MLB LDS LD

[Stormtrooper]

And they aren't easily better, position by position (this season)

OK, lets go position by position.

C- Tigers, easily.

Not at all easily. Push at best. Russel Martin is a fucking all star, good hitter, and a phenomenal Defensive catcher. Avila is a rookie. Good player, but still a fucking rookie. You're severely underrating Martin here.

1B- Tigers, rather easily.

We're not gonna get into you underrating Teixeira again. Yes, Cabrera is better, but it's closer then you think.

2B- Yankees, easily.

Yes. Cano is just as good as Cabrera, if not better.

SS- Push. Jeters had a good 2nd half, but Peralta's been great all year as well.

You're HIGHLY underrating Jeters 2nd half. Jeter has been GREAT the 2nd half, and most teams in the league would take him over most Shortstops.

3B- Yankees, slightly. A-Rod's been hurt and not as effective, but he's still better then the Betemit/Inge platooning.

Agree. And don't be surprised if A-Rod has a good postseason. He's still A-Rod.

LF- Yankees, marginally. Youngs been effective offensively (as has Gardner) but his D is quite bad.

You gotta be fucking shitting me. Garnder is the best left fielder in baseball. Young was acquired in late August. Young is pretty good, but Gardner is EXCELLENT. You're advanced metrics actually say that he is the best left fielder in baseball, by the way.

CF- Yankees, rather easily. Both strike out a ton, but Granderson gets on more and has a lot more pop.

Granderson is a fucking MVP candidate. Guess you forgot to mention that. Plus he's 2nd in the league in homers and up there in RBI too.

RF- Yankees, easily w/o Boesch. Magglio/Dirks is a bad platoon.

Agreed. Although Swisher has not been a good Postseason player. It may be closer then you think.

DH- Tigers, easily.

Agreed. Although don't sleep on Posada. He got hot last month.

SP- Tigers, slightly. JV, Fister, Scherzer > CC, Nova, Garcia/Colon (one game doesnt change my opinion on this)

I'll agree here, but it's beyond really close. First of all, Colon isn't on the roster.

Verlander this year is better then CC. Not as much a landslide as you think, but it's clearly Verlander.
I'd still take Nova over Fister. Based on their entire year. At worst it's a push.
Freddie Garcia is a solid veteran pitcher. Not great, not bad. Scherzer is good, but can be very bad too. Closer then you think, but Scherzers upside wins out.

RP- Push. Rivera's been Rivera, Robertson's been great, and Soriano's been a good 7th inning guy, but Valverde was the one that went perfect in saves (pretty or not he got the job done) Benoit has been great since about May, and Coke/AA have been good 7th inning guys.

How was the copious amounts of narcotics you just used to be able to even think this? You did NOT just try to tell me that Valverde is better then Rivera. He has never been, and will never be better. He's been great, but that means jack shit. Rivera is the best of all time, and is having a great season. And Rivera's Postseason numbers (0.71 ERA with 42 postseason saves; 0.776 WHIP, etc) should really make this a Yankee win easily. Not to mention AL All Star David Robertson being the best set-up man in the league this year (K/9 the best among relievers, ERA up there too). Soriano has bee very good after his injury.

So, by my scoreboard, its 5-4-2 Yankees, certainly not 'easily' more talented.

And your scoreboard was pretty biased.

Luis Ayala needs to get out of here. Fuck it, put in Rivera, he needs work. Or Robertson. OK, Rivera it is.

 

[Stormtrooper]

And just like that, BALLGAME OVER. YANKEES WIN. THAAAAAAAAAAAAA... YANKEES WIN!

 

[JJYanks121]

Oh you guys and your position by position arguments.........

We did one of these at my website where a guy argued very poignantly that the Red Sox were better position by position than the Yankees. He was biased, but he wasn't that far off. Still, the Yankees are in the playoffs while Papi is on the golf course with the rest. It's not about individual stats and sabremetrics. If it was, maybe "Moneyball" would have ended with, you know, Oakland actually winning something.

