What's So Great About CM Punk?

[TWJC: The Beginning]

He's a walking dichotomy. He just blows my mind. It's like, he's a punk, but he's straight edge. He's a face, but he's not in good with the boss. I can't get my mind around it! It's like a Mayan calendar, what's going to happen when the calendar ends!? Did Randy Savage die to save us all?


Punk IS different what with the straight edge punk thing going on. But he's just a mixture of Raven & Austin. That's a good thing, obviously there's a very vocal minority that think he's the second coming of Christ. But compare CM Punk to Steve Austin 2 months after debuting Austin 3:16 and CM Punk is doing amazing. Granted Austin wasn't pushed like Punk was (so early) but even with that taken into account Punk is still growing in popularity and he's doing very well for himself as a draw. He certainly hasn't topped out yet.

I hope that was sarcasm. I'm not saying I don't like Punk's character, I'm saying some people are such marks for him it's ridiculous.

CM Punk is just a contrarian. That's all his character is. Which appeals to contrarians (most of the IWC) and annoys most other people.

 

[RicoLen]

I hope that was sarcasm. I'm not saying I don't like Punk's character, I'm saying some people are such marks for him it's ridiculous.

What do you mean HOPE? Of course it was. My point is that he isn't complex.

BTW if he's inspiring loyalty like that, then you can bet your ass his popularity will only grow as long as he stays true to the image he created. Kinda like Ron Paul.

For the record I DON'T like his character. I just don't dislike it either. He's another John Cena to me. Someone to sit up and watch because he's gonna cause a big stir, but ultimately, he's not my cup of tea. I like the R-Truth's and Miz's that have the lovable heel personalities. Like Bobby Heenan.

CM Punk is just a contrarian. That's all his character is. Which appeals to contrarians (most of the IWC) and annoys most other people.

So was Austin, and many other characters, but that's an oversimplification too. I mean, I'm a pretty black and white guy, hell I'm an objectivist, but CM Punk is more subtle than your average pro-wrestler, in fact he's pretty mellow and relaxed during his promo's up until it's time to throw down. So was Raven at times, and I think that's what's helping him get over, because he comes across as being pragmatic & intelligent rather that some over the top brainless idiot you see most wrestlers depict.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

What do you mean HOPE? Of course it was. My point is that he isn't complex.

BTW if he's inspiring loyalty like that, then you can bet your ass his popularity will only grow as long as he stays true to the image he created. Kinda like Ron Paul.

So was Austin, and many other characters, but that's an oversimplification too. I mean, I'm a pretty black and white guy, hell I'm an objectivist, but CM Punk is more subtle than your average pro-wrestler, in fact he's pretty mellow and relaxed during his promo's up until it's time to throw down. So was Raven at times, and I think that's what's helping him get over, because he comes across as being pragmatic & intelligent rather that some over the top brainless idiot you see most wrestlers depict.

Not really. He's inspiring loyalty like that to people who are contrians like that. Much like Ron Paul (good comparison), there is a small segment of extremely loyal fans, but everyone else thinks he's an annoying idiot. It's not like Ron Paul is going to be the next president, just like Punk isn't going to be the next "top guy". Just because you get a smaller, very defined segment of the audience to really like you doesn't mean it has enough appeal to spread everywhere. Like the example I used with the X division. If 20% of your customers like strawberry ice cream, and the other 80% likes vanilla and chocolate, and you introduce strawberry. Sure you're going to get a those 20% to really love your shit and be loyal and keep coming back, however, it's not going to sell to everyone else. Punk's demographic is small and loyal and that's who he appeals to. It won't grow. Did you notice that he's only getting super loud reactions when there is Cena or HHH to be a catalyst for him? Against anyone else where he has to be the heat getter, it's significantly smaller.

CM Punk is incredibly subtle in the ring. I LOVE that he used the gory special on Mysterio. It's a slap in the face of Mysterio to use a move invented by his dead friend's dead dad. However, Randy Orton is also subtle. The difference is, Orton is subtle in ways that get his character over. CM Punk is subtle in ways that make IWC people shoot their wad. Which is why they overrate Punk and underrate Orton.

 

[RicoLen]

Not really. He's inspiring loyalty like that to people who are contrians like that. Much like Ron Paul (good comparison), there is a small segment of extremely loyal fans, but everyone else thinks he's an annoying idiot. It's not like Ron Paul is going to be the next president, just like Punk isn't going to be the next "top guy".

