So lots of hate for Orton and Cena these days. Why?

[Poop Master Flex]

So after some backstage decisions that happened over this past week (not gonna say what it is cuz I don't wanna ruin anything for anybody, if ya wanna know look it up but don't post it on here) there has been a lot of Orton and Cena bashing these days.

Now I'm not here to talk about what Cena and Orton did I wanna talk about the fans reactions to it. Over the last week I have seen TONS of Orton and Cena trash talking and its been a lot more than usual. All I ever hear is that these guys have too much political power and are keeping the young guys down because of it. Others such as HHH and Taker can be thrown in the mix as well.

I understand that a lot of us fans want to see some new faces but the fact that these guys are on top is not really their decision, at the end of the day its Vince's decision and the thing is there is politics in every business, its almost impossible to get ahead if you don't play the politics game and its unfair to trash these guys because they do. No matter how much they MAY politic its ultimately not their decision.

Not only that the 4 names are some of the greatest guys to ever come out of WWE (mainly HHH and Taker) and the other 2 work their tails of every night to get better, frankly you aren't gonna find too many people who work harder than Cena. Maybe the reason these guys are on top is because of their skill and work ethic, not because of politics because no matter how much Vince likes you he isn't gonna make you a top player if you don't make him money plain and simple.

I wish we had a different champ than Cena (although I'm glad Christian is champ) but ultimately he is always a safe bet to carry the title, just because he doesn't need it doesn't mean he doesn't DESERVE it. Same with guys like Orton who are constantly in the hunt.

Nothing wrong with being upset because YOUR guy isn't champ or a main eventer, but to flip out on Cena and Orton because of it is stupid. If you are gonna get mad at anybody get mad at Vince and booking, they are the decision makers NOT the wrestlers.

In closing if the people on top piss you off THAT much, there is always a better alternative, like turning the channel when those guys are on, if ratings constantly drop when Cena and others are on their push will slow down, but they don't and thats why they are on top.

So what do you guys think, does it make sense to trash guys like Cena and Orton because of their position? Do they deserve their spots? All responses are welcome.

 

[Mindshatter]

I agree with you fully. I think the Cena issue is just because many older fans don't like that he only appeals to the kids so they want to see the heel kick his ass and take the title in the case of The Miz for example.

The Orton issue is self-explanatory after this week but I feel that overall it's due to the fact that one of them is always champion or in the title picture and they get annoyed because of this. The older fans I think compare them to Austin and The Rock and clearly there is a huge difference because people like Cena don't appeal to them nor are they really designed to.

Overall I think they are the hardest workers in the business currently but at times because they are always shoved down our throats they get annoyed. But I agree with you because as you said, if people don't like it they can switch the channel. No matter how much Vince likes somebody, he won't put someone who doesn't draw at the top.

 

[laddclan]

Unfortunately, the 2 poster boys have to face the wrath of an upset public.

Much like Triple H and the Undertaker, Cena and rapidly, Orton, are both at the point they don't have to have a belt. They are already so over, it's not even funny.

Now Cena has a belt because he wants to battle the Rock at WM 28 for the championship. Which means he's going to hold it (theoretically) for a year. Yawn.

Instead, they SHOULD have either:

Let Miz win, or Morrison. Then the two could have a main event at the next PPV. This would allow Cena to go after either R-Truth (he could have interfered against Cena) and pushed him to the stratosphere as THE main event villain on Raw. Or Del Rio, cementing his place atop the food chain as well.

This would have helped put Morrison into the main event, and kept Miz there.

Cena doesn't have to have a belt, to help build up credible threats and establish # 1 contenders.

 

[Rammsteinerteen]

Randy Orton sucks,
But I love John Cena.

Randy Orton makes shitty matches, he CAN't put anybody over and his move set is ridiculous. His gimmick is stupid, he hisses for some reason, and he opens his mouth like a ******, and he bangs on the wrestling floor, despite breaking his hand, and yet, the ****** still does it. His slow talking promos are sooo stupid, and I really hate it when they give him the microphone.

