That's such a ridiculous position. Those guys aren't superstars because they are HHH's friends, they are superstars because they are great.
No. Only ignorant and/or jealous people play that game.
If Randy Orton didn't have famous relatives and/or HHH's backing, would he be Champ?
- Thread starter Rich the UK WWE Fan 2k14
- Start date
Why is it ridiculous? You don't like to think it is that way, but it is.
Take Batista for example, he got a big push despite all the cons weighed against him. There are and were plenty of people with better ring skills and better mic skills. There are/were plenty of guys more over and plenty more marketable. WWE, just like many other companies is prone to politics and a certain degree of nepotism. I'm sorry to say that you're just naive or ignorant if you really don't think it happens.
Jeez, if you really think the only thing that matters is how good you are, i hate to break it to you buddy...
Batista, Randy Orton, Sheamus, all those guys had/have the crowd invested in them. That's all that matters. They had talent and were given the opportunity to be a superstar. They achieved success. Being friends with HHH had nothing to do with it. If anything, it shows that HHH has a pretty good idea on who can be a superstar. Is he right all the time? Of course not. Who can forget Shelton Benjamin. Or his thoughts on John Cena.
Sometimes it takes longer for other wrestlers to catch on, but they are given the opportunity and the ones who take it, never let it go. Talent always rises to the top.
WHO THE F**K CARES. So many dumb hater threads get created everyday. Would we have had The Rock if he didnt come from a wrestling family? what about Bray Wyatt? Would we have had Kurt Angle if he didnt win the olympics?
Not everyone has to go wrestle in gyms in front of 30 people for 10 years while doing 900000 moves in five minutes. Randy Orton is a great wrestler and would have been a world champion either way imo. This is just stupid.
BTW, how the hell would you succeed if you didnt have backing by people in high places (HHH) in the company? You think Vince didnt back Austin? Vince was practically in love with HBK but nobody says anything about that being the only reason he was successful.
Batista, Sheamus, Orton getting pushed because they are hhh's friends??? UM NO... how about its because they are big guys. You know the same type of guys that have always been pushed even before hhh had power, was a wrestler, or was even freakin born yet.
Not everyone has to go wrestle in gyms in front of 30 people for 10 years while doing 900000 moves in five minutes. Randy Orton is a great wrestler and would have been a world champion either way imo. This is just stupid.
BTW, how the hell would you succeed if you didnt have backing by people in high places (HHH) in the company? You think Vince didnt back Austin? Vince was practically in love with HBK but nobody says anything about that being the only reason he was successful.
Batista, Sheamus, Orton getting pushed because they are hhh's friends??? UM NO... how about its because they are big guys. You know the same type of guys that have always been pushed even before hhh had power, was a wrestler, or was even freakin born yet.
No, it's not. Not all wrestlers are created equal. Bad wrestlers will not be successful. It doesn't matter how hard you book certain wrestlers, if they are not deserving of being a superstar, the fans will not accept them.
Cons like an incredible look, very good ring skills, great charisma and a larger than life character?
Please understand wrestling if you're going to discuss it with me.
But there are not plenty of people who have all of them together.
Obviously not. If that were true, then why would Batista always be a main-eventer?
The WWE isn't stupid, they are not going to put in the main-event someone who doesn't draw well. This isn't junior high, where we go against our own self-interests because we're having a girl feud. This is the big leagues of wrestling, it is a publicly shared company...the WWE is going to do what makes the most money.
The WWE is far more driven by profits. They go with what they think will make money. They have a financial duty to shareholders to maximize their profits.
At the end of the day, you're pretending this is junior high school. It's not. This is a global wrestling promotion...they're going to do what makes money. Just because you are not privy to the information they have regarding drawing, it doesn't change the fact you're wrong.
Jeez, if you really think you understand anything about pro wrestling, I hate to break it to you pal...
Cats Pajamas
Serenity now!!!
Personally, Randy Orton has never been a top five guy for me, but I have to respect his hard work. HHH knows potential when he sees it and you would only have to assume that Trips position with the company didn't hurt the odds of guys like Orton, Batista, or Sheamus getting a genuine chance to shine, but definitely did not assure it.