Heh, you're talking to a fan of Ron Paul, so I'll let the political stuff slide.

Just because you get a smaller, very defined segment of the audience to really like you doesn't mean it has enough appeal to spread everywhere. Like the example I used with the X division. If 20% of your customers like strawberry ice cream, and the other 80% likes vanilla and chocolate, and you introduce strawberry. Sure you're going to get a those 20% to really love your shit and be loyal and keep coming back, however, it's not going to sell to everyone else. Punk's demographic is small and loyal and that's who he appeals to. It won't grow.

Problem is that it's not that well defined among the fans, not yet. They're still sorting things out, and it's going to take another feud before they can tell what they really think of him. That's why he's moved on to this thing with the Kliq. This is an important feud for him, because if he can't grow his fanbase here he's going to fail, but if he can... Who knows where the ceiling is for his fanbase.

Did you notice that he's only getting super loud reactions when there is Cena or HHH to be a catalyst for him? Against anyone else where he has to be the heat getter, it's significantly smaller.

Are you speaking about The Miz? Or the Kliq? Kliq is a dynasty, and arguably bigger than Cena. The Miz is more of a comparable character in terms of where they stand in the WWE's hierarchy. It's not too surprising that was a mixed reaction because they appeal to a similarly sized fanbase.

CM Punk is incredibly subtle in the ring. I LOVE that he used the gory special on Mysterio. It's a slap in the face of Mysterio to use a move invented by his dead friend's dead dad. However, Randy Orton is also subtle. The difference is, Orton is subtle in ways that get his character over. CM Punk is subtle in ways that make IWC people shoot their wad. Which is why they overrate Punk and underrate Orton.

I wasn't talking about in the ring though, I was talking about his promos.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Heh, you're talking to a fan of Ron Paul, so I'll let the political stuff slide.


Problem is that it's not that well defined among the fans, not yet. They're still sorting things out, and it's going to take another feud before they can tell what they really think of him. That's why he's moved on to this thing with the Kliq. This is an important feud for him, because if he can't grow his fanbase here he's going to fail, but if he can... Who knows where the ceiling is for his fanbase.


Are you speaking about The Miz? Or the Kliq? Kliq is a dynasty, and arguably bigger than Cena. The Miz is more of a comparable character in terms of where they stand in the WWE's hierarchy. It's not too surprising that was a mixed reaction because they appeal to a similarly sized fanbase.



I wasn't talking about in the ring though, I was talking about his promos.

The whole "get rid of the federal reserve and have gold back your currency" makes no fucking sense to me. PM me if you want to have a civil, intelligent conversation on economics/politics.

I agree, he's not well defined with the fans. So we'll see, however, him not getting much of a reaction with the Miz and only really getting loud reactions with Cena and HHH is not a good sign.

I was talking about Punk. I totally agree with your assessment that it could have been bad booking with the Miz since they are basically the same guy in terms of their appeal. However, on the live Smackdown Punks revolutionary stuff didn't get over. Which I feel is because he shit on the product. Which is like working for a car dealer and saying "yea I wish we sold better cars, not like that piece of shit you just bought" to a customer.

I know you were talking about his promos. I don't think his promos are that subtle. He doesn't talk loud, doesn't make him subtle. He doesn't even really respond to what the other characters are saying, just kind of says stuff we could read on here.

 

[RicoLen]

I agree, he's not well defined with the fans. So we'll see, however, him not getting much of a reaction with the Miz and only really getting loud reactions with Cena and HHH is not a good sign.

Yeah, we'll see. At the end of the day it's just speculation, and it's fun to talk about but the system as a whole is somewhat more complex than a detailed conversation about marketing strategies. They only give indications, and sometimes you just need to watch and see how things turn out, because they'll surprise you. Apparently they figured this was a low risk venture with tons of upside, and it appears to be paying off, all you can do is wait and see how big it does pay off.

I was talking about Punk. I totally agree with your assessment that it could have been bad booking with the Miz since they are basically the same guy in terms of their appeal. However, on the live Smackdown Punks revolutionary stuff didn't get over. Which I feel is because he shit on the product. Which is like working for a car dealer and saying "yea I wish we sold better cars, not like that piece of shit you just bought" to a customer.

