At least 27 People Dead, 18 of them children.

[Beastmode 24]

The sheer glee you seem to have for shooting people saddens me, it truly does. How can one person have such little regard for human life? Keep in mind, you're not indicating you'd only shoot if your life was in danger, you're not indicating you'd only shoot after assessing the situation...if there's someone in your house, they're dead. That's your mentality.

How can you possibly think like this?

No, I'm saying that if someone comes into MY house on My property with the intention to steal from or harm my family, they will be dealt with. I'm honestly a pretty chill person for the most part, but I'm a firm believer in fuck with my shit and you will be dealt with. If someone comes into my house and they're not armed, I'll probably still pull a gun on them, but I'll most likely restrain them until the police arrive. If they come into my house and they have a gun and they're willing to use it, then I'm going to shoot them. I don't have glee when it comes to killing people. I'm in the Army and it haunts me every day to see some of the stuff I've seen. What I am saying is to defend my property and family, I'm willing to do what I have to do.


But you can sit over there with no guns or way to defend yourself, and if you ever get robbed (I honestly hope this never happens to you) by someone who has a gun, you can beg for your life and pray to God you don't get killed.

Me? I'll take a fighting chance.

 

[Slash-LN]

The sheer glee you seem to have for shooting people saddens me, it truly does. How can one person have such little regard for human life? Keep in mind, you're not indicating you'd only shoot if your life was in danger, you're not indicating you'd only shoot after assessing the situation...if there's someone in your house, they're dead. That's your mentality.

How can you possibly think like this?

I was at my former boss's house one day and we were talking about this. He has the same mentality. He has guns all over his house and flat out said if anyone were to break into his house he wouldn't give them the benefit of the doubt nor wait to see if they were armed or not.

One of our co-workers who is also a friend of mine is the same way. He carries a gun on him at all times because he got stuck up at a gas station once. So now he feels he needs to arm himself at all times.

 

[Rayne]

No, I'm saying that if someone comes into MY house on My property with the intention to steal from or harm my family, they will be dealt with. I'm honestly a pretty chill person for the most part, but I'm a firm believer in fuck with my shit and you will be dealt with. If someone comes into my house and they're not armed, I'll probably still pull a gun on them, but I'll most likely restrain them until the police arrive. If they come into my house and they have a gun and they're willing to use it, then I'm going to shoot them. I don't have glee when it comes to killing people. I'm in the Army and it haunts me every day to see some of the stuff I've seen. What I am saying is to defend my property and family, I'm willing to do what I have to do.


But you can sit over there with no guns or way to defend yourself, and if you ever get robbed (I honestly hope this never happens to you) by someone who has a gun, you can beg for your life and pray to God you don't get killed.

Me? I'll take a fighting chance.

Yes, I think we're all on the same page that no one hopes anyone gets robbed by criminals with guns. We're talking about how to prevent that.

Now then. I've demonstrated that, knowing that a homeowner is armed, a burglar will use a drastic increase in the amount of force he requires in order to rob your house. Your counter to this seems to be "well, I have friends who will go all rogue, find their weapon, load, draw, arm, and fire it in the time it takes someone to shoot their child." How does the presence of the firearm make anyone safer?

 

[Nate DaMac]

If you will shoot someone to protect your fucking material items, you're just as big of a monster as the burglar is. Fuck your possessions.

 

[BaconBits]

If you will shoot someone to protect your fucking material items, you're just as big of a monster as the burglar is. Fuck your possessions.

This. Times 1000. Useless shit can be replaced.

 

[Барбоса]

There have been several invasions of mainland Britain from France and Scandinavia since the Norman Conquest.

It's just that very few of them were successful to any extent.

 

[Slyfox696]

There have been several invasions of mainland Britain from France and Scandinavia since the Norman Conquest.

It's just that very few of them were successful to any extent.

It's because the British citizens were armed with handguns, right?

 

[Барбоса]

It's because the British citizens were armed with handguns, right?

Would have been quite difficult to have them in 13th century.

