Does Being A Bad-Ass Face Equal Gigantic Success?

[Ferbian]

Let's look at the primary and incredibly popular faces from the past 20 years of WWE. We have The Rock, Austin, Brock Lesnar, Triple H, John Cena, Batista and Randy Orton just to name the incredibly over guys.

And what makes them all so special? They're not the normal face. Sure they're all about fighting the bad guys and all that. But on one side they're all this kind of hard-noses kind of face.

John Cena is the kind of never give up never back down never say no to a challenge type of guy. He has his moments where he gets all worked up and angry. He's not exactly the ever loving type of face that Hulk Hogan was that always appealed to the crowd. Sure John appeals to the crowd, but he has that bad-ass attitude in there.

Austin was generally considered a tweener, who'd kick everybody's ass no matter who you were. And it got over. He were careless and trash talking and he was one of the biggest stars in wrestling ever.

The Rock was generally trash talking and much like Austin careless.

Triple H pretty much adopted much of his heel moniker and made it face. He doesn't take shit from anybody and you can be pretty convinced that he'll kick your ass if you piss him off (Look at Triple H vs Randy Orton 2009, hardly the pure face Triple H displayed)

Brock Lesnar.. Well he beat up everybody that got in his way and decimated them to bits.

Batista did exactly like Lesnar, got over for kicking peoples ass and he was also the brutal animalistic kind of wrestler that he originally got over as a heel for.

Randy Orton.. Well we all know he's more of a tweener, but he's cheered as fuck by the crowd.

All of these wrestlers, and probably more haven't displayed the ever loving face character that panders to the crowd and only care about what the crowd wants. No, they've all had some kind of self placed kind of face character.

And they're all some of the most popular superstars of WWE history.

So, does being a bad-ass face, or a face like tweener if you will, automatically make you popular?

 

[Kaneanite]

I'd say it does because it's so appealing to the crowd. And you have to keep in mind that creative probably only gives that type of gimmick (face like tweener) to those who really deserve it and can cause a commotion. All those guys have one thing in common - they have the look. "The Look" is not a myth, it's just hard to define. Those are some of the most talented wrestlers the WWE has seen (well I wouldn't say Batista but I like him nonetheless).

So I'd say it's a combination of great talent along with that gimmick. I honestly don't think everyone could pull it off just given the face-tweener.

 

[The Crock]

There's definitely something about being a bad-ass gets guys over, and I'm glad I'm not the only one noticing the trend. We, as wrestling fans have always been pulled into following guys like that for one reason... They're interesting. They're not just the regular old bland face or heel, they have multiple dimensions to their character. It's fairly logical isn't it? The fans want more versatile guys to be the main guys of the company, they want the product to be able to evolve, they want the product to change with the times yet still remain appealing to them.

The guys that you put on this list are just perfect, they fit the mold exactly. Sure, sometimes you might get slightly bored of one of these guys, but they're still the main man in the WWE. Here are my personal reasons as to why some of these guys succeeded as bad-asses.

The Rock - First came on to the scene as Rocky Maivia, bored the fans to death. Came back as a heel and slowly developed his character into what we know remember him for. He used to entertain the fans whether he was a heel or a face, he, similar to Cena, never backed down and was always getting into some kind of trouble.

Stone Cold Steve Austin - He was a blue collar bad-ass, a nice contrast to The Rock's superstar type persona. He would drink beer in the ring and generally raise hell whenever he was around. He was against authority, a rebel, he probably did things that some fans dreamed of being able to do... So they became rabid fans and followed him as loyally as they could.

Brock Lesnar - Lesnar, for a majority of his career, played a heel... And played it very damn well. He wasn't a heel for his whole career though, he played this bad-ass face, did great with it too. Lesnar was way different than the other two I've already mentioned. He was just a wrecking ball, an unstoppable force. It makes perfect sense to me why he was so huge during his time in the WWE. The fans love guys who can just dominate, look at Kane when he had just debuted: The crowd tried to hate him, but he just entertained them too much. This was the case with Lesnar as well. Brock is also a spectacular athelete, so he was able to do things that men his size generally weren't supposed to be able to do.

Triple H - The Game has been a bad ass for nearly his entire career, save for a few years in his early days, and it has always worked. Whether as a member of DX or as a solo competitor HHH has always been able to evoke emotions out of the crowd. He just has the right look about him, it just works for him. Remember a few years ago when he just destroyed Orton in his home? The fans loved it! Same as they love anytime he pulls out his sledgehammer and kicks some ass.

