I totally agree with Roman

[THTRobtaylor]

This angle seems odd, because they are seemingly desperate to shoehorn Roman into the Austin position... where he and Vince will now have beef going forward when the logical thing is to be playing this to make Roman a heel champion after Mania.

More people will be "boo hoo Roman" than behind him, however "worked shoot" they go. The most laughable part of his promo was when he said "after all these years". He's been there 6 years at best... someone like Cena, Orton, Show, Jericho, even Goldust it would be believable and a KILLER moment to use that line but Roman? no... it just makes him seem the one who is whiny and entitled.

To be fair, he does seem to be doing FAR better than expected in carrying this angle on his own... but I think fundamentally people just DO NOT WANT Roman in that position outside of the WWE board. Even Angle's face betrayed a bit of "who is this jerk demanding shit?" rather than "I hear you..."

As to the lifestyle, at the end of the day you are joining a touring circus if you join WWE. You know that going in... the schedule is x days per year and you have to get from A-B-C back to A and then to D and perform/gym/sleep/have family time AND get to the next shot on time, all in those 7 days.

It's a lifestyle choice to take that on. Where some may have issue with Brock is he chose EARLY in his career to fight that norm, he demanded a bigger money deal than any rookie in history for fewer travel dates and got it because the potential he had meant it was worth it to Vince to offer him that. When he returned he got an even BETTER deal, but by then he was a former UFC World Champion, so of course he could demand a better deal.

At the end of the day Brock may be "entitled" or have been when he started but as with anyone in any walk of life, if you're that good or seen as the future of a business, you can ask for more/better than your peers and get it. It might not be THEIR norm, but it's yours... and why should you (or Brock) feel remotely bad about it? I had a similar situation in a job once, where I was on much more money than the rest of the team AND didn't do as many/had better hours... Did they hate me for it, probably, but ultimately I was worth that when I was hired and had the negotiation skills they didn't.

If Roman's gripe was remotely a shoot, then it'd be the equivalent of "If Brock could get this then and now, and Cena can, why can't I after 4 years headlining Mania?..." and Vince would laugh, along with the fans. It this is remotely real, then he is the next Warrior rather than the next Hogan... there are already signs of it.

Those who get the sweetheart deals are the ones with proven long term drawing ability and who have put themselves out for Vince over the years... someone like Jericho has put over endless talent over the years and does longer runs rather than odd appearances. Part of the reason he'd get the leeway he does is cos he would show up and put over Fandango in his debut, even when logic screams...don't do it... he is a team player who just isn't always there. Someone like Goldberg was worth the part time deal as he was an attraction. Ronda is worth it in terms of mainstream ability, her "full time deal" is in effect more dates than Brock, not every week on RAW/SD but it's likely she WANTED them.

Brock got a deal other's couldn't get in 2002 and he got one when he returned and re-signed... that's not entitled, that's good business... knowing your worth and value, having the balls to walk away from the table if you need to and having a wife who once sued Vince and settled for sexual is also going to help...as that will have given a big insight into how Vince does business. Is Brock a "team player" no... but he NEVER was, even as far back as 2002... he's not changed in any way, if that rankles with people or Roman? Boo hoo... It's no different to how Andre had the run of the place, occasionally someone will but heads like Jericho did...and Brock just smiles... not cos Jericho couldn't take him or "I'd destroy you" but because he knows he is untouchable...and always has been in that company, even from his first match.
.

 

[d_henderson1810]

This angle seems odd, because they are seemingly desperate to shoehorn Roman into the Austin position... where he and Vince will now have beef going forward when the logical thing is to be playing this to make Roman a heel champion after Mania.

More people will be "boo hoo Roman" than behind him, however "worked shoot" they go. The most laughable part of his promo was when he said "after all these years". He's been there 6 years at best... someone like Cena, Orton, Show, Jericho, even Goldust it would be believable and a KILLER moment to use that line but Roman? no... it just makes him seem the one who is whiny and entitled.

To be fair, he does seem to be doing FAR better than expected in carrying this angle on his own... but I think fundamentally people just DO NOT WANT Roman in that position outside of the WWE board. Even Angle's face betrayed a bit of "who is this jerk demanding shit?" rather than "I hear you..."

As to the lifestyle, at the end of the day you are joining a touring circus if you join WWE. You know that going in... the schedule is x days per year and you have to get from A-B-C back to A and then to D and perform/gym/sleep/have family time AND get to the next shot on time, all in those 7 days.

It's a lifestyle choice to take that on. Where some may have issue with Brock is he chose EARLY in his career to fight that norm, he demanded a bigger money deal than any rookie in history for fewer travel dates and got it because the potential he had meant it was worth it to Vince to offer him that. When he returned he got an even BETTER deal, but by then he was a former UFC World Champion, so of course he could demand a better deal.

At the end of the day Brock may be "entitled" or have been when he started but as with anyone in any walk of life, if you're that good or seen as the future of a business, you can ask for more/better than your peers and get it. It might not be THEIR norm, but it's yours... and why should you (or Brock) feel remotely bad about it? I had a similar situation in a job once, where I was on much more money than the rest of the team AND didn't do as many/had better hours... Did they hate me for it, probably, but ultimately I was worth that when I was hired and had the negotiation skills they didn't.

