So I guess Vince has really lost it

[Kodo Sawaki]

Lost it? Its brilliant bussiness move.

Vince wins on publicity alone even if Brock loses. Not to mention if Brock wins and then anyone who challenges Brock at Summerslam will look like million dollars. Anyone who even dares to challenge Brock would be ultimate badass. Not to mention if you beat Brock after that and you can claim that you bested legitimate fighting star. Plus it was always one of Vince's dreams that WWE can be called legitimate fighting and not just sports entertainment. This is one way to do that dream.

 

[Dave]

Obviously Brock winning his fight is a great thing, but losing isn't likely to be of much detriment to his presentation in the context of WWE, even if it does bruise his ego on a personal level.

Do you believe that WWE will suddenly stop presenting him as dominant in the WWE environment, stop protecting him in matches by showing how strong he is, even if he loses those matches, stop having Paul Heyman build him up as invincible, even if that involves using the standard exaggerations and fabrications, and so on?

Hopefully he wins, but if he loses then WWE wil likely twist things and use that to their advantage as it gives more reason to have Brock (in character) be angry and take out that anger on whoever, which actually helps continue with or add to his WWE persona. If fans have some sort of negative chant about how he lost, tapped, out, or whatever, it's another thing that WWE would probably twist.

It's not that the WWE will stop presenting it, it's that no one will believe it any more. And if anything, it's going to make other people look bad when they see Brock Lesnar repeatedly beat WWE talents to a bloody pulp.

 

[Woodstuff]

A lot of you dweebs seem to really not understand the meaning of the world 'mistake'.

Seeing a lot of ******s talking about how Vince has no idea what he's doing, and that WWE will be out of business in the next 10 years (lol). Anyone care to elaborate?

Because the truth is, this brings eyes to the WWE product, further legitimizes a member of the WWE roster, improves the working relationship between the two companies, and probably keeps Brock Lesnar happy to stick around WWE. He clearly want to continue fighting in UFC, so Vince is letting him.

If we see a big UFC name appear on WWE TV, does that mean UFC is going out of business?

Morons.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Allowing Brock to fight in the UFC? Really? What good does this do for the WWE? What if Brock loses? Some people are saying this is a trade of some sorts so expect to see Rhonda Rousey at Wrestlemania. Rhonda Rousey? Rhonda Rousey is a woman and women will never draw a dime. This a huge screw up by Vince. I honestly see the WWE going out of business in five to ten years.

There's almost certainly something in this for WWE, otherwise Vince wouldn't have allowed it to happen. If Lesnar loses, so what? It's not like Lesnar has ever been viewed with great esteem in the eyes of many MMA fans and win or lose, this will generate a lot of buzz.

You truly come off as stupid saying that Ronda Rousey doesn't draw. Before making such statements, you should do a little research so you wouldn't come off looking like moron of gargantuan proportions. These are the UFC ppv events she headlined or co-headlined:

UFC 157 - 450,000 buys
UFC 168 - 1,025,000 buys
UFC 170 - 340,000 buys
UFC 175 - 545,000 buys
UFC 184 - 600,000 buys
UFC 190 - 900,000 buys
UFC 193 - 1,100,000 buys

She's been the biggest draw in mixed martial arts for the better part of 3 years and you think she can't draw and WWE, a company that had fairly close to $700 million in revenue for 2015 will be out of business in 5 years? Shut the fuck up.

 

[Dysturbed]

It's not that the WWE will stop presenting it, it's that no one will believe it any more. And if anything, it's going to make other people look bad when they see Brock Lesnar repeatedly beat WWE talents to a bloody pulp.

Regardless of what fans believe, if they don't translate those beliefs into reactions (meaning that they still still cheer or boo him as they always have) then it won't really matter. That's why the presentation on WWE's end can still be important in attempting to at least temporarily change any negative perception that some people may have if he loses. If done good enough, sometimes fans look past their own pessimism. I do know that they often don't though. It's a wait and see thing when it comes to this unique situation

He lost his last two UFC fights in the first round then his first match in his return to WWE (even though he should have probably been allowed to beat Cena), and it didn't negatively affect anything in regards to people buying into him. Sure it's years later, the past isn't always a predictor of the present or future, and at that point fans were just happy to have him back whereas now he's been back for years, therefore making things different. However, it isn't unprecedented for a lot of the cynical by nature WWE fans to sometimes overlook things when in arenas and buy into things in the moment, even if those same fans don't overlook them when pondering over things on forums like this.

