K
Kourtney_Game
Guest
You guys are hilarious honestly..... anyways this thread has nothing to do with buyrates and whatnot.....sly, name me a couple of wrestlers that u dont particualary like so i can praise them in every way possible...
- Status
He was on the card and in the main event of both PPV's so you can't just rule it out. Have a look at what I just told you about Backlash and Vengeance neither had a bad card. Cena was in the main feuds both times. They were both predictable. The buyrate bombed. Even with 3 and 4 other great superstars it was predictable and Cena once again overcomes all odds. That my friend gets very boring after awhile unless your 10 years old or a girl that knows nothing about wrestling...
Hahaha..
Batista
Monty Brown
The entire ROH roster (with particular focus on Bryan Danielson)
Have at it!
Oh, and if RVDGurl is watching....Rob Van Damn and Sabu.
Go Steiners!
I don't defend Cena because everyone else hates him, I do it because so many people are misguided by this "smark" definition of wrestling. And, they don't understand that wrestling comes in a variety of forms, and the great ones all understand the fundamental concept of wrestling. Entertainment in a realistic, logical form. And, that is why Cena is great.
So, you are calling me a 10 year old girl?
The problem is that you, like most other smarks, don't seem to understand the bigger picture. You get so caught up in the present, and don't see the long-term implications, and all the circumstances surrounding it. Take for example, HHH's reign of terror. Think how many people hated him, couldn't stand him, and bashed him at every cornet. And, now he's one of the biggest smark favorites around.
Don't get caught up in the short-term, look long-term, and do it with patience. Understand that Vince McMahon knows a whole hell of a lot more than you or I, and is the greatest businessman in wrestling history. Trust him.
K
Kourtney_Game
Guest
Well Ive loved Triple H ever since his turning from being Pompus Mr. Hearst Helmsley into Dx bad boy with micheals and Chyna and not once did i turn away from him and yes he was criticized like hell during late 02-04 however people were criticizing him for stupid reasons like his backstage powers and his cheating, but im not the kind of person who betrays wrestlers i like them and i stay with them, which is obviously how u are with cena, and i dont have anything agaisnt that i just disagree with ur pathetic reasoning
How could anyone take up for any of them. They suck. Me and You seem to agree on something Sly
I don't bash Cena because everyone else does it. I just have my opinion on what I think about him. I just don't see why people think he is such a great wrestler. I got give it to you Sly you have took me from despising(sp)Cena to I don't like or hate the guy on the poll. I don't like the way he is booked as a superman character or his lack of wrestling skills. His character is becoming stale to me. Me and You obviously have a different type of entertainment we like and dislike. But so does everyone. I think Cena should just take some much needed time off go film another movie work on his wrestling a bit. When he comes back he will still be bashed but I have alot of respect for him outside of the ring. He's the face of the WWE like him or hate him. He can be great but he has some work to do IMO.
watchingandwaiting
Unashamed Cena fan
I couldn't have asked for a better segue than your comment about Cena's character being stale. Slyfox brought this up about the promo that Cena and Lashley cut before the GAB, but I think this past Raw was an even better example of the continued evolution of the Cena character. Everyone complains that he's always playing the "underdog champ" card. But ever since the Lashley mini-feud that hasn't been the case. During that short program, Cena's character was the voice of experience talking down to the rookie Lashley. Not at all an underdog move. Equally telling were the "who do the famous guys pick" promos. It wasn't a "how can Cena possible stop Lashley" but rather hype for a match that was between equals. Again, not an underdog gimmick. This past Monday's Raw was even more blatant than that. Cena basically ordering around Kennedy and Carlito..the way he called out Randy Orton (not even remotely similar to how he called out Khali) and the way the Cena/Carlito match went with Cena completely toying with Carlito (ps. add "noogie" the the Cena move list).
The change is a lot more subtle than if Cena threw on a new outfit, facepaint, or a mask, but there is a definite shift from "underdog" to "confident champ" if you are willing to watch with open eyes.
