klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
I'm reading the gamecast stuff on ESPN.com. Yeah it's boring so far.
NFL Week 1
- Thread starter klunderbunker
- Start date
I usually use Foxsports.com when I'm somewhere where I can't watch. They update about as fast as NFL.com, and you get a pretty good breakdown of everything.
Little Jerry Lawler
Sigmund Freud On Ritalin And Roids
I believe so.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
ESPN changed their layout for this year. It's really good. More visually appealing too.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
The way the Eagles look today it doesn't matter who their QB is.
FromTheSouth
You don't want it with me.
Does anyone else's Fox feed seem kinda choppy, like a webcast?
Very true. As much as I love seeing the Panthers getting creamed, I don't like seeing the Eagles look this good. They could be getting better. That scares me.
I'll need the Giants game at 4p to calm me down a little.
Wait, let me see if I understand this...
Wins and championships are what determines a great quarterback...except when we're talking about Favre. Apparently his shortcomings are worse than Elway's numerous Superbowl losses.
Makes sense.
No one is arguing that Moon is better than Montana. Stats aren't the only determinant of quality, obviously.
But when you're discussing two quarterbacks who are both on the same plateau, as Elway and Marino are, then it's simply asinine to say that Elway is better because his team won two Superbowl titles in Elway's twilight years.
When both guys were at their best, Marino was clearly the better QB, and trying to say that Terrell Davis and the Bronco defense makes Elway a better QB shows just how weak your argument is.
As I've said, his rings came when he wasn't the same quality.
Which means that you're saying Dilfer is better than Marino. While Elway MIGHT have been better than Dilfer in 1999, it wasn't by much. Elway didn't win that Superbowl, TD and the defense did. Was Elway a part of it? Sure...just like Favre will be this year if the Vikings win.
Not when we're trying to decide who the best QB was, and the two rings in question came far after Elway's peak years.
If Kelly had success, then Marino had success, right? After all, Marino played in two Superbowls.
The fact of the matter is that when both were in their primes, Marino was the better QB, and trying to argue that by saying Elway won two titles in the twilight of his career is ridiculous.
FromTheSouth
You don't want it with me.
I picked Miles Austin up in free agency last night and started him on a whim. Awesome.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
If Elway wasn't an important part of his SB win, why was he the MVP? So, the TD he threw for, the 330+ yards he threw for, and the rushing TD he scored meant nothing? Yeah, he clearly didn't play a big role at all.
As for when the rings came, who cares? He was the starting QB of the teams that won them. If he had won just once, I'd likely agree on Marino. Two in a row though, plus three other SB appearences? Nah, that's too much for Marino's stats to overcome.
We're not talking about their primes. We're talking about their whole career.
As for when the rings came, who cares? He was the starting QB of the teams that won them. If he had won just once, I'd likely agree on Marino. Two in a row though, plus three other SB appearences? Nah, that's too much for Marino's stats to overcome.
We're not talking about their primes. We're talking about their whole career.
The Hiphopapotamus
The Dude abides
Eagles dominating thank god.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
If Favre loses this, I will die happy.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
The Lions are getting smacked. All is right with the world.
And if he didn't have a 2000 yard rusher taking the attention of the defense, do you think he would have won? Of course not. Why? Because he never had before. He had similar numbers in Superbowl 21, and they got their ass beat. Marino had similar numbers in Superbowl 19, but without the support, he didn't win either.
The fact of the matter is that Elway wasn't the focal point of the offense, Terrell Davis was. And everyone knows it. Just like Favre isn't the focal part of the Vikings offense, Peterson is.
Bullshit. You're saying that 1998 John Elway is better than 1993 John Elway? Silly.
At the end of the day, when both Elway and Marino were at their prime, Marino was better. You put Marino on those '97 and '98 Bronco teams, and he wins two titles too.
False, we're talking about the best player. And outside of two games when Elway was far from his best, Marino was a far better QB in every sense of the word.
Let's not fool ourselves here KB...Terrell Davis was the elite of the elite. He had quite a bit to do with that Super Bowl season.
Marino > Elway, all day. And that's coming from someone who loved Elway in the 90s. Not as much as Drew Bledsoe though
Oh and I've despised the Dolphins since birth. But even I can see that Marino was better.
Marino > Elway, all day. And that's coming from someone who loved Elway in the 90s. Not as much as Drew Bledsoe though
Oh and I've despised the Dolphins since birth. But even I can see that Marino was better.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
Marino was far better stats wise, not winning wise. Wins > stats by a BIG margin.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
Sure TD was great. Alright then. We'll take the two wins off the table.Let's not fool ourselves here KB...Terrell Davis was the elite of the elite. He had quite a bit to do with that Super Bowl season.
Marino > Elway, all day. And that's coming from someone who loved Elway in the 90s. Not as much as Drew Bledsoe though
Oh and I've despised the Dolphins since birth. But even I can see that Marino was better.
Without TD:
Marino-2 Super Bowls
Elway-3 Super Bowls. I'd rather get to the title game and have a chance to win it than have a bunch of stats.
Elways teams>Marino's teams by a BIG margin.
So again, we're back to Trent Dilfer is better than Fran Tarkenton, because his team was better? Stupid argument.
I HATE Dan Marino, and despise the Dolphins to this day because of Marino.Let's not fool ourselves here KB...Terrell Davis was the elite of the elite. He had quite a bit to do with that Super Bowl season.
Marino > Elway, all day. And that's coming from someone who loved Elway in the 90s. Not as much as Drew Bledsoe though
Oh and I've despised the Dolphins since birth. But even I can see that Marino was better.
But trying to argue that Elway was better than Marino is silly.
We're not talking about who was the best at winning though, are we? Alot of factors go into winning games, it doesn't rely entirely on a quarterback's performance.
We're talking about the better quarterback, i.e. the person who was better at their job on the field. Statistics are concrete evidence of who performed their job better.
Therefore, Marino > Elway
We're talking about the better quarterback, i.e. the person who was better at their job on the field. Statistics are concrete evidence of who performed their job better.
Therefore, Marino > Elway
Little Jerry Lawler
Sigmund Freud On Ritalin And Roids
I thought Marino went to only one Super Bowl.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
So, stats while losing are better than taking your team to titles? Yeah, I'm never going to agree with that.
Elway has stats, titles, more comeback/game tying drives in the 4th than anyone ever, and was more mobile. I'll take that over a pocket passer any day.
Elway has stats, titles, more comeback/game tying drives in the 4th than anyone ever, and was more mobile. I'll take that over a pocket passer any day.
Better QB = Marino
Better game manager = Elway
That's the way I've always seen it.
You make it sound like the quarterback is the only person on the field. A QUARTERBACK doesn't win a Super Bowl, a TEAM does.
We're not talking about who had more success. We're talking about on-field performance, no other factors here. And Marino performed better on the field than Elway. This is fact.
