WWE is in serious trouble once the older talent retires....

[Thephenominal1]

Heres the deal. plain and simple. WWE has no depth what so ever. The best thing that has happened to them in years is the rock coming back. The older guys are carrying the company and thats the way it's going to be. Whats gonna happen when taker and HHH retire, even edge? They will still have cena, orton, and WHO ELSE? Cena and orton are the biggest draws in the company out of everyone that has come in within the last 5-10 years. The only thing that could make WWE better is if jericho comes back. Even though he's older to it would give more fire power. There is nobody on the mid-card or undercard that could carry the company except for maybe Nexus and Corre. They need to use those to and rival each other. Change the matchups around a lot and MAKE the young guys work harder. The way WWE has been going lately is way downhill. They better hope they find a needle or 2-3 in a haystack to take over the reigns when the big dogs are gone.

 

[Ding_Dong_#2]

I would have agreed completely with this post two years ago.

Now, I think we are finally starting to see some stars that will be around for some time. Wade Barrett has enormous, enormous potential and has demonstrated it already. Drew McIntyre could work wonders if they allowed him more creative input into his own character. Daniel Bryan is another who will and is filling the Benoit role, Slater, Gabriel, Otunga, Michael Tarver all have what it takes but are not quite there yet. What they do need however is a real star, a Rock/Austin/Hogan/Hart that can transcend wrestling; Cena or Orton is not enough to carry the company.

In all honesty, I think the WWE has too much dead wood. I liked the old system of a big fanfare arrival, big feud and title win, pointless feud, tagging with Tim Horner and then bye. It kept things fresh. The only problem now is that the talent isn't out there so the WWE hasn't had much choice but to keep the older stagers hanging on.

In time, I think you will see some or all of AJ Styles, Beer Money, Motor City Machine Guns and The Beautiful People head over which will beef up the youthful side of the roster a bit as well. There is only so long TNA can keep going the way it is and WWE have a lot of patience.

 

[hlhbk]

Say what you want but if the current roster minus HHH, Taker, and Rock are what is going to be forced down our throats again after wrestlemania I am done watching.

I love Miz, CM Punk, and Orton but unless something changes dramatically the rest of the roster is not enough to keep me watching. I think most of the young talent needs to step up, but in some cases they just aren't being used right. Cena, and Daniel Bryan are perfect examples of this.

Taking the cuffs off of Cena on Monday night allowed him to cut the single most entertaining promo since coming to Monday Night Raw. Forcing the PG rating on the current roster sure hasn't helped their cause. It is not a coinsidence that the two most entertaining promos in years are the Rock's and Cena's and they didn't stick to the PG guidelines. It took HHH and HBK literally doing what they wanted in 97 to open McMahons eyes to what led to the attitude era, and we don't have anyone to make him realize he is handicapping his own talent.

Then there is Daniel Bryan. I agree to those who say he will never get over in the WWE. However it's got nothing to do with his ability or personality. It's got to do with McMahon won't use him right. His gimmick is he is anti WWE, which he is being punished for now. If they used him right he would be one of the top stars in the company.

 

[yoshi_doce2006]

WWE is in big trouble for one reason, Vince made the biggest mistake he possibly could two weeks ago, he brought in The Rock.

They brought in The Rock and gave him an open mic like they did back in the old days and he exposed the business for how completely awful it has gotten since he left. The Rock showed that when it came to mic skills the new kids are light-years behind. It's like the Young Guys are the USS Enterprise (No bloody A B C or D) and The Rock is the sleek, powerful, fully loaded Andromeda Ascendant. The gap is just so wide it's not even funny.

Bringing The Rock back was the worst thing Vince could have done because it raised the bar so high nobody currently on ANY professional wrestling roster under the age of 30 can even come close to touching. If the WWE suffers it's because Vince emphatically reminded the people how darn good things use to be and then shoved the best young talker in many peoples mind The Miz out and you can see how bad it is.

These young guys aren't even close to the quality The Rock gave us after 7 years away from the business, that is extremely sad. I agree with Triple H, if the WWE is to survive the developmental has to be fixed, if it's not the WWE in the end will be in some deep dodo.