.

 

[Messiah]

Right, the women in WWE don't draw a dime, none of them.. but Ronda would.. People love this women for some reason.. She's perhaps the biggest draw in UFC since Lesnar left.

Lesnar was humiliated in his last UFC fight against Overeem.. I see him being humiliated again... but him losing won't hurt his WWE credibility whatsoever, because WWE is not in the same league as UFC.. Just Lesnar competing in UFC is big for WWE.. It's not like it will hurt them unless Lesnar gets injured in the fight.

 

[Dysturbed]

You truly come off as stupid saying that Ronda Rousey doesn't draw..

He's admitted that he makes trollish topics for fun and that they don't express his true opinions.

 

[drobs85]

Right, the women in WWE don't draw a dime, none of them.. but Ronda would.. People love this women for some reason.. She's perhaps the biggest draw in UFC since Lesnar left.

Lesnar was humiliated in his last UFC fight against Overeem.. I see him being humiliated again... but him losing won't hurt his WWE credibility whatsoever, because WWE is not in the same league as UFC.. Just Lesnar competing in UFC is big for WWE.. It's not like it will hurt them unless Lesnar gets injured in the fight.

Overeem did not beat him straight up. Lesnar was out almost a year, and Reem kept hitting him in his stomach as he knew that was the only way he would win. Lesnar had no business getting in there with those issues. Plus Reem tested positive for roids not long after that fight. I think Vince really did not have a choice. No one really knows what Lesnar was able to master up in his deal.

 

[MERPER]

A lot of you dweebs seem to really not understand the meaning of the world 'mistake'.

Seeing a lot of ******s talking about how Vince has no idea what he's doing, and that WWE will be out of business in the next 10 years (lol). Anyone care to elaborate?

Because the truth is, this brings eyes to the WWE product, further legitimizes a member of the WWE roster, improves the working relationship between the two companies, and probably keeps Brock Lesnar happy to stick around WWE. He clearly want to continue fighting in UFC, so Vince is letting him.

If we see a big UFC name appear on WWE TV, does that mean UFC is going out of business?

Morons.

"dweebs"

"******s"

"morons"

Are you 9 years old? Please do us all a favor and get an education before making such an ignorant comment again.

Mature people can make a point in a debate without using elementary-school level vocabulary.

 

[SoulTrain4]

The facts are thus: this doesn't benefit Vince one bit.

Let's take the arguments presented and debate:

1) WWE can use the mainstream credibility.

No it can't. WWE has had real fighters on the roster numerous times before and nothing has changed. Wrestling is still seen as fake carny stuff. That will not change whether Brock wins or not.

2) WWE can use the promotion.
But they don't NEED IT. WWE is called "the machine" for a reason. They have a substantial promotions budget. If you were watching UFC 200 to see Brock the likelihood is that you were either 1- going to watch Summerslam anyway or 2- you weren't going to watch Summerslam anyway. Brock winning or losing will not effect whether most people watch Summerslam.

3) Brock wins - Great he looks like a monster and draws more money for Vince later.
Maybe true but that also means Vince has to PAY him more on the next contract because his value increased. It also gives Brock the option of going back to UFC when his contract expires.

4) Brock Loses
How do you justify his superpush if the dude gets busted up im UFC while under contract to you? How can you look at your roster - who he has used as a punching bag for 4 years and justify that? If you're Dean Ambrose you carried a feud by yourself was forced to job in a match you got nothing out of only for Brock to go job to some chump in UFC and kill his aura. If your Cena or Undertaker how do you feel if Brock gets beat and does benefit the BUSINESS YOU WORK IN? Makes no sense.

5) Brock gets hurt
A likely scenario. If you're Vince you have to justify to your shareholders that you allowed a top guy in the company to work somewhere else where he got hurt and cannot meet obligations to your company.

