**MERGED** John Cena & The Rock: Match fallout, etc.*KEEP IT ALL IN HERE!*

[Huey]

Yeah I could understand that. But at the same time don't you think maybe he hasn't really done anything to further the story line because John or the WWE hasn't really given him anything to move on with? Like for me I feel like it's the same debate between them and the IWC. Rocky you left, you're Hollywood, you're arrogant. John you're a bitch, you're this, you're that. I feel like since that has constantly been the topic since last year, it's like what else can be said to steer the promos in a different direction?

That's what I said earlier, I don't know. I would like to think that two people as talented as the rock and cena could make this a success. The WWE started building it up last year. Just announcing it one year out and talking about it like it's the biggest wrestlemania match seems like they're doing their part.

I am hopeful that tonight was a step towards making it more than hollywood, twitter, and cena sucks. I'm not stuck on the whole notes on the arm as a knock on the rock as a wrestler. I understand taking notes. They had cena come out laughing, he called the rock out for kung pow chicken and made light of how "genius" it was. Then he busted him out for the writers and notes, and left laughing about twitter like he was above it all. Then they had rock be lost for words and stutter around.

Cena could start talking about how the rock was great but dwayne isn't. Never address him as the rock again, always as dwayne. Instead of talking about how he left for hollywood and he's never around, just talk about how he's not the rock anymore and he's not as talented. The rock could talk about how he gets a big reaction and he's better now than cena will ever be.

The easiest way is to build it up as an icon vs icon thing but they haven't even done that well and it's pretty played out. The fans in attendance will go nuts, of this I have no doubt, but for many of the fans watching at home I'm afraid it'll be a lesnar/goldberg 2.0

 

[rge2010]

I am a big Rock fan, I think he is great and while Cena isn't my favourite, I am not on the hate bandwagon and I respect most of what he does so I will look at this objectively.

Content/Style

I have to laugh at certain members of the IWC slamming The Rock saying 'this was awful, it was not The Rock, it was Dwayne'. Well fuck me, these are the same cretins complaining The Rock is doing his 1999 catchphrases every time he turns up! I'd give the promo a 7.5, it wasn't his best but it wasn't bad by a long shot. He got his message across and he delivered well. Tonight was mostly Dwayne with a little bit of Rock thrown in aswell to appease the live crowd....which brings me to my next point.

Selfish Internet Fans

It amazes me how selfish and short sighted some members of the IWC are. They think that promos are for their benefit and nobody else. The Rock gets the live fans eating out of his hands like nobody else. He says jump, they say how high. A huge part of Rocks promos are for the benefit of the LIVE CROWD. It may not always make great TV but the fans there are having a great time - he gets pops like no other. WWE is not just a TV Production, it is also a LIVE production in front of an audience. WWE is pantomine, it involves interaction and thats what the fans who bought tickets want, they got it and they went home happy. Half these bitches moaning would be marking out if they were there!

The Notes on the arm

The Rock had notes on his arms, that is a given. This was not a work to make Cena look better, that was a shoot from the hip by Cena. Watch the promo again, at one point you see Rock looking down and reading his notes. At the end when he gets on the turnbuckle, he also wipes the notes against his leg to remove them. Is there anything wrong with this? Not at all. Rock is an actor, he can memorize with ease, he does a coherent promo with very little nerves at all, he delivers it well and he is one of the best in the business. Even the internet darling CM Punk uses bullet points on his arm, watch the 'pipe bomb' promo for evidence. I am not making excuses for Rock, but it is totally acceptable and a 'trick of the trade'. What is unacceptable is...

John Cena lacking a bit of class

That was a huge low blow by John Cena bringing that to the fans attention. Using dirty hand tactics like that is like saying The Rock bottom doesnt hurt and he could easily get up. By all means get personal but I felt uncomfortable he is almost giving the game away.

It just got even more personal

Like I said earlier, it just got personal. You could see The Rock was visibly pissed. He looked Cena dead in the eye straight after he said it....there was no pacing around the ring. I also believe he mouthed something into the camera for Cenas benefit.

Follow Up

There is certainly a buzz for me now, not sure about anyone else but I am intrigued to see where this goes. Looks to me like all bets could be off as far as The Rock is concerned. I may not agree with what Cena did but the fued certainly needed something like that. I am interested to see what material the Rock uses. His promo in July (off WWE camera) had lots he could bury Cena with. I hope he does.

 

[Jenna.]

That's what I said earlier, I don't know. I would like to think that two people as talented as the rock and cena could make this a success. The WWE started building it up last year. Just announcing it one year out and talking about it like it's the biggest wrestlemania match seems like they're doing their part.

I am hopeful that tonight was a step towards making it more than hollywood, twitter, and cena sucks. I'm not stuck on the whole notes on the arm as a knock on the rock as a wrestler. I understand taking notes. They had cena come out laughing, he called the rock out for kung pow chicken and made light of how "genius" it was. Then he busted him out for the writers and notes, and left laughing about twitter like he was above it all. Then they had rock be lost for words and stutter around.