 

[The Brain]

Trust me guy, no one could get me first. First of all, I'm a light sleeper, and every time I hear any kind of sound outside my house I'm up and investigating. If someone tried to get into my house, I most definatley would be able to get the jump on them, because I have a blueprint of my house that I study constantly to try to find ways that I could get the jump on them. Plus, if they came into a room, the doorway's a fatal funnel that I would be able to eliminate them in.

I'm not a gun nut, and I don't think I'm invincible, but If I can survive a deployment to Iraq, and if I really don't give a fuck about what it takes to defend my house, you're going the fuck down.

This all seems very odd to me but I'm going to go ahead and assume you're Jack Bauer, Dirty Harry, and John McClane rolled into one. We're not talking about you personally. We're talking about John Q. Public.

 

[Slyfox696]

Would have been quite difficult to have them in 13th century.

Wait...I thought private gun ownership is why no one invades countries.

Are you sure about that?

 

[Барбоса]

Guns have rarely stopped anyone from trying anything

 

[Slash-LN]

An 11 year old in Utah took a gun to school for protection at the request of his parents.
What does he do with it?

"He pulled out a gun and he put it to my head — me and my friend — (and) said he was going to kill us," Isabelle Rios told KSL. "I told him I was going to tell, but he said, ‘If you tell, I'm going to kill you.'"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/18/student-brings-gun-to-school_n_2324143.html?ref=topbar

Clearly those parents aren't teaching their kid gun safety and he could potentially hurt somebody.

 

[Shocky]

If you will shoot someone to protect your fucking material items, you're just as big of a monster as the burglar is. Fuck your possessions.

This. Times 1000. Useless shit can be replaced.

Then why bother having locks on doors. Someone has made the decision to go into a home that isn't theirs. Chances are that home has at least one, if not two locked doors, and at least a lock and deadbolt on said door. That is all the warning that person needs. There are castle doctrines that allow you to protect what is yours. I don't work for someone else to come steal my shit. If someone invades my property, I have the right to do what every I see fit. It's people like you that want to turn victims into criminals that is becoming a huge problem.

Guns have rarely stopped anyone from trying anything

Just a blatantly false statement.

An 11 year old in Utah took a gun to school for protection at the request of his parents.
What does he do with it?

"He pulled out a gun and he put it to my head — me and my friend — (and) said he was going to kill us," Isabelle Rios told KSL. "I told him I was going to tell, but he said, ‘If you tell, I'm going to kill you.'"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/18/student-brings-gun-to-school_n_2324143.html?ref=topbar

Clearly those parents aren't teaching their kid gun safety and he could potentially hurt somebody.

Quoting an anti-gun article from the Huffington Post is like going to Fox News to read about how great Mitt Romney is. Is extremely slanted journalism that pushes a left leaning agenda.


And here's a story about guns being used for the purpose they were intended, but of course its not sexy enough to create controversy.

Police say a 14-year-old boy shot an intruder who broke into his Phoenix home and pulled a gun on him as he was watching his three younger siblings.



http://www.kpho.com/story/18860571/14-year-old-boy-shoots-phoenix-burglar

 

[Shocky]

But if the person entering your house didn't have a gun, the stakes go way down and you no longer need a pistol to defend your home. This argument that all criminals will suddenly have guns when everyone else doesn't is simply wrong.

A person doesn't need to be armed with a firearm to be seen as a threat entering your home. A knife, a tire iron, a crowbar, hell bare handed, someone in your house at a time when you're vulnerable (night time sleeping) is a huge threat.

Believe me, I would love to live in a world where I don't need a gun, but I'm also not going to allow myself to be a victim if I can help it. As a victim of an armed robbery, I know when the time is to fight back. There are certain situations where you simply are helpless, but there are also situations where you can take control.

 

[Slash-LN]

Quoting an anti-gun article from the Huffington Post is like going to Fox News to read about how great Mitt Romney is. Is extremely slanted journalism that pushes a left leaning agenda.

So because you disagree with the source the story is less true?

My argument was against the parent sending their child to school with a gun. It isn't safe.

I didn't say that guns are bad. I said the parents are for not teaching him safety with the weapon.

