**MERGED** John Cena & The Rock: Match fallout, etc.*KEEP IT ALL IN HERE!*

[i'm a cm punk girl]

^All I read from this was "blah blah, Cena is justified to be the top guy, blah blah, I missed your point, again, blah blah don't call out Cena just cause your in the minority, blah blah."

Heres the deal, Cena is loved, he is admired, and if you read what I wrote you would know I respect the man. I do, I genuinely think he is a great asset to the company, hard working, a role model, an inspiration of sorts and he has gone that extra mile on more then one occasion. I have to stress this, I respect John Cena. I KNOW WHY HE IS THE TOP GUY. That doesn't mean I have to like him and his repetition, I will keep this short and sweet because its apparent you are a little ignorant on the whole concept of what I am driving at, the fact that you even failed to read my whole response shows that, its not the fact that Cena is established has a unique route and very outstanding track record that has stood out head and shoulders above everyone. My entire point is that you speak solely for you when you enjoy this guys set, and I speak solely for me when I say I've seen it all the same for years and years, and would like a break. Its my opinion that the WWE could very well benefit from a break of John Cena after WrestleMania. What is believable about John Cena feuding with a returning A-train after he beats The Rock? There is nowhere to go after The Rock. Hes done everything, he needs to take a bow and step out for a bit.

Simply put, after WrestleMania if you are on board with abysmal and pointless Cena megapush number 5000, thats fine but a lot of us are tired of being fed this same routine. Im not one of those people who falls into the category of enjoying the anti-cena or pro-cena crowds, I don't enjoy his segments because its usually, 8 times out of 10, the same thing just rearranged a little bit. I am an individual who finds it just terribly mundane and my entire point is that for the sake of credibility Cena simply needs to fuck off for a little bit. WWE won't hurt financially if they leave him off 1 show. Give the guy a mention in a 2 minute window, I don't care, just keep him off T.V or away from the same promo or superman match for just one week.

By the way, Batista, Randy Orton, HBK and HHH as DX, Kurt Angle, the Hardy's, Kane, Big Show, they all showed up at least once for ECW shows and for ECW Pay Per Views. Cena wasn't the only one. Hell, I would even go on record saying that Cena only defended the title on an ECW stage once, where as guys like Triple H and Shawn Michaels had a few matches on episodes of ECW on Sci-Fi. Which is more of a credit? I'd take two of the most over guys who don't have to do shit going on a poor Tuesday Night Show then one guy getting booed out of the building because he HAS to defend his title and put Rob Van Dam and the ECW launch over. Get off this guys crotch and stop thinking as if he is the only guy that does anything, the thing is he is just the only guy who stands out because its overpushed and again I respect that even though I stand by my statement that he is a genuine grade A puppet, he has worked hard, I'm just tired of it. Thats all, if you can get the point.

 

[grantedisme]

I doubt you guys read it anyways.

I'm guessing the post was directed to me. I'm one person, but thanks for giving me the benefit of the doubt.

That point was a mess, because it is a stupid solution to a basic problem you have for him. "He's shoved down our throats." Lots of people feel that, and that's fair. He has been the face of the company for a long time, so it makes sense that there is a sizable group of people who are sick of him. It's your "he should go away for a few months after Wrestlemania" solution that I disagree with.

It would have made sense to me if you said that he should take time to heal up on nagging injuries, and it even makes sense that you might personally want him to evolve or change his gimmick. I could even understand if you said that you don't enjoy seeing him, so you'd be happier if he weren't in the industry, but you somehow think he leaving for a few months will freshen up his character or make fans more responsive to his current character. Unless you want him to come back as the Funkasaurus or something as radical as that, leaving doesn't make a lick of a difference as far as the growth of his gimmick goes. The best and most successful changes that have happened to stop stars in the industry have happened during feuds.

Aside from that, his current character is the top draw in the company today. More than that, actually, he is the top draw in the entire industry. That means more people pay to see him and buy his corny shirts, wrist bands, alarm clocks than any other active wrestler today. It wouldn't just be stupid of him to risk a blow to his own credibility by randomly taking a few months off to "freshen his character", but it would also be stupid of the WWE to do that at this point for that reason.

Of course, I'm fairly certain that you won't agree with most of this regardless of the argument I make, which is why I didn't waste my time typing it all out to you the first time. You've shown that you don't like Cena's character, and nothing will ever change your mind.

I don't know what part of my post lead you to believe that I was riled up, but that's not what I meant to convey. I suppose I was a little annoyed, but I was mostly disappointed. I was mostly just responding to your points, which were (recap):

1) "I don't like Cena, because he is contradictory between making poopy jokes and acting like the match matters" leading to "The Rock is 100x more entertaining" - The Rock is the epitome of "poopy" jokes in promos. That's his gimmick. Also, you proved this by showing an example of how Cena acted in the news which didn't actually happen.