Ah, see I haven't seen that. I don't have SyFy, so I was gonna watch it later today online.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Yeah, we'll see. At the end of the day it's just speculation, and it's fun to talk about but the system as a whole is somewhat more complex than a detailed conversation about marketing strategies. They only give indications, and sometimes you just need to watch and see how things turn out, because they'll surprise you. Apparently they figured this was a low risk venture with tons of upside, and it appears to be paying off, all you can do is wait and see how big it does pay off.



Ah, see I haven't seen that. I don't have SyFy, so I was gonna watch it later today online.

Well, Punk not being over on Smackdown could have been a market thing. He wasn't over in Tulsa, OK on Raw and wasn't over in Witchita, Kansas on Smackdown. However, that kind of indicates even more that he's very over with a segment of the audience and not so over with the majority. Although I really think he should stop with the "make this fun again" thing. People bought the ticket, they think it's fun. You can say "I want to change things around here" all you want, just don't shit on the product because then you shit on the fans, even the ones who are smarky. If they truly hated it, they wouldn't have bought a ticket. You make the audience feel dumb for buying a ticket to see a product you promote only for you to shit on it.

 

[RicoLen]

on the live Smackdown Punks revolutionary stuff didn't get over. Which I feel is because he shit on the product. Which is like working for a car dealer and saying "yea I wish we sold better cars, not like that piece of shit you just bought" to a customer.

Well, you're entitled to your opinion. I disagree.

Well, Punk not being over on Smackdown could have been a market thing. He wasn't over in Tulsa, OK on Raw and wasn't over in Witchita, Kansas on Smackdown. However, that kind of indicates even more that he's very over with a segment of the audience and not so over with the majority. Although I really think he should stop with the "make this fun again" thing. People bought the ticket, they think it's fun. You can say "I want to change things around here" all you want, just don't shit on the product because then you shit on the fans, even the ones who are smarky. If they truly hated it, they wouldn't have bought a ticket. You make the audience feel dumb for buying a ticket to see a product you promote only for you to shit on it.

I liken it more to the effect Austin 3:16 and the Fingerpoke of Doom had. See, there's an initial reaction to an event, and then there's a secondary reaction to an event. There's actually a term for that, but the word evades me atm.

Austin 3:16 was NOT received well by the majority of the fans. I know that contradicts popular belief, but it's true. There WERE some people showing up with Austin 3:16 signs afterwards, but Austin was a mid-card nobody for the majority of 1996 jobbing to guys like Goldust who was being pushed. It wasn't until Bret Hart came back and started talking about Austin that he started getting over, and then came "Pillman's got a gun" and suddenly it was like a fire broke out among Austin fans and everyone started talking about him, and then posthumously Austin 3:16 picked up steam and became this iconic promo.

Likewise, but conversely, the Fingerpoke of Doom was looked at as a great joke, this elaborate fast one the nWo pulled on everyone, and was initially received fairly well live. But within just a short amount of time people were complaining that it left a bad taste in their mouth and as things kept getting worse and worse in WCW, they looked back and realized, this was really one of those defining moments in what went wrong.

My point here is that CM Punk is one of those guys that takes some time to really absorb, and the initial reaction isn't necessarily indicative of what the crowd really will ultimately think.

There IS a problem with this however, and that is Punk is going to have to cut some promos that DO get instantly over sooner or later or the fans will go away. His "Shoot heard round the world" was pretty good, but even that took some time for fans to really absorb. It's almost like he's not only talking over children's heads, but he's also talking over the heads of the older crowd too. I respect that, because he's just proving that the majority of people that watch wrestling aren't very good thinkers, and I like the irony in that, however it's gonna be his undoing if he doesn't figure out how to get the crowd involved and loving him WHILE he's cutting a promo.

Once he does that he's golden, because in the ring, he's amazing already.