 

[CrayzChris]

Then there is Daniel Bryan. I agree to those who say he will never get over in the WWE. However it's got nothing to do with his ability or personality. It's got to do with McMahon won't use him right. His gimmick is he is anti WWE, which he is being punished for now. If they used him right he would be one of the top stars in the company.

Can you PLEASE explain to me how Daniel Bryan is "not over". He was the standout on NXT. He was the mystery partner of Cena, Bret Hart, Edge, Morrision, Chris Jericho, R-Truth in the Main Event of one of the biggest pay per view events of the year. He defeated The Miz (who is now WWE Champ) for the U.S. Title (which he has held for the last several months. He was used as a Pro on NXT, he's featured in backstage segments, and they are using him as a way to elevate the Bella Twins & Gail Kim. Not to mention, he and the Miz have an awesome rivalry, which will no doubt play a huge role in both of their LONG careers. Oh, also - he never puts on a bad match. So, I think he's doing pretty damn well for himself.

 

[yoshi_doce2006]

I'm sure the same thing was being said when the likes of Hogan, Luger, Savage, Flair left in the early 90's, some of them their first time, for what seemed like greener pastures! "Who is going to be the future?" everyone said. I'm a lot of people didn't expect guys like Shawn Michaels, The Undertaker, Issac Yankem/Kane/Fake Diesel, Bret Hart, HHH, Steve Austin and Rocky Maivia to be future legends and carry the company. Well, they did. For several years. When Steve Austin, The Rock and Bret Hart left, the company was carried into the new millennium and beyond by the likes of John "The Prototype" Cena, Kurt Angle, Randy Orton, JBL, Booker T, Edge, Rey Mysterio, Batista and Chris Jericho. Look at the great potential for the future! Sheamus, Wade Barrett, The Miz, John Morrison, Dolph Ziggler, Daniel Bryan Danielson, Drew McIntrye, Ted Dibiase, Cody Rhodes, Kofi Kingston... etc etc. Sure, they aren't marquee names yet, but GIVE IT TIME. Not everything can happen over night. WWE has been GREAT at creating stars. John Cena and Randy Orton WERE NOT overnight sensations. Relax, IWC... relax.

But you have to look at WHO was finding the stars and creating them, you want to know who? A guy that is sitting at home right now blogging about everything by the name of Jim Ross. When Jim Ross was in charge of Talent Relations, he was finding and bringing in stars, then helping to create them. Now you have who? Johnny Ace? Who has he brought in?

The Miz, Punk, who else has he brought in that has become a huge star that has shot to the top of the business? Punk was compared to a young Ric Flair as far as ring work and charisma go, The Miz was just some reality POS that he hoped would work out and he got lucky on. Who else has become a huge name that Jim Ross did not bring in?

 

[Lawliet]

They're ok. While I think the WWE don't have the talent or star power back several years ago, they have potential and everything.

 

[You_What?]

Daniel Bryan is great wrestler and can really sell a match! The reason he will never be on top is he can't sell a promo!! Look back at the greats: Flair, HBK, Stone Cold, HHH and The Rock (to name a few) they were the top boys in the business because they could work the promo's in and out the ring.

Yes I think hlhbk has got it right, to an extent, the WWE are in a decline because their future stars don't have the ability to work a crowd as well as the old boys... BUT bringing the old boys back does have one big advantage!!!! The youth can by moulded!! If I was The Miz, Ziggler, JoMo, Swagger, Bryan etc I would be hanging with The Rock and HHH, listening to everything they've got to say and soaking it up like a sponge. I would wanna get in dark matches with greats of the industry, and really listen to what they've experienced!! I hope Mike Mizaran isn't as arrigant and self rightous a person, as his character is because he has so much talent. I hope he is bombarding The Rock, HHH and Stone Cold (now he's back in Tough Enough) with questions and asking for advice because he could turn The Miz character into something great! WWE talent is still really raw but has so much potential!!

Watching the Elimination Chamber, I was sold on JoMo's in-ring ability, I thought he had a cracker of a night. Sheamus is going to be a top heel, I reckon he learnt so much from HHH, he needs someone to fued with (other than JoMo). Wade Barrett just gets better and better, he really draws me into hating him. I even thought Drew McIntyre had a good night. I wish creative would do a better job with him, because he can rock a promo out. NOW, everyone I just mentioned there are top-mid carders at the moment... all got a lot going for them... all got a lot of potential... and you know what... when Summerslam comes around I reckon at least one of those four will be knocking around a title belt!!