2) "[Cena should] take a few months off, for Christs sake just go away for a while." -I responded to this with more than I wanted to already, and I fear it will have been mostly ignored by you.

3) "I will change the channel when he comes on TV after Wrestlemania" -Oh really? Judging by the rest of your post, I thought you were a fan.

As for your current post, I had to take a few breaks throughout, but I read it. It's mostly you accusing Cena of making poopy jokes while characterizing me as typing in all caps and like an lolcat (also, I'd like to point out that you said Cena is "staler than Barbara Walter's vagina"), claiming that Cena is the most overexposed wrestler in history (see: Hogan, The Rock, Undertaker, and Austin would probably be on the list if he didn't receive unfortunate injuries and walk out on the E in an immature fit of rage), and that there has only been one time Cena's career that he has been cleanly beaten (you have a bad memory).

CNN didn't apologize for putting the WWE in a worse light than they already were. They apologized for cutting and editing Cena's interview to make him look like he was a smug roided up star, which isn't how his actual interview went. They apologized for their portrayal of the man himself.

One final note:

I'd rather listen to anyone from from The Rock to David Schultz talk about Kung Pow chicken, fruity pebbles, even throw in the occasional twitter reference which I hate, and I'd rather them screw up lines fed to him from a titantron for an hour and then slapping an interviewer for asking if the business is fake then listen to Cena for two minutes with his preachy, condescending, over done, over rated, ridiculous, irrelevant, cheesy, cringe worthy dialogue and god awful shit eating expressions any day of the week. Hell, I'd even take a fifteen minute Mike Adamle promo on the fundamentals of physics over your typical Cena work now.

In this one excerpt, you kill any semblance of open-minded credibility that you might have tried to garner with your random paragraphs of "I respect Cena, but he annoys me" thrown throughout your longwinded and redundant post. If you put this at the top of your post, I probably would have completely ignored the rest of your post and might not have responded, which may have lead you to feel that you "won" this discussion (not that you won't feel that way anyway). In short, you are claiming that you will take any aspect of The Rock or Adamle that you don't like over ANYTHING Cena does. So by your own admission, nothing Cena does will ever matter to you as much as The Rock or Mike Adamle.

While I would normally end with that for a normal anti-fan of Cena, I feel that you may need me to point out that this excerpt of your post was absurdly biased from almost any perspective (notable exception being that of that "I Hate Cena" guy).

 

[boywithbluehanger]

Except its not BS. The main point of big feuds is to somehow in between make each other look good. Cena has to feel like someone who is above or with those guys. Hes the current big deal. Even Rock today on Twitter said that facing Cena is his greatest challenge. Its called selling the feud. A lost art these days it seems. We haven't really gotten that vibe yet, but finally its happening. Its supposed to be a big deal, two icons going at it. All we've gotten so far was the whining and shooting at each other. This was a great turn around.

I know that the purpose of his promo was to build the feud and to solidify Cena as one of the greats but the writing behind it was lame. The Rock made it seem as if he needed to beat Cena to be considered the greatest of all time. It's not like he's going to come back and fight every top-dog in every coming generation. That's why I'm saying that his comment about having to beat Cena in order to truly be established the GOAT is bs. It's just an added part to the story for extra importance.

Last year he made it clear that he just doesn't like Cena. He even went on to explain quite a few reasons why. He bashed Cena's character based off of the way he dresses, he claimed Cena was guilty of bagging on him for leaving, and he accused Cena (the character of course) of being a phony. He wanted to defeat Cena for THOSE reasons.

This whole "I need to defeat Cena to be considered the greatest" angle is out of the blue, forced, and unnecessary for someone who MANY already consider to be the greatest.

 

[Wrestling4Ever]

I know that the purpose of his promo was to build the feud and to solidify Cena as one of the greats but the writing behind it was lame. The Rock made it seem as if he needed to beat Cena to be considered the greatest of all time. It's not like he's going to come back and fight every top-dog in every coming generation. That's why I'm saying that his comment about having to beat Cena in order to truly be established the GOAT is bs. It's just an added part to the story for extra importance.

Last year he made it clear that he just doesn't like Cena. He even went on to explain quite a few reasons why. He bashed Cena's character based off of the way he dresses, he claimed Cena was guilty of bagging on him for leaving, and he accused Cena (the character of course) of being a phony. He wanted to defeat Cena for THOSE reasons.