 

[Degree In Huganomics]

I can't speak for everyone else, but I was pretty much giving up on wrestling, I only watched RAW once every few weeks because I just couldn't be bothered to find the time to watch it every week. I was lucky enough to catch the RAW with the shoot promo by CM Punk and I have been hooked back in ever since, even staying up to watch the show live now, which is something I never used to do.
I only started reading these forums recently to give myself something to do during quiet times at work, and I don't consider myself to be 'smart' on wrestling or anything, and my mates that also watch even less so, we just love guys that entertain us, and we all love CM Punk. I just think that shows that (despite what I keep reading on here) he can appeal to fans that are not members of the IWC (I actually had to google what that meant).
CM Punk is always entertaining. On the mic, he's funny and interesting and comes across as fearless. In the ring, he can put on great matches, me and all of my mates were blown away by MitB.
So to sum up my ramblings, I think people are really starting to like CM Punk because he's one of the most entertaining guys on the show right now, simple as that.

 

[Dolph Ziggler]

same here john cena killed the wwe for me but cm punk is our savour "and when he saids he wants to make this fun again" he wants to make wwe excititing again john cena never brought excitment to the wwe and twjc your the biggest mark ever and to me what ever you say is total crap! what about canada or london? cena doesn't get over there, you cant just make some shit out and wwe hasn't been fun for years and cm punk is trying to improve it!

CM PUNK IS OUR SAVIOUR!!

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

How is he decent in the ring and on the mic?!?He can speak like a normal person is saying shit to another person. You really are a 10 year old,aren't you?? Punk CAN wrestle better than Cena.

FLAWLESS ARGUMENT!!! Calling the other person a child, then pretty much only using opinion to back up your claim. Good fuckin job.

I'm not even really going to say much else. Only that, if I'm a fan of CM Punk, most of the other CM Punk fans would be pissing me off because of stupid comments like the one above. May as well said "you dumb doo doo head, the Red Ranger is better than the White Ranger" (see what I did there?).

Why do people like to back up their opinions with opinion? I back up my claims with logic and observations based on tangible, objective happenings. What next? Gonna claim your religion is better than another because you feel it in your gut? Gonna tell me to vote for your candidate because "it's the right thing?" What other awful logic are you going to use?


O, one thing I noticed. How come you guys are talking about Cena and putting him down every chance you get? This forum is about CM Punk. When I go to superhero or movie forums I don't say shit like "I'm really looking forward to the Dark Knight Rises....but that fuckin Spider-Man movie". You guys sound like you're basically doing this "Cena sucks" even though no one is chanting "lets go Cena". Funny funny

 

[AngryCenaFan]

Punk didn't politic his way to the top. WWE penalized him before for refusing to wear a suit when he was champion, and Undertaker took the belt off him.

But his point was valid, his character is not one that's going to wear a suit, why would he wear one, and possibly have fans see it? it would expose him as a phony as many in the business are now becoming.

The machine never got behind him til over the last year, even then they never marketed him as a cornerstone of the company, it was always Cena/Orton/Edge/Undertaker/Miz but the retirement of Edge, and scaling down of Undertaker has opened up spots, Punk has grabbed one of them and run with it. I just like Punks in ring work, everything he does has a purpose, my one critique would be dump the GTS it's a mediocre finisher and should not work on bigger wrestlers.

He's an excellent promo guy and is different than the "typical" WWE star there's a reason all the old timers respect him so much

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

cm punk is keeping it real that's why so many people like him! what he is in wwe he is in real life! more then i can say for others! like a certian guy who cant wrestle and rymes with lena

Harley Race, RVD, CM Punk, Samoa Joe, and Ric Flair say he can wrestle, I take their opinion over yours.

Punk isn't real. No more real than Cena. In real life, Cena is a good guy who does everything for the fans and the company. In real life, Punk is kind of like the kids in high school that made fun of the popular kids for liking popular music. The difference is that you relate to one.

Kinda funny that you bash cena in almost every one of your posts, this is a CM Punk thread. I don't bash Spider-Man when I'm posting on a superhero forum about Batman.

 

[Bill.]

Hey guys, I don't mean to insult the original poster one bit with this statement, but there will always be at least one guy that doesn't like what the others do. Personally, I think CM Punk is the best in the business today, & is a future legend, but don't bash on this guy if he doesn't have an opinion like that. I hear a lot of people like Crimson & think he's the future of TNA, but I can't stand him. I don't see "it" in him, but that's just my opinion. And this is his opinion.

