All Future Wrestlemania Discussion (Matches, Gimmicks, Angles.... KEEP IT IN HERE!)

Who will Lesnar face at Mania

  • Rock

  • HHH

  • CM Punk

  • Orton

  • Undertaker

  • Cena

  • Other


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could be a great one but will it? in order for it too be great everything right needs too happen

1 the streak needs too continue plain and simple

2 cena NEEDS to win this is his match too win he has not had a wrestlemania moment outside of the (wwe title) he is now bigger than the championship he needs his moment

3 hbk needs too screw hhh its epic its drama its what mania is about !

4 sheamus needs too win and bring prestige back too winning the rumble

5 punk needs too win too me punk is not a big time player until he gets a win over a big name star fairly his wins over cena were cheap cena got screwed besides that hes beatin miz and del rio LOL
 
I think Wrestlemania this year does have some potential and while a lot of people have their own opinions about the matches and the build, just the shear fact that everyone is talking about it this much leads me to believe that things will be good. As with everything, if you get your expectations too high then something is going to let you down. Everyone should just enjoy what does happen sunday. I know I'll be ordering the PPV and honestly the WWE can only do better then that garbage they portrayed as a Wrestlemania last year. So long as nothing remotely happens like last year's Mania ever again, then well WWE will be in the right direction. There are 2 matches that got some serious, if not way too much, build in Rock/Cena and HHH/Taker but rightfully so. 4 of the biggest stars in the WWE. The 2 championship matches are up in the air. If for some stupid reason Punk/Jericho isn't to people's expectations match wise then that'll be a giant let down considering the build up has been hit and miss. Sheamus/Bryan I think the build up hasn't been the best but that goes back to Shemus winning the rumble to begin with but I do think the match can be enjoyable. Show/Rhodes is the match I'm on the fence about. I'm not worried about Rhodes but Big Show can have decent matches and then he can have awful matches. Personally I think Rhodes should retain to cement in my mind that he actually did bring prestige back to the IC belt unlike how WWE seems to claim. A long title run but minimal title defenses in PPV matches simply means your middle card is weak. Long/Teddy team match I'm honestly looking forward to. I do wish it was elimination style but well whatever. The divas' match is just whatever, too bad what happened with Kharma because I wish we'd see Beth vs her or Nattie. Orton vs Kane has the weirdest built going into Mania. I guess what can you expect from a person (Orton) whose person he was supposed to probably feud with gets injured. As for Kane well, his matches with Cena did him no favors but I think throwing him in a feud with Cena wasn't supposed to do any favors, just an experiment gone wrong with WWE. Yes I'm glad Kane is back but whomever he feuds with next shouldn't feel thrown together just for the hell of it. I do wish the tag-champs were on the card to some degree but after being fed to the Big Show, I doubt it, even in a dark match capacity. Also, I really hope WWE doesn't do any of their unannounced type matches like they've done the last 2 ppv's. Not only does it come off as cheap but usually they're matches that are very forgettable. With everything said though, Wrestlemania this year does have a great chance. 3 matches I think people will be talking about or at least I hope it comes off that way. The other matches people should just enjoy for well what they are.
 
This Wrestlemania looks strong from a Main Event standpoint - Rock/Cena, Taker/HHH, Punk/Jericho. 3 really strong main events.

The undercard leaves a lot to be desired though. Orton vs Kane, yes, thats a strong match up but the Divas bout is appalling, Rhodes vs Show is stupid and Long vs Laurinatis lacks star quality.

I am not complaining, I just think WWE could have booked the event better. Injuries have played a HUGE PART in the demise of the undercard though. We have been roobed of Christian, Del Rio, Wade Barrett, Rey and Sin Cara 'and' Kharma. Imagine an undercard with Orton vs Del Rio, Rey vs Sin Cara and a MITB match?

Even without the talents I mentioned, Cody vs Goldust made a much stronger story to it than Cody vs Big Show. Orton should have been thrown into the World Title match making it a triple threat and Kane and Big Show should have been on opposite teams in the 6 on 6 match. Finally Beth vs Natalya. Why wont they do this?
 
