[UnOfficial] WWE vs. TNA Thread - New one active

[Kasey]

I know that every aspect of any company will not please every single fan. However, I feel that it's foolish to think that a company can't have solid enough wrestling (to please even smarks like me) AND have storylines and certain segments to please the average fan. Hell, a lot of the old storylines were simple, but nevertheless, they were creative and funny. Every time I see highlights of the "Bedpan McMahon" incident I still laugh my ass off. What irritates me is that creativity is frankly nonexistent with their current product.

ECW had and still has all of the makings to be successful, but even as McMahon stated on "The Rise and Fall of ECW" he felt that the marketing strategy for the company was off. Bull$hit. That company was screwed by TNN and by WWE, which subsequently stole their relationship with the very same network. He keeps trying to remake it as an offshoot of the WWE, which is fine, but doing that and calling it ECW is f**king blasphemy. Instead of treating it like a separate entity it has the same bland flavor of the two bigger shows and it just looks like the same old $hit, but with a lower budget. The "extreme" aspect is nowhere to be found, and numerous things about it reek of sheer stupidity.

Eye candy is cool, and I don't mind a hot valet or manager, but when I have to watch interviews with Maria and then Mickie James stinks up the ring, I can't help but think that the equipped women's division stars of the past like Luna and Madusa are profusely shaking their heads whenever they see the stuff. Long matches can work if they are booked correctly and the order of matches is selected right. Look at WM21. Biggest example. Michaels and Angle stole the show from the two main events and they weren't even wrestling for a damn title. They put on a twenty minute clinic that demonstrates EVERYTHING that's wrong with what WWE does in terms of who's pushed. It's also proof that WWE has the ammunition to turn everything around immediately, but then again, they can't pour piss out of a boot when it comes to execution. Imagine if they sunk as much time and focus into pushing guys like Edge, Orton, Carlito, and Benjamin as they do trying to convince the world that Cena and Batista are actually wreslters (which is the furthest thing from the truth). They did this very stuff in the late '90s. Rock, Austin, Angle, HHH, Michaels, Foley, and Hart were all very qualified workers and when McMahon focused on getting them over business went through the roof. When he forgot that recipe, everything began to unravel.

I take offense to what the "normal" fan likes because the intelligence behind it is nowhere to be seen. It wasn't more than a year or so ago that Cena was being booed out of arenas left and right, and instead of doing the smart thing and putting Angle or Christian or HHH or Michaels or any number of other guys in the title program, they kept ramming Cena down everyone's throat. When Christian upstaged Cena on the mic on Raw, he was promptly removed to Smackdown along with Angle because the fans couldn't stand Cena and the WWE marketing plan failed miserably. Finally, the fanbase just gave up and started liking Cena.

Anything I like? Wrestlers in particular as I can't stand most of the writing of the product on a fundamental level with regards to all of the shows, but there are a ton of the talent that I believe can be used to ignite a rennaissance within the WWE that takes the product to new heights. I just wished they'd encourage a more fast-paced, high impact style like they used to wrestle in the WWE.

The people I'd build a promotion(s) around:


-From RAW
Edge (needs to get back into shape, but rocks the mic and works awesomely)
Orton (minus pissing away his shot w/attitude issues, he's the future)
Carlito (needs to be allowed to let loose more in terms of offense)
Umaga (minus his retarted gimmick)
Nick Dinsmore (definitely minus his gimmick)
Kenny Dykstra (could be used to further a dwindling cruiserweight division)
Lance Cade (minus his retarted gimmick)
Jonny Nitro (future top heel and great seller)
Highlanders (gimmick should be replaced or the comedy aspect dropped)
Shelton Benjamin (should be a main eventer regardless of the mic skills)
Charlie Haas (best suited for tag work, but needs a credible partner or to get over in a stable with someone already established)
Shawn Michaels (can work creatively and sharply when he gives a $hit, but has become a routine man ala Flair most of the time)
Super Crazy (needs to be injected into the Cruiserweight division to give it some legit cred and up the workrate)
HHH (minus the nepotism, he's still one of the top guys, but he needs to focus more on staying loose for wrestling than he does shooting steroids and working out as it hasn't helped his quads much, his character also needs to be placed back in check as DX made him a parody)
Val Venis (Morley has solid ring ability but he was never pushed correctly. He was saddled in nowhere feuds in the midcard and wasn't pressed into anything worthwhile. He's got the tools, but they haven't spent enough effort doing anything more than having him steal Rick Rude's bit)
Victoria - (One of the only credible women in the last five years...a little sloppy sometimes, but with the proper work and some decent opponents she could likely up her game to a respectable level)

