A real Chair Shot Reality for you

[ScruffDog]

So, Undertaker and HHH were fined for there match at Wrestlmania because they hit each other with chairs. No joke, look what WWE posted on it's corporate website. http://corporate.wwe.com/news/releases_2011.jsp

"Superstars Fined for Chair Shot

Pursuant to WWE's Concussion policy, the stunt of using a folded metal chair shot to the head is prohibited. Triple H and The Undertaker have both been fined for violating this policy at WrestleMania XXVII. WWE penalizes through fine and/or suspension for violation of this policy, which is unchanged and still in effect."

Can you believe this? What the Hell do they expect you to do in a No Holds Bar match? I know the WWE is PG but there's got to be a line somewhere.

 

[Shocky]

Of course I can believe it, and I applaud the WWE for doing this. The world has changed, and guess what, concussions happen after getting hit in the head. Multiple concussions lead to health problems and in some cases, Chris Benoit.

However, I will say that I thought the chairshot was fantastic. Why? Because I haven't seen a chairshot to the head in the WWE in over a year. This is why it's awesome, because we don't see it, when it happens, it's damn more effective. The chair shot lost it's "awesomeness" when Vince Russo booked it into oblivion, likewise with blood. Now when we get the headshot, or blood, people will care because we don't see it at all anymore.

Glad to see the WWE isn't afraid to go after it's main two guys. I liked the chair shot, but it proves that everyone falls under the rules.

 

[@smarkmouth]

No Holds Barred breaks every rule except one; kayfabe.

I'm sure Triple H and Undertaker knew this going in, and I'm sure they weren't concerned about the fine. This was referenced quietly on their corporate site to make their investors happy, and shouldn't get any more attention then that.

 

[Kermit]

Rules are rules. The important thing about maintaining rules is that you have to be consistent with everyone. For Example: I would expect a user who has been on these forums for a couple years to receive the same treatment towards the rules as i do. If we just saw these people going around spamming up the place, then we wouldn't respect the rules very much, would we?

Also, it has nothing to do with "PG." This is to prevent situations like Chris Benoit from happening. You think it is a joke that they are trying to protect their wrestlers in the long run? Corporate has all the right in the world to do this, it prevents new comers from thinking, "hey, they can do that, so i can do that in a match too." If HHH and Undertaker didn't get in trouble for violating the policy, then wrestlers would just go, "they didn't get in trouble!"

I'm not mad at HHH or Undertaker, but i saw this coming when they used the chair like that. It was probably just force of habit. They might of even knew when they did it.

Can you believe this?

Yes, but i can't believe why you would think it's stupid of them doing this.

 

[stasheroo]

No Holds Barred breaks every rule except one; kayfabe.

I'm sure Triple H and Undertaker knew this going in, and I'm sure they weren't concerned about the fine. This was referenced quietly on their corporate site to make their investors happy, and shouldn't get any more attention then that.

Seriously.

Does anyone think that they did this spot with a chairshot on their own?

That nobody in the back knew there was going to be a chairshot to the head involved in the match?

If so, are these the same folks that actually think the Son-in-Law legitimately got fined?

This is more of the company's hypocrisy at work.

They're PG when it suits them and they break their self-implied rule when it suits them at other times.

 

[Nate DaMac]

Oh fuck me. Someone's really complaining because they actually seem to care about safety of their employees? I think it's great that they did this and Taker and Hunter aren't going to get away with something that 2 mid carders wouldn't.

Of course, I'm sure it's just for show and this spot was likely discussed beforehand. Still, I don't think it means anything else. They're acknowledging that something is wrong and at least making it seem that there is no tolerance for it.

Good move.

 

[shattered dreams]

I wonder how much money Austin had to put in the swear jar?

I find it extremely hard to believe that no one knew they were going to do that which makes this whole thing dumb. They are just trying to save face from all that effort they put into proclaiming themselves to be saints for banning chairshots to the head. Turns out they may have been a little more lax on that note than they led us to believe to begin with. This is hardly surprising though because loopholes intermixed in contradiction with pr campaigns is the wellness policy in a nutshell. Regardless, protected head shots are not necessarily as dangerous respective to other not banned moves as most people think anyway.

