[Official] John Cena Thread

[drphiltheawesomeninja22]

The one hour match was pretty much all HBK....Cena did hold his own there and I did think he had it won a few times..but anyways... I dont think Orton vs Cena will be nearly as good as Cena vs HBK. And I also dont think Khali will have a title run. He wants better competition and I guess hes getting it. Honestly I think when Khali gets a title shot, he'll DQ himself.

 

[TNA Smark]

How is Cena better competition when Cena had to be carried on more than one occasion by HBK? Wouldn't better competition be HBK? Last time we saw Cena vs. HBK it was Cena who's back was on the mat. Cena vs. HBK was without a doubt a good match but the fact is Cena had to be carried. Khali getting himself DQ'd is a ligit arguement or even winning by count out could work as that is how he has beaten Jeff Hardy when the Intercontinental title was on the line but with the WWE Championship on the line, a more prestigous belt would that be the best ending?

 

[X]

C'mon TNA Smark, the WWE Title is prestigious? That title hasn't meant shit since Cena got his claws on it, probably even before that. For me the title was dead after they created the Undisputed title and killed the old legacy.

For those of you who don't know my stance on Cena, I will simply shove all of my many many rants into three simple words:

FUCK JOHN CENA.​

That is all.

 

[watchingandwaiting]

Xfear, I don't think you could be more wrong about the lack of prestige in the WWE title because of Cena. To be fair, I wasn't watching wrestling when the Undisputed Title was created, so I don't really have an opinion on that...but if that killed the title for you, I dont' know what to tell you. With regard to the belt being on Cena though... I think there are two types of champions. Those who need the belt and those champions that the belt needs. The discussion in the "Undertaker not World Champion Material" thread is a perfect illustration of what I mean by the latter group. I think the former group is pretty self-explanatory, but in case the name is unclear, I mean champions who need the belt in order to be viewed as legit. I think the problem with Cena's reign is that while he started out as someone who needed the belt, WWE has tried to change him into someone who can build the belt up just by having it, which obviously isn't working for him. But that doesn't change the fact that some of the biggest names in the business have put over the belt during that time. Jericho, HHH, HBK, etc... all of them put over the belt, and the holder of the belt by association. That means that when Cena finally loses the belt, whoever beats him won't have just beat John Cena...they will have beaten the guy who beat Jericho, HHH, HBK, etc. and THAT is what will put the new champ over much more than having just beaten Cena. That's the reason why I actually, in hindsite, think it is a good thing that HBK didn't win the belt off Cena and why its even better than Cena didn't drop the belt in the fourway at Backlash. The belt needs to pass to someone who needs it and it needs to happen clean, one on one, and not some gimmicked way.

Anyway, I can understand that people aren't going to necessarily agree with the way I view the belt and Cena having it, and that is fine. I would like to hear what people think about it. I just hope that I get something more than "u fukin ideit, cena iz fukin gayfagboyworsthchamp evr i hpe he fkin DIIIIESSS" posts back...

 

[X]

Nah you only get posts like that from the n00bs, mate.

While yes the WWE title does still mean alot, it hasn't meant anywhere NEAR what it used to. For those who have been watching a long time like myself, let me tell you that title used to be the be-all and end-all of wrestling. Nothing was more important. The guys who won it and fought for it were LEGENDS, guys like Austin, Rock, 'Taker, HHH, Mick Foley, HBK, Bret Hart. These days the closest we can get is HBK and Taker. The title still means alot or meant alot to me and to others up until Cena for one major reason and that isn't the fact that Cena is one of the worst wrestlers of all time.

It's the fucking spinner belt. That right there destroyed the credibility of the WWE title. Of course it's still important, but my god could they make the title look any less imporant? It looks like something 50 Cent would wear if he were a wrestler. What happened to the Eagle? What happened to the proud writing of "World Wresting Entertainment/Federation Championship" on the belt? Cena killed it when it came to that.

Good points all around though.

 

[Monkey_Mania]

I TOTALLY agree with xfear.

The title still means a lot but after they created the spinner belt it was like they threw away the legends like bruno sammartino, bret hart, stone cold, hhh, Bob Backlund, Ric Flair, macho man, and yes even Hulk Hogan.

I wish they would take the title off of cena change his character around a little bit and change the belt into something a little bit more respectable

 

[TNA Smark]

C'mon TNA Smark, the WWE Title is prestigious? That title hasn't meant shit since Cena got his claws on it, probably even before that. For me the title was dead after they created the Undisputed title and killed the old legacy.

