Candice Michelle improving...

[rvd420blazeit]

Candice has been showing alot of improvement in the ring lately..its nice to see that some of the Women who couldn't wrestle are trying hard to fit in the womens division..so hopefully we can have more then one diva going after the title at once opposed to one diva going after it for the rest of the year....

so i can see a fatal four way for the womens title at BACKLASH...MELINA VS. MICKIE JAMES VS VICTORIA VS CANDICE MICHELLE

 

[Bernkastel]

I going to tell you the same thing I told someone else who brought this up. Yes Candice is improving in the ring, I think she's come a long way from when she first debuted, but that being said, i just think she needs more training before she can be in the main event. If you saw the match on HEAT, then you would have noticed the sluggish pace and off atomshere. I think its great that Candice is improving, but she just needs more time. if your going to make an event for Backlash, Melina vs Mickie vs Victoria is the way to go. I say put your best foot forward after that bullshit title match at Mania.

 

[RVDgurl]

I actually have to agree. I was really impressed that the women's match on RAW last night was a real wrestling match. I think the girls may have executed more wrestlings moves in their match then all the guys put together!

 

[Y 2 Jake]

I wouldnt really know. I tend to shut off whenever she star's wrestling. She'll never be a Jazz or Molly Holly so why even bother. I do think that she should be a valet. She has plenty of charisma. I think she would be a good manager for a wrestler with minimal personality. Possibly Masters. He's got the big roided up body ans she's got that whole fake tit thing going on. I think they would be good together.

 

[Bernkastel]

I still need more convincing, at least with Candice. In that Raw match, Mickie still had to do most of the work. Once Candice can get to the piont were she can go without Mickie and Victoria holding back, then I say put her in the main event. but untill then, keep her out of the title picture.

 

[Low_Ki]

I think she is definately improving. On RAW last night she held her own and was as solid as I have seen her in ring. Shes super sexy too!

 

[Bernkastel]

True, but Candice still has a ways to go before she reaches the level of intenisty I've seen Victoria, Mickie James, and Melina reach. But again, kudos to Candice for a least training hard and to getting this far. If she keeps persistant, than there is no doubt in my mind that she reach main event status one day.

 

[hatehabsforever]

Candice Michelle does not need any improvement. She knows her role and she plays it perfectly.

Let's face it, with the loss of Trish and Lita, there is no actual women's division per se, just a bunch of hot women for eye candy. She does not need to be able to wrestle, although it is nice that she is trying.

If they actually cared about the women's division, Victoria would be women's champion for the next several years as there is no one else on the roster that can wrestle. And that includes Melina and Mickie James.

 

[Bernkastel]

Candice Michelle does not need any improvement. She knows her role and she plays it perfectly.

Let's face it, with the loss of Trish and Lita, there is no actual women's division per se, just a bunch of hot women for eye candy. She does not need to be able to wrestle, although it is nice that she is trying.

If they actually cared about the women's division, Victoria would be women's champion for the next several years as there is no one else on the roster that can wrestle. And that includes Melina and Mickie James.

Are you Kidding Me?! hatehadsforever, thats has to be one of the most unintellegent things i've heard in months. You obviously have no idea what your taking about, and to be honest, you come across as a complete moron when you post something like this without having any previous knowledge about the subject. You plainly don't have any respect for any of the women that have sacrificed so much to get to were they are today and for the women that are trying to keep the heritage of the women's division alive.

 

[hatehabsforever]

Are you Kidding Me?! hatehadsforever, thats has to be one of the most unintellegent things i've heard in months. You obviously have no idea what your taking about, and to be honest, you come across as a complete moron when you post something like this without having any previous knowledge about the subject. You plainly don't have any respect for any of the women that have sacrificed so much to get to were they are today and for the women that are trying to keep the heritage of the women's division alive.

Actually, Echelon, I know exactly what I am talking about. What I am saying is that there is no women's division today when compared to the WWF/WWE of the past. There was a time when there were female wrestlers who actually could wrestle, and they could carry a plausible women's division. Alundra Blayze, Trish Stratus, Lita, Molly Holly, all of whom were attractive women, but could participate in a wrestling match that at least looked realistic. But this is not remotely the case now, with a women's division that consists of Maria, Candice Michelle, Ashley Massaro, and others who clearly are not in the WWE for their wrestling ability, but rather, are there strictly for their looks.