 

[stasheroo]

Oh fuck me. Someone's really complaining because they actually seem to care about safety of their employees? I think it's great that they did this and Taker and Hunter aren't going to get away with something that 2 mid carders wouldn't.

Of course, I'm sure it's just for show and this spot was likely discussed beforehand. Still, I don't think it means anything else. They're acknowledging that something is wrong and at least making it seem that there is no tolerance for it.

Good move.

Take a look at your own post and see how ridiculous it looks.

They 'care about the safety of their employees'.

And yet 'I'm sure it's just for show and this spot was likely discussed beforehand'.

Contradict much?

If there was 'no tolerance for it', they would never have allowed a spot they knew about beforehand to happen.

They simply changed the rules when it suited them and now they're throwing this BS fine statement out there to feign some fake 'outrage'.

Lots of sheep in this world who'll believe whatever line of bull the shephard's feed them.

 

[MJS]

Yeah I doubt only HHH and Taker knew about this beforehand.HHH now having a senior role in the company and all,I think its obvious that this was decided by a few people backstage,probably Vince included,then as somebody already said,it was posted quietly on the corporate website to satisfy all the appropriate folks there.

As much as I miss chair shots,I think its a decent ruling. I mean we all love the business and respect the work all the guys do,so the last thing we want is them ending up in terrible health later in life and suffering because of such things as chair shot-related neurological issues.

And the VERY LAST thing we want is to ever see anything like what happened with Chris Benoit again.

 

[Nate DaMac]

Take a look at your own post and see how ridiculous it looks.

They 'care about the safety of their employees'.

And yet 'I'm sure it's just for show and this spot was likely discussed beforehand'.

Contradict much?

If there was 'no tolerance for it', they would never have allowed a spot they knew about beforehand to happen.

They simply changed the rules when it suited them and now they're throwing this BS fine statement out there to feign some fake 'outrage'.

Lots of sheep in this world who'll believe whatever line of bull the shephard's feed them.

Lulz. I was actually just stating that the OP's outrage was quite ridiculous. He was upset they got fined, and I was speaking to the ridiculousness of that.

But I do believe there's a chance that it's just a front, I still don't see anything wrong with that. It gives the impression that it won't be tolerated, thus preventing anyone else thinking they could get away with it.

At the same time, until you have proof that it's actually a work and they didn't get fined, quit talking out of your ass. Triple H and Taker have never had a reputation for scripting their matches so there is a chance that the spot was called on the fly. It appears that someone isn't too clear on how matches go. Maybe Vince was legit pissed off about what happened and fined them to make examples out of them. Your thoughts have no more merit than the thoughts of anyone else.

 

[Mr. Artistic guy]

I know the WWE is PG but there's got to be a line somewhere.

If I can just take this quote and.........yep.........just.......there. Done.

"I know wrestling is about trying to make things as real as possible but you have to draw the line somewhere".

Would you rather the people who worked for your entertainment fell to pieces because of it or took one less bump and had another year of life down the road? If your answer is the first option you really need to consider how much you really care you your idols. Don't bay for blood, just be satisfied that you got a match as good as that at all.

 

[Camie]

I complete agree with this. As already mentioned they have sponsors that they need to keep happy and with HHH being high up and having his own office etc he is probably the one that created the fine!

 

[stasheroo]

Yeah I doubt only HHH and Taker knew about this beforehand.HHH now having a senior role in the company and all,I think its obvious that this was decided by a few people backstage,probably Vince included,then as somebody already said,it was posted quietly on the corporate website to satisfy all the appropriate folks there.

As much as I miss chair shots,I think its a decent ruling. I mean we all love the business and respect the work all the guys do,so the last thing we want is them ending up in terrible health later in life and suffering because of such things as chair shot-related neurological issues.

And the VERY LAST thing we want is to ever see anything like what happened with Chris Benoit again.

I agree whole-heartedly with you. I'm glad they've put a concerted effort into reducing chairshots to the head.