For those of you who don't know my stance on Cena, I will simply shove all of my many many rants into three simple words:

FUCK JOHN CENA.​

That is all.

I agree that all the different forms of the title have made the belt loose some prestigue but without a doubt it is the most prestigous title in the WWE. So hopefully they can make it mean something by not having title defenses ending in count outs, dq's and etc. I don't like John Cena either though. I like WWE believing in longer title reigns but Cena has been hogging the title for quite some time. At least in ROH they have long title reigns but with champions that can wrestle and entertain both smarks and marks.

 

[watchingandwaiting]

Nah you only get posts like that from the n00bs, mate.

While yes the WWE title does still mean alot, it hasn't meant anywhere NEAR what it used to. For those who have been watching a long time like myself, let me tell you that title used to be the be-all and end-all of wrestling. Nothing was more important. The guys who won it and fought for it were LEGENDS, guys like Austin, Rock, 'Taker, HHH, Mick Foley, HBK, Bret Hart. These days the closest we can get is HBK and Taker. The title still means alot or meant alot to me and to others up until Cena for one major reason and that isn't the fact that Cena is one of the worst wrestlers of all time.

It's the fucking spinner belt. That right there destroyed the credibility of the WWE title. Of course it's still important, but my god could they make the title look any less imporant? It looks like something 50 Cent would wear if he were a wrestler. What happened to the Eagle? What happened to the proud writing of "World Wresting Entertainment/Federation Championship" on the belt? Cena killed it when it came to that.

Good points all around though.

I see where you are coming from with the belt. I do agree that it would look better on my tires rather than around the waste of a champion. But let me ask you this.. if you had to pick one title to go for..would it be the WWE title, even with the spinner belt......the classic looking WHC belt? or the unique in its own way WWECW belt? For me personally, it would be WWE belt..I'd much rather go for the belt that's been competed for by guys like HHH, HBK, Jericho, and even Cena rather than the belt that Batista has defended against..umm. Booker T and Finlay? I won't even get people's blood pressure up by talking any more about the WWECW belt. I dunno if this is a fair response to your argument, or just a commentary on the sorry state of WWE at the moment..but there it is.

 

[X]

Well personally at this point I'd probably go for the WHC title. People seem to forget that the title has a very long history behind it, formerly being the WCW title that has been competed for with greats like Flair, Sting, Bret Hart, Booker T, Chris Benoit, Chris Jericho, Eddie Guerrero, etc. Of course the WWE Title will always be the top dog, but my point was that it just doesn't mean as much as it used to. Back in like 1999, when you won that title, you were a GOD. You went down in history as being one of the best of ALL TIME. These days with the titles being thrown around so much onto guys like Cena, it really kills its credibility for me.

And the ECW title...I'm not sure if its the old ECW-TNN era title, if it is, then it has a very rich history as well. But now that they've thrown it on guys like McMahon and Lashley, that title is as important as my toilet paper. It's like when 'Taker won the rumble, who HONESTLY thought that he would pick the ECW champion to face at Wrestlemania? Nobody, because everyone knows that title is worth all of shit at this point.

 

[Travy]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news but people like The Undertaker, HBK, Stone Cold, The Rock, etc. They're not gonna be around forever. Who will you cheer for once their gone? I mean, half of them are gone already. I think the people that hate John Cena are old school wrestling fans. They hate that he put the spinner on the belt and that he raps. To be honest, I hate it too. I hate that I have to let go of all my old favorite wrestlers because they're gone. They've moved on or retired or (it sucks to say) went to Hollywood. People have to move on and accept that you have to change with the times. Does John Cena suck? Not really. He may need a few new moves and be a little more innovative in the ring but he doesn't suck. I agree that it seems that he has never really had to work to get what he wanted. He was pretty much handed the title and made out to be a God. He needs to lose it and be out of the title hunt and earn some respect from the fans. I like Mr. Kennedy because he's earned my respect. He beat 6 champions in a year and still didn't get the strap. He's taken losses fair and square. I also like Carlito because he can put on a show in the ring. Flying off the ropes and doing back flips. I wish they'd give him a push to main event status. But as far as John Cena. He doesn't suck but he doesn't have my respect. WHAMMY!

