WCW LA, Round 3, Match 2: #6 Eddie Guerrero vs. #11 Jeff Jarrett
- Thread starter Shocky
- Start date
I have a feeling it's gonna get controversial.
Two great heels here. Both have been insignificant champs in big promotions - big fish in massive ponds. Jarrett, however, has been a blue whale in a puddle.
Jarrett seems just like the sort of opponent Guerrero would lose to. I don't know; I've just sort of ran out of steam here. Let me sit back and think a minute.
Two great heels here. Both have been insignificant champs in big promotions - big fish in massive ponds. Jarrett, however, has been a blue whale in a puddle.
Jarrett seems just like the sort of opponent Guerrero would lose to. I don't know; I've just sort of ran out of steam here. Let me sit back and think a minute.
Steamboat Ricky
WZCW's Living Legend
I honestly have no idea, here. I think Jarrett is likely stronger and more powerful, but Eddie's quickness and aerial ability will mess with JJ. Both are regarded as such great workers, though I would tilt the scale in terms of technical savvy toward Eddie.
I'm going with Eddie here. He was a major reason for WCW being as successful as it was, though he was stuck in Cruiserweight purgatory. The Cruiserweights entertained the fans interested in seeing great wrestling...and Jarrett really didn't come to prominence in WCW until it was going down the tubes.
I'm going with Eddie here. He was a major reason for WCW being as successful as it was, though he was stuck in Cruiserweight purgatory. The Cruiserweights entertained the fans interested in seeing great wrestling...and Jarrett really didn't come to prominence in WCW until it was going down the tubes.
I think you're exaggerating by calling Eddie a major reason for WCW being as successful as it was. Certainly, people don't seem to give a flying monkey's about Dean Malenko, and that portion of Jericho and Mysterio's careers is gladly ignored.
Also, criticising Jarrett for winning the strap during a lull is a bit rich considering how Eddie Guerrero was hardly a major world champion himself. Sure, he beat Brock Lesnar, but he needed more than a little help from one Bill Goldberg.
There's the argument that Eddie could win by cheating, but that argument is just as valid for Jarrett.
I'm stuck on this one. Personally, I feel that Jeff Jarrett is decidedly superior. I just can't put the reasons into words, for some reason. In my mind, he would just beat Eddie. There's no question.
Also, criticising Jarrett for winning the strap during a lull is a bit rich considering how Eddie Guerrero was hardly a major world champion himself. Sure, he beat Brock Lesnar, but he needed more than a little help from one Bill Goldberg.
There's the argument that Eddie could win by cheating, but that argument is just as valid for Jarrett.
I'm stuck on this one. Personally, I feel that Jeff Jarrett is decidedly superior. I just can't put the reasons into words, for some reason. In my mind, he would just beat Eddie. There's no question.
Jack-Hammer
YOU WILL RESPECT MY AUTHORITAH!!!!
I've found both of these guys to be kind of...meh overall. The question is, which one of them is less meh than the other. Hard for me to say really. Even though Eddie was WWE Champion, in some ways I think it hurt his legacy to some degree overall. Eddie was a very good in ring competitor and, even though his character in later years was basically an amalgam of nearly every type of Latino stereotype there is, he made me laugh.
Jarret is someone I never truly got into at any point in his career. Whenever I watched him wrestle, whenever I saw him do a promo I never said: "That guy should be the face of a major professional wrestling company". Jarrett was a big star in the Memphis area, though he did work for his father at the time. When he came to the WWF in 1993 with the whole Double J gimmick, he was a very good mid-carder but I never saw him as a main eventer. He went on to WCW and later to TNA and became a 10 time World Champion over the course of his career. Should he have been? In my opinion, no.
Cases can be made for or against either one of them but I'm leaning toward Eddie in this, just because I found him entertaining. I'd be willing to vote for Jarrett if reasons are convincing enough.
Jarret is someone I never truly got into at any point in his career. Whenever I watched him wrestle, whenever I saw him do a promo I never said: "That guy should be the face of a major professional wrestling company". Jarrett was a big star in the Memphis area, though he did work for his father at the time. When he came to the WWF in 1993 with the whole Double J gimmick, he was a very good mid-carder but I never saw him as a main eventer. He went on to WCW and later to TNA and became a 10 time World Champion over the course of his career. Should he have been? In my opinion, no.
