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The Lilypad

Been a little while tadpoles. I had some free time before I get off of lunch, so I wanted to throw this fly out there for all of you to chew on. With the recent almost-Saxton retirement, I was wondering who you would personally love to see come out of retirement and feud with someone for one more match. I remember when I first joined there was a Mr. Baller feud going on where he was trying to angle Steamboat Ricky to come back for one more match. I thought it was really cool and the "1-0" and "2-0" t-shirt segments were lovely. So let me have it, who would you pick to have one more match and with who?

As always, I am open for questions if you have got any.

Cheers!
 
I always thought I'd like to see Grizzly square off against Toyota, but if he's lean now, what's the point?

Other than that, Steamboat Ricky. I haven't followed the fed for long, but I actually went and read his story and segments. I'd also have Polly and Digger fight in a cockfight scenario, with the two men interrupting it, because they love their companions too much.

Other than myself... Dr Zeus and a headless Mr Baller would be money. A headshrinker with no head to shrink?

Thrash v Hades in a Rock god v Greek god match...

The rest, I don't know.

Who'd you have Chris fight?
 
I'd like to see how Everest would hold up against the group we have now. michigan was awesome, but the talent level for most of his time at the top was lower than it is now.
 
Toughie, Kravinoff sticking around to face Barbosa would be nice. I am happy with that formerly fat cunt, Wasabi Toyota.
 
One match I think would be fun would be Austin Reynolds vs. Stormrage. During the RRR/Strikeforce mini feud, all of the interaction was between Reynolds/Howard and Runn/Stormrage. I think they could put on some solid matches that would resemble the classic Styles/Samoa Joe matches.

Despite me totally spacing and forgetting to PM him back the last time he PMed me, Numbers and I talk a fair amount and he helped steer me from comedy sidekick to a solid mid carder and Reynolds is a complete 180 from GM.
 
Redemption is drawing near and I am getting nostalgic. Redemption 2011 was my first PPV in WZCW. I had joined during the cycle after Kingdom Come III, and I was young and ambitious. I was thrown into an open challenge against the reigning WZCW EurAsian Champion, Blade. However, it would be King Shabba, a fellow rookie of my class, who would go on to challenge Blade in a losing effort, and I would not even make the card. Yet, here I am two years later as the defending EurAsian Champion.

A lot has changed from now and then. Hell, last year I was main-eventing Redemption in a scenario that very few can lay claim to. That scenario being in the main-event on a PPV over the World Title. Wow, talk about feeling honored. Ty Burna picked me out of my recruiting class and mentored me into a solid spot on the card. He gave me the ball, and although I have stumbled, I have ran with it. I pour a lot into this outlet known as WZCW, whether it be RPs or constructing shows, and I must say that it feels great to see progress. Sometimes when you look at things on a micro level it can get frustrating, but when I really look at it over these last 2-3 years, I feel proud.

From rookie, to hero, to champion. Redemption will always have a soft spot in my heart when it comes to WZCW PPVs. It highlights my growth as a Rper and my commitment to the product. And now, as we are only a little over a week away, I am ready. I am ready for however the chips fall. I am ready for the next step in my journey here in WZCW. I am ready for the future.

So, let's have it tadpoles. What event in WZCW is significant to you? Is it a PPV? Or maybe even a specific show? Let me know!
 
Aftershock Insanity 1 (Episode 3) - After trying for almost an entire year I finally won the Mayhem Championship.
http://forums.wrestlezone.com/showthread.php?t=201534

WZCW Presents: Apocalypse! - First time I won on PPV and my victory over Mick Overlast to win the Elite X Championship.
http://forums.wrestlezone.com/showthread.php?t=229813

WZCW Presents: Kingdom Come III - Bowen vs. Cooper II for the Mayhem Championship. First time ever being on the Kingdom Come card and my first one on one title match.
http://forums.wrestlezone.com/showthread.php?t=162159

WZCW Presents: Unscripted 2012 - The night I beat both Chris K.O. and Constantine.
http://forums.wrestlezone.com/showthread.php?t=246391
 
I have elucidated on my favourite Barbosa moments before - cash in, beating Ty in HIAC etc. - but for the importance of how seriously the character is taken, his performances at Lethal Lottery III are the real stand out moment.