Do you think the Cavs would let LeBron just do whatever he wants? No. Brock is an investment, a substantial investment and to not have access because of reckless behavior FOR ANOTHER PROMOTION shows incompetence.

6) Dana White lets Ronda do Wrestlemania
So? Lol i mean its that simple.

Ronda is not important enough to risk cutting the legs out of most of the roster. To argue that Ronda is a draw is irrelevant Because she has ZERO history in pro wrestling. Again, real fighters have been under contract before and it never mattered.

The people who would watch WM will watch it whether Ronda shows up for not. People forget, UFC has its own fanbase that WILL NOT watch WWE no matter who is on it and vice versa. Ronda will not bring in any extra viewers.

So how does this benefit WWE?
How does this benefit the wrestling fan?
It doesn't. Its just Brock doing whatever he wants wasting everyone's time.
Whether he wins or loses is secondary to the stupidity of allowing such an asset to endanger himself. Which leads me to

7) Dana is going to make sure Brock wins and wins comfortably
So UFC is fixed? Lol
Unless he totally fixes the fight he cannot guarantee Brock will win or that Brock won't get injured - to which Brock could get hurt during TRAINING for God's sake!!

This has no benefit to the business its Brock doing another FU to wrestling fans, performers and the promotion that made him famous.

 

[MERPER]

The facts are thus: this doesn't benefit Vince one bit.

Let's take the arguments presented and debate:

1) WWE can use the mainstream credibility.

No it can't. WWE has had real fighters on the roster numerous times before and nothing has changed. Wrestling is still seen as fake carny stuff. That will not change whether Brock wins or not.

2) WWE can use the promotion.
But they don't NEED IT. WWE is called "the machine" for a reason. They have a substantial promotions budget. If you were watching UFC 200 to see Brock the likelihood is that you were either 1- going to watch Summerslam anyway or 2- you weren't going to watch Summerslam anyway. Brock winning or losing will not effect whether most people watch Summerslam.

3) Brock wins - Great he looks like a monster and draws more money for Vince later.
Maybe true but that also means Vince has to PAY him more on the next contract because his value increased. It also gives Brock the option of going back to UFC when his contract expires.

4) Brock Loses
How do you justify his superpush if the dude gets busted up im UFC while under contract to you? How can you look at your roster - who he has used as a punching bag for 4 years and justify that? If you're Dean Ambrose you carried a feud by yourself was forced to job in a match you got nothing out of only for Brock to go job to some chump in UFC and kill his aura. If your Cena or Undertaker how do you feel if Brock gets beat and does benefit the BUSINESS YOU WORK IN? Makes no sense.

5) Brock gets hurt
A likely scenario. If you're Vince you have to justify to your shareholders that you allowed a top guy in the company to work somewhere else where he got hurt and cannot meet obligations to your company.

Do you think the Cavs would let LeBron just do whatever he wants? No. Brock is an investment, a substantial investment and to not have access because of reckless behavior FOR ANOTHER PROMOTION shows incompetence.

6) Dana White lets Ronda do Wrestlemania
So? Lol i mean its that simple.

Ronda is not important enough to risk cutting the legs out of most of the roster. To argue that Ronda is a draw is irrelevant Because she has ZERO history in pro wrestling. Again, real fighters have been under contract before and it never mattered.

The people who would watch WM will watch it whether Ronda shows up for not. People forget, UFC has its own fanbase that WILL NOT watch WWE no matter who is on it and vice versa. Ronda will not bring in any extra viewers.

So how does this benefit WWE?
How does this benefit the wrestling fan?
It doesn't. Its just Brock doing whatever he wants wasting everyone's time.
Whether he wins or loses is secondary to the stupidity of allowing such an asset to endanger himself. Which leads me to

7) Dana is going to make sure Brock wins and wins comfortably
So UFC is fixed? Lol
Unless he totally fixes the fight he cannot guarantee Brock will win or that Brock won't get injured - to which Brock could get hurt during TRAINING for God's sake!!

This has no benefit to the business its Brock doing another FU to wrestling fans, performers and the promotion that made him famous.