I would be happy if just half of the PPV was great, the main matches were awesome and the rest can be filler.

But each year it's anticipation then WTF was that maybe 2 good matches the rest is just ok at best. am i watching TNA? but it's not just WrestleMania, every PPV is just ok nothing special.

Like the stars, the PPV's are all cookie cutter atleast from an "entertainment" standpoint.

this years WrestleMania seems they left it too late to decide anything, same with last 2 yrs actually where nothing was decided til the last 2 months.

atleast for me
Cena vs Rock - good on paper, could go either way but should be epic
Taker vs HHH - has already been decided so it's a moot point no way Taker will or should lose, it's just how will HBK cost HHH the match
Sheamus vs Bryan - meh
Punk vs Jericho - think they seriously botched that return and subsequent fued, match could still be a show stealer though
Diva Tag Match - WHY!!!! so who's been punished this year
Big Show vs Cody - waste of air time regardless of who wins
Randy Orton vs Kane - befuddling build up or lack of. Yeah i know they had a 1 match past b4 Kane was sidelined but it's just a way to give them something to do. Boring Match
Team Jobber vs Team Loser (just get rid of both of em and hire Hulk Hogan, he couldn't do much worse LOL) yeah i know that was a rib

no tag title match again - unless it's a dark match
no US title match again since hes booked in the Loser vs Jobber match

so that's maybe 4 watchable matches out of 8 matches in a 4 hr show better then normal but still seems really flat.
 
It's always going to be hard for the company to satisfy everyone's expectations. We're the audience, we want to be entertained and expect miracles. Spending time on this forum shows us that there are many fans who detest absolutely everything WWE does.....and you have to wonder why they keep watching if they hate it so much.

Also, it's the company's fault for promoting Wrestlemania each year as the "greatest event of all time" which presupposes each year is going to top the next. How can they ever measure up to that? ( I remember an NFL player quoted as saying: "If the Super Bowl is the ultimate game, how come they're playing it again next year?")

When you come down to it, WM features the same guys you've been seeing all along, right? There are only so many combinations of Cena-Sheamus-Punk-Jericho-Orton, etc. etc. you can put together to make everything seem fresh. Then, there isn't enough time on Raw and Smackdown to build every feud into an epic encounter; if they tried, there wouldn't be any wrestling matches.....only promos! This year, feuds like Sheamus-Bryan and Kane-Orton have been contrived for Wrestlemania; there's no real substance behind them. They'll probably be terrific matches to watch, yet I find myself curiously non-invested in the reason for them fighting in the first place.

If there's a feature that makes WM stand out as a true event, it's having matches involving people who don't normally perform in WM. This year, it's obviously The Rock; we're interested because seeing him fight today's #1 WWE performer is something rare and special. Last year, a lot of the excitement came from something that never even happened: the possibility of Sting coming in to fight Undertaker. Next year, maybe it's Brock Lesnar.....but the effect is the same; we'll get to see something we don't get for any other PPV. If there's anything unique about WM......that's it.

In any event, Wrestlemania features pageantry and excitement from beginning to end, along with the best wrestling matches WWE has to offer. Ironically, we tend to regard WMs of the past as great even though we probably dissed them at the time as being nothing special.

That's who we are.....we're the audience....entertain us!
 
Sure, it's possible to be satisfied. Quality is always going to be subjective but it most certainly helps if you go into a show with the hopes of actually being entertained rather than watching it mostly just to find something to complain about. If a ppv has quality wrestling matches, storylines that you're interested in seeing play out inside the ring and wrestlers that you're invested in, then I think the formula is there for potential satisfaction.