Cena could start talking about how the rock was great but dwayne isn't. Never address him as the rock again, always as dwayne. Instead of talking about how he left for hollywood and he's never around, just talk about how he's not the rock anymore and he's not as talented. The rock could talk about how he gets a big reaction and he's better now than cena will ever be.

The easiest way is to build it up as an icon vs icon thing but they haven't even done that well and it's pretty played out. The fans in attendance will go nuts, of this I have no doubt, but for many of the fans watching at home I'm afraid it'll be a lesnar/goldberg 2.0

Yeah that's not even a bad idea...but WWE of course isn't going to even go for that. They'll keep it where it's at. Which I really don't mind, and honestly I think the average fan doesn't either. For the WWE universe I think they're excited, not so much for the IWC. They're not like us, where we'll analyze and debate and nitpick the promos lol.

And I dunno I guess I am biased, but that note thing doesn't that seem odd? Like it didn't sit right with me. Yeah he's not God, but Dwayne's been doing this promo thing for years and the acting thing as well. So to come out there with notes, seems like it was part of the script so Cena could one up him. Who actually noticed that until he pointed it out? I feel like he'll definitely being using that material, which could probably steer the feud in a different direction.

 

[Huey]

The Notes on the arm

The Rock had notes on his arms, that is a given. This was not a work to make Cena look better, that was a shoot from the hip by Cena. Watch the promo again, at one point you see Rock looking down and reading his notes. At the end when he gets on the turnbuckle, he also wipes the notes against his leg to remove them. Is there anything wrong with this? Not at all. Rock is an actor, he can memorize with ease, he does a coherent promo with very little nerves at all, he delivers it well and he is one of the best ion the business. Even the internet darling CM Punk uses bullet points on his arm, watch the 'pipe bomb' promo for evidence. I am not making excuses for Rock, but it is totally acceptable and a 'trick of the trade'. What is unacceptable is...

I don't think it was a shot from the hip from Cena. The way he came out laughing, cut down the rock for the chicken and notes, and then left like the rock wasn't even worth his time, just fits together too well.

I'm not a fan of how this has been built from the two wrestlers or the company but I am hopeful that this is an attempt to make it more personal. Instead of cena talking about how the rock left and the rock talking about cena's lady parts Cena can blast dwayne for losing it and not being as good as he was. The rock can say he's better now than cena will ever be. I'm just looking for anything other than trending world wide and hollywood. Even the idea that the miz may interfere has done more to sell the match for me than the rock and cena so far.

The more I think about that the more I can justify it. I mean if cena wins and goes back to being cena there's no gain. If the rock wins and goes back to being the rock there's no gain. I would rather see cena and rock deliver their finishers and have some one else come out and wreck face while they're down for the ten count. Cena and Rock don't need the rub or the passing of any torch. Tie it in with the anon locker room reports against the rock and cut a promo the next night about how they held him back so he destroyed them both and ruined their biggest match. Doesn't have to be the miz.

 

[Huey]

Yeah that's not even a bad idea...but WWE of course isn't going to even go for that. They'll keep it where it's at. Which I really don't mind, and honestly I think the average fan doesn't either. For the WWE universe I think they're excited, not so much for the IWC. They're not like us, where we'll analyze and debate and nitpick the promos lol.

And I dunno I guess I am biased, but that note thing doesn't that seem odd? Like it didn't sit right with me. Yeah he's not God, but Dwayne's been doing this promo thing for years and the acting thing as well. So to come out there with notes, seems like it was part of the script so Cena could one up him. Who actually noticed that until he pointed it out? I feel like he'll definitely being using that material, which could probably steer the feud in a different direction.

I think the notes were there just for cena to point out. I don't think it's out of the ordinary for anyone speaking in public to have some notes, but it is out of the ordinary for a wrestler to call another wrestler out for it. I don't know where they're going with it I just hope they do something.

When I talk about wrestlemania with other wrestling fans I know they seem most interested in the HHH/Taker hell in the cell. After tonight I think jericho/cm punk have done the best job at selling their match, and I think they're taking big shots at cena and the rock with what they're saying.

I just want to see more out of two talented stars in the alleged biggest wrestlemania match ever.

 

[grantedisme]

I am a big Rock fan, I think he is great and while Cena isn't my favourite, I am not on the hate bandwagon and I respect most of what he does so I will look at this objectively.

Content/Style

I have to laugh at certain members of the IWC slamming The Rock saying 'this was awful, it was not The Rock, it was Dwayne'. Well fuck me, these are the same cretins complaining The Rock is doing his 1999 catchphrases every time he turns up! I'd give the promo a 7.5, it wasn't his best but it wasn't bad by a long shot. He got his message across and he delivered well. Tonight was mostly Dwayne with a little bit of Rock thrown in aswell to appease the live crowd....which brings me to my next point.

