CM Punk Ain't That Good

[angry_panda]

It seems to me that most people on here are bouncing between the kayfabe argument and the "real life argument".

First of all I'm not even gonna try and say if Punk is better than Cena/HHH/Orten, they are on different brands, so it matters not.

Sssssoooooo, Kayfabe first then, cause its fecking easy.....he retired the face of Smackdown! Do I really need to say anymore? Does he really need anymore credibility than that? Sure Hardy was on his way out, but Kayfabe (I.E the storyline of the Show) Punk did it. nuff said.

So that leaves none-kayfabe, so in this you cant say well he lost to this guy, or that guy etc, that’s kayfabe. This all boils down to do you enjoy his in ring work, his promos etc, and I do. I love it, I could watch an hour of Punk cutting promos, ffs when he ran on dressed as Hardy the other day, he made people cry...HE MADE THEM F*CKING CRY.

I love his work, he is one of the best things on Smackdown right now, and I look forward to his feud with taker, win or loose, I know he (along with taker) will make it very, very enjoyable.

 

[jimufctna24]

Kayfabe is dead,

Now ive got that out the way ill tell you why I Punk is so great and the best heel in wrestling at the moment

He is smooth on the mic and can carry a long promo and keep you interested, his gimmick is totally new and fresh which you cant say abou many in wrestling.

His feud with Jeff Hardy was the most fun I had with wrestling in years credit goes to Jeff for helping and get Punk over he did a awesome job but Punk more than carried his weight

In the ring he is a very good worker and has had decent matches with Morrison,Hardy and im sure he will have one with Taker

He is someone new getting in the main events which is vital as the main event scene in wwe is so stale and boring its like watching a repeat episode with RAW most weeks

For those saying about physique, I would prefer Punks physique which is natural than a steriod using near cripple like Dave Batista espicially in these days when the public is so anti-steriod (and rightfully so in my opinion)

He looks like a heel as well, he has chrasmia and ill pay him the ultimate comment coming from me, he is the best thing in wrestling I have enjoyed since Edge cracked the main event bracket in 2006

Punk is not dead

 

[axle124]

CM punk puts on a good match with just about anyone. His promos are getting better everytime out, so Punk is pretty good. Is he believable as a world champion of course not, but neiter is jeff hardy, rey misterio, john morrison, or wait for it chris jericho. Smack down is the second tier show, that does not have a lot of charisma out of the ring. Only a couple of the performers can even cut a decent promo.

 

[RawIsRamsey]

Alright, I've been dealing with Punk-hate for a few years now. He was a favorite of mine in RoH (especially after his spectacular matches with Joe and his tremendous TLC match with Chris Hero in IWA) and continues to be a favorite of mine. It was all about waiting for the opportunity for him to shine like he did on the indies and in OVW. Creative FINALLY was confident with him and gave him a chance to run with the ball, and not only did he score, he picked up a 2-point conversion AND the on-side kick.

The feud with Jeff made him a star. A win over Taker will make him legit. I'd say Punk could take the streak at Mania, but I believe that's being groomed for Swagger (and don't EVEN try to argue it with me!). It all depends on what they do with him AFTER the Taker feud...hopefully a recharged Edge or Mysterio?

He only looks as weak as how he's booked (case in point: his title run last year). He's been booked extremely strong, so he looks strong. He actually hasn't even looked bad so far with Taker. THAT is all based on Punk, though. His mic work...facials...that smug-ass smirk that makes you wanna slap the grease outta his hair...creative didn't come up with that. Phil Brooks did. Now, I'm a little worried about the match, as Punk hasn't really faced a lot of big guys, but he put on passable matches with Kane and Umaga, two guys who are nowhere near Taker's level of in-ring prowess. It's all how they book the ending.

Punk is on his way to being a legendary, memorable character, since it's something we haven't seen on WWE TV before...he's technically a good guy, telling us to do the right thing and fighting the people who go against his wholesome values, but he's so overzealous about his cause that he doesn't listen to reason. You'll hardly find another character as engaging right now as CM Punk.

 

[The Pope CTC MEM]

i see alot in Punk. his promos are great. he has 100000000X talent. he is one of the best heels in the biz IMO and he can wrestle.

 

[Viola Moonlight]

CM Punk is a great wrestler whom deserves to be in his position. He has honed his craft over the years inside the ring & is an excellent in ring worker. He has not been the cause of any serious injuries & has not sustained anything serious himself. He is very reliable for the WWE to push & is committed to the company. That fact he is also straight-edge means they won't be seeing him on the Wellness Policy violations list, which is a plus. He can work the mic & the persona as a heel, knowing how to draw heat from the crowd. As a face, he can make some sort of a connection with the crowd & can gain crowd support.

Besides the fact that he has not got the body of the stereotypical professional wrestler, CM Punk is the perfect package for any company. He has won audiences over in various companies & has been well-respected for what he has accomplished thus far. ROH audiences respected him, the company of pure wrestling. TNA audiences respected him, the company of high-impact, fast-paced wrestling. WWE audiences respects him, the company of entertainment, storytelling wrestling. Heck, even the original ECW audiences in the Hammerstein Ballroom respected him because of his wrestling background & they are hard to please.

