Round Two: Trunks vs. Dumbledore

[Lee]

Petrificus Totalus would bind him, Dumbledore having used it on Harry. If Molly Weasly can use a killing spell non-verbally I'm sure her former headmaster and far more powerful than her Albus Dumbledore could.

But Trunks can move fast? If only Dumbledore had used a non-verbal spell to slow down something. Oh wait, he does. The Snitch. Also used it last round on Neo who can run over 500mph. Speed? Pointless argument.

 

[enviousdominous]

Is the Normandy in flight while this fight takes place? If so, Joker will really be put to the test, but I have a feeling he can handle it. He is the best damn helmsman in the whole Alliance after all.

This will definitely be the most "" worthy battle for arena bystanders.

I would be fucking terrified if I was in a spaceship, where any kind of breach would probably mean death, and a Dumbledore vs Trunks battle suddenly materialized.

I imagine that one obstacle for both competitors is dealing with all the terrified people screaming "WHAT ARE YOU DOING HERE!?

 

[SSJPhenom]

So you're comparing Kid Goku, whose maximum power might have been about 300 to Trunks who is a SSJ and, you know what, nevermind. Examples from here on out. Here:

[YOUTUBE]TGM6dATRLi4[/YOUTUBE]
@5.42

Watch as Trunks tanks an energy blast (hotter than fire) from Frieza without blocking. Oh, and notice how he stands IN THE FLAMES AFTER THE SMOKE CLEARS.

Are you even trying anymore?

 

[SSJPhenom]

Petrificus Totalus would bind him, Dumbledore having used it on Harry. If Molly Weasly can use a killing spell non-verbally I'm sure her former headmaster and far more powerful than her Albus Dumbledore could.

But Trunks can move fast? If only Dumbledore had used a non-verbal spell to slow down something. Oh wait, he does. The Snitch. Also used it last round on Neo who can run over 500mph. Speed? Pointless argument.

Is there no limit to how slow the object becomes or is it a hax that works the same on everything? I'd imagine that something moving near light speed, if slowed down even to 50-75% of its speed would still be pretty damn fast. Also, doesn't he have to hit Trunks with it first? So Trunks will just stand there and let it happen? Trunks doesn't mess around in battle. He doesn't let his opponents get an advantage. If he can take them out, he does.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

So you're comparing Kid Goku, whose maximum power might have been about 300 to Trunks who is a SSJ and, you know what, nevermind.

Ignoring that he's half human. Okay.

Examples from here on out. Here:

Thank God you have finally decided to show evidence of things.

[YOUTUBE]TGM6dATRLi4[/YOUTUBE]
@5.42

Watch as Trunks tanks an energy blast (hotter than fire)

Hotter than fire? I don't know about you, but I've never seen an energy blast melt anything. Blasts blow things up all the time, but it hasn't changed the chemical properties of rock into, say, metal. Or a beach into glass. Things intense heat does.

from Frieza without blocking. Oh, and notice how he stands IN THE FLAMES AFTER THE SMOKE CLEARS.

In front of the flames you mean. If you're going to point things out, please do so properly.

Are you even trying anymore?

To be honest, you lost me a while ago when you defended pedophilia.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Ignoring that he's half human. Okay.



Thank God you have finally decided to show evidence of things.



Hotter than fire? I don't know about you, but I've never seen an energy blast melt anything. Blasts blow things up all the time, but it hasn't changed the chemical properties of rock into, say, metal. Or a beach into glass. Things intense heat does.



In front of the flames you mean. If you're going to point things out, please do so properly.



To be honest, you lost me a while ago when you defended pedophilia.

Here you go. I didn't think you'd want to watch this whole episode so I found the description.

The sixth Dragon Ball is found frozen inside an ice cave. Krillin and Gohan slowly melt the ice with energy waves to get the Dragon Ball. When the cave begins to collapse (Raiti and Zaacro might be the true reason behind this), Krillin, Gohan and Bulma sled down the tunnel on a block of ice.

Source: http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Fake_Namek

Unfortunately I couldn't find the video for it, but it's in DBZ episode 43. They melt ice with their beams. Also, Bulma tells them to hurry and they say that they can't because if they use too much power to go faster, they'll melt the whole cavern. This was way before Trunks and Frieza.