 

[mabuza]

The fact is,a majority of people who hate John are sheep.They never really understood why we were intially "booing" John.The quality of his matches has low,and we expected a high standard form our champ.It had nothing to do with his gimmick.Now that he's elevated his game,those of us who had legit complaints dont have that big a problem any more.At the end of the day,John is the WWE'S biggest star.Love him or hate him, he draws more than Taker ever did.I've seen thousands of people show up just to boo him and leave before the SD! tapings& Dark matches.
As for the WWE title legacy,it got dented when Vince won it.Not even Funaki could devalue a world title the way Vince did.

 

[TNA Smark]

Hmm, I think your wrong. We're not sheep first of all. I understood why I booed John Cena and he hasn't stepped up his game at all. A leg drop from the top and he is automatically a good wrestler? I don't think so. He has to do more than that and a suplex because at the end of the day its the same old shit all over but one or two moves added to his move set that anyone can do. I never had anything against his gimmick but I just hate that he is champion for so f'n long and we know there not giving it to Khali so he'll have it for more time. I think he is going to be like Hogan and have the title for 4 straight years in a row.

 

[watchingandwaiting]

I don't think mabuza was refering to the IWC as sheep.. I think it was more along the lines of there being a lot of people who boo Cena because it is the "fashionable" thing to do. I don't think its fair to judge his improvement on the number of new moves he's added. I think there has been a difference lately in the coherence and storytelling of his matches. Maybe the mistake he made at 'Mania by not selling the knee is serving as a reminder to him to really focus on the details of a match.

 

[X]

At the end of the day,John is the WWE'S biggest star.Love him or hate him, he draws more than Taker ever did

Bullshit he does, Cena is one of the lowest drawing champions since the early 90s. Benoit, Taker, everyone has outdrew him. Check out the Champions by Rating thread from the Shockmaster for more info on that one.

Honestly I think this thread is dead. What else is left to say? Either you're intelligent and can recognize that Cena has one of the worst movesets in the history of this biz and is about as exciting as cheese whiz, or you're a Cena fan.

 

[A.J.]

X i think your right as this thread is either for those who know love his five knuckle moveset and will defend him till the cows come home or those like us understand wrestling for what it and realize that this man is nothing more than an over pushed shoved down our throats mid-carder who is one lucky SOB to be on the spot he is in.

Look at the Ratings Cena has been horrible at ratings as Edge had better ratings and how can anyone ever put Cena and Taker in the same sentence Cena will never be at the level.

 

[TheRealDC]

X i think your right as this thread is either for those who know love his five knuckle moveset and will defend him till the cows come home or those like us understand wrestling for what it and realize that this man is nothing more than an over pushed shoved down our throats mid-carder who is one lucky SOB to be on the spot he is in.

Look at the Ratings Cena has been horrible at ratings as Edge had better ratings and how can anyone ever put Cena and Taker in the same sentence Cena will never be at the level.

This is the whole reason why the keep saying Cena is "controversial" Look people... no one is stupid. No matter who says what... no matter if Cena draws or not... no matter how much he is shoved down our throats... he IS the champion. We don't have to like him, but if you look around the crowd during a live event, and you see all those little kids that have Cena T-shirts on. You see all those kids that are huge Cena marks. Just take a step back for a minute and you realize that that was you when Austin was in the ring, or when The Rock was in the ring. The old school fans know better, and won't bite into someone like Cena, but... he is the modernized version of our Rocks, Austins, Takers, Hogans, and Savages. This is what it is now, they want him to become a new icon for the young generation. And they don't care if they have to lose fans in the process. Even if we don't like it, Cena is probably the only other person that is soulfully dedicated in his work. The man comes out every single night, no matter what, and takes whatever the crowd throws at him, you gotta give him props for that. I'm sure he knows what a lot of people think about him, but he goes out there every single night and gives us a show, that we either like or hate. The people that hate him boo, and the people that love him cheer. In actual reality, he is the best thing in WWE right now. Only because he has both sides of the fan base in a stand still. We will keep watching and buying tickets until he loses. But the more he wins, the more people eat it up... So, in retrospect, this thread won't die. But the only way it can stay alive is if the actual Cena marks that post in here become a little more literate and start posting exactly what is on their minds when they see Cena (wait... ummm... can Cena marks see Cena???) in more detail. If they don't, then this thread gets buried along with any sort of rational thought about Cena being a "decent" champ in his fans eyes.