-From Smackdown
Chris Benoit (Needs to be main eventing, WMXX was saved by him, HHH, and HBK...anything less is an insult to the business)
Helms (needs a fresh gimmick and to watch his old WCW matches so he can remember how to wrestle in a non-boring fashion and stop dropping the credibility of his belt)
Paul London (ROH, TNA standout that needs to be in the CW division instead of the tag scene...needs to be allowed to perform to the best of his abilities, but that won't happen because it'll show everyone exactly how inept some of the main eventers are)
Bryan Kendrick (Same thing as above...they could start great feuds built on matches alone and could restore the air of competition that used to come hand in hand with the WCW Cruiserweight title)
Finlay (Solid brawler who needs to up the speed of his game and increase the velocity of his motion in the ring...can be a great wrestler when he is made to do so)
Jimmy Wang Yang (Gimmick change instantly, and straight to the CW division)
Booker T (One of my all time WCW faves that has gotten complacent and needs to return to his roots before all hope is lost...his wife needs to be ringside like I need a case of the Clap)
Kennedy (Has the personality and mic work covered, but needs to work on his ring psychology and building a match to a solid climax...this is the only thing stopping him from main eventing convincingly right now)
Misterio (return to the CW division and stop doing the 619 bull$hit...earn his money like he used to when he broke the boundaries of wrestling and floored crowd after crowd with amazing workrate)
Tatanka (needs to get down to about 240 pounds and increase his speed and flexibility...if he wrestled like he did in in first two years in the WWE then he'd still be one of the top guys)
Vito (lose the dress and move him in with Guido and Mamaluke on ECW to reform a new FBI instead of having him flash his junk in his matches)
Regal/taylor (I suppose these guys are okay, even if they've lost a step, but they need credible opponents that can shoot...and they both need to pick up the pace with regards to their matches)
Undertaker (needs to drop the corny-ass Deadman gimmick...this kind of crap is why wrestling will NEVER have respect in the States...he also needs to be put into solid programs with guys who work well with him ala Orton at WM21)
Kane (Needs to drop thirty pounds of fat off his ass and work on his speed, flexibility and mobility, otherwise I wouldn't give him a job in OVW or DSW)

-From ECW
CW Anderson (should be used in a fashion to re-invigorate a new Four Horsemen that Flair would manage)
CM Punk (has loads of tools but he needs to have matches that showcase them instead of ten minute schlockfests where he jobs to Hardcore Holly)
Balls Mahoney (should be put into hardcore matches like the old days and kept away from stupid $hit like "Extreme Strip Poker"...it's a waste of talent)
Jazz - (Needs to be a cornerstone of the Women's division as she can work as good as some of the men)
Hardcore Holly (Needs to remember his pacing and speed from his old days before he began cycling assloads of steroids)
Elijah Burke - (Has the basic tools, but needs to refine his ring psychology and his moveset)
Kevin Thorn - (Worst gimmick ever...decent wrestler, though and his manager has nice boobies)
Lashley - (Needs to shed about twenty pounds of muscle and work on his flexibility instead of trying to be a human tank. If he increased his offense, he has the tools and the speed to be great. Keep him away from microphones, though as he talks like a ten year old.)
Mike Knox - (Solid worker, but needs to be allowed to tell a story in the ring...had a nice match with CM Punk a while back and he could be good if they packaged him right and let him earn his keep in the ring)
Guido (Technical cruiserweight second to none...needs to be part of a tag team w/Vito or Mamaluke or be the FBI's representative in the CW division, regardless of what show the belt is on)
RVD (Needs to take a long look at what he used to perform like and get his act together...he also needs to move with a purpose and be booked in matches against guys with a wrestling vocabulary that can match his...this is where he thrives, and they better hope he doesn't go to TNA because they'll immediately book him against a returning Jerry Lynn)
Shannon Moore (Cruiserweight division or something in a faction as he's never been able to get over by himself)
Stevie Richards (One of the ECW greats who should be allowed to shine like he used to instead of being dogfood for the Raw/Smackdown table scraps)
Tommy Dreamer (Needs to have his original personality and offensive creativity and drop forty pounds of fat in order to move well again)

There is a thousand things I'd do for each show involving roster moves and production/writing/booking overhauls that would restore the intelligence the product had during the Attitude Era, while establishing a new standard for wrestling that would do more than lift WWE out of the funk I think it's in.

 

[Dan1506]

Kasay you focus too much on wrestling, if WWE and TNA and others were JUST about wrestling I would not like to watch them.
I like gimmicks
I like storylines
I like it when once in a while, a dominate force comes in and takes everyone out; I loved it when undertaker appeared at Armageddon 2000.
And most of all I like having a laugh, and that’s what watching TV is all about.

However I agree what WWE are doing now is just plain stupid, and I wish for TNA to get MUCH better, to an extent they beat WCW's record and really make WWE try their best, and the great thing is WE the fans will be the winners.

 

[scream11605]

Hey, Rated R Superstar,please...SHUT THE HELL UP!!! What the hell are you talking about, TNA not having any good stars except for like 3. How about Kurt Angle, Samoa Joe, Chris Sabin, Sonjay Dutt, AJ Styles, Austin Aires. Have you even watched TNA or are you just saying that. Trust me I'm a WWE fan, but you are definitely wrong about TNA not having any good stars except for 3.

 

[BC 21]

This isnt all that far fetched. A lil over dramatic at the moment, but not far fetched.
Some theories as to why:

--Kurt Angle beating Samoa Joe.
Why was this bad? Here's why:
--It basically said the whole TNA roster that had tried for over a year to beat Joe, wasnt good enough to do so, but the guy from WWE on his first try was good enough. This also didn't help Joe.