This whole "I need to defeat Cena to be considered the greatest" angle is out of the blue, forced, and unnecessary for someone who MANY already consider to be the greatest.

I dont think so. The timing is off and very late, but it still works and is a good touch to the story. All the moaning and crying gets old and this gave it a much better dynamic. Many people may consider him the greatest, but Rock doesn't feel that way until he tops Cena. He could have had those thoughts last year when the match was made. We dont know. Some things you just have to sit back and let ride.

 

[boywithbluehanger]

I dont think so. The timing is off and very late, but it still works and is a good touch to the story. All the moaning and crying gets old and this gave it a much better dynamic. Many people may consider him the greatest, but Rock doesn't feel that way until he tops Cena. He could have had those thoughts last year when the match was made. We dont know. Some things you just have to sit back and let ride.

But that's just the thing. The Rock ALWAYS thought he was the greatest. It was part of his gimmick. He is THE Great One. He always thought that so I mean it just feels too forced coming from him. Like you just know it was added for intensity to the feud. As the storyline was before, The Rock has nothing to gain from winning this match other than whoopin' Cena's ass for talking shit about him prior to returning last year. The way they have him now, if he loses to Cena (which I'd expect) he doesn't really consider himself the greatest. That's a big and unwarranted character change compared to how he's portrayed himself up to last week.

Sure it was a simple plot but if they wanted to go a deeper route, they should have maybe figured that out in, I don't know, the SEVEN fucking years he was gone.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Rock saying he actually cares about winning to prove something is a bit late, but it's necessary. I think the WWE realized "wait, while Cena was promoting the match as two icons squaring off, Rock was mostly making dick jokes".

It's not really a character change for Rock to say he needs to beat Cena to be considered the greatest. No bigger a change than saying "when I was 12 I wanted to be the greatest" without adding "football player" to the end. Rock's character has always wanted to be the best. He challenged Austin a third time for this very reason, he challenged Hogan the prior year for the same reason. How is it a character change?

O, Kelly Kelly's girlfriend, your post was horrendous. You came across as incredibly bias, uneducated, and basically the epitome of a hater. Cena wrote "JBL is poopy" mostly to mock the fans like you, you're too dumb to get it. You also don't get the his matches are worked essentially the same way as 90% of all babyface matches. You think Cena is a phoney do gooder? You DO realize that there are people who are loyal company people. Then again, I guess some people thinking being loyal to a company that gives you so much is a bad thing. Maybe Cena should just quit on the WWE and the fans and tell them to fuck off. You're upset that someone apologized to him? lol WTF?

You come across as a hipster wrestling fan. You're a lot more annoying than you think cena is. I'm okay with people having a different opinion, however, figure this little equation out for me.

A) fans still watch the show and in a relatively stable manner, especially when you adjust for internet, tivo, more channels, etc

B) fans still show up to the live events in a relatively stable manner

C) fans generally make the most noise for Cena than anyone else on the active roster

Those are you "inputs", the possible outputs are

D) the fans legitimately hate Cena and are too fuckin dumb to stop watching, stop paying, and stop making noise

E) the fans that hate Cena love to hate him. He's the anti-hero to the anti-hero generation

I don't think D makes any sense. E is the most logical choice. Cena haters like you have been worked by Cena, no different than me hating Hollywood Hogan when I was 7. In other words, grow the fuck up, don't let your emotions get in the way of being rational; you sound like an idiot.

 

[AwesomeRko]

Rock saying he actually cares about winning to prove something is a bit late, but it's necessary. I think the WWE realized "wait, while Cena was promoting the match as two icons squaring off, Rock was mostly making dick jokes".

I really have no idea how you can say that when Rock from the offset had made his motives for winning the match clear. He stated several times previous to Monday that he wanted to win the match to free the fans from Cena being constantly shoved down our throats and because he legitimately dislikes him due to comments previously made by Cena about Rock. It seems that while accusing Rock fans of being blinded by bias towards him, your own bias is preventing you from acknowledging the serious points Rock has made amongst the 'juvenile' humour.

Cena only really stated that he NEEDS to win the match to complete his legacy in his empty stadium promo 3 weeks ago so the whole icon vs icon has been pushed late by them both. Most of Cena's stuff like Rock's has focused on personal reasons ie Rock's lack of appearances and how he has gone hollywood. So their motives and promotion of the match have largely been pretty similar and been executed well by both.

 

[ropeninja89]

i wish i could tell you how much i care about this match but we all know who,s going to win. this match is just to get someone over as the face of the company and the rock will leave and go back to hollywood cuz he doesnt care about us the universe

 

[grantedisme]

I haven't seen any reactions, so I don't know if this is a popular opinion or not, but tonight's Cena/Rock promo might have been my favorite one of the year. I thought Cena did a better job, but they both seemed to be on their A-games. This definitely gets me to look forward to the PPV.