 

[watchingandwaiting]

People can bash Cena and his limited moveset and his over-long title reign all they want to..everyone is entitled to their opinion, but I think its going to far to make the blanket statement that "because one is a Cena fan, then that person does not understand wrestling". Granted there are plenty of Cena fans out there who cheer him because they are told by the storyline that he is supposed to be cheered. And yes, he has a very limited and repetative moveset. And yes , his title reign has gone on WAY too long. I'll agree with all those things. But none of those things address why I am a Cena fan. Simply put, I like Cena because he is an energy guy. He's like the Anderson Varejao of the WWE (minus the hair...that is obviously Carlito..but I digress). Skill-wise, he'll never be mistaken for a prodigy. And he'll never carry a team (or WWE) on his own. But when you put him with someone great (Lebron/HBK) he works his ass off and does all the hustle plays that you need to take a team/match to the next level.

Cena works hard and I respect him for that. It's a shame that he's gotten so over-pushed because he probably would have gained a pretty good fan-base on his effort level alone if he'd stayed in the mid/upper-mid card. But that just isn't what happened, and the fact that I allow myself to look past his over-exposure and see that he gives his all for the fans every time out is what makes me a Cena fan. And I fail to see how that necessarily means that I don't understand wrestling or aren't a true wrestling fan.

 

[X]

Look, even I, the biggest Cena basher on this board, will say that there have been a few matches of Cena's that I enjoy. I understand that people either love him or hate him, but the thing is this--it's bigger then John Cena.

People don't just hate John Cena because he's garbage in the ring, people hate the fact that men like Cena these days are getting all the top spots while all of the younger guys aren't getting shit. Atleast when you hate hacks like Hogan or Yokozuna as champion you also had amazing wrestlers like Randy Savage and Bret Hart rising to the main event, thus being able to help and carry guys. Those guys were still young and finally got the breaks they deserved. But these days, when's the last time one of the amazing younger talents was able to break into the main event scene? Edge? Randy Orton? That's it, and we're talking a good three or so years there. Maybe I'm just being impatient, but the thing is that we had options back in those days and if we didn't like WWF we could switch to WCW. Now that that option has been taken away fans have become immersed in WWE, because it is the superpower in wrestling.

It isn't about hating Cena's match work(which I do), it's about the fact that guys like him are becoming more and more prevalent in the industry as the top dogs. Whether it be Cena, Batista, Lashley, or the Great Khali, all of these guys are midcard at the very best and do not deserve the breaks they've been giving. Why? Because they haven't proven themselves yet. Atleast younger guys talents like CM Punk, and Shelton Benjamin have proven themselves much more then capable of putting on excellent, excellent matches. CM Punk should be in the main event scene, ASAP. How long does he need to mire in the midcard? Whenever you bring in a top guy from a major indy, and you place him the midcards, he dies. Look at Taz for example. CM Punk could easily be putting on fantastic, fantastic main event matches with the likes of Benoit, Finlay, HBK, etc. If you don't believe that just look at his matches with Samoa Joe, if those aren't five star classics then I don't know what is.

Anyways, the real reason I wanted to come into this thread in the first place was to post a link to this: John Cena Battle Raps a Fan

Now, I had never heard Cena rap before this. And holy christ, he actually spit a couple of good bars. Granted, his flow is pretty bad and alot of the freestyle isn't exactly top notch rhyming, the line at the end is great about the lesbians.

I figure it's time to start talking about something besides whether Cena sucks or doesn't suck in this thread, so what do you guys think about his rapping skills? How is his album? (I'm disgusted that Esoteric is on it...that's just wrong)

 

[TheRealDC]

I've actually watched him rap, and I've listened to a bit of the album... and I can honestly say... compared to other rappers nowadays, he is not THAT bad... he is your typical white boy rapper though. But I like some of his lines. Kurt Angle totally owns him in the freestyle category though, lol. But that is what I liked about Cena, when he was rapping. It set him aside from everyone else in the business.