I think that Vince recognizes this fact and therefore for now there is no plausible women's division. This is why for the most part, women's matches in the WWE are lingerie pillow fights, bra and panties matches, and stuff like this that is not intended to promote wrestling ability, but rather, T & A. This is why Ashley, who coincidentally is on the cover of Playboy, gets a "push" to contend for the women's title, even though she is not even in the top 7 or 8 female wrestlers of today with regards to ability.

Extreme Expose, another shining example of the lack of a women's division.

It is the respect that I have for the women who have "sacrificed so much" in the past which prompts me to be derogatory toward the women's division today. And how can you comment on the women of today trying to preserve the "heritage" of the women's division, when they are doing so in their underwear, with a wardrobe malfunction routinely being the most talked about aspect of their matches.

I wish it was different, I really do. I wish Trish Stratus would return, and we could again see women who are hot, but can actually wrestle too. But if you expect Kelly Kelly, Layla, and Jillian Hall to follow in the footsteps of Trish Stratus or Lita, I think, with all due respect, that you are the moron.

By the way, it's a little bit rude to call someone a moron just because they disagree with you, especially when you can provide nothing to back it up.

 

[Bernkastel]

^ I overreacted, sorry for calling you a moron, but this is the problem I have, the womens divison is not crap as you say it is. It did not die when Trish and Lita left. Mickie, melina, Victoria, and Jillian are more than capable of going on without them. What I disagree with is that you think that the divas that can't wrestle, Maria, Kelly, Candice, Ashley etc Should stay how they are now, as eye candy (thats what you said above) and thats not right. If they stay like that, and don't learn how to wrestle and put on a good show, then whats the piont of having a division and a title. Trish is proof that a diva can come in the business on the bottom and, with hard work, work her way up. And I can see that happening agian with divas like Candice, Torrie, and Maria. Slowly but surely they are getting better. But in the meantime, don't disregard the divas that you have left, Mickie, Jillian, Melina, and Trinity plus Victoria could all be used to carry the division as they all are very talented and can put on great shows. Thats my main beef w/ WWE right now, is that I don't think that they use their talent correctly.

 

[Bernkastel]

I can also agree, to an extent, hatehabsforever, when you say Ashley got a push because she was in playboy. But then again, Torrie was on Playboy twice and so was Candice, and neither of them them got any reconigition or a push. To be honest, I have no idea why Ashley was given the push, but probabaly, to take mickie's place at Mania becaus she was on a leave of absense. I know why Victoria doesn't perform to her full caliber anymore is because an injured knee. I don't know why Mickie took time off, but she picked a horrible time to do it (unless she was injured, she can't help that) because the Mania match was horrible. To be honest, I think wwe knows what their doing with the division, but at times their so reckless, that it just seems like the division is one wrong move from being wiped out completely. And whats really really sad is that, OWV, with half as many women as WWE has twice the raw talent in their roster as WWE.

 

[Bernkastel]

Also, hatehabsforever, has far as heritage goes, I agree, wwe has dug itself a hole with all the plastic drones they hire, then they hire great talent like jillian and trinity and don't even use them. But the heritage is that dispite what you think, mickie, jillian, trinity, shelly, and melina have worked they're butts off trying to get into wwe, and without the use of modeling agencies, or bikini contests. I agree with you, that there is a long line of proud and great athletes in the womens division, but just because those women are gone, doesn't mean that there aren't still women capable of putting on a good match for the fans and without using their "assets". The reason why I suggested that you had no idea what you were talking about earlier was because despite the current condition of the womens divison, you said that the only worthy diva left was Victoria, totally disregarding everything that Jillian, Mickie and Melina worked so hard in their careers to achieve. You must think that their crap because thats the way they're protraited on tv. If the same thing must appliy to the men then Dean Malenko, Dynamite Kid, Jamie Noble, Raven, Shelton Benjamin, and Kane, must all suck because they were all held back in WWE as well. But you and I both know thats not true all of these guys are great performers and athletes. So apply the same thing to the womens division and know, that dispite how bad both you and I think the divison gets, that there is still great talent in the Womens Division, even if some of them are underused and all of them seem to be drowning in a sea of usless bimbos.

 

[Shadowmancer]

Id like to add that there are reports that Ashley actually cried after mania because she knew it was a match. so it shows that she is trying her best to improve, as for the push, I think Christy Hemme and Candice both got pushes it was just that the release of that issue of playboy they were in didn't coincide with Mania.

As to Candice improving, I think it is all to do with confidance in the ring, over the past two years she has been getting more time in the ring in a Wrestling capacity, this would predicate an improvement in the ring.

 

[Bernkastel]

Id like to add that there are reports that Ashley actually cried after mania because she knew it was a match. so it shows that she is trying her best to improve, as for the push, I think Christy Hemme and Candice both got pushes it was just that the release of that issue of playboy they were in didn't coincide with Mania.