 

[Victor1111]

Now like many wrestlers that retire say WWE is a machine.

When guys like Flair, Hogan, Rock, HBK, Huter, Eddie Guerrero, Stone Cold, and all the legends first started. I know most people didn't say oh we have just seen a future legend. Hell Look At Austin he started off as Ringmaster i'm more than positive people didn't look aat him and say future legend.

WWE had to adjust his Gimmick to what fit him and to the generations changes.
Same goes for all the Stars Trial and Error.

I see a very bright future ahead of us.

Look at how much a lot of people already believe in:

JoMo: His in ring ability is out of this world and his mic skills will improve as he
adjusts to a gimmick that fits.

Del Rio: Good in ring ability a belivable character that has the whole damn package.

Punk, Orton, Miz, Cena all young guys that will only get better.

The WWE has been around for a long time, if they didn't know what they where doing they would've been gone a long time ago.

 

[WunNightStan619]

Miz: Love what he has done. One of the best on the mic right now and is great in the ring. WWE should be thankful he came along.

John Cena: While I will never be sold on his in ring ability I will never say he isn't entertaining on the mic when done right. I won't say that Cena was forced on us when he was the rapping Cena and was one of the hottest wrestlers in the WWE when he was on Smackdown. That being said once he moved to RAW and was turned into Hogan Jr. it has been puke worthy.

soooo ur saying that the miz is better in the ring than john cena? pleeeeaaasssseee, cena at least does a little more than punch and kick the whole match...Miz cant wrestle, he has to be carried thru every match he's in and the only reason he seems like he's so great on the mic is cuz everywun else sucks so bad.

but back to what your point was, i think the main difference between superstars of then and now is the fact that the developmental process was much different. It used to be that the guys had to go thru different promotions and all that, and it gave them enough time to develop and hone their skills and master their craft before they get to the big stage of WWE. now alls they has if OVW or FCW, they spent a year there, they get brought up to the main roster, then they get pushed to the moon well before they are ready. Its almost like a restaurant that is sooo concerned about getting the food out to the customer that it doesnt take the proper time to make sure that the food is cooked all the way..i really hope HHH's push for a developmental overhaul goes thru

 

[GameOver]

Therefore I agree 100% with what Hunter said. Maybe it wasn't voluntary but he along with other top stars have been gone due to injury and these young guys haven't stepped up. Anyone who thinks otherwise just needs to look at the responses HBK, Rock, Taker, and HHH got the last month or so.

The young guys need to force the audience to take notice of them prior to getting the top. Miz did it, Cena did it before they changed his gimmick, Orton did it, and Batista did it. The young guys need to force their way to the top.

Agree 100%

Well coming from soneone who's watching since 1984 every new generation i was rebellious initially and thought WWF was going over the top or wanted the old generations back again but they grew on me. the Cena generation however is barely holding on to a shred of entertainment. If it wasn't for a few shining stars there'd be nothing to bother watching religiously.

despite this WWE has been trying to push younger talent all along, they've never really stopped. Why though would you take a gamble on someone who is just stagnant in a mid card status. Sure some has to do with booking and storylines, noone can deny that

for years, though people think Triple H was holding everyone back or others in the main even circle were holding talent back, IMO it was more to the point that they were looking for people who had a set and could earn there time in the limelight, Cena earned his spot, winning over the inner circle because he was dedicated, doesn't mean he's any good at some aspects but he's dedicated and earned his spot, same with Orton, Same with Edge, Same with Miz etc.. all of them have stepped up and taken advantage of the opportunities given to them.

on the flip side Jeff Hardy/Shelton Benjamin got through and what happened to them? Hardy screwed himself 3 times and Shelton Benjamin just seemed to stop caring, they were pushed time and time again and dropped the ball every time. There lies the issue.

You can let others run with the ball all you want but if they suck, they suck.

Talent needs to learn how to be entertaining and compelling which in turn will get them over and they will be able to prop up the company that is paying them.

Every generation change they've had to out of necessity push people who aren't necessarily ready to prop up the rosters and only a few have really broken through that glass ceiling into legend status, the rest are just along for the ride.

