[Official] Dragon Ball Z Thread

Lulz. If it were possible, it would make an interesting fight.

In a battle between Vegeto and Superman (in any given form), Vegeto easily wins.

Though, some people actually think Superman would beat Goku in a fight. I seriously doubt that.
 
Lulz. If it were possible, it would make an interesting fight.

In a battle between Vegeto and Superman (in any given form), Vegeto easily wins.

Though, some people actually think Superman would beat Goku in a fight. I seriously doubt that.

Ive compared the two and gone far in depth with the debate. I dont see Superman winning. The two are very close overall, Superman is better in some areas, Goku in others, but in the end Goku wins.

Goku was only second strongest in the series anyway. Mystic Gohan was the strongest. That is unless Goku went up in power tremendously during the ten years after Buu. And Superman couldnt beat Mystic Gohan. He was more or less Pre Crisis Superman with the Sword of Superman.

And Vegeto, no way in hell.
 
Yea I've debated the issue of Goku vs. Superman in the past aswell, Goku wins by alot. But it really depends o what "power level" Goku would be in...if it were like when he fought Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga, I could definately see Superman winning...But if it were like Super Saiyan 2 Goku (or higher)...Goku wins

I think by the end of DBZ, Goku did end up getting stronger than Gohan. Gohan turned into a nerd and Goku kept on training. By common sense, it means Gohan got weaker and Goku got stronger...but there is no way to tell for sure.
 
Yea I've debated the issue of Goku vs. Superman in the past aswell, Goku wins by alot. But it really depends o what "power level" Goku would be in...if it were like when he fought Vegeta in the Saiyan Saga, I could definately see Superman winning...But if it were like Super Saiyan 2 Goku (or higher)...Goku wins

I think by the end of DBZ, Goku did end up getting stronger than Gohan. Gohan turned into a nerd and Goku kept on training. By common sense, it means Gohan got weaker and Goku got stronger...but there is no way to tell for sure.

I wouldnt say Goku wins by a lot actually. I think it would be somewhat close. I read a lot of comics too, Superman has some feats where it shows he far outclasses Goku in some areas. Strength For example. Superman lifted a book which contained the Multiverse, infinite barely grasps the meaning of the level of weight involved, thus he is much stronger.

Superman can fly much faster, being able to fly across the universe in mere panels, now Goku compensates and wins based on IT, and hes faster in combat speed, so Goku has the advantage in that area.

But when you compare everything they are much closer than you would think, though Goku still wins, and probably by a good amount.

Also, the "powering up" argument is also a bull argument. If we allow Superman to fight at full power its only fair to allow Goku too. Also Goku can instantly power up, the argument it would take him forever is based on them not reading the manga and thinking that the padding out they did in the anime is how it actually works. Even in the anime before he faced Buu, Goku showed he can go SS3 instantly.
 
Also, the "powering up" argument is also a bull argument. If we allow Superman to fight at full power its only fair to allow Goku too. Also Goku can instantly power up, the argument it would take him forever is based on them not reading the manga and thinking that the padding out they did in the anime is how it actually works. Even in the anime before he faced Buu, Goku showed he can go SS3 instantly.

I agree with everything else so i dont see the need to say anymore but...

You mis-understood what I ment. I said power-level not power-up (nased on the story's progression). Goku gains a higher power level throughout the progress of the entire series. For example, against Raditz, Goku was at power level 420 (i think). But when he was SS3...he was way higher...I dont know the number so lets just say 500,000,000

So it depends on what part of the series of Goku your talking about. Saiyan Saga Goku---Superman wins. SS3 Goku---Goku wins.

If it were at full power Goku SS4 against Superman full power...the answer is obvious...I read a lot of Superman comics in the past but that was like in 6th-8th grade so my memory of them isnt that good.
 
I agree with everything else so i dont see the need to say anymore but...