If Roman's gripe was remotely a shoot, then it'd be the equivalent of "If Brock could get this then and now, and Cena can, why can't I after 4 years headlining Mania?..." and Vince would laugh, along with the fans. It this is remotely real, then he is the next Warrior rather than the next Hogan... there are already signs of it.

Those who get the sweetheart deals are the ones with proven long term drawing ability and who have put themselves out for Vince over the years... someone like Jericho has put over endless talent over the years and does longer runs rather than odd appearances. Part of the reason he'd get the leeway he does is cos he would show up and put over Fandango in his debut, even when logic screams...don't do it... he is a team player who just isn't always there. Someone like Goldberg was worth the part time deal as he was an attraction. Ronda is worth it in terms of mainstream ability, her "full time deal" is in effect more dates than Brock, not every week on RAW/SD but it's likely she WANTED them.

Brock got a deal other's couldn't get in 2002 and he got one when he returned and re-signed... that's not entitled, that's good business... knowing your worth and value, having the balls to walk away from the table if you need to and having a wife who once sued Vince and settled for sexual is also going to help...as that will have given a big insight into how Vince does business. Is Brock a "team player" no... but he NEVER was, even as far back as 2002... he's not changed in any way, if that rankles with people or Roman? Boo hoo... It's no different to how Andre had the run of the place, occasionally someone will but heads like Jericho did...and Brock just smiles... not cos Jericho couldn't take him or "I'd destroy you" but because he knows he is untouchable...and always has been in that company, even from his first match.
.

If Brock can get away with that, then he can fuck off from WWE.

I hope he leaves from WWE and never comes back. He doesn't deserve to be in the Hall-Of-Fame either.

Back in 2002, Brock was on Smackdown EVERY WEEK. He featured in regular programs, and when he had the belt, he defended it at every PPV he was champion.

Maybe they shouldn't have had Roman go out there and say it, but someone needs to, and if Vince is okay with Brock's deal, then he needs to be called out as well.

The fact that you feel no guilt about getting for doing less at your work speaks volumes as well. Also, just because your boss is stupid enough to agree to it doesn't make it morally right.

Jericho gets the deal he does for the reasons he said, and also because he has other things outside of wrestling to persue, such as Fozzie. Jericho has some stroke and uses it as well, but he delivers when he comes back.

Goldberg got that deal last time because it was a promotion for WWE2K17, who he was the pre-order DLC for, so 2K the video game company making it paid Goldberg to appear in WWE for that stint, to promote the game. Goldberg came cheaply to Vince last time around.

Cena, Taker, Rock, Jericho...all of the ones on part-time deals give back more when they return and do more for WWE than Brock ever has. These guys do it part-time, but are invested when they are there. Brock acts like the whole thing is beneath him.

Maybe I am being too harsh. Obviously Brock Lesnar is a narcissist and a sociopath, so I shouldn't have expected more from him. I just hope he gets his one day, that karma pays him a visit.

 

[Vintage Punk]

Who cares if it was Roman or Joe Bloggs who said it, it doesn't change the point that Brock is a manipulative, self-serving knob who doesn't love the business, and doesn't respect or appreciate anything but his own massive ego. He is a bully who injures other workers, and doesn't care.

Roman shows up to work. Roman does all his dates. Roman drops the belt when told to. I don't see Brock doing that.

But then, you don't care, because you don't like anyone Vince puts up as "the guy". You probably booed Hulk Hogan too, back in the day. Or is only in later years you became a disrespectful smartarse? Yeah, because some guy in the crowd or in front of the TV who sits on his hands and acts like he is over it all, and knows better than someone who has been in the industry for years, knows who is better to push.

Who would you push to the top? Skinny Finn Balor? Someone vanilla guy like Roderick Strong? I bet if Finn said the same thing, you would lap it up, and agree with him. But because they had Roman said it, you instantly dismiss the point, because he said it.

I bet if he said that it was a sunny day during summer, you would say that it is cold and wet, because you can't bring yourself to ever give Roman credit, because Vince likes him.

If Roman was in NXT, when you all fawned over him, or when he was in the Shield, you would agree with him. But being the top guy is a no-no, unless it is "your" guy. Wrestling doesn't need people like you supporting it.

What you just said is complete and utter BS, however that may be your opinion. I simply stated my opinion. So let me run down some of your points since maybe a nerve was struck. In my opinion, I said Roman was a worker and I applaud him for showing up and doing all the shows and house shows but guess what, so do a lot of other guys like AJ, Rollins, Usos, Rusev, etc.

I don't care for Brock as champion and hate that it's been this long. I want to see someone else as champion. I agree that he probably is alot of those things that you said but Vince and management gave him that deal. It is what it is. I actually hope he stays gone for awhile as I am tired of Brock too.

However, I am tired of the Roman initiative. I'm not some mark that only wants indy guys in the same vein that hipsters think radio or mainstream bands suck. Actually, I think AJ, Rollins, Miz, Strowman-just to name a few should be pushed over Reigns. I always though Seth was the most talented out of the Shield. The problem is not Reigns as a person, just the way he is currently booked. They should've turned him heel at least after last year's Mania and then work on eventually getting him back to face down the line. I don't mind him as being a champion or one of the top guys, just book him correctly.