I never once said I didn't like the Bobby Lashley vs John Cena feud. The more I watch the promos,matches and build up. It was great LOADS better than what Cena had done in previous feuds. Also Lashley impressed me and devoloped better mic skills during that promo. The bad thing though is the booking of the storyline. The were calling that a dream match. Bullshit. Not yet it wasn't they made it seem that way so Cena would look better when he beat Lashley. That match is not even close to a dream match. Rock vs Austin my ass. Cena and Lashley had a good feud and build up Match was good but dragged on and shoved down our throats a little too much. If Lashley wasn't injured I wouldn't have minded it going on. But Cena dropped the ball again this past Monday Night. He needs to quit trying to be The Rock because he isn't and never will be. He came out said the same bullshit about how the champ is still here and then called out Randy Orton only to lose later on during the night. Right now it seems fishy that hes going to win again at SS. That's my point he wins at SS. I'm done at least for awhile. I'm sick of seeing the same exact champion month after month after month. The was he's booked is terrible. Nobody wants to see superman characters anymore. People had enough of that in the 80's and early 90's. Cena/Lashley good short feud and decent match...Cena/Khali...terrible. Randy/Cena looking ok so far but nothing special..
watchingandwaiting
Unashamed Cena fan
I wasn't trying to say anything about your feelings on the Cena/Lashley feud. The only point I was making was it was at that point where Cena's character shift occurred. As for the beginning of Raw.. I don't understand how you saw it as the same old shit. Sure the core of his character of still there, but Cena dropping "The champ is here" would be like Rock dropping "If you smell.." or Austin not using "cause Stone Cold said so"... It was the rest of the promo that was different.. In the past its been "I know I'm gonna get my ass kicked, but I don't care and I'll figure out some way to win"...now its "if you wanna test me, I'm gonna kick your ass".. To me that is a pretty big change. And give Orton/Cena some time. They still have what? 3 weeks to build it up? I kind of like the slow burn strategy they are using, although I look for things to pick up next week. Maybe a Cena and Cody Rhodes against Orton and Carltio tag match as the main event.. And if that is the case, then a side effect of the Cena/Orton feud, no matter how it turns out, will be the elevation of Carlito and the establishment of Cody..both of which bode well for the future of the WWE
K
Kourtney_Game
Guest
Funny thing is when cena doesnt have the belt lets see whst catch phrase he uses unlike austin or rock catch phrases it had nothing to do with the championship but anyways im just going to think positive and enjoy this orton cena fued and pray that orton wins the title and i would be more than happy to see them shake after the match or better yet, have cena go heel and start attacking orton to a array of boos. i just want cena to go heel, i think it would help him alot. i still wouldnt like him, but as ive said before i'd stomache him then watch all thses wrestling fanboys and gurls boo him and ask why cena why, those signs never cease to humor me...all these fucking trader fans....
J
jawn87
Guest
dont care what anyone has to say. i think if cena was to use more of a movelist than just 5 or 6, he would be better. yes, a heel turn would be sweet cause i remember when he was a heel, everyone loved him then more than they love him now. i think taking the title off him is a great idea but you all know they cant do it for long, in all honesty, if he stays on Raw, turn him heel, if he happens to get sent to smackdown, keep him face and throw him in the WHC race, because if he wins it, at least he'll lose it to someone whos already in that race with him whos been pushed a lot and it can be back and forth with different people all the time, but no matter what, hes never gonna be out of the world title picture because hes just not in the stage of his career anymore to compete in the midcard slot. i guess what im tryin to say is...get use to it.
Get used it guys Cena's "The Man" in the WWE right now.And franky I dont blame Vince for pushing him soooo much.In order for prowrestling to survive it needs "megastars" like Austin,Rock,Hogan.Hart and yes JOHN CENA.They needed to put him over with the title& have him wrestle a protected style for tht reason.But no that he's been put over enough now,I think he'll have more freedom in his career interms of both fueds& wrestling moves.
Downward Spiral
I'm Not From Your Country
After watching Raw on Wednesday, one thing came to mind after I saw Carlito hit Cena with the backsnapper: where was Cena's supposed 'great seling ability'? Carlito hit the manouevre, won the match, and spat in Cena's face. Carlito walked up the ramp, and suddenly, Cena was getting up, gripping his back with a look that could hardly be described as 'in agony'. Then, around 5 seconds later, Cena seemed pain-free, just looking out at a shocked Carlito with a smile on his face.