[YOUTUBE]cbVatD4Yyj8[/YOUTUBE]

Gohan burns food.

[YOUTUBE]NUqdME9y1fk[/YOUTUBE]

Gohan sets a log on fire.

Need I show more?

I hope I have lost you. Maybe you'll stop with your ridiculous statements. Fire will hurt Trunks because he's not full Saiyan? Now you did make that up.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

Here you go. I didn't think you'd want to watch this whole episode so I found the description.

The sixth Dragon Ball is found frozen inside an ice cave. Krillin and Gohan slowly melt the ice with energy waves to get the Dragon Ball. When the cave begins to collapse (Raiti and Zaacro might be the true reason behind this), Krillin, Gohan and Bulma sled down the tunnel on a block of ice.

Source: http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Fake_Namek

Unfortunately I couldn't find the video for it, but it's in DBZ episode 43. They melt ice with their beams. Also, Bulma tells them to hurry and they say that they can't because if they use too much power to go faster, they'll melt the whole cavern. This was way before Trunks and Frieza.

[YOUTUBE]cbVatD4Yyj8[/YOUTUBE]

Gohan burns food.

[YOUTUBE]NUqdME9y1fk[/YOUTUBE]

Gohan sets a log on fire.

Need I show more?

You said energy beams were hotter than fire. I don't see it anywhere in these examples, do you?

I hope I have lost you.

On defending pedophilia? Are you really proud of this victory?

People should vote against Trunks on common principle now. You've possibly hurt Trunks chances because now we know he isn't above chatting up a kid version of somebody he wants to fuck. It's pretty sick that you defended that.

Maybe you'll stop with your ridiculous statements. Fire will hurt Trunks because he's not full Saiyan? Now you did make that up.

You don't know much about the human anatomy and what happens to it when it is set on fire, do you? It's not magic. I'm not making science up.

And I didn't say fire hurts Trunks because he's not full Saiyan. Saiyans aren't immune to fire. Half humans aren't immune to fire.

 

[SSJPhenom]

I can assure that fire won't hurt Trunks. My example with the ice shows how hot they can get their energy beams. I know what fire does to humans, but it doesn't do it to these characters. How do you think enemies are disintegrated by energy beams? It's not from magic as you said. It's literally from the heat and power of the beam. If it comes from a stronger enemy, then their own power can't protect them. Now if Dumbledore could summon flames from the sun, you'd be on to something.

Speaking of, I just finished reading a list of all of the Potterverse spells and all of them say that the victim had to be hit by the spell, charm, or curse. Trunks isn't going to stand still and just let that happen.

 

[JGlass]

Hey guys, let's try to keep this fight focused on who would or wouldn't win, not on who is or isn't a pedophile.

 

[The Doctor]

I have two things to add to this discussion:

1. This is a tourney about people beating each other up and it devolving into weird tangents just isn't helping anyone. Focus on the fights. Also, please try to stay away from ad hominem. C'mon, guys.

2. Spells ricochet. Spoiler alert, Voldemort only died because he was hit by one of his own spells. No, Trunks might not stand in one place and allow himself to be hit by a spell, but as demonstrated earlier in this thread Future Trunks is hotheaded and doesn't always think things through, so it's not too farfetched to think that Dumbledore (who is incredibly strategic and intelligent) manages to hit Trunks with a spell angled off of a wall.

 

[SSJPhenom]

That's a cool idea, however, it's also been established that Trunks isn't Goku and he isn't going to play with Dumbledore. He will end it as fast as possible. Faster I think than Dumbledore can react

 

[Spidey Revivey]

In a world full of monologues and intense stares, I think it's fair to point out that Trunks will not end the fight as soon as possible. No fight in the Z Universe ever ended quickly. Trunks is cocky and will talk like every other Z character does. Arcs that should have ended in a few episodes run on into double if not triple digits because the characters don't know when to shut up. To say Trunks is going to fight Dumbledore head-on like some silent avenger and dispatch of him quickly would be a disservice to the world of Dragon Ball.