And no, I actually was a big Hogan fan growing up as a kid. Why? Because he was booked right and was cheered by most as a face. Hogan did not have thousands of people chanting "F*ck You Roman!" like Reigns did after Mania as a face. Lastly, I never said I knew more than those on who to book however, Vince has said many times that they listen to the pulse and wants of the crowd however, in the past few years with Roman, he must have turned off his hearing aid...Again these are my opinions and you have yours. Some will agree with me and some with you. It is what it is. Good day sir

 

[Deoxyribonucleic A.C.I.D.]

Then why have any of them show up then?

If it doesn't matter to you, then maybe all the other talent should just not show up until Wrestlemania then.

How dare someone be in love with wrestling, with the wrestling business. How dare someone love their job. But then, I suspect that you don't really care about your job, or about wrestling, so you don't get it.

I think there are many wrestlers who care about the others. They have to, since a wrestling match involves one wrestler trusting the other to execute their move properly, and protect them in the ring. It requires them caring about their opponent in real life, so that they don't injure them.

However, Brock injures other wrestlers, and I have yet to hear any indication that he apologized backstage afterwards.

Triple H works FULL-TIME for WWE. When he isn't wrestling, he is being C.O.O. of the company, learning the ropes to take over, and also plays a major hand in running NXT and the Performance Centre. That is like saying that Vince or Shane don't work full-time because they wrestle only occassionally. They are still there, and still contributing.

Orton has worked full-time, as far as I can remember, and he only misses because of injury (which he has had a few the last couple of years). I have never heard him recently no-showing events or only doing certain dates.

Undertaker doesn't work full time because he is semi-retired. He gets a Wrestlemania payday, and paid from a Legends contract. Taker did show up all the time when he was full-time, unless they are keeping him off screen for storyline reasons (like when Kane buried the American Bad Ass and Taker was kept off screen to return at Wrestlemania XX as the Deadman). Taker has knee, back and hip issues which restricts his movement, so it is a bonus to even get him doing any matches anymore. When Brock has stuffed knees, back and hips, and serves WWE faithfully for thirty consecutive years, then I will say that he deserves an Undertaker-type contract.

As for Cena, well, yes,he is doing movies, so isn't there all the time. But I thought you would be glad to not have him shoved down your throat any more. He also does outside stuff for WWE, and is an ambassador to some of their charities, like his involvement in "Make-A-Wish".

The most important thing is, none of them took time off when they were champion, and kept the title belt off screen. The only recent time one of them did this was Triple H winning at Royal Rumble and not showing up again until Wrestlemania 32, but there was only one PPV in between, so it didn't impact it as much.

I have a bigger problem with Brock doing it because he is Universal champion. He should show up full-time, at least while champion, or if he wants to do certain dates, he doesn't get to be Universal Champion. His choice. Having the belt off-air for months at a time is ridiculous, and cheapens the belt. If they had at least done the dual-brand PPVs every month during his reign, like they plan on bringing back after Wrestlemania, then at least you could cover it by having the WWE Title match be last the months Brock isn't there (I mean, we can rely on A.J. or Shinsuke to show up).

When Brock is running the company and putting in as many man hours as Triple H, wrestling whenever he isn't injured like Orton, still wrestling when his body is past it because he loves it so much like the Undertaker, or does as much for WWE in and outside for WWE like John Cena, then Brock can have whatever contract he wants, but he does none of these things, and has been given more than 90% of the roster has been allowed to achieve, and not shown gratitude, so he deserves nothing but disrespect.

He SHOULDN'T DO anything. Brock Lesnar isn't obligied to do anything. That's Lesnar contract. So you want Lesnar to work more days than his contract states. Go to Vince and say, "hey Vince I WANT TO WORK MORE for the same money".

Please..

As I said. Vince is the one disrespecting the bussiness and the model of work. Not Brock.

And hey, wanna know the reason Brock doesn't show up that often? It's called mystique and Vince has allowed Brock Lesnar to keep his mystique intact, cause Brock Lesnar is a "special attraction" in Vince's eyes. Plus, Brock Lesnar's character, CAN'T WORK UNDER A FULL TIME SCHEDULE. What were they gonna do? The roster only has a handful of wrestlers that Lesnar can beat. Brock Lesnar's role has always been: put Roman over. How do you have Lesnar be full-time? Where do you find the competitors for him to beat? How many people can he beat?

You can't.

 

[ShinChan]

"To my knowledge, no one has got four consecutive Wrestlemania main events".

Wrong. Hulk Hogan got 5 CONSECUTIVE MAIN EVENTS AT WRESTLEMANIA!

WM 5 v Randy "Macho Man" Savage
WM6 v The Ultimate Warrior
WM 7 v Sgt Slaughter
WM 8 v Sid Vicious
WM 9 v Yokozuna (in an impromptu match after Bret v Yokozuna)

So, even if you exclude the WM9 one, Hogan still made four main events (as in, last match of the night) at Wrestlemanias.

Triple H has had a WWE or World Title match (which counts as one of the main events) from WMX8 to WM22.

But don't let facts get in the way of your rant.

Also, if someone else more fitting to say it did, would you then concede that Brock is a lazy self-entitled piece of crap who is a stain on wrestling?