Randy Orton CAN'T LOSE TO ANYBODY.

John Cena on the other hand can. Sure, he gets repetitive and annoying a lot, but the man can MAKE AWESOME Matches. Wade Barrett was allowed to beat him, The Miz was allowed to beat him, CM Punk was allowed to beat him, and even more!

John Cena winning the belt again is good. Honestly, Miz is still boring in the ring, he does not deserve it for so long ever. John Cena can make awesome main events, and I'm hoping he makes another great match.

Randy Orton is a loser, who does not deserve a world title anytime soon, but I don't see that happening

And John Cena is underrated to the IWC in my opinion, because his matches are honestly good.

 

[Lucid]

To me, wrestling champions are the guys who make everyone the money. No two ways around it. Do they always need to hold the title? No, but they do need to appear and be visible because they are the ones who put the bums in the chairs and allow the rest of the players to do their thing. Granted, some fans pay to see certain guys. This is as it should be, as all the guys are attractions to one degree or another. I don't know the inside numbers of who(say, top ten) makes the most money for the company but, to my eyes, these are the guys you feature.
That said, hating on the players and the politics is a lot too much for me to invest into.
I like certain characters, sure, but I respect all the players. I can agree that many fans today get "bored" and "sick of seeing the same guys all the time". To me, it makes little sense. I see folks spend keystrokes, energy and time pouring out all these feelings when one click on the remote is far easier and effective.

 

[mattschiefs]

I think a good part of the heat/hate is more for WWE then Cena and Orton.

With Cena I don't hate him I hate how little WWE has developed him. There has been very little change in him from when he first went to his current stage. He went from the rapper to the "marine" gimmick. And we have not seen much change. It's like seeing the same movie every week. Not something that most people want to do. If WWE were to do something NEW with him a lot of the cena hate would stop. It doesn't have to be a heel turn just something new.

Orton is suffering from much the same thing. The fact that we have seen this with Cena I think is getting Orton a lot of hate. People are seeing what they are doing with Orton and are thinking that he is the next Cena. So that hate has just carried over to Orton.

 

[AntiChristDeicide]

The Cena hate is because he is to superman like. I mean damn the guy could get beat up by the NWO for 20minutes and still win his match? Thats really dumb.

Orton, well (i can't tell you because you know tha rules) but you would be pissed too and you could be (i can't tell because you know tha rules).

All i can say is Go TNA go.

 

[diorjets]

Now if this was 04-06 Orton I would have been estatic but I fucking hate this pampered punk now. He is nothing like the Orton I grew up with over the years, watching him rko people like hogan onto cars and spitting in the face of legends!
I don't like Cena either but more so because he is being forced down our throats and I can't take it.
Miz has always occupied an eye of mine since his debut and Christian has been in my top 5 since forever.
As of 09 Miz moved to my top 1 and Christian to number 3 so I had really high hopes for them then they finally do shine and it gets taken away from them.
I don't know if I can bare watching WWE this year after lackluster ppvs from left to right and down right bad decisions from an entertainment point of view.

 

[whoopin' ass]

personally, i have no hate for either guy. they have busted their asses to get to where they are. what i hate is their booking/overprotection. right now, neither guys needs to be champ - this is the perfect time to get other guys established yet we get monday where miz gets dq'ed because the ref went to get the belt and it wasn't at ringside? what the hell was that? this is the first time i can ever remember someone being dq'ed for that reason, and the belt seems to find its way into the ring quite a bit(same with them folding chairs). it is stupid and a cheap way to keep the belt on cena and get rid of the miz. it is stuff like that which makes people hate cena and orton.


to be fair, vince has done this with a lot of guys lately. remember the big deal before mania for the return of the undertaker? aweful lot of hype for someone who stays for a few months and then is done 6-9 months. why not put that kind of attention towards a new guy and make them a star? i am not saying guys like this should be jobbing out to jtg or santino but they can afford to lose a lot more often than they do and it won't hurt them any. rock did, austin did, hell even hhh and hbk did.

