The *Official* John Cena Thread

[juliocamba10]

i know that kids and some others like cena, but well the guy has already head wrestlemania 2 times in a row and is always in the title picture. i never liked him and i dont have any disrespect or respect for him because i dont know him. I dont think he s a good entertainer tho. I think is time for a change and dont force the fans that he s a good wrestler

 

[juliocamba10]

i know that kids and some others like cena, but well the guy has already head wrestlemania 2 times in a row and is always in the title picture. i never liked him and i dont have any disrespect or respect for him because i dont know him. I dont think he s a good entertainer tho. I think is time for a change and dont force the fans that he s a good wrestler

 

[SSJPhenom]

If we are going to be comparing this year so far to other years, then yes, it hasn’t been the best of years for him. I still don’t think it has been horrible though.

I just haven't found him entertaining this year, at all. Honestly, Smackdown has been the better show for the majority of the year. This isn't all Cena's fault, but with him always in the Main Event scene, he deserves a lot of the blame.

Please show me posts of me hating on HBK, HHH, and ‘Taker. Please do so. I actually try to defend them every time I can. I actually like them all. Maybe other people do that, but I don’t recall me hating on them when they do something questionable.

Maybe not you exactly, but a lot of people are very critical of everyone except for John Cena, especially people like Sly.

What does this have to do with me? I can’t force people to enjoy those matches or force them to post a certain way.

I know, I know. But if you are going to criticize on performer for something, you should for everyone.

I don’t think any of those main events were horrible, they weren’t good but they weren’t horrible either.

I find them horrible. I'm sorry and it's not just because it's Cena, they just weren't good at all and in my book, that's horrible. Before anyone tries to say that I am only saying that because it is Cena, 'Taker/Punk at HIAC was horrible too.

Once I stop enjoying the matches Cena has on Raw AND on pay per views, that’s when I’ll realize things aren’t going to change anytime soon.

So you are telling me that you have been enjoying his matches on Raw and at the PPV's. I don't see how, but ok.

They don’t map out the matches move by move, but they tell them what they want to see and what they need to do. Cena just follows his orders. It would be a completely different story if Cena wasn’t good because that means that you cannot blame creative since Cena wouldn’t be able to deliver on what he is asked to do.

He might do what they ask, but you said it yourself. Creative doesn't map out every single move, so Cena and Orton should get the blame for the matches as well.

I wish I could give you an answer; unfortunately I can’t because I don’t know it.

I do know the answer. Either they don't care or they just aren't as good as everyone likes to think they are.

No, we don’t blame him because he is Vince’s son in law. We would blame if he had an input on how the match should go.

A lot of wrestlers have input on how their matches should go. It was reported that Cena was the driving force behind the PG thing. If he can influence that, don't you think that he would be able to influence a match?

Sometimes it’s their fault and sometimes it’s his fault. If he has a bad match when creative gave him great instructions, then it is his fault for not being able to deliver.

My question now is, how do we know any different though? How do we know when creative has given him a gem and he just f'd it up? How do we know when creative as completely clusterfucked him like at SS? We don't know, so the only logical thing to do is hold the performer accountable.

It is fair if some wrestlers have a say on how their matches go and if others don’t have a say.

Again, how do we know who does and who doesn't?

Remember though, some wrestlers can influence his decision. If they are able to influence his decisions enough to change a match to the way they want it to go, then if the match ends up being horrible it would be the wrestlers fault.

I'm sure Cena is one of those that can influence Vince backstage.

It’s possible. You don’t know what he is dealing with or anything about his personal life.

I'm a fan of wrestling. I don't really care too much for his personal life. I want to see a good show. As do the majority of fans. Look, HBK had a messed up back at WM 14 and he still went out a delivered a great performance.

He has had them before and I don’t hold it against him because sometimes it just happens.

I've seen HBK have some bad matches, yes, but they are few and far between.

Oh please, wrestling isn’t going to hell as long as there are younger stars getting pushed.

The future doesn't look bright if we, the fans, can't hold our top stars to high standards.

Like I said, the use of weapons adds to the match but doesn’t always mean it’s going to make the match good or better.

IMO, history has shown that weapons do improve the overall quality of a match.

Because I haven’t really been entertained by most of their previous matches and because I find Orton to be incredibly boring therefore I don’t expect good and intense matches from anyone that has to wrestle Orton.

He had a good and intense program with Undertaker. Orton is definitely capable of putting on some good stuff. Is it Cena's fault that he isn't right now? No, however it is Cena's fault that Cena isn't putting on some good stuff right now. This can be blamed on creative because they are trying to make this outstanding feud with Orton and Cena when they absolutely have no chemistry whatsoever. I hope that this feud does end soon.

That is all........for now!

 

[SSJPhenom]

ST, if you don't mind I'm going to cut in on something of the things that he said...

I'm sure he doesn't mind if I kick you around for a little bit.

I can't remember a time that many have done that. I know I've been critical, but I'm critical of everyone. You know that. I've gone on about 'Taker, HBK, Triple h, hell not to long ago I went off about Cena. Did you miss that? I did.

I can remember plenty of times where people have done that. Check out all of the thread made on 'Taker here recently and check out the Shawn Michaels thread. Please. People shit on them all of the time.

I didn't watch it so I'm not going to comment on how bad. Now I know people have been bashing it, Though if you haven't noticed, as of late people have been extremely critical of 'Taker.

Which makes no sense, because if there is one person in the WWE that has proven without a shadow of a doubt that he is great, his name would be Undertaker and HBK. You don't get to be called a Phenom for nothing.

...... One was overbooked to the max. If you couldn't see that then well I'm sorry. The Breaking point match wasn't horrible, it was decent, not the best, but certainly not the worse. Or as bad as you've been making it out to be. Hell in a Cell didn't watch so can't say.

I know that one was overbooked and I'm sorry, but Breaking Point was a complete joke. Back to the booking, however, we don't see the writers, we see the performers. Like I said to ST, how do we know when it's creative's fault or not?

Agreed.

About time.

Do you? Because no matter how much we try and tell you that with Cena it goes in one ear and out the other.

Yes I do understand that, but again, how do we know when it is creative's fault or not? We have to stick with the performers.

Yeah I didn't think you did. If we used that logic the why can't Chavo pull off a five star segment with Horny? Yes it's up to the talent, I'm the first to admit Cena looks ridiculous at points. But look how he's been booked for the past month. He gets the crapped beat out of him by Jericho and Show, only to get Orton in the Cell? That makes no sense. That isn't him that's creative shitting on everyone, by not coming up with a creative way to get him and Orton in the cell to begin with. I've been highly critical of creative for the better part of this year. It's insane what they've been doing.