Cases can be made for or against either one of them but I'm leaning toward Eddie in this, just because I found him entertaining. I'd be willing to vote for Jarrett if reasons are convincing enough.
I think eddie should go over in a cakewalk. Jarrett has been forced down our throats ever since say 2000. He could never get over in wwe, went to wcw and i guess sold his soul to russo or something because he was always in the title picture and was never over and same with tna. He is the luckiest person in the world to have his career and really be undeserving.
Eddie on the other hand came up with talen struggled for years and through hard work finally got over to mainstream and beat one of the most dominant wrestlers in past decade for title.
VOTE EDDIE
Eddie on the other hand came up with talen struggled for years and through hard work finally got over to mainstream and beat one of the most dominant wrestlers in past decade for title.
VOTE EDDIE
Well, yeah, but no. Definitely not.
2002-2006, actually.
He very much could, he just wasn't allowed to and then was a baby over it. Allegedly.
He was over in WCW and incredibly over in TNA.
There was the small matter of Goldberg having to spear Lesnar for Eddie to then hit an opportunistic Frog Splash and then pin him, but yeah, let's just forget that.
Not only that, but his title reign was very much underwhelming.
Don't.
These are two guys that, at some point in their careers, I really liked, but more often than not I just didn't care about them. Both are a little above average, but I wouldn't call either of them great.
Both guys were world champions. Personally, I don't think either of them were world champion material. Ever. Guerrero had one run with the WWE strap, which is as forgettable as Kane's run in WCW as Bruiser Mastino. It was crap. Jarrett has won ten world championships, putting him up there in the elite leagues with the likes of Ric Flair, Hulk Hogan and Sting. If we're being honest, his world title reigns were total shit. His first three world championship reigns came to a total of seventeen days. That's how shit they were. His fourth managed just over a month. Nothing impressive at all. His NWA/TNA Championships were a lot longer, but let's be honest, when Jeff was champ, he had no real competition. His accomplishments there might look impressive on paper, but really they weren't.
Jarrett's definitely the stronger of the two, also having quite a few inches on him in height. But really, I think that's the only aspect where Jarrett surpasses Guerrero in. Guerrero's faster, more agile, a better technical wrestler, a better high flyer and he's more charismatic.
But I have to say, I've been enjoying Jarrett a hell of a lot lately. His match at the beginning of the year with Angle was great, one of my favourites so far. His current run in TNA so far is the best I've seen him. I wasn't a fan of Guerrero's WWE run at all, and his WCW run was average at best - mainly filler matches and being the leader of the LWO.
I'm waiting for a solid argument to be swayed one way or another, but at the moment I'm swaying a little more towards voting Jarrett.
Both guys were world champions. Personally, I don't think either of them were world champion material. Ever. Guerrero had one run with the WWE strap, which is as forgettable as Kane's run in WCW as Bruiser Mastino. It was crap. Jarrett has won ten world championships, putting him up there in the elite leagues with the likes of Ric Flair, Hulk Hogan and Sting. If we're being honest, his world title reigns were total shit. His first three world championship reigns came to a total of seventeen days. That's how shit they were. His fourth managed just over a month. Nothing impressive at all. His NWA/TNA Championships were a lot longer, but let's be honest, when Jeff was champ, he had no real competition. His accomplishments there might look impressive on paper, but really they weren't.
Jarrett's definitely the stronger of the two, also having quite a few inches on him in height. But really, I think that's the only aspect where Jarrett surpasses Guerrero in. Guerrero's faster, more agile, a better technical wrestler, a better high flyer and he's more charismatic.
But I have to say, I've been enjoying Jarrett a hell of a lot lately. His match at the beginning of the year with Angle was great, one of my favourites so far. His current run in TNA so far is the best I've seen him. I wasn't a fan of Guerrero's WWE run at all, and his WCW run was average at best - mainly filler matches and being the leader of the LWO.
I'm waiting for a solid argument to be swayed one way or another, but at the moment I'm swaying a little more towards voting Jarrett.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
I'm almost to the point of flipping a coin on this one. Neither jumps off the page at me at all. To begin with, we have Eddie Guerrero, by far the most overrated world champion in probably the last ten years. He never did anything of note, but he was too good for the midcard but not good enough to be a credible world champion. Putting the title on him wasn't what I would call a bad move, but it didn't work out. Could he have been a better champion later on? Perhaps, but people instantly assumed he would be which isn't fair at all. Based on what Eddie did, he was a good wrestler, but I wouldn't put him in the HOF.
