CM Punk is Allegedly "Homophobic"

[H33LTurn]

What do you think their intentions are? I think the intention is to get people to stop using words like homo and *** as derogatory remarks. How could you possibly find anything wrong with that?



And Gladd has every right to voice their displeasure about people who voice their displeasure against gays. Why do you defend CM Punk's right to say homo but you do not defend Gladd's right to voice their displeasure about it? That freedom of speech thing works both ways. If this is truly about freedom of speech you have no argument.

Again, and hopefully it's the last time I have to say this, I have no problem with GLAAD voicing their displeasure, but lately I've seen an unfair bias towards those in the media, expecially entertainers under special circumstances like comedians or wrestlers trying to get over, people whos words kids should know not to take as gospel. My initial argument is that there should not be mass hysteria because a man said the word homo when he:

1. Was being provoked
2. Appologized afterwards

I'm pretty sure straight people dont go around with a vendetta against gays, but if one of them insults the other and they feel they can do emotional damage by called them a derogatory term, then thats whats going to happen. I dont think gays should feel troubled about this, because they werent the two men Punk was speaking to and Punk didnt mean to insult the homosexual community in the first place. It was all a mistake and a misunderstanding and it would be great if everyone could just let it go.

 

[The Brain]

Again, and hopefully it's the last time I have to say this, I have no problem with GLAAD voicing their displeasure, but lately I've seen an unfair bias towards those in the media, expecially entertainers under special circumstances like comedians or wrestlers trying to get over, people whos words kids should know not to take as gospel.

Of course GLADD is going to target entertainers and celebrities. Who else would they go after? How are they going to know if a nobody like me calls a guy a homo? You say kids should know not to take entertainer's words as gospel. Guess what; kids look up to these entertainers. If a guy they respect, like Punk, uses homo as an insult it will be perceived as cool and they too will use that word. If we can get to the point where the public figures that kids look up to recognize these slurs are wrong hopefully the kids will receive the right message.

My initial argument is that there should not be mass hysteria because a man said the word homo when he:

1. Was being provoked
2. Appologized afterwards

I admit I don't keep up with this kind of thing but I was unaware there was any kind of mass hysteria over this. It doesn't matter if Punk was being provoked. He could have just as easily said ass hole but he decided to say homo. The whole point is to try to get people to stop using homo, gay, and *** as insults. Asshole would have been directed specifically at the one provoking him and not offended an entire group of people who were not involved in the incident.

 

[Rampage Bentley]

Your entire view is based on some Religious crap that has been forced into people's heads for hundreds of years.
Do you know what else use to be viewed as a "Genetic Disorder"?
Being black.
Were they wrong? Of course, just as they are by saying being attracted to another person of the same sex is a disorder.

First of all, I never said "Genetic Disorder." I'm sorry, but homosexuality is not genetic, no matter what you believe in. That theory has no weight in either Intelligent Design, nor Evolution. And secondly, being black was never believed to be a disorder by anyone who could spell the word disorder.

It's not based on "Religious crap that has been forced into people's heads for hundreds of years" It's based on case studies and documented evidence. Infact, psychology 101 says that in the adolescent years, a child seperates from it's mother and learns his/her sexual identity in the voice of their father. Infact a study was done in the early 90's that stated 100% of homosexuals interviewed (around 5,000) had either been abused in some form as a child, or had some deep seeded (and occasionally unknown) resentment for the parent of the same gender.

Quit being such a tool.

 

[itssoeasy123]

I admit I don't keep up with this kind of thing but I was unaware there was any kind of mass hysteria over this. It doesn't matter if Punk was being provoked. He could have just as easily said ass hole but he decided to say homo. The whole point is to try to get people to stop using homo, gay, and *** as insults. Asshole would have been directed specifically at the one provoking him and not offended an entire group of people who were not involved in the incident.

He could've said ass-hole, jackass, shithole, any other insult. But, he said "homo," and he apologized to saying it. Nobody is perfect, and people make mstakes. CM Punk said a derogetory word, and all the sudden he's "homophobic," it's just a stupid observation. I have heard many time's over the last day that Punk is behing gay marriage and gay right's.

There's also the fact Punk is known for these kind of tirad's, he used to do it in the indies. Sure, he probably never used a derogetory word like "homo" or "******," but he still made fun of people, even fan's. I'm not saying it's ok for him to call people a "homo," but I doubt he did it to put them down, much less it might've been a logical guess, or just a insult.

He apologized, called himself a douche, and said he should'nt jugde people on the way they live. I think's that enough to warrant people to stop talking about it.

 

[H33LTurn]

Of course GLADD is going to target entertainers and celebrities. Who else would they go after? How are they going to know if a nobody like me calls a guy a homo? You say kids should know not to take entertainer's words as gospel. Guess what; kids look up to these entertainers. If a guy they respect, like Punk, uses homo as an insult it will be perceived as cool and they too will use that word. If we can get to the point where the public figures that kids look up to recognize these slurs are wrong hopefully the kids will receive the right message.



I admit I don't keep up with this kind of thing but I was unaware there was any kind of mass hysteria over this. It doesn't matter if Punk was being provoked. He could have just as easily said ass hole but he decided to say homo. The whole point is to try to get people to stop using homo, gay, and *** as insults. Asshole would have been directed specifically at the one provoking him and not offended an entire group of people who were not involved in the incident.

But its specifically entertainers that they know say things that strike a chord. Comedians and wrestler are no exception. Just because Alberto Del Rio says "bad things happen to bad people" it doesnt mean its true, hes just getting heat. Parents need to teach their kids to distiguish between real and fake in wrestling. They also need to teach their kids that people can say what they say (because after all they have the right to do so) but as long as they follow their own values they'll be alright. Parents are supposed to set the guidelines for their kids, not whoever is on TV. A very successful man once said this, I belive his name was Eminem. I know this method proves true because my parents were able to curse around me and since they taught me right from wrong I have complete control over my words, which is something I cant say about your friend Sly.

