RAW LD 8/17/2015
- Thread starter BringThePain834
- Start date
John McCass
You talkin' to me?
Does Undertaker have something to do with Lesnar's groan? He did two low blows the two times they have met.
Because if Taker comes out and beats Brock up without them it doesn't cast as much doubt to if he can win.
Who said Brock is heel in this feud? Just seems like 2 very over guys going at it in a huge rematch. If anything, Taker is the heel in the feud, but at the end of the day, he is the Undertaker, and the majority of fans can't help but cheer for him even amidst the low blows to Lesnar.
Bernkastel
Reaper of Miracles
3rd one in history that I know of.
If done correctly, a Taker victory is possible, with Brock being pinned but not losing anything whatsoever.
I don't see any real benefit in a clean victory for either guy at all.
THANK GOD.. that ending confirmed that Brock is going over. There was not a single episode where Brock stood out on top, so a Brock victory is 95% certain. I can sleep in peace now knowing that WWE isn't going to hurt the momentum their best booked character of all time
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
Bernkastel
Reaper of Miracles
I agree. Taker should logically be the heel here. Which it would makes sense if Brock wins.
No.. Brock's unstoppable aura would be gone if he lost, clean or not. His first "loss" was at WrestleMania, but wouldn't he wasn't pinned in that. His second one wasn't really a loss, it was just a failure to reclaim the WWE Championship (BattleGround). If he loses at SummerSlam, clean or not, it would be the 3rd time he falls short. That wouldn't look good for his credibility. When youre booked to squash the face of the company and the entire roster, you need to keep the momentum going, not have him fall short 3 times in a row
BringThePain834
Getting Noticed By Management
Takers gets the upper hand twice. Lesnar wins Sunday
George Steele's Barber
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If that show had a "main event" it was Lesnar/UT. Nikki v Sasha does not deserve that distinction.
klunderbunker
Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House
Yeah this wasn't the Divas main eventing. It was the Divas having the last match of the night. Those are two different things.
nope...
If Brock loses due to interference and a beating, etc from outside, and Taker takes advantage of it alongwith adding his own beating... then Brock really doesn't lose his 'unstoppable aura' whatsoever...
Also, him squashing everyone in sight gets old after a time, so WWE has to mix it up in order to keep the Beast as a 'hot act' for the long-term.
Bernkastel
Reaper of Miracles
Good. That way Summer Rae can take the pin fall and I don't have to suffer the trauma of no talent Ziggler burying Rusev.
There is Taker going over Brock clean as a possibility that I dread, but Ziggler going over Rusev is something I dread even more than that and that says alot.
Nope.. Lesnar coming out short 3 times in a row, no matter how protected those 3 times were, makes him look significantly weaker.
What matters is whether or not this feud draws. I'd argue that if you check the ratings then people aren't into all that much at all. The crowd was hot for Zack Ryder for a while. Doesn't mean he drew ratings(Rather the opposite).
Reflection
is a happier and wiser man
Whoa... Taker seems to have become a full-fledged desperate heel now. Should be very interesting, since we've already seen the opposite. I wonder who will screw Lesnar this time around.
Waking up at 4:30 AM sure is gonna be tough, since I usually fall asleep at 2 AM
A day of hard work and some early supper should take me through.
Waking up at 4:30 AM sure is gonna be tough, since I usually fall asleep at 2 AM
A day of hard work and some early supper should take me through.John McCass
You talkin' to me?
Whoa... Taker seems to have become a full-fledged desperate heel now. Should be very interesting, since we've already seen the opposite. I wonder who will screw Lesnar this time around.
Waking up at 4:30 AM sure is gonna be tough, since I usually fall asleep at 2 AM
This is an easy answer. The faces in commentary stand up for Taker, the heels stand up for Lesnar and THE EVIL PAUL HEYMAN.
The superstars in that package, FREAKING SETH ROLLINS, A HEEL SAID LESNAR WOULD WIN, Reigns was a face, said Taker would win and many faces/heels acted accordingly.
It's not rocket science, if you hate what WWE is telling you, that's fine, but you can't argue against what the alignments are being booked as.
This sunday at SummerSlam, Undertaker will be DOWN ON HIS BACK, going for a recovery for 2/3rds of the match and get a babyface comeback, while Lesnar is dominating as a heel in the 2nd act of the match. LIKE PRACTICALLY EVERY WWE MATCH!
Period. You can't argue against in-ring psychology telling that to your face.