Not only was he booked as being able to stand toe to toe with Ty Burna, it took a Super Consecrated Banishment and getting caught up in the ropes for him to not win the WZCW title that night. And then he was given an almost show-stealing appearance in the Lottery itself, taking out names of all shapes and sizes with seeming ease. Made him look like a real monster.
 
Hey, tadpoles!

It's been awhile since I lit up this thread with some discussion. There is still some juice left in the tank. Also, I have to combat Falk's awful thread (which is prejudice to frogs).

As always, the thread is open for questions. I can't do the podcast anymore, but I would still love to give my insight to anyone that wants it.

Can't think of a question? How about we open up with an interesting stat?

26 characters competed at Kingdom Come V last year. That's not including the WZ Weekend that aired just before the marquee event. Out of those 26 characters, only 6 are currently on the roster going into this year's Kingdom Come. What do you think about that?
 
6 out of 26, that's a pretty big turnover, I hadn't realized that.

Have you read any of the Dorian Slaughter RPs? If so, what do you think of the RP quality? The Slaughter character? Any foresight as to where you could see the character going after Kingdom Come and through the next year?
 
That thread title wasn't changed at my request... nor am I requesting to change the thread title.

The last three Kingdom Come's have been different in regards to the pre-show: KC IV had pre-KC Aftershock show; KC V had WrestleZone Weekend; this year will be a regular pre-show (due to the roster size). Out of all three concepts, which one do you think is the best way to approach KC?
 
There's no doubt in my mind that if you had kept with Haven, Young Justice would be heading to Kingdom Come with the belts intact. Who would you have liked to have fought as tag team champion there?

I don't know much about the passed history of Chris K.O. As a refresher (mostly due to me being lazy), can you sum up his stint in WZCW so far to me?
 
6 out of 26, that's a pretty big turnover, I hadn't realized that.

Have you read any of the Dorian Slaughter RPs? If so, what do you think of the RP quality? The Slaughter character? Any foresight as to where you could see the character going after Kingdom Come and through the next year?

Indeed, it is.

I have not read any Slaughter RPs, but I'll make a point to these next two rounds. I'll drop some feedback in the appropriate thread when I get it finished.

That thread title wasn't changed at my request... nor am I requesting to change the thread title.

The last three Kingdom Come's have been different in regards to the pre-show: KC IV had pre-KC Aftershock show; KC V had WrestleZone Weekend; this year will be a regular pre-show (due to the roster size). Out of all three concepts, which one do you think is the best way to approach KC?

I'm on to you Falk.

I think the WrestleZone Weekend is the way to go. I think it could be done annually regardless of the roster size as well. Just put a match or two on it, fill it with lots of last minute hype for all feuds (whether it be through video packages or promos), and then cap it off with the HoF induction. The HoF doesn't need to be on the actual KC show, so why not make it the main-event of WZ Weekend? The HoF ceremony itself could carry the WZ Weekend experience regardless of additional content.

On that note, I would prefer Aftershock not run at all on PPV rounds. Pre-shows work just fine for all other non-KC PPVs (though, there may not be much need for pre-shows if the roster size stays this small). I think we have evolved past the point of dark matches, though.
 
Would Young Justice had been any different had you not had to bow out when you did and Krypto/Haven would have teamed?

Where does Flex go after Cerberus?

Who haven't you feuded with that you want to?
 
Can't think of a question? How about we open up with an interesting stat?

26 characters competed at Kingdom Come V last year. That's not including the WZ Weekend that aired just before the marquee event. Out of those 26 characters, only 6 are currently on the roster going into this year's Kingdom Come. What do you think about that?

I'd never have noticed, since the basic make-up of the fed is the same in regards to who is posting, although we have had a few large casualties of the likes of Zues and Barbosa among others. I think me not noticing might be down to my absence however, since I still haven't really caught up with goings on.