The word "homo" slipped from Punk's mouth because its a generational thing. The phrase "homo" is used to describe someone whos acting like an asshole, its not meant to offend homosexuals. Its much easier to change the meaning of the word than to try to erase a word that has been etched in the vocabularies of so many for so long. As my friend said on the subject, its only offensive if you let it. People are aware that "homo" doesnt refer to homosexuals anymore and the majority homosexuals have given their blessing to the word to be used as such, if people want to be offended by it then they're just creating an unecessary burden for themselves.

 

[The Brain]

He could've said ass-hole, jackass, shithole, any other insult. But, he said "homo," and he apologized to saying it. Nobody is perfect, and people make mstakes. CM Punk said a derogetory word, and all the sudden he's "homophobic," it's just a stupid observation. I have heard many time's over the last day that Punk is behing gay marriage and gay right's.

There's also the fact Punk is known for these kind of tirad's, he used to do it in the indies. Sure, he probably never used a derogetory word like "homo" or "******," but he still made fun of people, even fan's. I'm not saying it's ok for him to call people a "homo," but I doubt he did it to put them down, much less it might've been a logical guess, or just a insult.

He apologized, called himself a douche, and said he should'nt jugde people on the way they live. I think's that enough to warrant people to stop talking about it.

To me this is not about Punk specifically. I’m not looking to hang him over this and I’m not calling him homophobic. The idea is to stop using gay and homo as insults. These are words that have just become such a part of people’s every day vocabulary that they don’t even realize what they’re saying. I wonder why people use homo as an insult if they don’t mean anything negative toward homosexuals. Think about it.

 

[The Brain]

But its specifically entertainers that they know say things that strike a chord. Comedians and wrestler are no exception. Just because Alberto Del Rio says "bad things happen to bad people" it doesnt mean its true, hes just getting heat. Parents need to teach their kids to distiguish between real and fake in wrestling.

This was not done to get heat at a wrestling show.

They also need to teach their kids that people can say what they say (because after all they have the right to do so) but as long as they follow their own values they'll be alright. Parents are supposed to set the guidelines for their kids, not whoever is on TV. A very successful man once said this, I belive his name was Eminem.

Entertainers have been using this as a cop out for years because they refuse to accept their responsibility as role models. They want it all. They want all the perks that fame brings but none of the responsibility.

The word "homo" slipped from Punk's mouth because its a generational thing. The phrase "homo" is used to describe someone whos acting like an asshole, its not meant to offend homosexuals. Its much easier to change the meaning of the word than to try to erase a word that has been etched in the vocabularies of so many for so long. As my friend said on the subject, its only offensive if you let it. People are aware that "homo" doesnt refer to homosexuals anymore and the majority homosexuals have given their blessing to the word to be used as such, if people want to be offended by it then they're just creating an unecessary burden for themselves

To me this is the point of the whole thread. What makes the word homo an insult? Everyone knows it's short for homosexual. If homo is such an insult then you are implying that it is disgraceful to be a homosexual. If you don't mean it that way then the word homo would have no meaning making it pointless to use that word. The whole point is to not use homo as asshole or to use gay as stupid. If you mean asshole say asshole. If you mean stupid say stupid. You can criticize Sly about his comments toward you but at least they were targeted at you specifically and he didn't use any words that are associated with an entirely different group of people.

 

[WWWYKI777]

So you find it hard to swallow that a man can have sex with another man and enjoy it? What about a woman with a woman? Every mans fantasy. A big seller in the Adult Entertainment industry too. So that, to me, sounds like a big vote for equality. What that tells me is that Straight and Bi men like to watch Girl's have sex with one another. I'm sure you've seen some of this. Were you repulsed or turned on?

If you weren't then fine, I'll believe you. You are a guy who just doesn't see the appeal and I can fully understand that.

Well yes , I have seen lesbian porn before. Didn't look it up on purpose but it comes up sometimes. It always seems to be hot straight looking chicks though. Am I disgusted by it? Well its naked chicks , and while I don't like what they are doing but I like seeing them. So in that instance I think its a mixed feeling like "ooh hot chicks" but then "Ehhh what the hell are they doing?" at the same time

It may also be because of the less invasive nature of lesbians doing things , if 2 girls "have sex" its usually oral or with hands and in a hole that was meant to have things put in it. Add to that what I already said and you have a mixed feeling of kinda hot/kinda disturbed .

On the other hand watching 2 guys would come across as watching some very very disturbing , since there would be the involvement of penetration into places that aren't even meant for that purpose going on , not to mention likely hairy man ass all over the place and stuff. Definately seems way nastier yeah

(No I don't like anal straight porn either , though of course it is once again a more mixed feeling because its with a chick its then like gross but the chick is still there and still naked so its still at least kind of enjoyable)

I will say though , that of all the varietys of gay people that none of them truly disturb me (In every day life, not porn) except butch-esque lesbians , those gross me out and I'm sure if I had to watch 2 dykes getting busy I think I'd wanna hurl

May sound odd to you but gay men confuse me less than gay women , despite the fact that watching women do gay things is alot easier to stomach

Overall I gotta give you props for bringing up a pretty valid point

We're born with the capacity to love. Better yet, lust. As children, we aren't born with the knowledge of sex. We don't understand the difference between boys and girls until 2 or 3 years old and only then it's a suspicion that they're different. Without that knowledge, we make a choice of who we like and who we don't and it has something to do with attraction and if that person is nice to you then it's more likely to become friendship. Only as adults do we let sex get in the way at all times.

Contrary to that , nobody told me anything and long before I was told that boys and girls were different (Which was when I was like 8) I actually would get little crushes on the girls in my classrooms , never the boys. This even without knowing they aren't all the same.

So I don't beleive that. You don't have to be told its wrong or that there even is a difference to naturally lean one way or the other. If someones straight they're straight. If someones gay they're gay.

Again , on the subject of Bi is where things get confusing. Maybe Bis are born with their mind partially a female and partially a male? Maybe Bisexuality is just a straight person who gets a bit freaky sometimes? I don't know , nobody really knows or has the real answers.

But I do beleive that homosexuality is quite likely to be a mental disorder. Whys that so offensive? Would you prefer I said you're all just sick minded freaks? I would think that would be more offensive... and I just logically don't understand why anyone would CHOOSE to be gay. I mean , the rectal pain , the ridicule , the inability to have your own kids , etc. So it makes no sense to say they are just pervs so I lean towards the option that says they were born wired backwards?

