New Health Care Bill Passed and Other Political Chatter

[X]

Palin is the laughingstock of the left just as Biden is the laughingstock of the right.

And what is the majority of the media made up of FTS? The left. Palin gets mocked on a daily basis by everyone from the news to the Tonight Show to the Daily Show to friggin' cartoons. She's never going to win a Presidential election, I'd bet hard money on that one.

 

[FromTheSouth]

BUt she energizes the right, and moderate housewives love her. Realistically, she wrong for the job, but politically, she's not a bad choice.

Plus, she got hung out to dry by the McCain campaign. They never backed her and left her for the media to attack.

Bonus points for ackowleging that media leans left.

 

[X]

Well that's fairly obvious, I think we discussed this before. Typically the people that get into journalist are on the left, I'd venture to say the vast majority of journalism students in the nation right now are liberal. There's a correlation between the two.

And no offense to moderate housewives, but that demographic isn't going to win you a national election.

 

[FromTheSouth]

It won Bill Clinton a national election.

Soccer moms used to always vote Republican. Clinton swayed them his way, and the combination of Perot's sucking votes from Bush, the tax thing, and soccer mom's is widely regarded as what won for Clinton.

 

[X]

Palin couldn't have the appeal of Clinton if she sold her soul to the devil.

 

[FromTheSouth]

She appeals to my balls...that's for sure. Total Milf, well, I guess Gilf at this point.

 

[klunderbunker]

Nope you're wrong, you can clearly die from depression. To say otherwise is just ridiculous. And yeah, for some people they can be cured, but for most that's not the case, it's simply made tolerable for those who are lucky enough to respond positively. For most, medication is a vicious cycle of side-effects, horrendous, awful withdrawl (which is when most people kill themselves), new meds, new side-effects and so on.

I did write a long reply on depression but even after 12 years I still can't adequately describe it to anyone so there is little point in trying. All I can say it's not feeling miserable or uncomfortable with yourself.

Yeah, you're wrong again. See, when you die, you have no hope. When you're depressed, you can get better. I'm still waiting to find a cure for death. Also, see, you point out that the person kills themselves. It's not the depression that does it: it's them. Sorry, but it's completely different things.

 

[klunderbunker]

I must have missed this.
I'm 50/50 on the cause of obesity. On one hand I think it's been genetically established that it runs in the genes, which gives credence to a notion that it's not entirely the persons fault. On the other hand, isn't a bit silly to class every little character flaw or physical imperfection as an illness because it's genetically inherited? You remember The Simpsons episode where Lisa was told she'd never play Saxophone professionally because of her inherited stubbiness, is that in the same ballpark?
Anyway I'm getting off point, it seems deeply unfair to me that anyone could be financially screwed because they're significantly ill over a long period of time. I've said this before but healthcare can't be run as a private business without failing the very people who need it most. It's utterly fucking ******ed that the people who need insurance the most are being priced out of it, assuming they can even get insured in the first place. There has to at least be an alternative where the priority is patient care and not profits or shareholders.
People over here may complain about the NHS (they complain about everything infact) but there would be riots if we abandoned it for your system.

The genetics argument holds zero water for me. My family has a long history of alcoholism, so I have genes for it in me also. Solution: I don't drink a drop. Now I know it's different with food, but there are ways around it. Self control can play a huge factor in it.

 

[X]

You can choose not to drink KB. You can't choose for your metabolism to work faster.

 

[FromTheSouth]

You can do things to speed up your metabolism. You can eat more often, exercise, take vitamins.....

 

[gd]

You can choose to work out and eat healthy.

 

[X]

It's a completely different situation with alcoholism. It's a genetic predisposition, with obesity it's your actual biological makeup that's effected. You can't control how your body works for the most part.

 

[klunderbunker]

As for Obama not winning in 2012, that's just amusing. Like X said, unless something huge coems out, he's winning with ease. He's done fine so far, not great but fine. Considering where he started, he's done fine.

Palin is s a joke, plain and simple.

We can't afford national healthcare. We couldn't afford the wars we didn't need either but we did them too. Why should healthcare be different? We'll spend money to protect the lives of our people but not to save them. That makes sense right?

 

[Razor]

You bleeding heart jackasses don't understand anything. Insurance is cheap. It'e the democrats who make you think it's so hard to get. I pay $80 a month. That isn't a major expense when compared to how bad it could be otherwise.

So the stories of people who get sick and get their rates hiked up so that they have to drop the plan, making the insurance companies more money in the long run, are made up? But the propaganda about waiting for hours in dirty public hospitals and people dying everyday because of missing a life-saving surgery while on the national waiting list are true. Right.