You mis-understood what I ment. I said power-level not power-up (nased on the story's progression). Goku gains a higher power level throughout the progress of the entire series. For example, against Raditz, Goku was at power level 420 (i think). But when he was SS3...he was way higher...I dont know the number so lets just say 500,000,000

So it depends on what part of the series of Goku your talking about. Saiyan Saga Goku---Superman wins. SS3 Goku---Goku wins.

If it were at full power Goku SS4 against Superman full power...the answer is obvious...I read a lot of Superman comics in the past but that was like in 6th-8th grade so my memory of them isnt that good.

I understood that part, but that goes into my full power argument. Superman can be at full power but Goku needs to be weakened? Its stupid. Even back then though they were capable of planet buster levels, so they could give Superman a fight, but of course he would win, which goes further to make their argument stupid.

Also I know you were just using figures from nowhere, but their power levels would be closer to the trillions at the end of DBZ. As Toriyama said Goku and Frieza's power levels were well over 200,000,000 during their fight.

And Gt isnt canon lulz
 
I understood that part, but that goes into my full power argument. Superman can be at full power but Goku needs to be weakened? Its stupid. Even back then though they were capable of planet buster levels, so they could give Superman a fight, but of course he would win, which goes further to make their argument stupid.

Not Exactly. I wouldn't say stupid...I'd say redundant (if I were agreeing). Its logical to assume that Goku as SS3 would be stronger as like the "figures" state, his power level was higher than 2,000,000,000...while in the Raditz fight it was only 420. If you see it from my point of view, all it is is using common sense.

But still, when you go to an in-depth arguement or debate (which I don't really feel like going because we will both reach the same conclusion---Goku would win) about who is stronger...you'd have to use all the facts and would have to base everything on their "full-powered from"...

Also I know you were just using figures from nowhere, but their power levels would be closer to the trillions at the end of DBZ. As Toriyama said Goku and Frieza's power levels were well over 200,000,000 during their fight.

No way. Really? 200,000,000 with just Frieza final form? Now that seems a bit too far fetched. If just Frieza in his second form was only 1,000,000. To go that high after only two more transformations is a bit to far...

And Gt isnt canon lulz

For the record, GT sucked ass and only killed the "credibility" Dragonball and DBZ established.
 
Not Exactly. I wouldn't say stupid...I'd say redundant (if I were agreeing). Its logical to assume that Goku as SS3 would be stronger as like the "figures" state, his power level was higher than 2,000,000,000...while in the Raditz fight it was only 420. If you see it from my point of view, all it is is using common sense.

But still, when you go to an in-depth arguement or debate (which I don't really feel like going because we will both reach the same conclusion---Goku would win) about who is stronger...you'd have to use all the facts and would have to base everything on their "full-powered from"...

yes, or else it wouldnt be fair, and them attempting to give Superman an unfair advantage is stupid, as Ive said before.

No way. Really? 200,000,000 with just Frieza final form? Now that seems a bit too far fetched. If just Frieza in his second form was only 1,000,000. To go that high after only two more transformations is a bit to far...

Ok I was off by 50 million but SS Goku was at 150,000,000 when he faced Frieza whom was around 20 less than himself. They were the last official power levels. Frieza's second form was "Over one million, not one million" he also had 2 more forms PLUS his maximum which was far above his final form.

But at the end of Z they were insect like in comparison so one would assume theyre way into or even past the billions at that point. And if we're going on pure destruction powers it makes sense, as Buu was capable of destroying the universe.

For the record, GT sucked ass and only killed the "credibility" Dragonball and DBZ established.

Idk, with the creation of Kai I think that its gaining more again. The DB movie may have done more damage than GT, but I like to keep them separate.
 
Furyof5 said:
Ok I was off by 50 million but SS Goku was at 150,000,000 when he faced Frieza whom was around 20 less than himself. They were the last official power levels.