Selfish Internet Fans

It amazes me how selfish and short sighted some members of the IWC are. They think that promos are for their benefit and nobody else. The Rock gets the live fans eating out of his hands like nobody else. He says jump, they say how high. A huge part of Rocks promos are for the benefit of the LIVE CROWD. It may not always make great TV but the fans there are having a great time - he gets pops like no other. WWE is not just a TV Production, it is also a LIVE production in front of an audience. WWE is pantomine, it involves interaction and thats what the fans who bought tickets want, they got it and they went home happy. Half these bitches moaning would be marking out if they were there!

The Notes on the arm

The Rock had notes on his arms, that is a given. This was not a work to make Cena look better, that was a shoot from the hip by Cena. Watch the promo again, at one point you see Rock looking down and reading his notes. At the end when he gets on the turnbuckle, he also wipes the notes against his leg to remove them. Is there anything wrong with this? Not at all. Rock is an actor, he can memorize with ease, he does a coherent promo with very little nerves at all, he delivers it well and he is one of the best in the business. Even the internet darling CM Punk uses bullet points on his arm, watch the 'pipe bomb' promo for evidence. I am not making excuses for Rock, but it is totally acceptable and a 'trick of the trade'. What is unacceptable is...

John Cena lacking a bit of class

That was a huge low blow by John Cena bringing that to the fans attention. Using dirty hand tactics like that is like saying The Rock bottom doesnt hurt and he could easily get up. By all means get personal but I felt uncomfortable he is almost giving the game away.

It just got even more personal

Like I said earlier, it just got personal. You could see The Rock was visibly pissed. He looked Cena dead in the eye straight after he said it....there was no pacing around the ring. I also believe he mouthed something into the camera for Cenas benefit.

Follow Up

There is certainly a buzz for me now, not sure about anyone else but I am intrigued to see where this goes. Looks to me like all bets could be off as far as The Rock is concerned. I may not agree with what Cena did but the fued certainly needed something like that. I am interested to see what material the Rock uses. His promo in July (off WWE camera) had lots he could bury Cena with. I hope he does.

Your post seemed well thought out when I read it, but I disagree with most of it. It's cool that you're trying to be objective about this, but I think you're more biased than you might realize. I'll try to organize why I feel that way in the same way that you organized your post for the sake of simplicity, so please don't get the wrong idea and assume that I'm mocking the structure of your post.

Content/Style

For what everyone is touting as a 20 minute speech, incredibly little was done to build the feud or respond to Cena's promo from the last week. The first maybe.. 2-3 minutes were the fans chanting, and between every 3 or 4 sentences, he would pause to let them chant again. While the reception he got was indicative of how popular he was in the past and how much staying power that popularity had, it does not make his promo any better than a card board cut-out's on its own. That being said, I am one of those who complain about him recycling catchphrases from 10 years ago to a nauseating extent, and while I'm glad that he didn't resort to the same tactics for most of his promo (that is, unless he was at a loss of words after Cena completely out-witted him off script assuming it was real), his promo was not clever, innovative, or new.

In 20 minutes, he rehashed Cena's resemblance to fruity pebbles, called him a Kung Pow Bitch, made fun of Cena's genitalia twice, and what no one else has seemed to point out, performed the exact same cheap pops that Cena is constantly criticized for by people online. He played up to the Trailblazers, said that he was fighting for the fans, and said that nothing is more important to him than entertaining the WWE universe. I'm not saying that you personally are guilty of this, but speeches like that are exactly what people used to criticize Cena for doing against Punk, Miz, Del Rio, and a plethora of other stars. Anyway, you made other points, so I don't want to keep trying to refute this one. In short, I simply disagree with you about The Rock's content being entertaining.

Selfish Internet Fans

As far as any fan is concerned, on TV or live, a promo is for them as individuals. The entire point in a promo is to draw or to build a feud. If the performer didn't fulfill any of these, it was a poor promo. As a fan who wasn't drawn to his promo or didn't see the feud furthered by his insults, I consider his promo as poor. The Rock's ability to make the fans go into all kinds of random chants is a testament of how good he was in the past. That being said, they were chanting before he started speaking. The mere presence of his legacy spurred it. As I said before, I absolutely find that understandable, but it does not mean that his promo was good. He may have put in the work in the past to get the praise that he does, but he hasn't done anything lately to deserve it (unless you consider showing up for the first time in months to build a feud scheduled a year in advance as deserving of praise, which I personally don't). It's for that reason that I don't think he earned the reaction he got through his work on this Monday Night.

The Notes on the arm

I pretty much agree with you here. As a fan, I don't care that he had notes on his arm. He had no trouble presenting that which was written as I presume he intended, and it doesn't matter to me how he remembers his lines. It was a clever line in the moment that caught most of us off guard, and for that, I was entertained, but it has no lasting effect on my opinion on The Rock on its own.