First of all, that is so amaturish that it's beyond comprehension. Here is Cena, a guy that is supposedly one of the better sellers in the WWE, yet he pulls a Hogan, and gets up as if nothing happened. Carlito's move obviously would and looks like a painful move, yet Cena absolutely no-sold it by getting up like that. Hell, I would have been happy if he was there holding his back the whole time, but less than about 20 seconds after the move, Cena was up and looked never better (except for the apple on his face.)
And don't say that we are 'digging up reasons to hate Cena' because this was an obvious flaw right here. If you've been at the top as long as Cena has, you wouldn't expect him to just no-sell a finishing move like this. There is always a limit that you have when trying to make someone look like the wrestling superman, and Cena just proved that he is well past being a superman with this one.
It's a finisher that anyone else sells, because it's supposed to be incredibly painful. Certainly didn't help Carlito out to have Cena up quicksmart, and smiling none-the-less.
First of all, that is so amaturish that it's beyond comprehension. Here is Cena, a guy that is supposedly one of the better sellers in the WWE, yet he pulls a Hogan, and gets up as if nothing happened. Carlito's move obviously would and looks like a painful move, yet Cena absolutely no-sold it by getting up like that. Hell, I would have been happy if he was there holding his back the whole time, but less than about 20 seconds after the move, Cena was up and looked never better (except for the apple on his face.)
And don't say that we are 'digging up reasons to hate Cena' because this was an obvious flaw right here. If you've been at the top as long as Cena has, you wouldn't expect him to just no-sell a finishing move like this. There is always a limit that you have when trying to make someone look like the wrestling superman, and Cena just proved that he is well past being a superman with this one.
It's a finisher that anyone else sells, because it's supposed to be incredibly painful. Certainly didn't help Carlito out to have Cena up quicksmart, and smiling none-the-less.
Da Vinci's Nightmare
WZCW's Own Arch Angel 0-1
When were Cena ment to be the one of the best sellers in the WWE, do you not remember WM where shawn spent an age workin the leg an cena were just walking around like nothing has happened?
Downward Spiral
I'm Not From Your Country
I based that comment on the fact that I have heard a number of people use that as his defence. Countless times have I heard 'Cena's selling is phenomenal' or something like that, and then I see this. I just honestly cannot believe how he could have the 'brains' to just get up like that. It completely devalued Carlito's move, and again, made Cena look unstoppable. He lost the match, got spat in the face. yet he still finds a way to 'Hulk Up' the situation. Carlito got the win, and in my eyes, he ended up looking like he had a pretty weak finisher. Yeah, it won him the match, but it doesn't make sense to have him pin a guy that gets up just a few moments later. So now, I hope people will think before they come to Cena's defence using his 'selling ability' (if we needed more evidence as to the fact that that 'ability' has disappeared if it ever was reality, it's here.)
Carlito was basically squashed trough the whole match, hit his finisher and won. A finisher out of nowhere was enough to pin Cena, how does that make Cena unstoppable? And doesn't that make anything else than Carlitos finisher look weak?
Downward Spiral
I'm Not From Your Country
Did you read the part where I mentioned that Cena got up right after he hit the move, not even holding his back after a few moments? Yeah, it won him the match, but you'd expect that with anyone's finisher. It was Cena getting up that I'm complaining about.
And you make another good point in that Cena looked unstoppable in the match as well. Of course, Carlito got the win, but Cena still has to look good. He can't lose a match that's even. If someone gets a win over him, Cena's got to dominate the opponent first. I would say that it makes him look unstoppable, in that not even a finisher that has taken down many an opponent, can keep Cena down and in pain for long.
And you make another good point in that Cena looked unstoppable in the match as well. Of course, Carlito got the win, but Cena still has to look good. He can't lose a match that's even. If someone gets a win over him, Cena's got to dominate the opponent first. I would say that it makes him look unstoppable, in that not even a finisher that has taken down many an opponent, can keep Cena down and in pain for long.
Yes, Cena got up right after the pinfall, but he was down for a three count and that's all that matters. Do you honestly believe McMahon would job Lashley out for Cena, let Lashley squash Carlito a day after that and let Carlito dominate Cena the next week?