Like I said earlier, "To my knowledge". I never said that it's a fact, did I? I'm not an expert about knowing it all. Sorry for sounding like one, I guess. But It wasn't intended.

Now, you come to Hulk Hogan part. I can understand him getting so many main events. He's one of the best. Can you say the same about Roman Reigns? Not even close to being great. Let alone being compared to Hulk Hogan. When Hulk main evented, he was already a big name. One of the greatests. Roman Reigns isn't even comparable.

And no, that wasn't even a mini-rant. This one is. Mini.

And I won't call Brock that bad. But I ain't interested in seeing his matches anymore. That come rarely and when they come, it's all about German Suplex, F-5 and kick outs from Brock. Unless it's Roman Reigns. Not interested in that match up either.

 

[Sexcellence of Sexecution]

Okay, then, let me ask you this.

let's play hypothetical. Let's say it was someone like, say, A.J. Styles who cut the same promo on Brock Lesnar. A.J., who has done the hard yards, has the respect of the fans, is a hard worker, shows up all the time and pays his dues.

If it was him saying it, or Dolph, or Shinsuke, or one of the others you admire and respect saying it, instead of Roman, would you think that they are making a valid point?

The discussion is, does Brock deserve preferential treatment. It's not about Roman Reigns. Hell, I only mentioned Roman because he is the one in this storyline who cut the promo. I don't care who said it, I would agree with them, because I have thought that Brock has been selfish and entitled for years. All Roman said is what I have been thinking, and even if a wrestler I didn't like said it, provided he shows up every week himself, then I would still agree.

Roman is not the issue. It wouldn't matter what Roman said, you people would still hate him, because you choose to. That doesn't change the fact, the FACT, that Brock only shows up when he choses to, while others have to work every date or get fired, he gets paid more for doing less, and he injures others in the ring. That is the issue. Stop turning everything into a "Roman hate" discussion. Brock is the issue, not Roman.

(Mods, can you reprimand anyone who goes off-topic for the rest of this post, and talks about Roman, rather than the subject, and that is Brock Lesnar and whether he is entitled or not).

And of course, you completely missed the point.

My point was, THIS IS AN ANGLE. A story. A work. A ruse. You are meant to agree with Roman and hate Brock because of it. And it's clearly working. You've bought in 100%. Lesnar being entitled is part of the angle.

As for whether or not Brock legitimately deserves to have the deal he's got, that's irrelevant. He was a smart enough businessman to land the deal, and I applaud him for doing so. You're a mark, Brock Lesnar isn't.

Lesnar isn't "taking advantage" of the company, and if he was... good. The WWE has taken advantage of and exploited workers forever, if they get fucked in return once and awhile it's a good thing. Lesnar doesn't need them, at all.

The fact is that people cheer for Lesnar because he's legitimate. Not just a legitimate athelte, with legitimate combat sports credentials, but a legitimate character. A lot of guys pretend to be badasses that don't give a fuck, Lesnar actually doesn't give a fuck. He legitimately doesn't give a fuck. The WWE is a heel company, the people who devoutly cheer Lesnar are in a weird position where they hate the WWE and most of the product, but still pay tickets to go to events. I don't get it either, but there you go.

Another aspect of Lesnar's appeal is the universally recognized awesomeness of a big dude throwing people around like sacks of shit. Another part of it is nostalgia, as Lesnar is a holdover from another era when the WWE was perceived to be "not terrible." The truth is obviously that it was a completely mixed bag, both then and now, but perception is what matters.

So there's your analysis of why fans cheer for Brock Lesnar. He's legit, he doesn't give a fuck, he tosses guys around easily, he's unstoppable, and he's a major star from a time when Austin, Rock, Undertaker, Kurt Angle and others were also around. You don't have to agree with them, in fact you're now being encouraged by this angle not to, but that's why he gets the response he gets.

Also in the future, if you don't want people mentioning Roman Reigns, don't put his name in the fucking title of your thread. Chances are he's gonna come up.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

The OP and this thread started silly and hasn't let up. It's not as silly as the build for this main event WM match. I'm more interested in this thread than the build but it is silly all the same. There's not much you can do with Roman, he's milquetoast on the mic. He's also not a very good actor. If I were WWE I would just have Roman focus on the "prestige" of the title and his desire to have it not just for him but so that the fans that come to a PPV, a Raw, or even a house show in Bumblefuck, Rhode Island get to see it. I don't give a crap about the props that titles are but others buy in to that crap a lot more. He can also revisit the dig that Cena took at him about "If Roman did his job better, WWE wouldn't need Cena around any longer". He can talk about one way to give WWE a reason to think about paying Lesnar any longer is by beating him and taking the title. I think it would play better than this "Borck is a big jerk" stuff. Maybe throw in a stipulation that Brock loses Heyman's services if he loses.

I don't know. It all depends on how the match is going to end. If Brock is going to win, I guess this lame theme makes sense.

 

[THTRobtaylor]

If Brock can get away with that, then he can fuck off from WWE.

I hope he leaves from WWE and never comes back. He doesn't deserve to be in the Hall-Of-Fame either.

Back in 2002, Brock was on Smackdown EVERY WEEK. He featured in regular programs, and when he had the belt, he defended it at every PPV he was champion.

Maybe they shouldn't have had Roman go out there and say it, but someone needs to, and if Vince is okay with Brock's deal, then he needs to be called out as well.