 

[Shocky]

So because you disagree with the source the story is less true?

My argument was against the parent sending their child to school with a gun. It isn't safe.

I didn't say that guns are bad. I said the parents are for not teaching him safety with the weapon.

I'm anti media almost all around. Almost every media source has an agenda and a higher master they answer to.

Adults letting their children take guns to school is beyond stupid, and those parents should be shot.

All I'm saying, newspapers like the Huffington Post will use any type of anti-gun news to push their agenda, but will willfully ignore any pro-gun story out there.

 

[Slash-LN]

All I'm saying, newspapers like the Huffington Post will use any type of anti-gun news to push their agenda, but will willfully ignore any pro-gun story out there.

I'll have to take your word for it. I don't read it enough to know. I just saw that article and thought the parents were horrible for doing that.

 

[JGlass]

I'm anti media almost all around. Almost every media source has an agenda and a higher master they answer to.

Adults letting their children take guns to school is beyond stupid, and those parents should be shot.

All I'm saying, newspapers like the Huffington Post will use any type of anti-gun news to push their agenda, but will willfully ignore any pro-gun story out there.

My theory is literally every media outlet right now is pushing the same agenda right now: fear. I reckon most news channels right now don't care if you put down the paper/turn off the tv/close your tab with a new perspective on gun ownership in the United States, all they want is for you to keep giving them your time/money to make sure you don't miss a second of the grim and horrifying details about how you could be the next victim.

It's worth noting that after Friday gun sales have gone up, which I think is just proof of how powerful the fear mongering media is.

Then again, I might just be overly cynical. I have been known to be so in the past.

 

[Slyfox696]

Quoting an anti-gun article from the Huffington Post is like going to Fox News to read about how great Mitt Romney is. Is extremely slanted journalism that pushes a left leaning agenda.

I wouldn't say Huffington Post is as bad as Fox. Thinkprogress.org definitely is, but Fox News, website and TV, is incredibly extreme to the right. Huffington Post isn't as extreme to the left, though they definitely lean clearly to the left.

A person doesn't need to be armed with a firearm to be seen as a threat entering your home. A knife, a tire iron, a crowbar, hell bare handed, someone in your house at a time when you're vulnerable (night time sleeping) is a huge threat.

But if someone enters your house with a knife or a tire iron or what have you, then you can grab your baseball bat.

If I'm sleeping, I'd MUCH rather an intruder to be carrying any of the weapons you mentioned than a gun. An intruder could stand outside my bedroom doorway and shoot me dead before I even awoke. For any of those other objects, they'd have to get much closer and even then, I have a much better chance of fighting back and surviving.

Believe me, I would love to live in a world where I don't need a gun

Ban assault rifles and handguns, and the likelihood of you needing a gun goes way down. That's the point I'm getting at.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

I'm anti media almost all around. Almost every media source has an agenda and a higher master they answer to.

I heard the same thing on a cable news network, so it must be true.

 

[Nate DaMac]

Then why bother having locks on doors. Someone has made the decision to go into a home that isn't theirs. Chances are that home has at least one, if not two locked doors, and at least a lock and deadbolt on said door. That is all the warning that person needs. There are castle doctrines that allow you to protect what is yours. I don't work for someone else to come steal my shit. If someone invades my property, I have the right to do what every I see fit. It's people like you that want to turn victims into criminals that is becoming a huge problem.

It's fucking stuff. Unless you have Jesus' autographed drinking glass, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that nothing in your home is worth more than someone's life.

If you're defending your life or your children's life or whatever, more power to you. The fact remains that the gun in your house is far more likely to cause a death in your home than someone else's.

 

[Richard Blonoff]

I own a gun, a shotgun, because my dad used to take me hunting in my early teens, but I literally have no use for it now. I know how to safely handle it and most other guns. If a serial killer was in my house, yeah I would use it, but if a guy breaks in and wants my stuff, just take my fucking stereo, I'm not going to kill a man over a goddamn stereo.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

I own a gun, a shotgun, because my dad used to take me hunting in my early teens, but I literally have no use for it now. I know how to safely handle it and most other guns. If a serial killer was in my house, yeah I would use it, but if a guy breaks in and wants my stuff, just take my fucking stereo, I'm not going to kill a man over a goddamn stereo.