The problem is, however, that a hefty portion of the IWC is made up of fans that are about as far from reasonable as you can get. I've been posting in WZ for 3 years now and if there's one thing I've learned when it comes to the WWE, internet fans and dirtsheet writers is that it's nearly impossible for WWE to win. No matter how good something is, no matter who gets pushed, no matter what unexpected twists and turns pop up, the WWE still catches flack from all different sides. Over the course of the build for WM 28, I've read a lot of posts that make it sound like those fans have already made up their minds to be disappointed if EVERYTHING doesn't turn out the way they want it to. For instance, in the WM 28 section, I think a thread was created a while back talking about the order of the matches and how some matches will suck if they're in a certain order. For instance, Poster 1 says something like "well Bryan vs. Sheamus will suck ass if it goes on after Punk vs. Jericho" while Poster 2 says something like "Any match after Undertaker and Triple H won't be worth watching" and so on and so forth. To me, it's a ludicrous notion. What it boils down to is for some inexplicable reason, there are lots of internet fans that want WrestleMania to fail. They want the show to suck, they want the matches to fall flat, yet they also intend to devote the 4 hours and $55 it takes to watch the event.

When I look at the WM card, the top 4 matches have potential greatness written all over them:

Cena vs. Rock will be a physical, hard fought spectacle in which I think both guys will leave it all in the ring. It might not be a "technical masterpiece", but the story will be there and I have a feeling the action will be as well.

Taker vs. Triple H at HIAC has all the makings of another all time WrestleMania classic match. Again, the storyline is more than there, the emotional investment of fans' interest in Taker's streak and the potential end of a storied career is there, the action will be there, the x factor of HBK's presence adds questions and wonder as to how it will turn out.

Punk vs. Jericho features arguably the two best overall pro wrestlers in the world at the biggest event of the year for the WWE Championship. Like most people, I'm expecting nothing short of a clinic for this match and I have no reason to think that we won't get it. Whenever CM Punk or Chris Jericho makes a statement about putting on a match to steal the show, the match tends to do just that. They're more than capable.

Bryan vs. Sheamus features two very over wrestlers that work really well together and their styles mesh very well. Sheamus is a big Irish lug with a stiff, physical style that fans love to cheer for. Daniel Bryan's character comes off as a world class jerk that people will pay to see get his ass kicked all over the ring. Like Sheamus, he has a physical, stiff style coupled with great natural athleticism and is a mat specialist. If anything, I don't think people are giving this match enough credit.

Even most of the matches that seem as "filler" this year sound really good. In terms of overall story, Orton vs. Kane is pretty weak but I've little doubt it'll deliver solid action. The GM vs. GM match is somewhat iffy. There are lots of great wrestlers involved in the match and this match can also be much better than expected if most of the focus is kept on the wrestlers & the match itself instead of whatever shenanigans might go on between Teddy, Big Johnny, Hornswoggle, Vickie & Aksana. Rhodes vs. Big Show has told a solid story in my view. Overall, since coming back from his "injury" from Mark Henry, Show's been doing some of the best work of his career and Rhodes, in my eyes, has become one of the best young heels working today in both the ring and on the mic.

That's not to say that WM 28 couldn't wind up sucking, but I'm not going into the show with expectations and even hope that it does suck. If that, however, is the sort of attitude a fan is taking going into it, then there's almost nothing WWE can do to satisfy them. If you have hopes & beliefs that WM can be good, you'll have a good shot of coming out of the show entertained. If you go into it determined to nitpick at this and that, complain if this match doesn't end the way you think it short or this match went on sooner or later than it should have, then why bother?
 
You have to have some bad matches for the the top ones to succeed. Look at Wrestlemania 10. Do you think Shawn/Razor would have "stole the show" if every other match on the card was a Bret/Owen classic? Hell no.

You will always have the crappy matches, because if you didn't the audience would be DEAD by the main event. They would be so worn out from screaming, jumping and yelling from every spot or moment. The Wrestlemania MAIN EVENT (or Co/Triple Main Events) is the selling point of the show and MUST be successful for the show to be successful.

So does the event have to be perfect from start to finish? Of course not....but the the selling points must live up to the hype. This year... Rock/Cena, HHH/Taker and Punk/Jericho must be memorable. If they are, and the other 5 matches stink up the place, it still might go down as one of the best ever.
 
Yes, the IWC will be satisfied with this Mania in 5 years and whatever is going on at that point in time will be the worst thing known to man, until 5 years after that, they will look favorably on that and say "how come no one today draws an emotion response like Cena did 10 years ago?"