Jarrett is another interesting case. He looks like a superstar, he talks like a superstar, he wrestles like a superstar, he acts like a superstar. For some reason though, no one has ever accepted him as a superstar. He's a class act from what I've heard and just flat out loves the business that he's a part of. However, no one buys him as a credible world champion either. He was WCW Champion when the promotion was in the ground already and no one cared, and he literally owns TNA, so who is going to tell him no there?
I think in the end though, I'm going with JJ. Eddie is overrated, but when I look back at Jarrett, he's never been anything but a class act. Like him or hate him, you can't deny that he's out there doing whatever he can to make things work. That's all I ask from a wrestler: effort. Even if you put on a bad match, you can tell when a man is trying, and I've rarely seen a big name guy that tries harder.
Jarrett is another interesting case. He looks like a superstar, he talks like a superstar, he wrestles like a superstar, he acts like a superstar. For some reason though, no one has ever accepted him as a superstar. He's a class act from what I've heard and just flat out loves the business that he's a part of. However, no one buys him as a credible world champion either. He was WCW Champion when the promotion was in the ground already and no one cared, and he literally owns TNA, so who is going to tell him no there?
I think in the end though, I'm going with JJ. Eddie is overrated, but when I look back at Jarrett, he's never been anything but a class act. Like him or hate him, you can't deny that he's out there doing whatever he can to make things work. That's all I ask from a wrestler: effort. Even if you put on a bad match, you can tell when a man is trying, and I've rarely seen a big name guy that tries harder.
Jeff Jarrett takes this easily. Like, really easily. People always talk about how Jarrett was never over in WWE, even I did it when I tried to get Canek over him, but its complete and utter bullshit. He may never have won a world title there, but he probably would have had he stayed until the brand split.
Within WWE, he was on top of the midcard. He won 6 Intercontinental Championships, which is only matched by RVD and bettered by Jericho. He also won the European Title, so he won all mid card titles available to him. Next he went to WCW where he was world champion 4 times and US Champion 3 times. People can say what they want, but he won the title when Hogan, Nash, Flair, Sting etc. were all still there.
Even if you completely ignore his career in TNA, where he has helped carry a promotion from nowhere to being a legitimate alternative if not a competitor. Who is there from the early days that still matters? Daniels, Styles, Jarrett, maybe Abyss. Of them, probably only Styles is as synonomus with the company as him. But yeah, even if you ignore that, he has still acheived more than Eddie Guerrero, who was a cruiserweight in WCW, a midcarder in WWE, and who won a title when Lesnar left, Angle was injured and about to go for surgery and JBL wasn't ready for the main event.
The guy was a career midcarder, and I don't care if he was over, he was not as over as a face as Jarrett has been as a heel in the past. Look to his match at the Royal Rumble against Razor Ramon for an over heel, or any part of his WWE career really. Bear in mind that he was a complete rookie then too.
Eddie wrestled a Mexican style, but never enjoyed any singles success in Mexico. Jarrett won the Rey de Reyes in AAA in 2004, which is their King of the ring tournament, although, to be fair, Jarrett won it in a singles match not a tournament.
If we go kayfabe, what does Eddie have over Jarrett really? He's weaker and equally technically adept. Maybe speed? But it's not as if Jarrett is slow. I can't see his advantage at all really. Jarrett has made a career out of cheating, so I don't think he'd be any less likely to win in this manner than Eddie.
So, in conclusion, Jeff Jarrett should win this match by pretty much any criteria except how dead you are and how annoying your widow is.
Within WWE, he was on top of the midcard. He won 6 Intercontinental Championships, which is only matched by RVD and bettered by Jericho. He also won the European Title, so he won all mid card titles available to him. Next he went to WCW where he was world champion 4 times and US Champion 3 times. People can say what they want, but he won the title when Hogan, Nash, Flair, Sting etc. were all still there.
Even if you completely ignore his career in TNA, where he has helped carry a promotion from nowhere to being a legitimate alternative if not a competitor. Who is there from the early days that still matters? Daniels, Styles, Jarrett, maybe Abyss. Of them, probably only Styles is as synonomus with the company as him. But yeah, even if you ignore that, he has still acheived more than Eddie Guerrero, who was a cruiserweight in WCW, a midcarder in WWE, and who won a title when Lesnar left, Angle was injured and about to go for surgery and JBL wasn't ready for the main event.