If it would have been a title match, he wouldn't be champ anymore just because Carlito hit his finisher... the message is, Cena is not unstoppable and Carlitos finisher is effective. He could have won the ironman contest right after the pinfall, he still would have lost the match and the title.
If it would have been a title match, he wouldn't be champ anymore just because Carlito hit his finisher... the message is, Cena is not unstoppable and Carlitos finisher is effective. He could have won the ironman contest right after the pinfall, he still would have lost the match and the title.
Azrael has pretty much hit the nail on the head.
First, the reason why Cena looked so dominant in their match was BECAUSE he was going to lose. I remember watching the match at the time and thinking, "damn, they are really having Cena job Carlito out", but then the end came and it all made sense. Remember, Carlito has been jobbing for the last year and a half. So, it's not like him being made to look bad is a big deal because he's been made to look bad for a long time.
Cena was booked to look dominant in that match for 2 reasons. One, it fits his new attitude that he's been displaying for a while now. His new attitude, for those who have been paying attention, has been one of confident assurance, cocky almost, and one that says he IS the best and everyone else is beneath him. See the Lashley promo on Raw before GAB where he talks down to Lashley. And apparently, he did the same thing on Raw with Carlito. Cena is getting a new attitude, and his dominance and showing his superior ability matched that attitude. Two, Cena was made to look dominant in the match so the ending would be a complete surprise, and give Randy Orton massive amount of heel heat since Orton is the only reason Carlito won that match.
So now that we've addressed how Cena and Carlito match went, let's move on the selling. I have a question. How long do you want Cena to sell a move that had no prior damage to it? Carlito had done absolutely no work on the back, and the win was more out of shock than it was physically beating the man down so far he couldn't win. Cena stays down for the three, he stays down to get an apple in his face, he stays down while Carlito exits the ring, he stays down while Orton goes to the back...it wasn't until Carlito was at the top of the ramp before Cena got back up.
How long do you want him to lay on the mat selling a surprise move that had no prior damage?
Cena sold it fine. Quit finding excuses.
And, I swear, I think I'm going to start red repping people who talk about WM 23 and try to use that as evidence that Cena is a poor seller. Seriously fucking Christ, it is getting so god damned old and repetitive, especially since I've proven time and again that Cena is a good seller and that the WM thing was not about no-selling but rather overselling.
First, the reason why Cena looked so dominant in their match was BECAUSE he was going to lose. I remember watching the match at the time and thinking, "damn, they are really having Cena job Carlito out", but then the end came and it all made sense. Remember, Carlito has been jobbing for the last year and a half. So, it's not like him being made to look bad is a big deal because he's been made to look bad for a long time.
Cena was booked to look dominant in that match for 2 reasons. One, it fits his new attitude that he's been displaying for a while now. His new attitude, for those who have been paying attention, has been one of confident assurance, cocky almost, and one that says he IS the best and everyone else is beneath him. See the Lashley promo on Raw before GAB where he talks down to Lashley. And apparently, he did the same thing on Raw with Carlito. Cena is getting a new attitude, and his dominance and showing his superior ability matched that attitude. Two, Cena was made to look dominant in the match so the ending would be a complete surprise, and give Randy Orton massive amount of heel heat since Orton is the only reason Carlito won that match.
So now that we've addressed how Cena and Carlito match went, let's move on the selling. I have a question. How long do you want Cena to sell a move that had no prior damage to it? Carlito had done absolutely no work on the back, and the win was more out of shock than it was physically beating the man down so far he couldn't win. Cena stays down for the three, he stays down to get an apple in his face, he stays down while Carlito exits the ring, he stays down while Orton goes to the back...it wasn't until Carlito was at the top of the ramp before Cena got back up.
How long do you want him to lay on the mat selling a surprise move that had no prior damage?
Cena sold it fine. Quit finding excuses.
And, I swear, I think I'm going to start red repping people who talk about WM 23 and try to use that as evidence that Cena is a poor seller. Seriously fucking Christ, it is getting so god damned old and repetitive, especially since I've proven time and again that Cena is a good seller and that the WM thing was not about no-selling but rather overselling.