Think about this though, it could have been even fewer, had you not returned with K.O and stayed with Young Justice, had Red Skull not decided to bring back Alhazred at the last minute, when I left the fed I genuinely thought I might never return and if I did certainly not before 2015, and had I not left precisely when I did I might've beaten XXX and been the one to face Ricky Runn in the Cell, or made the third participant in the Cell, which could well mean no Ty Burna, on the other hand I think XXX was driven away by that whole situation.

Still though, we have many of the same RP'ers, and that I think is largely because a lot of characters reached their peak at last years Kingdom Come and in the months afterwards, and for me it was a nice fresh roster to come back to, all that worries me now is that with the fed transitioning the way it is whether my character will become stale.
 
That an insane number of people leaving this place. Sometimes I think this whole site will die along with WZCW, but at least I'll be here to see it happen an sneak in a few world title reigns when the people better than me leave hehehe.

What goes through your mind when you begin to write an RP and how do you begin to construct your ideas?
 
Ialthough we have had a few large casualties of the likes of Zues and Barbosa among others.

So after having a little think, I take back some of my previous post. Since KC 5 we've lost;

Hiaku Hogan - Dr. Zues
Barbosa - Barbosa
Muffin Top Merkley - Rush
Crock - Sam Smith
Doc - Action Saxton
JGlass - Saboteur
Numbers - GM/Reynolds
BK Barrage - Triple X
Pancake - Ricky Runn
Shotaro - James Howard

I could mention Coco and GD as well, but their hearts didn't appear to be in it by KC 5 anyway.

Pretty sure each and every one of those names has at some point been knocking on the door of the main event, only to fall off for one reason or another, or in two of those cases actually made it to become world champion, only to leave straight after. Thats actually mental... Okay, I am definitely noticing the difference now, and it makes me sad.
 
There's no doubt in my mind that if you had kept with Haven, Young Justice would be heading to Kingdom Come with the belts intact. Who would you have liked to have fought as tag team champion there?

I don't know much about the passed history of Chris K.O. As a refresher (mostly due to me being lazy), can you sum up his stint in WZCW so far to me?

I don't know, partner. You guys pulled out the big guns at LL. I think the problem for YJ is that we tried to take on a much larger story outside of the fed and it was going to belittle our feud in the fed. I am a constant critic of keeping a character grounded in the actual wrestling, so I am willing to admit that I felt my character start grasp. I also feel bad because I feel the majority of responsibility in pushing our characters that well. I strongly believe that the concept would have been fun and payed off well, but it was hurting on current RP qualities in terms of addressing our actual opponents. T

Time constraints completely made working two characters impossible (which was my original plan). I would have put out very poor work with both my characters had I stayed in the team with Darkside and RPed as Chris K.O. simultaneously.

However, had I stayed in the team, and somehow we retained, I am not quite sure who we would have faced. Had you guys been championed, I think there is no doubt that it should have been an epic rematch with a thrilling stipulation to end our feud. But as champions, I don't think you guys would have got another crack at the belts. It would have made three straight PPVs that we had beat Cerberus in some fashion. My dream would have been to dig up JGlass and Doc for a one-off match (kind of like The Rock returning to fight Cena thing).

----------------

I will gladly recount Chris K.O.'s history to you. I'll just cover the kayfabe aspect as it could get a bit wordy injecting what I went through on the RP side of things. It will already be wordy as is.

First and foremost, the character entered the WZCW under his real name, Sam Masters, as face. He quickly turned heel and found himself under the tutelage of Ty Burna alongside James King. Those three were the original members of Apostles of Chaos.

Ty was world champion in the early days of the stable, but lost the belt at Unscripted '11 to Big Dave. From there, he went back into hunt mode for the belt while also positioning himself into a surprising big transaction. Meanwhile, James and Chris were tearing up veterans like Everest and Steamboat Ricky. After a brief partnership, Chris slowly found himself pushed out of the tag division with the re-emergence of Dr. Alhazred, who along with James reformed the Forgotten Powers under the Apostles of Chaos banner. The three Apostle members engaged in a brief feud with Steven Kurtesy, Saboteur, and Action Saxton in a losing effort at All or Nothing '11. However, Ty had other plans for Chris soon after.

