[Official] 2009 MLB Season Thread

[CH David]

Well today I haven't heard too much on the trade market, it has been fairly quiet. Will Halladay be traded? I can't say for sure because Toronto seems to be balking and asking for too much. I realize it is Roy freaking Halladay, but them asking for like 2 top prospects and another player is turning teams away. So either they will move him on within the next 4 days, get 3-4 players in return, probably 1 top prospect and 2 good minor leaguers or something, or he isn't going anywhere and trade talks won't happen until winter.

That said, this is now the offical MLB thread for the 2009 season, so I want to hear some thoughts on the ROTY runnings.

Currently the top AL Rookies look to be Ricky Romero from Seattle, Gordon Beckham and Chris Getz from the White Sox, and Matt Wieters from Baltimore. I think it will be a tight race between Beckham and Romero at the end of the year. Wieters is doing well but the Orioles aren't going anywhere, whereas Seattle, while 7 1/2 games back, can still try to make a run, and the White Sox are only 2 games out. I think that Gordon Beckham will edge out Romero for the award, as he has emerged lately as one of the best young hitters in the game, while still learning the position at 3rd. So who do you think wins it for the AL?

I don't know NL ROTY candidates, so whoever posts those candidates I will look up and make my decision.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

How ridiculous are the Phillies? They are sure favorites in the National League with Roy Halladay, yet refuse to give up Kyle Drabek, a kid who might turn out to be a great pitcher in the league and a couple of other "good" prospects? Please. Roy Halladay is the best pitcher in the game. They're being stupid.

 

[Thriller Ant]

It makes even less sense since they will get Halladay for a year and a half, rather than the typical half of a season plus the playoffs. It is a hefty price to pay, but he very well may be the best pitcher in baseball today. In addition, if he does go to the NL, that is one less quality batter he has to face each time through the lineup, potentially making his numbers that much better. The Phillies need to get this deal done if they don't want to be seen as completely crazy or unwilling to take that next step.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

Nothing is too big a price to pay for being the odds on favorite to win and repeat as World Series champion. Nothing that Drabek or Happ could give Philly in the future compares to what Doc Halladay can give them now. On a team like the Phillies, with Rollins, Victorino, Ibanez, Utley, and Howard, runs are going to be scored every night. They have one of the most stacked teams in the Major Leagues on offense, and have been able to excel with mediocre pitching. Roy Halladay on this team almost gives a guaranteed win every five days and twice a series in the playoffs. That is huge. All that asks the rest of your staff to do is to win two games in October. Happ and Drabek will never be that kind of pitcher. Get the deal done, Philly, or watch your chances of a repeat slip away.

 

[BooCocky]

Rob Bradford at WEEI is reporting that the Red Sox are close to a deal that would net Cliff Lee from the Indians for Michael Bowden, Josh Reddick and another prospect.

This would be a great deal for Boston. It'll give them a good arm in their rotation and a great left handed arm. There pitching has struggled do an extent, Dice-K wanted to blow, and most are inconsistent. I don't believe they are giving up a lot, and if the Red Sox would win the WS none of this would matter anyway.

Another interesting note is the Rays are getting into talks with the Jays about Doc. This would be a great acquisition and I am sure the Rays have enough minor leaguers to make this deal work.

Also, the Giants are working hard to acquire Freddy Sanchez. And the Sox are looking at Jack Wilson. That's cool, the Pirates aren't going to trade them unless they see a good offer, and now they want to pay some of Sanchez' 2010 contract to make this happen. Lets do this.

Also, The Yankees want Ian Snell for some odd reason, but at this moment they'll take anything they can get..

 

[X]

This would be a great deal for Boston. It'll give them a good arm in their rotation and a great left handed arm. There pitching has struggled do an extent, Dice-K wanted to blow, and most are inconsistent. I don't believe they are giving up a lot, and if the Red Sox would win the WS none of this would matter anyway.

Honestly I'm not sure if I understand this deal. On one hand having a guy like Cliff Lee on your staff is always a good thing and I guess technically you can never have too much pitching, but we're dangerously close. Jesus we have Beckett, Lester, Dice-K, Wakefield, Smoltz, Penny, Buchholz, and now we're going to throw Lee into that mix?! Apparently we plan on using an 8 man rotation or something.

