Live Discussion: Raw 6/30/08

[jmt225]

I’ve been a CM Punk fan since 2004 when I saw a match between he and Raven in MLW. He was the only reason I ever got into ROH, and I've followed his career as close as I could ever since seeing him that first time.

It's interesting to note that my first days on any wrestling forum period (which was in early 2006, the first time I got an internet connection in my home) consisted of me bitching about him being in OVW for too long. And now, two and a half years later, the motherfucker is World Heavyweight Champion. The ECW Title win was sweet because it happened in such a kick ass match, but this tonight was beyond amazing. Punk deserves this; I don't give a fuck what anyone says. He's worked his ass off to get where he's at, and he's done a damn good job while at it.

It’s hard to believe that just a couple of weeks ago he was losing clean to The Miz, and now he’s Raw’s World Champion. WWE is really fucked up, but this is incredible. I couldn’t be happier for Punk. I just hope we get some good shit from this run; that it doesn’t go down like Jericho’s run in 2002 or something along those lines.

But hey, also… Raw as a whole was a pretty good show tonight. And I fucking liked the way Cena and Cryme Tyme looked as a unit. That would be a GREAT faction in my opinion. Face or heel, wouldn’t matter.

 

[danaconda]

Could they possibly be building up a heel turn for Cena in a couple of months. This new group of Cena, Crime Tyme and Punk run together for a while. Punk holds onto the title while WWE ****es the straight edge guy out to the press for some "positive" WWE news stories, then we get a Cena turns on Punk.

 

[slayerofpanda]

spawn i actually agree with you on one point I really do with we saw a return of the anaconda vice....submission finisher are ultimately better. But I think he has earned enough for this what else could he have done....go after the IC title? With money in the bank the IC title would've been buried even more than it was, besides I happen to really like Kofi with it.

Idk maybe I'm just a fan of him and it causes me to be biased. lol When I went to smackdown last year besides the undertaker the only one I was dying to see was Punk so that gives ya my mindset.

 

[lamarre2012]

wow, fucking crybabies. So HHH wins, bitch bitch bitch. Cena wins, Bitch Bitch Bitch, Orton wins Bitch Bitch Bitch. Now out of the fucking blue CM Punk wins and more bitch bitch bitch.

Unbelievable!!!!!!!

I remember back in '92 when Bret Hart was just an upper midcard guy. Then all of a sudden I get Sean Mooney telling me tat over the weekend Bret Hart won the World title from Ric Flair. Talk about no build up, and it wasn't even on T.V. you had to wait till it was on one of those shitty Coliseum Home Video releases.
Just to be clear, I'm not putting CM Punk in the same catagory as Bret Hart.

I think Punk is just fine. All he needs is a good story, some good matches and a fairly long run Maybe a new finisher, how about going back to the anaconda vice.

And I just want to say the internet and it's fanboys have kind of ruined the surprise of wrestling for me. This was one of the few moments that actually came out of nowhere, it's a pleasant change.

 

[PDecicco]

Great Raw after what was an average PPV at best. But I'd say the PPV and the draft made much more sense after tonight. Last night I questioned Kofi, HHH and "Priceless" winning. All week I've pondered the draft.

Tonight it came together in what was an awesome 2 hours of TV.

Kofi winning is only going to fuel Y2J's new attitude. And I like how they are building Y2J right now. He is the best heel on Raw and for my money the best true heel in the company. Him and HBK work very well together. In Jericho's book he said WCW wanted him to be there version of Shawn Michaels. They were right, he was, they just fucked up and never realized how good they had it with a star as versatile as Y2J.

And Kofi himself is more than talented enough to warrant a title. A Kofi/Cade feud would be new and hopefully could produce worthy matches. Throw in a Haas, Noble, Kane and Chucky P and you have got a new and worth while IC division.