All he needs now is the one big feud to propel him into stardom & solidify himself as a main event player.

 

[Tenta]

Well.... Let's see if I can shake the old rust off these here bones. It's an interesting theory, I suppose. You're not going to get an argument from me that Punk's first shot in the main event was, for lack of better word, lackluster. Granted, I personally feel that it was better than most people feel, and that Punk simply suffered from a lack of wrestlers to feud with, and a sense that the guy couldn't carry the marquee with names such as Cena and Trips. And then and there, I can't help but feel as though Creative was right in that assesment. Punk's first run as a main event wrestler was, for lack of better word, a flop, and I wouldn't dare dispute that.

However, there's an old saying in pro wrestling, and it's simple; you're only as good as your last match. And in recent months, Punk has been looking better than you even begin to give him credit for. As for your argument that he doesn't look credible from a kayfabe standpoint, I can see what you mean. How many credible heels wind up doing jobs? How many of them tend to make the face look great, and try to make their opponent look more talented, and get the crowd cheering for the face? How many of them are Hall of Famers, while going down in flames in a loss? I'm sure I couldn't possibly think of one possible name...

Oh yeah.... There's that guy....

Look, I'm not going to even attempt to say Punk is remotely in the same stratosphere as Ric Flair, but Punk is using the same type of strategy that worked for Ric Flair for a good thirty years. The type of heel that Punk is playing is one that makes his face challengers look credible, holding his counterparts to terrific matches, and making it appear as the man he's facing is a strong candidate... Before pulling off a victory. That's what Flair did for a good chunk of his porfessional career, and I'd dare say you would consider Flair one of the top five wrestlers all time, at the least. It's a simple forumula... The type of heel Punk portrays is one that makes his challengers look good, while managing to get the heat eventually. It's a simple formula, that has been followed for long before you or I were wrestling fans.

In short, I believe you have your logic somewhat twisted... Whilst you're of the belief that it's the heels that should look good, and the faces job, it's truly the other way around. Faces are made to look formidible, while the heel, Punk, does all he can to make that face look strong. Before, eventually, getting the well deserved heat.

 

[spiketbear]

CM Punk is one of the most exciting wrestlers I've seen in recent years. He has a certain unique style that sets him apart. His heel promos sting with a hint of truth and he is articulate enough to sound good cuttting them. Punk is also a very versatile in ring performer. He can have HHH/Cena/Orton-type brawl matches if he wants, he can be a high flier like Jeff, and he can be a technical guy with his submissions and martial arts moves. He has chrarisma and the ability to emote to tell a good in-ring story. He is something special and WWE knows it. That's why he is a 3-time heavyweight champ already, and it won't stop anytime soon.

 

[CH David]

I skimmed over most of the posts, didn't really take heed to any except a few.

I'm going to cut straight to the chase. I don't know what people see in him, but he is not that good, and he damn sure isn't a credible main eventer. He has been given title after title, but really what has he done to truley deserve this? I'm speaking in a ratio of about 80% kayfabe/20% reality.

How isn't he a credible main eventer? He has taken the WWE by storm, after taking over the Indys. He can wrestle any type of match, technical, hardcore, long match, short match, with almost anybody, and make it passable at worst. He is one of the better technical wrestlers, and has more moves in his arsenal, but doesn't use them in the WWE.

I'm going to go from when he won his first MITB and got drafted to RAW. Who has he beaten? He was jobbing out the ass until one day he gets a fluke win over Edge for the WHC. Then what? He gets a double DQ in a match against Batista and looks completely weak during the match. He beats Snitsky, William Regal, and JBL a couple of times. He loses the title by getting taken out by Orton.

So you are going to say his first MITB was a fluke? You are right it was. If you go back, in reality, it was meant for Jeff Hardy, and I don't think anyone will deny that. Remember, 2008 was going to be Jeff's year to become huge, but he got suspended and they went to the most reliable person, who was Punk. So when that happened, Punk wasn't in the best setting to take the title, but who was going to take the title from Edge and give Raw a title? Punk had to use MITB to keep the title on Raw. Then it was a clusterfuck because there was no one that Punk could really feud with at the time.

He wins the tag straps with Kofi and loses them at a house show to M&M. Wins the IC title Tourney and beats Regal after 3 DQ wins in a row. He defends against no one and loses clean to JBL.

Actually, there were only 3 matches, 2 were DQ, Punk won the first by DQ, and then lost the rematch by DQ. Then Punk won the 3rd in a No DQ match. Would you want a title match to end in DQ and not have any continuance in a feud? That would make many people pretty pissed, so they finished it and gave Punk the title.

He sporadically jobs and doesn't get any huge victories and then wins MITB. Loses cleanly to Kane and Umaga (in his hometown), then beats Umaga twice cleanly.

It caught people by surprise. You know, make someone look weak, then beat a behemoth in Umaga and use that momentum to push forward.

Cashes in on Hardy the same night and gets another fluke WHC win.

