Wrestlemania XXX: WWE WHC - Orton VS Batista VS ?

[JoeFromTomsRiver]

If you don't think adding Bryan to the main event match at WM was the smart thing to do, I don't know what you're watching.

If you are upset that the fans didn't embrace Batista as the returning hero, and we didn't just get a face Batista vs. heel Orton match for the title, you need to accept the fact that fan reaction at live events, when overwhelming, can change the course of things.

People are upset about these latest developments because they have been proven wrong. They don't like the fact that Bryan fans have gotten what they wanted. They almost sounded like they were talking in kayfabe, about how Bryan is a "B+ player" and doesn't have the look. Basically regurgitating Triple H's promos to us.

But if you guys step down from your soapbox for a minute, and quit bitching about how awful it is that the WWE is listening to their fans, you'll see that this is what Wrestlemania needed.

WWE is about making "moments". After months and months of being "screwed", Bryan gets revenge on his nemesis , AND gets the prize at the end of the show in front of 80,000 people doing the YES chant.

When compared with that, YES, Orton vs. Batista would have been "bad".

 

[d_henderson1810]

I know that's how you guys would feel but I honestly think it would have been better than Cena/Orton again. I'm not saying it would have been the greatest thing ever but it would be better than that crap HHH/Orton match we had and the many Cena/Orton matches in recent months. I wasn't comparing Rock/Austin in terms of rivalry power I was just saying that a key to their rivalry always staying fresh was the constant evolving of characters. You don't think that if Rock never tweaked his gimmick over the years that eventually fans would have grown tired of seeing that same match again and again?

If Batista v Orton was a new match, and they had never fought before, do you think people would be any more interested in seeing it?

If Batista v Orton had been classic matches in the past, and they had the ring skills of an Angle, Benoit or Shawn Michaels, would there be more interest in it?

Or would it not matter, unless Daniel Bryan was in it?

 

[BestWrestlingOpinions]

Everyone was saying that Batista/Orton at WM would have been a disaster but I don't think so. If WWE kept Batista face the way they did then yeah I would agree but Batista/Orton would be completely different than Cena/Orton was a few months ago even though we saw this already.

Here's why. Look back at Stone Cold and The Rock. They faced 3 times at Wrestlemania each time getting great reviews and getting massive reactions from the crowd. The third match in fact had very little build in comparison to the usual amount for feuds. They had so much history already it wasnt needed. Why were they able to do that? Because each time The Rock was a different version of himself. 1999 Rock was completely different from 2001 Rock and both of them were completely different than 2003 Rock so essentially they were 3 different matches with the same wrestlers but in a sense 3 different character clashes.

Here's why John Cena/Randy Orton failed. John Cena has been the same stale, unchanged person he's been since 2005. Randy Orton has been the Viper since 2008 so of course fans wouldn't like a match between the same characters that they've already seen collide many times before. Meanwhile, Batista battled Orton a few years ago too. At that point Orton was in between the Legend Killer and the Viper and Batista was still face. Here we are in 2014 and Orton is pretty much the same now as he was then but Batista is completely different. So far this story they have leading into Wrestlemania is more interesting than anything involving John Cena in a while.

Did you just compare Austin vs the Rock to Orton vs Batista? Just this comparison is enough to figure out that your thread is to troll people, but I digress.

We don't like Orton vs Batista, not because of what you said, but because it should have Bryan in the match. Nothing more nothing less. Think before you make a thread next time.

Oh for the record, it would be a DISASTER. The fans would either be booing the entire match or just leave the arena.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

In my opinion, Orton vs. Batista would've been EXTRAORDINARILY lackluster. When Orton & Batista were feuding for the WWE Championship back in 2009, their feud was pretty damn lousy. I honestly can't remember them having anything really resembling a good match. Batista won the WWE Championship for the first time at the Extreme Rules ppv back in 2009 and he won it by beating Orton in a steel cage match that barely lasted 7 minutes. Batista had to give up the title 2 days later after suffering a torn left bicep. He and Cena would then feud for it during WrestleMania season in 2010 and Batista "quit" the night after WrestleMania.