John Cena lacking a bit of class

With this, I disagree with you majorly, and I'd accuse you of holding a double standard. The Rock prefaced this by resorting to the "realism" route with his Cell Phone comment, which cheapened Cena's kayfabe promo from the previous week. Furthermore, if you have already conceded that having notes on his wrist isn't a big deal, you are employing ridiculous levels of hyperbole by labeling Cena as classless. In a feud where The Rock has consistently insulted Cena's manhood on a global scale for an entire year, one off-the-cuff remark about The Rock needing to write down bullet points on his wrist does not register on the scale.

It just got even more personal

The Rock was at a loss for words. If Cena's line really wasn't planned, The Rock had no idea how to respond to it. He wanted for Cena to completely exit the ring, the ramp, and the entrance area before starting, and he stuttered and riddled the rest of his promo with redundancies. If Rocky wasn't legitimately angry by the end of the taping, he is a much better actor than I thought he was.

Follow Up

I agree with you here for the most part. This promo got me psyched to see how the rest of it will go. I think Cena mopped the floor with Rocky tonight, but I think it'll be a wake-up call for him to pick up his promo work and hopefully step it up a level as Cena has. The difference here is that The Rock is trying to play up to the catchphrases, the chants, the gimmicks, and that whole circus. Cena, on the other hand, is making this seem real and personal. On a fundamental level in this stage of my life, that's why I've been enjoying Cena more in these last two weeks than I would ever enjoy any incarnation The Rock has shown.

You and I can probably agree that this feud shows lots of promise, and hopefully it can live up to all of its hype and hoopla.

 

[I Heart Cena]

I think the notes were there just for cena to point out. I don't think it's out of the ordinary for anyone speaking in public to have some notes, but it is out of the ordinary for a wrestler to call another wrestler out for it. I don't know where they're going with it I just hope they do something.

They want to make it out to be a 50/50 feud. They want to show the Rock as vulnerable. Anyone who thinks this wasn't a work, is a fool.

The main event of the Raw after WM28 is already set. It's gonna be a 6 man tag with Kane and 2 heels on 1 side, and Rock, Cena and a face on the other. WZ leaked that. So this all shows that Rock will put cena over at WM, then shake his hand afterward. On Raw the next night, Rock will apologize for being immature, and they will be friends to face Kane's crew.

Lame.

That's what WWE is trying to do. Make Rock this bully who just insults Cena, but Cena rises above the hate, and beats Rock. Then Rock will apologize. Sickening.

Last nite reminded me of the Goldberg/Hart/metal plate incident. It started with a "shoot" by Hart that got everyone wondering if it was real. Then Berg came in and speared him. After the spear and metal plate, you realized that it was all 100% a work.

It's plain as day. WWE can do so much more with this feud. I'd rather see outrageous stuff happen between them in the buildup. But so far, reality show garbage.

 

[ryanmclfc]

100% a work in my mind.
The Rock has never used lines in his life

Dwayne is an actor, actors need scripts.

This fued started that cena didn't respect DWAYNE for being the movie star.

So the fued will now be "When you were The Rock you never needed a script or lines, now you are just Dwayne you need the lines because you're not the same man this is why I'll beat you at Wrestlemania" - has to be.

I refuse to believe The Rock needed any help, on the contrary if he did it's not a big deal, when you're cutting a promo that needs to land, plenty have used lines, not going into that as it looks like an excuse but punk did Twice if I remember once in Nexus and the "infamous" leaving promo on RAW. So if Rock needed bullet points so what, wrestling is a scripted business any way so why so much is being made I'll never know...

 

[mb47]

It is very easy to argue that this is not a work but very easy to argue it is.

It's a work
1. Rock was not on point and I've never seen him seem so unsure of himself on the mic before. He's a Hollywood actor for crying out loud, he knows how to memorize lines, he knows timing very well and he has heard much bigger crowd reactions.

2. If he's going to make notes why would he put them on his wrist in such an obvious fashion? Surely he'd use wrist tape or something to try make them less obvious.

3. Cena came in, pulled Rock up on it and continued the "Rock is here with his own agenda" etc... This now allows Rock to kick Cena's ass next time pushing Rock as the hell and Cena as the face leading up to WM.

It's not a work

1. The Rock looked visibly pissed when Cena pulled Rock up on having "notes" and Rock rubbed it off after the promo. He also became less on point, stuttered more and it seemed to have rattled him.

2. Having just finished G.I. Joe 2 there is the possibility that Rock was concerned with going in to the wrong character and the notes helped him stay as "The Rock".

3. He was straight up lazy or didn't have the time to memorize his promo.

Conclusion

It's a work. Plain and simple in my opinion. Rock has always acted in some manner so he could easily throw out a bad promo, look pissed off when Cena pulls him up on the notes and stutter around with his lines. The goosebumps line was so when this came to light that it furthers that it's "real".