Ty began grooming Chris to take the first step into becoming just like him. That step involved a title chase and a series of bouts against Black Dragon, the EurAsian Champion (and arguably one of the best RPer to ever grace the fed). Chris failed on three separate occasions. The last of which came at LL IV, where on that same night Ty Burna won the LL. Not only was Ty now main-eventing KC for the world title, but he had also positioned himself into buying one-half of WZCW from Chuck Myles, who blindly sold his half in hopes of early retirement.

Enter the slow-burn towards a face turn. Ty's complete manipulation and control of Chris' free time and Ty's utter vileness led Chris to miss a very personal event during the LL Cycle, the death of his father. Bitter and upset, Chris joined alongside Ty's business partner (the man who helped orchestrate Ty's purchase of half of WZCW) to take down Ty Burna from the inside. All the while, Ty put Chris in charge of the Apostles of Chaos (James, Alhazred, Alex Bowen, and S.H.I.T.) to face Team WZCW (Celeste Crimson, Titus, Everest, Steamboat Ricky, and Gordito) at Kingdom Come IV for full ownership of WZCW.

Along the road to Kingdom Come IV, Chris would have a series of strange interactions with Team WZCW's captain, Celeste Crimson (which led many people to believe that Chris was in love). However, Celeste's motherly nature simply reminded him of his own late mother. In addition, Chris began an affair with Serafina, Ty's lady of the dark. Ty was not amused.

At Kingdom Come, Ty Burna lost the main event, but Chris reluctantly led the Apostles to victory, which gave Ty Burna full ownership of WZCW. Ty quickly unveiled his knowledge of Chris' betrayal in the Redemption cycle and hung him, bloodied and bruised, on a chaos symbol for all to see. Soon after, the Apostles of Chaos would disband and the focus was put solely on Ty vs. Chris. The weight of WZCW was put on Chris' shoulders as he was set to take on Ty Burna at Redemption in a Casket Match to gain back control of WZCW.

In a rare scenario, the Casket Match went on as the main-event (which I am still extremely humbled by to this day [even though I know it was mainly due to Ty's star power and not mine]) over the world title six pack. Chris, with some help from Serafina, was able to successfully defeat Ty and close the casket. However, the casket burst into flames immediately after the match. Ty Burna was nowhere to be seen.

After the PPV, order was re-established in WZCW. Serafina left Chris to search for Ty and the "hero" of WZCW had a name to live up to. The pressure of the fans and those in the back caused him to undergo what his manager called "Project White-Wash". It was the complete denial that Chris could do anything wrong, and it built him up to be an almighty perfect "savior" of WZCW.

The fans and those around him quickly turned sour on the moniker. Chris tried to portray himself as a White Knight, even going as far as to wear a white knight helmet out to the ring for matches. Chris seemed arrogant in his attempts to live up to the hype. The fan's boos, a loss to Steven Holmes on PPV, a heart-breaking loss to Titus for a world title shot in a battle royal, and ultimate low of losing to Justin Cooper in an open invitational pushed Chris into a dark area.

Aftershock 18, after a cycle of boos, Chris K.O. finally turns heel and attacks Titus, who had been questioning Chris' "heroic" antics. The two would go on to fight at All or Nothing where Chris would pull off a pretty big win. The two were not finished there, but the continuation of their feud would have to wait for an interesting detour made its way into WZCW.

El Califa Dragon arrived on the scene and garnered the attention of conspiracy theorist Drake Callahan. Chris joined Drake's theory that El Califa was actually Ty Burna after some similarities in in-ring style and action. The story culminated at LL V when two El Califa Dragon's entered the LL match. They executed two consecrated banishment, and one revealed himself as Ty Burna. Drake would ultimately win the LL match, which would leave Chris alone to go after his long desired resolution to the Apostles aftermath saga. But sadly, it was not to be.

El Califa and Ty suddenly vanished after LL. This led to a reprisal in the Titus feud. Titus returned to reclaim his honor against the man with a messiah complex. Along the way, Chris took advantage of a down-on-his-luck Triple X and became EurAsian Champion. The stage was then set at KC V for Titus to take on Chris for the EurAsian Title in an "I Quit" match. Miraculously, Chris retained and defeated Titus.