I'm not sure if giving up two of our top prospects in Bowden and Reddick is worth it, especially for a a half-year rental. Lee is a great pitcher, but he's not a Halladay. If we're going to be trading off some of our better prospects, I'd prefer we just go all out and try to grab Halladay.

Speaking of the Sox interest in Halladay, there are rumors going around that Clay Buchholz has been added to the mix. Buchholz, someone like Reddick and two more B prospects should be enough to get it done I think. Not sure how I'd feel about Buchholz being traded though. I'd only be okay with it if we either A) Won the WS or B) Were able to sign Halladay long-term. Otherwise screw it, we're in good enough shape.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

Cliff Lee on the Red Sox would be unfair. I fail to see how they keep throwing their names in the hat for all of these players every year. As a Yankee fan, I find it very unsettling. I don't see how we'll come out of the American League if we had to overcome Beckett, Lee, Penny, Lester, Dice-K, Wakefield, and the others. I mean, we have wonderful hitting, a good pen, and passable starters, but The Red Sox would be a super-team. They truly have the best manager in baseball if they can pull this off. (Can't believe I said that.)

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

Breaking News: The Phillies have acquired Cliff Lee from the Indians in a six-person trade. This is the second year in a row that the Indians have traded the reigning AL Cy Young award winner at the deadline.

My thoughts: Thank God! The Red Sox did not acquire Cliff Lee, and if they don't get Halladay, Adrian Gonzalez, or Victor Martinez, the Yankees are in good shape. This obviously shuts the door on Halladay to the Phillies, but still puts the Phillies in excellent position, and they probably didn't have to give up Drabek.

For Halladay, well, he's probably not going anywhere this season. Unless the Rays make a play, or the Dodgers give up their ace, I think he's staying in Toronto. I don't see the Sox giving up Clay or Lester. It's a good day to be a Yankees fan, and well, a Phillies fan. Must suck to live in Cleveland.

 

[gd]

Well, the Pirates fire sale continues. After trading Jack Wilson and Ian Snell to the Mariners. From the beginning of the season we've traded our opening day left fielder, center fielder, shortstop, first baseman, #2 starter, and our all-star second baseman is almost sure to follow. I am not faulting the management as most of these were reasonable trades, but they better hope the team turns around soon.

We actually got a pretty decent amount of talent back in return. Jeff Clement is a former 3rd overall pick and can give us some power at first if he stays healthy. Ronny Cendeno can be a serviceable major league player and his contract is expiring. We also got 3 pitching prospects, at least one of them might be decent.

I do have to say that it is sad to see Jack Wilson go though. He has been a great guy during his 8 year career with the Pirates. He's one of the best defensive players in the majors and he comes to play every single night. I will certainly miss him and hope that he has success for the rest of his career.

As for Ian Snell, I'm glad that fucker is gone. He asked to be demoted to AAA and even though he could have helped the team he wanted to stay in the minors. He is a lazy bastard, hope he sucks in Seattle.

 

[X]

Oh well. I didn't have my hopes up for Lee or anything. We really don't need him at all, he'd be a nice little bonus sure, but we already have the deepest pitching in baseball. Lee being traded to the Phillies though is big news for them. With a guy like that in their rotation their WS hopes just went up quite a bit.

I'm glad we didn't trade for him though. He wasn't worth giving up Buchholz for, not at all. Especially since Buchholz just threw a great game yesterday and has done so all year. He's going to be one great pitcher. Not worth a rental that we don't actually need. If we're going to be picking up anything, it's going to be a bat. I wouldn't be shocked if the Sox traded for a guy like Victor Martinez before the deadline is here. Who knows, maybe they'll go all out and get Adrian Gonzalez, that would require quite a hefty return though.

Not sure why you're rejoicing over this as a Yankees fan though 48. You guys should worry about your own pitching, not ours.

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

Not sure why you're rejoicing over this as a Yankees fan though 48. You guys should worry about your own pitching, not ours.

I rejoice over anything the Red Sox don't get. Cliff Lee would have made you guys much harder to beat. The Yankees can hit Clay. Cliff if the reigning Cy Young winner; he's much harder to win against. While I'd love to make a move for a pitcher, such as Jarrod Washburn of the Mariners, I don't necessarily see it happening. We have very little depth, and our farm system is weak. Adding a good arm would make us infinitely better, though. Especially an arm that has an ERA under 3.00.