Simple, because Chavo or Hornswaggle are not good performers That's why they couldn't pull off a five star match. Come on, even if creative wrote perfectly for them, it wouldn't be anything special. It is a really easy concept to understand.

I agree that creative has been messing up with the story between Orton and Cena, but the matches themselves has to go to creative and the two performers. You can't blame one and not the other.

Their first one was. The reason was they were allowed to have a match. Not some over hyped screwed senseless high school soap opera. That's all that was.

I agree with you here.

How many times have come here and defended his matches against you before SS? All summer. I was telling you how he was having solid matches, while you said they were crap. Only since SummerSlam have I been talking about booking. Really its becoming an issue when I'm getting annoyed with the way Cena comes back sometimes.

You act as though telling me that his matches are solid makes them so. In your opinion they are solid, however, I found them to be a joke. Not all of them, but the majority of them were.

No it isn't. Have you seen booking lately? The only match from HIAC that I saw was DX vs Legacy. That was shit... I mean really let's have one guy get the shit kicked out of him then get locked out of the cage. Mean while let his partner get the you know what kicked out of him to the point he's bearly able to walk. Only be able to help his partner when he comes and gets back in. How the hell does that work? I'm being extremely fair. Booking has been going down hill since Mania. Now it's involving Cena, and yet you're still telling me that it's his fault. That's bullshit!!!

I'm sorry, but DX/Legacy HIAC was solid, especially when compared to the other two of that night. I agree that booking is going down, but again, booking can't be blamed solely for a bad performance. It has to go on the performers as well. So yes, I am still saying that Cena has to accept his part of the blame. He is obsolved because you think he is.

Really? I'm not saying that Cena and Orton have been great or amazing, but I haven't been impressed by any of Legacy DX matches. Well maybe the Breaking Point match, but still. They weren't amazing.... Cena vs Orton hasn't been good because of the booking... Look you have a clusterfuck at summerslam that was pointless. Then you have Cena get the holy hell beat out of him to turn around in three minute beat Orton. How does that make Orton look? Terrible, he just quit to a man he dominated for the majority of the match. (Personally I though they were out of time) HIAC? What's the point of having Cena win the belt and make Orton look weak only for him to come back and go over Cena? WHAT THE HELL ARE THEY DOING? They are making both men look weak... It makes no sense. You can't deny that...

DX/Legacy has been solid and it has done exactly what it set out to do and that was to put Legacy over. Their matches were solid and entertaining and they have been better than all of Cena's main events here recently.

I agree that creative has made this Cena/Orton thing one big clusterfuck.

I do, but I never thought that Orton is that great... I've challenged you to name me a match that he had this year that was good and you still haven't...

I haven't answered you simply because they're haven't been any great Orton matches this year. Now, do we blame Orton or creative for this? If it were Cena you would say creative. They are both to blame for this creative and Orton. Just like creative, Orton, and Cena are to blame for their horrible matches.

That is all........for now!

 

[The Todd]

This argument isn't mine, but a couple of things you have said don't hold up.

I just haven't found him entertaining this year, at all. Honestly, Smackdown has been the better show for the majority of the year. This isn't all Cena's fault, but with him always in the Main Event scene, he deserves a lot of the blame.

Always in the main event scene? Since the draft, he has had an upper mid card feud with Big Show, a mid card feud with The Miz (The Miz! A guy who wouldn't have known a main event if he saw one when he joined Raw) that lasted three ppv's. During this time Orton and HHH were having terrible matches.

I know, I know. But if you are going to criticize on performer for something, you should for everyone.

Yes. But if people are criticising Cena for a limited move set or repetition in his promos/matches (not sure if you fit the bill or not) then the same can be said of HBK, HHH, Orton, 'Taker, CM Punk, Edge and Jericho. So the Cena haters should hate CM Punks two moves of doom, Orton's three moves and seventeen versions of the headlock of doom etc.

So you are telling me that you have been enjoying his matches on Raw and at the PPV's. I don't see how, but ok.

I have found them entertaining as I liked his work with HHH earlier on in the year, I think they work well together, and his stuff with Orton isn't as bad as everyone is making out. His "clusterfuck" of an ending at SummerSam was brilliant for me, see how the crowd were reacting to each and every little thing. They had that place wired.

He had a good and intense program with Undertaker.

Orton is getting praise because one feud he did four years ago was good? Which of his feuds since have been good? He should be getting as much stick as Cena does from you if you don't think he's done anything in four years.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Damn, three on one. Not suprising, but I have enough to go around.

This argument isn't mine, but a couple of things you have said don't hold up.

Feel free to join. It bothers me not.

Always in the main event scene? Since the draft, he has had an upper mid card feud with Big Show, a mid card feud with The Miz (The Miz! A guy who wouldn't have known a main event if he saw one when he joined Raw) that lasted three ppv's. During this time Orton and HHH were having terrible matches.

Ok, so he went a total of what? 3 months not feuding for the title. I'm sorry, how wrong I was. BTW, Miz and Cena had only one PPV match and the rest were on Raw. What are you talking about? Also, his feud with Big Show came after the two of them headlined WM for the title. Yes, his is always in the Main Event scene.

Yes. But if people are criticising Cena for a limited move set or repetition in his promos/matches (not sure if you fit the bill or not) then the same can be said of HBK, HHH, Orton, 'Taker, CM Punk, Edge and Jericho. So the Cena haters should hate CM Punks two moves of doom, Orton's three moves and seventeen versions of the headlock of doom etc.

I will be the first to tell that all wrestlers have their own set of signatures, however, none are as predictable as Cena, but enough about that. I rather enjoy him on the mic, especially when he is serious. I have said that before.

I have found them entertaining as I liked his work with HHH earlier on in the year, I think they work well together, and his stuff with Orton isn't as bad as everyone is making out. His "clusterfuck" of an ending at SummerSam was brilliant for me, see how the crowd were reacting to each and every little thing. They had that place wired.

I understand that you may have liked it, however, I haven't.

Orton is getting praise because one feud he did four years ago was good? Which of his feuds since have been good? He should be getting as much stick as Cena does from you if you don't think he's done anything in four years.

I'm not praising him for that at all. I was just pointing out that he is capable of a lot better. If you want me to gone on about Orton, then create an Orton thread and I will be more than happy to express my views there. Last time I checked, this was called The Official Cena Thread.