From there, Chris would go on to briefly mentor Dustin Hunter. The combo was paired when Chris won Dustin's soul back from a voodoo master. The combo was short lived, and at Redemption, Dustin betrayed Chris and caused him to lose the EurAsian Title in a triple threat against Mikey Stormrage and James Howard (the latter winning it).

After Redemption, Chris hopped on a plane to head overseas to promote the upcoming All Stars event. His plane went down, and the wrestler was presumed dead. However, after more than 210 days, news broke that Chris K.O. was found alive. He has now returned as the bearded crazy man you see on screen. He is managed by a volleyball named Steve. His only clear motive is the desire to get his hands on Ty Burna in hopes to finally resolve a multi-year long personal qualm.

I know that really wasn't the short version, but that basically sums it up kayfabe wise.
 
Would Young Justice had been any different had you not had to bow out when you did and Krypto/Haven would have teamed?

Where does Flex go after Cerberus?

Who haven't you feuded with that you want to?

I'm not sure if the team of Krypto/Haven would have been named Young Justice. Honestly, I am really bummed things happened the way they did fed-wise. I feel as though Krypto/Haven could have made a big splash and maybe even filled the shoes of Saxton/Saboteur.

Working with Darkside was great, but there would not have been as big of a learning curve with two established members of the fed. Not only that, but Krypto/Haven probably would have lasted longer as well. I imagine I would probably still be fed-head at this point had I not occurred my personal issues. Haven was always meant to be a character to written during my stint as fed-head in order to not be so serious with Chris.

Concerning Flex, hopefully towards mid-card gold and beyond. I don't know who of Cerberus would turn face in a break-up, so I presume there would just be a falling out. That should free Flex up to immediately go after the Elite X. I'd really like to see what you can do outside of the tag division.


I'd never have noticed, since the basic make-up of the fed is the same in regards to who is posting, although we have had a few large casualties of the likes of Zues and Barbosa among others. I think me not noticing might be down to my absence however, since I still haven't really caught up with goings on.

Think about this though, it could have been even fewer, had you not returned with K.O and stayed with Young Justice, had Red Skull not decided to bring back Alhazred at the last minute, when I left the fed I genuinely thought I might never return and if I did certainly not before 2015, and had I not left precisely when I did I might've beaten XXX and been the one to face Ricky Runn in the Cell, or made the third participant in the Cell, which could well mean no Ty Burna, on the other hand I think XXX was driven away by that whole situation.

Still though, we have many of the same RP'ers, and that I think is largely because a lot of characters reached their peak at last years Kingdom Come and in the months afterwards, and for me it was a nice fresh roster to come back to, all that worries me now is that with the fed transitioning the way it is whether my character will become stale.

Yeah, we are a few surprise returns away from only having a couple characters back from last year. You make a good point about KC V kind of being a huge page turner for a lot of characters. This year could definitely be defined as a rebuilding year, character wise.

Sure, you still have some veterans at the top like The Elite or Matt Tastic, but a lot of the middle and uppercard has been flooded by new and emerging talent. Beard in the main-event is the perfect example. The new faces speak life, but the roster size and low turnover of existing characters also is alarming.

I mostly blame the lull in wrestling in general, with a small part given to some past delays (sometimes ridiculous ones). However, it seems the team is on a better track now with producing shows. Hopefully after KC we can fully turn the corner and forget some low points of this past calendar year.

That an insane number of people leaving this place. Sometimes I think this whole site will die along with WZCW, but at least I'll be here to see it happen an sneak in a few world title reigns when the people better than me leave hehehe.

What goes through your mind when you begin to write an RP and how do you begin to construct your ideas?

I don't see this place dying anytime soon. As mentioned above, there is just a general lull in wrestling. Punk gone, Bryan out, Reigns out, and what can be seen as the "off-season" in wrestling is at its peak. Wrestling just took a deep hit after Wrestlemania 30. Everything was so awesome, but then we just got this big let down with content and injuries.