 

[Thriller Ant]

It is really starting to look like the Pirates are a major league level AAA team that everyone can call players up from. It seems like every year, some guy on Pittsburgh is having a good year, and gets traded for some prospects, who eventually make it to the Pirates major league team, just to get traded away again. I would feel bad for Pirates fans, but then I remember they are in the Cards' division and Pittsburgh seems to win every other fucking championship so it all evens out.

 

[CH David]

Well I think Phillies fans can rest a little easier these days with their acquisitions of Cliff Lee and Ben Francisco. Cliff Lee has added a huge lift to that starting rotation, and it is one I would not want to see in a 5 game series. He is one of the better left handers in the game, so enjoy him. Francisco is a good player, can probably come in off the bench and pinch hit for them.

Yesterday a deal went down between the Red Sox and White Sox that has obviously gone under the radar, but could potentially be a good trade for both teams. Brian Anderson went to Boston in exchange for Mark Kotsay. Anderson may be going to Triple A Pawtucket, but he is a solid player, he just hasn't put it together. He has all the tools to be a starting outfielder, but with Boston's outfield, I don't know how much time he would get in the field right now.

Mark Kotsay to the Pale Hose to me is a great deal and a big boost. I've liked him ever since he was in Oakland. The White Sox have an abismal batting average when it comes to pinch-hitting. Kotsay has done a great job in his career pinch-hitting, I think his average is like .373 or something of that nature. He can play a good center field, and I really like that Kenny Williams was able to make this trade.

What is your opinion on this trade X?

Also, no love for Mark Buehrle? He now owns the MLB record for consecutive batters retired with 45. Previous holders of the record were Jim Barr and Bobby Jenks, both with 41. Again showing that he is the ace of the White Sox staff, and one of the best left handers in the game. Although he is overlooked by a lot of people, and he also fields his position extremely well, how does he not have a Gold Glove yet either?

 

[gd]

It's official, Freddy is gone as well. Sanchez was traded to San Fransisco for a AA pitcher by the name of Alderson. Apparently he's one of the top pitching prospects in baseball and could be in the majors by next year. This actually may be one of the best Pirates trades in recent years.

 

[Cowboyfromhell]

As a Phillies fan, I like the Cliff Lee trade because he wil solidify their rotation and they didn't give up the guys Toronto wanted (Drabek, Brown, Taylor or JA Happ). We do have a log jam of lefties in the rotation now, but there are worse things that could happen.
Buehrle is a stud. That was an amazing run he was on. While the 45 is an amazing stretch to go, which do you think is tougher, doing it as a starting pitcher, like Mark did, or the 41 that Jenks did as a reliever?

 

[CH David]

Breaking News

Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz tested positive for performance-enhancing drugs in 2003, lawyers with knowledge of the results told The New York Times.

The two were key members of the Boston Red Sox World Series teams in 2004 and 2007.

This is from espn.com. I am not surprised that Manny's name came up in the report, as he was busted for the masking agent earlier this year. David Ortiz I am a little surprised at. He has been scuffling the past few years, and I didn't really think of steroids when it came to it, I just thought it was injuries. So Big Papi and Man Ram have officially been outted on the steroids subject. What are your thoughts on this?

 

[gd]

There really is no reason to be surprised about either of them. Sure Papi seems like the big, fun loving, never do anyting wrong guy, but steroids aren't a shocker. If you look at his career he went from average player in Minnesota to a home run hitting maching in Boston just like that. Over the bast few years since the testing policy has been amped up his numbers have been decreasing, culminating in his pretty dreadful season this year. I just wish they'd release the whole list of names all at once to get it over with.

 

[X]

Breaking News

This is from espn.com. I am not surprised that Manny's name came up in the report, as he was busted for the masking agent earlier this year. David Ortiz I am a little surprised at. He has been scuffling the past few years, and I didn't really think of steroids when it came to it, I just thought it was injuries. So Big Papi and Man Ram have officially been outted on the steroids subject. What are your thoughts on this?

Well that pisses me the fuck off. I've always maintained Papi being clean, but if this turns out to be true, it's a shame. Doesn't mean jack shit in the long run or in reference to his legacy though. People just do not give two shits about whether or not players have used steroids, the only people who do care seem to be the Hall of Fame committees. Seriously, did you see Manny's return to LA? They welcomed him back like he was the fucking Pope or something. The general public just doesn't care about steroids any more.