We simply can't afford national healthcare, and if Obama is this determined to be a one term President, whatever, but this government needs to stop printing money to pay for entitlements for people who choose not to work.

We simply couldn't afford to wage two wars after Bush burned through the surplus in less than a year with 2 wars AND tax cuts to the rich. I don't know about you, but waging a war while cutting taxes to the rich doesn't make much sense. I thought you needed more money from your citizens for a war. You know we would have paid anything to see the masterminds of Al-Qaeda locked up. But no, he cuts taxes and launches wars we can't win. We're in the Graveyard of Empires, for fuck's sake.

And yes FTS, everyone who doesn't have insurance chooses not to work. Just like everyone on Medicare or Welfare or WIC just chooses to be too poor to feed their children. Don't forget those dirty homeless, choosing to live in their own filth after fighting in Vietnam or Korea. We should just de-patriotize the entire population that is on Unemployment, Welfare, or Medicare. If they're going to be lazy like that, we should just cut them loose.

 

[Ambiguous Turd]

Prepare to be fined. Also this pretty much assures that the Republicans will gain more seats next year, most americans from all the polls I saw were against this bill. I don't agree with making it a mandate for anyone to get health care.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. Most recent polls I viewed show that a majority of Americans DID support a Public Option.

But the name of the game is strategy.

There are obviously some Democrats in the House of Representatives who are actually in some semi-Conservative districts. But if you noticed, the bill only passed the House because of a slim majority.

That was a strategical decision.

Many of those Democrats who voted "No" were up for re-election in those semi-Conservative districts. They didn't just vote "No" because they were against the Bill. This way, the Republican challengers to these seats can't use this as ammunition against the Democrat incumbents currently occupying these seats.

So essentially, Pelosi got the votes she needed, then had conversations with the Democrats who were up for re-election in the questionable districts who may not have been in favor of the bill .... and determined which of these Congressmen could afford to vote "No" to save their seats, and still pass the bill at the same time.

All about strategy. And pretty damn good strategy at that.

And Obama will be re-elected if he gets Health Care passed. It is an issue that completely divides the country. But he has the support from the key states that produce electoral votes for him, that want Health Care reform.

The Right is furious. But the Left couldn't be more pleased.

 

[FromTheSouth]

The left isn't pleased at all. Your strategy argument is the reason why. The entire House is up for reelection, so most of those dems could never vote for it.

The Senate is where the problem lies because of a majority of the Southern Democrats are up for reelection next year, and they can't vote for the bill. The bill is going to die in the Senate, and if it doesn't, there will be another Gingrich revolution in congress in 2010.

 

[Ambiguous Turd]

The left isn't pleased at all. Your strategy argument is the reason why. The entire House is up for reelection, so most of those dems could never vote for it.

The Senate is where the problem lies because of a majority of the Southern Democrats are up for reelection next year, and they can't vote for the bill. The bill is going to die in the Senate, and if it doesn't, there will be another Gingrich revolution in congress in 2010.

When I say "The Left", I was referring to the voters on The Left, not the representatives.

Now, which Democrats do you feel could not have afforded to vote "Yea" for this bill in the House, but was "forced to" ....

and which Democrats do you think can not afford to vote "Yea" on the bill (that plans on doing so) in the Senate?

 

[Shocky]

Hmmm, so the Democrats take a hit in the 2009 elections and the general attitude of displeasure with health care reform, and they go ahead and pass this Bill. When 2010 hits and the Republicans win back the house, I don't want to hear any bitching.

 

[klunderbunker]

Take a hit? We gained members of Congress.

 

[X]

I'm baffled by how some of you think the world and our country views Obama. The man is still overwhelmingly popular in this country and around the globe. The Obama-bashers have become like the IWC---constantly overestimating their strength and power.

 

[klunderbunker]

Nobel peace prize anyone?

 

[Shocky]

Well first of all, I personally don't give a damn what the rest of the world thinks of the leader of America. Obama is our President, not theirs. 2nd, his numbers have come down to earth. He's still a popular president, but a lot of people don't agree with his politics. He's very much like Ronald Reagan in that regard.

 

[Shocky]

Please, the Nobel Peace prize is a joke. It's pretty much been given out the last few years to anyone that was not George Bush. Giving the thing to Al Gore for something that hasn't been proven scientifically pretty much makes it irrelevant.

 

[klunderbunker]

True, a lot of people don't agree with him, but I can't think of a single person that would stand a chance in hell at beating him, barring something really big happening.

 

[klunderbunker]

Please, the Nobel Peace prize is a joke. It's pretty much been given out the last few years to anyone that was not George Bush. Giving the thing to Al Gore for something that hasn't been proven scientifically pretty much makes it irrelevant.

Tells me others still think something of him. Granted it made no sense, but whatever.