Earlier someone asked me where was I getting this stuff from wheres my proof where are the studies that say this stuff etc. Well apparently this guy knows

Infact, psychology 101 says that in the adolescent years, a child seperates from it's mother and learns his/her sexual identity in the voice of their father. Infact a study was done in the early 90's that stated 100% of homosexuals interviewed (around 5,000) had either been abused in some form as a child, or had some deep seeded (and occasionally unknown) resentment for the parent of the same gender.

So then there are studies on this stuff , and you know I've seen TV shows about this stuff and alot of it said the kids who were gay seemed that way from an early age. Which supports my idea that people are just born that way.

Just to tell a ridiculous story I once on the news saw a guy was being arrested because he beat his baby to death because it was "acting gay"

On a seperate note everyone in this topic may want to check out this show , an interesting insight to how society reacts to gay people and intolerance and all of that
[youtube]Zhl9MLno424[/youtube]

Very amusing to see the variety in different reactions , really intruiging show that also branches out into how society reacts to other forms of discrimination and issues , I'd reccomend watching it and then spending several hours watching some of the other episodes on youtube , great show.

 

[H33LTurn]

This was not done to get heat at a wrestling show.



Entertainers have been using this as a cop out for years because they refuse to accept their responsibility as role models. They want it all. They want all the perks that fame brings but none of the responsibility.



To me this is the point of the whole thread. What makes the word homo an insult? Everyone knows it's short for homosexual. If homo is such an insult then you are implying that it is disgraceful to be a homosexual. If you don't mean it that way then the word homo would have no meaning making it pointless to use that word. The whole point is to not use homo as asshole or to use gay as stupid. If you mean asshole say asshole. If you mean stupid say stupid. You can criticize Sly about his comments toward you but at least they were targeted at you specifically and he didn't use any words that are associated with an entirely different group of people.

And Punk wasnt adressing the entire gay community when he let the word "homo" slip. I mean if Sly calls me a dumbass then everyone out there who claims to be insulted by the word can tell him to stop using it because it refers to dumbasses as a lesser group. Its just your logic. Look I'm just saying the word homo isnt pretty, a lot of words arent. the n-word isnt, but if people honestly mean no harm from the heart then is it really worth getting upset about it?

 

[The Brain]

And Punk wasnt adressing the entire gay community when he let the word "homo" slip. I mean if Sly calls me a dumbass then everyone out there who claims to be insulted by the word can tell him to stop using it because it refers to dumbasses as a lesser group. Its just your logic. Look I'm just saying the word homo isnt pretty, a lot of words arent. the n-word isnt, but if people honestly mean no harm from the heart then is it really worth getting upset about it?

You are missing the point. I know Punk wasn't addressing the gay community. The word homo however is a reference to the gay community. Therefore Punk should have used a different word to get his point across. If people don't mean to offend gays with the word homo they should stop using that word. It's really as simple as that. I know it was heat of the moment. The goal GLADD is looking for is to phase the word out as an insult. By making a big deal out of it when someone famous uses the word they are planting a seed that it is wrong. Hopefully next time someone wants to insult someone they'll remember an incident like this and choose their words more carefully. The goal is to eventually phase these insults out all together. Do you really see something wrong with that?

 

[H33LTurn]

You are missing the point. I know Punk wasn't addressing the gay community. The word homo however is a reference to the gay community. Therefore Punk should have used a different word to get his point across. If people don't mean to offend gays with the word homo they should stop using that word. It's really as simple as that. I know it was heat of the moment. The goal GLADD is looking for is to phase the word out as an insult. By making a big deal out of it when someone famous uses the word they are planting a seed that it is wrong. Hopefully next time someone wants to insult someone they'll remember an incident like this and choose their words more carefully. The goal is to eventually phase these insults out all together. Do you really see something wrong with that?

No I dont, and thank you for actually making a valid point in the "counter-argument". I think GLAAD deserves respect for doing that all I was saying, a point that didnt need to be extended to 9 pages, was that people are overreacting to this in ways I've never seen. He made poor word choice and appologized for it and I think since hes been a man and we understand that the younger generation has made a joke out of the word "homo" people should just cut Punk slack and move on with their lives and learn from this situation. Thats all. I dont undertand why people needed to stretch this conversation so much to undertand the point I'm trying to make.

 

[dman1373]

this is so ******ed (not to offend the mentally handicapped.)

This is so fucking stupid. If you don't get what he meant, it was to almost convey the metro sexual part of being gay. He was talking about a Mohawk and saying it was gay. He was calling him a female to(not to offend any women). Thats why gladd are a bunch fucking cynical assholes. They are just like naacp. Just idiots that try to censor people because they can't they have to find something to control.

Just bullshit.

 

[Slyfox696]

Wait wait, what? "They do have the right to believe it's wrong, but not the right to take action against it based upon that belief". So they can believe whatever they want as long as they're quiet about it.

Okay, I'm officially done being nice to you. Yes, I was being nice in my last post, hardly an insult to be found. But this is stupidity at it's finest, and you deserve your lashings for it.

Do you fucking know how to read? Were you absent the day they taught reading comprehension in school? Did I say one fucking thing about "being quiet" about it? No, I didn't. What I said was quite clear, that you cannot discriminate against a group of people because of your beliefs. God, you want me to not call you stupid, and you keep posting stupid things.

Wow maybe the African Americans who thought slavery was wrong should have been quiet about it and not taken action against it due to their beliefs.

You're fucking dumbass, you know that? No, literally, you're a moron. Those who fought slavery did so for equality, not for oppression. Completely different.

Btw, nobody is stopping people from being gay, they're just organizing to prove that its wrong, which they have every right to do. I'm not going to get into the whole comedian thing, if you think any of those shows would be sucessful with anyone over the age of 12 in these days then you need help. Clean comedy had its time, and now its over.

And you're a moron who probably has never even seen those shows and has no fucking clue as to what you're talking about.