Mexican Geek
It's good to be back!
The only thing new I found in Cena is his attire. Wait, even that is over used, when Cena was a rapper. Cena has been working with the overconfident attitude for so long, (Feud vs Umaga, anyone?) and the one that says he is the best (everytime he howls "the champ is here", generally is because he made a incredible "new" speech about how he defeated every inimaginable ammount of odds, so, that attitude is nothing new either)
I posted my comment about that promo. and i still think it was one of the worst promos by John Cena. How in the freaking world he dared say to Lashley that he (lashley) only was thinking to fight anyone on his sight?? If i'm not wrong, Lashley is not working in a beauty parlor, he is a wrestler, and the wrestlers FIGHTS. And talking about domminance, Lashley pwned Cena in his own talking game before the GAB, without even talking so much.(anyone remember that wwe.com interview?).
Maybe that's why RAW ratings are so great. The top star gets a new attitude, and nobody cares, because you can't even notice that, it's all repetitive.
With that said, how can you call the result a surprise?? Dont tell me you believed that Carlito was getting a legit push and got the win surprisingly?? We all knew what will happen with Orton seated on the ringside. So it's not a surprise win, at all.
Why dont you ask that to every star who received a Stone cold stunner??
Hell, even Donald Trump knows how to sell a super botched stunner!! Why Cena dont sell anything but merch?? Yes, because he is unstoppable.pfft.
...and suddenly, he got up like nothing happened, and make his "im angry, and you will pay with blood" routine. And the pain? do you call that a good selling? i dont.
Again, it's not about laying on the mat only, you have to completely SELL the injury, not laying one or two minutes and then stepping up like nothing happened. Even Lashley knows how to sell his injuries!! (see: feud vs Umaga)
Do whatever you want with the rep, seriously. I payed for the WM23 PPV, for the WM23 DVD, and i think as a fan of the product, I have the right to complain about it, as much as I want. If Cena is a bad seller, well, he better start to learn some new tricks to correct that. The truth is, he sold shit at WM23.
Sorry if it sounds old and repetitive, but i think the same thing about his title reign. And i'm not repp'ing you red because you support that. But again, maybe you'll get tired of red-repping not only me, but a lot of posters around here.
Personally, i dont think Cena is a terrible seller, but sometimes his "superior" attitude makes him forget that he is one more backthere.
What are you talking about? When has he ever gone into a feud or match with the smugness and confidence he does now. It was always "I'll bring it" or "I'll do whatever it takes" or "I don't know if I can, but if you want some, come get some". Now it's like "You have no chance" or "Who are you?".
It's different. Maybe it should be less subtle so fans who don't get subtlety understand it. I don't know. Hell, there are still people who think he's a Marine. Maybe that's the problem. IWC wrestling fans aren't smart enough to catch on to the subtleties. I don't know.
You're one of the few.
No, because I don't read WWE.com...kind of like most wrestling viewers. How did Lashley "pwn" (which isn't even a word) Cena? Cena made Lashley look like the upstart challenger, and put him down the entire time.
Or maybe it's because Triple H is gone, Vince McMahon is gone, HBK is gone etc.?
Bullshit. No one thought Carlito would pin Cena 1-2-3 without some kind of physical interference from Orton. And, when I say physical interference, I mean an RKO or a chair shot or something like that. Orton did little more than tickle Cena, while Carlito used the Backstabber for the win. No one thought that Carlito would go over Cena clean 1-2-3, with only minor outside distraction from Orton.
Donald Trump's not a wrestler. And, it was always ridiculous for a wrestler, who had not been in a match, to sell a Stunner for 5 minutes. It makes no sense.
But, are we really going to compare Steve Austin and Carlito and decide who has (in kayfabe) a more powerful finisher?
And, by suddenly, I'm sure you mean slowly.
What are you talking about? If I were to kick you in the back, would you still be clutching and grabbing your back and making awful pain faces 3 minutes afterward? If you did, I'd call you a major wimp. A minute is MORE than enough time to get the pain shaken out from one move.
Oh, and here's the video for you. I want you to show me how "quickly" Cena got up. Also, keep in mind that when the camera is on Carlito and going through the replay, not to mention when they are off the air, you have no idea what Cena is doing with his face.