Yes, Taker screwed Lesnar, but they played off Taker to cut a MORAL promo at the beginning of Raw to chastise Lesnar and Heyman's cockiness.
Lesnar didn't turn babyface during Wrestlemania season, it doesn't matter how much he was cheered, that was just bad booking.
He may have turned face during the Rollins feud AT BEST, but even then Lesnar (proxy by Heyman) and Heyman kept rubbing in the streak, which is immoral to do.
but you know what WWE did? They RETCONNED it. They changed history, like they always do. They are having staff members act, that Taker is the face and Lesnar is the heel.
Taker cannot be heel at all for the remainder of his career, period. Especially going into a possible feud with Sting. Especially going into a feud that tells a story about two people who were loyal to their company through thick and thin, regardless of money lost, regardless of poor ratings. Taker doesn't have time to be a "heel". Lesnar is still a gimmick who gets paid to only show up every few months for a fight, like a mercenary like John Cena said.
You cannot claim someone is a face and someone is a heel for being cheered/booed. You have to listen to the announcers, listen to where they are being placed by other members on the roster and look at the in-ring psychology this Sunday at SummerSlam when Taker is on his back.
It's not even about fanboyism, yes, it's a bit of shoddy booking, but you can't twist the alignments that WWE is going to tell you.
The superstars in that package, FREAKING SETH ROLLINS, A HEEL SAID LESNAR WOULD WIN, Reigns was a face, said Taker would win and many faces/heels acted accordingly.
It's not rocket science, if you hate what WWE is telling you, that's fine, but you can't argue against what the alignments are being booked as.
This sunday at SummerSlam, Undertaker will be DOWN ON HIS BACK, going for a recovery for 2/3rds of the match and get a babyface comeback, while Lesnar is dominating as a heel in the 2nd act of the match. LIKE PRACTICALLY EVERY WWE MATCH!
Period. You can't argue against in-ring psychology telling that to your face.
Yes, Taker screwed Lesnar, but they played off Taker to cut a MORAL promo at the beginning of Raw to chastise Lesnar and Heyman's cockiness.
Lesnar didn't turn babyface during Wrestlemania season, it doesn't matter how much he was cheered, that was just bad booking.
He may have turned face during the Rollins feud AT BEST, but even then Lesnar (proxy by Heyman) and Heyman kept rubbing in the streak, which is immoral to do.
but you know what WWE did? They RETCONNED it. They changed history, like they always do. They are having staff members act, that Taker is the face and Lesnar is the heel.
Taker cannot be heel at all for the remainder of his career, period. Especially going into a possible feud with Sting. Especially going into a feud that tells a story about two people who were loyal to their company through thick and thin, regardless of money lost, regardless of poor ratings. Taker doesn't have time to be a "heel". Lesnar is still a gimmick who gets paid to only show up every few months for a fight, like a mercenary like John Cena said.
You cannot claim someone is a face and someone is a heel for being cheered/booed. You have to listen to the announcers, listen to where they are being placed by other members on the roster and look at the in-ring psychology this Sunday at SummerSlam when Taker is on his back.
It's not even about fanboyism, yes, it's a bit of shoddy booking, but you can't twist the alignments that WWE is going to tell you.
Coming up "short" builds Brock Lesnar as the Huge babyface that he is now. He still is booked head and shoulders above everyone else on the roster regardless of his coming up "short" anyway...
Oh and btw, Taker has used 2 low blows(A clear Heel move) to bring down Lesnar since he returned at BG. If that doesn't confirm him as the "heel" in this feud, nothing else will. Pretty much nothing more to say on that.
Nope.. Lesnar should not be built up as a sympathetic face who got screwed over, he should be booked as an unstoppable force which is what made him unique and got him over. So why change that? Also Taker had the upper hand the whole feud (beat Lesnar up twice, while Lesnar never got the upper hand), so for him to get the upper hand the entire feud AND beat Lesnar isn't a smart decision.
Also I Taker is not a heel, most people view the low blow as a "tactical" move rather than a cowardly move : http://www.wwe.com/inside/polls/how-would-you-describe-the-undertaker-ambush-on-brock-lesnar
In addition, the night after BG, Taker clearly explained to the crowd that the reason he attacked Lesnar was because Heyman kept taunting and bragging about it every single week. So there is no clear face or heel in this. If anything Lesnar might be the heel since Heyman is acting immoral by constantly bragging about his client breaking the streak