--Everyone being promised title runs.
--Rhino, Sting, Christian and possibly even Angle (rumored) were all enticed with the promise of title runs. Rhino had the ever lethal 2-day run, which was given to him just to say he was given a run. Sting wins the belt from JJ and loses it on a dq (although he did offer to be pinned). Christian had a successful title run that got killed so they can turn him into a heel and eventually job to Sting.

--Vince Russo
Plain and simple, yes Russo sucks. His story lines are terrible. VKM sucks as well.

--The mishandling of Bobby Roode
The build up for Roode's single's career was great, and then he's jobbing to Eric Young and is stuck in the middle of a E-Young vs Traci Brooks Bikini contest. Way to blow the start of what could of been an awesome heel character.

--Monty Brown
TNA will miss him. Never doing him vs JJ in a real legit feud was a huge mistake.

These are just some idea's along with the cost cutting and complete neglect of Konnan that TNA might lose that bright and shiney luster in 07. Konnan is a well respected member of that locker room. BG James threathens to quit. Once he and Rockabilly get upset watch how they go from the clown princes of TNA to jobing to D-X at survivor Series 07.

There's several things in this that are wrong and will be proven so over the next few monthes. There are things in here I agree with as well.

But TNA neglecting Konnan is completely wrong. Each wrestler is responsible for him/her self. They are independent contractors. They handle their taxes, insurance, etc. on their own. So how is it TNA's fault that Konnan didn't have insurance or enough insurance or enough money. It's not! They didn't have to even step up and offer to loan him the money, but they did.

And as for BG, he's done this before, both with WWE & TNA. It was expected by everyone that he would react this way.

 

[BC 21]

They need to spend a little more time enhancing their own talent instead of living off WWE's..They need to make their own name instead of banking on WWE's

So your telling everyone here that WWE has never signed a talent that made his name in another company?(Tongue planted firmly in cheek). That's just an idiotic statement. Every company throughout wrestling history has signed talent that made their name in another company at some point or another. And guess what? It'll happen again and again and again.

[/QUOTE]TNA hasn't yet adopted that type of Success and after 4 and a half years,and at their current pace of hovering around the 1.0 mark(2.5-3 points behind WWE's average)despite additions of Angle,Sting,and the Angle-Joe feud i'm starting to wonder If they ever will.[/QUOTE]

But they have, to the extent that 2 hours is probably going to happen before this summer. At which time they will be able to push more of the roster. Everyone knows they don't have enough TV time to do pushes like they want or need to. That's why you see the tag matches you see.

And the rooms not being paid are not as big a deal in the locker room that is being made. Of course your going to hear about BG blowing up and wanting to quit. It's part of the train wreck society. We'd rather hear about 1 person being p'd off about something, than 25 people being OK with the same thing.

 

[Austin007]

In my opinion both brands are good i like tna for wrestling and WWE for promos and the occasional good match but im just saying TNA is in a bit trouble finnacilly here i dk but having to pay for my own hotel every week out of my paycheck would really suck.

 

[ErkBono23]

Tna has good stars...wwe has good stars...overall i think Tna would never reach the status that the wwe has..and thats even if they get a 2 hour show..i hope they do get a 2 hour show..i hope they get on primetime..id eve n hope they would go on monday nights against raw...wwe knows they do not have any comeptition right now...iif and when Tna does step up and become a challenge then it will b great because wwe will step up their game and then we would see alot better stuff...right now there is no reason for the wwe to do anything but jus keep goin with what they have..ratings r still fine..tna's arent close..

 

[BC 21]

You all are on here saying they are in financial trouble. But could it be a step back to take several forward. The TNA guys I know don't have an issue with the rooms not being paid for. They said they will share rooms if they have or need to, just like they did on the indy circuit. And as long as the flights are paid for, they are fine with the situation.

 

[BRandonkin]

I refuse to buy that the WWE is in better shape than TNA. Yeah, better shape if you call having a stupid Rosie vs the Donald match, a nightmare PPV that was the ECW one and most of all, their heavy hitter in Triple H is out and will miss Mania. Yeah, they're in great shape. And if they think TNA isn't a threat, why are they taking notice at the fact that at BOTH ppvs for TNA, their buyrates have increased and it's because of Samoa Joe vs Kurt Angle. Why? Because the key words here are wrestling. The WWE has had 3 injuries in the last two months. Candice Michelle, Joey Mercury and now Triple H. And they think that Khali and Umaga is going to be the answer to their prayers. FAT CHANCE!!!

Yeah, but at least the segment was a wrestling match. 2 weeks ago the PWI said that they only had 15 minutes of wrestling on. Russo is making TNA Impact a promotional show for PPV and not letting PPV be the annex of fueds in my opinion. Also WWE has the funds and the ownership to make investment risk and watch and see what gonna happen. TNA doesn't.