Yes. Yes they were when we look at it by "numbers". Androids never had power levels and the scouters were never used again. Akira couldnt keep up with his own math lulz.

Frieza's second form was "Over one million, not one million"

Same...difference...

Idk, with the creation of Kai I think that its gaining more again.

Kai helps out the "kiddies" who never learned about DBZ...it shits on hard-core DBZ fans such as myself (at least the voices do anyways)...but in terms of profit---Yea. DBZKai is doing wonders for the Dragonball legacy.

The DB movie may have done more damage than GT, but I like to keep them separate.

You mean the "Patht o Power"? I thought that movie was good. Dragonball (the original) stayed awesome throughout the entire run---even its movies were good---though not as good as the anime/manga.
 
Yes. Yes they were when we look at it by "numbers". Androids never had power levels and the scouters were never used again. Akira couldnt keep up with his own math lulz.

Yes thus why those were the LAST official numbers.

Same...difference...

Normally yes, but people usually like to think it means rounded to rather than actually being above it. Either way he was way beyond it in his final form.

Kai helps out the "kiddies" who never learned about DBZ...it shits on hard-core DBZ fans such as myself (at least the voices do anyways)...but in terms of profit---Yea. DBZKai is doing wonders for the Dragonball legacy.

I for one like Kai, its more streamlined and actually follows the manga. Also the voices are fine with the exception of Gohan. Who actually cares about Bulma or the other less important characters voices? Especially when you consider the original voices were in Japanese.

I do like the original Gohan voice more however, but I think they used this voice actor because the other one had a contract with another company. Theres always a chance they will bring them back.

You mean the "Patht o Power"? I thought that movie was good. Dragonball (the original) stayed awesome throughout the entire run---even its movies were good---though not as good as the anime/manga.

Dragonball Evolution. And DB was good, I prefer Z by far.
 
Furyof5 said:
I for one like Kai, its more streamlined and actually follows the manga. Also the voices are fine with the exception of Gohan. Who actually cares about Bulma or the other less important characters voices? Especially when you consider the original voices were in Japanese.

Yea the lack of so much fillers is nice...But I care about Bulma and "the other less important characters"...there is nothing like the original voices of any given TV show. They had more of a natural feel and I think many will agree.

Example: Futurama. They were gona replace the original cast when the "re-birth" was planned but they decided not to because everyone "boycotted" it.


I do like the original Gohan voice more however, but I think they used this voice actor because the other one had a contract with another company.

I dont really know for sure to agree or argue...I dont pay attention to anime and manga as much as I used to. I still remember DBZ because it was always my favorite show to watch as a kid. I started re-watching Dragonball like around early August and planned to watch every single episode until the movie "A hero's Legacy"...Unfortunately, I bearly like on episode 90 of Dragonball.

Theres always a chance they will bring them back

Would be nice.

Dragonball Evolution. And DB was good, I prefer Z by far.

Oh FUCK YES! Evolution was absurd. I literally felt like they were shitting on us...That guy that played goku couldnt even say Kamehameha right. And Goku in highschool?! oh my god! so stupid.

I liked Dragonball alot (almost as much as DBZ) because of all the comedy bits. Goku (as a child) was fucken halerious. But yea, I think DBZ was better too.
 
Yea the lack of so much fillers is nice...But I care about Bulma and "the other less important characters"...there is nothing like the original voices of any given TV show. They had more of a natural feel and I think many will agree.

I like all of the original voices, dont get me wrong, its just that it doesnt really effect my viewing pleasure over all. And as Ive said their original voices are in Japanese anyway, thus the problem becomes less significant. Most "hardcore" DBZ fans hate the dub and only watch it in Japanese.

Example: Futurama. They were gona replace the original cast when the "re-birth" was planned but they decided not to because everyone "boycotted" it.