WWE will always make do with what they have and will make stars out of seeming nobodies, it's just a matter of who will be entertained enough to keep watching the next generation.

 

[CuddleBuns84]

Well, time for my two cents...


HHH is going to be retiring soon, and wants to over-haul the developmental promotions.

Meaning, one of the retires is helping the company promote new guys.

HHH has a good eye for talent, and doesn't put up with crap in the long run. We all can laugh and point out he married the boss's daughter, but he has the work ethic and love for the business. He isn't going to let it fall apart.

Oh yea, the Rock didn't bury anybody. He built up wrestlemania. Hell, Cena brought back some thuganomtics. Plus, the Rock has the world buzzing about wrestling again. A couple more promos like he gave a couple weeks ago, Wrestlemania is going to sell a million buys.

 

[orton0384]

To the OP your bias in favor of the shHhovel has made retort by using the hHhammer. The Game does not mind being on top since no one has stepped up. I would venture a guess and say that they didnt meet his criteria as a superstar. That does not give him the right, not matter his knowledge or years in the business to be the judge of that and hold up his 75lb. nose and say he can stay on top.

His staying on top has done nothing but expanded his title resume and bury others. Instead of telling people to "step up" so i can stay on top, take time to train and develop stars instead of goin on shows like punk'd, making bad films like the Chaperone, riding your private bus with the family, and eating out fancy restaurants not tipping after going to bodybuilding shows.

Not every young newcomer will make. Not every veteran worker puts in the effort. Where is his effort? I don't see him going and trying to fix the problem. What the HHHammer should have said was"I don't mind staying on top because I really don't do much. These guys need to step up but Im not the guy to show them the way. Im too busy going to red carpet events man."

Are they in trouble once these guys retire? I dunno. None of us do. Stock Market could crash a year from now and thats no wrestlers fault. The shHhovel might become a full time behind the scenes guy and retire and maybe do something to help. We don't know. I just hope that things stay the way they are. Could always be worse.

 

[jholcomb22]

I could appreciate the original post, hlhbk, but then you kept replying to people,and saying you weren't going to watch anymore. So don't watch. You speak as if the WWE has never repackaged anyone. Like if the current product doesn't work, they will just let it run into the ground. Do you remember Paul Levanesque? The high class douche. No, you remember HHH, the badass who kicks ass and takes names. Do you remember when the Rock wasn't the Rock? You remember who these people became. This youth movement in the WWE isn't going to get all of these young stars over, but I guarantee the ones who don't get over will get repackaged in developmental and brought back up in a new role. So please, hlhbk, stop watching, and stop bitching on posts like this about how you don't like the current product.

 

[MoizH28]

Im gonna play devils advocate. Lets analyze MOST of the MID CARD AND LOWER MID CARD wrestlers that will probably get moved up after the older ones retire. Im skipping the guys like Sheamus, Punk, Cena etc. that are already in the main event and upper mid card.

Daniel Bryan- He is a great wrestler and will be able to entertain fans with his style for years to come.

John Morrison- Yes he is a very spotty performer, but he always has at least 2 "holy shit" moments a month which and would be solid getting the MITB briefcase.

Tyson Kidd and Evan Bourne- When Bryan and Morrison get into the upper mid card these two will respectively most likely get their shots to shine. These two will be the mid carders putting on the fun 10 minute matches.

Zack Ryder- Im making a personal promise to everyone in this forum this guy will get a mid card title before Summerslam 2012. WOO WOO WOO YOU KNOW IT.

Kofi Kingston- I dont think he will get to main event anytime soon, but I think he will be around for a while and will be next to get the "Morrison Love" as I like to call it. Where we want him in the main event but its gonna take awhile.

Jack Swagger and Drew Mcintyre- Yes these two are just floating around right now but when Del Rio and Wade Barrett get put permanently into the main event these guys will be the upper mid card heels. Swagger is great at annoying people and Drew Mcintyre is getting better very slowly but its happening.

Big Zeke- He will probably become the "monster" heel replacing Kane.

Other guys I think will be fine in the future... Gabriel, Slater,Cody Rhodes,Ted Debiase, Skip Sheffifeld, Otunga,A Ry, and Husky Harris. This is just my opinion people so please dont hate.