Punk, who I despise in every way possible, even had me cheering tonight. If only for the pure shock of seeing something new. And I was impressed by him picking up JBL, I have to admit. Punk vs Batista is what I see happening for the time being. Buidling up Cena vs Batista for W25.

I like Cena recruiting Cryme Time to hopefully be the new chain gang. This would be a perfect...PERFECT!...time for him to start rapping again. I like the Dr Of Thuganomics much better than this faux marine we've had for way too long.

I see Cryme Time feuding with Priceless after tonight. If they get Holly a new partner and maybe get one more team you might even have a good tag team division for Raw.

On SD! if you built up Kennedy as the top face and MVP as the top heel and on ECW...God help me...keep Mark Henry as the champ for a while and build up and Evan Bourne as a credible US champ we could move Matt Hardy to ECW champ at some point, and the WWE would have a product featuring familiar faces intertwined with fresh and upcoming stars and actually be a product worth watching.

 

[whoopwhoop12]

All in All...out of much criticism on how the draft effected a lot of Superstar pushes...mainly Smackdown...CM Punk as the World Heavyweight Champion was a brilliant move by WWE.

Agreed that Punk hasn't done anything spectacular since his win at WM 24 in MITB. All due to a Jeff Hardy fuck up.

It had to come in use at a good time and to know that is what had happened, WOW. Shocked.

They used the same tactic on Undertaker...Mark Henry beats him up, Edge comes out, CASHES...new WHC.

Now used in the same scenario except Punk is a face...the crowd is going crazy and Edge doesn't leave happy.

but of course when theres a new champ, there's new feuds and once again John Cena and Batista are not going to be leaving the title picture anytime soon. We shall see where this goes...but good job PUNK. WOW. WHAT A SHOCKER.

 

[Afro-Ameri-Spawn]

Tonight is such a graphic example of how much of a team player Edge is. Willing to put a guy like CM Punk over him if it will shock the fans and draw ratings. Not like that pompass backsatge ass kisser HHH, who probably engineered this by whining to Vince.

Poor Edge will now be forced to job to Hunter as the B guy on a show he spent the year or so building up.

Not really. Do you realize that in one single move, Hunter becomes the top guy on Smackdown while, at the same time, Edge looks weaker? Think about it for a minute.

 

[Afro-Ameri-Spawn]

wow, fucking crybabies. So HHH wins, bitch bitch bitch. Cena wins, Bitch Bitch Bitch, Orton wins Bitch Bitch Bitch. Now out of the fucking blue CM Punk wins and more bitch bitch bitch.

Unbelievable!!!!!!!

I remember back in '92 when Bret Hart was just an upper midcard guy. Then all of a sudden I get Sean Mooney telling me tat over the weekend Bret Hart won the World title from Ric Flair. Talk about no build up, and it wasn't even on T.V. you had to wait till it was on one of those shitty Coliseum Home Video releases.
Just to be clear, I'm not putting CM Punk in the same catagory as Bret Hart.

I think Punk is just fine. All he needs is a good story, some good matches and a fairly long run Maybe a new finisher, how about going back to the anaconda vice.

And I just want to say the internet and it's fanboys have kind of ruined the surprise of wrestling for me. This was one of the few moments that actually came out of nowhere, it's a pleasant change.

Dude, you could dig up Andre the Giant, reanimate him and have him get a legit win over Jamie Noble for the world title and we would still sit here and bitch bitch bitch. lol

Oh and I already mentioned the new finisher point. lol

 

[lamarre2012]

Not really. Do you realize that in one single move, Hunter becomes the top guy on Smackdown while, at the same time, Edge looks weaker? Think about it for a minute.

how the hell does Edge look weaker? He got the shit kicked out of him by Batista. Then he got fed the same shit he's done on two occasions. That's good story telling.

You're just looking for a reason to blame HHH.
Sorry dude, they can't have both titles on Smackdown. The reason Hunter is still champ is because having the WWE title is better marketing for smackdown the having a non-specific World title.