I watch Andy Griffith today more than any other comedy on television. I've even seen every episode, and still watch it on Netflix, because today's sitcoms are fucking horrible.

And no, I dont believe that theres no hatred in the world, I believe that you have to pick your fights.

And this is a fight GLAAD chose to pick. Who the fuck are you to tell them which fights to pick? Because they picked someone who entertains you? Get the fuck out of here with that stupid shit.

Just because someone used the word homo doesnt mean that it has to impact your personal life.

And yet, GLAAD's response has made you spend a day or two arguing about it. Hypocrite much?

And I know the reaction I would get if I acted like a gay person, but thats because I live around immature and unedjucated gang members.

Oh my god! What the fuck is wrong with you? How the fuck do you not understand how stupid you sound right now?

You freely admit prejudice against homosexuals, but get upset when a group works to end that prejudice. You are severely fucked up in the head. You're the poster child for post-birth abortions.

Those states have a right to vote against gay marrige.

Not really. It hasn't been challenged yet, but if it ever gets challenged up to the Supreme Court, and the Supreme Court does what it should, any bans on gay marriage will get easily crushed.

There is ZERO reason to ban homosexual marriage. The only reason people give is a religious one, which holds no weight in this country due to the First Amendment. They DON'T have that right.

Does it seem fair, no, but its our system and its the closest we'll get without violating someoenes religious rights. Once you understand how important religion is to certain people, you'll undersatand why certain senators are saying no.

And once you realize the First Amendment bans the establishment of a religion in this country, you'll realize why gay marriage bans based upon religious reasons are in violation of the First Amendment.

And for the last time I'm not pro discrimination

Yes, you are, Hitler. You're actively defending someone who cast a homophobic slur. By default, that makes you pro discrimination.

I'm pro freedom of speech.

For the last time, no one violated CM Punk's freedom of speech, you stupid fuck. Seriously, call your government teacher, tell him you're an ignorant moron, and ask him to explain the difference between law and social consciousness.

I'm saying the world isnt all sweet and if you're going to get upset about something, with all the problems that people face in this world, then one guy accidentaly saying homo shouldnt be your first choice.

No one said it is my first choice. But it's what I'm talking about now, and just because it isn't my first choice, doesn't make it any less wrong. Prioritization doesn't work here, Hitler.

No one is getting treated as a second class citizen.

But the attitude is being propagated by Punk, which is why GLAAD was upset. Sorry GLAAD doesn't stand idly by when a celebrity is defaming homosexuals, Hitler.

You act as if all the laws were put in place for the straights and the gays just had to fight for everything.

45 states which don't recognize homosexual marriage would prove me right.

Both gay and straight people have had to fight for their rights.

Very true. Which is absurd, because the Declaration of Independence (even though it holds no legal weight) declares "that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness".

What a shame people still don't live up to that. People like you, Hitler.

Why is it wrong? Do you realize that marriage was created by a religious institution? What I think is wrong is that an extreme minority wants to make Priests, Pastors, Ministers, and Rabbis go against their religious beliefs because less than 4% of the population feels slighted by it.

It's wrong because the law and state grant married individuals certain benefits which can only be obtained through marriage. When marriage is granted legal benefits, it no longer remains exclusively a religious ceremony, but a state ceremony as well. As such, it is wrong to deny homosexuals the same benefits afforded to heterosexuals.

Your entire views on homosexuality come from pop psychology (it's genetic, etc.) Every piece of evidence documented files homosexuality as a sexual disorder, only being removed from that list because people found it offensive.

Words cannot describe the ignorance in this paragraph.

People are allowed to have their opinions, no matter what you think of them. It doesn't make them a better or worse person than you. Get over yourself.

Opinions I don't mind. It's discrimination I do. I think you're a shallow egotistical cunt. But I'm not banning you from the forum for it. My opinion on you doesn't dictate my actions, and I do not discriminate because of my opinion. See how easy it is to treat all people with fairness, regardless of how you feel about them as a person?

I am proud of you for making this post , I agree 100%.

Its one thing to preach love , peace & acceptance , but to do it by calling us all assholes and fucktards and all of that like he has so far is definately not the way to go about it imo

I'm calling people fuckwits based upon the choices they make, not because of things they cannot control. I've explained this on at least three difference occasions now.

Joey, why are you so supportive of people having the right to voice their displeasure with homosexuality yet you don’t support the right of organizations such as GLADD to defend it?

Because he's a hypocrite.

I think you should look up the first amendment. When the constitution was written it was not with the idea that random people had the right to go around calling people ****. I find it funny how many people think that the first amendment gives them the right to say whatever they want wherever they want whenever they want with out having to be held responsible for their comments. If I called one of my customers a *** I could kiss my job goodbye and I wouldn’t be able to use the first amendment to get it back. I don’t recall reading anywhere that CM Punk faced any consequences from the government for what he said. Your freedom of speech argument is completely irrelevant. Also I notice how you seem to think freedom of speech only applies to your side of the debate.

Exactly. Maybe if someone else says it, he'll understand.

1st of all , this is not religious. We have a dude up in this topic who said hes Catholic but he defends homosexuality with alot of conviction and rage.

I on the other hand am not a very religious person at all and I think for myself and do not care what a 2000+ year old book written by mortal men translated from another language says. I do not think its right , I don't think its natural , because I myself think so.

So your whole arguement of religious people being against gays and non religious being for them , has just been proved wrong by examples

Religion or not , general concensus is that being a man wanting another man to ram his dick up your ass repetitivley & having no desire whatsoever to have sex with females is pretty weird

If you ask me , its a birth defect to be 100% gay & then Bi people are just perverted

What happens is , a baby is conceived and while its forming its brain for unknown reasons developed to be that of the opposite gender that it really is. As such yes we shouldn't hate on them and whatever , but to rule out the likely possibility that it is a birth defect is absolutley obsurd.

Its also one thing to be able to recognize the beauty in someone of ones own gender , and then another thing to actually be having sex with someone of ones own gender. Being able to tell another dude looks good does not make you gay.

I find it absolutley ridiculous that our society has somehow recently brainwashed a ton of straight people into thinking being gay isn't even some sort of mental issue but that its 100% natural and normal , and that they then go and defend the concept of it to no end.