What if it were Jesus' autographed stereo?

#inappropriate, but seriously this conversation has seriously devolved. Let's all blame Stormtrooper.

 

[Rayne]

I'm anti media almost all around. Almost every media source has an agenda and a higher master they answer to.

Adults letting their children take guns to school is beyond stupid, and those parents should be shot.

All I'm saying, newspapers like the Huffington Post will use any type of anti-gun news to push their agenda, but will willfully ignore any pro-gun story out there.

I know. The media hasn't been covering all of the pro-cancer stories either. I heard about a guy who had a malignant tumor, went to his doctor, found out he had a heart defect. If it wasn't for cancer, he'd be dead today!

I'm absolutely sure people can find cases where someone used a gun to kill someone else with a gun that had vicious intentions. What's far more common is when someone uses a firearm in the commission of a robbery or burglary, or when a child gets shot playing with idiot daddy's unsecured firearm. There is a mutual problem that can be addressed here- reduce the fucking supply of guns. This isn't a "turn in your guns tomorrow!" issue, this is an issue where we need to reduce the supply over time. (I can go much more in depth on this, and have earlier in this thread- it's late, I don't feel like cut and pasting, but if you'd like, I'd be happy to discuss.)

I read in a Nicholas Kristof piece (NY Times) earlier today that a child is fourteen times more likely to die as a result of a firearm in the US than they are in other industrialized countries in the world. Either the rest of the industrialized world is beating the shit out of us when it comes to mental health, or we might have a firearms problem in this country.

 

[Tastycles]

I've said this before, but nobody responded. The chances are if someone is going to rob your house, there's going to be more than one of them. That big TV isn't going to go easily. Say you hear them and you shoot one, the other one, assuming he is armed, will shoot you and run away. Your TV still lives in your house, but you don't anymore.

Since the vast majority of people here seem to think they are some sort of rootin' tootin' demon with a gun that couldn't possibly make a mistake. I'm going to tell you a personal story.

I am willing to bet that with the exception of those in the army, I have used a gun more than any of you. I went to military school, and am like Forrest Gump at dismantling and reassembling this:

And was forever in the shooting range.

When I got a bit older, the time came to teach the younger kids how to use the gun properly. When you take one apart, there's often a bullet lodged somewhere it shouldn't be, so you have to inspect it. 90% of the time, there isn't one. 9.9% of the time there is and you can clearly see it. 0.1% of the time, it's in an odd place, so the last point of the inspection is to fire the gun in a safe direction. It was so uncommon for the bullet to be hidden in this way that nobody ever used to bother to tell the kids to do this, and just said if they were confident it wasn't loaded they could pull the trigger to reset the mechanism. This one time, I did it properly, there was a bullet in a little girls' gun that safely went out of the way. Had I not done my job properly, which most people usually didn't, there's a good chance she'd have killed somebody.

What the lesson here is, is clearly you should always be safe and thorough with things like this, but most people aren't, because they are complacent with the familiarity. If I gave someone British who wasn't me an assault rifle, they'd be careful as fuck. I probably wouldn't be so much, I'm desensitised to it. If you make guns a part of everyday life, you remove the enormity of what they really are. That means using one safely is less likely to happen. How many times do you think you'd run the safety checks if you were flying a space shuttle? Compare that to how many times you check the oil in your car. It also, of course, means you resort to using them more readily.

The other lesson I can give you from my life in Full Metal Jacket Jr. is this. Guns are mass produced quite cheaply and still largely rely on very mechanical movements to work. That means they malfunction, quite regularly.

When the hamburgler comes in for your TV, armed but with no pre-meditated idea of killing anybody, you jump out at him and shoot him. Click. Gun's jammed. RIP.

This romantic idea of protecting yourself and yours with a gun? It's great, but the reality will be removed from that, almost always. There'll be two perpetrators, you'll miss, it'll actually be a surprise barbershop quartet your wife ordered. Who knows?