Speaking strictly of Orton, a lot of credit should be given to him for improving and adapting his work every time his role changes. This is my own opinion, but his work since unifying the titles has been nearly as entertaining to me as anything I've seen in the past few years. Following Sin Cara's hush-hush departure, I'm inclined to believe that being a HHH guy can't be the sole driving force behind someone's continued success.
I can't speak on Orton's alleged backstage issues and how they've been handled as I have no known facts about the situation, but in my eyes Orton's position in the company fits him like a glove and his own dedication is an important piece of the equation. Take care, WZers.
Speaking strictly of Orton, a lot of credit should be given to him for improving and adapting his work every time his role changes. This is my own opinion, but his work since unifying the titles has been nearly as entertaining to me as anything I've seen in the past few years. Following Sin Cara's hush-hush departure, I'm inclined to believe that being a HHH guy can't be the sole driving force behind someone's continued success.
I can't speak on Orton's alleged backstage issues and how they've been handled as I have no known facts about the situation, but in my eyes Orton's position in the company fits him like a glove and his own dedication is an important piece of the equation. Take care, WZers.
Poop Master Flex
Mid-Card Championship Winner
In a technical sense probably not because the influence of wrestling growing up undoubtedly played a huge part in Randy Orton's life, I'm sure his dad, granddad and uncle wrestling had a lot to do with it, I'm sure his dad was able to use his connections to get him a shot in WWE but that's not what we are talking about here.
Removing his heritage from the equation these were known facts of Randy Orton coming in:
- He's 6'5"
- He has a tremendous physique
- Has a good look
Even if he had ZERO knowledge of wrestling, even if his father wasn't a wrestler he would have gotten a good, solid chance based of those attributes alone. Also you add in the fact that I've heard numerous wrestlers from William Regal to Arn Anderson that say Orton was the most naturally gifted athlete they've ever seen in a wrestling ring and that he had natural abilities most guys take years to learn. On top of that (and this one is HUGE in WWE) Randy Orton doesn't coast in the ring, with his character, and he always tries to improve. I've seen Orton since his very first match on WWE Television and one thing I've noticed about him is that through the years you could see him getting better in front of your very eyes and when he figured out his character there was no stopping him.
I often hear about guys like Shelton Benjamin, Dolph Ziggler and John Morrison, how they should have been the guys on top and although all 3 are good talents the one thing that is very noticeable with all of them is they didn't respond well when they got their shot in the main event scene, for whatever reason they didn't click as well as the company (or anyone really) would have hoped and when WWE came around and said "you need more work before you're back in the main event" they all seemed to stop trying hard and started to coast, their characters stopped growing, their mic work got stagnant, their matches were still alright but you could tell they were just going through the motions, only Ziggler has a shot now but its starting to look like he's gonna follow the same path set by guys like Morrison and Benjamin which is a shame. The same thing happened to Orton too but the difference is when he got his shot with top players and legends he responded well. In his program with Foley he was elevated immensely, his first main event title match at Summerslam '04 blew away everything else on the card, his feud with Triple H wasn't that good (but then again nothing Triple H did at that time was good), his feud with Taker was real good and his 3 way program with Mysterio in Angle at the beginning of '06 was good, a year after that it was obvious he was ready to take that final step and become a permanent top guy in the company.
I've seen Orton the most beloved wrestler in the WWE, I've also seen Orton the most despised wrestler in the WWE, that doesn't happen without having a buttload of talent to back it up and outside of maybe CM Punk there is no one on that roster that has the ability to go from beloved to hated as well as Orton can.
In regards to the current storyline I think Orton has played his part about as well as he could of, I don't think his current role fits him well but that's not his fault and he's doing as much as he can possibly do with it. It's not Orton's fault HHH and Steph have decided they are the top heels in the company and have essentially made Orton their errand boy.
All in all though Orton is at the top because that's where he deserves to be, even when he was doing NOTHING as a face he would still get one of the top 3 pops from the crowd every night, when you get to a point the audience cares for you without you doing anything then you're a very valuable commodity, couple that in with his looks, skill and overall knowledge of wrestling and you get a main eventer.