[youtube]Zo2Jdm7ub10[/youtube]
It takes Cena nearly a minute to get to his feet. He sold it as hard as most wrestlers do and as much as was realistic. You lose.
Again, Cena's biggest problem was OVER selling, not the no-selling. And, I'll admit, his instance of OVER selling was poor. But, again, that doesn't make him a bad seller. If one instance of poor selling makes him a bad seller, than Randy Savage, Ricky Steamboat, Ric Flair, Harley Race, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Steve Austin, The Rock, Triple H, Chris Benoit etc. are all poor sellers.
One instance of poor selling in the countless matches he's had does not make him a poor seller. To continue to claim otherwise is completely ignorant.
Mexican Geek
It's good to be back!
Last time i heard the "If you want some.." routine, was before the GAB when Kennedy and Booker stopped the contract signing,less than a month ago; and if by "you have no chance" attitude, you are refering to the poor comedy segments when he mocks Mr Kennedy...now that's confidence.
1) 7 years old kids maybe??
2) are you suggesting that IWC are not smart enough to catch the deepness and complexity of John Cena's character? I think we got it since Hogan: There's always an invincible superhero, with some stones on the road, but nothing really serious...come on, even the 7 years old on number 1 knows this.
funny, because a lot of the threads here regarding news, events or just random wrestlers notes are based on WWE.com info. Unless you believe all the time what the "accurate" Ryan Clark and pals has to say, of course.
And regarding the word PWN..Slyfox isn't even a WZ nickname.. dont believe me? Check slyfox.com LOL!
Triple H has been airing his return promos at least for 1 month and a half, and nothing happened to the ratings, Vince "died", and we couldn't see the ratings exploding, HBK has a career threatening injury vs Orton, and nobody gave a fuck, at least ratings didnt show that.
dont you think that Cena showing on everysingle PPV as the RAW main event, has something to do with the actual ratings? Why dont you say that to the countless fans who thinks that this year PPVs, were so bad, with some mediocre exceptions. And I really dont care if Cena wins at Summerslam, but the main thing is, he has everything to deliver a true Classic against Randy Orton, so he can lift those ratings again. He just need to "deliver". Not gonna happen though.
Sorry, but it would had been pointless to watch a brawl between Orton and Cena, or even a chairshot or another RKO. Why? They need to create a tense atmosphere between them, but without giving the edge to just one. If Orton had attacked Cena, he would had the edge for the match, thus making it less anticipated.
And I know Randy already gave him an RKO, but that was just for oppening the feud.
1) Thats worse, the Donald selling the move better than the champ. Shame on him.
2)No, i was just talking how BAD he sells the move, not how LONG.
My apologies, i didnt know that one minute is the standard time for selling a finisher.
The sad part is other wrestlers sells (or sold) his moves way better than the champ. Example: Chris Benoit. You say that Cena over-sell his moves? Benoit used to sold his in less time, and a million times better.
And if you call me a major-wimp, i would tell Prax, so he could ban you
And unfortunately, i cant see youtube here at work(bastards!), but i promise to check when i get home.
And i didn't loose. Cena Did.
Maybe you want to read my post again, At the end, you will find this:
that instance of selling (we wont agree if it was no-selling or over-selling, so, i'll keep it just as "selling", temporary) was POOR. Thus resting shine to the match. Sure, he knows how to do it
so, why he didn't do it? Maybe he is the ignorant one.
I'm saying that there is still substantial numbers of posters who think Cena is still trying to pull off the marine gimmick. I'm also trying to say, that Cena's attitude is changing before their very eyes, and some people don't see it. Maybe it's too subtle of a change. I don't know. But, Cena IS changing, which is my point from the very beginning. He is evolving.1) 7 years old kids maybe??
2) are you suggesting that IWC are not smart enough to catch the deepness and complexity of John Cena's character? I think we got it since Hogan: There's always an invincible superhero, with some stones on the road, but nothing really serious...come on, even the 7 years old on number 1 knows this.