That is all........for now!

 

[Paradox]

I'm sure he doesn't mind if I kick you around for a little bit.

You kick me around? That'll be the day....

I can remember plenty of times where people have done that. Check out all of the thread made on 'Taker here recently and check out the Shawn Michaels thread. Please. People shit on them all of the time.

Okay, I will admit that people do shit on them. I haven't been high on 'Taker since he came back, and am not high on him right now. I think it was a complete joke for him to come back and take the title. Also I can see where people are pissed a Michaels. He really hasn't changed anything since he came back in 02.

Which makes no sense, because if there is one person in the WWE that has proven without a shadow of a doubt that he is great, his name would be Undertaker and HBK. You don't get to be called a Phenom for nothing.

That does mean that you take of three months because of injury and come back and take the belt of the hottest heel in the company? Hell No!!! I wasn't happy when Cena did and I'm not happy now. It is a complete joke!

I know that one was overbooked and I'm sorry, but Breaking Point was a complete joke. Back to the booking, however, we don't see the writers, we see the performers. Like I said to ST, how do we know when it's creative's fault or not?

Breaking point was not a complete joke. Come on, it had some great moments you won't deny that. The ending left you wanting more. It was a pissy end to a match I'm not going to deny that. Though isn't it the endings of matches that are booked? That's when I blame creative.

Yes I do understand that, but again, how do we know when it is creative's fault or not? We have to stick with the performers.

Pointed out above.

Simple, because Chavo or Hornswaggle are not good performers That's why they couldn't pull off a five star match. Come on, even if creative wrote perfectly for them, it wouldn't be anything special. It is a really easy concept to understand.

yeah I'm sure!!!

I agree that creative has been messing up with the story between Orton and Cena, but the matches themselves has to go to creative and the two performers. You can't blame one and not the other.

I will agree with you they haven't put on great matches, but I'm not going to place all the blame on Cena... Orton has to be blamed as well, what was the last thing that he's done note worthy?

You act as though telling me that his matches are solid makes them so. In your opinion they are solid, however, I found them to be a joke. Not all of them, but the majority of them were.

I'm sure you did... It's not just I that said they were their are a majority here that think that.

I'm sorry, but DX/Legacy HIAC was solid, especially when compared to the other two of that night. I agree that booking is going down, but again, booking can't be blamed solely for a bad performance. It has to go on the performers as well. So yes, I am still saying that Cena has to accept his part of the blame. He is obsolved because you think he is.

Agreed, then people have a right to bash 'Taker for his match. Yet you were just defending him weren't you? So let 'Taker and Michaels take responsibility and stop defending them.

DX/Legacy has been solid and it has done exactly what it set out to do and that was to put Legacy over. Their matches were solid and entertaining and they have been better than all of Cena's main events here recently.

And Legacy is so over now... No their not....

I agree that creative has made this Cena/Orton thing one big clusterfuck.

Thanks!

I haven't answered you simply because they're haven't been any great Orton matches this year. Now, do we blame Orton or creative for this? If it were Cena you would say creative. They are both to blame for this creative and Orton. Just like creative, Orton, and Cena are to blame for their horrible matches.

I would say you could blame creative. Look how badly he was booked from NWO to the bash. Squash match at mania. Had to win the title in tag match. Only to turn around to lose the title to an injured man. Then he wins it back a week later? That makes sense. After that he wins a couple of match against Trips with the help of legacy. Then you have everything with Cena.... Yeah I can blame creative... Orton was looking strong going into Mania. He had a great chance to be one of the biggest stars the company had seen in a long time. Then creative screwed that. Not that Orton could put on a good match, honestly look at it. I agree with you Cena and Orton have no chemistry together that's why there matches suck. Honestly I wish Cena vs Edge could be going on now instead of this.

That is all........for now!

Thank the Lord!!!!

 

[The Todd]

Ok, so he went a total of what? 3 months not feuding for the title. I'm sorry, how wrong I was.

It's still well away from the title scene for three months, a hell of a long time in wrestling. And anytime way from the main event soon ends the "always in the main event" scene. The challenge is to not be involved with the main event and still be relevant, which Cena did brilliantly, as do people like Jericho, HHH (his DX stuff) and HBK.

BTW, Miz and Cena had only one PPV match and the rest were on Raw. What are you talking about?

It was still a three month long feud. It's not just the PPV that matters, you know.

Also, his feud with Big Show came after the two of them headlined WM for the title.

Oh, so R-Truth and Drew McIntyre main evented Hell in a Cell did they? Along with the triple threat US title match? They were after the title matches after all.

I will be the first to tell that all wrestlers have their own set of signatures, however, none are as predictable as Cena, but enough about that.

HHH is extremely predictable. HBK is also extremely predictable. They rarely get abuse for it, Cena does. I do not care if they are repetitive or not, I enjoyed The Rock's work and his attack was very predictable.

I'm not praising him for that at all. I was just pointing out that he is capable of a lot better. If you want me to gone on about Orton, then create an Orton thread and I will be more than happy to express my views there. Last time I checked, this was called The Official Cena Thread.

You praised Orton first. I'm just making sure you aren't letting Orton off with any blame for not liking their current feud, just because you liked one feud four years ago. If you don't like it, they are both culpable. I, for the record, am very much into this feud and wish it was saved for the long build to 'Mania.

 

[SSJPhenom]

You kick me around? That'll be the day....

That is exactly what is happening, so I guess today is that day.

Okay, I will admit that people do shit on them. I haven't been high on 'Taker since he came back, and am not high on him right now. I think it was a complete joke for him to come back and take the title. Also I can see where people are pissed a Michaels. He really hasn't changed anything since he came back in 02.

I understand all of that. Trust me, I do. But why, when it comes to Cena, does creative get the blame, but for 'Taker and HBK, it's their fault? I'm sure that 'Taker didn't say, "When I come back give me the belt." It was creative that did this because there was no one else to go into the main event scene.

That does mean that you take of three months because of injury and come back and take the belt of the hottest heel in the company? Hell No!!! I wasn't happy when Cena did and I'm not happy now. It is a complete joke!

I agree with you, but to use your logic against you, it's not 'Taker that done this, it was creative.

Breaking point was not a complete joke. Come on, it had some great moments you won't deny that. The ending left you wanting more. It was a pissy end to a match I'm not going to deny that. Though isn't it the endings of matches that are booked? That's when I blame creative.