Removing his heritage from the equation these were known facts of Randy Orton coming in:
- He's 6'5"
- He has a tremendous physique
- Has a good look
Even if he had ZERO knowledge of wrestling, even if his father wasn't a wrestler he would have gotten a good, solid chance based of those attributes alone. Also you add in the fact that I've heard numerous wrestlers from William Regal to Arn Anderson that say Orton was the most naturally gifted athlete they've ever seen in a wrestling ring and that he had natural abilities most guys take years to learn. On top of that (and this one is HUGE in WWE) Randy Orton doesn't coast in the ring, with his character, and he always tries to improve. I've seen Orton since his very first match on WWE Television and one thing I've noticed about him is that through the years you could see him getting better in front of your very eyes and when he figured out his character there was no stopping him.
I often hear about guys like Shelton Benjamin, Dolph Ziggler and John Morrison, how they should have been the guys on top and although all 3 are good talents the one thing that is very noticeable with all of them is they didn't respond well when they got their shot in the main event scene, for whatever reason they didn't click as well as the company (or anyone really) would have hoped and when WWE came around and said "you need more work before you're back in the main event" they all seemed to stop trying hard and started to coast, their characters stopped growing, their mic work got stagnant, their matches were still alright but you could tell they were just going through the motions, only Ziggler has a shot now but its starting to look like he's gonna follow the same path set by guys like Morrison and Benjamin which is a shame. The same thing happened to Orton too but the difference is when he got his shot with top players and legends he responded well. In his program with Foley he was elevated immensely, his first main event title match at Summerslam '04 blew away everything else on the card, his feud with Triple H wasn't that good (but then again nothing Triple H did at that time was good), his feud with Taker was real good and his 3 way program with Mysterio in Angle at the beginning of '06 was good, a year after that it was obvious he was ready to take that final step and become a permanent top guy in the company.
I've seen Orton the most beloved wrestler in the WWE, I've also seen Orton the most despised wrestler in the WWE, that doesn't happen without having a buttload of talent to back it up and outside of maybe CM Punk there is no one on that roster that has the ability to go from beloved to hated as well as Orton can.
In regards to the current storyline I think Orton has played his part about as well as he could of, I don't think his current role fits him well but that's not his fault and he's doing as much as he can possibly do with it. It's not Orton's fault HHH and Steph have decided they are the top heels in the company and have essentially made Orton their errand boy.
All in all though Orton is at the top because that's where he deserves to be, even when he was doing NOTHING as a face he would still get one of the top 3 pops from the crowd every night, when you get to a point the audience cares for you without you doing anything then you're a very valuable commodity, couple that in with his looks, skill and overall knowledge of wrestling and you get a main eventer.
jacdnwarrior
Championship Contender
He is a great performer in the ring, he's okay on the mike, there has been worse but there have definitely been better out there in that department. His name has helped him get in but to be fair his talents helped him more so than his name.
But his attitude (if reports are accurate) has alienated some, he's had two strikes and those two things have sent performers out. So the important factor for his success, imo, is H's support. H has spoken for him and helped him immensely as a performer and now as an executive. Another problem is the main event roster isn't that great right now, it's razor thin and WWE is reluctant to push up other performers to the main event level. Punk was ok but not a huge success ratings wise, Sheamus is good but not great, Cena is overexposed in the position and Bryan, while having great crowd reaction, isn't a sure thing.
Orton is a great talent but he has a great friend in H backing him.
But his attitude (if reports are accurate) has alienated some, he's had two strikes and those two things have sent performers out. So the important factor for his success, imo, is H's support. H has spoken for him and helped him immensely as a performer and now as an executive. Another problem is the main event roster isn't that great right now, it's razor thin and WWE is reluctant to push up other performers to the main event level. Punk was ok but not a huge success ratings wise, Sheamus is good but not great, Cena is overexposed in the position and Bryan, while having great crowd reaction, isn't a sure thing.
Orton is a great talent but he has a great friend in H backing him.
Rich the UK WWE Fan 2k14
Pre-Show Stalwart
And that is my point, if almost anyone else had as many wellness violations and other strikes against their name, they would've been fired years ago, but because Orton is friends with HHH, he gets away with it.
No they wouldn't, not if they were a big star. Hell, assuming the CM Punk walkout is legit, McMahon would welcome him back tomorrow if Punk wanted to come back.
It has nothing to do with whom Orton is friends. It has everything to do with whether or not a wrestler can make the company money.