Jeff Hardy Shoots on CM Punk

[Mitch Henessey]

I just watched the video, and I spent most of the time shaking my head. Jeff was obviously wasted here, and he made sure to voice his feelings about CM Punk. I actually like Jeff, but he looked like a fool here. He just came off as this bitter drunk guy. Feuding with Hardy did help Punk get over as a heel in WWE, but Punk's excellent mic skills helped him stay over as a heel. This was just so sad to watch. The only thing that made me laugh in this video was watching Matt eat french fries towards the end.

 

[Mr. Artistic guy]

You know mick foley gets so much stick throughout his career for being a glorified stunt-man, a spot-monkey if you will. Mick foley used to have the ability to deliver promos that could rival anybody. But for the lack of talent and inproportionate success these guys have had in their careers, and yet not get the same stick is unmerited and bizarre. These guys got into the business through spots, they have made their name through spots because I'm damn sure neither of them has wrestled a match over 10 minutes that wasn't half absorbed by failed twist of fate attempts, swanton bombs and pandering to the crowd. Quite possibly the two least telented guys in all of the industry with relation to the position they have in it and they have the gaul to go and try to de-throne one of the seated kings of proffessional wrestling today. Well it's disgusting.

You know, the true success stories start off in the minor leagues and work their way up and eventually it becomes clear to everybody that someone was destined to be where they ended up. CM punk has endured as much as any guy trying to make it to the top possibly with the exception of daniel bryan and even that is arguable seen as punk had to start off on ECW which is like an acme door factory, really hard to break out of. But did so and ended up as a now three time straight edge world champion, one of the biggest and most deserved success stories in wrestling. So for Hardy to claim that punk got over because of him is true, but not because of anything hardy did. CM Punk required jeff's irrational fan following just like he did with rey at wrestlemania to get himself where he did but that doesn't mean he leeched off him. I watched that feud avidly and loved every second of it, punk every week becoming more and more psychotic and attacking hardy after matches with elbows and knees and a barrage of unorthodox attacks. I loved that feud, for me it was feud of 2009, but lets get this straight, jeff hardy may as well have been a sorpse for the part he played in it, he did nothing at all. Punk carried an inferior hardy the whole way and I marked out when I watched jeff get eliminated by punk from the WWE and funny thing is I never even saw punk before WWE, this was only from the work he did whilst he was there. CM punk has done more in WWE than either of those guys combined in his considerably shorter time there and he can could out-talk or out-wrestle either on their best night. Initially people would stick up for jeff because of the first drugs incident and I understand that, the same way i'd stick up for MVP now. But if jeff or matt hardy feels hard done by after the way WWE used jeff's real life issues, they really need to get a grip. You guys are your own biggest enemies.

Jeff was starting to impress me with his heel turn and his promos until it arose in my mind that it has taken him 15 years to develop this level of charisma so my respect plummetted instantaneously, not to mention his botched chair shot to anderson did piss me off seen as he the TNA saviour. And after watching this attempt to belittle a man who lets face it, isn't going to fight back under the reigns of WWE management advise they have done two poor things. One is made themselves look like cowards trying to grab the spotlight because not both having a steady job right now, and the other is ruin TNA's reputation. Every time TNA tries to slander the name of the WWE it's viewership goes down, and doing this to one of their stars has the same effect, they really don't need jeff embarrassing themselves more than they do every time they mention a "bunch of rookies" or "ECW being destroyed at the hands of vince". Heres a hint that all viewers have learnt by now. You don't prove your better than the other company by saying they aren't as good, that vince mcmahon's and ahole, that WWE sucks. You prove your better than the other company by going out there and putting on a better show. This time it wasn't directly their fault but honestly we all knew jeff wasn't worthy of holding the belt in the first place. But honestly, saying that, i really hope punk responds because in his ever-sobre state he would put those two walking contradictions in their place. And how can you tell matt is a loser. His former girlfriend of years who cheated on him and even recently commented about matt that she thinks he's being attention seeking with his MATTHEW youtube videos....and he takes her word about a relationship between her and punk as fact. Well matt your youtube videos do suck, I've tried watching them and you suck up to yourself!! I mean you could have picked a better wrestler couldn't you?

This time I feel a little bit sorry for TNA because their top man, the guy they're banking on to take them to the next level, is acting like an out-of-work guy who got dropped by a major wrestling company years ago and decides to do a shoot to earn a little money on the side. To me that doesn't say much about what it means to jeff hardy to be TNA world champion. Jeff don't focus on CM Punk, focus on yourself. Jeff should focus on what he's doing, not anybody else. thats where he could learn from cena, job dedication gets you everywhere and jeff has leaped between companys enough time to not be trusted anymore IMO.

Oh and I'm sure matt hardy mentionned on one of his youtube videos that he was going to get into the bests hape of his life. Good start matt.

Can't wait til these losers get too old to be booked anymore, they have as much of a stangle hold on the business as "the band", they're just bad news. Honestly I wouldn't book em for a kids party. The fact jeff hardy is world champion is a disgrace. Like I said, before this I wasn't happy about the chair shot incident...NOW I THINK THESE WASTE OF SPACE BROTHERS ARE HINDERING THE PROGRESS OF THE ONLY REAL COMTENDER TO THE MEGA-POWER OF THE WRESTLING WORLD. If I was to quite ludacris I'd say "Move bitch, get out the way". I'll spend no more time ranting, it's wasted on these two infants.

So anyway, sorry about the sheer length of the rant, if jeff had picked someone like big show I probably would have written about a third of this, but everyone knows CM Punk is the fucking man. Hardy is lucky he ever got to lock up with that man.

 

[The Raven's Epitaph]

Why don't you go watch a PG match and *********e to Sheamus or something..

Why don't you grow up and get banned or something? Better yet, stop spamming a perfectly good thread that has a decent discussion going on in it.

And in reply to your other post, we aren't dumbasses. You're the dumbass if you think Jeff Hardy is justifying anything by doing his own shoots whilst he's high or drunk or whatever the fuck he was. Seriously, what do you think he's trying to prove?

That he's the 'anti-christ of proffesional wrestling' ? The only thing I see out of Jeff Hardy is a washed up old wrestling mark that likes to abuse his body with drugs and alcohol. Do I sound straight-edge? Too bad, I am straight-edge, and that's not just because I'm a CM Punk fan. I've always been strongly against doing pointless things like smoking, doing drugs and drinking when they have absolutely no purpose in the modern day world and do nothing but rot your insides.

It's tore apart my family like you wouldn't know what. My cousin? Yeah, he was a sound guy. What happened? He got stoned and did 90mph round a corner, smashed into about 5 trees and now he's brain damaged. He no longer knows who anybody is and can't remember anything beforehand. He's only 34 years old.

My Grandfather? Yeah, I loved him to bits. What happened? He drunk, then he drunk some more, and he had abit more, and he died of liver failure. All because of booze. Pointless fucking drink.

What's my main love in life? I suppose you could say it's my family, and then after it'd be wrestling. Who was one of my favourite wrestlers? who did I look up to? Jeff Hardy, of course. He was my idol, until he turned into a complete asshat that took pills and smoked weed to get through life. What kind of human being does that? A motherfucking stupid human-being that's what.

So please, do us all a favour. FUCK OFF, you really aren't needed here and you're probably going to end up banned, which would do us all a favour here.

If you haven't got anything positive to add to a thread rather than risk an infraction just to have a shot at somebody then be my guest, do it all you like, you'll be banned before you know it. Then who's having the last laugh?