John Cena - What can I say, Cena is a superstar he knew how to pull this off... Props to him. Cena really epitomized this in his early days, right around his first WWE Championship run, and still shows flashes of it today. He beats the hell out of people, shows no mercy, and the crowd goes crazy. It takes true talent to be able to pull that off.

Batista - Remember right around when Batista left Evolution? That is when he really became a badass. He destroyed Flair and HHH, put them through tables, hit them with chairs, and then at 'mania he destroyed HHH and became WHC. This launched him into superstardom. I think it worked especially well just because it had been vs the most hated heels of that time, but regardless Batista's bad ass persona worked.

Randy Orton - To this day Orton is still running with the bad ass gimmick, and he is getting cheers that rival Cena's. Orton has the right body language, reminds me of SCSA at times. Hell, even in his early days as a superstar the fans loved him when he was being a bad ass... Especially when he had split off from Evolution during his first run as WHC.

So, in the end, although these guys have shown how well being a bad ass can work, it doesn't mean guaranteed superstardom. These guys were a rare combination of having all the traits and being over with the crowd. They're once in a lifetime superstars, to be honest.

 

[Fire Marshall Bill]

It really all depends on the wrestler honestly. Randy Orton didn't get all these cheers as a tweener. He got them as a heel and they turned him based off of that popularity.

Guys like The Rock, Austin and Lesnar, well that's the kind of era they were in. The Attitude Era was bred for tweeners if you really look at it. A John Cena type superman character would've gotten booed off stage before he was able to get as big as he is now.

Triple H also benefited from the Attitude Era, but has evolved along with the PG era. He's still a badass face as you say, but he also does a lot of childish comedy to appeal to the kids out there.

In general, all faces who are built up well by WWE are going to be cheered. Obviously they have to be liked usually to get built up well enough to be that big of a face, but other things go into it. The look alone has a great deal. Would someone like Batista have been cheered so much if he wasn't 300lbs of solid muscle? I doubt it. Plus, look at John Morrison. He's not some badass face...yet. And I think part of that has to do with the fact that he can't be one cuz of his lack of mic skills. Mic skills go a long way in determining how much you are liked.

So no, I don't think it automatically get's you to very popular. If you're someone with the build of Evan Bourne, good luck with being a successful badass face. Or with the mic skills of John Morrison. You just need those things to make it. But you are right in how it's the best route to making it to one of the elite guys. You just have to be able to pull it off first.

 

[mikenance]

There are also some other wrestler's that have/had the bad-ass gimmick but fizzled out. X-Pac for example. He was hot with DX there for awhile along with his WCW stint. Although he lived the bad-ass gimmick too. I don't think you can classify him as being a gigantic success.

Booker T was hot in WCW and during the beginning of the invasion angle with WWF but he didn't go very far.

I always like Razor Ramon, Yo chico! His bad-ass face went to WCW and that one worked.

I think it depends on the storyline(s) involved. The Mr. McMahon character is a perfect example. Mr. McMahon screwing everybody out of a title helped developed his character. You don't do things the Vince McMahon way you are screwed.

Mike

 

[Whippersnapper88]

Your missing one of the best badasses in WWE history. Should, he may not have been a giant, nor do I like what happened at the end of his life, but Chris Benoit was a complete badass, and he was loved by WWE fans (until the end that is). Seriously, I would much rather face men like Cena, Orton, Rock, and Austin before I would have ever wanted to step into the ring with Benoit...

As for the question, yes, the be a top face in WWE, you really do have to be a real badass. If you're loved but not a badass (Hurricane, Shelton Benjamin, etc), no matter how many good matches you have, it will be tough to break into the main event...

 

[Derf]

I agree with what your saying, but the other way around. Being badasss don't make you a huge success, you already have to be a success before you can be badass. Name me one legit badass that didn't get over. You can't, because if they wern't over before, they didn't become a badass, they became a jackass.

Once your a success, you can do just about anything "badass" and get over for it, and the list isn't limited to the guys you name. Almost all the World Champions in the past few years had some bad ass to them. Khali was a badass in that he just fucked peoples shit up (for the first few years) CM Punk managed to look badass, dispite his gimmick almost implying he was the opposite, even Rey Mysterio, the little tattood luchador who went all in, no matter what he had for cards.

My roomate and I just tried to think of someone that tried to be badass and didn't get over, and the only one we could think of was Shark Boy impersonating Austin. Bad ass don't equal success. We tried to think of a success that wasn't a badass... we drew a blank.

 

[Dowdsy McDowds]

So, does being a bad-ass face, or a face like tweener if you will, automatically make you popular?