You see, I don't see how this is a fluke win? But then again, if you are saying his wins are flukes, then you are saying that Edge's wins are flukes as well. You can't not say that without being a hypocrite. Besides, Jeff kicked out of the first GTS, and put up a semi-decent fight, so it wasn't like it was one move and finished. Give Punk some credit.

Loses to Morrison cleanly on TV twice, but finally gets a clean win before his title defense.

He was putting Morrison over. Is that hard to comprehend?

Gets a DQ loss to Hardy. Loses by DQ to Khali in a match in which he got squashed. Gets pinned by Matt Hardy in a tag match. Loses to Hardy cleanly for the WHC. Then beats him the next month two nights in a row because Jeff was leaving the company...he HAD to drop the strap. Loses to Matt Hardy by DQ last week on Smackdown.

So he DQ'd himself against Jeff to save his title. Seems like something a heel would do. I think any match with Khali could be a squash, so why not get a DQ and try to save yourself. Losing to Jeff cleanly was an attempt to actually try and get Jeff to resign in reality. That they trusted him as the face, but Jeff felt too burnt out, so he left. Beating him in one of the best matches of the year at Summerslam, I thought Jeff actually had a chance to win that match. The cage match was awesome as well. Of course we knew that Jeff was leaving, but what about those that didn't? It just showed that Punk could be the Rainbow-Haired Warrior. The rivalry was very good, and probably could have gone further if Jeff didn't want to leave.

With that said, where is the credibility in this character? He doesn't have the physique, his moves aren't devestating in comparison to his peers, and he isn't a threat to anyone! What the hell has this guy done that seem to make people say, "Oh he's such a great heel!" The guy is average at best and isn't bringing any credibility or prestige to the main event scene on Smackdown. I mean he can't even beat a fat ass Matt Hardy?

Then how the fuck was Chris Jericho a champion? How was Edge a champion? Fuck I'll go so far as saying how was HBK a champion? They aren't the biggest guys or have the best physiques. If it were based on physique, Lashley would have been a multiple time World Heavyweight Champion, not ECW, but World, or WWE Champion, Masters would be a champion, and so on.

He has a better moveset than a lot of people, he just doesn't use them. And on Smackdown, where the competition isn't as huge (sizewise) as Triple H is, or Batista, or Cena, he does awesome with who he works with. But he works his ass off to do what he does. How isn't he a great heel? His promos have been second to none the past few months. I'm not going to spoil anything since I was there, but watch Smackdown tonight, things may surprise you. And after it comes on I will probably come back and talk.

If this guy can be WHC ANYONE can be WHC. Where is Punk's big win? Where is his moment of glory that solidifies him? I mean c'mon he is a 3 time champion now. He can EASILY go back to the mid card at anytime. The guy isn't that good and damn sure shouldn't be WHC. I think the WWE agrees with me and will take it off of him at Breaking Point and have him feud with Hardy in the mid card to upper mid card where he belongs.

So you are saying if CM Punk can be champion, Eugene can win? Slam Master J can win? Fucking Santino can win? You are out of your mind with that notion. Lets see about wins. His clean win over Morrison in 2007 for the then relevant ECW title was huge, and a great match as well. Umm, MITB was a big win as well, both of them. His TLC and Cage matches with Jeff. And if he can slip back to the mid-card, isn't that good since he can elevate people? Jericho is the same way. So you tell me about Jericho too.

So you honestly don't know why Punk is where he is do you? Great matches and great promos during his Indy days.

This is some funny shit. Watch it, go ahead.



Punk can get under anyones skin.



He also has one at Death Before Dishonor 3 which was a heel turn, which was absolutely remarkable.

Paradox had the Jeff Hardy imitation promo. If you can get people to cry, how is that not a great promo?

Punk can have great matches, hell he had the first 5 Star match that Dave Metzler handed out in over a decade I believe when he faced Samoa Joe in ROH.

The reason Punk is where he is is because he earned it. He worked his way up as a kid to be a wrestler. He loves the business. He worked his way up, from backyard wrestling, to being actually trained, to the top of Indy promotions such as IWA: Mid-South, ROH, FIP, MLW, and was in TNA for a time. Now he is finally in WWE, having earned it. There is no question that Punk is one of the top heels, if not the top heel in WWE today. You just seem to either not like him much suneeboy, or are just blinded by your love of the Attitude Era.

 

[byrnside]

here is the word of clarity from me C.M Punk is a great heel i give that but look at him he is extremely small hell i know what match i would have wanted for breaking point Undetaker V.s The Champ Kane put C.M Punk beside Kane and you will see that the kid has nothing on the big red guy he deserves it more than C.M and hell he is a lot more interesting in the ring than Cookie-Monster Punk

In the words of Peter Griffin.. "I, uh... what?" You guys are nuts. C.M. Punk is without a doubt one of the top 3 heels in the WWE for a reason. It's hard to say it now with all the stuff that just came out about Jeff Hardy. But Punk's straightedge promos, really had me almost legitimately pissed off, because I don't live straightedge by a long shot. But that's what a good heel does, he pisses you off. And there's no way I'm going into a debate about his in ring work.. It's second to none. IMO, he revolutionized the current style the WWE is in/working towards.