 

[evilashv02]

I agree 100% Being a wrestling fan is so hard these days because all the fans do is bitch and whine and complain about every little tiny thing. Its really sad. Why are you watching if you hate wrestling so much? I'm a Cena fan, but I do agree he should not be holding the title right now, but me whining and bitching and complaining isn't actually going to do anything. It would actually make me look pretty stupid. Ya know, I respect wrestling..sorry

 

[AxAs]

Words can not describe how absolutely angry and what a slap in the face Smackdown was (won't ruin it for people but you'll understand on Friday). My tollerence of Orton has been going down hill a while due to people always calling Cena Super Cena but he is NOTHING on Orton who will get dominated a whole match then RKO out of no where every single time and 1, 2, 3.... But Smackdown just crossed the line. Sure it was probably Vince's idea but i'm sure Orton could of prevented it happening and it's an absolute joke and made me question watching WWE for the first time in my life because of how angry i am about what happened.

 

[THEFUWCHAMP76]

People are just sick of seeing the same people winning the belt all the time.
With Orton winning they should thought this through. Let Christain have the belt till summer slam that would of been great, but no Vince Knows best not!!!! I could book a better show than TNA and WWE bet on it WOOO WOOO WOO you know it.

 

[KnowYoRole]

To me it seems like the hate for John Cena is slowly dying down, and rightfully so. People used to hate him because he didn't have talent; but if anything, he proved in the past year and a half that he has a shitload of talent. He MADE the Miz a staple in the main event. He consistently put on good matches. He had some of the best promo's of the "PG Era". He's been able to hang in there with the Rock in a verbal battle. He can't even be hated because of being "super cena", because he hadn't won the title in 10 months and actually got pinned clean a few times. He's proved himself to many, especially me. I became a fan of his.

Randy Orton on the other hand, gets a lot of hate, and in my opinion, some of it is deserving hate. I have no idea why, but the crowd absolutely eats this guy up, even though he hasn't shown HALF the amount of intensity he had when he was a heel in 2009. He hasn't been interesting in God knows how long. He doesn't do the things that made the crowd turn him face. He has never had a promo that stood out. He's never been in a feud that has progressed anyone, including himself.

Orton is straight up boring, while Cena is actually interesting. But the fact is, neither of them are going anywhere while the audience continues to go crazy over them.

 

[JUSTINMFNBEEMER]

Jeez, all the hate on Randy...wow. Apparently nobody here appreciates him and his ultimate finisher...no, im not talking about the rko, im talking about the much more dreaded finisher in his arsenal, the MOD (microphone of death). not only is it lethal to his opponents, its also deadly to anyone within ear shot of him! its gotten so deadly that just seeing him with a microphone and boom!, i lose several minutes of conciousness...Randy would be the ultimate movie star if this was the silent film era...

 

[Morpheus101]

It's because those at the top always attract the same criticism. I remember hearing the same arguments about the Rock & Austin 10 years ago. It's just easy to hate the top guys and blame them for everything that's wrong. Orton and Cena are up there for a reason, like them or not. Personally, I don't have a problem with it. WWE is a business and good business it to make money. As Cena in particular appeals to kids, that's a big cash cow, just like Hogan was back in the 80's.

 

[stilltippin]

I dislike cena for obvious reasons.. I dont need to explain them..

Orton, Well the new orton ticks me off because the legend killer gimmick was so much cooler.. sure it was duller to a extent.. but this weird viper stuff and pounding on the floor is just dumb.

I do think i hate orton more than cena right now, but if cena holds onto the wwe title untill mania next year.. WOW.. ill be hating cena more before then.


BUT!!!

I DO like Randy Orton much better overall since tuesday night xDD Vince McMahon is a good person, he gave the fans a taste and christian a taste and he did what he wanted to do personally and he did whats best for the company. Cannot argue with that!