For the most part wrestling is wrestling. VKM is on the same level as the Rosie and Donald match. And I do not like either on of them. But in my opinion WWE has better stars and wrestlers to me than TNA. I stated in other post that all storylines are simlar and can be traced back to other storylines. But everyone also knows that TNA is not turning a profit yet, and are still trying to get to that point. I like both of them though and I think the athleticsm is great

 

[daveamania]

Everyone is thinking that TNA is this big time player and that they are loosing money. Yeah, they are loosing money but they are gaining so much more. The money can come back if they play their cards right. Turn on Raw sometime and you can hear TNA chants in the background. TNA is offering something the WWE hasn't in a long time....and that is wrestling, and good entertainment. I rather watch a crappy TNA pay per view than the past five Wrestlemania's anyday.

 

[ErkBono23]

I rather watch a crappy TNA pay per view than the past five Wrestlemania's anyday.[/QUOTE]

that is a pretty bold statement to say...the past 5 wrestlemanias WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY suprass a tna ppv..to make a statment like that is just bull...b logical

 

[Downward Spiral]

Kasey I honestly cannot argue with you. A 14 year old just doesn't know enough about the business to win an argument with you. Your ideas were good and it's great to see someone backing up opinions with ideas, but you can't just say that you think someone should be doing that and another should lose some weight or anything. As fans we do expect full dedication to the business and want our favourites to perform the way we see best, but we do not know their full priorities or work ethic, and whether they actually want to do the things we demand of them, such as losing weight and training hard to get into shape. The ultimate wrestlers will do this, but you can't ask a whole company of wrestlers to change what you've asked them to do. (BTW it was not surprising to not find Batista or Cena in the wrestlers you would build the WWE around.)

You cannot say that a fan is stupid because he likes the things that you despise to see. The reason they started liking Cena was because they were manipulated into doing it by the way they presented Cena, and the people who did turn around are called MARKS. These people believe what they see and have a right to take wrestling in that way. They may think that seeing a thirty minute mat-wrestling clinic is boring and stupid, just the same as you think seeing a 5 minute punch fest that ends with the hero winning is stupid. The one thing I think marks have got over most smarks is that they can sit there and enjoy wrestling for what it is meant to be: ENTERTAINMENT in one form or another to all different types of fans.

Sure, the WWE is a little stale and dry of creativity, but can you blame a company that's been around for the time they have? Just about every storyline in the history of storylines has been used, so it is assured that we will see some O'Donnell's and Trump's on tv. Maybe concentrating more on rivalries inside the ring could help. But they are trying new things, albeit they are ones that haven't worked out.

There Kasey, I don't know how much more I can attempt to combat your posts with. That was pathetic from me again. Looks like you win the argument about me trying to defend the WWE.

 

[Kasey]

McMahon can expect people to do things with regards to their body in order to get a push, so I feel I should expect nothing different. This is why steroid use has been rampant with wrestlers for nearly thirty years. Hell, even on the documentary Beyond the Mat, they told a tryout competitor from APW in California that they'd consider signing him one day if he learned how to build his upper body some more. They liked his timing but felt that for a heavyweight he was too light in the ass. I mean, don't get me wrong, I'm definitely AGAINST steroid use in any form and would rather push a product geared around clean athletes than juicers like Chris Masters and Test. Hell, steroids took two of my all time favorites not only out of the game, but killed one and crippled the other (The Bulldogs). If you can be the guy in charge of an entire wrestling company (McMahon) then you can definitely expect anything you want from the talent, at any time. It wouldn't be hard for them to do a lot of the things that I want. Hell, lesser wrestlers have done some of this stuff. DDP became more flexible with yoga to fight off injury, and Sting dropped over 20 pounds for his comeback match. If these old farts can do it, then so can guys like Kane, who I think could be good if he focused more on wrestling, than he did on lifting heavy weights. Then he wouldn't suffer another bicep tear from lifting every goddamn weight in the gym.

Entertainment is subjective, and committing excuses for mediocrity is something I don't and won't swallow at any given time. It's something I did as a youngster when I was a diehard fan of WCW. I was there from the first episode of Nitro all the way to the very end with McMahon's ugly ass doing a simulcast from Raw. The one thing I kept doing was making excuses and saying that they were going to turn it around. They were making cold crowds with a subpar product (the wrestling began to suck most of the time) and pretty soon the WWF was having the hottest angles in wrestling. I started noticing this as early as 1997...only one year into the NWO. By the time the show ended it was in such a mess that no one would've noticed it went off the air. The same type of mentality is flourishing with the WWE and a lot of the fans. I grew up watching WWF TV and credit that and the NWA with getting me beyond excited about wrestling, but I hold a higher standard for McMahon and the boys because they have EVERY conceivable weapon in their arsenal that no one has been able to compete with since Bischoff in the last decade. Talent, presentation, marketing ability, TV connections. The recipe for repair with the product is taking it back to basics and making the wrestling logical and exciting and letting THAT be what drives the product...not the gimmickry and storylines. As much as the Attitude Era was a birthplace for the modern rendition of wrestling story types, the in-ring product was kick-f**king-ass a majority of the time. I pray that the VKM/TNA chants at the press conferences and at this last Raw is a wakeup for Vince, because he has to understand that their is a grassroots concurrent of American wrestling fans who want nothing more than to see his product become second fiddle again. I don't care if it does, but I just want to see it be good again.

