Wrestlemania failed on every level from a fans perspective.

[Sedated]

It would appear that it is your memory that needs checked.

Despite having been WHC, Punk was still largely a niche market before the WWE version of the Summer of Punk that sprouted from the Pipebomb. It was that feud which got him over. And who was his in-ring opponent in that feud and the initial spark/fuel for a significant portion of his diatribe?

Some guy called John Cena.

and? After Cena actually did the job to him, he eventually forced CM Punks heel turn and made him look weak for months. This is probably the best case of Cena putting someone over and in the long run it's still questionable.

The match VS The Rock should have went to CM Punk. I'm not even a punk fan but a properly booked CM Punk who eventually went on to face The Rock at WM and win could have been huge and it would have been OVER. Unlike the disaster we saw where both men were booed.

 

[Sedated]

Generation vs Generation! Legend vs Legend! Two of the best of all time collide! Yet at the end of the night both of them are being booed? In what bizzaro world is that considered over?

Fans don't boo stuff like this when it's good, they eat it up! Just like they have with Austin vs Rock, Hogan vs Rock, Undertaker vs HBK... at the end of it nobody cares about the outcome because the match was great and have respect for both wrestlers...yet with Cena he manages to get one of the greatest of all time jeered...

When people boo this kind of stuff that's not being over, that's people legit not being happy, there's just no excuse for that. The fans keep going "We don't like this" and Vince keeps going "Yes you do, your saying you don't like it proves it!" and the fans keep tuning out and it's like Vince doesn't notice simply because he still hears people going "We don't like this!" so that MUST mean it's super over heel heat...but it's heel heat for a face... but Vince doesn't care because It's over and it's drawing! Except it's not over.. and it's not drawing, people are tuning out, ratings are going down.

In what fucking universe do ratings on a 10 year decline = you're a draw? In what fucking universe does people booing you as a face, chanting boring, and same old shit mean you're over? Oh, that's right, the "WWE UNIVERSE" give me a fucking break.

Yea, post WM crowds are the only time Cena gets this reaction, Cena isn't booed every single week by half the audience. The only difference is this crowd had enough energy to chant more than "Let's go Cena! Cena sucks!"

I think at this point I'll just keep saying this over and over and over and over again until someone will actually address it.

 

[ABMorales787]

Generation vs Generation! Legend vs Legend! Two of the best of all time collide! Yet at the end of the night both of them are being booed? In what bizzaro world is that considered over?

Fans don't boo stuff like this when it's good, they eat it up! Just like they have with Austin vs Rock, Hogan vs Rock, Undertaker vs HBK... at the end of it nobody cares about the outcome because the match was great and have respect for both wrestlers...yet with Cena he manages to get one of the greatest of all time jeered...

When people boo this kind of stuff that's not being over, that's people legit not being happy, there's just no excuse for that. The fans keep going "We don't like this" and Vince keeps going "Yes you do, your saying you don't like it proves it!" and the fans keep tuning out and it's like Vince doesn't notice simply because he still hears people going "We don't like this!" so that MUST mean it's super over heel heat...but it's heel heat for a face... but Vince doesn't care because It's over and it's drawing! Except it's not over.. and it's not drawing, people are tuning out, ratings are going down.

In what fucking universe do ratings on a 10 year decline = you're a draw? In what fucking universe does people booing you as a face, chanting boring, and same old shit mean you're over? Oh, that's right, the "WWE UNIVERSE" give me a fucking break.

Yea, post WM crowds are the only time Cena gets this reaction, Cena isn't booed every single week by half the audience. The only difference is this crowd had enough energy to chant more than "Let's go Cena! Cena sucks!"

I think at this point I'll just keep saying this over and over and over and over again until someone will actually address it.

I see the concept of smarky crowds eludes you.

 

[Sedated]

I see the concept of smarky crowds eludes you.

I see the fact that Cena is booed at every Raw/PPV eludes you.

 

[ABMorales787]

I see the fact that Cena is booed at every Raw/PPV eludes you.

No, I hear it. I also understand that fans do it to have fun. Not because they hate him. Otherwise buyrates would drop as would ratings and overall interest in the product. If people truly hated him, WWE would be in the same spot as 2003-2005. With Triple H hogging it all. People just like to boo the good guy.