 

[OwenHart100%legend]

Well there are a million and one reasons why I like Punk but I suppose bottom line is I find him very entertaining! On the mic he is gold in the ring he is excellent. You(OP) compare him to Orton and Cena well in my opinion, Orton in the ring is great very fluid but I still favor Punk just personal preference I suppose, and on the mic I think Orton is ok but I just cant buy into him as a face and I dont think he seems as comfortable as he does as a heel and I think that comes across on the mic. And compared to Cena, well Im not a Cena fan because I think he is stale however thats not his fault lets be fair because SuperCena = $$$ therefore every night Vince wants him out there giving it the champ is here and Im here for the people and rightly so. Ill also add that I do think he can wrestle and people who claim he cant are talking nonsense, can he wrestle to the standard of Punk? No. I prefer Punk on the mic because I think he is above most right now and possibly one of the best ever but Cena is also skilled in that department but once again just a bit stale for me! However my seven year daughter thinks Cena is the be all and end all and that Punk sucks and who are any of us to question the logic of a seven year old! lol

 

[hollowpoint]

I think my problem with Punk is even though I like his talent, which I already stated, I don't like the fact that he's bashing the WWE like he's got all the answers and the product just completely sucks. It's a slight on not only everyone in the company that helps it run successfully (and yes it IS successful) and a slight on the fans that buy the tickets to fill the arenas and the fans that buy the PPVs at home. I think what kills me is the comparison to SCSA because he was the first anti-establishment. SCSA didn't try to do shoot promos against the company that paid him and he actually embraced the fans and worked for them. Punk seems to be in business for himself. There is something to be said for loyalty.

 

[Sin Jackal]

I like CM Punk because he piques my interest without having to resort to saying the same stuff over and over (not just catch phrases either, just similar lines every time. . .a lot of wrestlers do that, but not Punk). In the ring he's okay. Has some moves other guys don't use, but since he isn't that strong he doesn't do many big grappling moves which are usually the more impressive ones.

CM Punk has managed to seem like he's reacting to everything unscripted, which makes it more enjoyable for me (it's probably the same for people who want to see something other than the typical melodramatic promos). Like tonight after Nash got fired, you could hear him tell Nash "good luck with your future endeavors" as he was leaving the ring. Which is clearly an inside joke for when wrestlers get fired. It was barely picked up by the nearby camera's mic unintentionally.

 

[H33LTurn]

To be honest I feel the exact same way. Theres nothing special about him and I think his "bitching and moaning" has been more about him never being as over as Cena, or Rock, or whoever hes trash talking these days than it is about small guys not making it in the WWE. Hes painting this whole corrupt image of the WWE that simply doesnt exist. I'm not going to say he isnt good, but I'm not about to celebrate someone who made such a fool of himself to get to where he is. He claims that people backstage didnt like him but what do you think guys backstage who worked their way up feel about a guy who got to where he wanted to be in one night what they spent years trying to achieve.

 

[rockyrocky11]

Punk separated himself from the other superstars tonight. Calling himself different because he won't lay down, and he'll keep fighting. That's a lot DIFFERENT than Never Give Up Never Quit John Cena???? I don't get it? He also COMPLAINED about Nash complaining ...he's really separating himself

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

Punk separated himself from the other superstars tonight. Calling himself different because he won't lay down, and he'll keep fighting. That's a lot DIFFERENT than Never Give Up Never Quit John Cena???? I don't get it? He also COMPLAINED about Nash complaining ...he's really separating himself

Like I always say, he's exactly like the fuckin kid with an indy rock shirt on outside the music store bitching about how everyone else follows the stupid mainstream trends when he himself is just following the underground trend and is a hypocrit. Also like those kids, he had to tell everyone "I'm different". If you're so fucking different, you don't have to tell people.

I actually like the character, he's going to be a great heel when we find out it was all a plot to get HHH out of office. He sacrificed the WWE title in the short term to achieve a bigger goal of controlling the WWE.

At least that's the vibe I'm getting. He's nowhere near over enough as a babyface. He only gets cheers from the smarks. If you think any different, you're kidding yourself. The "CM Punk" chants are pretty much all young adults. If he turns full heel where he's whining and complaining, I guarantee he gets more over. Nobody except for his marks (erm...smarks?) care about him as a babyface.