Don't sell yourself short. At 14 you are more level-headed and can discuss better than 90% of the people who frequent this place. Keep your self-respect high. You deserve it.

 

[Kasey]

that is a pretty bold statement to say...the past 5 wrestlemanias WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY suprass a tna ppv..to make a statment like that is just bull...b logical

It's subjective. There were a few solid gems on each of the WM's but the overall consistency is definitely absent from the cards. Match to match, pop for pop, TNA's best efforts beat anything from the WWE since way before it changed the last initial of it's name. The size of the arena doesn't say jack$hit as to the quality of what's going on in the center of it.

 

[Downward Spiral]

I agree that they do have all the essentials needed to take it back to ultimate supremacy again, except one thing: decent competition. Until the majority of fans know what TNA is, they will never consider it a rival company. Only when the crowds die down and the ratings fall wiill McMahon realise he has to go back to the way it was. They can never achieve what the Attitude Era did, because they do not have the calibre of wrestlers they did back then, and neither does TNA. I will admit that you get tired of seeing gimmicks get in the way of a wrestlers ability to perform. An evenly balanced program of entertainment AND wrestling like the attitude era had would be greatly beneficial to the WWE. But the WWE's priorities have changed. They no longer want to show what wrestling is all about. They now want to show off to a different audience that it is not all big dumb beefcakes pretending to hit eachother. They are trying to make it relevant to today's society, and including celebrities to get interest from the public in their show. The old WWE was never like this, but times have changed. It has finally hit me that if they don't do things for the die-hard fans, that they will lose them to rival companies that are ready to step up to the mark and take responsibility in fulfilling the fans with their WRESTLING fix. I don't see Vince doing anything to spite the fans of pure wrestling. He knows how many there are, and as you said, they have the weaponry to kick ass once more, it just isn't being targeted right. Priority now is the mark looking for entertainment in gimmicks etc. A decade ago, they were able to satisfy all types of fans. You could be right that the WWE fans are now just being ignorant of the drop in quality and are just making excuses, but a company this big didn't get to where it is now without knowing how to get there, and I'm sure they know how to get out: it just hasn't hit them yet. Sooner or later they will listen to the chants, and help themselves out, but you have to be patient. Be thankful that you may never see a Rosie vs Trump again.

If McMahon takes full control of the wrestlers and demands things of them, don't you think it's going to make TNA all the more enticing. No one likes being pushed around by the boss, even if it is there job, but Vince needs to sort out who's priorities are this business and nothing else. The steroid factor is very big, and it is bringing the credibility of their wrestlers down. From the truthful allegations that Vince gave his wrestlers steroids, to today when wrestlers are taking steroids bhind his back to achieve full potential, it still is an issue with the WWE. Unless Vince gets serious with them, they will continue being sub-par in the ring and have terrible work ethics which could result in the steroid abuse by some of the wrestlers. Vince would obviously respect any star who gets to the top cleanly, and by devoting their time to the business, and as a result, you see guys like Cena as champion - for his work ethic. The tremendous ethics and skill shown by some of the TNA stars could inspire Vince to be tougher with his wrestlers, and demand that they get into shape. Who knows, maybe TNA could sort out any internal problems the WWE has in regards to their wrestlers.

Thankyou for the compliment. I guess I shouldn't be comparing what I write with a 25 year old genius. BTW, I hope to be a journalist one day - I've always liked writing but never though I was that good at it. If I ever make it to a paper, I will demand that I can start up a wrestling section lol. And sorry it took so long, it wouldn’t reply for some reason.

 

[Downward Spiral]

tna sucks wwe rules

I'd make sure that Kasey doesn't see this as he doesn't take kindly to posters who come in saying stupid shit like that like I did the first time I posted in this thread. Make your opinions smart and your posts smarter. BTW, I agree with that, but express it in a different way.

 

[ExtremeRage81]

TNA ppvs, you feel you got what you paid for and a sense of satisfaction in it. Even the not so great ppvs are worth it more than WWE shows lately. Oh and if the WWE is in such good shape, why is Vince cancelling ALL press conferences from now on? All because he can't stand the TNA and VKM chants. You know what that shows me? Vinny Mac is scared! That dumb bit with Rosie vs Trump, nobody in the media cared about it enough to rip on it. Howard Stern couldn't even make anything funny out of the clips. He couldn't stomach playing the whole thing of them. Also, chants of "We Want Wrestlers" as well as the TNA and VKM chants, not a good sign for the conneticut boys. WWE is the past. TNA is the future. Look at it like this. Christian Cage and Kurt Angle jumped ship. Heyman is gone. Big Show retired. Lita and Trish retired. Stacy left. They produced a PPV for the so-called ECW that was a financial disaster. Wrestlers are unhappy. RVD and Rey are probably next to jump ship. Oh and they have had 3 injuries just in the last month. Candice Michelle, Joey Mercury, Triple H. Now they're having to just throw crap together for mania now that their heavy hitter and the rivalry they were banking on, is out of the picture. They are doomed. This keeps up, WWE will meet the same fate as WCW. It may not be as quick as WCW's downfall, but it'll happen. And the further that WWE sinks into oblivion, the more that TNA rises. And Monty Brown, he's gonna regret leaving to the WWE. If he brushed up on his skills both on the microphone and in the ring, he would have gotten a push. Jeff Hardy I can forgive because his brother is at the WWE. But both the Hardys will regret that one too.