The real news is generally provided by Dave Meltzer. If Meltzer says it, it is probably as close to the truth as you'll find in the business. And Slyfox isn't a WZ nickname, it is an e-mail address that my cousins and I created...oh...ten years or so ago. Slyfox has been around longer than "pwn". Why not just say "own"? It's allowed here, it's not banned.
Return promos for Summerslam, not Raw.
This was my point? That McMahon helps draw ratings as well.
I'm not sure you understand what I'm saying. By losing these guys, it hurts ratings. That was my point.
Based on history, if anyone fails to deliver in the Cena vs. Orton feud, it will be Orton. History shows that to be true.
What's your point? How does that change the fact that nobody saw Carlito winning that match clean with only a distraction from Orton? If I told you before Raw, that Carlito would pin Cena clean 1-2-3, and Randy Orton would not lay a harming finger on Cena, would you have taken that bet? Of course not, so don't say it was obvious.
How did he sell it bad?
I didn't know there was a standard time, but from what I've been told by you, it's about 3 minutes. Why are you contradicting yourself here?
You need to clarify this paragraph because I'm not understanding you.
He made a mistake? How come Triple H on either Summerslam or a Raw near Summerslam last year, gets taken out in the early part of the match, lays on the ground the entire match, gets a hot tag and then acts like he was never hurt? How come on Raw in Milan, Cena works HBK's back the entire match, but HBK can still do his nip-up, and go to the top rope for the elbow drop? How come Ric Flair can be the worst seller in history and still be considered great? How come Randy Savage got beat up, and then got a burst of energy which led him to deliver flying punches? How come Rey gets whipped an entire match, but when his opponent is lying on the ropes, he has great energy in doing a 619 and a West Coast pop?
Everyone has mistakes. Some do it repeatedly. John Cena is one of the better sellers in the WWE, because it is realistic, it advances the match, and it progresses the story of the match. And, one instance of poor selling, in what is probably over a 1000 matches now, is not a good enough reason to say he is a bad seller.
I don't even think most people could give a crap about how wrestlers sell moves. Until Cena's involved. Then it's all "Cena didn't sell this, and Cena didn't sell that". I'm not a fan of Cena (well, I've started to like him a bit more, as much as I hate myself for it), but even I can see that's clinging at straws. Anyway, I think for people to really recognize a change in Cena it needs to be less subtle. This is professional wrestling, subtlty isn't its strong point. Now that it's been pointed out, I did notice that Cena has become (or, has become more comfortable being) cocky and self-assured, while still not dropping his face stance. Still, he could come out dressed as a clown for all I care. It's still John Cena under it all, it's still the same guy, he's still held the title for what I and many, many others consider far, far too long. No matter what "new" gimmick he pulls out, people are going to find him stale. And I mean actually stale, not just "saying it for the sake of it" stale. I'll address the whole Orton/Cena thing later, when I have a bit more energy.
ya im starting to see how ppl try and find anything to bash cena with, im not a cena fan, i did hate him b4, now i just dont like him, but i have to say, if there is one thing cena does well IMHO its selling moves, sometimes he does over-sell but even the likes of HBK or flair over sell many times, he does usually sell moves better than many other guys in the WWE, and hes also one of the best guys on the mic nowadays (out of the young guys) if only his move set wasnt so stale and his gimmick wasnt directed to 10 year olds i could actually be behind him
though he is starting to get better in ring, but doesnt pass average, lets see if in the future he learns some cool new tricks XD
though he is starting to get better in ring, but doesnt pass average, lets see if in the future he learns some cool new tricks XD
Mexican Geek
It's good to be back!
That's one huge problem. Cena first started with the rapper gimmick, which i find very entertaining, then, the marine...for me, kind of Hogan-esque, and boring.
And back again with a mix of white rapper and tugh guy, the actual one.
But out of the gimmick, what else has changed? sure, he now have a lot of experience, and maybe a couple of new moves.... But the "depth" of the character hasn't changed, the same bad jokes, the same style....
i would love to see Cena as a heel, maybe just for 5 or 6 months, but this could be great for his future career, he need to see both sides of the coin, just as Rock, Hogan, Austin, Taker, etc, did.
This whole change of "attitude" is not going to lead anywhere, unfortunately, the character would be staled until....well, for a long time.
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