Orton's been pushed as a top level guy for so long that many fans are just bored with him, even though he's still got a lot of talent. There's just nothing fresh to do with a guy that was a 6 time World Champion and Royal Rumble winner before he was 30 years old. Batista is a genuinely overrated, 45 year old, one dimensional muscle man without a speck of charisma to his name who left WWE for nearly 4 years, pops up out of the blue and is handed the WrestleMania main event. Fans are fully aware that WWE has a roster with a ton of talented and fresh guys who they're interested in. It's 2014 and, frankly, fans aren't interested in seeing rehashes of feuds from 5+ years ago headlining WrestleMania. When you consider that Orton vs. Batista back in the late 2000s flat out sucked, why would fans want to see that again nearly 5 years later when there's a talented roster with a lot of fresh faces that fans are obviously more interested in?

 

[DarksideEric]

If Batista v Orton was a new match, and they had never fought before, do you think people would be any more interested in seeing it?

If Batista v Orton had been classic matches in the past, and they had the ring skills of an Angle, Benoit or Shawn Michaels, would there be more interest in it?

Or would it not matter, unless Daniel Bryan was in it?

If they had not ever faced off before they would not have the same type of build up they have now due to history, everything would be fresh.

With that said, all of your "what ifs," while Batista remains the jackass heel and Orton remains the cocky heel, the match would not be the same quality (especially story and pay off wise) if it was purely limited to Orton and Batista.

 

[adamscott]

I am calling it now. DB beats HHH and in the ME one of two things happens. First Bryans about to win and all the sudden a guy in a hoodie hops the barricade, puts Bryan on his shoulders for a GTS and is revealed as CM Punk (either Orton or Batista pin Bryan). Next night we find out Mcmahon hired him back. Second Bryan wins and Mcmahon comes out and like with Edge at NYR06 he says there is another match that night with a man he recently hired back and out comes Punk to beat Bryan. If Punk doesn't return at WM than it was a legit leaving of the company but I remember a while back there were rumblings that there were BIG plans for Punk at WM. I could see him, Mcmahon, HHH and a couple others knowing about the plan and them taking him off promos and making it seem like he quit was just a creative way to hide this from even crossing our minds. As I said if he doesn't come back at WM it was legit, but I have a gut feeling Punk is gonna end up screwing Bryan.

 

[HBsam31]

I would not have had any interest in Orton vs Batista at all. Batista is a shell of his former self, and the crowd would have shit on the whole match anyway. I think it would have been an extremely boring match from start to finish. Bryan will win and be added to this match, and I think that was the only thing they could do to save the main event.

 

[Dead-Angel]

if WM had original idea money in the bank match, and if bryan loses hes match against hhh, during money in the bank math the briefcase is stole by dragging it up to the roof, and later Hogan announces that he just sign Sting, backstage Sting gives the briefcase to Bryan and says he deserves another chance. Bryan wins, the next day it's announced Sting is a new RAW gm. That's how you introduce him and make history, but wwe are ******s and cant build story like that.

 

[BaronVonBrunk]

I love being a wrestling fan.

There's no obvious winners here, to think so is lame

Randy Orton is my pick to win, and I don't see very many other people picking him. He has the bod, the look and the will. We get a great match no matter what happens, but I want to see this man walk away number one.

Everyone is all Daniel Bryan this and Hunter that. C'mon, let's wait until before the night. Everyone goes through a mix of emotions before a big dance, we'll know what's right when the time comes. I might even change my mind, who knows.

I've watched Randy Orton for a long time, he's been a loyal wrestler for his entire run. He hasn't wandered off to do anything else, he's kept himself in good shape. What can I say? I like his style and if the match was tonight I would be cheering for him to win.

I don't want to cause an argument, I'm really liking the reasons every one else has for who they picked. Please just say who you like and I promise I'll like it.

 

[d_henderson1810]

All you fans want Daniel Bryan to win the title, and main event Wrestlemania, but what if he only achieves one of these, but not the one you thought.

Bryan can win the title, yet who says that he will be the last thing we see when Wrestlemania XXX finishes?

How do we know that WWE won't put on the Triple-Threat second-to-last, and the Undertaker v Brock Lesnar or John Cena v Bray Wyatt match last?

Remember, WMs 8, 11, 26 and 28 didn't have the WWE or World Title as the last match at Wrestlemania, so there is precedence for it.

Maybe if Bryan is in the Triple-Threat, and wins the title, the match may not be put on last as a way to sticking it to the WWE Universe for messing up their original WWE World Title plans, and giving you what you want, without giving you ALL of what you want.

 

[@smarkmouth]

All you fans want Daniel Bryan to win the title, and main event Wrestlemania, but what if he only achieves one of these, but not the one you thought.