You also have to remember that back in 2003, just about everyone and their mother was on steroids. Literally you could look up and down all of the league leaders from those few years and see steroid user after steroid user after steroid user, as this was before it became such a huge issue.

I'm one of those people that doesn't care about drug use when it comes to baseball though. So many of the game's greatest players used drugs, PED or recreational. Guys in the old days used to eat up amphetamines like they were vitamins, yet I never hear of Hank Aaron's legacy being tarnished because of it. I for one think steroids are a completely bullshit excuse to write off someone's career. The only thing steroids do is help build muscle, they don't teach you how to swing the bat or hit a home run.

Papi's definitely not on any 'roids these days though, and he's perfectly fine. He struggled a bit last season and towards the opening of this season, but he's been raking for the last 2 months. He's still an elite hitter, but he's getting older. He'll always be known as one of the greatest clutch hitters of all time.

Anyone who comes in here and tries to write off Papi or the Sox 2004 WS win though is a fucking idiot though.

 

[X]

There really is no reason to be surprised about either of them. Sure Papi seems like the big, fun loving, never do anyting wrong guy, but steroids aren't a shocker. If you look at his career he went from average player in Minnesota to a home run hitting maching in Boston just like that.

He's Dominican. That's how it works GD, no one ever knows what to expect from players coming over from the DR, or Puerto Rico or even Cuba. There's very little scouting information.

And I'm not sure if I'd call 20 HRs and 75 RBIs in only 125 games as "average". Those are All Star numbers. Plenty of great players take a while to blossom.

 

[CH David]

Oh I am not writing off what he did in the WS in 2004. I had hoped he was clean because I love David Ortiz as a player, and he had that funny commercial for ESPN and SportsCenter. I have changed my stance on steroids a little bit, they should be allowed in if their numbers are good enough.

I just want the game to be clean now, even if it hasn't been in the past. Will it happen 100%? I doubt it, but who am I to say it can't. Personally I just want this list to come out so we can find out who tested positive in 2003. Also I want to hear their responses to this. For some, Manny only tested positive for a masking agent earlier this season, so I want to hear about this.

 

[X]

Oh I am not writing off what he did in the WS in 2004. I had hoped he was clean because I love David Ortiz as a player, and he had that funny commercial for ESPN and SportsCenter. I have changed my stance on steroids a little bit, they should be allowed in if their numbers are good enough.

Well that's good to hear, I knew you had a good head on your shoulders ChiHawks. Ortiz isn't just a great player, he's a downright great human being. He contributes a lot of his time and money to charities (including his own charity, the David Ortiz Children's Fund) and is just a downright great teammate to have in any locker room.

I just want the game to be clean now, even if it hasn't been in the past. Will it happen 100%? I doubt it, but who am I to say it can't. Personally I just want this list to come out so we can find out who tested positive in 2003. Also I want to hear their responses to this. For some, Manny only tested positive for a masking agent earlier this season, so I want to hear about this.

I agree that in a perfect world I too would want to the game to be free of steroids, but that perfect world is NEVER going to happen. Doesn't matter how strict the drug policy is in the MLB, there will always be guys who want to use steroids to get bigger.

As for Manny, please. Testing positive for the masking agent is as good as testing positive for steroids, and if anyone tries to refute that they're being a complete moron. It's like someone running out of a burning building and saying "Well we didn't see any fire, all we could see was smoke". The smoke wouldn't be there without the fire, just like Manny wouldn't be using a masking agent if he didn't have something to mask.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Well that's good to hear, I knew you had a good head on your shoulders ChiHawks. Ortiz isn't just a great player, he's a downright great human being. He contributes a lot of his time and money to charities (including his own charity, the David Ortiz Children's Fund) and is just a downright great teammate to have in any locker room.



I agree that in a perfect world I too would want to the game to be free of steroids, but that perfect world is NEVER going to happen. Doesn't matter how strict the drug policy is in the MLB, there will always be guys who want to use steroids to get bigger.

As for Manny, please. Testing positive for the masking agent is as good as testing positive for steroids, and if anyone tries to refute that they're being a complete moron. It's like someone running out of a burning building and saying "Well we didn't see any fire, all we could see was smoke". The smoke wouldn't be there without the fire, just like Manny wouldn't be using a masking agent if he didn't have something to mask.