Great, great post. Couldn't agree more.

Specifically, your points on injury and the LeBron hypothetical.

 

[mlp420]

I don't see it as a clear positive or negative just yet. While it's true WWE wouldn't allow this if it didn't benefit them, you could make the same case for UFC. Why would Dana White throw Brock in there knowing if he looks good fans will put pressure on him to make more fights happen in the future? They have problems as it is with their stars losing and/or getting injured. Last thing they need is to have a big star people want to see that they can't use. Wouldn't surprise me if Dana's trying lure Brock back to UFC. WWE contract didn't stop CM Punk.

If he wins, it becomes tricky. Yeah, it's good on WWE to have Brock coming off a win, but what if his win gives him the itch to make another title run in UFC? Is he really going back into UFC to further his WWE character or does he want to be UFC champion again? He is a legit athlete, not wired like the average pro wrestler.

Of course, if he loses, it's WWE's problem. How the WWE fanbase views him coming off a widely publicized loss in UFC is anyone's guess.

 

[silverbullet]

The question should be changed to what was dana white thinking? the contracts apparently favored dana, brock supposedly told dana that he couldn't fight right now and he has a pay day with vince, and dana agreed to it, if he would come back when he's healthy, the deal was agreed to by both parties, also a rousey appearance wouldn't be out of the question, or something with cm punk and the wwe even, cm punk will also need that payday if he can't hang in UFC.

imagine a relationship with brock and wwe/ufc, where brock and haymen would cut their promos on his ufc opponents in a wwe ring, that would gain a lot of social media attention too, possibly cm punk vs brock lesnar at mania.

 

[LBGetBack]

Why does everyone want to be arm-chair businessmen? My God. Some of y'all are insufferable. Bunch of know it alls, who really have absolutely no clue what's going on yet.

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

Win or lose, it gets Brock Lesnar, UFC, and WWE some exposure. I'm assuming a pretty good pay day for Vince and WWE too. Everyone wins.

IMO this is a great example of people overthinking things.

 

[@smarkmouth]

Why does everyone want to be arm-chair businessmen? My God. Some of y'all are insufferable. Bunch of know it alls, who really have absolutely no clue what's going on yet.

They're right up there with the keyboard lawyers. It's okay though. When I waste my time armchair-booking, I remind myself and take solace that I'm not as bad as those guys.

I'm actually excited to see how WWE handles this, creatively. This is completely uncharted territory for them. If Brock wins, then he absolutely should go on a tear in the WWE. If he loses, well, maybe he becomes an unleashed beast, who is damaged and embarrassed and decides to take it out on the WWE, entirely. Or maybe Paul Heyman begins to doubt his own meal ticket, stuff like that.

 

[Kamala316]

Vince wouldn't allow this unless there were something in it for him. So pretty much Brock helps save UFC 200, and Ronda gets to participate at next year's WrestleMania (which means that Steph can get her "WrestleMania moment"). Can't wait to see how much air time Steph and HHH will have committed to their "slow burn storylines".

 

[BestSportsEntertainer]

Has it been reported Ronda Rousey will be in WWE or is everyone just assuming that?

 

[MERPER]

Has it been reported Ronda Rousey will be in WWE or is everyone just assuming that?

Assuming.

And the funniest part about it is that after her first loss to Holly Holm, her superstar status has fallen significantly.

People assume that she will fight at WrestleMania. By then Rousey could lose another 1 or 2 UFC fights in which case her pop culture status will be totally gone.

 

[OYDK]

People getting annoyed about discussion on a discussion forum? Yup, must be in the right place.

I'm sorry, but anybody who thinks Vince is letting Brock go to the UFC, possibly putting his Summerslam main event in jeopardy, just for some publicity either:

A) Doesn't know Vince McMahon all that well OR
B) Doesn't understand what mutually beneficial means

Will Vince benefit from this partnership? Probably a bit. Will he benefit enough to risk placing his top draw and commodity in an environment where he's likely to get hurt and miss the second biggest PPV of the year? I doubt it. Is White taking any risks or is he the one profiting here without having to make any sacrifices? It seems to me like that's the case, and you're crazy if you think Vince would let that happen. Not unless he was getting some other sort of guarantee out of it. Whether that be a slice of the profits, a guaranteed appearance from a UFC Fighter in the WWE, or something else. Or as mentioned earlier, perhaps Brock worked this into his contract and if that's the case, Vince's hands are tied.