NO its not right to ridicule other people and hurt their feelings. Its not right to automatically hate people for being gay. But that doesn't mean you have to defend them and that doesn't mean you have to tell yourself its not even possibly a mental issue of some sorts.

As I said before , I don't really care if someones gay thats their own problem and their own business but to try to say its not perverted in any way to say its not un-natural in any way , and to say theres no way its a mental defect is absolutley obsurd.

If it wasn't a defect of sorts that would mean every single person on the planet is actually gay whether they realize it or not... and well that flat out makes no sense

I sometimes think that in the future if our world continues at this direction... that one day once gay marriage is legal in all parts of the english speaking world... that the next thing on the agenda is going to be people protesting and bitching for the right to marry animals , and/or aliens in the event that they ever live in harmony with humans on our planet.

To your other point : Being black is a literal race , that makes no sense (If anyone ever even said that , I really doubt it , no clue where you're getting that from) and if anyone ever REALLY said that they would have to be joking

TLDR? :No , its not right to hate people just because they are gay. Being gay is a mental birth defect IMO this is why we shouldn't hate on them because they (probably) didn't choose to be.

BUT you don't have to think they are natural/right or defend them either.

I basically rambled in a circle for a long time on these points.

Also that simply calling someone as a homo doesn't mean someone hates gay people either , and that this whole thing has been blown way out of proportion. Ever heard the saying "Making a mountain out of a mole hill?"

Plus Punk apologized (Which as a heel I think he shouldn't have to , people should expect disorderly conduct and rudeness from heels at a wrestling show TBH) but anyway , this has just been taken way too far and seems like its not even about CM Punk anymore lol

Edit : I see the post below me now. I will have you know that I do not watch FOX news. K , quit assuming things

Now you're throwing Pro-life and the KKK into this somehow? Cmon.... (For the record , no I'm not aware of specific things the KKK says , why and how exactly are you aware? You go to their meetings? Eh? Eh?? Is that what it is? )

You know what I'm done posting about this I've said what I have to say and you people are taking this whole subject and twisting it all kinds of weird ways

There's really no way to twist what you said here. You're a homophobe, plain and simple. I think you have a birth defect which renders you incapable of deep and rational thought.

I would LOVE for you to take this argument into the "New York Legalizes Gay Marriage" thread in the Cigar Lounge. Seriously, just post it verbatim. I would so make you my bitch. Seriously, take it to the Cigar Lounge, this exact post.

I know this method proves true because my parents were able to curse around me and since they taught me right from wrong I have complete control over my words, which is something I cant say about your friend Sly.

Your parents failed you, from the moment you left your mother's cavernous vagina. Any child who grows up to say the stupid shit you're saying now is an example of a parent's failure. Don't try to deny it, we all see it for what it is.

 

[H33LTurn]

"Your parents failed you, from the moment you left your mother's cavernous vagina"

Dear WZ I have two complaints:

1. Why do you have someone as immature as Sly running your forums?
2.How do you expect me to have an educated conversation with this^

That was the straw the broke the camel's back. I no longer wish to express my point, a valid one that many praised, if this is what I'm supposed to reply to. Heres the definition of hypocrite from dictionary.com...

"1.
a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, especially a person whose actions belie stated beliefs.
2.
a person who feigns some desirable or publicly approved attitude, especially one whose private life, opinions, or statements belie his or her public statements. "

Let me say it really simple so you undertand.

you: homo=hurtful phrase
most of society: dimwits, dumbfucks, your mother's cavernous vagina = hurtful words

You= hurtful words should be eliminated from people's vocabulary.

you said: your mother's cavernous vagina, which = hurtful words.

and most importantly you=hypocrite.

And the funniest part was The Brain was the only person who opposed me who actually made a valid point, and he didnt need to mention my "mother's cavernous vagina" to do it. Go figure.

 

[Slyfox696]

"Your parents failed you, from the moment you left your mother's cavernous vagina"

Dear WZ I have two complaints:

1. Why do you have someone as immature as Sly running your forums?
2.How do you expect me to have an educated conversation with this^

Because I do a damn good job at running the forums, and you're incapable of having an educated conversation due to your low intelligence?

Questions asked, questions answered.

That was the straw the broke the camel's back. I no longer wish to express my point, a valid one that many praised

Congratulations, a bunch of knuckle-draggers agree it's okay to defame an entire class of people, as long as it's not "as bad" as other ways to defame them. That's something to be proud of, for sure.

"1.
a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, especially a person whose actions belie stated beliefs.
2.
a person who feigns some desirable or publicly approved attitude, especially one whose private life, opinions, or statements belie his or her public statements. "

Let me say it really simple so you undertand.

you: homo=hurtful phrase
most of society: dimwits, dumbfucks, your mother's cavernous vagina = hurtful words

And see, this is why you're a dumbass. I've explained on at least three different occasions the difference between words which incite hatred against a group of people for what they were born with, and words which accurately reflect words and actions of a specific individual. The fact you don't get it proves I've been right all along.

I don't have a problem with hurtful words, I have a problem with words which propagate prejudice against a group of people because of how they were born. That's not hypocrisy, no matter how much you dearly wish it to be.

And the funniest part was The Brain was the only person who opposed me who actually made a valid point, and he didnt need to mention my "mother's cavernous vagina" to do it. Go figure.

Oh no, I've made plenty of valid points, especially since Brain has basically repeated the same things I said. I imagine he even will agree with that.

I can't help it if you're too stupid to see it.

 

[H33LTurn]

For the record thats 3 reps I've gotten for stating my point like a man, and not stooping down to personal insults. On your profile it says you're an educator and for the sake of the children in Missouri I hope thats just a joke. Do you call them dumbasses and mention their mother's cavernous vagina when they disagree with you? Look I know its hard for you to understand your own hippocratic actions but if you undertand that the word homo can hurt a group of homosexuals I dont understand why you cant grasp why calling a bunch of people online who disagree with you dumbasses is any different. Just because someone isnt born a certain way doesnt mean that using a hurtful word towards them isnt going to hurt. People arent born with cancer, but making fun of people who get cancer in the latter stages of their lives is a bit hurtful dont you think. We might not be born with these views, but our experiences in the world make us disagree with you and if you cant make a point without spewing personal garbage then you are immature no matter how you want to phrase it.