It'll be about guys performing in the posteason. So far Nova came out and did well while Fister blew up in one inning. Whether Detroit has advantages or not, they didn't look great today.

Also, you can't take 3 guys in a bullpen and make a comparison. The Yankee bullpen also features Boone Logan, Ayala (who was bad today), and Cory Wade with ERAS under 3. Add them to Soriano, Robertson, and Rivera and most of your bullpen is capable of getting outs. That's big since Joe Girardi will overmanage every game of the postseason.

 

[Megatron]

I hate my computer. Got to starting rotation and it froze on me and I lost all my replies prior to that. So in short-

Not at all easily. Push at best. Russel Martin is a fucking all star, good hitter, and a phenomenal Defensive catcher. Avila is a rookie. Good player, but still a fucking rookie. You're severely underrating Martin here.

No, its not. Avilas D has been better and his been the best hitting catcher all season in the AL (possibly MLB, not sure on NL guys). Traditional and sabremetric agrees with me. hell he's not the best catcher in his division, thats Wieters.

We're not gonna get into you underrating Teixeira again. Yes, Cabrera is better, but it's closer then you think.

Cabrera = top 5 hitter, at worst. Teixeira = not top 20. Tex is all or nothing with homers, Cabby spreads it out and will walk if it's given to him. Cabrera was .100 points higher at getting on base and his OPS was .200 points higher. Better D doesn't make this closer because you'll trade defense for offense at 1B (and Tex hasn't had a great season defensively to sabremetrics).

Yes. Cano is just as good as Cabrera, if not better.

Cabrera's speaken in the same breath as Pujols. When Cano's thought of like that, you'll have an argument. He's not as consistent or as good of a hitter as Cabby.

You're HIGHLY underrating Jeters 2nd half. Jeter has been GREAT the 2nd half, and most teams in the league would take him over most Shortstops.

Peralta's had a more complete year and had 3 straight months of .300 hitting. He gets on base only slightly less, and hits for much more power. Many would take Jeter, but just as many would take Peralta (in terms of this year, of course).

You gotta be fucking shitting me. Garnder is the best left fielder in baseball. Young was acquired in late August. Young is pretty good, but Gardner is EXCELLENT. You're advanced metrics actually say that he is the best left fielder in baseball, by the way.

Don't know what I'm shitting you about, since I gave the Yankees the edge. But Young has torn it up since he came over. He doesn't get on enough, though, or play good defense.

Granderson is a fucking MVP candidate. Guess you forgot to mention that. Plus he's 2nd in the league in homers and up there in RBI too.

Again, I said that. But Jacksons D > Grandersons. However, it wasn't even close. I admitted that.

Agreed. Although Swisher has not been a good Postseason player. It may be closer then you think.

Push at best then (for the Tigers sake), because mags is old and Dirks is a rook.

Agreed. Although don't sleep on Posada. He got hot last month.

Consistent year > one month. V-Mart has been the 2nd best hitter on the tigers.

Verlander this year is better then CC. Not as much a landslide as you think, but it's clearly Verlander.
I'd still take Nova over Fister. Based on their entire year. At worst it's a push.
Freddie Garcia is a solid veteran pitcher. Not great, not bad. Scherzer is good, but can be very bad too. Closer then you think, but Scherzers upside wins out.

Fister only looks bad because Seattle couldn't get him run support. If that 11-13 was a 15-10 he would've gotten a lot more respect. He's gone 8-1 since coming over to Detroit. He's been a true #2.

How was the copious amounts of narcotics you just used to be able to even think this? You did NOT just try to tell me that Valverde is better then Rivera. He has never been, and will never be better. He's been great, but that means jack shit. Rivera is the best of all time, and is having a great season. And Rivera's Postseason numbers (0.71 ERA with 42 postseason saves; 0.776 WHIP, etc) should really make this a Yankee win easily. Not to mention AL All Star David Robertson being the best set-up man in the league this year (K/9 the best among relievers, ERA up there too). Soriano has bee very good after his injury.