Firstly, why are you saying "you fans". Are you not a fan? I don't understand why you'd try to segregate yourself from us. If you are in fact not a fan, like us, what brings you here? I'm not aiming to be disrespectful, but I am a fan of language and how it's used.

If Daniel Bryan only achieves 1/2, it's likely I'll still enjoy Wrestlemania this year. I'm sure I'll dwell on that in a bit.

Bryan can win the title, yet who says that he will be the last thing we see when Wrestlemania XXX finishes?

How do we know that WWE won't put on the Triple-Threat second-to-last, and the Undertaker v Brock Lesnar or John Cena v Bray Wyatt match last?

Remember, WMs 8, 11, 26 and 28 didn't have the WWE or World Title as the last match at Wrestlemania, so there is precedence for it.

I remember around the build up for WM18, where as a fan, I was appalled by the suggestive hype that Hogan v Rock was going to be the main event. The rightful main event should be for the WWF championship, H's vs Jericho, right? Hindsight is 20/20. Thrown was wrong.

Many a time it is appropriate that the main event is not for the main event championship. I disagree with those logistics on paper, but Rock v Cena was more appropriate than Jericho v Punk, as was HBK v Taker II over Batista v Cena. Key word here is 'appropriate'. Arguments can be made for other matches, especially Taker v Lesnar, as the main event. It has to be done for the right reasons.

Maybe if Bryan is in the Triple-Threat, and wins the title, the match may not be put on last as a way to sticking it to the WWE Universe for messing up their original WWE World Title plans, and giving you what you want, without giving you ALL of what you want.

WWE can be petty, no doubt, but to change the order of matches on the 30th WrestleMania to spite smarks is lower than them. That's my hope, at least. I won't be surprised if the card is closed by the championship match or Lesnar/Taker (while I'm excited for Cena/Wyatt, I think it's a stretch for that to be the main event). I won't be surprised, nor will I be spiteful.

I'm a bit lost on your argument. Are you simply trying to express your disinterest in Daniel Bryan's match? Or are you saying that the match doesn't deserve to be the main event? Or (last or, I promise) are you just trying to stick it to Daniel Bryan fans? I'm not knocking you for that last one if you are, I just want to understand your stance.

 

[Softcore Holly]

Anything's possible, but I think it's extremely unlikely. For one it's the main title match, while it doesn't always main event considering the whole unification business I would imagine they would want it in this year's main event to make it seem as important as possible. There's also no bigger stars that can follow that match like Cena and Rock. Cena is huge of course but Bray has a lot way to go before even coming close to main eventing a WM, much less following up the main title match.

Taker-Lesnar are both big stars but considering the lackluster build up to their match along with the extremely obvious outcome there's no way that can follow it either. If either men was retiring it might be a different story but obviously that's not the case.
And of course DB is in the biggest storyline and the biggest storyline gets the main event, simple as that.

Also last time I checked being petty isn't "good for business."

 

[d_henderson1810]

Firstly, why are you saying "you fans". Are you not a fan? I don't understand why you'd try to segregate yourself from us. If you are in fact not a fan, like us, what brings you here? I'm not aiming to be disrespectful, but I am a fan of language and how it's used.

If Daniel Bryan only achieves 1/2, it's likely I'll still enjoy Wrestlemania this year. I'm sure I'll dwell on that in a bit.



I remember around the build up for WM18, where as a fan, I was appalled by the suggestive hype that Hogan v Rock was going to be the main event. The rightful main event should be for the WWF championship, H's vs Jericho, right? Hindsight is 20/20. Thrown was wrong.

Many a time it is appropriate that the main event is not for the main event championship. I disagree with those logistics on paper, but Rock v Cena was more appropriate than Jericho v Punk, as was HBK v Taker II over Batista v Cena. Key word here is 'appropriate'. Arguments can be made for other matches, especially Taker v Lesnar, as the main event. It has to be done for the right reasons.



WWE can be petty, no doubt, but to change the order of matches on the 30th WrestleMania to spite smarks is lower than them. That's my hope, at least. I won't be surprised if the card is closed by the championship match or Lesnar/Taker (while I'm excited for Cena/Wyatt, I think it's a stretch for that to be the main event). I won't be surprised, nor will I be spiteful.

I'm a bit lost on your argument. Are you simply trying to express your disinterest in Daniel Bryan's match? Or are you saying that the match doesn't deserve to be the main event? Or (last or, I promise) are you just trying to stick it to Daniel Bryan fans? I'm not knocking you for that last one if you are, I just want to understand your stance.