 

[ilapierre]

Caitiff, you are yet another naive lameass buddy. The real world is full of so called real men who use their so called word to deceive others for personal gain. That's nothing new. It's common sense, and common sense is something you gain with age and experience living in the real world and not in your parents basement in your underwear blogging on internet chat sites. WWE dictates the PG goofball mentality that you possess and expects its wrestlers to emulate that and if they don't they get let go and stigmatized as fuckups. CM Punk emulates the phoniness of the company he works for, like almost everyone in the work world, but that doesn't mean he is what he says he is anyway? You should never take anything seriously you see on TV or hear about someone based on what google says. Who really cares what he does outside of the ring, he doesn't do shit for anybody these days in the ring. All he can do is be an honourable man and take petty shots at Alex Riley or Matt Hardy. Or say shit about Hulk Hogan when he's an absolute nothing. The guy's a douchebag, all straight edges are because they are too pussy to be open minded enough to think outside the box or try anything new or question authority. Is it really honourable to let a boss or parent dictate to you who you are and you just be what they tell you to be or is honourable to be a hypocrite lying Christian schmuck like Shawn Michaels? Is it really dishonourable to retire like Ric Flair did and come back? If so, then you'd be saying Flair was dishonourable coming back to WWE 10 years ago because he should have stayed retired in 1994 after losing a retirement match to Hogan. Since he was dishonourable with his word, then you are saying all his career accomplishments and legacy should be tarnished and therefore so should his last WWE match with Shawn Michaels. It wasn't a real retirement match that meant anything, he went back on his word before so therefore the match didn't mean anything. Under your reasoning, Flair should not be valued for anything he did after 1994 and therefore should not be considered the best wrestler of all time unless he was already that by 1994 (which he was not).

I'm so sick of all this classy honourable bull espoused by the idiot kids and lame ass adults that frequent this site and haven't done a whole lot of frequenting the real world where real adult things happen like lying, drinking, stealing, and getting high. Real men buddy don't take shit from anyone, they don't cry like a baby about it like you. In the fake world of wrestling, Stone Cold put his boss in his place, that i can relate with because that's what i'd like to do in real life sometimes, but i can't relate with a butt kissing hack like John Cena who for some contrived reason lets a nobody like Wade Barrett boss him around and tell him his career is over. A real man acts like a man, he kicks ass and takes name without fear of consequences or being labeled pathetic or a fuckup. In real life people don't kick their bosses' ass but most want to. Most don't want to tune in and watch a shitty wrestling program where the top star is being told what to do by a nobody. Only a subservient straight edge dork would want to watch something so tedious and only a straight edge dork would call me pathetic for being real and calling a spade a spade. Little whiners let the law dictate their lives and let bosses take advantage of them. I mean most of us don't need law to know that killing and stealing is dishonourable. Most of us know better than to break the law if it threatens someone elses' life. But, c'mon, smoking dope? Rolling a joint? Man, how the hell does that hurt anyone? Smoking plain cigarettes is more dangerous than smoking weed but its not outlawed. So yah, if the law doesn't permit doing drugs then fuck the law. Ever hear of Eddie Guerrero's schtick a few years ago, "lie, cheat, steal." He was a face, not a heel, during that period so would that make him a major fuckup? One of the best wrestlers ever but he wasn't a straight edge dork like CM Punk so he was a fuckup eh? Guerreero reflects reality a lot better than some douchebag nobody like CM Punk trying to be a role model for a douchy generation of PG babies and lame ass adult girlyboys.

I'm plain pathetic because you don't agree with me. OK whatever buddy, your the opposite of pathetic for being a pansy ass and i'm pathetic for trying to open your eyes to the fact that your a little girl. I could give a rats ass if a guy you never met before either CM Punk is a straight edge or not, but i do give a rats ass that there's actually people like you on this site that think you know shit about shit when you obviously have no clue. There's no incoherence there unless you're a high school dropout and then the incoherence is that you can't make sense of the big words and real life concepts i'm using.

Why don't you go watch a PG match on youtube and *********e to a WWE diva in a tshirt or something..or better yet, why don't you look for some classy girl porn instead of that unclassy dishonourable man porn. You fn wuss. Maybe you'll find some PG porn.

 

[dman1373]

wow!!
Most of you guys are taking this so personal.
"OMG, Jeff Hardy made a video about cm punk when he was drunk or high or whatever."
"i lost all my respect for jeff hardy, because he was drunk and said something about a guy he didn't like."
"OMG, I HATE Jeff Hardy because of this so i will right the worst possible thing i can about him."

Most of you people are fucking ******ed. Just because Jeff Hardy said something about another wrestler when he was drunk is nothing to get pissed about. I have said something when I was drunk about someone i didn't like. Hell, who hasn't. This is just a bunch of fanboys ( and thats what you are) acting holier than thou and getting pissed because someone said something bad about their god cm punk.

This is coming from a guy that likes CM Punk alot more than Jeff Hardy as a wrestler.

 

[ilapierre]

The Raven's Epitaph: I'm gonna get banned here because i'm combating all the WWE smarks and upsetting them with my logical argument that Jeff Hardy can shoot all day on CM Punk and that PG WWE sucks balls. Let's censor me, because my opinion doesn't favour the consenus of a group of lame asses. Yah, i'm not needed here because you don't like what i have to say so lets censor me before i start changing minds here. You're 16 years old buddy, i'm almost the age of your cousin. I'm sorry to hear about your family history but man most people who drink and do drugs don't kill themselves in car accidents or die of liver failure. Most people do it in moderation and anyone who isn't smart enough or strong enough to moderate has it coming. I barely touch alcohol anymore and i don't smoke whatsoever. It's not because it's harmful, i just don't feel the need to now that I have a family. Buddy, i have a hard time coming on this site after 13 years of being here and listening to kids like you say the dumbass shit they are saying about real world adult stuff. It bothers me, you were 3 when i was on here and i never had to have arguments with people like you when i was 16. It's like this generation is completely sheltered and brain washed into believing the world is a completely different place than it really is.

You have no proof Jeff Hardy was drunk or high at 5 am doing a shoot video years ago putting down CM Punk. Who cares if he had some drinks, who cares if he did some weed, for all we know he was tired and it was 5 am! CM Punk shit on the Hardys, WWE sided with Punk and cut the Hardys loose so they can say whatever shit they want. CM Punk would do the same thing if he was treated like shit and cut loose from WWE. Most of us would, most might not get caught on video doing it but most would do it. The fact that you think less of Jeff Hardy because of that video clarifies that you simply just hate TNA, feel threatened by it and are a WWE smark.

Jeff Hardy abused his body with drugs. Ok. So you don't like him because of it. Guess you can't like the Rolling Stones either. Guess you can't like Eminem. Guess you can't like Nirvana or Britain's golden boys Oasis. Guess you can't like 95 percent of musicians, guess you can't like pornstars, guess you can't like any a whole lot about the real world.
People in the entertainment realm do drugs, and a lot crazier shit than Jeff Hardy is on.

What kind of human being is Jeff Hardy? He's a real human being who makes mistakes and lives a far from perfect lifestyle. But he's real, he's no fake like CM Dork. Why should he have to be a role model for squares? A role model should be someone who is real with real flaws but who kicks ass. Jeff Hardy isn't exactly the best wrestler of all time, and he wouldn't ever be close to being a role model for me, but CM Punk and his straight edge gimmick is the last person i'd ever consider as a role model. He's an utter douche. Jeff Hardy disappoints you, well you've got a lot to learn in life because a whole lot more than Jeff Hardy is gonna disappoint you once you get some life experience and figure out Jeff Hardy isn't the only so called asswipe out there making so called mistakes. Hardy's not stupid for doing what he may or may not do to himself, but people who argue along your lines are stupid for being intolerant of things they don't understand and have no clue about. Arguing that drugs are for fuckups and alcohol is for pathetic losers indicates you know nothing but what you've seen from your family's tragic experiences. I'm not trashing you or your family here, but generally stupid people drive under the influence, it wasn't the pills or alcohol that killed them or made them braindead or made them drive or drink, it woulda been their own stupidity. God rest their souls, but you can't blame it on the stuff they decided to take or the speeds they decided to drive while under the influence. You have to blame them, the people, for the poor choices they made. Lots of people die from stupid decisions driving a car, smoking cigarettes or eating garbage food but they don't blame the food or the cigarettes or the car. All they have to blame is themselves. Same with the alcohol and drugs. Things should be done in moderation and people should know better when it comes to driving under the influence.

 

[CH David]

Lulz. The funniest part about this whole video is that Jeff actually thinks he made CM Punk a superstar. For a while I actually thought Punk was as hated because of Jeff too. But it wasn't. Punk made that feud what it was. It just so happened that Jeff was the one they put him with. Every promo from Punk was gold and Jeff continued to suck on the mic. The credit I'll give Jeff is that they had solid chemistry in the ring for good matches.