The guy was a career midcarder, and I don't care if he was over, he was not as over as a face as Jarrett has been as a heel in the past. Look to his match at the Royal Rumble against Razor Ramon for an over heel, or any part of his WWE career really. Bear in mind that he was a complete rookie then too.
Eddie wrestled a Mexican style, but never enjoyed any singles success in Mexico. Jarrett won the Rey de Reyes in AAA in 2004, which is their King of the ring tournament, although, to be fair, Jarrett won it in a singles match not a tournament.
If we go kayfabe, what does Eddie have over Jarrett really? He's weaker and equally technically adept. Maybe speed? But it's not as if Jarrett is slow. I can't see his advantage at all really. Jarrett has made a career out of cheating, so I don't think he'd be any less likely to win in this manner than Eddie.
So, in conclusion, Jeff Jarrett should win this match by pretty much any criteria except how dead you are and how annoying your widow is.
It's...Baylariat!
Team Finnley Baylor
I'm going with Jarrett. Gurrerro is a winner and can wrestle, and can confuse most wrestlers with his style, however, Jarrett does one thing as good as anyone has the past few years...and that's win.
It'll be back and forth, and to be honest, I could be swayed either way with a legit argument for Gurrerro, but for now, I'm sticking with Jeff. He had the stroke in WCW, and he'll have it here...in WCW.
Vote's for Jarrett, but it's not etched in stone.
It'll be back and forth, and to be honest, I could be swayed either way with a legit argument for Gurrerro, but for now, I'm sticking with Jeff. He had the stroke in WCW, and he'll have it here...in WCW.
Vote's for Jarrett, but it's not etched in stone.
Eddie Guerrero is the most over rated wrestler of the last decade, bar none. He has one of the most forgettable title reigns in history, and he's only become a mega star because he died, whoopy doo.
Jeff Jarrett has done everything that Eddie Guerrero was able to do in his career, and then some. From the mid card, to the main event of companies, Jarrett surpasses Eddie Guerrero in every category in bth WCW, and the WWE. Oh Wait, I'm guessing with the way the logic is turning in this torunament that somehow 1 WWE Championship run is greater then 4 WCW and 6 NWA championships, you know, since the WWE is like da greatest eva.
Jeff Jarrett has done everything that Eddie Guerrero was able to do in his career, and then some. From the mid card, to the main event of companies, Jarrett surpasses Eddie Guerrero in every category in bth WCW, and the WWE. Oh Wait, I'm guessing with the way the logic is turning in this torunament that somehow 1 WWE Championship run is greater then 4 WCW and 6 NWA championships, you know, since the WWE is like da greatest eva.
Jarrett is still alive here? 
Take away everything Jarrett gave himself, and you don't have much. Guerrero is a better wrestler, and a better showman. He's simply better than Double J in a WCW ring, and will go over here. Hopefully we'll get to see the 3 Amigos, and the Frogsplash.
With any luck, Double J gets DQ'd for a guitar shot.
Take away everything Jarrett gave himself, and you don't have much. Guerrero is a better wrestler, and a better showman. He's simply better than Double J in a WCW ring, and will go over here. Hopefully we'll get to see the 3 Amigos, and the Frogsplash.
With any luck, Double J gets DQ'd for a guitar shot.
Jarrett still in it, because he deserves to be in it.
If you take away everythign that Jarrett supposedly self booked for himself, which is a ridiculous argument considering he was the big star of TNA, and he built that company with his name and star power into what it is today, but lets take away the self booked argument.
So that leaves Jeff Jarrett a 3 Time US Champ, a 4 Time World Champ, and a 6 Time IC champion, not to mention all of the success with lesser titles and in the tag ranks. You add all of that together, and it's still a more impressive resume then Eddie Guerrero ever had in the business. People want to take a dump on Jarrett and his 4 Title reigns outside of TNA, but it's not like Eddie Guerrero's one title reign was any better.
If you take away everythign that Jarrett supposedly self booked for himself, which is a ridiculous argument considering he was the big star of TNA, and he built that company with his name and star power into what it is today, but lets take away the self booked argument.
So that leaves Jeff Jarrett a 3 Time US Champ, a 4 Time World Champ, and a 6 Time IC champion, not to mention all of the success with lesser titles and in the tag ranks. You add all of that together, and it's still a more impressive resume then Eddie Guerrero ever had in the business. People want to take a dump on Jarrett and his 4 Title reigns outside of TNA, but it's not like Eddie Guerrero's one title reign was any better.