 

[rjoconnell]

i don't think hatred should directly be pointed at super cena and mega orton.. they don't do the booking, they don't have the final decisions. they just do what vince says. and honestly, what superstar is gonna say: "please vince, don't make me the champion."

what happened on smackdown.. is a travesty. i've mentioned the state of WWE in another thread a few days ago. everything is ass backwards. the fans, at least most the fans that are on the forums, are calling for one thing, and we just keep getting the other.

randy orton with 3 clean wins on cm punk.. are you kidding me?
the leader of the zack pack, zack ryder, HIMSELF, can't get a match on RAW.. and is STILL jobbing to guys like evan bourne. BARF

if TNA wasn't such a terrible, unwatchable product... i might have to switch over

 

[Sleep Time]

I don't necessarily agree with the fans saying Cena sucks, hes actually A good wrestler, thats coming from a former Cena hater also. I seen him do a monkey flip at extreme rules, that was awesome, Cena is a good wrestler and the fans just don't like the way he talks

I hope the fans turn on Randy Orton, he is one of the worst wrestlers in WWE today. The fans hate him because hes boring. Boring boring boring. Nuff said.

 

[rjoconnell]

Both Cena and Orton have enough backstage pull to go to the writers and tell them "Hey, this is stupid".

Do they need another title run right now?

listen, i hear ya, i just feel like it doesn't work like that. and i agree.. neither needs a title run right now.

in cena's case it kind of makes sense though, since i feel an inevitable del rio v cena main event at summerslam is bound to happen.

and speaking of del rio.. he's feuding with mysterio again? YAWN

 

[ultrasonic205]

Personally, I have never cared much for John Cena, but I will say I respect that he's worked hard to get where he is. I have always enjoyed Orton, and again, I have big respect for his work... it's the BOOKING that is so frustrating! Someone said it perfectly earlier in the thread... now is the PERFECT time to be building up other names so you have a broader top tier to choose from, instead of burying the Miz (in a RIDICULOUS way) or having what happened (happens?) on SmackDown this week go down.

Things like this harken back to the days where Hulk Hogan dominated the business to the point that NO OTHER WRESTLER got a real break, except as his latest whooping boy. I just wish the WWE would show a little more faith in the talent they have, instead of burying people without giving them the chance to prove they can be the next Austin, Rock, HHH, Cena, etc. It's old, repetitive, and ridiculous.

 

[midgensa]

Hell ... this one is easy.

In the IWC if you don't hate faces, you are nothing but a mark. That simple really. The IWC thinks we are soooo smart ... and that smartness means we love all the heels (Punk, Del Rio, Miz, etc.) ALL THE TIME and have to hate the top faces or you're an idiot and a mark.

Of course you are allowed to like faces like John Morrison and Zack Ryder, because they are just being held back.

 

[JUSTINMFNBEEMER]

In the IWC if you don't hate faces, you are nothing but a mark. That simple really. The IWC thinks we are soooo smart ... and that smartness means we love all the heels (Punk, Del Rio, Miz, etc.) ALL THE TIME and have to hate the top faces or you're an idiot and a mark.

Its not the top faces that i hate, its the repetitiveness of the storylines that seem to be going on. Hell i love the rock, Im just sick of seeing the same guy over and over and over with or going for the straps. Its like watching your favourite movie over and over, eventually your gonna get sick of it....

 

[rjoconnell]

Hell ... this one is easy.

In the IWC if you don't hate faces, you are nothing but a mark. That simple really. The IWC thinks we are soooo smart ... and that smartness means we love all the heels (Punk, Del Rio, Miz, etc.) ALL THE TIME and have to hate the top faces or you're an idiot and a mark.

Of course you are allowed to like faces like John Morrison and Zack Ryder, because they are just being held back.

actually, i'm not a big morrison fan.

and zack ryder is only a 'face' on his youtube show. he's still a heel when he's on tv.

i don't really care about faces and heels anymore.. it's about who entertains me.

and i don't chair for all the heels.. del rio and sheamus really don't do anything for me yet. but cm punk is the MAN, how can you not like him?