Other than that, I actually couldn't give two shits about what Jeff has to say to Punk, no matter when it was recorded. It means nothing in the long run other than Punk may not invite Hardy over for Christmas. It's really not a big deal. Oh and lulz at Matt Hardy being shown eating.

 

[Caitiff]

The guy's a douchebag, all straight edges are because they are too pussy to be open minded enough to think outside the box or try anything new or question authority.

So, I'm a "douchebag" and a "pussy," all because I don't drink? "Try something new?" Okay. I'll go skydiving. I'll watch an Eli Roth movie. I'll pretend that Michael Bay doesn't deserve to die for his crimes against Transformers fans. Those are all new things for me. I don't need to get drunk or high to do "something new."

And, by the way, aren't you trying to asert authority to me, by saying that only people who drink or get high are worthwhile? I mean, that's generally the point of every single commercial for any alcoholic product on the market, so it must be true, right? And, as it seems, you've fallen, head first, for every word of that marketing hypnosis. Me? I question the authority of a society that believes it has the right to tell me what I must do with my life. My life! My rules! I don't give a shit what you do with yours. Get the fuck off of mine.

And, you're not pathetic because I don't agree with you. You're pathetic because you completely dismiss anyone who doesn't agree with you. You're pathetic because you can't even see any opinion that's not yours. Don't get me wrong. I see your opinion. I've seen it every day for the last 3 years, 3 months, and 17 days. (At current count.) I have stood against people who outright tell me how to live every moment of that time. You wouldn't know my struggle, because you would just fall into line, like the pathetic sheep you are.

And, more important than standing against the unthinking masses that have tried to force a bottle into my hands almost every day for the time since I stopped drinking, I've resisted my own urges to pick that bottle. I got over 3 years sober. And, unlike most people, I've done it completely cold turkey. I never needed a 12 Step Program. Straight Edge is the 1 step that saved my life. People like you want me to go back to the addiction that threatened to kill me. And, THAT is why you're pathetic.

And, by the way, the reason I'm not going to directly comment on the other parts of your comments is very simple. None of them make a lick of sense. What the hell does Ric Flair have to do with CM Punk? No. Seriously. That's not a rhetorical question. I want you to answer.

 

[Nikeo]

And, more important than standing against the unthinking masses that have tried to force a bottle into my hands almost every day for the time since I stopped drinking, I've resisted my own urges to pick that bottle. I got over 3 years sober. And, unlike most people, I've done it completely cold turkey. I never needed a 12 Step Program. Straight Edge is the 1 step that saved my life. People like you want me to go back to the addiction that threatened to kill me. And, THAT is why you're pathetic.

No, nobody gives a damn if you do or don't drink or do drugs, just don't force your opinion on me and try to exclaim that abstinence is the only way. Further, getting drunk and smoking a joint (after you've made millions) doesn't make you a fuck up. A fuck up is someone on the side of the street begging for money to go get a fix.

I'd like to inquire how Jeff is a fuck up when he's made more money than any of us ever will. I'm sorry, this video is a non-issue. He's not snorting coke, he's not smoking a joint on camera, he's not shooting up. There is NO proof he's done anything but had a bit too much to drink and go to a fast food restaurant, which is a weekly ritual for a lot of people I know and it doesn't make them fuck-ups. You can say "look, he's rubbing his nose!", "OMG! HE'S RUBBING HIS NECK! DRUGGY!" But at the end of the day you have no proof, you cannot prove beyond reasonable doubt that he was on anything harded than Jack Daniels. It'd be different if he was doing something on camera but he wasn't.

I'd like to echo someone else's sentiments: You're only annoyed because he's dissing your hero.

Beyond the IWC, despite your claims to the contrary, CM Punk is not held in such high regard. Even as a face, people like him...but he didn't have his own fan base. There weren't a mass of people who favored him over HBK, HHH, etc. That's why he failed as a main-event level face. He wasn't liked.

You claim Punk carried the feud with his promos? No, he didn't. Without Jeff Hardy CM Punk hasn't been able to stay in the ME, let alone steal the show like he did night in and night out with Hardy. Hardy didn't cut good promos but he had what Punk didn't, something an AWFUL lot more important than mic skills, he connected with the crowd, he had natural charisma. Punk couldn't connect with the crowd as a face. You claim Hardy is a spot monkey who got lucky? Go watch his No Mercy match with Triple H, Punk has NEVER put on a match that good with anyone (besides Hardy) in the WWE. Spot monkey or not, Hardy has nothing left to prove. As a midcarder he was getting better reactions than the WWE Champion, during his ME run the crowd was RIDDLED with Hardy signs and merch. He connected with the fans. In the world of pro-wrestling, that's an awful lot more important than being able to cut a promo because if the crowd doesn't care what you have to say, it's worthless. Punk could have cut those same promos on Kofi Kingston.....and nobody would have cared. The fans cared because he was cutting them on Jeff Hardy.

Hardy didn't need mic skills, all he had to do was get on the mic and scream and the crowd would go crazy. You don't need a well planned, well delivered promo when you can get the desired reaction. It's called doing more with an awful lot less and it's a skill in and of itself.

If you don't like Hardy or his character, that's fine. However, just because you don't like him doesn't make him a 'spot monkey who got lucky'. There's a reason post-Hardy CM Punk was a failure.

 

[Eyebrows]

To be honest I don't think Jeff is on anything more than alcohol or weed here and honestly it'd be much better if he was on the second than the first anyway. I know a lot of people look down on people that use weed and deride them as potheads but it's a hell of a lot better for you than alcohol. Most people just believe the hyperbole and propaganda that's been fed them and I have to say that I think it's Americans more than Europeans that seem to believe in that drug's 'evil'.

I'm not pleased with the video simply because I am a Punk fan so don't want to hear him put down but at the same time they can say whatever they want. If they are simply drunk at 5am talking shit then I can relate...I've done that many a time at university. I am a loser for that? Absolutely not...I'm just as healthy now as I was before I started university. A lot of my friends did weed, friends now on their way to becoming doctors, lawyers, businessmen...perfect well-adjusted individuals

For Hardy though, outside of this video, maybe you don't want to call him a fuck-up but the guy is on trial for drugs and though he'll probably get off fairly lightly it has the risk of a long prison sentence. The coke, soma, steroids he was caught with is not the same as drinking or smoking weed or even taking one quarter of E in your own home.

The wider debate here is that Jeff Hardy as a professional wrestler should have learnt from cases like Eddie Guerrero the dangers of drugs like steroids and somas (I think this is what he was caught with). In a sport that's PLAGUED with drug problems and premature deaths because of that Hardy should be a bit more savvy.

And he is a role model to kids, whether he likes it or not, that's how it's turned out. Pornstars, Eminem, Nirvana, Oasis or The Rolling Stones aren't. But like you say, it is Jeff Hardy's choice.

Caitiff, I commend you for being sober but you can't force that view on others. Personally, I think that someone like Jeff Hardy, a champion on national television, should be clean...but most of the guys on this forum who drink, dabble in recreational drugs or smoke are not like Hardy and won't get caught with a multitude of somas and anabolic steroids. They'll enjoy it in moderation.

Straightedgers aren't ****** for not trying anything new, that's just as ignorant as straightedgers telling people that all drugs/alcohol is evil. You don't need drugs/alcohol to enjoy yourself, and straightedgers know that. Trying something new isn't just drugs. You're being just as guilty as hardliners (not straighedgers) by saying that they should be doing drugs. Saying stuff like that makes you come across like the chavs in high school that think people who don't smoke aren't cool. Other people know the chavs aren't "bad people" for smoking, they aren't afraid to start smoking they just don't want to and that's perefectly fine.

And though others might think Caitiff is telling them what they should be doing (and honestly, it does come across like that a bit), I'm sure Caitiff feels pressure from society in general for drinking. How many times has someone said to you "Go on, just have one." I know that if I'd said I didn't drink at university I'd have gotten some strange looks and been labelled as differing from the norm. Peer groups etc. do influence propensity for drinking and doing drugs. I did my dissertation/thesis on it. So it works both ways in terms of people telling other people what they should and should not take.

CM Punk arguably was a failure post-hardy because of how he was booked as Undertaker-fodder.