 

[enviousdominous]

I just want to emphasize again, this fight has "Peter Griffin vs Giant Chicken" written all over it.

I see both men trying to one-up each other's abilities and both men constantly respond to attacks with "IS THAT ALL YOU GOT!?" and "I HAVE NOT YET BEGUN TO FIGHT!" Yeah; the Normandy is going to explode before they're even halfway through taunting each other. Which for me begs the question; which of these men can survive in the vacuum of space?

I honestly don't know, I'm way too exhausted to research either person. Is there an expert who can help me out with this one?

 

[Hyorinmaru]

I know and love both of these characters so originally this was one of the harder matches for me to vote on.

After reading every single post in this thread I've decided to vote Dumbledore.

Not only do the myriad of people arguing for Dumbledore have me convinced he will win I'm pretty sure reading Phenom's posts killed some of my brain cells.

So while I won't be upset if Trunks manages to win I can't vote for him and feel I made the right choice.

 

[SSJPhenom]

I just want to emphasize again, this fight has "Peter Griffin vs Giant Chicken" written all over it.

I see both men trying to one-up each other's abilities and both men constantly respond to attacks with "IS THAT ALL YOU GOT!?" and "I HAVE NOT YET BEGUN TO FIGHT!" Yeah; the Normandy is going to explode before they're even halfway through taunting each other. Which for me begs the question; which of these men can survive in the vacuum of space?

I honestly don't know, I'm way too exhausted to research either person. Is there an expert who can help me out with this one?

Trunks is more than tough enough to survive the vacuum of space, but the question of whether or not Z Fighters can breathe in space is an on-going debate in the fan community. At first it was believed that no, they could not, however, in movie 2, The World's Strongest, Krillin, Gohan, and Piccolo are seen either in orbit or right at the brink or where Earth's atmosphere ends. Also, Vegeta has been seen flying unaided through space and most recently, Goku fought Beerus outside of Earth's atmosphere unaided. There hasn't been anything definitive within the series that says that they can survive space, but there are examples of them doing so.

 

[SSJPhenom]

I know and love both of these characters so originally this was one of the harder matches for me to vote on.

After reading every single post in this thread I've decided to vote Dumbledore.

Not only do the myriad of people arguing for Dumbledore have me convinced he will win I'm pretty sure reading Phenom's posts killed some of my brain cells.

So while I won't be upset if Trunks manages to win I can't vote for him and feel I made the right choice.

I'm sorry that you can't keep up. Since you're a fan and my posts hurt your brain cells, tell me where I'm wrong.

Or is it that, like always, you want a seat at the cool kids table and have to make sure you're seen backing the majority?

 

[SSJPhenom]

In a world full of monologues and intense stares, I think it's fair to point out that Trunks will not end the fight as soon as possible. No fight in the Z Universe ever ended quickly. Trunks is cocky and will talk like every other Z character does. Arcs that should have ended in a few episodes run on into double if not triple digits because the characters don't know when to shut up. To say Trunks is going to fight Dumbledore head-on like some silent avenger and dispatch of him quickly would be a disservice to the world of Dragon Ball.

But your own video shows Trunks defeating two very powerful opponents in less than 5 minutes.

 

[Viola Moonlight]

I'm sorry that you can't keep up. Since you're a fan and my posts hurt your brain cells, tell me where I'm wrong.

Or is it that, like always, you want a seat at the cool kids table and have to make sure you're seen backing the majority?

There is a fine line between arguing, and incessantly telling people they're wrong. I believe you've crossed that line, considering the amount of posts in this thread. I understand you're pushing Trunks, much like I am for D.Va, but you have to admit: constantly posting why Trunks would win, and never really conceding that Dumbledore has a chance, can really change the tide on people's votes.

Even with your posts, I honestly, in good conscience, cannot vote for Trunks. Yes, he's an extremely powerful fighter, and probably one of the few competitors in this tournament who can give Dumbledore a hard time advancing, but the diversity of magic Dumbledore has at his disposal outweighs the powerful attacks Trunks can dish out. Dumbledore also has a wealth of knowledge, experience, and wit that severely outclasses Trunks (although, you could make a claim they're evenly matched in experience). Dumbledore might be old, but he can still move very quickly with magic, and keep up with Trunks, and his blindly fast attacks that DBZ is notorious for. All Dumbledore needs to do is get a few potshot spells on Trunks that annoy the absolute bollocks out of him, or weaken his defenses significantly, and follow up with one big spell. I cannot see Trunks reflecting spells as well as Dumbledore reflecting attacks, too.