Breaking Point had great moment but the moments didn't mesh well together. Add a horrible ending to the mix and you get a horrible match. Sure, I will accept that creative can be blamed for endings, such as the clusterfuck ending at Summer Slam, however, what about the rest of the match?

yeah I'm sure!!!

So you're saying that, if given the chance, Chavo and Hornswaggle could put on a 5 star match?

I will agree with you they haven't put on great matches, but I'm not going to place all the blame on Cena... Orton has to be blamed as well, what was the last thing that he's done note worthy?

I'm not saying that Cena should get all of the blame, however, it isn't just on creative either. Orton, Cena, and creative need to accept their part of the blame.

I'm sure you did... It's not just I that said they were their are a majority here that think that.

All of the other people that have said that are also speaking from their opinions. My opinion just differs. Just because you have people agreeing with you also doesn't make it true.

Agreed, then people have a right to bash 'Taker for his match. Yet you were just defending him weren't you? So let 'Taker and Michaels take responsibility and stop defending them.

I wasn't defending 'Taker and HBK. I was just pointing out that if creative can be blamed for Cena then creative can be blamed for 'Taker and HBK as well. However, that's not the case in these here forums.

I agree that 'Taker should accept responsibility for his match at HIAC and trust me, if I say that a 'Taker match was bad, then it had to be horrible. Creative and Punk also had their hand in it.

And Legacy is so over now... No their not....

Well let's see. They main evented Raw last night, one got the win over Orton, and the other is in the main event at the next PPV. Also, they were in the main event at the last PPV. If they're not over, then what do you call it?

Thanks!

You're welcome.

I would say you could blame creative. Look how badly he was booked from NWO to the bash. Squash match at mania. Had to win the title in tag match. Only to turn around to lose the title to an injured man. Then he wins it back a week later? That makes sense. After that he wins a couple of match against Trips with the help of legacy. Then you have everything with Cena.... Yeah I can blame creative... Orton was looking strong going into Mania. He had a great chance to be one of the biggest stars the company had seen in a long time. Then creative screwed that. Not that Orton could put on a good match, honestly look at it. I agree with you Cena and Orton have no chemistry together that's why there matches suck. Honestly I wish Cena vs Edge could be going on now instead of this.

I agree with just about everything that you said here except for Orton can't put on a decent match. We have seen him do so in the past. He can actually put on a decent match, he just hasn't here lately. Same goes for Cena.

Thank the Lord!!!!

F U buddy, F U!

That is all..........for now!

 

[SSJPhenom]

It's still well away from the title scene for three months, a hell of a long time in wrestling. And anytime way from the main event soon ends the "always in the main event" scene. The challenge is to not be involved with the main event and still be relevant, which Cena did brilliantly, as do people like Jericho, HHH (his DX stuff) and HBK.

As I recall, Cena didn't actually feud with Miz for three months. Sure Miz called him out for awhile, but Cena was still feuding with Edge for the title and the Big Show before he actually had his two matches with Miz and if I recall correctly, after Miz's second match with Cena, Miz left Raw for awhile.

Oh, so R-Truth and Drew McIntyre main evented Hell in a Cell did they? Along with the triple threat US title match? They were after the title matches after all.

So you are going to tell me that Cena/Edge/Big Show was not one of the Main Events for WM 25? It doesn't have to go on last to be the main event.

HHH is extremely predictable. HBK is also extremely predictable. They rarely get abuse for it, Cena does. I do not care if they are repetitive or not, I enjoyed The Rock's work and his attack was very predictable.

Of course they are predictable, but not as repetitive as Cena. HBK and HHH do not win their matches the same way every match. Cena does. Get the shit beat out of him. Signatures. Win. That is a Cena win for you right there, everytime.

You praised Orton first. I'm just making sure you aren't letting Orton off with any blame for not liking their current feud, just because you liked one feud four years ago. If you don't like it, they are both culpable. I, for the record, am very much into this feud and wish it was saved for the long build to 'Mania.

I was just trying to point out that Orton was capable of better. Of course I hold Orton and Cena responsible for their horrible matches. They have no chemistry.

I'm glad that you are enjoying this feud, but for me, it sucks!

That is all.......for now!

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

As I recall, Cena didn't actually feud with Miz for three months. Sure Miz called him out for awhile, but Cena was still feuding with Edge for the title and the Big Show before he actually had his two matches with Miz and if I recall correctly, after Miz's second match with Cena, Miz left Raw for awhile.



So you are going to tell me that Cena/Edge/Big Show was not one of the Main Events for WM 25? It doesn't have to go on last to be the main event.



Of course they are predictable, but not as repetitive as Cena. HBK and HHH do not win their matches the same way every match. Cena does. Get the shit beat out of him. Signatures. Win. That is a Cena win for you right there, everytime.



I was just trying to point out that Orton was capable of better. Of course I hold Orton and Cena responsible for their horrible matches. They have no chemistry.

I'm glad that you are enjoying this feud, but for me, it sucks!

That is all.......for now!

Cena doesn't automatically hit the Attitude Adjustment or apply the STF after doing the Five Knuckle Shuffle. HHH never hits the Pedigree after spinebuster and HBK rarely hits Sweet Chin Music after his flying elbow. So there's no basis to criticize Cena on that department without criticizing everybody else.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Damn, four on one. I'm a popular guy.

Cena doesn't automatically hit the Attitude Adjustment or apply the STF after doing the Five Knuckle Shuffle. HHH never hits the Pedigree after spinebuster and HBK rarely hits Sweet Chin Music after his flying elbow. So there's no basis to criticize Cena on that department without criticizing everybody else.

If Cena wins, which is what I pointed out in my arguement that you quoted. If he wins, he does hit his finsher right after his signatures. At least 90% of the time.

At least HHH, 'Taker, HBK, Orton and others still have the element of suprise. You can see Cena's AA coming a mile away, but alas you are right. I don't like how the others have become predictable as well. Sometimes, it is a bit boring to watch any of the ones that I have mentioned.

However, I don't see where you all think 'Taker is so predictable. Usually his Chokeslam and Tombstone come out of no where these days. I will admit, however that his Last Ride is predictable. The only thing predictable about 'Taker his second or so offensive flurry. You know, Snake Eyes, Running Big Boot, Leg Drop. That's about it from 'Taker.

 

[Stickstar 16]

Damn, four on one. I'm a popular guy.



If Cena wins, which is what I pointed out in my arguement that you quoted. If he wins, he does hit his finsher right after his signatures. At least 90% of the time.