 

[ilapierre]

Eyebrows: Good point above. Perhaps i was sounding a bit like a pusher. All i was saying though that people drink and do drugs and it doesn't make them evil. Jeff Hardy doesn't push it on his fans, and only dumb weak people will let their addictions get the best of them if they don't naturally learn how to moderate with their peers and evolve into well adjusted adults. A well adjusted type that are far too advanced for the entertainment lacking PG crap of the past decade.

 

[ilapierre]

Culantro: Do you live in Uranus?

Caitiff: Everything in moderation buddy. People who don't drink are *****es. People who drink way too much are *****es. And for the record people who like Transformers are mega *****es.

People who are too afraid of the consequences of alcohol and drugs indicate far more than not liking alcohol and drugs. It indicates your intelligence level, it indicates your complacency in life, it indicates you don't have the brain matter to like anything other
than PG pussy crap.

I'm not trying to assert authority to you. I'm just telling you what i think of people who act all holyier than thou when it comes to telling the truth and being a normal person. A normal person doesn't go through life as a straight edge. A kid can go through life from 12 to 18 like that, but if he doesn't grow up at some point and learn through trial and error, he'll get stuck watching PG wrestling and making ridiculous claims about people who sometimes drink and do drugs. You think people who do that are fuckups. Well i think people who watch PG WWE are fuckups.

TV commercials, ha, i don't drink anymore buddy and when i did it was in moderation. I didn't start either because of commercials. I had a social life and drinking led to fun and people being themselves. If you don't drink, you likely have a pretty lame social life like i do now writing on WZ forums. I'm straight edge, i've been that way for a good year but its not something i think about all day. I have an occasional drink but i don't get drunk nearly as much as i did. I just think people who brand alcohol and drugs as evil without even doing them are very out of touch with reality. I've been there, done that, and now i'm straight edge for the most part. That makes me less of a pussy than someone who never gains the necessary life experience needed to help a person moderate things. People who abstain from something long enough usually end up crazy drunks or hardcore druggies, people who moderate and try new things usually evolve into better human beings.

I don't completely dismiss people who disagree with me. I completely dismiss people who are nowhere near any level to be asserting an opinion as stupid as you about being a fuckup if you drink or do drugs. I have had many arguments on this site with people with really interesting opinions and advanced thought processes that have swayed my own. I like the argument posted above by Eyebrows, most of it sums up what i'm trying to say to you. But, really, the dumb shit i read from most of the know it alls here who have the whole world figured out by the ripe old age of 20? Their arguments i can rip to shit.

3 years, 3 months 17 days what? Is that when you think WWE starting sucking ass? I'd say times that by 3 and you'd have the official date of ass sucking. You stand against people who try to help you open your stubborn closed mind? Wow what a genius you are, you sound like you read a lot. Yah, everyone uses that line about falling into line like pathetic sheep. In fact, it was the line i felt like using earlier about all you WWE smarks. I see you the same way you see me buddy. Perhaps i could learn something from you if your argument wasn't so juvenile.

So you, as part of the thinking mass who love PG WWE and don't drink or do drugs because you are so much better than people who do, stand up to the unthinking masses of people who don't prefer to have their intelligence being insulted by PG WWE and drink and do drugs like their idol Jeff Hardy? Man, i don't know where you're going with all this, it's twice as pathetic if you ask me calling other people who don't agree with you sheep. Sheep are people like you who are misguided without a shepherd and need parental guidance to enjoy wrestling entertainment. Vince McMahon is your shepherd. You can't call me a sheep, cause i don't follow PG crap. I'm a journalist who analyzes real world matter and not only knows a great deal about the facts of the real world but i can also put it all together better and understand bigger, more in depth concepts than some douchebag wrestling fan who thinks they know everything. In my job for over a decade i've had to make sense of those facts to put the world into perspective for people decades older than me and now decades younger than. I've been the little punk disrespecting my elders, and man do i ever feel stupid with some of the dumbass shit i said back then because it was so naive of me to think i could at any age have it all put together. I've learned through dealing with older and more powerful people that the truth is never completely certain and that you have to be more tolerant of things you don't understand because you someday might come to best understand those things and like them. It's all part of growing up: When you're a kid you don't like adult stuff, you like kid stuff. But with age you naturally grow out of kid stuff and take on adult tastes. Some adults never make it to that stage though if their parents were also sheltered lame asses.

Anyway, most of my elders coulda put me in my place but didn't because they were tolerant of my stupidity. Thankfully people came along who called me out and helped me grow a set, and thankfully i got a real education so i could see how blind i had been in the work world after high school. Some kids here need a life lesson or ten because they are so sheltered and so hard headed about things like alcohol and drugs. I have experience, i have tolerated idiots on this site for so long, but some things need to be said in a just as juvenile tone to penetrate the stupidity. And i'm not a fuckup for living life: I successfully held a job as a journalist and i'm well respected by my boss and peers. I am someone with 8 years of university education with two of those at Oxford and on my way to becoming a Rhodes Scholar. I have had to present thesis' to high level history profs and university heads, i have been sought out by top universities and i've had many professors from different departments try to recruit me into studying their subjects. I'm a History/English major with Honours. I'm working on my Masters. I know the history of wrestling like the back of my hand. I have a minor in Sociology and i specialize in the field of social problems, which include alcohol and drug consumption. So it's not like this subject we're discussing is beyond my expertise.

Not that all that mentioned above makes me any more knowledgeable about wrestling, but it does signal that i might know a thing or two about what i'm talking about. But as the intolerant WWE smark you are, you'll stigmatize me as some dumbass sheep who watches commercials and becomes tricked into drinking and doing drugs and throwing my money and health away. Ha. Everything in moderation buddy, even calling people sheep you sheep!


And buddy, the unthinking masses are people who let their addictions get the best of them. They aren't people who drink or do drugs and moderate them with a healthy lifestyle. Good for you, you sobered up. You are straight edge now. It's made you a better person cause you're still alive and you know better than to go back to it. But what about kids who don't know better who deny doing so called bad thing in moderation in their younger years while their too busy being straight edge nerds? They aren't gonna stay that way forever because some no name like CM Punk told them to, and unless their hardcore Christians they're likely gonna rebel at some point in their evolution and become triple the alcoholic you were.

And not all casual drinkers and tokers need to become straight edge. Maybe you need to be because you have an addictive personality and can't control your urges. I don't, a lot of people don't, and the majority of people in the world are intelligent and unsheep-like enough to stay away from something if it threatens their life. That stuff does not threaten the life of someone who does not allow themselves to become addicted. And Alcohol and soft drugs are NOT anywhere near as addictive as hard drugs and normal cigarettes. If CM Punk was straight edge about smoking and hard drugs, good for him, if he's straight edge about having a drink or doing some weed then he's a wuss pandering to wusses having a hard time getting over things with low addiction levels. And no I don't want you to go back to a behaviour you have no parental guidance control over. No, i'm not pathetic, i'm all grown up and know how to look after myself without allowing addiction to get the best of me like some wuss.

Ric Flair having anything to do with CM Punk? Go read the point i was getting at and if you don't get it then just disregard it. I don't have any more time here to explain.
Ric Flair drank, partied, did his share of drugs and he turned out all right and the generations of kids he served as a role model for turned out alright for the most part.

 

[Caitiff]

Caitiff, I commend you for being sober but you can't force that view on others.

The closest I've come to "forcing a view" on anyone is to say that you shouldn't drive after drinking. I get the feeling that you misread what I posted, but I openly, and directly, said that I don't care what other people do with their lives.

Or, is the view I'm forcing on others to keep themselves out of my life? Seriously, man. At this point, Nikeo and ilapierre are saying, in no uncertain terms, that other people are, for whatever reason, not allowed to abstain from intoxication. I'm not saying anything about the people who do drugs, because I don't give a rat's ass about them. I care about my own life. Why do you guys have such a hatred for people who don't get drunk or high?

I said that drinking wasn't for me, and gave my reason why. If that makes me 'holier than thou," as ilapierre claimed, then he's definately got little to no experience with actual society. And, yes, ilapierre, I put down the bottle on August 7, 2007. If that means that I "kiss WWE's ass" in your eyes, then there's nothing I can say to change your mind. But, frankly, you really are a sorry son of a bitch. I hope, for the sake of the gene pool, that you never procreate.