I will likely be satisfied with this year's Mania. There are filler matches like the women's match but so what. It's strategic. You MUST give the crowd a break.
 
Yes, the IWC will be satisfied with this Mania in 5 years and whatever is going on at that point in time will be the worst thing known to man, until 5 years after that, they will look favorably on that and say "how come no one today draws an emotion response like Cena did 10 years ago?"

I will likely be satisfied with this year's Mania. There are filler matches like the women's match but so what. It's strategic. You MUST give the crowd a break.

I think the problem with the IWC is that you get these dumbass ideas in your heads and you convince yourself that they're going to happen and then when they don't, you're more upset that what you wanted to happen didn't happen because you didn't allow yourself to just watch. As if it's beneath you to just enjoy the show. Which is dumb because getting worked up over it and analyzing it in a way that it shouldn't be analyzed ("my favorite needs to win" or "so and so who is injured like Mysterio should be in the match instead of Booker") is about as low as you can get. May as well get angry at Kobe Bryant for not playing hockey.

If you just sit back and enjoy the show, it's fun. Allow yourself to have fun. If you are going to analyze it, think about WHY Cena is the top guy, think about WHY all the vets love Punk (it's his attention to detail selling). Don't try to answer questions, ASK THEM.


Delete the previous post please.
 
I'm actually moaning about the Divas match this year.

That's how satisfied I am with the card.

Mainly because we could've actually had a decent wrestling match in Beth vs. Nattie or Tamina. And partly because I have no idea who Maria what's-her-face is.

Otherwise, pretty damn chuffed.

Of course, you could take up the argument that the only reason it's going to be a big draw this year is because the part-timers have been wheeled out and are taking up most of the main event spots, but you've got to remember, this is Wrestlemania. People will be tuning in who only watch wrestling once a year because they know that there'll be faces they recognise. Heck, I don't know toffee about American Football but I'll still watch the Superbowl.

Wrestlemania is not IWCmania. Wrestlemania is a global, social event aimed at garnering the largest audience possible.

So can we be satisfied by it? Yes, and we should. To choose not to would be stupid. If you're not satisfied by 'Mania because it doesn't have Sting vs. Taker vs. Goldberg vs. Lesnar vs. Stone Cold vs. Zack Ryder in an Iron Man War Games TLC First Blood Match, then you're missing the point.
 
This match will indeed be that as it is stated "End of An Era!" Taker is well past his prime as well as HHH but if you look at who came into the first Hell in a Cell match and who is was against it would be Taker vs HBK. However, HHH did his share of matches versus Foley and others in Hell in a Cell too. But all other of that Generation are gone away but never forgotten and may never be able to compete at the level it takes for Hell in a Cell. Except, Taker and HHH. They will always be remembered for the Era that defined the Match itself and not only made Taker The Phenom and HHH the Game.
 
Thanks for the replies, all very interesting to read. Just a few points...

For those who say "don't expect and just enjoy it" yeah that sounds nice, but this is WRESTLEMANIA! You have to have some expectation for it. If you don't expect it to be great then why buy it?

As far as WM28 goes, i'm really looking forward to this one. Last year I bought WM27 just because it's wrestlemania. This year i'm buying it because I genuinely am excited about the card, and as long as those top 3 matches (Cena/Rock, Taker/HHH, Punk/Jericho) deliver then I will be happy. As for the rest of the card, if they're great matches then that's just a bonus for me.
 
As many of you know, John Cena is a 12 time world champion. That's 4 away from Ric Flairs record, and 5 away from breaking it. There is no doubt in my mind that Cena can't get 2 or 3 reigns in 2012. So,this is where the storyline comes into place. It's the 2014 Royal Rumble and Cena has just defended his 16th world title in a brutal match. The loser of the match gets mad and tries to beat Cena down. Cena gets hurt but is still able to over come this guy. All of a sudden the MITB winner runs down the ramp and cashes in on Cena. Cena loses. Later that night, it's time for the Royal Rumble. It's time for number 30. Cenas music hits and he runs down and wins the Royal Rumble. Then, for several weeks Cena promotes the fact that at Wrestlemania 30, he will break Flairs record. At WrestleMania 30, Cena takes his place as SuperCena and wins number 17!!! Ric Flairs music hits and he walks down to congratulate Cena. Cena gives him the Attitude Adjustment and gets major heat for it. Cena then feuds with Triple H or Randy Orton afterwords.