 

[Dj Martyn]

Not sure if monty will regret it...its been noted he is quite commited to his physical training jobs and been in WWE means he doesnt have to spend time improving, his current skills are very much what WWE looks for.

 

[TheCriminal92]

tna/vkm sucks. they are not even cose nor will the ever be as good as the wwe. if dx and vkm ever wrestled i think we all know who would win.(dx would kick ass) all tna is is wwe rejects.

 

[TheCriminal92]

im tired of everyone ripping on the rosie vs. trump match. all they were trying to do was get the wwe attention, who can blame them. and also, you cant honestly sit hear and say that tna doesnt have stupid mathces sometimes, i dont know about you but I dont caare about monster abyss' secret, i just wanna see him wrestle. and eric young is a dumbass who cant wrestle. rhino is a fat bastard. ron "the truth" killings is a wanna be gangsta, PCS is ******ed, i would rather see them wrestle than pla frigin musical chairs. Kurt Angle still is full of himself because he won a gold medall 11 frigin years ago. chriastain cage cant do shit with without tomko. AJ styles is the biggest fruit kake. and LAX need to go back to mexico. nd most of all vkm is hypocrits, they are always doing stupid skits and dx has stopped doing skits anyways, if they had any balls they would go after dx for real, not go to the alamo where obviously shawn michaels will not be, he would be traveling, or go OUTSIDE a raw event.

Overall i would say that the wwe has the upperhand now and will forever, you think tna should atleast have more than 1 show, and if hey are just going to have 1 show it could last more than an hour.



AND IF UR NOT DOWN WITH THAT............SUCK IT!!!!

 

[Troy82690]

Rated R Supertstar316...Learn how to spell STUPID, not stubid. Raw sucks already, they have NO tag team division, they never defend the womens title,And they hardly have IC title matches unless its with Jeff Hardy and Nitro which we ALL have seen 2,9684,04578,00 times before. Smackdown is even startin to get better ratings then RAW and Smackdown sucks the worse !? They dont use there crusiweights good. They could sign big crusiweight names(Juvented, Super Crazy, Psicosis ETC., they already have Rey and Chavo and other good crusiweights.) and really make the crusiweight division a main thing on Smackdown. But like Raw they dont know the meaning to Tag Team wrestling. Who even has the US Heavyweight Title? They suck. John Cena CAN NOT wrestle. Batista cant wrestle worth shit. And ECW? God, they just suck. Bobby Lashley and Test as main-eventers? That basically says it all. Vince dont know what to do with good wrestlers. He needs to stop hiring all these indy guys and stick with what he has. Vince is lettin his head get to big and here soon he is gonna get carried away and TNA is gonna be the #1 company.

 

[Downward Spiral]

Rated R Supertstar316...Learn how to spell STUPID, not stubid. Raw sucks already, they have NO tag team division, they never defend the womens title,And they hardly have IC title matches unless its with Jeff Hardy and Nitro which we ALL have seen 2,9684,04578,00 times before. Smackdown is even startin to get better ratings then RAW and Smackdown sucks the worse !? They dont use there crusiweights good. They could sign big crusiweight names(Juvented, Super Crazy, Psicosis ETC., they already have Rey and Chavo and other good crusiweights.) and really make the crusiweight division a main thing on Smackdown. But like Raw they dont know the meaning to Tag Team wrestling. Who even has the US Heavyweight Title? They suck. John Cena CAN NOT wrestle. Batista cant wrestle worth shit. And ECW? God, they just suck. Bobby Lashley and Test as main-eventers? That basically says it all. Vince dont know what to do with good wrestlers. He needs to stop hiring all these indy guys and stick with what he has. Vince is lettin his head get to big and here soon he is gonna get carried away and TNA is gonna be the #1 company.