Anyone who reads this, I have one question. Would you show that video to your 10 year old child, and tell your child that it's okay for him/her to get drunk or high, so long as they only doing it once in a while? We're not talking about being a role model for adults. We're all old enough to decide for ourselves what's right for ourselves. Role models are for children. And, like it or not, your kid's favorite wrestler/actor/athlete IS a role model, because that's what your kid, at some level, wants to be.

I don't give a shit about Jeff Hardy smoking, snorting, shooting, popping pills, drinking, or whatever the fuck he does. That's his business. But, when that message is pushed onto the internet, and placed for consumption by his youngest and most impressionable fans, then it draws my ire.

And, frankly, if there are any children that lurk on these boards, and read this thread, too many people just told those children, in no uncertain terms, that ANYONE who doesn't drink or do drugs isn't a worthwhile human being.

I don't have any children yet. I do, however, have 7 nieces and nephews, ranging in age from 6 to 20. I also have a 8 month old grand-niece. The 20 year old can do his own thing. He's an adult. But, if someone tries to get my 11 year niece or my 6 year old nephew to take a drag off the pipe, I don't know exactly what my reaction would be. I do know, however, that it would make that pusher doubt the existance of a just and loving god.

That's the message you guys are sending. That's the message Jeff Hardy is sending. And, to all of you, I have one question. "What the fuck is wrong with the lot of you?"


Edit: Can you find a video of Ric Flair, drunk or stoned off his dick, tellin the entire world that anyone who isn't like him is worthless? Because, that's exactly what Jeff Hardy did. That's exactly what you're doing on this message board. I really think that Eyebrows and Nikeo might understand that, and any differences we have is a misunderstanding. But, you, ilapierre, suffer from cranial-rectal inversion. Yes, I'm afraid you have your head up your ass. And, there really is no cure for that. I'm sorry.

 

[ilapierre]

Ok then Caitiff. I get some of what you're saying there (still completely disagree though about my initial point though). You're above argument is a lot more rational when it concerns how Jeff Hardy is not a role model for 10 year olds. I have a 10 year old step daughter and a 2 year old son. In fact, the 10 year old wanted to see what i was watching and i wouldn't let her. Because i knew Jeff Hardy would be swearing. But not all wrestling fans are little kids. A lot of fans are like me and want to be into it again but can't because the focus is too much for little kids. I want the adults on this site to unite and protest WWE until it changes. I'm tired of letting kid mentality direct wrestling, i'm a grown adult and i want to watch intelligent WWE programming. I don't want to have to watch TNA, but its more for adults and doesn't insult my adult intelligence as much.

Ric Flair has a proven track record as being a party animal. If you don't think he sounds like he's on crack most of the time in his interviews then how can you say that's what Jeff Hardy was on in his video. Flair sounds and looks 10 times as intoxicated as Hardy at all times!

I think the only person misunderstanding anyone's argument is you bud. There's all sorts of things you've quoted me as saying or trying to get at that i did not say or get at.

And really, no one hates people who don't get high or drunk. It's a bit nerdy to not try something because you think you'll instantly be addicted. I don't think it's nerdy to not try something because it absolutely doesn't interest you, as long as you don't become the polar opposite of a heavy drug addict and push your straight edge belief on other people. I never took a puff of anything till i was 24 because i was worried about getting addicted. Now that i'm past that i know i never will get addicted and there's no fascination with it. It's all out of my system, i've moved on. I don't drink or smoke anywhere near as much as my friends. But normal people do stuff like that and still are straight edge when it really unhealthy things like coke, heroin, or drinking hard every day which can all kill you. But what people do hate are people who act holier than art thou when it comes to making life decisions. Learn to tolerate others. You were a heavy drinker, under your definition you were a total fuckup till 3 years ago. I don't think you were, i think you got addicted and needed help and you were stronger than most people and came out of it on your own. But others can't, and most people don't have life threatening addictions. You must really hate Stone Cold Steve Austin now but 10 years ago I bet he was your idol. Stone Cold was the man, best character in the world, and he was almost everyone's role model. He was an AWFUL role model, but i think he might just be mine. I don't do the shit he does, but i want to. I don't do it though. Same goes with fans today with Jeff Hardy. They should be able to differentiate between what's right and what's wrong and how everything should be done, if its done at all, in moderation. People got to grow up in the real world and not in front of a TV. They need to apply the adult life experiences to the wrestling they watch and not vice versa. They don't need some propagandist like Vince McMahon and WWE telling them what's what. If 10 year olds 10 years ago were watching WWE they'd be told one story and 10 years later they'd be confused out of their minds being told another story. Drunk ass Stone Cold is your role model, now straight edge CM Punk is your role model. I bet it has turned this generation into a bunch of hypocrites with extremely contradictory arguments and that's why WZ gets so many hits from polar opposites completely disagreeing. .

Oh and when it comes to my kids, I would never say the shit i'm saying to you or posting here. I'm not an intolerant control freak who is going to tell them how they should live their life. I'm going to encourage them in a positive direction and try to
put the world into better context for them. They'll become who they become, i'll help mold them, but really if they end up smoking or drinking i'm not go ballistic and scare them with ******ed stories of addiction. I'm going to encourage moderation and keeping an open mind, and tell them that sound decision making is the best way to avoid dire consequences. One thing I will not encourage them to do is watch wrestling until they are old enough to be watching. And really the big leagues of wrestling, the WWE, should be targeting an older audience not children. If my kids watch PG WWE when i'm not around, so be it, i might think its bad for them like you think drinking and smoking is bad for adults, but they will probably find The Miz boring anyway and flip back to Spongebob.

 

[Caitiff]

Ric Flair has a proven track record as being a party animal. If you don't think he sounds like he's on crack most of the time in his interviews then how can you say that's what Jeff Hardy was on in his video. Flair sounds and looks 10 times as intoxicated as Hardy at all times!

And, therein lies the difference between in character and out of character. Acting overly hyperactive is not a sign of any drug use. Well, maybe one too many Red Bulls. And, Flair, to the best of my knowledge, has never advocated drug use to any of his younger fans, through either speech or action. Jeff Hardy does, on a pretty damn regular basis. Don't get me wrong, though. This "Icing" shit has got to stop.

And really, no one hates people who don't get high or drunk. It's a bit nerdy to not try something because you think you'll instantly be addicted. I don't think it's nerdy to not try something because it absolutely doesn't interest you, as long as you don't become the polar opposite of a heavy drug addict and push your straight edge belief on other people.

"If you don't drink, you're a pussy." That's the sum total of your last 5 posts. My Straight Edge belief is that I don't drink. I don't smoke. I don't do hard drugs. You saw the key word, right? The word was "I." As in "me." You know. First person. Wasn't describing anyone except myself. And, the entire point of that is, I don't give a shit what you do, just don't hurt anyone else. Or, is the "don't hurt anyone else" part what you object to?

You were a heavy drinker, under your definition you were a total fuckup till 3 years ago. I don't think you were, i think you got addicted and needed help and you were stronger than most people and came out of it on your own. But others can't, and most people don't have life threatening addictions. You must really hate Stone Cold Steve Austin now but 10 years ago I bet he was your idol.

I readily admit that I was a fuckup. And, I had to do something drastic to turn my own life around. Am I saying that what worked for me will work for others? Of course not. In fact, I've been saying the EXACT OPPOSITE, this entire time.

Steve Austin was never my role model. Believe it or not, my role model growing up was my dad. Well, and Hulk Hogan. But, outside of the drinking, I never had a problem with Austin's character. But, then again, to the best of my knowledge, he never had a DUI from his consumption on camera.

I'm not an intolerant control freak who is going to tell them how they should live their life.

No. You're content to simply tell complete strangers how to live their lives.

They'll become who they become, i'll help mold them, but really if they end up smoking or drinking i'm not go ballistic and scare them with ******ed stories of addiction.

Have I brought up anyone's addictions, other than my own?

If my kids watch PG WWE when i'm not around, so be it, i might think its bad for them like you think drinking and smoking is bad for adults, but they will probably find The Miz boring anyway and flip back to Spongebob.