Using this years stats, buddy, the Tigers back end has been more effective. They've lost 1 game all year where they led in the 8th inning or later. I know Mo's blown quite a few saves. Also Al Albequerqe's K/9 is actually higher then Robertsons. Benoit really started to get back to last years form around May and got his once high ERA to under 3.

This year, the Tigers pen has been just as effective as the Yankees (not comparing just Rivera to Valverde either). If I had to have one I'd take the Yankees because of Mo, but the Tigers are closer then you think with Valverde (who's gotten the job done each time this year, unlike Rivera), Benoit, AA, and Coke all quite strong pitchers.

And your scoreboard was pretty biased.

Fuck no it wasn't. In fact you're trying to make some of those slam dunks closer then they are (or you just aren't paying close enough attention to the great season some Tigers have been having).

 

[Rising Savior]

Ugh the Yankees win as predicted. Detroit just isn't good enough against The Yankees. Nova as been a complete stud for the yanks and he really surprised me tonight I was thinking he was gonna struggle tonight but no he was great. I'm calling a sweep in this series not to mention Verlander isn't very good against the yanks.

 

[Megatron]

Oh you guys and your position by position arguments.........

We did one of these at my website where a guy argued very poignantly that the Red Sox were better position by position than the Yankees. He was biased, but he wasn't that far off. Still, the Yankees are in the playoffs while Papi is on the golf course with the rest. It's not about individual stats and sabremetrics. If it was, maybe "Moneyball" would have ended with, you know, Oakland actually winning something.

It'll be about guys performing in the posteason. So far Nova came out and did well while Fister blew up in one inning. Whether Detroit has advantages or not, they didn't look great today.

Also, you can't take 3 guys in a bullpen and make a comparison. The Yankee bullpen also features Boone Logan, Ayala (who was bad today), and Cory Wade with ERAS under 3. Add them to Soriano, Robertson, and Rivera and most of your bullpen is capable of getting outs. That's big since Joe Girardi will overmanage every game of the postseason.

ST said the Yankees were 'pretty easily' more talented then teh Tigers, which is wrong.

Nova pitched well and caught a break here and there. But tomorrows a new day, so yeah.

Logan and Soriano don't have ERAs under 3, btw. And the Tigers have 3 of their own with ERAs under 3, another with one with about identical ERAs (with more IP) and one (Coke) who's ERA was bloated due to he started as a pitcher. The Tigers use about 5 guys in important situations (with Ryan Perry the other one getting more then 20 games this season and he's not on the playoff roster) and those guys have all been effective. It's closer then you guys are recognizing.

 

[JJYanks121]

ST said the Yankees were 'pretty easily' more talented then teh Tigers, which is wrong.

Nova pitched well and caught a break here and there. But tomorrows a new day, so yeah.

Logan and Soriano don't have ERAs under 3, btw. And the Tigers have 3 of their own with ERAs under 3, another with one with about identical ERAs (with more IP) and one (Coke) who's ERA was bloated due to he started as a pitcher. The Tigers use about 5 guys in important situations (with Ryan Perry the other one getting more then 20 games this season and he's not on the playoff roster) and those guys have all been effective. It's closer then you guys are recognizing.

I didn't say Soriano had an ERA under 3 though. He might since he's come back from injury but I said the "second three" had ERAS under 3 and that's true of Wade and Ayala. Logan bloats himself when he stays in for more than a hitter or two but hopefully he won't be used outside of getting out lefties in the postseason. That's his role and that's all he should do. But I stand by the Wade/Ayala thing as they both pitched well this year.

Both bullpens are good but whenever they show bullpen ERA stats, the Yankees are shown as the tops in baseball. Regardless, the regular season doesn't matter. I've seen plenty of guys dominate the regular season and falter in the postseason. So you can go on and on with the comparisons, but I throw them out the window come playoff time.

 

[Stormtrooper]

It'll be about guys performing in the posteason. So far Nova came out and did well while Fister blew up in one inning. Whether Detroit has advantages or not, they didn't look great today.