If you feel special you can take my little chip in as it being 5 on 1.

Okay, i've watched a lot of Cena matches, and most of the time, when he makes his comeback and gets to the 5 knuckle shuffle, just like most of the top flight superstars, he fails to connect with the AA straigh afterwards, just like shawn hardly ever hits SCM after tuning up the band, but in the end i don't know why i'm typing this as you'll just refute it anyways.

At least HHH, 'Taker, HBK, Orton and others still have the element of suprise. You can see Cena's AA coming a mile away, but alas you are right. I don't like how the others have become predictable as well. Sometimes, it is a bit boring to watch any of the ones that I have mentioned.

Hmm, not really, cause in most matches the Pedigree will be preceeded by the Spinebuster or Facebuster, after the first failed SCM you know that HBK will get beat a bit, then as the opponent leaves an opening he hits it out of nowhere, Same with Orton, or he does that pounding on the ground shit. Cena has turned a crossbody into a AA at least once, and i think i remember him turning a Spear into an STF one time as well with a leg drop toe hold.

However, I don't see where you all think 'Taker is so predictable. Usually his Chokeslam and Tombstone come out of no where these days. I will admit, however that his Last Ride is predictable. The only thing predictable about 'Taker his second or so offensive flurry. You know, Snake Eyes, Running Big Boot, Leg Drop. That's about it from 'Taker.

Okay, i respect Taker for the work he has done but he's just as predictable as them all, and i'm glad that you admit the whole "snake eyes etc" thing is predictable. The chokeslam is not as random as you think, it usually occurs after the oppenent has gotten in a few good shot to taker, then they either go for a top rope move, or off the ropes, run to hit the move and "bang", taker catches them, they eat the chokeslam, aside from the occasions he holds his hand up and waits for them to walk into it, and similar stuff happens with the tombstone, nothing wrong with it, just as there's nothing wrong when Cena does it for his moves.

 

[SSJPhenom]

If you feel special you can take my little chip in as it being 5 on 1.

Oh, I do feel special. I've got enough for you too.

Okay, i've watched a lot of Cena matches, and most of the time, when he makes his comeback and gets to the 5 knuckle shuffle, just like most of the top flight superstars, he fails to connect with the AA straigh afterwards, just like shawn hardly ever hits SCM after tuning up the band, but in the end i don't know why i'm typing this as you'll just refute it anyways.

I know that he rarely hits the AA, when he is in a losing effort. I don't see why you all can't see it. When Cena wins, 90% of the time he hits his finisher right after his signatures and if he doesn't, then he will hit a drop toe hold and put them in the STF.

Hmm, not really, cause in most matches the Pedigree will be preceeded by the Spinebuster or Facebuster, after the first failed SCM you know that HBK will get beat a bit, then as the opponent leaves an opening he hits it out of nowhere, Same with Orton, or he does that pounding on the ground shit. Cena has turned a crossbody into a AA at least once, and i think i remember him turning a Spear into an STF one time as well with a leg drop toe hold.

HHH rarely ever hits the Pedigree after his signatures. It is usually blocked the first time or two and then he will hit it.

I know Cena has turned a crossbody into an AA and a Spear into the STF. Undertaker has turned SCM into a chokeslam and a spear into Hell's Gate. What's your point with this?

Okay, i respect Taker for the work he has done but he's just as predictable as them all, and i'm glad that you admit the whole "snake eyes etc" thing is predictable. The chokeslam is not as random as you think, it usually occurs after the oppenent has gotten in a few good shot to taker, then they either go for a top rope move, or off the ropes, run to hit the move and "bang", taker catches them, they eat the chokeslam, aside from the occasions he holds his hand up and waits for them to walk into it, and similar stuff happens with the tombstone, nothing wrong with it, just as there's nothing wrong when Cena does it for his moves.

The chokeslam as become more random these days. He rarely ever hits it when he has his hand up waiting. He usually hits it out of nowhere like when they are coming off of the top rope or something like that. IDK about you, but I couldn't see the Tombstone coming in his last match with CM Punk or in his match with HBK at WM 25 and I couldn't see that chokeslam coming. The one where he caught Michaels while he was trying to do SCM.

'Taker isn't as predictable as one might think.

That is all.........for now!

 

[Paradox]

That is exactly what is happening, so I guess today is that day.

Since when did you think that you are winning this?

I understand all of that. Trust me, I do. But why, when it comes to Cena, does creative get the blame, but for 'Taker and HBK, it's their fault? I'm sure that 'Taker didn't say, "When I come back give me the belt." It was creative that did this because there was no one else to go into the main event scene.

No, but let's think about this... Using your logic from the past. As soon as 'Taker speaks up back stage, and gets on to Punk. Punk loses the belt... There is something going on....

I agree with you, but to use your logic against you, it's not 'Taker that done this, it was creative.

Fair enough, but that still doesn't mean I have to like it....

Breaking Point had great moment but the moments didn't mesh well together. Add a horrible ending to the mix and you get a horrible match. Sure, I will accept that creative can be blamed for endings, such as the clusterfuck ending at Summer Slam, however, what about the rest of the match?

No, you get a match that didn't flow at all. You want a horrible match, go look at anything Khali does, or chavo or horny... That's horrible. It was a meh match was some decent moments....

So you're saying that, if given the chance, Chavo and Hornswaggle could put on a 5 star match?

Nope, just using your logic against you.

I'm not saying that Cena should get all of the blame, however, it isn't just on creative either. Orton, Cena, and creative need to accept their part of the blame.

So then why the fuck are you running to this thread after each of these matches and screaming at how bad Cena is. I haven't once heard you go off on Orton, or on creative until this point. You've laid all the blame solely on John Cena which you shouldn't have done. It wasn't all his fault like you've been making out to be for the past 2 months.

All of the other people that have said that are also speaking from their opinions. My opinion just differs. Just because you have people agreeing with you also doesn't make it true.

Yeah, I'm not telling you to conform, I'm telling you to get over it. The same way you go and tell people to get over it about HBK and 'Taker.

I wasn't defending 'Taker and HBK. I was just pointing out that if creative can be blamed for Cena then creative can be blamed for 'Taker and HBK as well. However, that's not the case in these here forums.

Actually you did. You told us that because of their time spent in the company that they people shouldn't go after them... Least that was the gist of it. I'll find it.

Which makes no sense, because if there is one person in the WWE that has proven without a shadow of a doubt that he is great, his name would be Undertaker and HBK. You don't get to be called a Phenom for nothing.