Furthermore, if it wasn't a work and Cena really did pull Rock up on having notes then Vince would have exploded! To literally break down the 4th wall (not in the CM Punk way!) that would hurt the company more and Cena would be in the doghouse and we would know by now. It doesn't matter how big and valuable Cena is, he would get some shit for it.

Finally, it furthers the story line that Rock doesn't care. Rock can now come back and tear Cena apart with a promo, Cena comes out and this time Rock hits him, it becomes even more personal and the intensity is at full force.

All I can say is, as long as this is a work, very very well done WWE.

 

[Ellye]

The Rock almost always used some kind of notes for his promos. This isn't something new. It isn't something bad, either.

But bringing this to attention was a good way to move this feud forward, I believe.

 

[rge2010]

John Cena lacking a bit of class

With this, I disagree with you majorly, and I'd accuse you of holding a double standard. The Rock prefaced this by resorting to the "realism" route with his Cell Phone comment, which cheapened Cena's kayfabe promo from the previous week. Furthermore, if you have already conceded that having notes on his wrist isn't a big deal, you are employing ridiculous levels of hyperbole by labeling Cena as classless. In a feud where The Rock has consistently insulted Cena's manhood on a global scale for an entire year, one off-the-cuff remark about The Rock needing to write down bullet points on his wrist does not register on the scale.

The cell phone comment wasn't breaking any '4th walls' though was it? How do we know it is even true!? Yes, I like the realism route but the classless comment I made was because Cena just had to bring it up. While I dont think having notes on the arm is a 'big issue', to try and show The Rock up like that is classless. It was a cheap point scorer.

Cenas manhood and all that is in jest - it is for comedy and nothing else. Yeh, its schoolboy humor but its nothing personal. Cena takes it in good spirits and the Rock has had the same done to him in the past (watch his 2003 promos with Hurricane).

I dont think it was double standards from me at all.

 

[AustinHartLesnarHBKTaz80]

that was a helluva promo by rock and cena.

rock looked legitimately rattled after cena's 'notes on the wrist' comeback as he stuttered his lines, calling himself dwayne rock johnson like 5 times, then hammered out his 'smell what the rock is cookin' fallback phrase.

work or shoot, i'm enjoying the ride.

but check this out....

correct me if im wrong, but isn't that a teleprompter in the ring whenever the rock cuts a promo?

what is that huge black rectangular-shaped object sitting in the corner of the ring during every rock promo?

at one point, he looks down at it, then he immediately references a twitter trend! is this really a teleprompter or what?

i only see this during the rock's promos, and i remember seeing it during some of austin's back in the day.

anyone else notice this?

anyone can shed some light on this?

it can't be a speaker.....

 

[MayorMcCheese]

I was following on twitter before I got home.
Everyone was talking up Cena.

I come home, hoping to be wowed, but honestly I don't get what he did that made everyone think he "won" The ROCK Carried 20 minutes BY HIMSELF which is very hard to do. He made Cena's job so easy, only having him out there for a couple minutes.

The fans were overwhelmingly on Rocks side during and after, then I realized those people on twitter were mostly under 18 years old. It made sense.

I am very interested in the match, one things for sure, they DO NOT LIKE EACH OTHER

Cena also exposed the business by attacking Rock for the "notes" those were Bullet Points, MANY wrestlers have done this, and I bet you Cena has himself

 

[Green Bay Wisconsin]

that was a helluva promo by rock and cena.

rock looked legitimately rattled after cena's 'notes on the wrist' line as he stuttered his lines, called himself dwayne rock johnson like 5 times, then cut his classic catch phrase.

work or shoot, i'm enjoying the ride.

but check this out....

correct me if im wrong, but isn't that a teleprompter in the ring whenever the rock cuts a promo?

what is that huge black rectangular-shaped object sitting in the corner of the ring during every rock promo?

i only see this during the rock's promos, and i remember seeing it during some of austin's back in the day.

anyone else notice this?

anyone can shed some light on this?

it can't be a speaker.....

It's a speaker.

They use them a lot, If you go back to the RAW when it was only HHH, Sheamus, Punk and Cena they had them in the ring then as well.

 

[LoudClearVoice]

Rock wasn't reading notes word for word. He had a few words on his arm, so that he'd stay on point during his promo. It's not like he stared at his arm the entire time. If you watch closely he may have glanced at the notes, maybe once.

It's no big deal. Even the best talkers in history have done this. Anyone who does public speaking has notes to work off of. I'd have an issue if it was word for word, his entire promo, which it wasn't. I give Cena credit for calling him out on it but honestly, it's no big deal.

As for the promo, I like that he clarified the "never leaving" comments. I also like that he flipped the script on Cena when he said Cena does it for the guys in the back, the Rock does it for the fans.