 

[Steve0904]

To me, The Rock just doesn't sound very believable when he says he wants to win. The whole thing tonight about beating Hogan and Austin and Cena was cute and yeah he dislikes Cena sure, but he just doesn't sound believable trying to explain to me why he absolutely HAS to win.

 

[Wrestling4Ever]

Great work from both. It wasnt cheesy or silly, it was downright serious. Cena got more time but hes the one getting over in the end so its expected. Rock was great tonight and im glad he finally got to speak after Cena's rebuttal (which was amazing). Normally Cena would go on and Rock would be shook or not talk but he fired back. The Hogan/Austin mention was awesome. My favorite part was Rock saying this house you talk about, he helped build. That was such a great counter and true.

Sure the end was cliche, but I figured we would have to wait. Cant wait. 6 days.

 

[prestonluv]

Never sure why the rock did not fire the barb "Cena you tried acting and your acting sucked, thats why you stuck to wrestling cause hollywood did not want you" or something to that extent.

It was so easy...but he must of been told to hold back cause of the good ol' WWE movies

 

[grantedisme]

Never sure why the rock did not fire the barb "Cena you tried acting and your acting sucked, thats why you stuck to wrestling cause hollywood did not want you" or something to that extent.

It was so easy...but he must of been told to hold back cause of the good ol' WWE movies

In my opinion, it would be too tangental and wouldn't really make much sense in the current context of the feud. Cena has only acted in a handful of movies, those movies were company movies (which would imply that he did it under orders of McMahon), and he kept showing up to live shows while filming, which is the argument he has made in the feud. Besides, Cena has already made fun all that on his own a few weeks ago.

Of course, your theory that Rock was told to hold back could be true, since none of us can be sure what is going on backstage or anything, but honestly doubt that anyone backstage would have the guts to tell Rock to do that at this point. I think The Rock realized that those insults wouldn't be worth any more than his normal personal insults. I, for one, am glad he stuck to building the importance of the match itself these last two weeks rather than simply explaining his dislike towards Cena.

 

[ryanmclfc]

There are way way way too many posts to read to see if this has been brought up already, but I had a brainwave last night. If The Rock is to Wrestle @ Summerslam, and it has been suggested Rock Cena II at Mania 29... Maybe, Cena wins this Sunday via a run in, or some form of skull-duggery in which he is told he only beat The Rock through this virtue. So He accepts a Re-Match at Summerslam in which The Rock wins clean then they have a final match at WM29?

 

[The Fabulous Rougeau's]

I'm not so sure they plan on having another match. They keep promoting this as never before and never again. Would seem odd if they had a rematch some 4 months later, then another one 8 months after that.

 

[ZiggingThenZagging]

From the onset, I expected to be rooting for the Rock. I wanted to root for the Rock. As the feud has continued, I've been leaning more and more towards Cena, and hating myself for it, until last night. Last night it seemed to me that the Rock is just doing it to say that he is the best of all time. His reason for wanting to be the best of all time is not from a love of the wrestling business perspective, but rather a love of personally furthering his brand. Beating Cena would truly put him at the top of where he would want to be with the company, so he could leave forever without looking back.

Cena, on the other hand, doesn't want a guy like Rock to just come and go. As said, Cena has been in the WWE longer than the Rock, and he wants to do it not only because he wants to be the best, but because this is his life. I'm sure Cena has had plenty of opportunities to ditch WWE for the big screen, but he hasn't because it wouldn't be better than the WWE. It really hit home during the hour special before Raw that Rock's main goal now is to win an oscar. That's just not what I'd want the best the WWE has seen to hold more importance over.

 

[Wald]

Last night made me think a Cena heel turn is on the cards for the first time ever to be honest

His promo sounded awfully like Steve Austin's Wrestlemania 17 'I need to beat you more than anything you could ever imagine' promo. Storyline wise it would set up that Cena couldn't take the chance that the Rock would come in and rip his career out from under him.

Either way I can't wait for Wrestlemania. Amazing how it still has the ability to bring out the fanboy in me after 25 years watching

 

[Australia's Finest]

I'd actually love to see a heel turn for Cena. I think he could pull it off and actually make him interesting. Though i doubt it cause the kiddies will hate it and that's all that matters it seems.

 

[Wald]

I'm actually in two minds about a Cena heel turn.

For: His character hasn't got many places left to go after this Rock feud. If he goes back to goofy John Cena who doesn't take anyone seriously than the WWE clearly haven't listened to the dissent among the fans. It gets louder in time, not quieter.