 

[lenguy]

People seem to have the most absurd reason to hate these two. Argument A: Cena can't wrestle! Argument B: I'm tired of Vince shoving Cena down our throats. Argument C: Cena holds the belt to often and is in all the main events! I hate him, stupid super Cena! Here's the best one of all. Argument D: Cena sucks! he has no talent!.

Okay, well I guess you are entitled to your opinion but let me straight a few things out. One, Cena may not be your bret Harts or your Kurt Angles, meaning hes not the most technical guy on the roster. He is a brawler,which is a type of wrestler, hes more of a fighter, Austin was like this,yet nobody was on his ass because he couldn't pull off a super eye-opening move. He made up for it in charisma and storytelling, much like Cena does. As for Cena being on top,its obvious the guy deserves it as he has worked his ass off to get there, the guy is a phenomenal worker and loyal as hell to the business. You don't have to like him but you sure as hell better respect him for that. Cena is also on the top more often than others because hes the companies biggest asset in terms of starpower, therefore it makes sense that Cena will be placed at the top of the ladder in terms of feuds and championship reigns, its happened in every generation..the top guy is the king of the hill, its always been that way. I'm not even going to acknowledge argument D. If you can't see it then you shouldn't be watching wrestling if you can't spot great talent.

Now for Orton. Argument A: Ahh Ortons so boring, hes slow and does nothing spectacular. Argument B: He's complete shit on the mic. Argument C: I hate his gimmick! its so stupid when he does all those lame facial expressions! and finally a more recent argument. Argument D: He starting to become like supercena! the guy never loses and it pisses me off!

Well, the reason Orton is so..slow is because it is part of his gimmick, he is the slow calculating viper that analysis his opponents and his moveset goes along with it perfectly. Orton is soo monotone on the mic..yeah? Okay, do you want him to change his voice? Get over it, hes not the greatest but hes far from the worst, I will admit his promos pre-viper gimmick were more exciting but what do you want? Gimmicks change and wrestlers evolve. Since we are on the topic of his gimmick, you hate it? Good for you, I love it, I love all the little things he does in the ring, the shaking,the faces,the way he coils up like a snake, its all great in-ring psychology. Super Orton? Okay, hes arguably the top face in the company only 2nd to Cena, its obvious hes going to win more often than lose. Its called putting his face persona over, I will admit that Punk should have got at least a win over him once but what are you gonna do, as long as he keeps getting those huge reactions, he will keep winning.

I think for the most reason people hate guys like Orton and Cena so much is likely from the big transition from the attitude era to PG. People were so hung up on guys like Rock and Austin running the show and causing absolute mayhem that it has tainted their image on what wrestling really was, its not about the over-abundance use of curse words,raunchy themes and excessive violence, its abouting telling a good story inside and outside of the ring. Then when guys like Cena and Orton came in the picture,the realized that the company is no longer chattering to them and the greatness of the attitude era was left in the dust, so they felt neglected and in feeling of neglect they rebelled against the current product and tore it apart. So basically Orton and Cena had a tough act to follow and big expectations after coming out of a hot era with Austin and Rock and when fans saw that the product wasn't what they were seeking, they, like I said, rebelled. I say the fans of the attitude era were spoiled and its completely ruined any reasonable expectation for their view on the product these days.

...This is just what I think though, I have an opinion just like everybody else.

 

[Lucid]

One, Cena may not be your bret Harts or your Kurt Angles, meaning hes not the most technical guy on the roster. He is a brawler,which is a type of wrestler, hes more of a fighter, Austin was like this,yet nobody was on his ass because he couldn't pull off a super eye-opening move He made up for it in charisma and storytelling, much like Cena does.

Look, I appreciate Cena's ethic and his hard work, but saying that Austin couldn't wrestle is not true. Austin was a technician long before he played the brawler, and knew "moves". He was the Ringmaster! I think this part of your opinion is, if not uninformed, under-informed and needs to be remedied.