I'm sure you'll respond, and I encourage well-thought out rebuttals, but it's going to take some serious convincing to switch my vote.

 

[SSJPhenom]

I've acknowledged good arguments for Dumbledore from several posters and those that have argued why Dumbledore would win as opposed to why why Trunks would lose, I haven't said were wrong. I told Spidey he was wrong, because, well he was. So if me saying he was wrong offended you, I'm not sorry.

As for your argument, I'll never say that Trunks is smarter than Dumbledore and I've never made an argument against his age. I won't even say that Trunks can, even with his collective experience in outstanding battles, come close to Dumbledore's experience. Sure Trunks is used to fighting for his life, but in the grand scheme of things, Trunks is only 20 something and Dumbledore lived to be well over 100(I did some research). However, Trunks' specific experience in having fought Babidi, a powerful wizard in his universe, only improves his chances of winning, while Dumbledore has never fought a being like Trunks. There will be no spells, curses, or charms for Dumbledore to counter or defend against. There will be no all powerful wand he has to worry about or a wand that he can send flying with that one spell. All Trunks would have to do is avoid getting hit, which he can, long enough to get close to Dumbledore and end this. I've never argued Dumbledore is slow, but is he as fast or faster even than Trunks? Isn't Dumbledore, underneath all the magic and eccentricities still just human? Could he survive a high powered punch or kick from Trunks?

Vote Trunks.

EDIT: There is an argument that would completely sway me and if made, not only would I concede, but I would vote for Dumbledore. If anyone is a DB fan, it should be easy enough to make.

 

[nightmare]

This is why I hate being a DBZ fan sometimes. People like Phenom ruin it a little.


Dumbledore's universe is not known for its constant city destroying battles like DB has grown accustom to. Theirs is one of less physicality, but it does not mean weaker. For all that Trunks is, he is not the best in his source material world. Dumbledore seems to be that guy. I am not familiar with all his feats, but legend and that which I do know suggests he could match Trunks in his own right.

It wont be a fist fight with flashy use of flying attacks. Trunks wont see Dumbledore as an immediate threat based off first looks, so it isnt like he is gonna start throwing huge blast attacks first off. He will talk with him while assessing his power, then it will be a one up scenario where each guy trades blocking the others attacks.

Since neither is an outright killer, this will end in KO & most likely by Dumbledore. He is more likely to incapacitate Trunks and hit a final blow, given his quickness with casting. The problem with Trunks is that his most powerful attacks take time to charge or he must power up. Two or three syllables or a flick of the wrist is all it takes for Dumbledore to put Trunks to sleep, knock him out or worse if need be.

Oh, and for the record, the wizard Trunks faced is a bumbling idiot compared to who he faces now. Not even close to the same power or intelligence.

 

[SSJPhenom]

This is why I hate being a DBZ fan sometimes. People like Phenom ruin it a little.


Dumbledore's universe is not known for its constant city destroying battles like DB has grown accustom to. Theirs is one of less physicality, but it does not mean weaker. For all that Trunks is, he is not the best in his source material world. Dumbledore seems to be that guy. I am not familiar with all his feats, but legend and that which I do know suggests he could match Trunks in his own right.

It wont be a fist fight with flashy use of flying attacks. Trunks wont see Dumbledore as an immediate threat based off first looks, so it isnt like he is gonna start throwing huge blast attacks first off. He will talk with him while assessing his power, then it will be a one up scenario where each guy trades blocking the others attacks.

Since neither is an outright killer, this will end in KO & most likely by Dumbledore. He is more likely to incapacitate Trunks and hit a final blow, given his quickness with casting. The problem with Trunks is that his most powerful attacks take time to charge or he must power up. Two or three syllables or a flick of the wrist is all it takes for Dumbledore to put Trunks to sleep, knock him out or worse if need be.