Yes, I remember this, however this is very different. These were the original characters every episode revolved around. Bulma was marginalized in DBZ, she spent most of the time in the Namek saga off to the side or involved in unimportant filler episodes. She has been in some important things, but the minimization of her character makes the voice less important. Every main or important character kept their voice, with the exception of Gohan, but they wanted to keep his voice anyway and may very well bring him back after the VA's contract expires.

Oh FUCK YES! Evolution was absurd. I literally felt like they were shitting on us...That guy that played goku couldnt even say Kamehameha right. And Goku in highschool?! oh my god! so stupid.

"The flying crane attack is the ultimate airbending move", what the hell was that? We waited for YEARS for it to be released and they gave us that pile of shit? Honestly, I could make a better film than that.

Though one argument that didnt bother me was that they casted Goku as a white character. Well He wasnt asian to begin with, he was an alien. Furthermore they had blonde hair and blue/green eyes as Super Saiyans, and even had a Hitler joke about it. So theres no issue.

I liked Dragonball alot (almost as much as DBZ) because of all the comedy bits. Goku (as a child) was fucken halerious. But yea, I think DBZ was better too.

Yep
 
I always knew the idea of a live action Db movie would suck total ass. Unless it was directed by the Wachowski brothers. All they would have to do is rip off the Neo/Smith fight's, especially the one from Revolution, and it was all set. Shame.
 
[QUOTE="iMPACT! Player" Riaku;2440813]I always knew the idea of a live action Db movie would suck total ass. Unless it was directed by the Wachowski brothers. All they would have to do is rip off the Neo/Smith fight's, especially the one from Revolution, and it was all set. Shame.[/QUOTE]

Really I dont think this is what needed to happen. All they needed to do was follow the story and it would have worked. Sure people may still not like the actors and direction, but it still would have been decent. The director basically said "Fuck that" and did something TOTALLY different from the story.

I think what they should have done was make it an episodic series, have the story follow the actual story line. One film for the Raditz/Sayain Saga, maybe 1-2 for the Frieza Saga, 2-3 for the Androids/Cell sagas, and finish it off with 2 Buu sagas. Now this seems like it may be a lot, but we see series like this all the time. For Example theyve made 8 Harry Potter films. It would be at the most that many. Now how about DB you may ask? I and pretty much everyone else saw DBZ before DB(With the exception of a few episodes as a young child) and thought it was perfectly fine, as they referenced the story. We could simply have flash backs or sum it up beforehand.

Fans go to see the films because of the story and to see that story told on screen, not some bullshit the director thought of during an acid induced viewing of Avatar: The Last Airbender.
 
Really I dont think this is what needed to happen. All they needed to do was follow the story and it would have worked. Sure people may still not like the actors and direction, but it still would have been decent. The director basically said "Fuck that" and did something TOTALLY different from the story.

I think what they should have done was make it an episodic series, have the story follow the actual story line. One film for the Raditz/Sayain Saga, maybe 1-2 for the Frieza Saga, 2-3 for the Androids/Cell sagas, and finish it off with 2 Buu sagas. Now this seems like it may be a lot, but we see series like this all the time. For Example theyve made 8 Harry Potter films. It would be at the most that many. Now how about DB you may ask? I and pretty much everyone else saw DBZ before DB(With the exception of a few episodes as a young child) and thought it was perfectly fine, as they referenced the story. We could simply have flash backs or sum it up beforehand.
In my eyes there would have been no way to make the movie look good the deeper into the DBZ story. I mean the X Men movies were barely able to nail the comics in terms of the mutants powers with the FX's. I can't imagine the Vegeta/Goku fight from the World Tournament saga looking well at all. Or the Frieza saga overall.

They should've just taken the the Saiyan saga and that was it.
Fans go to see the films because of the story and to see that story told on screen, not some bullshit the director thought of during an acid induced viewing of Avatar: The Last Airbender.
Haven't seen Airbender but from the credits it actually looks loyal to the show.
 