 

[Peoples_Champ]

I am a big Rock fan, I think he is great and while Cena isn't my favourite, I am not on the hate bandwagon and I respect most of what he does so I will look at this objectively.

Content/Style

I have to laugh at certain members of the IWC slamming The Rock saying 'this was awful, it was not The Rock, it was Dwayne'. Well fuck me, these are the same cretins complaining The Rock is doing his 1999 catchphrases every time he turns up! I'd give the promo a 7.5, it wasn't his best but it wasn't bad by a long shot. He got his message across and he delivered well. Tonight was mostly Dwayne with a little bit of Rock thrown in aswell to appease the live crowd....which brings me to my next point.

Selfish Internet Fans

It amazes me how selfish and short sighted some members of the IWC are. They think that promos are for their benefit and nobody else. The Rock gets the live fans eating out of his hands like nobody else. He says jump, they say how high. A huge part of Rocks promos are for the benefit of the LIVE CROWD. It may not always make great TV but the fans there are having a great time - he gets pops like no other. WWE is not just a TV Production, it is also a LIVE production in front of an audience. WWE is pantomine, it involves interaction and thats what the fans who bought tickets want, they got it and they went home happy. Half these bitches moaning would be marking out if they were there!

The Notes on the arm

The Rock had notes on his arms, that is a given. This was not a work to make Cena look better, that was a shoot from the hip by Cena. Watch the promo again, at one point you see Rock looking down and reading his notes. At the end when he gets on the turnbuckle, he also wipes the notes against his leg to remove them. Is there anything wrong with this? Not at all. Rock is an actor, he can memorize with ease, he does a coherent promo with very little nerves at all, he delivers it well and he is one of the best in the business. Even the internet darling CM Punk uses bullet points on his arm, watch the 'pipe bomb' promo for evidence. I am not making excuses for Rock, but it is totally acceptable and a 'trick of the trade'. What is unacceptable is...

John Cena lacking a bit of class

That was a huge low blow by John Cena bringing that to the fans attention. Using dirty hand tactics like that is like saying The Rock bottom doesnt hurt and he could easily get up. By all means get personal but I felt uncomfortable he is almost giving the game away.

It just got even more personal

Like I said earlier, it just got personal. You could see The Rock was visibly pissed. He looked Cena dead in the eye straight after he said it....there was no pacing around the ring. I also believe he mouthed something into the camera for Cenas benefit.

Follow Up

There is certainly a buzz for me now, not sure about anyone else but I am intrigued to see where this goes. Looks to me like all bets could be off as far as The Rock is concerned. I may not agree with what Cena did but the fued certainly needed something like that. I am interested to see what material the Rock uses. His promo in July (off WWE camera) had lots he could bury Cena with. I hope he does.

Most coherent, well-written post here. Even if I didn't agree with most of it, you really made a good argument. I'll counter some details...


Content/Style

I absolutely agree. Rock was true to form, and personally, I didn't think it was all that boring of a promo. The word I'm looking for is underwhelming - I expected The Rock to bring it above and beyond his already high standard. His promo last night did not meet that expectation. But that being said, he's still an elite talker, him and Punk are tied for best in my mind. And I'm sure his future promos will not be as underwhelming.

Selfish Internet Fans

I disagree here. The IWC complaining about the IWC is cliche as it is, but there were legit reasons why the live crowd and the televised crowd had different opinions on the promo. The live crowd had Rock say Portland a few times, I don't think I need to explain the cheap pop in any detail. The TV viewers saw the notes, weren't pandered to, and judging by twitter and the forums, many changed their opinions of The Rock last night. Also, there were 20,000 or so at the arena last night. There were multi-millions who watched it on TV / DVR / downloaded it. To me, their reaction is more important than an audience that has been pandered to.

The Notes on the arm

Totally agree. And for everyone saying Punk had his on his forearm - the difference between the two promos was content. Punk's pipebomb promo was awesome. Rock's promo last night wasn't. If Rock had done better, it wouldn't have been so much of an issue. But again, this goes back to being underwhelming. If Rock brought it last night, few people would have cared.

John Cena lacking a bit of class

Was it a cheap shot? Yes. But then again, it could be argued that questioning his manhood is a cheap shot. This is WrestleMania season, and I'm pretty sure there is very little that is off-limits. Going all out and breaking industry 'rules' to get heat and sell the PPV is fine by Vince so it's fine by me.

It just got even more personal

Absolutely. For anyone that doesn't think it got (more?) personal, rewatch The Rock after the promo. He's absolutely flustered. He trips over his own lines. His voice starts out raspy. He stutters. He's no longer coherent. Has anyone seen The Rock like this before, ever? When Rock was full-time WWE, he was never like this on PPV, never on WWE TV, hell, I bet he never did that at live shows either. For all the talents that verbally went one-on-one with the great one - not a single one made him flustered. Until John Cena last night. The Rock seems like a pride man, and something like this would have hurt his ego.