Thoughts?
 
That sounds.....just horrible.

Everything about what you just said, is everything that is wrong with WWE over the last few years.
Dropping the title willy nilly.

That makes me sick...and you make me sick for saying it.

Its not even me being Anti-Cena...its just Anti-BULLSHIT. And Bullshit which I hoped WWE realised when they started the whole CmPunk angle.
 
I voted yes even though I don't want him to, I think Cena has been given enough breaking Flair's record would be the straw that broke the camels back for many people. Yet I think with his perennial spot in the main-event and the mileage that he has left in the tank matched with his desire to keep going he probably will. I'm not truly anti-Cena I just don't think he needs to be handed every accolade going around if anything its just going to undermine his popularity rather than consolidate it.
 
WWE,TNA and Pro Wrestling Illustrated recognize Flair as a 16-Time World Champion. Technically he is a 21-Time World Champion, 10 NWA World Titles, 7 WCW Titles, 2 WCW International World Titles and 2 WWE Titles... And if you really want to get technical then Cena is only an 11 time champion because last summer CM Punk never "really" left WWE so, really he was the champion not Cena (I have a major problem with WWE recognizing Cena as champion at that time, but thats another issue.) And dont argue with me saying that situation doesnt matter etc. saying the Titles mean nothing nowadays and are just props because then this thread is irrelevant
 
So basically, Cena gets beat up, loses his title, and wins the rumble just to win it back at WM? That sounds... just dumb. Like really, I can see Cena breaking it.. but like that? It would ruin a lot of credibility of the title just to get hot potato'd and then the MITB guy who was supposed to be pushed, just loses it within 2 months. I can't fathom how dumb that sounds really...

Not to mention, killing the thing that MADE Ric Flair himself to a degree. The most world titles should be his accolade, it sounds bad on many fronts honestly.
 
The same thing was brought up I think a few years ago when people realized that HHH or Edge we're on their winning streaks of massive world title wins. Personally do I think Cena will win more world titles than Flair, sure do. Flair can out-wrestle Cena and most of the WWE roster but consider the fact that titles are exchanged a lot more quickly and randomly than when Flair was more active. I do hope nothing like your idea of how Cena ends up breaking Flair's total reign ever happens. Honestly I really like and really hate the MITB stuff that happens. Daniel Bryan has turned a real BS title win into a VERY good heel run but how he won the title was pure bullshit and he was still a face. If someone won the title via MITB cash in at a rumble, just for Cena to win the rumble and win the title back at Mania is plain stupid. I understand the MITB winner has been just for a random cheap heel win but that's just too much stuff and then to shatter what Flair accomplished on top of it.
 
firstly Flair is a 21 time world champ not 16 16 is just what was televised and recognised by WWE and WCW due to ongoing disputes with NWA transitioning. and the term "World champion" is open to discussion since most wrestlers in TNA, NWA/WCW, WWF/Eare are or were from the Nth/Sth America or Canada. so then does that mean any company that houses a few foreigners can state there main title is a World Title?. So for WWF didn't have a world title it had the WWF Heavweight Championship

Therefore World Title wins is no different to say Heavweight Title reigns or Cruiserweight Title Reigns since they can all be competed against with people from all over the globe.

and who's to say Flair doesnt win more titles

Secondly who cares....
almost all world title reigns in the last 5yrs mean nothing.
Flair was a champion in an era with real men who were "wrestlers" not glorified amateur actors, now you got the "selfish generation" as Robert Roode puts it, the reality is crap generation where titles change hands every time they are defended if they are defended at all. and the title doesnt mean you are the best it's just a token to who is bringing in the most cash (in the case of Cena) or trying to create new stars.

regardless,the greatest champion (title wins wise) of all time is not Ric Flair if you wanna go that route, it's Jerry lawler at 125 or so Main Event Titles in alot of different regions and companies including 52 time Southern Heavyweight Champion

might also add that Ric Flair may have 16 recognised world title reigns but over half of them were less then a few weeks reign. Cena's were not.

and Triple H is still 1 up on Cena atm so he'll fall first. and Hogan is at 12 atm so he's equal.
 