As to Candice improving, I think it is all to do with confidance in the ring, over the past two years she has been getting more time in the ring in a Wrestling capacity, this would predicate an improvement in the ring.

I read those reports too, and what am I suppost to feel sorry for her? Everyone in the whole arena knew that it was not going to be a good match, but when it the whole match lasted less than 3 mintues, what are you supposted to think? I know that Ashley tried her best with what she had, but you should have seen this coming after watching her struggle through a match with Jillian. IMO if Ashley wants to improve, then WWE should send her to RAW, that way, like Candice, she can get more in ring time and with divas that can introduce her to a wider varitey of styles. Not that Jillian isn't a great teacher, she is, but Ashley had so many mismatches with Jillian, that Ashley never really improved. Did you see their match right before Mania? Jillian had to practically stand still for Ashley to get the advantage and win, and that was after weeks of practicing with her.

 

[Shadowmancer]

Usually I can't watch Smackdown due to me being at work when its on in New Zealand. As to what you said, no I don't think you should feel sorry for her, it me saying that if she keeps going and get ring time like Candice, even though Candice isn't the best example there. As for something you said earlier Mickie requested time off for moving house according to some report and this was one reason that she wasn't going to be on the card, not because she was moving that weekend but that she took time off to Move house in the build up to WM.

 

[Bernkastel]

Actually yeah I do remember that now. I thought at first she was injured, because I new that the wouldn't put Ashley on the card unless they had to.

The reason why Victoria is so underused is because she is nursing a potenial leg injury. She has needed surgery for years, but decided to go ahead a wrestle anyway, hence the leg brace. because of that, Victoria is not used as much and is not pushed as hard, because if she injures that leg, her career may be over. And its because of things like that, that WWE has to turn to women like Ashley and Candice to wrestle in the main event before they're ready.

 

[The not-so Great Khali]

The reason why Victoria is so underused is because she is nursing a potenial leg injury. She has needed surgery for years, but decided to go ahead a wrestle anyway, hence the leg brace. because of that, Victoria is not used as much and is not pushed as hard, because if she injures that leg, her career may be over. And its because of things like that, that WWE has to turn to women like Ashley and Candice to wrestle in the main event before they're ready.

If this is the real reason why Victoria hasn't held the Women's title since 2004 then why doesn't she just have surgery?

 

[Downward Spiral]

Please, Candice Michelle is as awful in the ring as she ever was and it is evident. Learning a few moves is a completely different thing to actually improving in the ring. She is eye candy the WWE is trying to pass off as a wrestler, and that is further proof that the Women's division is the worst there ever has been. It may look like she's improving or anything like that, but that could be because she started off with zero ability anyway. Women's wrestling is at such a low standard in the WWE that someone with as little ability as Candice could be considered a decent diva wrestler and that's a disgrace. It's painful to watch women like her fumble around in the ring, and it makes me miss the days of Trish/Lita even more. She will never impress me until she does a freaking moonsault off the top turnbuckle, or get the crowd at least half interested in her matches and that doesn't seem likely with any of the women in the WWE right now. Yeah she may be trying to improve, but why bother? She doesn't have talent in the first place and doesn't show signs that she is improving and learning a few new moves doesn't make a good wrestler. Also, learning the moves is a whole lot easier than actually performing them well. God the women's division sucks.

 

[thatdamgood]

I totally agreee Candice is improving and if she is committed to being more then just eye candy she will continue to work hard and will become in time a top contender for the womens championship.However putting her into the main event at backlash however good she is getting is still way way to early for her

 

[Bernkastel]

If this is the real reason why Victoria hasn't held the Women's title since 2004 then why doesn't she just have surgery?

I don't know why Victoria hasn't opted for surgery yet, probably because it will make her weaker than she already is, and at least now, with the brace, she can get a few more years out of that knee before she has to have surgery. I figure she'll probably have the surgery once she retires, or unless something happens before then, but I think both WWE and Victoria are both being careful to make sure that something doesn't happen to her knee.