 

[Capt. Charisma]

ha comparing The Rock or Stone Cold to Cena is like comparing Barcelona to Queen of the South! The Rock and Stone cold contray to popular belief on these forums could indeed wrestle. Have u watched Stone cold's matches prior to 1997? and getting dropped on his head by Owen Hart? Similarly The Rock as Rocky Mavia was an athletic and technical wrestler. Cena on the other hand is a piece of shite, however unfortunatly he does indeed draw. However consdiering the amount he has been pushed if he didnt draw as much as he did it would draw about as much as The mean street posse could. You people buy WWE's marketing, its just like any other business whatever you try to say if your a Cena fan it is because you have fallen for it hook line and sinker. Finally The Rock and Stone cold had one other thing going for them and that was charisma. Do you see Cena eventing a new catchpharse every week, and absoloutaly owing his opponents- answer no not really. Is every match Cena in unpredictable and exciting? no? And do Cena's storline keep you tuning in every week? quite frankly no. Cena is nothing compared 2 Rock and Stone Cold, if you believe otherwise then i dont care go have a wnk over a John Cena poster or something.

 

[Shocky]

Undertaker one of the lowest draws??? Come on, back up your statements. Go into the old school thread, and I've conveniently done this for you already. The Undertakers 3rd title reign is the highest EVER in the history of Raw, averaging well over a 6.0, whereas Cena is lucky to average a 3.7. Undertaker doubled Cena, so get off of this myth that Cena draws. Cena is a very low rated champion, he is in the bottom half of the grand scheme of Monday Night Raw, do some research, and quit regurgitating spoon fed shit that is simply not true.

Cap't Charisma, I don't agree with you a lot of the time, but you've hit it spot on with Austin and the Rock. If anyone watched Austin wrestle before he got his stinger, they realized he was a damn fine wrestler. Flair even wanted Austin to be the next main eventer while he was in WCW before Hogan came, and that says a lot. And The Rock, he is an athlete. He is not technically sound, but he comes off smooth in the ring, and can actually hit the moves that he specializes in without landing and flopping around like a fish out of water.

The bottomline on Cena, he works hard, okay, I work hard, but should I be the poster boy for my job because I work hard. Just because I work hard doesn't mean I work the best out of everyone, so that is why I'm not the highest paid. I bust my ass everyday, but I recognize that people do my job better then me, and they are above me for that. Everyone works hard, so throw that arguement away. Cena draws as champion, is again horseshit, go to Old School and do some research. Cena outsells everyone, yes this is true, because over 50% of the items on Shopzone are Cena products, so do the math. Cena hasn't invented a new catchphrase in what, 2 years, that is horrible for a guy that is supposed to be so damn good on the mic. And even the "Champ is Here" was stolen from Ali. The reason why Cena gets his push is because Vince McMahon is hell bent on creating another star, but instead of listening to his fans like he used to, he is shoving a hack down our throats, and the fans simply refuse to take it.

 

[watchingandwaiting]

Capt Charisma and Shockmaster, both of you make very valid arguments as to why Cena shouldn't be WWE champ. And, even as a Cena fan, I agree. There are better options, although the number of available options is dwindling a bit due to injuries the main event level stars. But the arguments for Cena not being the champ don't necessarily translate to reasons to hate him. For the sake of discussion, let's look at some of your points from that perspective..

The bottomline on Cena, he works hard, okay, I work hard, but should I be the poster boy for my job because I work hard. Just because I work hard doesn't mean I work the best out of everyone, so that is why I'm not the highest paid. I bust my ass everyday, but I recognize that people do my job better then me, and they are above me for that. Everyone works hard, so throw that arguement away.

Hard work does not a champion make. BUT, hard work should earn you respect. Shock, I have no idea what you do for a living, but I would assume that you busting your ass at the office (or wherever) should translate in your co-workers respecting the work that you do. And if you are in any type of industry where your work gives a direct benefit to people outside your company, I would think that you working hard for their benefit would lead them to respect you also. Same thing with Cena. Aside from that one, isolated report about Cena and Vince spending time together backstage, I haven't heard/read anything about Cena having heat from any other wrestler backstage. It strikes me as strange that he gets bashed by the fans, but not by the guys best qualified to evaluate his hard work and dedication

Cena outsells everyone, yes this is true, because over 50% of the items on Shopzone are Cena products, so do the math.

I'm not gonna go with numbers or anything, because I frankly don't care how much merch. someone can sell. The only thing I can say about this is that WWE is a business, and therefore subject to things like supply and demand. I don't think that they would make Cena products greater than half their stock unless there was a demand for them.

Cena hasn't invented a new catchphrase in what, 2 years, that is horrible for a guy that is supposed to be so damn good on the mic. And even the "Champ is Here" was stolen from Ali.