The fact that Cena has had the title this many times is a joke in itself. The fact that there is no doubt that he'll pass Flair's record is an unbearable thought.
 
Cena will break Flair's record before this, at the rate he's getting hot potitles, he'll be 20x champion soon, it's inevitable barirng (god forbid) an Edge style retirement, Cena has at least a decade left if he stays w/ the company and healthy.

Flair wouldn't consent to a program like this that would shit on his legacy more than being in TNA has, and I don't think it's that compelling.

The story the OP gives, I don't like it one bit, it's such cheap heat, and destroying legends is more Randy Orton's forte. Cena needs to get his record, then tell all the kids that if they put their mind to it, and dedicate themselves, they can become WWE champion, then close off the night.
 
WWE,TNA and Pro Wrestling Illustrated recognize Flair as a 16-Time World Champion. Technically he is a 21-Time World Champion, 10 NWA World Titles, 7 WCW Titles, 2 WCW International World Titles and 2 WWE Titles... And if you really want to get technical then Cena is only an 11 time champion because last summer CM Punk never "really" left WWE so, really he was the champion not Cena (I have a major problem with WWE recognizing Cena as champion at that time, but thats another issue.) And dont argue with me saying that situation doesnt matter etc. saying the Titles mean nothing nowadays and are just props because then this thread is irrelevant

Ric Flair's five extra reigns aren't nearly as legitimate as Cena's 12th, so it makes so sense whatsoever for you to make such a statement.

The myth of the 20 title reigns was debunked here: http://forums.wrestlezone.com/showthread.php?t=163198

I can't even guess which one is the 21st you're claiming. He had at least three other illegitimate reigns.

firstly Flair is a 21 time world champ not 16 16 is just what was televised and recognised by WWE and WCW due to ongoing disputes with NWA transitioning. and the term "World champion" is open to discussion since most wrestlers in TNA, NWA/WCW, WWF/Eare are or were from the Nth/Sth America or Canada. so then does that mean any company that houses a few foreigners can state there main title is a World Title?. So for WWF didn't have a world title it had the WWF Heavweight Championship

Therefore World Title wins is no different to say Heavweight Title reigns or Cruiserweight Title Reigns since they can all be competed against with people from all over the globe.

Firstly, like I said, Ric Flair is a 16 time World Champion. Secondly, it had nothing to do with the NWA transitioning, in fact NWA is the reason he has 2 less reigns than he does, as they didn't recognize two title changes. You could argue that those were legitimate reigns, but that would still only bring him to 18, not 21.

Also, the term "World Champion" is not open to discussion and it does not mean people from all over the world compete for it. It means that the championship is defended around the world. For example, ROH's "ROH Championship" became the "ROH World Championship" when it was defended in the UK on May 17, 2003.

Anyway, in response to the OP, god no. No to all of it. If he's going to break the record(which is not the lock people think it is - remember, it wasn't that long ago that people thought it was a lock Triple H and maybe even Edge would break it. Cena could be taken out of the main event, become a part time wrestler who doesn't go after the World title anymore, or retire due to injury long before he wins a 17th title.), it needs to be done right. That's almost like when somebody suggested Undertaker should lose at WrestleMania by countout. Ugh.

I do like the idea of having Ric Flair involved, though. (Obviously not to be attacked by Cena afterwards.) When Cena's chasing his 17th reign(and hopefully it's a lengthy, old school pursuit), have Flair come in and give him his blessing to break the record. Tell him he deserves it, records are made to be broken, all that nonsense. Maybe even put him in Cena's corner during the WrestleMania match where he finally wins it. That's what I would do, anyway.
 

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