Against: I actually genuinely like that his character is all about his fans and that he doesn't care what anyone thinks other than them.

They do need a wrinkle in his character though if they keep him face, I'm just not sure what that could be. Turn him heel however and you risk alienating a lot of the families that watch the show if you have no-one to take over from him. CM Punk isn't the guy to make dads and moms let their kids watch the show.

 

[RD_21]

Yesterday for the first time when I heard John Cena talk (well I always knew it was the smartest business decision to make), I believed that Rock will win at Mania.

I've been saying for a year now that Rock NEEDS to win the match, let's be honest if Cena win, well he beat an actor big deal. But if The Rock win (in my scenario the Rock agreed to 3 matches, one match will serve nothing as I already established) then he gains credibility back and he can then lose to Cena in a rematch or two to really put Cena over. Can't pass a torch that you don't have in the first place.

But Cena was so confident that he always win, no matter who he face he always win, it would be a GIANT spit in the face of everyone who are bashing the WWE for being predictable. If you want Cena to win you hide it and you build the Rock as unstoppable, not as an old washed out wrestler. Of course Rock could get his magic back in the match and show that he still got it only to come short, but then Cena would have beat a former wrestler turned actor and there's no need for that or sense in that.

 

[RD_21]

Turn him heel however and you risk alienating a lot of the families that watch the show if you have no-one to take over from him. CM Punk isn't the guy to make dads and moms let their kids watch the show.

I never understood why (not bashing just legitimately don't understand it) people make this argument. If you turn Cena heel the next jobber who face him would become a monster face because Cena will be able to make his former fans HATE him with a passion they will root for anyone who would stand for them.

 

[grantedisme]

I never understood why (not bashing just legitimately don't understand it) people make this argument. If you turn Cena heel the next jobber who face him would become a monster face because Cena will be able to make his former fans HATE him with a passion they will root for anyone who would stand for them.

That would work for one feud, but as soon as the feud was over, fans would forget about the jobber again. The most recent example of this I can think of was the NBA finals last season. Even people who didn't watch the sport hated Miami Heat more than anything in the world, and so the Dallas Mavericks ended up having a ridiculous amount of fan support throughout the country during the series. If you ask most of those random people who rooted for the Mavs today, most of them would probably tell you that they have no idea what the Mavs are doing anymore.

Aside from that, the fact remains that Cena might be only wholesome face in the industry right now. That's the kind of person most parents probably want their kids to look up to and imitate, and if the only mega-face with that kind of attitude is gone, Raw pretty much stops being a family program. That might be appealing to you, but I can't imagine it being good for overall business.

 

[RJJ]

Yesterday for the first time when I heard John Cena talk (well I always knew it was the smartest business decision to make), I believed that Rock will win at Mania.

I've been saying for a year now that Rock NEEDS to win the match, let's be honest if Cena win, well he beat an actor big deal. But if The Rock win (in my scenario the Rock agreed to 3 matches, one match will serve nothing as I already established) then he gains credibility back and he can then lose to Cena in a rematch or two to really put Cena over. Can't pass a torch that you don't have in the first place.

But Cena was so confident that he always win, no matter who he face he always win, it would be a GIANT spit in the face of everyone who are bashing the WWE for being predictable. If you want Cena to win you hide it and you build the Rock as unstoppable, not as an old washed out wrestler. Of course Rock could get his magic back in the match and show that he still got it only to come short, but then Cena would have beat a former wrestler turned actor and there's no need for that or sense in that.

Nah. I still believe Cena is coming out on top. However, one line from The Rock's mouth will change everything in my view. If The Rock "Guaran-DAMN-tee!!" victory, then I'd be more than 90% sure that he will win. Rock never lost a "guaranteed" match before, never(It's like a spoiler). Can't wait for his pre-match interview.

I really don't care who wins as long as we have a clean finish...but, I got a strong feeling that vince will stick his ego into this match.

 

[ryanmclfc]

I was watching the Wrestlemania 17 promo between Rock and Austin, Limp Bizkit - My Way... One of the best promo's of all time imo. And this Rock cena match seems a lot like that in the respect of cena's "I have to win" very much like Austins "I have to win Rock, more than you could ever imagine"... Makes me think cena will win but not clean.

 

[RJJ]

He guaranteed victory at Royal Rumble 2001.

Either way, hope Rocky wins, because Cena sucks.

No he didn't. He guaranteed victory the Rumble before(2000) and he delivered. He guarenteed winning the title at backlash 2000 and he delivered. He guaranteed beating austin at WM 19 and he delivered. Like I said, I've never seen Rock lose after guaranteeing victory.