[QUOTE="iMPACT! Player" Riaku;2440856]In my eyes there would have been no way to make the movie look good the deeper into the DBZ story.
[/quote]

How do you figure?

I mean the X Men movies were barely able to nail the comics in terms of the mutants powers with the FX's. I can't imagine the Vegeta/Goku fight from the World Tournament saga looking well at all. Or the Frieza saga overall.

Really, with graphics today I think it could be pulled off quite well. If they can make a totally cg created world such as Pandora in Avatar then they can do flying, fighting and Ki blasts. Of course the fights wont last as long as they did in the anime, and some less important ones would be cut to conserve time, but the film overall would work.

One of the biggest reasons they cut and lessened the powers in the X-Men films(which mind you, the first one was made 10 years ago) was because they figured it wouldnt work, or simply would appeal. They could have easily had Sentinels and everything however they didnt for those reasons.

They should've just taken the the Saiyan saga and that was it.

Overall or simply in this one film? If the latter I agree, but most likely the Saiyan saga would leave room for more and people wanting more. Just look at how far graphics have come since Harry Potter And The Sorcerer's Stone, it would take probably just as long to make a series out of this and they could certainly keep up with graphics by then. From pretty much every angle this would look good if executed correctly.

Haven't seen Airbender but from the credits it actually looks loyal to the show.

I wouldnt know, I was just referring to the show.
 
Yes, I remember this, however this is very different. These were the original characters every episode revolved around. Bulma was marginalized in DBZ, she spent most of the time in the Namek saga off to the side or involved in unimportant filler episodes. She has been in some important things, but the minimization of her character makes the voice less important. Every main or important character kept their voice, with the exception of Gohan, but they wanted to keep his voice anyway and may very well bring him back after the VA's contract expires.

Even still, it can't be denied. the original FUNIMATION cast was much better

I like all of the original voices, dont get me wrong, its just that it doesnt really effect my viewing pleasure over all. And as Ive said their original voices are in Japanese anyway, thus the problem becomes less significant. Most "hardcore" DBZ fans hate the dub and only watch it in Japanese.

To be fair, it affects mine because I was one of the people that preferrd the dub rather than the japanese. Sure, the japanese stereo version had more dirty in it. Especially in Dragonball, But the voices were just so annoying. Goku sounded like a child in his 16's that still hadnt gone through puberty. All their voices didnt match with the characters. Rather Funimation voices were all spot on. Chris Sabat (that was his name right?) along wit everyone else did a wonderful job.

Though one argument that didnt bother me was that they casted Goku as a white character. Well He wasnt asian to begin with, he was an alien. Furthermore they had blonde hair and blue/green eyes as Super Saiyans, and even had a Hitler joke about it. So theres no issue.

YES. I liked having Goku as an american actor instead. But honestly, the guy still did a horrible job.


To get involved in your's and Raiku's discussion, I think that the idea for the Dragonball movie was good. But it was the story/plot that killed everything. Evolution being based on King Piccolo was a great idea to start off a movie series of Dragonball. If I were to have chosen an idea for a second film, I pobly would have chosen Saiyan Saga (involving Frieza). Third film =Cell. Fourth (optional film) = Buu

The thing here is that whoever the screen writer would have been, they wouldnt be able to follow the story strictly. They would have to change a few things. For example, in the second. Frieza would have come to like earth instead of Namek. Another thing is that the story would have to have a way so that everything could fit into 2 hrs.

This is what Evolution tried to do. Only, it did a horrible job---thus, all its criticism
 
Haaa, bit off subject to what everybody else has been discussing but I ordered DragonBall Z season 3 and 4 from Amazon a few days ago and they've been dispatched. :) can't wait to get stuck into those.

I spent about 2 days sitting watching Season 1 and 2. :D
 
Haaa, bit off subject to what everybody else has been discussing but I ordered DragonBall Z season 3 and 4 from Amazon a few days ago and they've been dispatched. :) can't wait to get stuck into those.