I think they definitely have long-lasting and serious effects on the brain and may well have led to the Benoit tragedy. The NFL is finding similar patterns of their own regarding concussions. And chairshots became almost passe' as they occurred all too regularly.

My problem comes with the company's hypocrisy regarding their own policies. They absolutely knew and allowed this to happen. They needed this sort of violence to carry what wouyld have been a disappointing match. How much furniture did they break for that match? Why? Because they needed to. Otherwise, you'd have a match between two guys who couldn't 'go' between the ropes.

Feigning outrage after the fact is insulting.

They're breaking many of their own rules when the need suits them.

That's what I take issue with.

 

[Reddog1146]

Triple H probably noticed that the show was starting badly and thought he would add a chair shot to make the event better. But i can believe that head shots are not allowed because a concussion can lead to a coma and put a superstar out for an indefined amount of time. Even when they wake up they still have to go through physical therapy to get their movement back in working order.

 

[stasheroo]

Lulz. I was actually just stating that the OP's outrage was quite ridiculous. He was upset they got fined, and I was speaking to the ridiculousness of that.

But I do believe there's a chance that it's just a front, I still don't see anything wrong with that. It gives the impression that it won't be tolerated, thus preventing anyone else thinking they could get away with it.

To who, marks like you? The reality of it is that anyone other than the son-in-law wouldn't have gotten away with it. There wouldn't be some fake fine, they would have gotten suspended.

At the same time, until you have proof that it's actually a work and they didn't get fined, quit talking out of your ass. Triple H and Taker have never had a reputation for scripting their matches so there is a chance that the spot was called on the fly. It appears that someone isn't too clear on how matches go. Maybe Vince was legit pissed off about what happened and fined them to make examples out of them. Your thoughts have no more merit than the thoughts of anyone else.

So your claim is that they went into business for themselves out there? Oooh, that's a good one. Now who's 'talking out of their ass'?

Right. You keep going along with whatever nonsense they spoon-feed you. Less stress on your brain that way.

They busted up every piece of furniture they could find to cover for the fact that neither guy could actually wrestle. The chairshot was just another prop used to mask those deficiencies. Great for them that you bought it.

And now they want to put the genie back in the bottle so the sheep like you buy into the feigned 'outrage'. Good thing for them they've got people like you who don't question them.

Makes their lives a whole lot easier I'm sure.

 

[bigbootydaddyV]

banning chair shots has nothing to do with being PG and everything to do with recent studies on the effects of concussions. Doesn't help that the biggest tragedy in wrestling occurred partly because of concussions. I'm willing to bet the chair shot was HHH and Taker's idea to help get the match over as being brutal. In bret hart's book he wrote about how blading was outlawed by wwe during his match with stone cold but the two of them decided to do it and just hid it so well no one knew they bladed. So it more often than not happens that wrestlers will choose to do spots in a match to spice it up w/o letting anyone know. I'm sure these two did just that and either A) believed their status was so high they wouldn't get in any trouble for it or B) didn't care and were willing to accept a punishment to get their match over (how bad would it be anyways for the phenom and the boss's son in law). If anything this makes me question taker and hhh as locker room leaders in THIS instance... they took a real shortcut to help get over their match, what are the young guys supposed to take away from that?

 

[Mindshatter]

It's only one chair shot? One chair shot to the head every year or so will not cause that much damage. You people make it out as if he did it 10-12 times during the match rather than just once. On the subject of the fine, I doubt Taker and HHH care in all honesty. Most likely HHH wrote the article to make everyone happy.

 

[Kingofthedeathmatch]

This isn't about being PG, it's about preserving the health of their superstars as clearly stated in the report. Just because it was a NHB match doesn't mean chair shots to the head are necessary although Undertaker did get his hand up before the chair connected so I do think it was a bit unwarranted in this case.

 

[FightOwensFight]

It's only one chair shot? One chair shot to the head every year or so will not cause that much damage. You people make it out as if he did it 10-12 times during the match rather than just once. On the subject of the fine, I doubt Taker and HHH care in all honesty. Most likely HHH wrote the article to make everyone happy.