On the topic of writing RPs, my process usually looks something like this. I plan out a general story arc for one, or in rare cases two, cycles. I generally have an end goal with some key points brewing in my head to touch on during the cycle. I then adapt those points to who I am facing on a given round.

When I approach my RP for the round, I have most likely already been brain-storming some connections to my character, opponent, and current story arc. Sometimes I get lucky and all three mesh together perfectly.

I sit down and just start writing. I let my RP flow organically. Almost to the point of stream of consciousness. I know I need to get to certain points, but most of the stuff in-between I let it flesh itself out. I have a general idea on where I want the setting to take place, and what I want the dialogue to hint towards, but I don't have anything written down to base it off of.

In the end it all comes together. I've only ever re-written a RP once. Mostly because I do all my RPs on the day of deadline, and also because I generally enjoy what I write in the first draft. Because of time, I usually only give it a once over. I make sure dialogue sounds as natural as possible and that there are no huge mistakes.

That's my RP writing process in a nutshell. I am sure that I am missing something important, but it's a rough idea.

So after having a little think, I take back some of my previous post. Since KC 5 we've lost;

Hiaku Hogan - Dr. Zues
Barbosa - Barbosa
Muffin Top Merkley - Rush
Crock - Sam Smith
Doc - Action Saxton
JGlass - Saboteur
Numbers - GM/Reynolds
BK Barrage - Triple X
Pancake - Ricky Runn
Shotaro - James Howard

I could mention Coco and GD as well, but their hearts didn't appear to be in it by KC 5 anyway.

Pretty sure each and every one of those names has at some point been knocking on the door of the main event, only to fall off for one reason or another, or in two of those cases actually made it to become world champion, only to leave straight after. Thats actually mental... Okay, I am definitely noticing the difference now, and it makes me sad.

It takes a real marathon man to stay with a character for so long consistently. Kudos to guys like KillJoy, Ty, Dave, Holmes, and Showtime who have found ways to revitalize their gimmicks time and time again to find success.

That being said, I want to make a statement that I have been called crazy for a lot of times. When Beard won the world title and left with it, I was really excited when a new one emerged as a prize for LL. For the first time, the idea of two separate world titles existed.

Let's not kid ourselves. Time in the fed is elongated. We go through six PPVs in more time than it takes the WWE to go through 13 or 14. How long do we really expect guys like Sam Smith or Rush to wait for their chance? Showtime, Drake Callahan, and Steven Holmes dominated the world title scene a year ago. And they rightly should have. But we have a handful of other guys that never got to see the top because we had to wrap up a story (rightly so). And that isn't the first time it has happened.

So, why does the idea of two world titles scare us so much? What is two separate top tier belts really going to do to the integrity of being world champion? Hardly anything at all. It opens up the door for more 1v1 world title shots on a consistent basis and can extend feuds without feeling like we are excluding the others who also deserve a chance. It eliminates the extremely thin exclusivity of the main-event scene.

I'm sorry, the idea of one title is great if you can finally make it to the top, but so many get burned on the underside. 90% of Miko's list proves it. I am sure there are many others we are forgetting that are active even now. Constantine had to win KFAD to even get his one-shot. After that, it was over. He hasn't scratched the world title scene since.

I'm sorry, but do people really want to spend 3-4 years here to get that one shot where if they lose it presses the reset button? :shrug: If we were getting paid 5-6 figures to do this all the time, sure?
 
Take into consideration this as well, I was World Champion for an entire calendar year. That set back a lot of guys that could be argued that could have held the world title a hell of a lot sooner in their careers, take into consideration Showtime, Big Dave, Barbosa, you could argue Blade was due, and in the mean time others rose up, such as Holmes, Kurtesy, Constantine, Kravinoff, the list goes on, while still having Titus and Everest around that could be thrown in for a shot as well.

As you said, a year in this fed is not as much action as in the WWE where they have that many PPVs. So you push all those guys that should have been champ sooner back a year, it sort of left those later risers as Rush and Smith on the outside looking in. I can't speak a whole lot on why they didn't get a shot as I was on Creative for a cup of coffee the second time around before they left, but I'm sure the time table didn't help any.
 

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