The fact that you feel no guilt about getting for doing less at your work speaks volumes as well. Also, just because your boss is stupid enough to agree to it doesn't make it morally right.

Jericho gets the deal he does for the reasons he said, and also because he has other things outside of wrestling to persue, such as Fozzie. Jericho has some stroke and uses it as well, but he delivers when he comes back.

Goldberg got that deal last time because it was a promotion for WWE2K17, who he was the pre-order DLC for, so 2K the video game company making it paid Goldberg to appear in WWE for that stint, to promote the game. Goldberg came cheaply to Vince last time around.

Cena, Taker, Rock, Jericho...all of the ones on part-time deals give back more when they return and do more for WWE than Brock ever has. These guys do it part-time, but are invested when they are there. Brock acts like the whole thing is beneath him.

Maybe I am being too harsh. Obviously Brock Lesnar is a narcissist and a sociopath, so I shouldn't have expected more from him. I just hope he gets his one day, that karma pays him a visit.

Who are you to decide what is "morally right"?... By your reckoning it isn't morally right that ANYONE in your office earns more than anyone, based on their experience/time served/skills or can they F*** off cos they get more than you and had the balls to ask for and get it or get the annual pay increase and extra holiday cos they have been there 20 years while you've been there 2?

No... you have a boss, you have at least one co-worker on more than you doing a similar role in almost ANY place you can work, still you do your job at the rate you accepted, they do it at theirs.

Is Brock's deal any worse than Nash Hall or or Hogan's in WCW? where they could literally tank the show or choose to show up or not cos of Creative Control...and be paid a kings ransom to do so..,if another talent came in paid more than them they AUTOMATICALLY got a pay rise? Was it their fault for taking the deal or Bischoff's for offering it?

Is it any worse than allowing Undertaker to show up in terrible shape once per year and earn a full year's money? Is Taker a sociopath and in need of karma for that?

As to me having "guilt"... no mate... Everyone has the right to negotiate, if I can and you can't...I'm not going to feel guilty about that... likewise if I need reasonable adjustments to do my job cos of disability.

It might seem "I get" extra to you like a guaranteed parking space or a guaranteed two days off together/fixed hours on a rota system... that's not a perk, but a necessity and a legal right... if I am worth more in terms of salary even with that than a co-worker in terms of experience or skill isn't my fault, nor something "guilt" should EVER be felt for. You have a messed up view on the world if you get so angry over Brock's deal... I guarantee you someone at your job will be deserving of your version of karma if you are serious.

 

[d_henderson1810]

What you just said is complete and utter BS, however that may be your opinion. I simply stated my opinion. So let me run down some of your points since maybe a nerve was struck. In my opinion, I said Roman was a worker and I applaud him for showing up and doing all the shows and house shows but guess what, so do a lot of other guys like AJ, Rollins, Usos, Rusev, etc.

I don't care for Brock as champion and hate that it's been this long. I want to see someone else as champion. I agree that he probably is alot of those things that you said but Vince and management gave him that deal. It is what it is. I actually hope he stays gone for awhile as I am tired of Brock too.

However, I am tired of the Roman initiative. I'm not some mark that only wants indy guys in the same vein that hipsters think radio or mainstream bands suck. Actually, I think AJ, Rollins, Miz, Strowman-just to name a few should be pushed over Reigns. I always though Seth was the most talented out of the Shield. The problem is not Reigns as a person, just the way he is currently booked. They should've turned him heel at least after last year's Mania and then work on eventually getting him back to face down the line. I don't mind him as being a champion or one of the top guys, just book him correctly.

And no, I actually was a big Hogan fan growing up as a kid. Why? Because he was booked right and was cheered by most as a face. Hogan did not have thousands of people chanting "F*ck You Roman!" like Reigns did after Mania as a face. Lastly, I never said I knew more than those on who to book however, Vince has said many times that they listen to the pulse and wants of the crowd however, in the past few years with Roman, he must have turned off his hearing aid...Again these are my opinions and you have yours. Some will agree with me and some with you. It is what it is. Good day sir

My point that you most don't get is, this is not a Roman Reigns thread. I actually was worried it would deteriorate into that.

However, it was Roman onscreen who said it. I would have preferred of some of the guys you named, one of them had said that during a feud with Brock. Roman may be the last person who is entitled to say it, but this is the storyline they are going with.

If you want to sound off on Roman, go right ahead, on one of the hundred other threads about him. I want you all to get past Roman saying it, and get to the real question I want answered:- Is Brock Lesnar lazy and entitled, or not, and what do you think of that.

Some of the posts here have made it a "Do you agree with Roman or not" rather than "Does Brock get special treatment?"

Also, even if you hate or anyone else hates Roman Reigns, you can still agree with him on something. You can still think he makes a good point.

Roman said that many of the locker room think the same thing. I would like to know if that is true, and others should be asked, or one of them should have cut the promo instead.So pardon me for getting heated, as people have to go off-topic, rather than stick to the question I want answered.

 

[d_henderson1810]

Who are you to decide what is "morally right"?... By your reckoning it isn't morally right that ANYONE in your office earns more than anyone, based on their experience/time served/skills or can they F*** off cos they get more than you and had the balls to ask for and get it or get the annual pay increase and extra holiday cos they have been there 20 years while you've been there 2?