There it is. That is right after I told you people were getting critical of 'Taker, and Michaels. You defended them... In the same way that we've been defending Cena. While it wasn't in the same words, it was the same idea. You defend them after people have been overly critical of them. So gotcha there.

I agree that 'Taker should accept responsibility for his match at HIAC and trust me, if I say that a 'Taker match was bad, then it had to be horrible. Creative and Punk also had their hand in it.

Then let him. As soon as I went on to criticize him you went off in an uproar about it. Saying he's the phenom. Doesn't matter you have a bad match you take responsibility for it.

Well let's see. They main evented Raw last night, one got the win over Orton, and the other is in the main event at the next PPV. Also, they were in the main event at the last PPV. If they're not over, then what do you call it?

Wait a second. They were doing that before. All summer if I recall with all of those 6 man tag matches. Though they were getting wins over Batista and Cena... Not Orton, so you have me there. Oh and didn't they Main Event Backlash? Oh yeah that's right!!! DX hasn't done anything special for them. Once they get the belts they'll be legit. Not Orton's lackies.

I agree with just about everything that you said here except for Orton can't put on a decent match. We have seen him do so in the past. He can actually put on a decent match, he just hasn't here lately. Same goes for Cena.

The last time that Orton put on a worth while match was at SS 07. Wait who was that with? OMG Cena. Before that the last thing was Mania 22.... Then 'Taker. He's doing so well.... One good match a year...

F U buddy, F U!

Sorry, I'm not bi....

That is all..........for now!

Good... I look forward to something good. Because the only thing that I have seen is you give me a double standard for Cena. You get on his case, yet turn around and defend guys who do the same thing.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Since when did you think that you are winning this?

Because I'm Undertaker's#1fan and I'm AWESOME!

No, but let's think about this... Using your logic from the past. As soon as 'Taker speaks up back stage, and gets on to Punk. Punk loses the belt... There is something going on....

It is widely speculated that Punk was going to lose the title to 'Taker anyway. So, what's your point?

Fair enough, but that still doesn't mean I have to like it....

No one said that you did.

No, you get a match that didn't flow at all. You want a horrible match, go look at anything Khali does, or chavo or horny... That's horrible. It was a meh match was some decent moments....

Fine. Maybe I went a bit too far calling the match horrible, however, it was a bad match.

Nope, just using your logic against you.

How? You asked me why haven't Chavo and Hornswaggle been putting on 5 star matches and I replied that they, even if given the chance, aren't capable of producing 5 star matches. I didn't revert to saying, "It's creative's fault their matches suck."

It is creative's fault that they are put together, but it isn't all on creative for their horrible matches.

So then why the fuck are you running to this thread after each of these matches and screaming at how bad Cena is. I haven't once heard you go off on Orton, or on creative until this point. You've laid all the blame solely on John Cena which you shouldn't have done. It wasn't all his fault like you've been making out to be for the past 2 months.

I run to this thread and bitch about Cena because this is the Official New Cena Thread. If you want me to bitch about Orton, go create an Orton thread. My gosh people. You all ask the same thing every time. "Why don't you get on them, or them, or them?" It's because them, them, or them don't have a thread for me to bitch about them in. GAH!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah, I'm not telling you to conform, I'm telling you to get over it. The same way you go and tell people to get over it about HBK and 'Taker.

I never tell people to get over it when defending the two best in the business today. I'm always up for an argument in explaining exactly how good the two of them are.

There it is. That is right after I told you people were getting critical of 'Taker, and Michaels. You defended them... In the same way that we've been defending Cena. While it wasn't in the same words, it was the same idea. You defend them after people have been overly critical of them. So gotcha there.

Ok, so maybe I do defend the two of them a little much, but can you blame me? I mean come on, one is my all time favorite wrestler ever and the other is the greatest in ring performer that this business as ever seen. Why wouldn't I defend them?

Can the same things be said about Cena? Is Cena a Phenom? Is Cena the greatest in ring performer ever?

Then let him. As soon as I went on to criticize him you went off in an uproar about it. Saying he's the phenom. Doesn't matter you have a bad match you take responsibility for it.

You just don't get it though do you? I have to go off whenever anyone may speak about 'Taker. I just have too.

What would you do if someone spoke out about The Rock. You don't have to answer that because I have experienced if first hand.

Wait a second. They were doing that before. All summer if I recall with all of those 6 man tag matches. Though they were getting wins over Batista and Cena... Not Orton, so you have me there. Oh and didn't they Main Event Backlash? Oh yeah that's right!!! DX hasn't done anything special for them. Once they get the belts they'll be legit. Not Orton's lackies.

No, they are a lot more recognizable if you ask me. They seem better in the ring and DX was their first feud without Randy Orton being involved. They are more than just Orton's lackeys right now.

The last time that Orton put on a worth while match was at SS 07. Wait who was that with? OMG Cena. Before that the last thing was Mania 22.... Then 'Taker. He's doing so well.... One good match a year...

Yea, you have a point here. However, Orton is capable of better.

Sorry, I'm not bi....

Damn, really? Oh well, I can always wish.

Good... I look forward to something good. Because the only thing that I have seen is you give me a double standard for Cena. You get on his case, yet turn around and defend guys who do the same thing.

Bull shit, I don't give you a double standard. Just because I point it out about Cena and not about other wrestlers, doesn't mean that I am using a double standard, it means that I am talking about Cena and not everyone else.

That is all.........for now!

 

[Paradox]

Because I'm Undertaker's#1fan and I'm AWESOME!

Excuse me!!!! Excuse me!!!! EXCUSE ME!!! That is my line thank you!

It is widely speculated that Punk was going to lose the title to 'Taker anyway. So, what's your point?

Really? No it wasn't. There were a lot of people that were saying the only reason this feud was going on was to get Punk more over. Which I believe both of us were the of that same opinion.

Fine. Maybe I went a bit too far calling the match horrible, however, it was a bad match.

Ok, I can somewhat agree with that. I'll still stick with the fact that these two men don't have any chemistry together.

How? You asked me why haven't Chavo and Hornswaggle been putting on 5 star matches and I replied that they, even if given the chance, aren't capable of producing 5 star matches. I didn't revert to saying, "It's creative's fault their matches suck."

No it's not, but it there fault for thinking that this would be decent... Which it isn't.... You put people together that don't have any business being together then that's what you're going to get.