My stance is that I don't mind Daniel Bryan per se, but I already feel burnt out by the hype, and he hasn't even main evented Wrestlemania yet.

If he wins, it is so predictable, along with the streak, that WMXXX may be a tad boring.

 

[d_henderson1810]

Firstly, why are you saying "you fans". Are you not a fan? I don't understand why you'd try to segregate yourself from us. If you are in fact not a fan, like us, what brings you here? I'm not aiming to be disrespectful, but I am a fan of language and how it's used.

If Daniel Bryan only achieves 1/2, it's likely I'll still enjoy Wrestlemania this year. I'm sure I'll dwell on that in a bit.



I remember around the build up for WM18, where as a fan, I was appalled by the suggestive hype that Hogan v Rock was going to be the main event. The rightful main event should be for the WWF championship, H's vs Jericho, right? Hindsight is 20/20. Thrown was wrong.

Many a time it is appropriate that the main event is not for the main event championship. I disagree with those logistics on paper, but Rock v Cena was more appropriate than Jericho v Punk, as was HBK v Taker II over Batista v Cena. Key word here is 'appropriate'. Arguments can be made for other matches, especially Taker v Lesnar, as the main event. It has to be done for the right reasons.



WWE can be petty, no doubt, but to change the order of matches on the 30th WrestleMania to spite smarks is lower than them. That's my hope, at least. I won't be surprised if the card is closed by the championship match or Lesnar/Taker (while I'm excited for Cena/Wyatt, I think it's a stretch for that to be the main event). I won't be surprised, nor will I be spiteful.

I'm a bit lost on your argument. Are you simply trying to express your disinterest in Daniel Bryan's match? Or are you saying that the match doesn't deserve to be the main event? Or (last or, I promise) are you just trying to stick it to Daniel Bryan fans? I'm not knocking you for that last one if you are, I just want to understand your stance.

But, think about this, there is a rumor that Sting is going to show up at WMXXX and challenge Undertaker.

What is the WWE plan for this bombshell at the end of WMXXX? I mean, Sting showing up in WWE and challenging the Undertaker at WM31, at the end of Wrestlemania XXX, will be a bigger talking point, and will draw more people to Raw, than even a Daniel Bryan WWE title win.

 

[Softcore Holly]

But, think about this, there is a rumor that Sting is going to show up at WMXXX and challenge Undertaker.

What is the WWE plan for this bombshell at the end of WMXXX? I mean, Sting showing up in WWE and challenging the Undertaker at WM31, at the end of Wrestlemania XXX, will be a bigger talking point, and will draw more people to Raw, than even a Daniel Bryan WWE title win.

Not really. Sting showing up after Taker's match earlier in the card would have the same drawing effect without having the awkward at best problem of trying to follow up with the big DB moment. Like I can see them making a huge deal out of Sting's WWE debut but not at the expense of their current stars/plans, especially if the rumor's true about him just wanting 1 match before retiring.

Also Taker's matches doesn't need the year long hype, not that I can see them maintaining it if both men will be out the ring till WM 31. That they can save for next WM season.

 

[Mustang Sally]

Also Taker's matches doesn't need the year long hype, not that I can see them maintaining it if both men will be out the ring till WM 31. That they can save for next WM season.

True, although I can see WWE placng a surprise Sting appearance into WM30; it's not as if people will buy the event only because they're hoping Sting will show up. What they don't want to do is drop in a "wrestling" appearance by Sting.....that's something people would pay for; why stick it in there for free?

At the same time, it seems like overkill to have Sting challenge Undertaker for a match next year. For one thing, Mark Calaway doesn't know at the end of each WM whether he'll be back for the next one......if anything, after taxing the hell out of his body, he probably figures the current WM effort will be his last. Second, I just don't know that notice for this match will keep people excited for a full year.

I figure Sting could possibly show up on Raw the next night......but not to challenge Undertaker. Just let us know he's here, do a few of his bird calls (or whatever the hell they are) and let nature take it's course.

Oh, but that's right! This topic is supposed to be about Orton/Batista/Bryan ......and I agree with prior posters that ruining Daniel's coronation as world champ by inserting Sting in there too close to the festivities would prove a disservice to Daniel's night.

 

[Kidpolean]

Not really. Sting showing up after Taker's match earlier in the card would have the same drawing effect without having the awkward at best problem of trying to follow up with the big DB moment. Like I can see them making a huge deal out of Sting's WWE debut but not at the expense of their current stars/plans, especially if the rumor's true about him just wanting 1 match before retiring.