 

[TWJC: The Beginning]

That's funny because Punk was cheered by more than Cena last night

lol was he? It's incredible the lengths people here go. I would post the youtube video comparisons, but I think that's illegal. Cena got more of a pop when he was the only guy left on his team and the crowd was behind him than Punk did all night. Just because Punk gets 20% of the audience to aggressively chant his name, doesn't mean he gets louder cheers. Do you have hearing problems? Or just selective hearing?

 

[Lionshare]

lol was he? It's incredible the lengths people here go. I would post the youtube video comparisons, but I think that's illegal. Cena got more of a pop when he was the only guy left on his team and the crowd was behind him than Punk did all night. Just because Punk gets 20% of the audience to aggressively chant his name, doesn't mean he gets louder cheers. Do you have hearing problems? Or just selective hearing?

Don't forget the cena sucks chants man, Punk doesnt get those, and from here to the future the cheers will get better, plus the match with r-thruth was awesome.

 

[Alittude]

Like I always say, he's exactly like the fuckin kid with an indy rock shirt on outside the music store bitching about how everyone else follows the stupid mainstream trends when he himself is just following the underground trend and is a hypocrit. Also like those kids, he had to tell everyone "I'm different". If you're so fucking different, you don't have to tell people.

I actually like the character, he's going to be a great heel when we find out it was all a plot to get HHH out of office. He sacrificed the WWE title in the short term to achieve a bigger goal of controlling the WWE.

At least that's the vibe I'm getting. He's nowhere near over enough as a babyface. He only gets cheers from the smarks. If you think any different, you're kidding yourself. The "CM Punk" chants are pretty much all young adults. If he turns full heel where he's whining and complaining, I guarantee he gets more over. Nobody except for his marks (erm...smarks?) care about him as a babyface.

You're a ******. You come off with some of the stupidest stuff on here. Saying the Punk chants are all from young adults is so stupid. You can say the same thing about Cena and his chants are all from kids. In the match against R-truth more people got into the match to support Punk including kids and you are really blind and deaf if you couldn't hear that. Why would he turn heel? He's selling merchandise everywhere and is one of the biggest superstars on the show at the moment. Isn't this one of the reasons your against Cena turning heel as it's not financially beneficial. Punk will turn full babyface before he turns full heel and I bet you that. HHH will turn full heel very soon maybe at NOC and Punk will become much more over with the little jimmys and such after that. I still don't get why you go out of your way to put down punk and have to lie try and validate your points.

 

[The Future Rises]

You're a ******.

Alright calm down TWJC isn't a ****** he's a pretty damn good poster though he tends to pick a fight with almost everybody if he disagrees on something.

Saying the Punk chants are all from young adults is so stupid. You can say the same thing about Cena and his chants are all from kids. In the match against R-truth more people got into the match to support Punk including kids and you are really blind and deaf if you couldn't hear that. Why would he turn heel? He's selling merchandise everywhere and is one of the biggest superstars on the show at the moment. Isn't this one of the reasons your against Cena turning heel as it's not financially beneficial. Punk will turn full babyface before he turns full heel and I bet you that. HHH will turn full heel very soon maybe at NOC and Punk will become much more over with the little jimmys and such after that. I still don't get why you go out of your way to put down punk and have to lie try and validate your points.

Ok I have to agree with you on that. Punk has gained a lot of younger fans and still is as he's slowly turning into a full fan favorite. I think HHH is too beloved with the fans and what Punk is doing to him right now doesn't makes him a tweener. If HHH turns heel as expected and everything Punk says turns out to be true then I can guarantee that all the "Little Jimmys" are gonna be on Punk's side on this. He definitely shouldn't turn heel in the near future considering how beloved he got himself with fans of all ages. And one thing I noticed about Punk is the way he's been playing to the crowd by pointing at his fans just like the generic babyface does. I remember seeing a little kid wearing a CM Punk "best in the world" T-Shirt about a month ago I really think Punk is starting to gain a lot of younger fans cause lets face it the kids automatically cheer for the face and boo the heel and Punk is slowly turning into a full babyface it's that simple when you're a "Little Jimmy".

 

[CM_PUNK1995]

What's so good about CM Punk? I could go on for hours telling you but it all comes down to three things:

- He's unique and great in the ring
- Charasmatic on the mic
- And he brings out the best in his opponents such as John Cena (not saying Cena is a bad wrestler)

In the end that's what it all comes down to, that's why he is so GREAT!