Actually, each concussion someone gets is exponentially worse. It isn't something that ever actually "heals". It causes permanent damage that builds up. Think of concussions not as individual incidents, but as one long incident getting progresively worse. Obviously, this assumes a chair shot to the head is causing a concussion (not that much of a stretch).

 

[Big Nick Dudley]

I find it extremely hard to believe that no one knew they were going to do that which makes this whole thing dumb. They are just trying to save face from all that effort they put into proclaiming themselves to be saints for banning chairshots to the head. Turns out they may have been a little more lax on that note than they led us to believe to begin with. This is hardly surprising though because loopholes intermixed in contradiction with pr campaigns is the wellness policy in a nutshell. Regardless, protected head shots are not necessarily as dangerous respective to other not banned moves as most people think anyway.

If any of you were curious, this is SD's way of saying he has no problem with wrestlers smashing each other over the skull with steel chairs, mostly because it's still allowed in TNA. Not because it makes sense, but due to TNA's not giving a shit.

I really don't care about chair shots (to the head). In the late 90's, they were something new, kind of. But, as always, they were booked to death. Too many of them not only hurt wrestlers, but took away the shock value. Fans began to expect chair shots to the skull, and if they didn't get them, they felt ripped off. We were spoiled.

If not smashing someone over the head with a steel chair will lead to less head trauma, meaning a 40 year old wrestler (with the brain of an 80 year old man) doesn't end up murdering his family someday, I have no problem with this rule. Head trauma is a real, and serious issue.

Did the company know, in advance, that Triple H would do this? Who knows. Is the penalty real, or just a PR play? Who knows. Either way, this not being the normal way they go about things is fine with me.

 

[deadelviX]

i highly doubt that they were ACTUALLY fined. i'm sure it was something like:

"hey guys.. we're gonna have to...(ahem)...'fine' you... (cough cough).. for the chair shot"

"hahah.. sure ok boss"

just because you see it on the corporate website doesn't mean it's true. and if it DID have to be a real fine... i'm sure it was just added back to their cut for the match.

don't believe everything you read. the corporate world is full of fine print.

they could've been fined $1000 for the chair shot.. and then given a $1000 bonus for not breaking the lamp in the dressing room!

 

[ScruffDog]

I have a great way for you not to get a concussions, DON"T BECOME A WRESTLER! It's just like all these rules they're adding into football, they are taking the excitement out of the game. When you become a football player, or a Wrestler, or any other physical demanding sport, there is a risk, and you know this going into it. Like the saying goes, "Can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen" you want to be safe, work from home.

Now I do appreciate that there are rules to try and cut down on injuries, and even when your two biggest stars brake a rule you still punish them. I can't knock the WWE for that, they are fair when it comes to rule breaker, like when they let go of Daniel Bryan for choking someone. They followed the rule they had in place and brought him right back when there rule allowed it.

My biggest problem with this, is that why are watering down there product. This is Wrestling, people get hurt. Soon with all the rules they have ,the WWE can drop the "Don't try this at home" because the product will have completely removed all risk.

 

[Army_JB]

They busted up every piece of furniture they could find to cover for the fact that neither guy could actually wrestle. The chairshot was just another prop used to mask those deficiencies. Great for them that you bought it.


First of all, they "busted every piece of furniture" because it was a 'No Holds Barred' Match (since they didn't want to bill it as the same 'Street Fight' from their previous WM encounter).

Second, "neither guy can wrestle" ?!?!?!?!?!?! Are you SERIOUS?!?!?! Maybe i'm just a fan of 'old-school' wrestling...but these guys can TELL A STORY in the ring...(I go back to the initial "Promo", not a word was said, but EVERYONE in the arena, and at home knew EXACTLY what was 'said' by both guys)...in the ring, you could see the "WTF do i have to do to beat this guy" from HHH...to the 'realization' that he couldn't...it could be seen...and felt!