So, smoking and drinking are good for you? I've seen my uncle's lung after the doctor's removed it, due to his emphyzima. It looks like a pile of dryer lint covered in roofing tar. Pardon me if I don't want that to happen to me.

But, you've been talking about "moderation" with booze. Yeah, I can understand that. And, for the first year after I quit drinking, I really did wish that I could just stop at one. But, after that year passed, that urge got a lot easier to deal with. Well, except for the people who keep trying to get me to drink with them. It's still not gone, and I have to work at it. But, that's my own personal issue. That's my journey with my Straight Edge. And, that's what I want for my life. Everyone else? Do what you do. But, let others do the same.

 

[mrbooker]

I love how people come on here and start questioning morals instead of talking wrestling. Before i state my opinion i will start off by saying im a HUGE fan of both Jeff Hardy and CM Punk.

With that said take away if you think hardy is high/drunk whatever you may think and look at what he said he made Cm Punk relevant.

Ask yourself when has CM Punk been any where near as popular or as over as Jeff Hardy

FACT CM punk won money in the bank then went on and became champion at the end of june and lost the title the first week of september and not even competing in match, Legacy jumped him, orton punts him and Jericho replaced him in the championship scramble does that seem like someone who is REALLY OVER, is that how you book your WHC on RAW your flagshipshow... CM Punk was given the ball and was not over enough to hold it, He had a title defense against JBL that was his first reign. That shows just how good CM punk was as a WHC, an shows just how not over CM Punk was as a face that he couldnt car a good feud or the title.

FACT CM punk wins money in the bank again and cashes it in against the 2nd biggest face in the company at the time Jeff Hardy. he retains the title 8 day later in a triple threat vs hardy and edge, at THE BASH he retains by DQ by kicking the ref by a "eye injury". Cm punk turns heel bringing in a real life scenario of being drug free and slamming the fans for supporting Jeff Hardy who as we kno is far from drug free. Hardy wins the title at night of champions. that leads to a TLC match at summer slam where cmpunk regains it. Then he beats hardy again in a cage match on smackdown at the end of August which get hardy "fired" from the company.

Hmmmmm i wonder whats the difference between both reigns its clear as day and that is that CM Punk needed someone to carry him and Jeff Hardy did just that he made CM Punk popular and relevant as a heel with a long back and fourth feud. Which would then lead to CM Punk feuding with the undertaker.

So his fist reign is short and ends with a dud where he forfeits the title in less then 3 months, and afterwards he goes and wins the tag titles with KOfi

and his second reign is a long feud with the 2nd biggest face in the company jeff hardy which turns him heel gets him over as a major heel, and follows up with a feud against the undertaker a WWE hall famer

Knock hardy all you want but he did make CM Punk relevant he did make CM PUNK a star, the fact that WWE was willing to but Cm punk in a feud with undertaker for the title is a testament to how over Hardy helped Cm punk become compared to his first reign.

you people need to learn your facts and stop putting you arguments out their like little kids who want to hate on hardy because he is in TNA, or because he does drugs, or whatever have you the facts are in the WWE programming and if you cant realize then you are not a wrestling fan you are simply a fan of one performer which means you are nothing but bias and have no business arguing a point because its illogical

 

[The Raven's Epitaph]

I love how people come on here and start questioning morals instead of talking wrestling. Before i state my opinion i will start off by saying im a HUGE fan of both Jeff Hardy and CM Punk.

With that said take away if you think hardy is high/drunk whatever you may think and look at what he said he made Cm Punk relevant.

Ask yourself when has CM Punk been any where near as popular or as over as Jeff Hardy

It isn't about CM Punk ever being as over as Jeff Hardy. The last time I checked, CM Punk wasn't the one calling somebody out whilst under some form of influence.

FACT CM punk won money in the bank then went on and became champion at the end of june and lost the title the first week of september and not even competing in match, Legacy jumped him, orton punts him and Jericho replaced him in the championship scramble does that seem like someone who is REALLY OVER, is that how you book your WHC on RAW your flagshipshow... CM Punk was given the ball and was not over enough to hold it, He had a title defense against JBL that was his first reign. That shows just how good CM punk was as a WHC, an shows just how not over CM Punk was as a face that he couldnt car a good feud or the title.

So what you're saying is that CM Punk wasn't over enough to have the World Heavyweight Championship for long, but it's still okay for Jeff Hardy to represent his own company by going around stoned/drunk and calling other businesses employees out? That's what it sounds like to me.

You're still forgetting that Jeff Hardy is not only shitting all over his company, but all over the industry. Wrestling already has a bad name with the media, what with speculation about use of drugs and other supplements. Once the media grab hold of material like that to work with, they're all over it like flies around shit. Jeff isn't really the 'good guy' right now, is he?

FACT CM punk wins money in the bank again and cashes it in against the 2nd biggest face in the company at the time Jeff Hardy. he retains the title 8 day later in a triple threat vs hardy and edge, at THE BASH he retains by DQ by kicking the ref by a "eye injury". Cm punk turns heel bringing in a real life scenario of being drug free and slamming the fans for supporting Jeff Hardy who as we kno is far from drug free. Hardy wins the title at night of champions. that leads to a TLC match at summer slam where cmpunk regains it. Then he beats hardy again in a cage match on smackdown at the end of August which get hardy "fired" from the company.

...I haven't got the foggiest where you're planning on heading with this. So far, you've gone completely off topic and started reeling off CM Punk's championship history, beforehand stating that you were 'HUGE' fans of both Punk and Hardy. So far, you haven't said one good thing about Punk.

Hmmmmm i wonder whats the difference between both reigns its clear as day and that is that CM Punk needed someone to carry him and Jeff Hardy did just that he made CM Punk popular and relevant as a heel with a long back and fourth feud. Which would then lead to CM Punk feuding with the undertaker.

CM Punk didn't need anybody to 'carry' him. Jeff Hardy didn't make CM Punk popular. CM Punk was in ECW to begin with, and after proving himself worthy of being a champion after gruelling matches there, he proceeded to feud with, then heel, John Morrison. After an amazing fued, CM Punk became the face, ECW Champion.

Already CM Punk had proven himself as World Champion material, and everybody knew that he was a brilliant wrestler. He's one of the greatest in-ring performers out there.

Still, you've gone completely off topic, so I'm assuming you're just going to keep flaming CM Punk. Funny, I could have sworn you were a HUGE fan of his.

So his fist reign is short and ends with a dud where he forfeits the title in less then 3 months, and afterwards he goes and wins the tag titles with KOfi

....Okay?

and his second reign is a long feud with the 2nd biggest face in the company jeff hardy which turns him heel gets him over as a major heel, and follows up with a feud against the undertaker a WWE hall famer

You already said this like 2 paragraphs ago. What are you trying to get at? All you've done is reel of Punk's accomplishments, flame him and confuse the hell out of me.

Knock hardy all you want but he did make CM Punk relevant he did make CM PUNK a star, the fact that WWE was willing to but Cm punk in a feud with undertaker for the title is a testament to how over Hardy helped Cm punk become compared to his first reign.

This is really rich.

you people need to learn your facts and stop putting you arguments out their like little kids who want to hate on hardy because he is in TNA, or because he does drugs, or whatever have you the facts are in the WWE programming and if you cant realize then you are not a wrestling fan you are simply a fan of one performer which means you are nothing but bias and have no business arguing a point because its illogical

We need to learn our facts? Did you not notice what this thread is about AT ALL? We don't hate on Hardy because he's in TNA. We don't hate on him full stop, we're merely discussing what an obnoxious waste of time he is. If you were paying attention to ANY of this thread, then you might have realised.

Oh..my mistake. I'm not allowed to be a wrestling fan because I like CM Punk and I don't like Jeff Hardy, the guy that goes around being addicted to drugs all the time and giving both his own business and the industry a horrible name. That sounds about right to me, point dexter.

Ah well, you gave me a good chuckle or two. What did we learn today kids?

mrbooker, is a HUGE fan of CM Punk, but all he did was flame him and talk about his championship accomplishments. He then proceeded to make himself look like an absolute arse on the internet, something he must have had experience in before.