An interesting topic for discussion, just wondering if the Brothers of Destruction fit into this, or just Taker maybe?

I think the initial storyline can have a huge impact on how the wrestler develops as they continue over the years. I remember seeing Brock run into the ring from the crowd, F-5 someone then just bail after he made his point. There was a lot of build up and then he faced Rock at SummerSlam where I was hoping Rock would put him in his place which wasn't the case. After that, Brock had a fantastic run at being this unstoppable force that no-one seemed to be able to get the upper-hand on.
So I think when he started to turn, there was maybe a sense of relief that he'd start kicking someone other than the face wrestlers' asses all the time. To a lesser extent the same was true with Kane; rips a cage door away, brings up fire, tombstones the frigging Undertaker and continues a destructive run for a while, but when he switched he got a good reaction too.

 

[Dzone]

Agreed but there is a reason for it; type of era, crowd reaction, their look and such. But I wanna just say something about the Triple H comedy pieces, they are hilarious and I sure as hell wish WWE tried making the number of talking promos as they did in the Attitude Era in this PG one all based on jokes. I seriously do believe WWE is missing out on one thing and this happens to be the one thing. An example being, when I saw Edge "getting rid of all stupidity" I was like FINALLY I GET TO SEE MORE FUNNY PROMOS. Yes, I am a wrestling fan and I hate people who become great with just pure mic skills but I also do enjoy watching stupid random promos --> theres just something great about them.

 

[douce1973]

Wrestling fans love "Characters" period.

It's the generation's attitude and that defines what character's they cheer for and boo. Fans will cheers anything they see that they would want to do themselves. Post WWII it was beating the shit out of anyone who displayed a Nazi or Japanese symbol. The 50's/60's and 70's it was the superhero gimmick, which ultimately culminated with the Hogan Era.The Attitude Era gave us the "I'll do whatever I want to... too whoever I want to" phase - which was way over with the fans because they basically got bored of the black and white hat version of wrestling that they've been watching the 30 years previous.

These days it seems to be the "I do evil things to evil people" type of thing that's getting over these days.

 

[Undertaker the 5th]

I think it does make them more interesting to the crowd. People want someone with an attitude that won't let others bully him. They want to see someone get pissed and kick the shit out of another wrestler once in a while.
One of the reasons I think I like Kofi Kingston is because of what he did to Randy Orton. Sure he didn't beat him clean in a fair one on one. but he did kick the shit out of him once on Raw. I was really excited because of that. That and the promo he did in Orton's new car. That made him look like a bad ass to me and me like him.

 

[Wolf Pac]

It's funny cause 5 of my fav wrestlers are badasses (Austin, Rock, Taker, Angle, Samoa Joe), so I guess yeah.

Maybe in the WWE it does as was the case with Austin, Rock, Taker, HHH, Cena, Orton etc. TNA not so much cause after Samoa Joe's World Title reign, they hardly do anything with him but then again Kurt Angle has always been TNA's top guy but I'd would use Joe as an example as not all badasses gain gigantic success but I dont think it's Joe's fault, TNA just dont know how to handle any of their stars right. Badasses just need the right company to gain huge success like ROH, who Joe was THE man of for years before he left & WWE of course.

 

[TheGamea]

TRUE it has to be look at Orton, anyone that watched orton when in was evolution well post evolution and got the belt noticed he was loved but not like he is now, even months before he regained the belt, I mean this is amazing the way the crowd loved him and he isnt even really a face

 

[Nada]

As a kid, you might remember a time where you thought that Luke was amazing and that stupid evil Vader needed to die and Han Solo needed to shut up and help Luke win !!!1!one!!

But at some point, you started hating the little goodie too shoes Luke and liked Han Solo for being cool, relaxed and not taking things seriously. Vader stopped being evil and just became awesome, look at him! He chokes his own men!


I think that happens to kids, especially males, when you start liking villains or just badasses more than the cookie cutter good guy. Its not just reflected in wrestling, look at movies and tv shows, videogames.

Every hero in a video game today is some scruffy guy with a dark past and personal problems and a thirst for violence. In the 80's it was some italian fat plumber with a stache and Hulk Hogan with his prayers and milk drinking.

Dark Knight was a huge success because even Batman was allowed to be a badass, and Joker was even a bigger badass


But it does not guarrantie success, everyone was a so called badass in WWF Attitude era, but you kinda need charisma and talent to make it work, Test and Bad Ass Billy Gunn did not work as well as Stone Cold Steve Austin or Undertaker.