I don't think charism and catchphrases have a correlative relationship. For example, HBK is certainly a charismatic superstar, but when is the last time he's come up with a catchphrase? He cuts great promo's, but calling himself the "Heartbreak Kid" and the "Showstoppa" are certainly not new. Another example, Mr. Kennedy. Aside from his "Kennedy...Kennedy" and "fastest rising superstar" phrases, he just cuts good promos. he doesn't come up with new catch phrases left and right unless you are gonna count "BANK...bank" as a new one. And as for stealing "the Champ is here" from Ali... look at DX. both HHH and the NAO stole their shtick from the guy who used to work the big boxing fights (sorry I don't know the name).

And do Cena's storline keep you tuning in every week? quite frankly no.

That is the writers' fault. Are you gonna honestly tell me that if they hadn't revealed Khali as the guy who destroyed Edge, Orton, and HBK at the end of that week's Raw, but instead left it as a cliff-hanger and dangled the possibility that Cena had turned heel and done it himself that you wouldn't have tuned in the following week just to see whodunit? And what about his TLC match with Edge where if Cena had lost he would have gone to Smackdown...even if you were praying he lost and went to Smackdown, wasn't that at least an interesting enough storyline to follow? Or the entire lead-up to Mania with the tension between Cena and HBK?

The Undertakers 3rd title reign is the highest EVER in the history of Raw, averaging well over a 6.0, whereas Cena is lucky to average a 3.7. Undertaker doubled Cena

So I checked on WWE.com and it says that Undertaker's 3rd title reign lasted from 5-23-99 to 6-28-99. That's what? 5 shows? While that does show drawing power, it certainly isn't sustained drawing power. Plus, if we wanna pull out stats from that, it was Undertaker's 4th title reign that dropped ratings down into the 3's, from which they have only rarely gotten back into the 4's, no matter who the champ was. In fact, the only times the ratings have broken 4 for a reign was with either Cena being champ, or Edge and RVD as the champ and Cena in the title picture. Now before I get shot down in flames for stating this, it was the move to Spike TV that killed ratings and not a specific champion. It was only 'Takers bad luck to be the guy who had rating dip under 4, but the trend was going in that direction before he got the belt. The point is is that comparing the ratings pre- and post- Spike TV is a little bit misleading. Plus, Taker's 3rd run corresponded to a lot more interesting and better quality midcard action than any of Cena's title runs. For example, during Taker's 3rd run, you had a HHH/Rock and McMahon/Austin fued going on. I'm pretty sure that those contributed to the ratings successes. I also think its safe to say that there haven't really been "undercard" fueds of that quality all throughout Cena's title runs.. Bottom line is - ratings are midleading.

 

[X]

I'd have to disagree watchingandwaiting. Sure, I woud've tuned in to see WhoDunIt had they not revealed Khali, but I tune in every week regardless of what the storylines are because I love wrestling. The storylines and angles in the WWE have been nothing but absolute amazingly huge steaming piles of horseshit since Brock Lesnar's "Next Big Thing" angle panned out. Honestly whens the last time a good feud really elevated the product? The only other ones I can think of are HBK-Jericho and HBK-Angle.

There is actually quite a bit of heat on Cena backstage as well, because he's seen as Vince's "pet" who he does everything with and who never gets bad angles/storylines/feuds while guys like Kane who've worked their asses off in the company for a good ten years are stuck in storylines involving him having sex with dead people.

I already stated the reason why I loathe Cena, it's much bigger then just one guy who has a limited moveset and pisses some people off, it's about the fact that guys with little to no talent and movesets comparable to a five year old have been becoming more and more prevalent and getting bigger pushes over guys with amazing talent who could actually keep the fans on the edge of their seats. Batista, Lashley, Cena, Khali, etc. All big, slow, dumb, and absolute shit in the ring.

And what is with this argument that Cena works his ass off? Really? If he worked his ass off maybe he could've taken the couple monthes out of his busy schedule to learn how to fuckin' wrestle in the first place, you'd think someone who's so passionate about what they do would want to do it right. Just because your motives are good doesn't mean your working hard. Cena has a ton of heart, I'll give him that, but unless that heart translates into him actually giving a flying fuck about his in ring work, he's nothing but lazy in my book.