 

[Slyfox696]

For the record thats 4 reps I've gotten for stating my point like a man

Three were positive, and one was negative. And of the three people who gave you positive rep (Gaga777, 3/4 Facelock, and Yurnewhero), 3/4 Facelock is just pissed I always kicked the crap out of him the couple times we've debated, Gaga777 is an admitted homophobe, and Yurnewhero has all but proven himself to be the same.

Knuckle-draggers, like I said.


EDIT: Oh, and the fourth rep? It was from Nate, and I quote, "Oh my fucking God. That is the longest horseshit post I have ever seen."

That Nate is a smart fellow sometimes.

On your profile it says you're an educator and for the sake of the children in Missouri I hope thats just a joke.

It's not. And in my class, kids are not allowed to use homophobic slurs, and I tell them that the very first day and I tell them why. And when one of the accidentally slips up and says it, they apologize to me for it, and take their repercussions without complaint.

You see, unlike you, my students understand the concept of treating people like human beings. You're still struggling in that area. Maybe if you could have had me as a teacher, you would be less likely to be accepting of prejudiced practices.

Look I know its hard for you to understand your own hippocratic actions

I'm a doctor now?

The word you were looking for is hypocritical, not hippocratic. The Hippocratic Oath is something doctors take. I should have been your teacher, you would have learned a lot more.

but if you undertand that the word homo can hurt a group of homosexuals I dont understand why you cant grasp why calling a bunch of people online who disagree with you dumbasses is any different.

*sigh*

Really? You really don't understand this yet? How many times do I have to explain the difference between actions and genetics?

Just because someone isnt born a certain way doesnt mean that using a hurtful word towards them isnt going to hurt.

If you wouldn't say stupid things, I wouldn't call you stupid. It's that simple.

People arent born with cancer, but making fun of people who get cancer in the latter stages of their lives is a bit hurtful dont you think.

Do people choose to get cancer? No? Then your point is invalid.

We might not be born with these views, but our experiences in the world make us disagree with you and if you cant make a point without spewing personal garbage then you are immature no matter how you want to phrase it.

Call me immature all you want, but at least I'm not an idiot.

It's really simple. Anyone who defends what Punk says, even after Punk admitted he was wrong, has serious problems. The fact you're upset with GLAAD for exercising their First Amendment right, while simultaneously trying to claim they are stealing the First Amendment rights of others (which is stupid to begin with, but I digress) shows you to be someone who is okay with discrimination. Anyone who is okay with discrimination, and actively supports it, is a low class idiot in my book.

So fine, call me immature. Coming from an idiot, that doesn't mean a whole lot to me.

 

[H33LTurn]

You know, I feel for your kids man, you dont let them be kids because of your own views. I doubt you teach the "homosexuality history" class, so your views should be kept in your head. But at the same time I'm glad your a teacher, kids are the most vocal group and will definately give you the hell you deserve. In fact, if I knew you were a teacher I wouldnt have stepped into this argument, you are some of the most stubborn people out there. Its a shame you'll be able to affect the development of these children, you shouldnt be at the front of the class but should rather take a seat in the back and learn a lesson from the kids you "teach". Oh and those knuckle-draggers that you're talking about happen to be some of the most well expressed people I've seen on this site. They definately dont need to mention someones vagina to get their point across. Shout out to everyone who had my back in this! But well, I have shit to do so I'm going to end this, three things have resulted in this thread:

1. Either you manned up and spoke your mind about the Punk incident. You're an understanding person, can place yourself in Punk's shoes, and therefore have let the situation go.

2. You came in all offended and heard what me and my trusty team of "knuckle-draggers" had to say and therefore changed your outlook on the situation for the better.

3. You didnt get it, and you probably never will.

 

[Slyfox696]

You know, I feel for your kids man, you dont let them be kids because of your own views.

No, I don't let them practice hate speech because of my own views. I tell them I don't care how you personally feel about it, but you're not going to say those things in my class.

I doubt you teach the "homosexuality history" class, so your views should be kept in your head.

Completely false. My job is to teach, and I'm teaching children how to be nice to one another. I don't influence their views, I just prohibit them from practicing hate speech.

But at the same time I'm glad your a teacher, kids are the most vocal group and will definately give you the hell you deserve.

My students are wonderful kids, and I get along with almost all of them. No teacher can ever get along with everyone (just too many different personalities in the world), but I can't even begin to count the number of times and the number of different students I've had come up to me in public to talk to me.

So, sorry, my students are great kids, and I love what I do.

In fact, if I knew you were a teacher I wouldnt have stepped into this argument, you are some of the most stubborn people out there.

We're only stubborn when we're right. Like now, for example.

Oh and those knuckle-draggers that you're talking about happen to be some of the most well expressed people I've seen on this site.

And I thought you said a comedian couldn't be funny unless insulting a group of people! That was one of the funniest things I've read all night. I literally laughed out loud when I read that.

That was a good joke. You scored some points in my book with that one.

1. Either you manned up and spoke your mind about the Punk incident. You're an understanding person, can place yourself in Punk's shoes, and therefore have let the situation go.

I told you long ago I don't hold it against Punk. He said something he shouldn't have, but unlike you, he realized it was wrong for him to say it, and apologized for being a total douche.

People make mistakes, I understand that, and Punk owned up to his. I have no problem with him. The problem I've had in this thread is with your attitude it's okay to promote prejudice.

2. You came in all offended and head what me and my trusty team of "knuckle-draggers" had to say and therefore changed your outlook on the situation for the better.

3. You didnt get it, and you probably never will.

No, I get it just fine. You want a world where everyone is exactly like you. You admit violence happens against homosexuals, you freely admit you would never want to be one because of what they have to go through, but at the same time, you curse a group like GLAAD for working to change people's perceptions of homosexuals.