Don't knock Fister. He was damn good today. He didn't get roughed up at all. He can't help is his bullpen gave up a bomb to a guy who is (believe it or not) thought of as a top-5 hitter in all of baseball. Yes Mega, Robinson Cano is already on that level as Cabrera/Pujols.

 

[Stormtrooper]

Regardless, the regular season doesn't matter. I've seen plenty of guys dominate the regular season and falter in the postseason. So you can go on and on with the comparisons, but I throw them out the window come playoff time.

this times 10000.

Regular season means fuck all come postseason time. Verlander could easily give up 6 runs in 6 innings in Game 3 (as could Sabathia). You can win 30 games in the regular season, but it's the postseason that really matters.

 

[Megatron]

Don't knock Fister. He was damn good today. He didn't get roughed up at all. He can't help is his bullpen gave up a bomb to a guy who is (believe it or not) thought of as a top-5 hitter in all of baseball. Yes Mega, Robinson Cano is already on that level as Cabrera/Pujols.

No, Cano isn't on Cabrera's level. Look, I think he's a great hitter, but to put him in the same breath as a guy like Cabrera and Pujols isn't right. There isn't many guys at THAT level of those two. They've had consistently great seasons ever since they've been in the league. Honestly, it's tough for me to put anyone at their level because not many have had the consistency they've had for as long as they've had. Bautista's had seasons like them the last two seasons, but he's obviously not even as close in consistency. Cano's top 15 possibly top 10, but you could very well make an argument that there's a handful hitters better then him, but you can't do that with Cabrera.

Look, Cano's played 7 seasons, Cabrera's played 9. Cano has posted one season with an OPS above .900 (last year). Cabrera has posted OPS's above that 6 of 9 seasons (with two of them being his rookie and sophomore season and the other being his first year in a Tigers uni when he switched leagues and had to get used to AL pitchers). Cano's Offensive WAR totals are 25.7 (~3.6 a year) Cabrera's is 45.8 (~5.1) that's a huge differential. Cano's career OPS+ is 119, a very solid worth over 7 seasons (with only one below 100) Cabrera's is 149, a very wide margin (with none below 100 and only his rookie season below 120).

I know you wanna back your guy, but to say Cano is on Cabby's level is injustice to him because its Pujols, Cabrera (in that order) possibly Bautista if he can keep consistency for the next 3-4 years (which I doubt) then everyone else that can be argued for.

this times 10000.

Regular season means fuck all come postseason time. Verlander could easily give up 6 runs in 6 innings in Game 3 (as could Sabathia). You can win 30 games in the regular season, but it's the postseason that really matters.

I realize that, but that's not to say the Tigers aren't as talented, which is what we're arguing.

 

[Megatron]

That's why Cabrera's awesome, boys. Needed that. Huge to jump out on him right away.

 

[Megatron]

C'mon Max throw some strikes and make them put it in play.

 

[Megatron]

Wasn't pretty but won the inning. Gonna need a few more runs, though.

 

[hatehabsforever]

Nice to see one of the Detroit teams not sucking today. Goddamn Lions!

 

[Megatron]

Lions still have a shot, though.

 

[Megatron]

Much better inning Max. If he can get into a groove now we'll be in good position.

 

[Megatron]

Delmon could be a little more patient then he has been. Two first pitch outs.

 

[Megatron]

7 in a row retired for Max. Getting in a groove.

 

[Megatron]

Well we're seeing good Max early on, which is huge. Can't go back down 0-2.

 

[Megatron]

Good to see Max get out of that jam. His PC is a little high, but he's still pitching bagels.

 

[Megatron]

Time to bust it open boys.

 

[Megatron]

Clutch hitting yet again for Cabrera and Martinez. All started with an error by the Captain as well.

4-0.

 

[Megatron]

Would've loved one more, but at least we got some more.

 

[Big Sexy]

The Tigers need to close it out these last 4 innings. Going back to Detroit tied 1-1 with Verlander pitching is an ideal situation.

 

[Megatron]

Bye bye no no, but Scherzer wouldn't have lasted 9 innings anyway. If he can finish this inning at the same score I'll be happy.