Seriously, you made me lol.

 

[Eyebrows]

Like people have said in the Wade Barrett thread, it's called a rub. Hardy gave Punk steam as a heel persona but he didn't "make" Punk and it's arrogant to say that he did. The difference between Punk's first title run and his second was the booking. He was booked weakly in his first run but strong in his second. I'd say that's because a heel Punk clicked so well. He's been successful the past couple of years because he is a fantastic heel.

I won't say Hardy did nothing for Punk in that feud but I still think that CM Punk carried 75% of the mic work for that story. Hardy isn't and never has been good on the mic., though I'm quite enjoying his heel stuff at the moment...CM Punk's promos was the main reason that feud worked. Jeff Hardy was the perfect foil...the only foil the WWE could really have for that first Straight Edge heel since he was the only guy on the roster who the WWE could tap into his drug use.

Punk was pretty much buried by 'Taker also, the only reason they feuded was because it was the inevitable 'time to put the belt on Undertaker' period.

Jeff Hardy helped Punk with his heel turn and provided the perfect opportunity BUT he did not make Punk a 'superstar'...CM was well on his way to the top and this feud was just the catalyst. Hell, he was even over in ECW as Raven's Epitaph said.

And to be pedantic and risk calls of being a smarky, internet wrestling fan...CM Punk won his first World Title in Ring of Honor years before Jeff Hardy won his first World Title. I know that Ring of Honor is in no way comparable to WWE in terms of star power but that "FACT!" still remains. He's also a better wrestler than Jeff Hardy.

I'm a fan of both TNA and WWE by the way...I shouldn't have to qualify my posts with that just to try legitimise my argument to MrBooker.

 

[Sparky]

This thread is just one big flame fest.

I'm sure Jeff just did this for attention and to piss people off. Obviously CM Punk is 100% better then Jeff. Punk carried that whole fued. there is no way Hardy would of been as big of a champion by himself. his mic skills are fucking dreadfull, he puts no emotion into anything he does.

 

[MB1025]

It isn't about CM Punk ever being as over as Jeff Hardy. The last time I checked, CM Punk wasn't the one calling somebody out whilst under some form of influence.



So what you're saying is that CM Punk wasn't over enough to have the World Heavyweight Championship for long, but it's still okay for Jeff Hardy to represent his own company by going around stoned/drunk and calling other businesses employees out? That's what it sounds like to me.

You're still forgetting that Jeff Hardy is not only shitting all over his company, but all over the industry. Wrestling already has a bad name with the media, what with speculation about use of drugs and other supplements. Once the media grab hold of material like that to work with, they're all over it like flies around shit. Jeff isn't really the 'good guy' right now, is he?



...I haven't got the foggiest where you're planning on heading with this. So far, you've gone completely off topic and started reeling off CM Punk's championship history, beforehand stating that you were 'HUGE' fans of both Punk and Hardy. So far, you haven't said one good thing about Punk.



CM Punk didn't need anybody to 'carry' him. Jeff Hardy didn't make CM Punk popular. CM Punk was in ECW to begin with, and after proving himself worthy of being a champion after gruelling matches there, he proceeded to feud with, then heel, John Morrison. After an amazing fued, CM Punk became the face, ECW Champion.

Already CM Punk had proven himself as World Champion material, and everybody knew that he was a brilliant wrestler. He's one of the greatest in-ring performers out there.

Still, you've gone completely off topic, so I'm assuming you're just going to keep flaming CM Punk. Funny, I could have sworn you were a HUGE fan of his.



....Okay?



You already said this like 2 paragraphs ago. What are you trying to get at? All you've done is reel of Punk's accomplishments, flame him and confuse the hell out of me.



This is really rich.



We need to learn our facts? Did you not notice what this thread is about AT ALL? We don't hate on Hardy because he's in TNA. We don't hate on him full stop, we're merely discussing what an obnoxious waste of time he is. If you were paying attention to ANY of this thread, then you might have realised.

Oh..my mistake. I'm not allowed to be a wrestling fan because I like CM Punk and I don't like Jeff Hardy, the guy that goes around being addicted to drugs all the time and giving both his own business and the industry a horrible name. That sounds about right to me, point dexter.

Ah well, you gave me a good chuckle or two. What did we learn today kids?

mrbooker, is a HUGE fan of CM Punk, but all he did was flame him and talk about his championship accomplishments. He then proceeded to make himself look like an absolute arse on the internet, something he must have had experience in before.

Seriously, you made me lol.

It is funny because you are trying to break down his posts. Either you are an idiot or you are just doing this to be a jackass. Anyone can obviously see what he is saying. Punks first run was pretty bad in the WWE he had won and lost the title in a 3 month period while being a face. It wasn't until the feud with Hardy which got him to turn heel that made punk a star. Yes that is right it made Punk a star. Much like every bitching in the Wade Barrett topic about Cena making Barrett a star. Same thing happened here. CM Punk was better on the mic and in the ring, but without Jeff Hardy being so over with the fans a heel SES CM Punk doesn't get as over as a character.

I mean hey what has CM Punk done since then.

1. SES flopped big time. How many 2 on 1 or 3 on 1 matches have they lost?

2. Buried by the Undertaker

3. Jobbed to Rey Mysterio for months

4. Jobbed to Big Show for months


People are acting like CM Punk has just been steam rolling through the WWE and the fact is he hasn't. People who follow the WWE should understand it isn't about talent, but about entertainment and Jeff Hardy has done more for the WWE than CM Punk will ever do. Jeff Hardy maybe a B-Champion on a B-Show, but at least he hasn't been getting jobbed out to over the hill wrestlers on WWE's B-Show.

 

[MB1025]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPFcJLnhRTg

It starts at 1:07 and Matt talks about the entire video. When it was shot and where he was at when it happened. I am not sure if this will change anyones crazy has opinions on this but I thought I would pass this along because he talks about it for a little while.

 

[The Raven's Epitaph]

It is funny because you are trying to break down his posts. Either you are an idiot or you are just doing this to be a jackass. Anyone can obviously see what he is saying.

No, I was breaking up his posts because I obviously couldn't see what he was saying. Paragraphs are a wonderful thing, and quotes are there to be used. Got a problem with it? Use a different forum.

Punks first run was pretty bad in the WWE he had won and lost the title in a 3month period while being a face. It wasn't until the feud with Hardy which got him to turn heel that made punk a star. Yes that is right it made Punk a star. Much like every bitching in the Wade Barrett topic about Cena making Barrett a star. Same thing happened here. CM Punk was better on the mic and in the ring, but without Jeff Hardy being so over with the fans a heel SES CM Punk doesn't get as over as a character.

The feud with Jeff Hardy didn't make him a star. Most of his work with Hardy aren't even the highlights of his career. I much more remember the ECW feud with Morrison and the feud with Undertaker over the Breaking Point screwjob, leading to Hell in a Cell.

When Punk was rivaling against Hardy, all he was doing was fighting through the matches and keeping his title. The only memorable Hardy match that's worth mentioning is the one on Smackdown in the Steel Cage. How you believe that Jeff Hardy made CM Punk a star, I'll never know. Punk retired Jeff Hardy. CM Punk made himself a star by fighting through tons of people to get to where he was, and where he still is now.

On top of that, you've just made a stupid and contradictory post. Go re-read that Barrett thread about him 'not being over' and count all the people that completely disagree with the original post. Wade Barrett is over. Every night he's out there, he's booed by 15,000+ fans. If that isn't over, then I don't know what is because CM Punk and the SES recieved the EXACT same reaction every night. They were one of the most hated groups around.

I mean hey what has CM Punk done since then.

1. SES flopped big time. How many 2 on 1 or 3 on 1 matches have they lost?

2. Buried by the Undertaker

3. Jobbed to Rey Mysterio for months

4. Jobbed to Big Show for months

1. SES didn't flop, CM Punk didn't need them anymore. They were a brilliant and revolutionary group of gimmick characters that worked the angle excellently. As the story progressed, the SES messed up and CM Punk got rid of them. It may have been sloppy booking, but CM Punk was fine with or without them.

2. Everybody gets buried by the Undertaker at some point in their career, it's in his job description. Own everybody. He's the phenom and he's 18-0 at Wrestlemania for christ sake. Of course he's going to bury people.