You are a very pathetic person. Do yourself a favor. Take tonight, and just think what the world would be like if everyone treated everyone based upon who they were, not what they were born with or have to deal with due to circumstances outside of their control. Now, imagine how that will ever be possible, if prejudice is permitted to be practiced without response.

You know deep down, even if you won't admit it here, that comments which dehumanize another group of people are wrong. I assure you, there are many instances where Political Correctness goes overboard. I agree completely with you on that. But this is not one of those times. If CM Punk had called the person a "******", would you still be defending it? Or what if he called them a "spic" or "wetback", would that be okay?

Of course not, so why is it okay if he calls them a homo? In all seriousness, you need to take a little time to re-evaluate who you are as a person, if you are seriously okay with that kind of speech.

 

[H33LTurn]

Ok see now you're starting to open up and talk like a man! Shyt took you 2 days bro! Although I doubt if you walked into a classroom in NYC and said "you guys cant use the words homo or gay or ******..." you wouldnt be able to finish your sentence. Just saying

I'm not ok with hate speech, I really dont know how I have to phrase these words in order for you to understand them. I just think everyone should take a chill pill because Punk made a mistake, appologized for it, and now its all over. Anyone who was hurt by his words can now relieve themselves of their feelings due to Punk's apology. I dont want to judge, honestly thats the last thing right now, but it looks like you come from a place much different than I do. When people use the word homo in my neighborhood, we know what they're talking about, and it just bounces off. You have your views, and I'm pretty sure you've seen some shit or experienced some shit to make you feel the way you feel but in the grand scheme of things its not that big of a deal, believe me.

No I wouldnt be defending Punk if he used the words ****** or spic because those words arent used as terms of endearment. Theres honestly no excuse that can come out of your mouth to make those words right, that we can agree on. But I think that knowing what we know about the word "homo" and how its used that people shouldnt be up in arms about the Punk situation but should be like, he fucked up, ohh well, bet he wont do it again and just move on. and PLEASE make this you're final reply i'm fucking tired.

 

[Slyfox696]

Ok see now you're starting to open up and talk like a man! Shyt took you 2 days bro! Although I doubt if you walked into a classroom in NYC and said "you guys cant use the words homo or gay or ******..." you wouldnt be able to finish your sentence. Just saying

Weren't you leaving? Like twice?

I'm not ok with hate speech, I really dont know how I have to phrase these words in order for you to understand them. I just think everyone whould take a chill pill because Punk made a mistake, appologized for it, and now its all over.

But you were upset GLAAD commented on the situation. That's why we argued in the first place.

I dont want to judge, honestly thats the last thing right now, but it looks like you come from a place much different than I do.

I come from some place where we are taught to treat everyone with respect. Where do you come from?

When people use the word homo in my neighborhood, we know what they're talking about, and it just bounces off.

That doesn't make it right though. Even if you're only saying it to be funny, it's still an insult by associating the offending person with homosexuality.

You see that, right? It's not innocent. It's harmful. Maybe for you it bounces off, but maybe not to your friends. You already agree where you come from is unkind to homosexuals, so it obviously doesn't bounce off others. The only way to combat this is to change the context of how we refer to others. As long as you are saying someone is inferior to you with the word "homo" or "******" or whatever, you're propagating the idea that being homosexual is undesirable.

All insults aside, you HAVE to be able to understand that, right?

You have your views, and I'm pretty sure you've seen some shit or experienced some shit to make you feel the way you feel but in the grand scheme of things its not that big of a deal, believe me.

I haven't. I just understand what's right and what's wrong.

No I wouldnt be defending Punk if he used the words ****** or spic because those words arent used as terms of endearment.

And neither is homo. Do you ever go up to your mom and say, "I homo you, Mom"? No, of course not. How do you use it? In a derogatory sense. For example, if your friend shoots you with a water gun, and you're mad about it, you'll call him a homo (as an example). That's not a term of endearment, it's as far from it as possible.

Theres honestly no excuse that can come out of your mouth to make those words right, that we can agree on.

Absolutely. And there's no excuse which makes "homo" or "******" or saying "you're so gay" right either.

But I think that knowing what we know about the word "homo" and how its used that people shouldnt be up in arms about the Punk situation

And that's what I'm trying to get across to you. They SHOULD be up in arms, for the same reason they should be up in arms if he had said ****** or spic or Jap or Gook, or whatever the hate term might be. Because they are hate speech, used to try and dehumanize another.

and PLEASE make this you're final reply i'm fucking tired.

You don't have to keep replying, you know.

 

[H33LTurn]

I know I said I was leaving, twice (thank you for pointing that out) but I cant help leave with the homophobic image you've helped paint of me by pulling out one or two phrases out of context and not understanding the bigger picture.

I'll leave with this: to some using words like "homo" is severely cruel, to others its a little far from harmless. It shouldnt be a word thats so commonly thrown around but it is and we need to accept that. If you think its your duty in life to educate others on why the word homo shouldnt be used then go right ahead, but I hope you have a better reaction than Sly when people just arent willing to hear what you have to say. Another thing SLy, if you're student are anywhere above the grade level of 8th grade then they've already received the "hurtful words" speech, so you can drop it. They know right from wrong, theres no need to keep repeating the same thing over and over.

To some people the biggest issue in America is learning not to use words like "homo", to others its being able to live in the place that you want, wear the clothes you want, without having your life threatened. Its not a special interest problem, its a society problem. If its not gay people its short people, or black people, or ugly people, and it'll just continue. We dont tease kids for being in the AV club anymore do we, because now we can tease ugly kids, and with technology like Facebook we can tease kids over their personal lives and the situation will always keep going on. In a world were this is something that regularly happens, a guy accidentlay saying "homo" shouldnt be whats getting people up in arms. PRIORITIZE! Live your lives, determine right or wrong with your own minds, no by what others tell you. And remember that you have the right to believe what you want to believe, regardless or who or how many people may disagree and what they do to disagree. MLK, Huey Newton, Malcom X, Gandhi all fought for waht they belive in, and thats why I was intending to do tonight, sorry if I came across the wrong way but understand that I'm fighting for you so that one day if you make a poor choice of words (which we all do) and you just so happen to be successful the media or the people around you dont blow it out of proportion.