As someone who has studied this business & works mildly on the Indy circuit, i'm appauled at the fact that you 'think' they cant 'wrestle'...Wrestling is not about "Spots" (thats the key moves in a match that happen nearly every time a performer is out there...), but is about telling the story of the match...and furthering the storyline as a whole...

its "Fans" like you that PISS ME OFF, you're so worried about getting your short little adrenaline rush from seeing the *YAWN* 'Five-knuckle Shuffle'...that you miss the fact that as HHH & Taker were 'destroying furniture'...that they were actually building interest & intrigue into the match...nevermind the fact that you can look back into the match & neither guy hit a 'signature' move for about 10 minutes...nevermind the fact that they continued to build each little moment like a house of cards...stacking each moment (not just moves, but 'emotion') on top of each other...from the chair shots, to the Pedigree(s)...and the Last Ride(s), Tombstones, etc...It was a modern day CLASSIC, that both men should be applauded for!! And the fact that they CONTINUED the story POST MATCH was genius...did anyone (including myself) actually think Taker was going to leave on a stretcher?!?!

As far as the Chair shot to the head...do i think it was "known" ahead of time...maybe...but does it really matter? Think about baseball...do pitchers throw at opposing batters heads? is it allowed...but do they get away with it? Did WWE "Corporate" do the right thing & 'fine' HHH/Taker...yes...but as so many people are quick to point out...they change the rules to meet their needs in the moment...at the end of the day, its ENTERTAINMENT... Was the "Shooting Star Press" barred for a while after Brock messed it up against Angle at Mania? Yes...but its a regular move for Bourne now...

Many people may not know this...but Evan had to perform that move REPEATEDLY...at different angles, at different distances...and NOT MISS...BEFORE being allowed to do the move live on tv...to show that he wouldn't injure the other wrestler...

Two 'old-school' performers like HHH/Taker KNOW how to give & take a true 'chair shot' to the head...did they do it safely, looked that way to me...did they deserve to be 'fined' by the letter of the law...yes...

but using the fact that they took the basis of the match (No Holds Barred) and trying to use that against them, saying its a 'cover up' for them not being able to wrestle is RIDICULOUS!

 

[Nate DaMac]

To who, marks like you? The reality of it is that anyone other than the son-in-law wouldn't have gotten away with it. There wouldn't be some fake fine, they would have gotten suspended.



So your claim is that they went into business for themselves out there? Oooh, that's a good one. Now who's 'talking out of their ass'?

Right. You keep going along with whatever nonsense they spoon-feed you. Less stress on your brain that way.

They busted up every piece of furniture they could find to cover for the fact that neither guy could actually wrestle. The chairshot was just another prop used to mask those deficiencies. Great for them that you bought it.

And now they want to put the genie back in the bottle so the sheep like you buy into the feigned 'outrage'. Good thing for them they've got people like you who don't question them.

Makes their lives a whole lot easier I'm sure.

L.O.L. I love it. Whenever someone resorts to calling you a mark or using the phrase sheep you can truly tell you've hit a nerve. You know, we could have had a simple discussion/debate over what is going on here, but you just had to start in with your smarky ass comments like you actually have any more insight into any situation than the rest of us.

Truth is, I've already acknowledged the fact this could all be a front. In fact, I wouldn't be surprised a bit if it is. But for you to act as if it's absolute fact holds no more merit than me saying it could be legitimate. In fact, there is a statement claiming my argument is correct, while you really have nothing but pretentious bullshit to hold up your end. The odds seem to be in my favor.

Who's to say that Triple H didn't think that he could get away with a chair shot to the head without clearing it? There has been evidence to the size of his ego in the past, it isn't a far stretch to suggest not a lot has changed. Maybe Vince finally decided to put his foot down in this instance. How do we know what is actually happening? Surely the image of his company is more important than whether or not Triple H is happy. Hunter is a smart guy, he could probably understand.

All I'm saying is that there are 2 sides to this and several different plausible situations here. For you to state outright that what you're saying is what is really going on is no more absurd than me suggesting that you're full of shit.

 

[Dzone]

It's a good ruling and its also good that both Superstars got fined but anyone want to bet than Vince McMahon was involved in the decision to use it in the match. Because I'm sorry but if 'Taker AND HHH get fined for it and i was a young superstar in the locker, is be like "im never using a chair shot to the head ever again".

i.e. It effectively enforces the ruling, just to make sure it doesnt happen again.