 

[Hodgos]

My problem with the OP is that he makes a lot of unsubtantiated claims about younger wrestlers who "havnt stepped up" or who are flatout "terrible", without actually backing it up. In fact not only are the claims unsubtantiated; they often fly in the face of the reality of what is actually happening.

Orton: Was great as a bad guy but he needs to have a evolution as a character. If not he won't stay on top.

He's not one of my favs, but Orton has done an exceptional job repacking himself throughout his career, from cocky, cowardly heel in the beginning, to cocky, tough heel in Evolution, to his legend killer gimmick, to his sadistic "psycho" persona while feuding with Triple H, to his current gimmick, which is sort of that of a loner with psychotic tendancies but with a sort of personal moral code. His character is CONSTANTLY evolving.

CM Punk: Is great but for whatever reason he hasn't found the single story to propel him as being seen as the man in the WWE.

Is insanely over and is becomming moreso every week. As JR said in his twitter, he really "looked like a star" at the Elimination Chamber PPV, moreso than ever. He is getting monster heat as the demented head of Nexus, which is the most engaging storyline in wrestling right now. If he's doing this well right now, and if the momentum continues, then just imagine how over he'll be in a couple of years (when the current "big names" are all gone). We'll be calling Punk a "legend" in five years time.

John Cena: ... I won't say that Cena was forced on us when he was the rapping Cena and was one of the hottest wrestlers in the WWE when he was on Smackdown... once he moved to RAW and was turned into Hogan Jr. it has been puke worthy.

See, this just flies in the face of reality. Under his cuddly, family-friendly babyface persona, Cena has been selling a fucktonne of merchandise. The kids LOVE him. It's not that he's being forced down our throats, it's that people WANT to see him, are prepared to pay money to see him, and so WWE are responding accordingly and giving the people what they want. YOU may find him puke-worthy in his current persona, but this has no relevence in the context of whether or not WWE will be in trouble when the "big names" retire. It has no relevence because your opinion of Cena does not change the fact that he's a draw and a cash-cow.

You also went on to say that

- Del Rio and Sheamus are "terrible": The fact is that both of these guys are getting over, especially Del Rio who is drawing major heat for someone who has just stepped into the picture. You're in a minority with your view on Del Rio, whether in the company of IWC members like ourselves, or the marks comprising the so-called "WWE universe". The guy is over as hell, is a born main-eventer, and (barring something unforseen) will be a great draw for the WWE for years to come.

Sheamus' rise has been more gradual, but he is now an established upper-card heel; I think most people would say that he has been gradually improving every week since he started, and is now a very solid worker. He will only get better.

- Morrison has not stepped up: "Stepping up" is such a vague term that it is hard to either prove or disprove what you've said, but the fact is that -slowly but surely- he has IMMENSELY improved over the last two years. As I see it, he has been in a transitional stage for the last few months, adding new "tweeks" to his character and his look, and trying to incorporate a little bit of ring psychology into his matches instead of being a pure "spot monkey"; high spots will always be his game, but it is evident that he's trying to become a more complete wrestler. It is too glib and simplistic to say "he hasnt stepped up"; he is very much in the process of stepping up, but it takes time and we'll see if he's up to it over the course of the next year or two.

- Daniel Brian is not over because he is not being used correctly: I totally agree that WWE does not have a good track record when it comes to booking wrestlers of Brians ilk. The "ladies man" gimmick doesnt suit him. But he's managed to make it work to the greatest extent possible, and he IS over. The plus-side is that this ladies-man/affable nerd crap has not hurt his character; he is still taken seriously by the fans. Eventually, they'll give him something else to work with, hopefully something that suits him better; a no-nonsense ring technician who will break your neck as soon as look at you would seem the obvious choice. I'm hopeful that in a couple of years, he'll be a Benoit-style fringe main-eventer.


Honestly, the WWE has been doing a good job with its youth policy in the last 12 months; if I have one criticims it is that they should have started a year or two earlier. If the veterans retired right now, then the WWE would be in a lot of trouble. But all of the young guys you've mentioned (not to mention Barrett, Kofi Kingston, etc) will only become bigger stars in the next year or two, especially as the big name veterans you speak of start to put them over on their way out, just like Snuka put 'Taker over and the Warrior put Trip... well, you know what I mean.