No... you have a boss, you have at least one co-worker on more than you doing a similar role in almost ANY place you can work, still you do your job at the rate you accepted, they do it at theirs.

Is Brock's deal any worse than Nash Hall or or Hogan's in WCW? where they could literally tank the show or choose to show up or not cos of Creative Control...and be paid a kings ransom to do so..,if another talent came in paid more than them they AUTOMATICALLY got a pay rise? Was it their fault for taking the deal or Bischoff's for offering it?

Is it any worse than allowing Undertaker to show up in terrible shape once per year and earn a full year's money? Is Taker a sociopath and in need of karma for that?

As to me having "guilt"... no mate... Everyone has the right to negotiate, if I can and you can't...I'm not going to feel guilty about that... likewise if I need reasonable adjustments to do my job cos of disability.

It might seem "I get" extra to you like a guaranteed parking space or a guaranteed two days off together/fixed hours on a rota system... that's not a perk, but a necessity and a legal right... if I am worth more in terms of salary even with that than a co-worker in terms of experience or skill isn't my fault, nor something "guilt" should EVER be felt for. You have a messed up view on the world if you get so angry over Brock's deal... I guarantee you someone at your job will be deserving of your version of karma if you are serious.

Actually, I think pay scale should be paid the old fashioned way- by who works harder.

If that was the case in WWE, then Brock would be at the bottom of the pay scale, as he does less work for WWE than anyone.

Doesn't it piss you off that Brock was the one to end the Streak, rather than some newbie or someone who needed it, like Bray Wyatt, Finn, Shinsuke, A.J. or one of the others that you like? It could have made them, instead Brock got to do it, when it does nothing for him.

Yeah, Hogan and Nash got those deals, and WCW went under as a result. Vince should learn from this. It's a stupid practice.

Taker worked harder over the years, being on the shows every week for 20 years and he only wasn't on when he was injured, or taken off screen to be repackaged. He only does Wrestlemania now because he is banged up, and he gets it due to his loyalty and the fact that he chooses to come back for another Wrestlemania match every year when he has to.

I bet he doesn't have a contract either, but gets paid per Wrestlemania. He might also still get merchandising rights, money for appearing on the video games and maybe a Legends contract.

He is like the elderly worker who worked for the company for years, and now is semi-retired, but works a couple of days a week for you still because he loves work and the company, so he keeps coming in rather than retire. You look after guys like that, if you can.

When Brock sticks with WWE for 28 years without leaving, is banged up due to years of performing for WWE, keeps coming back to Wrestlemania each year out of loyalty and love of the sport, then he can get an Undertaker-like contract.

If I want to continue the work analogies, Brock is more the guy who does the bare minimum at work, is careless with his work, makes it all about himself and watches the clock, since he can't wait to leave, but gets looked after by the company because his father and the boss play golf together, so the entitled son gets a blind eye turned to him.

I bet Brock is counting down the minutes until his contract with WWE is over, and he can go back to UFC. He has never shown a love of wrestling, but just uses it.

You don't understand, because you obviously don't love your workplace or the people you work for or with, or you would work together with them for a common goal, rather than look out after yourself only.

 

[d_henderson1810]

The OP and this thread started silly and hasn't let up. It's not as silly as the build for this main event WM match. I'm more interested in this thread than the build but it is silly all the same. There's not much you can do with Roman, he's milquetoast on the mic. He's also not a very good actor. If I were WWE I would just have Roman focus on the "prestige" of the title and his desire to have it not just for him but so that the fans that come to a PPV, a Raw, or even a house show in Bumblefuck, Rhode Island get to see it. I don't give a crap about the props that titles are but others buy in to that crap a lot more. He can also revisit the dig that Cena took at him about "If Roman did his job better, WWE wouldn't need Cena around any longer". He can talk about one way to give WWE a reason to think about paying Lesnar any longer is by beating him and taking the title. I think it would play better than this "Borck is a big jerk" stuff. Maybe throw in a stipulation that Brock loses Heyman's services if he loses.

I don't know. It all depends on how the match is going to end. If Brock is going to win, I guess this lame theme makes sense.

You say that Roman isn't great on the mike, nor a good actor.

The funny thing is, many of the same people who boo Roman now loved him in NXT and when he was in the Shield. They even booed when Batista eliminated him in the Royal Rumble in 2014, disappointed that Roman didn't win.

You ONLY turned on him when dirtsheets revealed that Vince was going to push him to the top. It was Cena all over again.

It boils down to this. You just choose to boo whoever builds as "the guy" because it isn't "your guy". He wants muscle-bound guys who actually look like heavyweight champion, you want flippity flop guys who wrestled in Japan, and can get blown over by a gust of wind. The skinnier the wrestler, the more you want him as champion, to go the opposite to Vince's "big man" fetish.

It is you people thinking as fan you are far more important to the wrestling landscape than you are. WWE can't say it, because they need your money, so I will say it. Sit down, watch and shut up. No one cares what you think. WWE have your money, because you bitch and moan, and yet you still buy their product, even for the sole purpose of bitching on this site about it. You are the fools because you complain, but refuse to walk away. if you don't want Roman as champion, then boycott WWE. Don't attend shows, and boycotts sponsors of WWE as well. That will get the message across more than bitching on wrestlezone.