 

[Sedated]

No, I hear it. I also understand that fans do it to have fun. Not because they hate him. Otherwise buyrates would drop as would ratings and overall interest in the product. If people truly hated him, WWE would be in the same spot as 2003-2005. With Triple H hogging it all. People just like to boo the good guy.

Ratings and overall interest HAVE dropped. When Evolution was big and HHH was champion for what seemed like an eternity ratings were still in the high 3 - low 4 ballpark. I'm not sure the exact numbers but they were significantly better than they are now and have declined over the course of these 10 years.

 

[PsychoBlack]

Ratings and overall interest HAVE dropped. When Evolution was big and HHH was champion for what seemed like an eternity ratings were still in the high 3 - low 4 ballpark. I'm not sure the exact numbers but they were significantly better than they are now and have declined over the course of these 10 years.

Still averages around a 3 sometimes a 4. Your an idiot

 

[Sedated]

Still averages around a 3 sometimes a 4. Your an idiot

You're*

http://www.genickbruch.com/statistiken/rawratings2003.html

Those ratings are not near what WWE gets now. Keep arguing with facts though.

 

[ABMorales787]

Ratings and overall interest HAVE dropped. When Evolution was big and HHH was champion for what seemed like an eternity ratings were still in the high 3 - low 4 ballpark. I'm not sure the exact numbers but they were significantly better than they are now and have declined over the course of these 10 years.

Hm. Must be why Wrestlemania 28 was the highest grossing event in WWE's history.

 

[Sedated]

Hm. Must be why Wrestlemania 28 was the highest grossing event in WWE's history.

Are you serious? The ratings have gone down over the course of these 10 years - that's a FACT.

So now you want to change the argument to be about one single PPV? Because the overall success of the WWE is determined by a single PPV.

http://www.genickbruch.com/statistiken/rawratings2003.html

 

[PsychoBlack]

Are you serious? The ratings have gone down over the course of these 10 years - that's a FACT.

So now you want to change the argument to be about one single PPV? Because the overall success of the WWE is determined by a single PPV.

http://www.genickbruch.com/statistiken/rawratings2003.html

They still average a 3.0

 

[Sedated]

Here's 2012 ratings

http://www.gerweck.net/tv-ratings/2012-tv-ratings/

 

[Барбоса]

and? After Cena actually did the job to him, he eventually forced CM Punks heel turn and made him look weak for months. This is probably the best case of Cena putting someone over and in the long run it's still questionable.

Cena put over Punk in the biggest way, losing to him twice in a row only for Vince/HHH/Creative to screw up the Summer of Punk. Then basically a full year later, when it has been decided that Rock is getting a title shot at the RR and that after a year of entertaining matches with Ziggler, Jericho and Bryan, CM Punk is over enough to be his opponent, Punk turns heel in order to make that match more appealing but at the same time cutting much of Punk's creative legs out from under him in turning him into a chickenshit champion.

How is any part of that John Cena's fault or are you one of those morons who thinks that Cena is using his political clout to make everyone else look bad?

 

[Sedated]

They still average a 3.0

.....................................................................

 

[Sedated]

Cena put over Punk in the biggest way, losing to him twice in a row only for Vince/HHH/Creative to screw up the Summer of Punk. Then basically a full year later, when it has been decided that Rock is getting a title shot at the RR and that after a year of entertaining matches with Ziggler, Jericho and Bryan, CM Punk is over enough to be his opponent, Punk turns heel in order to make that match more appealing but at the same time cutting much of Punk's creative legs out from under him in turning him into a chickenshit champion.

How is any part of that John Cena's fault or are you one of those morons who thinks that Cena is using his political clout to make everyone else look bad?

You're absolute right, Cena made CM Punk a huge star and consistently helps get new talent over in an effective fashion. He's obviously hugely over as demonstrated by his being booed despite being a face and he's also a mega draw as proven by the decline in ratings.
You happy now? Fuck off with this already, I'm more concerned with the guy who thinks those 2003 ratings come out to a 3.0 average.

 

[CH David]

Is this a "Blame John Cena for the ratings" thread?

 

[Poop Master Flex]

The last person to blame for anything is Cena, I've never seen a top guy try to put as many over as Cena has in WWE, maybe Bret.