 

[watchingandwaiting]

Xfear, I think my short response to you would be - Fuck the creative team. But to respond point by point

Sure, I woud've tuned in to see WhoDunIt had they not revealed Khali, but I tune in every week regardless of what the storylines are because I love wrestling. The storylines and angles in the WWE have been nothing but absolute amazingly huge steaming piles of horseshit since Brock Lesnar's "Next Big Thing" angle panned out. Honestly whens the last time a good feud really elevated the product? The only other ones I can think of are HBK-Jericho and HBK-Angle.

If Cena wasn't the champ, or at least wasn't getting the push he was, then younger talent would have the chance to move up the card and we might get to see some of those storylines that are good for everyone involved in them and wrestling in general. But that argues against Cena as the champ, which is something I agree with, and not Cena the wrestler. In the interest of counter-point, although I do NOT believe this makes up for the overall quality of the storylines, the Edge/Cena fued did make Edge a legit main eventer. But yeah, the fueds in general..fuck the creative team.

There is actually quite a bit of heat on Cena backstage as well, because he's seen as Vince's "pet" who he does everything with and who never gets bad angles/storylines/feuds while guys like Kane who've worked their asses off in the company for a good ten years are stuck in storylines involving him having sex with dead people.

I only saw Wrestlezone post that "pet" story maybe two or three times. And then there was no follow up. And those stories came out a while ago..maybe 6 months? That is what leads me to believe there is an acceptance of Cena in the locker room. If there have been other such reports that I've missed, then I'll concede the point, but I'm just not aware of any other ones. As to the fact that deserving guys aren't getting the good feuds that they deserve, again I say fuck the creative team.

And what is with this argument that Cena works his ass off? Really? If he worked his ass off maybe he could've taken the couple monthes out of his busy schedule to learn how to fuckin' wrestle in the first place, you'd think someone who's so passionate about what they do would want to do it right. Just because your motives are good doesn't mean your working hard. Cena has a ton of heart, I'll give him that, but unless that heart translates into him actually giving a flying fuck about his in ring work, he's nothing but lazy in my book.

I think it would be fantastic if Cena took an "injury" break and got a few more moves and smoother in-ring work. And maybe when a bunch of the currently injured main eventers get back, that will happen. But for now, because of the fact that Cena has been pushed for so long, the main event picture is very limited and he can't take time off even if he wanted to (whether he would agree to doing that or not I have NO idea, but the part of me that is a mark hopes that he would). My reasoning for saying he works his ass off is that he hasn't taken any injury time off and he's been involved in some very physical matches. TLC vs. Edge, Extreme Lumberjack vs. Sabu and Last Man Standing vs. Umaga are three that spring to mind. He takes the big bumps and still comes out the next night on Raw and puts on a show (such as he can).

 

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C'mon now, Last Man Standing with Umaga? That's considered hardcore these days? What bumps were there---a table spot that involved Cena moving out of the way and Cena choking Umaga out with the ring rope. That's it. TLC against Edge, again the most hardcore it got was what happened to Edge at the end. Cena barely took any of the spots in that entire feud nor any other of his feuds. I haven't seen the extreme lumberjack with Sabu so I'll save my judgment on that until I can track down a copy online.

Look, even I can enjoy some Cena matches, like the ones you mentioned, I'll admit I did enjoy the two TLC matches with Edge and the Last Man Standing with Umaga. However it wasn't based on wrestling, it was more of atmosphere, and weapons. However it would be incredibly easy to just let Cena out of the main event picture. Look at Smackdown, they just lost their two biggest stars who usually carry the show, Undertaker and Mr. Kennedy. And Smackdown not only took it in stride but even made the situation MORE exciting with Edge cashing in his MITB. It would be very easy to get Cena out of the main event picture and it would do wonders for everyone involved--Cena could take some time to improve in the ring, so many of the fans would stop hating his guts and learn to tolerate him, the RAW main event scene would be reenergized and could be awesome. Cena has been in the main event scene of RAW for what--2 years now nonstop? Almost every main event feud in RAW in the last two years has involved Cena. It's about god damn time to freshen things up don't you agree? HBK, Orton, Flair, Carlito, all could feud in the main event and be over with the fans. Plus, one of the very few dream matches left in my book could take place---HBK vs. Flair.

Maybe I'm just an optimist about the potential in the WWE right now, but I just think everyone and everything would improve if Cena just took some time off(like six monthes) and improved his in ring skills.