Follow Up

How can anyone not be more amp'd for WM? It's still a month away, but I'm dying to see it all come together. Hell, even if this were the go-home show, I would be inclined to buy it. And, in the end, isn't that the goal?

 

[rge2010]

People-Champ - nice reply. Makes a difference from been shot down!!! I will agree to disagree on the internet fans. Take your point, plenty more fans at home watching on TV but you must cater to the live crowd and the Rock does that. A pumped up crowd does wonders for the TV experience.

I loved your assumption of the 'it just got personal'....read this by Mick Foley and Jim Ross. I think the Foley thing relates to the 'notes comment'. It was uncomfortable. I feel bad for Rock that Cena had to point that out and I do think it was uncalled for but it takes this fued to the next level.
_________________________________________________________________________

WWE legend Mick Foley tweeted the following on Monday night regarding The Rock and John Cena's segment that closed the show:

"That promo felt kind of uncomfortable to watch. Not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing."

WWE Hall of Famer Jim Ross seems to think there could be legit heat between The Rock and Cena:

"@JohnCena calling @TheRock a "SOB" tonite shocked me & made me uncomfortable. Sounded more personal than in a professional context...IMO."

"It's getting personal...@JohnCena & @TheRock...legit. Guaranteed. No BS."

When asked directly by a fan whether there is legit heat between Rock and Cena, JR replied :

"If there wasn't before tonight, there certainly seems to be now"

 

[Peoples_Champ]

^ What JR said about Cena calling The Rock an SOB shocked me a bit too, and I bet it shocked a bunch of Cena fans as well. It was completely out of character for him. I acknowledge that everyone is bending their characters a bit during WM season, but for the clean-cut face to call another man an SOB (a week after saying he didn't respect The Rock) was another level to itself.

The promos have become increasingly personal in my opinion, and it reminds me of HBK & Bret from 1997, right before Bret left WWFE. We all know there was actual heat between the two at the time, and the promos between The Rock and Cena seem very similar.

One other thing - Cena had a shit-eating grin on his face when he said he was going to kick Rock's ass all over WM. What if The Rock does put over Cena on April 1, and that was the intention all along (he came back for the sole purpose of putting over Cena)? If I were The Rock and, knowing this, Cena smirks in my face and implies he'll be going over at WM - how would I feel?

 

[Dmbfantomas]

You sound incredibly stupid. It isn't shoving down your throat when his catchphrases are chanted amongst a good percentage of the audience. It isn't shoved down your throat when the crowd chants whatever the fuck The Rock wants them to chant. Part of being a good mic worker is getting the crowd to react to you - positively or negatively. The Rock does that and has done that since day one. Not one member on these boards can come up with a logical argument for The Rock sucking tonight because he didn't. He connected with the fans just as good, if not better than he ever has before. There isn't a single wrestler that can hold the audience in the palm of their hands like that. If you ask me, this generation can take a few notes on how to deliver a damn promo like him.

It is the People are Sheep effect to the extreme. People like the Rock right now because they keep being told over and over again that they are supposed to like the Rock. That it's special that Rock is here. It's an amazing occasion. Watch when he tried to get that stupid Boots 2 Asses thing over. He had to keep saying it over and over, painfully. He repeats a line over and over again, like he's basically yelling "YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO BE CHANTING THIS NOW!"

I find it amusing that the one catchphrase that actually came organically was far and away the only really good one which was the lady parts bit.

The Rock is simply a relic, being brought out for people to gawk at because it is rare. He's a shitty actor (Be Cool aside), and all of the terrible techniques he picked up trying to be a film actor are ruining him. He's not edgy anymore, he's rather boring. I feel like I'm obligated to watch his promos now, but for a totally different reason than in his prime. In his prime, I felt obligated to watch them because I didn't want to miss genius. I'd liken it to as a film fan feeling obligated to see Casablanca. Present-Day Rock, I feel obligated to watch him because I'm just trying to see why exactly people think he is still good, trying to see what is really there. And there's nothing. The Emperor is naked.

 

[Headman]

So you think Eve deserved to have ALL the blame for what happened? She didn't. A true man would own up, not put it all on the girl.

Now, you need to get on youtube and watch the Attitude Era. And Flair. Then you'll see what being "on fire" is all about. cena doesn't come close to that. And never will.

Hey, I'd give cena credit if he earned it. He earned some props in 2002-2004 with thuganomics. He clowned lesnar good. He punked Vince and that Japanese guy. Not bad stuff. But since then, he has been shit.

lol I need to Youtube the attitude era? I was in my 20's during the attitude era. I went to more wrestling shows in that era than any other era. I do not need a reminder. If you have a problem dumping on women the attitude era should be your least favorite.