How can you say that they have no tag division? If anything, it is stronger than ever before. There are a whole lot of new teams out there, and most of them are on Raw. They have put the Intercontinental title on the line on Raw a lot in the past month. At least the Nitro/Hardy feud is just that: a feud. The downside to Raw going down lately is that SD is going up. I see no problem in that as it creates more competition between the brands. They could hire Psicosis and Juventud, but like they did the first time, their attitude problems would cause trouble again. Tag Team wrestling on SmackDown isn't showcased a lot because the focus is on the main title. They have quality main eventers for the title which probably makes the World Heavyweight Title the premier title in the WWE right now - because of the competition. John Cena is not meant to be a Kurt Angle or a Shawn Michaels. Put it this way, if he can carry a match for 17 minutes against a 350 pound man, don't you think that equates to some sort of wrestling ability, other than just the moves you see? Again, big men are not going to be technical wrestlers because times have changed and the average wrestler is no longer 230 - 240 pounds. With that comes the drop in competition in the Cruiserweight division. Yes ECW does suck, but it is a 1 hour show with no potential. At least it is showcasing the young talent of the WWE, instead of thrusting them into the big leagues of Raw/SmackDown. If it wasn't for that, CM Punk would still be in the indies if TNA weren't smart enough to get him. Bobby Lashley and Test are quite credible wrestlers -terrible on the mic, but they can still wrestle for big men. Tell me, what is a good wrestler today? There are so many different definitions today, but the one I perceive a good wrestler to be, is someone that gets the crowd involved in a match and can draw crowds - no matter his in-ring skills. If he didn't hire indie wrestlers, who else is he going to hire? I suppose you want to see a bunch of old wrestlers duke it out for many months without ever seeing someone fresh and new. If they hire indie guys, it usually means that they are youngsters who have gotten enough training in the small leagues to come up to the main rosters, so that is better than having no one talented coming into the WWE. The WWE is going to remain where it is because of Vince. If it wasn't for Vince - you would NEVER have seen a TNA, and if the WWE becomes second best, TNA has no material to use when in promos. TNA can never become the top company, because there is not enough publicity yet, and like I said before, if TNA can't compete with the WWE, what chance do they have of doing it when the WWE gets back in shape?

 

[Lee]

I'm just annoyed at this whole TNA vs WWE thing because 90% of the TNA wrestlers have wrestled for WWE at some point, and Angle lost a load of respect with me for jumping ship

 

[Kasey]

I agree that they do have all the essentials needed to take it back to ultimate supremacy again, except one thing: decent competition. Until the majority of fans know what TNA is, they will never consider it a rival company. Only when the crowds die down and the ratings fall wiill McMahon realise he has to go back to the way it was.

This is my main problem. He's happy with treading water, and for that he's an idiot. He's had three chances in the last twenty years to take wrestling mainstream and keep it there and he pissed them all away.

They can never achieve what the Attitude Era did, because they do not have the calibre of wrestlers they did back then, and neither does TNA.

On the contrary, the performers of today are just as good if not better. They have a larger indy network and international connections to go through. Hell, WWE has their own farm system...two to be precise. They can do what they want, but that's the problem. What they want is dumb. Their talent roster is big enough to choose from that they have THREE shows for a total of seven hours of programming each week as opposed to the available one or two they had during the first half of the Attitude Era.

I will admit that you get tired of seeing gimmicks get in the way of a wrestlers ability to perform. An evenly balanced program of entertainment AND wrestling like the attitude era had would be greatly beneficial to the WWE. But the WWE's priorities have changed. They no longer want to show what wrestling is all about. They now want to show off to a different audience that it is not all big dumb beefcakes pretending to hit eachother.

Batista, Cena, Kane, Lashley, or Test all fit this mode to a T. This is what they're pushing. I don't mind a big beefcake wrestling if he has the talent...ala Lesnar, but these guys are green to say the least.

They are trying to make it relevant to today's society, and including celebrities to get interest from the public in their show. The old WWE was never like this, but times have changed.

It used to be that when they pleased the target audience, the celebrities would all fall into line. That's what Wrestlemania was about. It should always remain that way.

You could be right that the WWE fans are now just being ignorant of the drop in quality and are just making excuses, but a company this big didn't get to where it is now without knowing how to get there, and I'm sure they know how to get out: it just hasn't hit them yet. Sooner or later they will listen to the chants, and help themselves out, but you have to be patient. Be thankful that you may never see a Rosie vs Trump again.

I do believe I'm very right about this part. I recently flipped in my Royal Rumble 2003 DVD and the WWE Title was a hell of a match between Benoit and Angle. The crowd gave Benoit a standing ovation, even though he lost. It was a twenty-five minute showdown that told a hell of a story and nearly stole the show from the actual Rumble match. It should always be this way. The biggest gun should be on the front line, and these two guys were packing heavy artillery in that match. My pledge to any diehard WWE fan is to revisit some of the older PPVs and matches from years past, and if you tell me you prefer the new product and are fine with it being the way it is, then I'd be amazed. This is the reason I only pay for TNA PPVs these days. It's not that I think TNA is perfect, because it's not. However, I know I'll at LEAST get my money's worth with a TNA PPV because the crowd almost always stays hot and the action fierce throughout.

If McMahon takes full control of the wrestlers and demands things of them, don't you think it's going to make TNA all the more enticing. No one likes being pushed around by the boss, even if it is there job, but Vince needs to sort out who's priorities are this business and nothing else. The steroid factor is very big, and it is bringing the credibility of their wrestlers down. From the truthful allegations that Vince gave his wrestlers steroids, to today when wrestlers are taking steroids bhind his back to achieve full potential, it still is an issue with the WWE. Unless Vince gets serious with them, they will continue being sub-par in the ring and have terrible work ethics which could result in the steroid abuse by some of the wrestlers. Vince would obviously respect any star who gets to the top cleanly, and by devoting their time to the business, and as a result, you see guys like Cena as champion - for his work ethic. The tremendous ethics and skill shown by some of the TNA stars could inspire Vince to be tougher with his wrestlers, and demand that they get into shape. Who knows, maybe TNA could sort out any internal problems the WWE has in regards to their wrestlers.