It is creative's fault that they are put together, but it isn't all on creative for their horrible matches.

You have a midget evolved in a wrestling match... What more can you get?

I run to this thread and bitch about Cena because this is the Official New Cena Thread. If you want me to bitch about Orton, go create an Orton thread. My gosh people. You all ask the same thing every time. "Why don't you get on them, or them, or them?" It's because them, them, or them don't have a thread for me to bitch about them in. GAH!!!!!!!!!!!!

Calm down.... Yes it is, and you have a right to complain if you want. Though don't just come here and destroy Cena. Lay the blame at everyones feet. How many times have I seen you come here after a match that he's involved in and lay it all on him. SummerSlam, Breaking Point, Then again every other ppv. You could make it just as easily as I could. If you were really that mad about, you would make it. Instead, you come here and solely hate on Cena. It's until someone points out that it wasn't just Cena that you admit that.

I never tell people to get over it when defending the two best in the business today. I'm always up for an argument in explaining exactly how good the two of them are.

We know you like to argue. You haven't used those words, but you've implied it.

Ok, so maybe I do defend the two of them a little much, but can you blame me? I mean come on, one is my all time favorite wrestler ever and the other is the greatest in ring performer that this business as ever seen. Why wouldn't I defend them?

No, but I have a right to bash them if I want, the same way you bash Cena. Yet you like to get in a fit about it.

Can the same things be said about Cena? Is Cena a Phenom? Is Cena the greatest in ring performer ever?

In my opinion, Cena is the best performer today... Why because he entertains the masses. If you took a poll today, I promise you that a majority of fans, (non-smarks) would say Cena is extremely entertaining. I find him entertain. Even though the whole Cell thing before the ppv was set up horribly I was entertain when Cena got Orton in the Cell.

You just don't get it though do you? I have to go off whenever anyone may speak about 'Taker. I just have too.

Then allow me to go off when someone attacks Cena.

What would you do if someone spoke out about The Rock. You don't have to answer that because I have experienced if first hand.

First I would laugh at them... The put them in their place. Just as I did with you. Now you know your role!

No, they are a lot more recognizable if you ask me. They seem better in the ring and DX was their first feud without Randy Orton being involved. They are more than just Orton's lackeys right now.

That's an opinion.... They have been in the same place for over 4 months now. That's a fact. This was their first feud without being Orton's lackeys... Which was nice and fresh, but they haven't really gone up or down the ladder.

Yea, you have a point here. However, Orton is capable of better.

I know I have a point... I don't if he is. Why? Because when he has had great memorable matches. He's been carried through them. Look back his matches with Foley? Foley got him over and carried him. Edge? Yep same. 'Taker? No doubt.... Mania 22? Angle and Rey, though more so Angle. (Angle was a beast in that match.) Cena, you can't argue that year reign that Cena had he carried a lot of matches that he was in. Having some great one.

Damn, really? Oh well, I can always wish.

Really, maybe sometime when I'm bored or just am drunk out of my mind! Though you can always dream!

Bull shit, I don't give you a double standard. Just because I point it out about Cena and not about other wrestlers, doesn't mean that I am using a double standard, it means that I am talking about Cena and not everyone else.

No it's not. You talk about how horrible matches with Cena have been over the past couple of months. I defend that... Then turn around and go after some of the joke matches that have been put on by your favorites and I get chewed... That's exactly what a double standard is. It's when you don't use the same standard for everyone.....

That is all.........for now!

Know your role and shut your mouth.

 

[Billie Jean]

I am a huge John Cena fan. This man I think is one of the very few people to come along in the recent years that I consider to have the it factor, in that, he may not be amazing all of the time, but when the hype is on, man, does he deliver. He always gives his all and he shows something that I think is lacking from the WWE locker room out of such and that is...passion. He may not always put on five star matches. But who does? He consistently puts on good matches and I think that is more than acceptable to some of the stuff that we are made to watch. I feel he shows his passion and love for the industry on a daily basis and is a extremely hard worker. He entertains millions and is generally and all round nice guy.

Can the same things be said about Cena? Is Cena a Phenom? Is Cena the greatest in ring performer ever?

No, cena is not a phenom or the greatest in-ring performer ever. But I don't consider Undertaker to be the greatest in-ring performer ever, that honor goes to Shawn Michaels. I don't think it matters through. He is consistent and makes lots of money. Ten years ago it would not matter how good or bad or whatever he was, but now, there is a global recession going on. And if Cena is going to put asses in the seats and put money in their pockets then they are going to make him the face of the company.

It is not just the thing I have mentioned above through, it is everything he does out the ring. He sold over half a million rap albums, had his own show on wwe.com, does stuff for charity. I know a lot of WWE superstars do work for charity and stuff, but man he is a frekin work house. I think he is just both a great ambassador for the WWE and a great role model for kids world wide. When he tore his pec, he still did Tribute to the Troops, he worked hard for a qucik recovery, TWICE. Wrestling is just in his blood. And he will be here to stay for quite a long while yet.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Excuse me!!!! Excuse me!!!! EXCUSE ME!!! That is my line thank you!

My line, your line, do you really care? IT DOESN'T MATTER IF YOU CARE!

Really? No it wasn't. There were a lot of people that were saying the only reason this feud was going on was to get Punk more over. Which I believe both of us were the of that same opinion.

Bullshit. On the main page of this site it was said that it was speculated that 'Taker would win the match. You need to read.

Ok, I can somewhat agree with that. I'll still stick with the fact that these two men don't have any chemistry together.

You're right, they don't have any chemistry. So why does WWE keep giving us clusterfuck matches with the two of them?

Calm down.... Yes it is, and you have a right to complain if you want. Though don't just come here and destroy Cena. Lay the blame at everyones feet. How many times have I seen you come here after a match that he's involved in and lay it all on him. SummerSlam, Breaking Point, Then again every other ppv. You could make it just as easily as I could. If you were really that mad about, you would make it. Instead, you come here and solely hate on Cena. It's until someone points out that it wasn't just Cena that you admit that.

I went into the Randy Orton thread and complained about him. What more do you want. Just like this thread, only the Orton marks turned up and complained about my post. Where are the people that think these guys are getting horrible. I know you're out there.

Also, the only reason that I come here and bash Cena and the reason that I didn't make the Orton thread is because I have a bigger opinion on Cena than I do on Orton. You just don't get it. I want Cena to be good. I want it so bad that it pisses me off that he isn't at the level of great that I was used to seeing as a child. I want my wrestling back and Cena isn't helping matters any.