Oh, and for the record, the wizard Trunks faced is a bumbling idiot compared to who he faces now. Not even close to the same power or intelligence.

Damn, you did it. That's the argument I've been waiting for. All these so called DB fans went right through it. I thought for sure someone would've brought it up after I mentioned Trunks could sense life force.

Trunks' ability to sense life energy also gives him the ability to distinguish between benevolent and malevolent forces. So Trunks wouldn't perceive Dumbledore as a threat right off. Even after Dumbledore attacks, Trunks would ask him, "why are you doing this?" He would try to figure out Dumbledore's motives and wouldn't decide to attack until he had no choice. From I'm told and know of Dumbledore, that would be too late. However, from what I've read of Dumbledore, he also is a great judge of character and can also tell the difference between good and evil, but he's much more likely to strike first. You're right, Trunks' most powerful attacks do take time, but I don't see him needing such an attack to incapacitate a human. Did you see what kid Trunks did to Mr. Satan? The Z Fighters can fire fairly powerful blasts without saying anything or yelling anything. You should know that.

I just have one other question; are the characters aware that they are in a tournament or are these random encounters? If they are aware of the tournament, all that goes out the window.

Also, people like you nightmare is why I hate these online debates. Instead of just debating and getting your point across, you have to send backhanded insults at people. I've never understood WZ Debate Tactic 101. Does it make people feel better?

And that bumbling idiot you speak of was smart enough to out smart all of the Z Fighters and Kaioshin(God) and, Idk I keep having to say this(because people ignore thats why) he was powerful enough to explode people with a thought, teleport, communicate with every living person on Earth at once. Yea, he's weak.

Anyways, given the scenario I just described, Trunks would lose.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

But your own video shows Trunks defeating two very powerful opponents in less than 5 minutes.

That wasn't even close to their first encounter. Maybe if Trunks & Co. didn't waste time the Androids wouldn't have won in the first place and Trunks wouldn't have needed to go back in time.

Trunks stood there and talked when he faced Frieza & King Cold. He stood there for Cell. Kid Trunks and Kid Goten stood there for Buu (And that was when they knew he was a threat).

The DBZ world is full of people just standing there and talking.

 

[nightmare]

I am not alone in my thinking Phenom. Plus, what fun is it without throwing some barbs in with a lesson?

Trunks would beat many here, but this match is just not his to win.

 

[Gelgarin]

Primary observation: DragonBall is a complete shitshow.

Now, settle my vote for me. Can Trunks actually move at comparable lightspeed? If he can move and lightspeed and punch a mountain in half then he wins, and he wins against everyone else in this tournament, and his inclusion was a glaring mistake.

If he can't, and the fight's going to degenerate into two dudes lobbing magic projectiles at one another's shield, then I'm going for the guy who is better at outside the box thinking.

 

[Spidey Revivey]

Primary observation: DragonBall is a complete shitshow.

Now, settle my vote for me. Can Trunks actually move at comparable lightspeed? If he can move and lightspeed and punch a mountain in half then he wins, and he wins against everyone else in this tournament, and his inclusion was a glaring mistake.

If he can't, and the fight's going to degenerate into two dudes lobbing magic projectiles at one another's shield, then I'm going for the guy who is better at outside the box thinking.

Trunks could be a fast guy, true, but suffers from hubris like every other DBZ character, making him do what every DBZ character does- stand there and talk.

Dumbledore does not. He suffers from a lust for power, as shown in his battle with Grindelwald and why he didn't take the Minster of Magic position. That and shame for loving Grindelwald.

I don't see Dumbledore draining Trunks's energy or anything, but because of their weaknesses I think Dumbledore would get the slip on Trunks, and he has shown in The Order of The Phoenix Chapter 36 that he could seriously tear shit up without monologuing. Trunks is going to monologue, regardless of what Phenom says about a "quick" fight.

Of course I leave Phenom to try and sway you. But Dumbledore at least has the ability to breathe in space using an amateur Bubble Charm or since he's a Transfiguration Expert, turn himself into another being capable of breathing without oxygen, if Trunks blows up the spaceship with his godlike powers (something his own character wouldn't do, because human lives are on the line).