This is why a lot of wrestlers DO leave, along with being saddled with Eugene-quality gimmicks. Angle being the most recent along with Christian and loads of others over the years. In the WWE, McMahon is god. No ifs ands or buts about it. McMahon doesn't really like anything that he doesn't create and that he doesn't understand how to control with regards to the marketing (RVD, Rhino, CM Punk, ECW) and the crowd response. He only respects money and praise to himself. Loyalty is a non-issue with him, just ask Bret Hart. Even after Bret lost his brother, Vince's tacky ass sent a boquet of flowers to the funeral, but rather than having the tact and decency to sign the card personally, it of course had the WWE logo plastered on it. Even Dave Meltzer has said that anyone who trusts Vince McMahon is a fool. Vince only cracked down on controlled substances in the last year because of Eddie's passing, sadly. He kept the policy lax as he lets juicers work, even if they don't get paid. He only stopped doing what he was doing for a while in the nineties because of the court case (which is one of the prime reasons Warrior and Bulldog were eschewed out of the company in one fell swoop in '92). Looking at the roster as it stands, I can pick out a handful of guys I'd bet money on loading a cycle or two recently. He'll never get truly serious because his meal tickets would dry up. And there is no way that he doesn't know what's going on. He's been an avid bodybuilder since way, way before I was born. Hell, his son-in-law juiced from 1998 on.

 

[Kasey]

im tired of everyone ripping on the rosie vs. trump match. all they were trying to do was get the wwe attention, who can blame them.

There is a difference between being famous and infamous. The Rosie/Trump $hit was definitely not going to get them fame. Instead they were ridiculed by Howard Stern and the vast majority of the wrestling fans on this board (WWE or TNA fan) thought the segment blew goats. Some people don't support crap. That segment falls directly in that category.

and also, you cant honestly sit hear and say that tna doesnt have stupid mathces sometimes, i dont know about you but I dont caare about monster abyss' secret, i just wanna see him wrestle.

Abyss' secret is irrelevant, but at least when it comes time for a PPV, he earns his goddamn money unlike a couple of gold-sporting phonies from up north. If wanna champion bad wrestling with decent writing, that's your prerogative...as stupid as I find it to be. However, I'd rather watch a solid main event w/Abyss busting his ass in the ring...even if the storyline was a tad juvenile.

and eric young is a dumbass who cant wrestle.

Well, actually he can sell fairly well and has pretty crisp offense when he actually sets his mind to it. He's booked in a lousy program that tries to draw in the kind of marks that frequent crap like Raw. Not what I'd have him do, but then again, I don't work for TNA.

rhino is a fat bastard.

This is the dumbest critique I've seen in a while. Yes, he's a hefty guy. So what? He can also wrestle his ass off and put on a hardcore match worthy of it's press at a moment's notice.

ron "the truth" killings is a wanna be gangsta

No, actually he was a real gangsta when growing up. Unlike Cena, who was a well-off kid from Massachusetts who just happened to like rap music and had a $hitty wrestling gimmick built around it. At least Killings can wrestle.

Kurt Angle still is full of himself because he won a gold medall 11 frigin years ago.

When you have done all he has in the business...in spite of piss-poor booking up north, you can have a little leeway with how much confidence you show. He's worth his press and could kick the $hit out of HHH, HBK, Batista, or Cena any day of the week shoot-style, so he has every right to have a top spot in ANY company when he can also entertain as well, if not better than nearly every other main eventer around.

chriastain cage cant do shit with without tomko.

Please explain this further. I'm dying to see where you take this point...if you can even find it.

AJ styles is the biggest fruit kake.

Please explain further. I'm really waiting to see what you have to say about Styles. Regale me with your views on the subject.

and LAX need to go back to mexico.

Why, because they generate massive heat with the audience and their tag reign is one of the best in the last few years...and ten times better than the tag reigns in WWE? Granted, amazing teams like the Highlanders and Cryme Tyme can't wrestle everywhere at once, I think the TNA fans won't shed a tear they don't have to watch another lousy match with either of the WWE "tag team elite."

nd most of all vkm is hypocrits, they are always doing stupid skits and dx has stopped doing skits anyways, if they had any balls they would go after dx for real, not go to the alamo where obviously shawn michaels will not be, he would be traveling, or go OUTSIDE a raw event.

Go to wikipedia and look up the term "work." Next, realize that VKM has legit heat on a trio of ********s who work in the WWE and have hated their guts for a long time...for real. Tell, me, what's so hypocritical about taunting three guys who pretty much helped to bury you?

Overall i would say that the wwe has the upperhand now and will forever, you think tna should atleast have more than 1 show, and if hey are just going to have 1 show it could last more than an hour.
AND IF UR NOT DOWN WITH THAT............SUCK IT!!!!

Please go watch your taped Rosie/Trump showdown and leave the real discussion to those who aren't insane. Oh, and just so you're aware...DX was only cool before the year 2000.