It's not called being an "armchair businessman". It's called making a prediction based on the limited knowledge that you posses on the topic at hand and debating on said topic which, if I'm not mistaken, is the whole point of this forum.

 

[King Patrick Star]

This would be a great opportunity for the WWE to do some crossover promotion here!! Here’s how I would lay out the next few weeks.

I would have Brock Lesnar added to the Money In The Bank Ladder match and have that match open the show. Do you already see where I’m going with this?? I’d have Brock Lesnar win the Gold Briefcase and hold it until the next American holiday. On the 4th of July, I’d have Brock Lesnar cash in on Roman Reigns and take the Big W. 5 days later, the WWE World Heavyweight Champion is in the Octagon. Have him face UFC World Heavyweight Champion, Stipe Miocic, in a Champion vs. Champion match. It would have to be non-Title of course, due to short notice, or is it?? I can picture Brock Lesnar walking into Raw on July 11th as the Undisputed Ultimate World Fighting and Wrestling Entertainment Champion!!

 

[JoeFromTomsRiver]

I DON'T CARE if this is a "good business decision" for the WWE. As a FAN, this is a GREAT decision. Seeing Lesnar return to the Octagon, while still remaining a WWE wrestler, is INTERESTING and FUN. That's all I care about. I'll leave it to the rest of you to play CEO.

 

[Psykohurricane55]

the problem now, is that Brock Lesnar is facing MArk Hunt at ufc 200 which is the same type of fighter that lesnar is so the risk of injury is even greater now plus Lesnar will have be cleared by the new york athletic committee if he want to wrestle at summerslam which mean that if anything happens to lesnar during the fight and he's get a medical suspension that could last a long time then goodbye lesnar as a wrestler for summerslam.

This is a huge risk that vince is taking so he probably getting something huge in return for this and it probably would be for summerslam. So let's wait and see.

 

[MERPER]

the problem now, is that Brock Lesnar is facing MArk Hunt at ufc 200 which is the same type of fighter that lesnar is so the risk of injury is even greater now plus Lesnar will have be cleared by the new york athletic committee if he want to wrestle at summerslam which mean that if anything happens to lesnar during the fight and he's get a medical suspension that could last a long time then goodbye lesnar as a wrestler for summerslam.

Correct. Someone called me out for saying earlier in the thread that there is a very real chance Brock can't compete at SummerSlam.

Told me WWE already said he would without a problem, which simply isn't true.

If anyone knows anything about combat sports, ACTUAL fighting, etc. injuries occur all the time, especially in the realm of head issues/concussions.

Brock could win the fight and still take such a beating with big punches to the face/head that doctors won't clear him for SummerSlam.

6 weeks between UFC 200 and SummerSlam may seem like a lot, and there's a chance he can do both. But that's far from a certainty.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Even if something happens to Brock Lesnar during the fight that renders him unable to compete at SummerSlam then, for me as a fan, it's not that big of a deal. Lesnar generates buzz, no question, but I'm sure I'm not the only one that's sort of bored with Lesnar as this unstoppable destroyer who just mauls his way through the WWE roster. I mean....I'm just bored with seeing the guy deliver 6, 8 or 10 German Suplexes during his matches while the smarks gleefully count on for the primary reason of hearing themselves chant something.

Losing Lesnar wouldn't be that detrimental for SummerSlam if WWE focuses on giving us a strong, overall card and they've most definitely got the talent to do it. If given a choice between watching Lesnar and wrestlers like Owens, Zayn, Cesaro, Cena, Ambrose, Wyatt, Styles, New Day, Anderson & Gallows, Sasha Banks, Enzo & Big Cass, etc. I'd rather take them than Lesnar because I'm kinda bored with the guy as the formula for booking him is pretty stale to me. I understand why WWE keeps at it as it's a formula that's working but, as a fan, I'm over it.