to be cool, jump on the bandwagon, etc. But the truth is that I have never liked him. His ruthless aggression phase was probably the most tolerable for me, but when he went over Jericho on PPV, I instantly couldn't stand the guy. Here comes a rookie beating the first ever Undisputed Champion, and this was BEFORE Jericho ever left. I knew instantly at that point that Cena was going to get pushed down the fans throats, whether they likes him or not.

As soon as Cena became "The Doctor of Thuganomics" that was completely the end for me. As a fan of rock and metal music, and a person that always has and always will hate rap and hip hop, that gimmick didn't do it for me. Marky Mark and Eminem are not people that I like or can relate to, and so it was the same with Cena. I know most people loved this character, but I hated it. And when the fans started getting behind it, I couldn't understand why.

And then he won the WWE Title. I was expecting it, but I didn't like the way it went down. JBL has this monster reign, going over Booker T, Eddie Guerrero, Undertaker, and numerous others, including a Fatal Four Way match between the previous three mentioned. He escapes with the title all year, only to drop the Title to Cena completely clean and in decisive fashion at Wrestlemania in a 10 minute match? Not okay! And once Cena was at top, he brings that nasty, ugly, disgusting bling bling sideshow WWE Title that is still being used today to replace that awesome looking WWE Undisputed Title design. To me that was something that was unforgivable. I know that obviously it was a decision that WWE, and not Cena himself made, but in this case I feel the need to shoot the messenger.

Then Cena heads to Raw, goes over everyone on the roster before dropping the belt to Edge, only to win it back two weeks later. I always felt that Cena was pushed down the fans throats, and the fans apparently started to feel the same with the increasing boos every week. Cena goes through the drastic character change and becomes the fake, cheesy, baby kissing, goody two shoes wannabe Marine character because he played one in a movie. It's not like he served. He was in a movie! How you can go from Marky Mark to Ron Kovic is beyond me!

As for his in ring skills, he's not as bad as a lot of people say, but I don't think he's really that good either. He generates a reaction, but a lot of it is negative. He appeals to a demographic that I don't fit into, and I feel like it alienates the older fans that enjoyed an edgier product with rebellious characters. Cena is the clean cut, all American, apple pie eating babyface that little kids look up to, but I'm not a little kid so I don't appreciate it.

All in all, I've never liked Cena the character, and I never will. He just rubs me the wrong way, and he's never really done anything that I've liked. He's had a few okay matches, but I never wanted to see him win, yet he has time and time again.

 

[Master JM]

Addressed this in a previous thread. John Cena is my favourite face in the company and the top guy in wrestling, period. Someone might point to The Rock or Brock Lesnar and say that they're better due to drawing more or being bigger names, but he's still full-time, still gets great reactions, still sells his products, and can still go perfectly well in the ring and on the mic. Again, as I've said before, I'm looking forward to 2013 as it looks to be a great year for him especially since he had a mostly so-so 2012.

I say this with great pride...haters can go *expletive* themselves with a crowbar, GO CENA!

 

[LascoX]

I went with in between as a tribute to the ultimate tweener Cena. Overall I actually have a lot of respect for him. He loves the business , week in and out he is there and performs at the top of his game everytime he steps threw the curtain. He gets some of the loudest reaction (both good and bad) from the crowd. He is decent in the ring, sure he is not the best but there is a lot worse out there as well. He can work a mike good and has developed a tough skin , even embracing the negative reation to him. Love him or hate him he is a solid worker who loves and respects the business. He also sells a shit load of merchandise and outside the ring does great work with the Make a wish foundation. He is actually a decent role model with the Hustle , Loyalty and Respect thing, not a bad thing concidering how bad society as a whole has slid over the years. Overall I am pro cena though I can understand how some are tired of him.

 

[Nadeem Ahmad]

Newflash A MAJORITY of fans can't stand Cena.

I don't particularly care for Cena one way or another in terms of fandom or hate, but "people like you" that don't like Cena are not in the majority.

Now, looking back at 2012, it obviously was a bad year for Cena for standards that a face of the company would have to deal with. Much time was spent quarrelling with Laurinitis, one of the most unimportant main characters in the history of the product, and he did get injured for about a month or longer. The older folks get, the more tolls these types of pains take on them, but most users here will not admit to it. Injury and lost brain cells (from thinking about Laurinitis) aside, he took a social blow to perception of physical legitimacy, losing to an actor from Hollywood, no matter how strong Dwayne is.

 

[Moneyinc]

What does your poll prove? The percentage of internet fans like or dislike Cena? You're forgetting that we're nothing compared to the casual fans. Internet fans are the minority bud. Otherwise, why the hell else would Cena's merchandise sell like crazy? If you're asking who here likes Cena, I do. It's certainly not something to be ashamed of. He's a hell of a talent that's managed to rise to the top and stay on the top despite the hate he gets from the small percentage of fans that are somehow the most vocal.

Like I kind of touched on already, children are the reason Cena sells. Merchandise included. There are a lot of people on this site. I'm not saying it is the end on be all but I am just showing that it is not rare for people to dislike Cena. Also a lot of the people on this site are well educated Wrestling fanatics. If you don't care about what people on this site think, then why are you on this site? People obviously use this site because it is one of the better wrestling forums on the web. I am not surprised to see that only 9 people out of 27 votes love Cena. That is ridiculously low. I am very curious to see this count when it is finished. Like I said, the people who think Cena is loved world wide seriously live in a freaking box. Quit looking at the dang numbers. When it comes to Hardcore old school wrestling fans, most of em see right through Cena. Not a big deal if YOU don't.

Hate is a strong word I should have just used Like and dislike. I don't hate Cena at all. I just hate his character as do a TON of WWE fans. I will tell you right now. I watched the WWE with 7 guys and not a single one of them were rooting for Cena to win the rumble and not a single one of em was remotely a Cena fan. They all respect Cena though just because like people have mentioned, he does good things for the business clearly. He just isn't a bad ass character/wrestler like all the greats that have come before.