I spent about 2 days sitting watching Season 1 and 2. :D

The only problem with shipping is you have to wait for your item to get to you lol. I hate waiting for a book when I buy one online, but I dont have much of a choice as theyve closed most bookstores near me.
 
Even still, it can't be denied. the original FUNIMATION cast was much better

You said original, do you mean before Schemell got there or after? I agree with the latter.

To be fair, it affects mine because I was one of the people that preferrd the dub rather than the japanese. Sure, the japanese stereo version had more dirty in it. Especially in Dragonball, But the voices were just so annoying. Goku sounded like a child in his 16's that still hadnt gone through puberty. All their voices didnt match with the characters. Rather Funimation voices were all spot on. Chris Sabat (that was his name right?) along wit everyone else did a wonderful job.

I agree, but I at least am someone whom can get used to it. I for example go from watching an anime in only English to watching it in Japanese many times, most;y to watch the series because it takes FAR too long for them to release it here. Ive done it with many animes such as Full Metal Alchemist Brotherhood. So it doesnt effect me as much. I do however prefer the dub, as its simply superior in DBZ.

YES. I liked having Goku as an american actor instead. But honestly, the guy still did a horrible job.

Yep.

To get involved in your's and Raiku's discussion, I think that the idea for the Dragonball movie was good. But it was the story/plot that killed everything. Evolution being based on King Piccolo was a great idea to start off a movie series of Dragonball. If I were to have chosen an idea for a second film, I pobly would have chosen Saiyan Saga (involving Frieza). Third film =Cell. Fourth (optional film) = Buu

You see I dont think 1 film would be anywhere near long enough for some sagas, Cell all in one film? The amount of changes would make it unwatchable. There should be AT LEAST 2, same for the Buu Saga, which while the Cell Saga ends better for a movie series, should be shown if we've already come that far, and because its probably the most popular one.

The thing here is that whoever the screen writer would have been, they wouldnt be able to follow the story strictly. They would have to change a few things.

The changes themselves would damage the entire story however as Ill illustrate.

For example, in the second. Frieza would have come to like earth instead of Namek.

This would simply ruin the story, in many way. The entire reason they went to Namek was because their friends had died and were unable to be wished back because the Dragonballs were gone. Vegeta then went after Frieza to Namek because Frieza now wanted them. The story on Namek is very important as it creates the story about Dende later on, Vegeta helping them, and of course all of the Nameks that were very important like Guru and the later elder. Not to mention that it would provide an awesome backdrop and the fight between Frieza and Goku literally couldnt be contained on Earth, seeing as one of the big points of it is that they are fighting on thee dieing planet.

Another thing is that the story would have to have a way so that everything could fit into 2 hrs.

Ive found if a film is good enough or a story is compelling enough people dont mind sitting for more than 2 hours. The LOTR trilogy had films far in excess of 3 hours, and people stayed. But I wouldnt go that far, perhaps 2:30 or something. It all depends upon the quality, or how its directed really. But a whole saga such as the Androids/Cell cant be done in one film unless we are making it Obscenely long, like 5 hours, and the same goes for Buu.

This is what Evolution tried to do. Only, it did a horrible job---thus, all its criticism

Yep, the director was horrible.
 
I've been thinking about maybe my favorite villian in DBZ, Turles. There was just something about him that I liked so much. It may be that he looked like an evil version of Goku. I thought he should have made return in a sequel like Cooler and Broly.

[youtube]biK13ykJKNo[/youtube]
 
I've been thinking about maybe my favorite villian in DBZ, Turles. There was just something about him that I liked so much. It may be that he looked like an evil version of Goku. I thought he should have made return in a sequel like Cooler and Broly.

[youtube]biK13ykJKNo[/youtube]

Yea this is one of my favorite movies. And even though Cooler coming back made little sense it would have made less sense for him when he got blown up by the spirit bomb.
 

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