But most of you will do nothing, because you like to complain. You don't want WWE to succeed, because it would then give you nothing to complain about, and therefore make you feel better about yourselves.

 

[blueskyy]

Just so that this doesn't get any more off topic that it already is, it's a worked shoot. Brock Lesnar is only required to fulfill his contract obligations. End of story.

They are going with this angle right now, because even for guys like John Cena who are a wonder at doing promos, cutting a promo one-sided with an opponent who really isn't there is kinda tough, kinda like the one time when John Cena had a Wrestlemania match with The Rock, and John Cena had to do most of the talking while The Rock would appear occasionally via "satellite".

Although far from perfect, I think it's a reasonably good move by the Creative. First, it would burden Roman Reigns less when it comes to cutting the promos all by himself. Second, it's another opportunity for him to play baby face, to win some of the casual fans over. But the thing is, ironically, many believe that "Vince's Boy" is non other than Roman himself.

Think about this for a second, why is it that some people feel that Shinsuke Nakamura is all so great, but by the same standards, are of the opinion that Roman Reigns sucks?

 

[George Steele's Barber]

You say that Roman isn't great on the mike, nor a good actor.

The funny thing is, many of the same people who boo Roman now loved him in NXT and when he was in the Shield. They even booed when Batista eliminated him in the Royal Rumble in 2014, disappointed that Roman didn't win.

You ONLY turned on him when dirtsheets revealed that Vince was going to push him to the top. It was Cena all over again.

"Stop making my thread about Roman you jerks". - You

I turned on him when he was given a major singles role and started doing a terrible job with his promos. They were boring, hokey, and poorly delivered. Three years later he still rarely connects with his promos.

He just doesn't entertain me.

It boils down to this. You just choose to boo whoever builds as "the guy" because it isn't "your guy".

Why would anyone cheer for someone they don't enjoy. That would be stupid.

He wants muscle-bound guys who actually look like heavyweight champion,

Like Brock Lesnar?

you want flippity flop guys who wrestled in Japan, and can get blown over by a gust of wind. The skinnier the wrestler, the more you want him as champion, to go the opposite to Vince's "big man" fetish.

Big men like Brock Lesnar?

It is you people thinking as fan you are far more important to the wrestling landscape than you are. WWE can't say it, because they need your money, so I will say it. Sit down, watch and shut up. No one cares what you think.

Says guy who started thread complaining about the chosen champion on WWE's premiere brand.

WWE have your money, because you bitch and moan, and yet you still buy their product, even for the sole purpose of bitching on this site about it. You are the fools because you complain, but refuse to walk away. if you don't want Roman as champion, then boycott WWE. Don't attend shows, and boycotts sponsors of WWE as well. That will get the message across more than bitching on wrestlezone.

I referred to the championship as a prop in my post. Do you really think I care too much who holds it? I just want to be entertained.

But most of you will do nothing, because you like to complain. You don't want WWE to succeed, because it would then give you nothing to complain about, and therefore make you feel better about yourselves.

Would you feel better if Brock stayed champion so you could create more threads bitching about him?

The biggest complainer in this thread is you. Others are just complaining about your jaded view of business, which actually seems to be mostly based in some alternate reality where Brock Lesnar kicks puppies. Or maybe it is solely in some bizarre anger you have against him for ending the streak.

 

[d_henderson1810]

"Stop making my thread about Roman you jerks". - You

I turned on him when he was given a major singles role and started doing a terrible job with his promos. They were boring, hokey, and poorly delivered. Three years later he still rarely connects with his promos.

He just doesn't entertain me.



Why would anyone cheer for someone they don't enjoy. That would be stupid.



Like Brock Lesnar?



Big men like Brock Lesnar?



Says guy who started thread complaining about the chosen champion on WWE's premiere brand.




I referred to the championship as a prop in my post. Do you really think I care too much who holds it? I just want to be entertained.



Would you feel better if Brock stayed champion so you could create more threads bitching about him?

The biggest complainer in this thread is you. Others are just complaining about your jaded view of business, which actually seems to be mostly based in some alternate reality where Brock Lesnar kicks puppies. Or maybe it is solely in some bizarre anger you have against him for ending the streak.

I wouldn't have a problem with Brock as champion if he is there every PPV defending it.

Roman Reigns could be the most entertaining guy in the world on the mike, and put on 5 star classics, and you would never embrace him, because he is Vince's boy and isn't a skinny guy who wrestled in Japan.

You know what, Brock Lesnar doesn't entertain me. He does the same type of match every match, gives little to his opponents (even when them having some offence is believable e.g. He pinned Braun Strowman after ONE F5, when it should have taken four or five to finally beat him), and he needs someone else to talk for him, since he has a voice of a six-year-old girl.

You bag Roman, but Brock isn't any better in the ring or on the mike.

 

[Psykohurricane55]

The funny thing with Roman Reigns is that without ever knowing it, the fans that supposedly hated him, did exactly what WWE wanted. The fact is, WWE wanted a new tweener guy like Cena to prove that fans could react the way they wanted and it was o.k. So Adult males fans don't like Reigns so be it, we're going to push another big man down their throat to get them to cheer what we want them to cheer, That's why They did the whole Strowman vs Reigns feud last year. They use the fans hatred for Reigns to push the other pet project of Vince to the same audience that hated Reigns because he'S ''vince's project''.