 

[Bernkastel]

Please, Candice Michelle is as awful in the ring as she ever was and it is evident. Learning a few moves is a completely different thing to actually improving in the ring. She is eye candy the WWE is trying to pass off as a wrestler, and that is further proof that the Women's division is the worst there ever has been. It may look like she's improving or anything like that, but that could be because she started off with zero ability anyway. Women's wrestling is at such a low standard in the WWE that someone with as little ability as Candice could be considered a decent diva wrestler and that's a disgrace. It's painful to watch women like her fumble around in the ring, and it makes me miss the days of Trish/Lita even more. She will never impress me until she does a freaking moonsault off the top turnbuckle, or get the crowd at least half interested in her matches and that doesn't seem likely with any of the women in the WWE right now. Yeah she may be trying to improve, but why bother? She doesn't have talent in the first place and doesn't show signs that she is improving and learning a few new moves doesn't make a good wrestler. Also, learning the moves is a whole lot easier than actually performing them well. God the women's division sucks.

Why Bother? I could say the exact same thing about Trish, who started out no better than Candice. While I agree with the majority of what your saying Spiral, I believe, that if some of these divas, Candice, Maria, and a few others who want to improve, than we should let them try. WWE doesn't need to waste money importing women from Japan and Europe while they have women on the roster willing to step up and work. While it may take a while, and it may be painful to watch right, just give it time, the division will improve. And if it doesn't work, then I say WWE just eradicates the ones who continue to fail and don't put in their fair share of work. Then wwe can start importing new divas, but let these girls have a shot first.

 

[watchingandwaiting]

Downward Spiral, I don't understand why Candice hitting a moonsault would impress you when you make the (imo very valid) point that "learning a few moves is a completely different thing to actually improving in the ring". The way I took your point is that learning things like pacing, selling, etc are more important than being able to hit two or three head scissors and a low drop kick and then call it a match.

I don't watch Heat but I think I remember JR or King mentioning that Candice beat Victoria on the web show. If that was the case, then I think WWE is making the right move. A few people have made the point that improvement will come with experience and I buy into that idea. Moves can be taught and added but they don't mean anything without context.

All that being said, I think that simply dismissing Candice as eye-candy is unfair if the reports of how badly her nose was broken a few months ago was true. The fact that she came back from facial surgery really makes me believe that she is taking her spot in WWE seriously and is tough enough that, given enough time, she could develop into a performer that honors the legacy left by earlier stars like Trish and Lita.

 

[DiceKid]

I still kinda take Candice for a joke though but she was looking pretty good in her match on monday. I really don't have no time for diva's who don't wanna train or wrestle and just shake their ass around the ring and look like ****s. Girls like Mickie, Victoria, Maria, Melina like them or not but they actually wrestle and try to but on good matches. Also some other ones I heard like Jillian and Ariel isn't half bad also but back to the topic, I hope she continues to improve and don't go to being eye candy and continue to work hard but about Ashley crying after her match just about everyone knew the match was gonna suck point blank I think it was kinda fast to give her a big push that soon but she just need's to train more I would have rather like to seen Mickie vs. Melina at WM23 then Ashley. She isn't quite ready to be wrestling for the championship if she can't keep up with the business then maybe it's not the best thing for her but I think it was way too soon to but her in a match like that and even be at WrestleMania. Girls like Kelly Kelly, Layla, Kristal, Torrie in a way and some others my respect is kinda low for them at the moment I take girls like Kelly Kelly for a complete joke although IMO Candice is better then her I don't see Kelly Kelly putting on matches every Tuesday on ECW and trying to improve, no all I see her doing is shaking her ass with two other girls in the ring. I don't think that though Candice is ready to be in like a fued for the championship but if she works hard and continues to train and puts on decent matches then maybe MAYBE one day in the future she can be at that level. Although the match that I would have like to seen at Mania would have been Victoria vs. Mickie vs. Melina but I know Victoria has an injury or something but yeah anyways diva's like Maria, Jillian, kinda Ariel and some others I see them have a future not everyone is gonna be like the best soon as they step in the ring it takes training and you gotta wanna work hard and improve and thats what I like to see so yeah I agree Candice is improving but let's hope she continues to improve and not do it for one week then disappear for three weeks and not wrestle.

 

[sean]

There is no other way to take candice than a joke. She has sold herself purely on looks, and that is the ashley ho way. She may be improving i nthe ring but she is far from up to snuff or adequate as a ladies' wrestler. Victoria jobbing to any of these girls is pathetic and looks so unbelievable. She could easily be champion again, but because of her no nonsense- wrestler before looks philosophy she has been eld back. Because she lacks blonde hair and the whole bimbo thing, she is never going to get what she deserves there. It doesn't matter that she is probably the best or one of the best wrestlers in that division and has been one of the few bright spots holding it toegther since trish & lita departed. It is a good thing they have melina, because there are far too many jokes running around in skimpy clothing and calling themselves divas... That can't even wrestle their way out of a hefty bag.