Wow. Clearly someone who doesn't know what they're talking about.
Shocky's argument is obviously better. "Entertaining" doesn't win you a match. "Charismatic" doesn't win you the match. It's the same as the Cena argument (sorta). To NSL, I couldn't have put it better than Shocky. Take away what he supposedly gave himself (event though he deserved it), he still has more title reigns than Eddie ever had. Also.
Even if he did win, it wouldn't be a cakewalk.
Right, because Eddie Guerrero was never shoved down our throats. Totally.
He was most certainly over in WCW. And he is now ridiculously over and respected in TNA.
Undeserving? He was charismatic, skilled in-ring, and a good champion.
Right. Dominant over not-too-great people with a non-exciting, non-over title reign.
Jarrett deserves to move on here. He will move on here. Vote Jarrett.
Evan Snow-Wolf
Running On Diesel Fuel!
I've gotta go with that Double J. Eddie is good, but the reality is that most of his biggest wins were done on pure stupid luck. Beating angle with the boot trick, or having Goldberg spear Lesnar, etc etc etc.
And I want to go on record as saying that personally (and this is just my opinion), that you shouldn't use blind luck events as criteria for victories in a WZ tournament (like HBK getting handed the HIAC win).
That being said, Jarrett has proved himself time and time again, wether the IWC really likes it or not, since they seem to like to compare him to the HHH of TNA. I think in a straight up match without the B.S., Jarrett is more than capable of taking down Latino Heat.
Its His World.
And I want to go on record as saying that personally (and this is just my opinion), that you shouldn't use blind luck events as criteria for victories in a WZ tournament (like HBK getting handed the HIAC win).
That being said, Jarrett has proved himself time and time again, wether the IWC really likes it or not, since they seem to like to compare him to the HHH of TNA. I think in a straight up match without the B.S., Jarrett is more than capable of taking down Latino Heat.
Its His World.
I was going with Eddie, right up until the second before I clicked on JJ. In the end, Eddie was a career midcarder who got lucky because the WWE wanted the Eddie/Benoit moment to end WMXX. Jeff has always been a class act and I've always liked the guy but for some reason he never got taken seriously as the main man.
Hmm, this could turn into quite an interesting match. Well, it is fairly interesting as it is.
I forgot what I was going to say. I always do that. Shame, too. I'm sure it was something relatively clever. I'm just glad to see people giving Jarrett support. Who's next? Lou Thesz or Sting, you say? Piece of piss.
I forgot what I was going to say. I always do that. Shame, too. I'm sure it was something relatively clever. I'm just glad to see people giving Jarrett support. Who's next? Lou Thesz or Sting, you say? Piece of piss.
Had to go with Guerrero here.
Jarrett has always struck me as the most overvalued wrestler of his entire generation. How in the world this man got the push he did in WCW is beyond me. Jarrett is definately a solid mid to upper card talent, but I've rarely watched a Jarrett match and thought to myself "Now THERE is a real World Champ!". I get the distinct feeling that if it were not for Jarrett's founding of TNA, the guy would be relegated to the "Oh yeah, remember when they tried to push that guy?" category (with such wrestling luminaries as Rikishi).
Eddie G. on the other hand was among the cream of the crop during that amazing surge in great, talented wrestlers that signed with WCW in the mid 90s. And to top off his amazing technical and luchador skills, the man just oozed flair and charisma, and was the perfect heel.
Quite frankly, I'm surprised the results are so close. I figured Eddie would run away with this one.
Jarrett has always struck me as the most overvalued wrestler of his entire generation. How in the world this man got the push he did in WCW is beyond me. Jarrett is definately a solid mid to upper card talent, but I've rarely watched a Jarrett match and thought to myself "Now THERE is a real World Champ!". I get the distinct feeling that if it were not for Jarrett's founding of TNA, the guy would be relegated to the "Oh yeah, remember when they tried to push that guy?" category (with such wrestling luminaries as Rikishi).
Eddie G. on the other hand was among the cream of the crop during that amazing surge in great, talented wrestlers that signed with WCW in the mid 90s. And to top off his amazing technical and luchador skills, the man just oozed flair and charisma, and was the perfect heel.
Quite frankly, I'm surprised the results are so close. I figured Eddie would run away with this one.