You know there are going to be questions about David Ortiz because he was released by Minnesota in 2003 because of his lack of power. I don't believe him, Manny, or A-Rod will be affected Hall of Fame wise like Bonds, McGwire, and Sosa are. The Red Sox are playing right now and you know after the game all the reporters are going to be swarming around Ortiz.

 

[CH David]

Well that's good to hear, I knew you had a good head on your shoulders ChiHawks. Ortiz isn't just a great player, he's a downright great human being. He contributes a lot of his time and money to charities (including his own charity, the David Ortiz Children's Fund) and is just a downright great teammate to have in any locker room.



I agree that in a perfect world I too would want to the game to be free of steroids, but that perfect world is NEVER going to happen. Doesn't matter how strict the drug policy is in the MLB, there will always be guys who want to use steroids to get bigger.

As for Manny, please. Testing positive for the masking agent is as good as testing positive for steroids, and if anyone tries to refute that they're being a complete moron. It's like someone running out of a burning building and saying "Well we didn't see any fire, all we could see was smoke". The smoke wouldn't be there without the fire, just like Manny wouldn't be using a masking agent if he didn't have something to mask.

X thinks I have a good head on my shoulders. YES!! That is a win for me in my book lol. Onto subject at hand. Baseball is a dirty game and will always have something to give the edge. Hell Kenny Rogers used the pinetar on his pitching hand in the playoffs in 2006, who knows how long he used it. Of course Manny did it, but 48.7 used that it was just a mask as his defense, so this will prove there truly was something to hide.

Also I have 2 questions, A) Why do players want to take a substance to increase strength? HGH helps with injuries and the healing process, that I can deal with, but steroids? For home run? The way the game of baseball is headed now is a more athletic game. Outfielders are faster, can cut through gaps and chase down balls faster. They can steal bases and bunt for hits. Sure there are still the big bats in the middle of the lineup, but if you are truly a great baseball talent, why do you need steroids? Hell Tony Gwynn was a fat bastard, I loved Tony don't get me wrong, he was not the strongest guy, but he knew how to hit. Arguably the best hitter for average in the past 20-30 years. And off topic question, B) Tenta where are you? I thought you were going to help discuss this here. I digress though.

Does anyone have any inkling towards those answers?

 

[48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You]

Manny wasn't so outspoken as David Ortiz about the issue. I haven't found any of his thoughts on the subject. Here's some quotes from Papi.

"They pick me [to be tested for steroids] every time. I don't know why. I don't know if it's because I'm a big guy, or what, but all I know is all they are going to find is a lot of rice and beans." - 2005

"I tell you, I don’t know too much about steroids, but I started listening about steroids when they started to bring that shit up, and I started realizing and getting to know a little bit about it. You’ve got to be careful. I used to buy a protein shake in my country. I don’t do that any more because they don’t have the approval for that here, so I know that, so I’m off of buying things at the GNC back in the Dominican (Republic). But it can happen anytime, it can happen. I don’t know. I don’t know if I drank something in my youth, not knowing it." - 2007

The last one is my favorite.

"I know that if I test positive by using any kind of substance, I know that I'm going to disrespect my family, the game, the fans and everybody. I don't want to be facing that situation. I won't use it." - 2009

David has also suggested a year-long ban for anyone who tests positive for steroids.

When Alex Rodriguez tested positive for steroids, everyone jumped down his throat. As a Yankee fan, I heard no end of it. That was all that was talked about in the world of baseball for two weeks or more. I got so sick of hearing it. Alex Rodriguez was a great player, before and after steroids. The difference here, is that David Ortiz was not.

 

[X]

When Alex Rodriguez tested positive for steroids, everyone jumped down his throat. As a Yankee fan, I heard no end of it. That was all that was talked about in the world of baseball for two weeks or more. I got so sick of hearing it. Alex Rodriguez was a great player, before and after steroids. The difference here, is that David Ortiz was not.

Hands down the most grossly ignorant statement you've EVER made 48. You come off as such a bitter Yankees fan, it's sad. David Ortiz isn't a good player? Are you fucking kidding me? Never call yourself a baseball fan again if you aren't able to look past petty team rivalries. Ortiz has over 300 fucking home runs (the overwhelming majority of which came AFTER 2003), and that doesn't make him a good player? Is that a joke?

Worst post I've ever seen from you 48. Put away your god damned Red Sox bias for a minute and attempt to tell me that Ortiz isn't a good player. I'll kindly laugh in your face.