Was it fair to give the blame to Eve? Hmmm, let's see. Yes. She gets to turn heel and fill the role of top heel diva on RAW that was previously occupied by the Bellas. She gets more heat and more tv time as a result, so yes I think this is a pretty nice reward for her.

My problem with you isn't your hate for Cena. Honestly, I agree with people all the time in the Cena bashing threads when their points are valid not not just crap they heard spewed from someone else. You on the other hand are a loud mouth twit who runs down others and then when you get called out on it accuse them of starting a flame war. Your arguments are poorly thought out, but that doesn't stop you from running your mouth every chance you get. Most of all, you are a blind mark who will never stray from your one sided point of view so arguing with you is about as pointless as every post you've made on WZ thus far. Thanks for the rep btw. It goes nicely with the overwhelming amount of good rep I got for putting you in your place a few days back.

 

[AdrianCLE]

Just want to add this, just watched the Rocks Toronto heel promo, the goldberg/ guitar promos/ his promo before survivor series and nothing was on his wrist, something seems fishy. Just saying.

 

[KnowMyRole-ShutYourMouth]

This doesn't feel like John Cena vs. The Rock. This feels like the WWE Machine vs. Dwayne Johnson. I mean, who else is going to come out and publicly trash The Rock when he's the reason you are getting as fat of a WM check that you got (27) and will be getting (28).

Look, I get the idea that Vince would want to keep his options open incase Cena went down. That's ultimately the reason I think Orton & Punk have been so vocal. If for whatever reason John went down, you had substitutes that would make sense.

But this whole feud seems to based on Vince's sour grapes that The Rock broke through into a business Vince will never get to. John Cena is just the mouth piece. And NO ONE is getting behind the propaganda that the WWE is spewing. Just listen to the reactions.

Half the audience hates YOUR lead "babyface" and your audience has shrunk significantly since Rocky left. This is childish bullshit. John Cena has NOT ever been in a position where he was offered more money by an institution outside of wrestling where he looked himself in the mirror and said, "Naw, screw all that money. I wanna wrestle."

I could rant all day on this. I'm just gonna stop. This feud just doesn't hit home with me, and I think that feeling resonates with a lot of fans. Match up the Chris Jericho/CM Punk promo with John Cena/The Rock. You can literally feel the trust (Y2J/Punk) and the lack there of (Cena/Rock) IN their promos. Punk and Jericho are willing to work together and put each other over in order to put THEMSELVES over. Rock and Cena: there's legitimate hard feelings, and they are not even maximizing it. They'd rather tear each other down than build the other up.

And it starts with the fact that when Rock walks onto the stage, the writing is already against him. Look at the BS "notes on (his) wrist." Cena has no legs to stand on, so they have to resort to shit like that. I'd much rather have someone come prepared to do their job and knock the ball out of the park, than come out and spray paint "poopie" on a car. Just because you are "there" does not make you good. Fuck, this went on too long. No one will read.

 

[MrMojoRisin]

I'm 99% confident the notes line was a work. Keep in mind that McMahon doesn't allow things to be on TV unless he plans them first.

If it wasn't a work??? Well we'll find out if that's true when we see what type of push Cena gets after Wrestlemania. If he somehow ends up in the doghouse after the big show, then you'll know that he went into business for himself last night and forgot that he's supposed to be working.

Considering the fact that there was a time in the business where Cena would have been beaten to within an inch of his life in the showers as soon as he got backstage, and then blackballed from ever working anywhere but a high school gym again for what he said to the Rock... and Cena knows that... I say work.

 

[rge2010]

I'm 99% confident the notes line was a work. Keep in mind that McMahon doesn't allow things to be on TV unless he plans them first.

If it wasn't a work??? Well we'll find out if that's true when we see what type of push Cena gets after Wrestlemania. If he somehow ends up in the doghouse after the big show, then you'll know that he went into business for himself last night and forgot that he's supposed to be working.

Considering the fact that there was a time in the business where Cena would have been beaten to within an inch of his life in the showers as soon as he got backstage, and then blackballed from ever working anywhere but a high school gym again for what he said to the Rock... and Cena knows that... I say work.

You do know The Rock was seen looking at his notes dont you? He also wiped them off as he did his pose on the turnbuckle. If this IS a work its very good one with extra attention to detail.

I say this wasn't a work. The Rock looked so fucked off with Cena pulling that stunt. Wrestling has changed, 4th walls, kayfabe, all being broken. I dont justify it, I like it old skool but its happening way to often. Look at the fucking t-shirts WWE have just released.

 

[rge2010]

Just watched the promo again. Not sure why people are saying The Rock stuttered after Cena left? He muddle up the world 'Wrestlemania' and that was it.

The Rock...Dwayne Johnson.....Dwayne Johnson......The Rock part was to reiterate a point about Cena confusing everyone on who he liked. Cena said he liked The Rock but not Dwayne Johnson.