WWE needs to capitalize on momentum but they often don't. Once a guy gets over they need to stay over, its almost impossible for someone to regain their momentum after its lost completely. 99/100 if fans go from caring to not caring, they stay not caring for good. MVP for example had tons of momentum, lost it and no matter what WWE did to get it back it didn't happen, once that window of opportunity closes it rarely ever opens again.

 

[Барбоса]

Is this a "Blame John Cena for the ratings" thread?

It went from "Cena is not over" to "Cena never puts anyone over" and now on to "Cena is responsible for poor ratings."

 

[CH David]

It went from "Cena is not over" to "Cena never puts anyone over" and now on to "Cena is responsible for poor ratings."

Fantastic.

All of these are false, but I assume people have already taken care of that.

 

[Sedated]

No, I hear it. I also understand that fans do it to have fun. Not because they hate him. Otherwise buyrates would drop as would ratings and overall interest in the product. If people truly hated him, WWE would be in the same spot as 2003-2005. With Triple H hogging it all. People just like to boo the good guy.

Says ratings would go down, gets shown ratings have gone down and sticks his head in the sand about it. Also tries to pretend that WM buy rates are the only measure of the current state of WWE. Even goes on to compare the current product to an era that WWE was drawing better ratings during, fucking brilliant shit right there bro!

They still average a 3.0

Then we have this gem of a post from some little kid who has zero idea how the fuck averages work.

http://www.gerweck.net/tv-ratings/2003-ratings/ there you go. This one even tells you the average, did that dumb it down for you enough?
Protip: 3.74 IS NOT the same thing as 3.0. It's a pretty big fucking difference actually when it comes to ratings.

The sad part is you people are fucking serious. I'm done with this thread, most of you are just too fucking stupid to even try to have discussion with.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Heh.

 

[CH David]

Well see now you're just trying to hurt feelings. That's not cool.

 

[BaconBits]

I was going to comment, but I'm apparently too stupid. So I'm going to go eat lunch. I'm thinking I want a tasty burger. Suggestions?

 

[PsychoBlack]

Says ratings would go down, gets shown ratings have gone down and sticks his head in the sand about it. Also tries to pretend that WM buy rates are the only measure of the current state of WWE. Even goes on to compare the current product to an era that WWE was drawing better ratings during, fucking brilliant shit right there bro!



Then we have this gem of a post from some little kid who has zero idea how the fuck averages work.

http://www.gerweck.net/tv-ratings/2003-ratings/ there you go. This one even tells you the average, did that dumb it down for you enough?
Protip: 3.74 IS NOT the same thing as 3.0. It's a pretty big fucking difference actually when it comes to ratings.

The sad part is you people are fucking serious. I'm done with this thread, most of you are just too fucking stupid to even try to have discussion with.

I have a 3.2 GPA at a top 20 school while being a walk on for the football team during the first semester. I'm far from a dumb little kid. The whole thing was that the ratings have not dropped that far and the drop is not Cena's fault. He's really the only reason the casual fan tunes in every week. Your an idiot and I challenge you to find someone who brings in more revenue than Cena does.

 

[Slyfox696]

Then we have this gem of a post from some little kid who has zero idea how the fuck averages work.

Okay, this was legitimately funny. Oh, not your insult, but rather the fact you're trying to accuse someone else of not understanding how pro wrestling works.

http://www.gerweck.net/tv-ratings/2003-ratings/ there you go. This one even tells you the average, did that dumb it down for you enough?
Protip: 3.74 IS NOT the same thing as 3.0. It's a pretty big fucking difference actually when it comes to ratings.

That may be, but 2003 is a pretty big fucking difference than 2013. You have to factor in DVR, internet streaming, an exponentially larger cable channel selection, a large increase in NFL popularity, oversaturation of the wrestling market and an economic collapse.

But you knew all of that, right?

The sad part is you people are fucking serious.

No, the sad part is you're one of the very few lucky people to have several knowledgeable wrestling fans coming together to try and educate you on where your argument fails the logic test, and instead of listening to what we have to say, you constantly change your argument in order to continue with your mindless parroting of stupid IWC rhetoric regarding John Cena.

The sad part is there are people who are willing to take time out of their day to educate you, and you're refusing to listen.