Also Taker's matches doesn't need the year long hype, not that I can see them maintaining it if both men will be out the ring till WM 31. That they can save for next WM season.

the big DB moment? Your argument is based upon the assumption that DB wins the title but I strongly disagree. Batista is 100% winning this match. DB being inserted is just to make the crowd at least be into the match. Batista wouldn't have returned so that he could job to DB in the main event.

 

[Zycho32]

the big DB moment? Your argument is based upon the assumption that DB wins the title but I strongly disagree. Batista is 100% winning this match. DB being inserted is just to make the crowd at least be into the match. Batista wouldn't have returned so that he could job to DB in the main event.

Here's an honest question; is it possible that Batista winning the WHC- despite ALL the crap that he's brought into said match- might actually carve out a chunk of the WWE fanbase and make them walk away?

 

[Mitch Henessey]

Bryan will find a way into the WWE WHC match, and it's a sure thing. WWE won't do a triple threat with three heels in the main event, because the crowd will shit all over the match. You have to have one face in there, someone the crowd can root for.

I'm more intrigued at the possibility of a Fatal 4 Way, with Bryan VS Triple H ending in a double pin, or double count out. I know some will complain about Bryan's missed opportunity for a "clean" win over HHH, but Bryan winning the the WWE WHC is the grand prize for the big picture.

 

[Softcore Holly]

the big DB moment? Your argument is based upon the assumption that DB wins the title but I strongly disagree. Batista is 100% winning this match. DB being inserted is just to make the crowd at least be into the match. Batista wouldn't have returned so that he could job to DB in the main event.

Same logic would apply if Batista won too, but I guess I should have said title change moment(I don't think anyone expects Orton to retain) just to play it safe, my apologies. So if Batista won I think it would be a bad idea to take anything away from his moment as well by following up with another match.

 

[Kidpolean]

Here's an honest question; is it possible that Batista winning the WHC- despite ALL the crap that he's brought into said match- might actually carve out a chunk of the WWE fanbase and make them walk away?

No not a chance at all because if Batista does win than it will be done in a way that makes people HAVE to see what happens next. Maybe a surprise return to help him or maybe and evolution reunion or maybe even an all new faction or evolution 2.0 with young guys. I dont think Batista will win clean or without outside help.

Softcore Holly- Ok I get what you were saying. The streak should only end the night if it is going to end or if its Takers last match imo.

 

[d_henderson1810]

the big DB moment? Your argument is based upon the assumption that DB wins the title but I strongly disagree. Batista is 100% winning this match. DB being inserted is just to make the crowd at least be into the match. Batista wouldn't have returned so that he could job to DB in the main event.

Besides, I heard a rumor that part of Batista's contract for him to return at WWE was him to win the Royal Rumble, and then win the title at WMXXX.

I believe this, as it was WWE who approached him, and often the wrestler will have certain demands if they come back, and often title reigns are involved.

So, if this rumor is true, then WWE could be in breach of contract if they give the belt to Bryan instead.

 

[d_henderson1810]

Did you just compare SCSA and the Rock's rivalry, which is one of the hottest in the history of wrestling, to Randy Orton and Batista? That's like comparing apples to turds.

Batista came back to WWE after a four year hiatus, during which no one really clamored for his return. That isn't all Big Dave's fault, but it wasn't surprising when the big return flopped.

Maybe you're right, it wouldn't have been that bad. Still, save the marginal main events for the B PPV's. I just read your conclusion, where you spewed more blind Cena hate. This thread won't last long, you forgot to ask an actual question and instead just stated your opinion. I doubt my response will change it.

Bottom line: Wouldn't have been that bad is not good enough for WrestleMania, which is traditionally about giving people what they want. The people did not want Orton versus Batista so WWE correctly called an audible.

Comparing SCSA and The Rock to Orton and Batista is like comparing a drunk, wife-beating cripple and a movie star to two current friends of Triple H.

 

[Danny84]

We all know it's gonna end up a fatal four way with hhh helping Batista become champ if u think db will win your just dreaming

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

What exactly happens to the WWE if there is a title clause for Batista and they breach it? If it's less than the financial strain of Daniel Bryan not winning (which I believe they could have), then they should breach it. Or they could, like I said in the other thread about this, have him win vs Orton then have made it a mini tournament. Dave wins vs orton then loses vs DB.

I really think DB wins at Mania and I think it's a fantastic match. I think a fatal fourway is the way they go.