The fact is Reigns is a money making machine for them and the realize damn well they he's not going to please everybody, yet he's selling more merchandise then anybody else not name John Cena.

As far as what they are doing right now between him and Lesnar, it's a smart move. Everybody has been bitching about how Lesnar doesn't show up at every PPV to defend the title while other guys are busting their ass every single week. So why not turn this into a storyline, that makes sense and Reigns is cutting some of his best promo's of his career right now through this so i don't have a problem with this at all.

But i agree with the WWE line of thinking about Lesnar, He's a major star and he shouldn't be on tv every week or defending the title at every PPV. He's a special attraction and he should be treated as such. In the end, this is the perfect way to get the male audience that don't know why they hate reigns anymore to actually cheer him at mania, because they found something that these fans hate more then Reigns being push and that'S Lesnar not showing up to defend the title every month.

 

[Very Average]

First post ever, gotta start somewhere.......

Brock is awesome, but for me he should either be full time or leave.

He (along with other old stars/part timers) make today's best look weak and it hurts the WWE.

As much as I hate having two World titles (and the Universal belt in general), this is likely the main event of Wrestlemania, and the build up has so far consisted of one 5 minute segment where they have both been there. Apart from that it has been Roman Reigns quite rightly calling out Lesnar with some retort from Paul Heyman.

Whilst it's only one example, look at the build up to arguably the best PPV ever, WM17. Rock and Austin were there every Raw AND Smackdown, building an already established rivalry starting off with a 'respect' for each other and gradually changing to Austin becoming obsessed with the title which culminated in his heel turn. Pure brilliance. This, not so much. Even the WM18 main event build up with Triple H, Steph, their dog (and that guy Jericho who was the 4th most important part, as the UNDISPUTED CHAMPION no less) was better than this.

This is a part of why WWE will never be as good as when it was WWF. Not the only reason but still a reason.

 

[therockiswwf]

The funny thing with Roman Reigns is that without ever knowing it, the fans that supposedly hated him, did exactly what WWE wanted. The fact is, WWE wanted a new tweener guy like Cena to prove that fans could react the way they wanted and it was o.k. So Adult males fans don't like Reigns so be it, we're going to push another big man down their throat to get them to cheer what we want them to cheer, That's why They did the whole Strowman vs Reigns feud last year. They use the fans hatred for Reigns to push the other pet project of Vince to the same audience that hated Reigns because he'S ''vince's project''.

Strowman. Vince liked him. Pushed him. He got booed. Improved. Not booed anymore.

The fact is Reigns is a money making machine for them and the realize damn well they he's not going to please everybody, yet he's selling more merchandise then anybody else not name John Cena.

And?

As far as what they are doing right now between him and Lesnar, it's a smart move. Everybody has been bitching about how Lesnar doesn't show up at every PPV to defend the title while other guys are busting their ass every single week. So why not turn this into a storyline, that makes sense and Reigns is cutting some of his best promo's of his career right now through this so i don't have a problem with this at all.

Because this was already done ad nauseam with Cena.

But i agree with the WWE line of thinking about Lesnar, He's a major star and he shouldn't be on tv every week or defending the title at every PPV. He's a special attraction and he should be treated as such. In the end, this is the perfect way to get the male audience that don't know why they hate reigns anymore to actually cheer him at mania, because they found something that these fans hate more then Reigns being push and that'S Lesnar not showing up to defend the title every month.

I hate Reigns because they don't portray his character in an interesting way.

I wouldn't have a problem with Brock as champion if he is there every PPV defending it.

Roman Reigns could be the most entertaining guy in the world on the mike, and put on 5 star classics, and you would never embrace him, because he is Vince's boy and isn't a skinny guy who wrestled in Japan.

Strowman. Not a skinny guy. Vince's boy. Cheered like crazy.

You know what, Brock Lesnar doesn't entertain me. He does the same type of match every match, gives little to his opponents (even when them having some offence is believable e.g. He pinned Braun Strowman after ONE F5, when it should have taken four or five to finally beat him), and he needs someone else to talk for him, since he has a voice of a six-year-old girl.

You know what, Roman Reigns doesn't entertain me. He does the same type of match every match, gives little to his opponents (even when them having some offense is believable e.g. He pinned John Cena after ONE [not counting table spot] spear, when it should have taken three or four to finally beat him), and he needs someone else to talk for him, since he has a tendency to mess up a lot.

You bag Roman, but Brock isn't any better in the ring or on the mike.

When you are not good on the mic, you have to have something special to make up for it. Brock has by being a very scary human being. He doesn't need mic skills.

Oy vey you two are something else.

 

[Navi]

I don't like Lesnar having the belt either. Doesn't mean I want Reigns to be champ either, but the belt should be defended at least on every PPV no matter who's holding it.

Lesnar can piss off to UFC or stay around doesn't matter to me, just get the belt off of him. It's been a total waste of a year in my opinion. Actually wrestling has gone so far downhill I haven't watched a RAW or SD in close to a month now. Probably not going to bother with Mania either as the main event is already spoiled. I just have close to zero interest in it right now.