We know you like to argue. You haven't used those words, but you've implied it.

I've implied nothing. You just think that I have.

No, but I have a right to bash them if I want, the same way you bash Cena. Yet you like to get in a fit about it.

I've told you. I get in a fit about it because they're the two greatest wrestlers wrestling today. One is The Phenom, the cornerstone of the WWE and the other is the greatest in ring performer ever, The Icon.

In my opinion, Cena is the best performer today... Why because he entertains the masses. If you took a poll today, I promise you that a majority of fans, (non-smarks) would say Cena is extremely entertaining. I find him entertain. Even though the whole Cell thing before the ppv was set up horribly I was entertain when Cena got Orton in the Cell.

Well I'm apart of the masses that he doesn't entertain.

Then allow me to go off when someone attacks Cena.

Why though? Is he really worth protecting from the big bad Undertaker's#1fan?

First I would laugh at them... The put them in their place. Just as I did with you. Now you know your role!

Wow, you put me in my place about The Rock huh? I thought that I told you that I only used The Rock to draw you out and it worked. I didn't even believe what I was saying about him.

That's an opinion.... They have been in the same place for over 4 months now. That's a fact. This was their first feud without being Orton's lackeys... Which was nice and fresh, but they haven't really gone up or down the ladder.

I happen to think higher of them as performers than I did before their feud with DX.

Really, maybe sometime when I'm bored or just am drunk out of my mind! Though you can always dream!

Oh come on. Do you really have to be impaired? Think about it! Great rivals turned really, really close.

No it's not. You talk about how horrible matches with Cena have been over the past couple of months. I defend that... Then turn around and go after some of the joke matches that have been put on by your favorites and I get chewed... That's exactly what a double standard is. It's when you don't use the same standard for everyone.....

You say that I use double standards because I come in a CENA thread and just talk about CENA. That doesn't make sense to you? Then I don't know what else to say.

Know your role and shut your mouth.

I know my role, and it's putting you in your place.

That is all...............for now!

 

[SSJPhenom]

Wow, who would have thought that we would come full circle?

Cena's match last night at Bragging Rights was pure gold. I mean, I can't believe that he and Orton have finally had a very good, maybe even great, match. It was outstanding.

It had everything in a match that a fan could ask for. It had drama, it told a story, the psychology was off the charts, it had suspense, and it had great action. It was a great wrestling match. There wasn't 20 to 30 minutes of rest holds like I thought there would be and the only slow part of the match, which was Orton running away from Cena, was explained very well as Orton wasting time off of the clock.

All in all, I was very happy with both Cena and Orton last night and I have a new found respect for John Cena. I still don't like him, but he definitely deserves my respect as a performer. I'm glad that their feud ended on a great match.

 

[Mat FTW]

Ok where 2 start. I hate Cena the character, but i respect the man. He has a great love 4 the game, but superman is getting old. All of the little catch phrases have nothing 2 do wit anything. Also he wins every big match. there is no way he shoulda won at mania or at bragging rights

 

[jackhammer_27]

This is my first thread, so bear with me. I wouldn't call myself a John Cena mark, but he is by no means my least favorite worker. I think he works hard, has great charisma, and is great on the stick. I also think he is somewhat limited by what is expected of him by the company. My question is, what would it take to get more people behind Cena in your opinion? This is assuming we agree that he is a good worker and is capable of putting on a good match when not being held back. I honestly think if he'd just bite the bullet and say "You know what, people don't buy the indestructible Cena stuff, let's just be more real with it in the ring" he'd probably get over more with some older fans. I don't think a heel turn would hurt either. It would just freshen up his character so much. And let's face it, love him or hate him, when he would turn back face(and he eventually would)it would be a huge moment. Thoughts?

 

[Suneeboy]

Let me establish that I think Cena is an excellent worker. His work ethic is what the business needs, and he brings to the table a passion that is unrivaled.

I do not like the Cena character. He has no attitude, and he has no edge. He needs those two things to get more people behind him. He needs to lose the "May the best man win" approach to have more people get behind him.

His promos have no depth to them. They basically sound like sales pitches with corny lines that seem to be written for a crowd to cheer at a specific point...not because they are excited about what he said, but because he pauses on queue and waits, so the crowd instinctively since there is a pause gives a reaction. The pops to the promos aren't that electric because many people don't like his promos...I am one of them. Not because he doesn't deliver well, but the content of the promo is very cookie cutter and lacking any type of attitude.

Cena needs a mean streak, and I mean a vendetta like mean streak. It would be nice if he had an "I'm going to kick your ass you son of a bitch" dimension to his character, yet no matter how much you do to him, no matter how much you hate him or try to end his career, it's always "May the best man win". That my friends is very boring.

 

[jackhammer_27]

Let me establish that I think Cena is an excellent worker. His work ethic is what the business needs, and he brings to the table a passion that is unrivaled.

I do not like the Cena character. He has no attitude, and he has no edge. He needs those two things to get more people behind him. He needs to lose the "May the best man win" approach to have more people get behind him.

His promos have no depth to them. They basically sound like sales pitches with corny lines that seem to be written for a crowd to cheer at a specific point...not because they are excited about what he said, but because he pauses on queue and waits, so the crowd instinctively since there is a pause gives a reaction. The pops to the promos aren't that electric because many people don't like his promos...I am one of them. Not because he doesn't deliver well, but the content of the promo is very cookie cutter and lacking any type of attitude.

Cena needs a mean streak, and I mean a vendetta like mean streak. It would be nice if he had an "I'm going to kick your ass you son of a bitch" dimension to his character, yet no matter how much you do to him, no matter how much you hate him or try to end his career, it's always "May the best man win". That my friends is very boring.

I kinda agree and disagree. I think to say he has no attitude or edge is a bit of a stretch. Just think back to his promos of about a year and a half or so when he feuded with Edge. Or better yet, before the PG era. I don't hate the PG era so much but it does limit what he can do as compared to before. I do think he needs a fresh character though. I love the idea of that "mean streak" you mentioned above, and I think a heel turn would facilitate that beautifully. It sounds like maybe you agree that he's limited by what Vince and Co. expect of him. And just to poke a little fun, I think maybe you were talking about the Rock's promo's lol!! Glad to see there is at least someone on here who appreciates Cena's work ethic though

 

[multiverseman.com]

Cena simply needs good creative choices behind him. He needs to regain the edge he had as a hell. He was SHARP in that role. They need to either turn him or have him become more like that.