3. He jobbed to Rey Mysterio? No, he lost matches against Rey Mysterio. Just because you lose doesn't mean you've just jobbed to somebody. It was part of the SES storyline anyway. If you look at it properly, it was a better way for WWE to book getting rid of the SES. CM Punk loses his power, takes his frustration out on his followers, they start screwing up, and the group falls to pieces. I take back what I said about sloppy booking, it was great.

4. Big Show is another Undertaker. Everybody has jobbed to Big Show at some point. Brock Lesnar, Kurt Angle, Triple H - the list goes on and on. He's 7ft 500lbs, he's a monster. Of course people are going to fucking lose to him. Big Show was another person involved in the downfall of the SES. He ran through them like a train. Why? Because that's what he DOES.

People are acting like CM Punk has just been steam rolling through the WWE and the fact is he hasn't. People who follow the WWE should understand it isn't about talent, but about entertainment and Jeff Hardy has done more for the WWE than CM Punk will ever do. Jeff Hardy maybe a B-Champion on a B-Show, but at least he hasn't been getting jobbed out to over the hill wrestlers on WWE's B-Show.

Jeff Hardy was good back in the day, but by the year 2002 he was ruined. He left and to my knowledge, didn't come back until 2006. What happened then? He left again after a short run with the tag team titles and the intercontinental title before coming back again in late 2007.

All Jeff Hardy will be remembered for in the WWE is jumping off a few ladders and injuring himself, putting himself out for even longer, returning countless times and having 1 or 2 good matches with the Dudleyz and Edge and Christian.

What will CM Punk be remembered for? Well, he won the Money in the Bank TWICE in a row. He started the revolutionary group that was the SES, He was the FIRST EVER Straight Edge World Heavyweight Champion, and he won it on MULTIPLE occasions, might I add. He was in a Hell in a Cell match with The Undertaker, and screwed him over the PPV previously and re-enacted one of sports entertainments most controversial real life angles, EVER.

He had an amazing start in ECW, and people already knew him from TNA and ROH. He became ECW Champion by having an amazing rivalry with John Morrison that most wrestling fans look back on and remember how good it was. He had his head shaven, despite him coming out worse and losing the match, people still remember it. He debuted himself a mask, that got people even angrier at him because they wanted to see him bald, giving him and the SES even MORE HEAT.

God damnit man, can't you see that CM Punk MADE HIMSELF and that's he's a hundred times better than Jeff Hardy? The LIST IS ENDLESS.

 

[johnbragg]

The feud with Jeff Hardy didn't make him a star

This is just wrong. During and after his feud with Jeff Hardy, Punk was one of the top guys in WWE, up there with Cena, Orton, Undertaker and Jeff Hardy in fan reactions and (probably) merchandise sales.

WWE pissed it away and sent Punk back into the fringe-main-event/upper-midcard pack, but Punk so far had his peak of popularity when he turned on and eventually retired JEff Hardy.

Jeff Hardy, known drug addict and fan favorite, was/is the ideal foil for Punk the Straight Edge heel.

The feud with Jeff Hardy didn't make him a star. Most of his work with Hardy aren't even the highlights of his career. I much more remember the ECW feud with Morrison

Most people aren't workrate smarks. The top of the card matters a lot more to most people.

and the feud with Undertaker
over the Breaking Point screwjob, leading to Hell in a Cell.

Oh, you mean where WWE destroyed Punk's momentum and put up neon flashing signs DO NOT CARE ABOUT PUNK. HE IS NOT A STAR. Instead of giving Punk a clean win over Undertaker to set up Punk vs Undertaker at Wrestlemania 2010?

1. SES didn't flop, CM Punk didn't need them anymore.

SES did flop. They flopped so bad that they were Future Endeavored. The purpose of SES was to give some of Punk's rub to GAllows and Mercury and Serena. That didn't work, and hurt Punk, because they were constantly losing 2-on-1 and 3-on-1 matches. (Thanks a lot, Creative!)

Jeff Hardy was good back in the day, but by the year 2002 he was ruined

The guy sure sold a lot of branded crap the last two years for someone who was ruined.

What will CM Punk be remembered for?

We don't know yet. So far he's had one good run at the top, against JEff Hardy. Hopefully he'll be back at that level, working with Cena and Orton and Miz and Morrison and Seamus and Barrett for the next 5-10 years. Then we'll see.

 

[Nikeo]

I'm finding the Punk marks SO damn funny. See, you keep touting Punk's talent and claiming it translated into success over time. It didn't. The Canadian fans turned on face Punk.....but they never turned on Jeff Hardy, even during a feud with Edge. That's not the ultimate indicator but I believe it to be an accurate indicator of Punk's connection with the fans: it wasn't there.

Punk's feud with Morrison WAS great, which I attribute more to Morrison's excellent turn, new character and innovative move-set. Punk, when he won the belt, grew very stale, very quickly. You gloss over the fact he was jobbed to Chavo...where's he now?

Whether you like it or not, Punk was a failure prior to Hardy during his title run (which McMahon considered so bad he didn't even trust Punk to drop the belt) and after Hardy with 'Taker, Rey, Show and the SES. You can be 'Taker fodder and still stay over if you've got a connection with the fans. EG: 'Taker/Jeff ladder match.

I find Punk marks to be absolutely hilarious, at least Hardy marks can admit Jeff's shortcomings on the mic. Punk marks, on the other hand, seem to try and blindly gloss over the fact that once Punk left ECW he was destined for the midcard, he was given every opportunity to succeed and he failed until Jeff Hardy brought him up to his level and allowed him to get over at Jeff's expense.

You say Punk's matches with Jeff weren't great? They were the matches and feud of Punk's career and he will never reach those heights again because any individual that has come out of two world title runs only to be thrown back to the midcard IS missing something. That something is someone to play off.

And by the way, whoever claimed to the contrary: CM Punk never got Hardy/Cena level ovations.

Jeff Hardy never needed CM Punk, the crowd loved him regardless and he sold so much merchandise that the WWE wanted to sign him to a merch deal while he was gone, not to mention his part time deal which was rumored to be better than 'Taker's. If CM Punk left in the morning, he'd be offered neither of those deals. That is an indicator as to how much money Jeff made the WWE.

Punk, on the other hand, needed and still needs Jeff Hardy to get over. The proof? The fact that after Breaking Point he had proven that nobody cares about CM Punk when his promos don't focus on Jeff Hardy.

Many people don't like Jeff Hardy, that doesn't bother me in the slightest. What bothers me is when people, because of this dislike, try to claim the guy is untalented, unsuccessful and 'just a guy who got lucky'. Jeff Hardy reached the top of the WWE on his own merit, by putting on amazing matches with Triple H, Edge and Orton. He had a connection with the crowd that I would argue nobody currently active in the E possesses. That is a lot more important than being able to cut a promo.

 

[LitasRevenge79]

Okay, I am equally impressed with both guys' talents. However, I think there are big time sour grapes on the end of Hardy Boys. I'm a little perturbed by Jeff calling out Punk on whatever he does in his off time, whether the allegations are true or not, so be it. Jeff, he's admitted his faults, fine, however, the timing on these videos by him and Matt seem a bit convenient, all these videos shooting down the people that they used to say were cool, until AFTER Matt was released by WWE, and then you also have Matt bringing up Lita AGAIN. You know, rub or not, I'm not sure, but if there is dirty laundry to be aired, I would think there's a better way to deal with it than talking about it on a video camera knowing the position you and your brother are in and the availability of the internet today. Given the fact if Punk and Lita may have any residual ill feelings from whatever may have happened from any fallout from this relationship etc that affected Matt, which you know would affect Jeff since they usually will stick up for one another, you don't see them taking to the net to call out anyone else, they are taking a higher road and staying quiet. I do find it kind of sad that them being of this age would choose to seek out this kind of attention to try to bring in more viewers for something like this, when in actuality it may in fact do the opposite and turn off people who considered themselves fans, and could possibly alienate their remaining friends they still had with WWE. Regardless of Punk's talent or the Hardys' talent, its about human decency, and doing the right thing. That old saying "If you don't have anything nice to say, then don't say anything at all."