 

[Slyfox696]

I know I said I was leaving, twice (thank you for pointing that out) but I cant help leave with the homophobic image you've helped paint of me by pulling out one or two phrases out of context and not understanding the bigger picture.

I haven't painted anything, you've done it all yourself.

I'll leave with this: to some using words like "homo" is severely cruel, to others its a little far from harmless. It shouldnt be a word thats so commonly thrown around but it is and we need to accept that.

You were doing just fine until you said "we need to accept that". No, we most certainly do not need to accept that. We need to do the opposite of that. We need to make people understand it's NOT okay to be said. It is wrong to try and teach people homosexuality should be discriminated against.

We don't need to accept that, we need to do the opposite.

If you think its your duty in life to educate others on why the word homo shouldnt be used then go right ahead

It's not my duty in life, but it is a "pet peeve" of mine.

but I hope you have a better reaction than Sly when people just arent willing to hear what you have to say. Another thing SLy, if you're student are anywhere above the grade level of 8th grade then they've already received the "hurtful words" speech, so you can drop it. They know right from wrong, theres no need to keep repeating the same thing over and over.

Completely false. There's never a time you quit teaching and reinforcing positive values. I've worked as the instructor to the gifted program with the most intelligent students our school. I've worked in physical education. I've worked as a basketball coach. I've worked in teaching computer classes. I've worked as a tech/network guy. I've done many jobs in the school, and one thing I know for certain is you never quit teaching and reinforcing what it means to be a decent human being.

Personal growth doesn't stop at the 8th grade. I've seen many students grow as human being to know that to be the case. Just as an example, two girls who were such fierce rivals there was an entire frontpage newspaper story about it when they were in 10th grade, became friends by 12th grade and were seen everywhere together.

I'm sorry, but as a trained educator, I can tell you that your comment is false. Most of the time, students do know right from wrong, but may not practice "right" because they don't believe it is acceptable for them to. You teach them it's acceptable to do the right thing, and they will.

In a world were this is something that regularly happens, a guy accidentlay saying "homo" shouldnt be whats getting people up in arms. PRIORITIZE!

That's just silly. Why can't you address problems when they come up? In what world is it okay to let a rapist go free because we have a murder trial to conduct?

thats why I was intending to do tonight, sorry if I came across the wrong way

You've been fighting for people to practice hatred. There is no other way for you to come off.

but understand that I'm fighting for you so that one day if you make a poor choice of words (which we all do) and you just so happen to be successful the media or the people around you dont blow it out of proportion.

If I say something I shouldn't, then I'll apologize for it, just like Punk did. That's not the problem here, and has never been the problem. I've explained this too you so many times I seriously wonder if you really were absent the day they taught reading comprehension.

The problem is not what Punk let slip, but rather your views he should be allowed to say it without response. That's the problem in this thread.

 

[H33LTurn]

Ok, got some spare time, one last thing. I dont belive Punk's situation should go without response, I just believe that they should've given him some time to appologize (which he did) before commenting or making it news on TMZ (you have no idea what its like to have your every mistake pointed out online to a audience of millions).

 

[RayneMaker]

Oh hey what’s up guys? A little late to the party i see. Damn. Well let me start by saying that trust me JoeyRazor i see where you are coming from. That being said you aren't really getting the big picture. Hold on let me back track. You see i am a gay man. Oh here is something better. i hope you respect this. i am still in the closet to my family. I am young, too young to survive on my own. So I have to make sure I can support myself in case I’m rejected from my family for being someone they don’t want me to be. So I’ve chosen to stay in the closet until that time. Not being “out” I hear this argument all the time. Also I want to point out I am not meaning to attack you or make you feel awkward. I just felt this will help you see my prospective.
See, the thing is I subscribed to your feelings on how people take the meanings of the words we say. In fact I use to say “that is so gay” all the time. I completely understand what you say but it’s bigger than that. I could personally care less what cm punk said. I take it with a grain of salt at this point. People do say it all the time and many don’t mean it. But that is the problem. Because I can have it not faze me doesn’t mean others are the same. I knew gay as an insult before I had any sexual feelings. In fact before I even knew what gay meant. That is before the 4th grade. We have to not let that happen for the younger kids because many people aren’t as strong willed as I am. I can deal with it but many of my peers take their own lives. I know someone who was physically born with both male and female parts. Eventually this person became a girl even though she felt like a boy. She lived as a lesbian, and killed herself because of who she was. She is a part of my society; many of us feel the same way as she did. We feel as if we were born the wrong sex. Many like her are forced to live with being a part of our community. Teaching people to not say those types of things make it more taboo and unacceptable in our society. I know firsthand a life that could have been saved if our society taught us to be more conscious of what we say.
This isn’t a gay problem though, it’s a society problem. When someone famous says something like that it can be enough to trigger a severe reaction in people. I love wrestling. For a few hours I can drift off in a fantasy world. I have no care or problem during this time other than what will happen next. Everyone feels trapped sometimes; it’s good to have an escape. When we watch something and expect to have a good time the last thing you want is to hear that sort of thing. Regardless of what sport or TV show you are watching. I grantee you some gay kid idolizes Cm Punk, who could have had his world crushed with a simple word. I think cm is not actually homophobic, and his apology is great. Good enough for me and most people. But this whole forum post went above and beyond the actual point at hand. In fact it seems to be started by people who wanted to bash gays. Everyone is talking like it was blown into such a big deal and it was not at all. If it wasn’t for homophobes starting this no one would have really even noticed.
Again this isn’t to upset anybody but to really give you some insight. I hope this helped a little.
And yes some people are too sensitive dman1373. I agree but we still are treated like second class citizens. If they could they would try and take our voting privileges away. Only 5 states can let me get the same benefits of a straight couple. Until the day I can do everything a straight person can we need to fight, even something minor like this. Also kind of a bad example, being born “stupid” is easily fixed. School. Whatever your anger is relax up a little, we have one life to live. Why get super pissed over it? This whole post I was not mad, I just want you guys to see a little explanation. In fact I respect you guys for even talking this much about it.
Peace bros