If HHH didn't draw he wouldn't be on top as much. and he probably wouldn't be married to Steph either. I don't see her marrying a loser.

HHH hasn't had a title reign in a few years and they just took a while building it up. Why would they pull the rug out from under it to start out at square 1. It's better to have edge chase the title at this point.

All I'm saying is you have some backward ass way of thinking my friend

 

[lamarre2012]

Dude, you could dig up Andre the Giant, reanimate him and have him get a legit win over Jamie Noble for the world title and we would still sit here and bitch bitch bitch. lol

Oh and I already mentioned the new finisher point. lol

you beat me to it while i was typing. i thought of it first

 

[8five]

Am I the only person who from the first moment Edge came out was like omg this is going to lead to a Batista beatdown and a Punkl title win, there was no other reason for him to be anywhere near Raw excpt for a world title to be on the broadcast. I mean I know it was surprising but no one else was thinking to themselves besides me that this seemed very fishy and something briefcase related was about to happen?

 

[Moon Knight]

Am I the only person who from the first moment Edge came out was like omg this is going to lead to a Batista beatdown and a Punkl title win, there was no other reason for him to be anywhere near Raw excpt for a world title to be on the broadcast. I mean I know it was surprising but no one else was thinking to themselves besides me that this seemed very fishy and something briefcase related was about to happen?

After he started running his mouth I suspected it, and when Batista came out I knew it.

 

[tha_icon85]

all in all this was by far one of the best raws in recent memory. Punk winning the gold giving edge a taste of his on medicine. this type of programming makes u wanna tune in next week. And big up to edge for hopefully starting a trend and help putting over a young star. now if they can repeat the suspense and add a lil more wrestling we may be seeing the begin stages of the next boom in pro wrestling. I dnt even watch smackdown on a regular basis but this not the draft makes me wanna tune in this friday.

side note: I see now why vince brought back ecw. u can give the young guys time to grow while build there fan base and when u wanna put the trigger, POW u got young established guy with a fanbase to add excitement to the higher shows new and fresh storylines and years worth of feud wit the vets and each other. heat and velocity come have never accomplish this. in a matter of a week u got to former ecw brand guy wit gold on the flagship show.

 

[Shocky]

Best Raw in years, no more of the same old shit

 

[wetland]

That for me was the best raw since 2003 (debut of goldberg) Perhaps even the best ever post attitude era Raw. OMG that was amazing. I live in the United Kingdom, i have liked wrestling since 1998 and have never bothered to watch Raw live (as its usually at 2am in the morning) Last night was the first time i bothered to watch it live, what a decision. For once well done vince, well done creative team, This is great. PUNK WINS! PUNK WINS! PUNK WINS!

 

[trev55]

I thought Raw was great! I'm not a Punk fan but I'm hoping him winning pushes Raw to focus more on wrestling because Punk is a GREAT wrestler. It is awesome how in less than 24 hours we have new tag champs new ic champ and a new world champ, talk about fresh and new! Hopefully Punk holds on to the belt until he faces Y2J. I feel its time for Jericho to have a legit run and I think it will happen now that he is pretty much the top heel.

 

[BooCocky]

The people who said edge looked weak was wack. It makes Punk an opportunist, it opens new feuds, and puts a belt on raw, and the Batista thing was payback from NOC.

 

[justinsayne]

The people who said edge looked weak was wack. It makes Punk an opportunist, it opens new feuds, and puts a belt on raw, and the Batista thing was payback from NOC.

I agree with you 100% (probably for the first time ever, LOL)

I love how when Edge goes out and does the same thing to Cena and Taker, he's an oppertunist and it was brilliant, but when Punk did it last night everyone goes out and crys and claims that it made Edge look weak

 

[dumbdumbjr]

Punk Wins Punk Wins Omfg Im So Fucking Happy

 

[ROHDude]

I can die a happy man now.

For the first time in a long time I am actually excited about RAW. I can't wait for next week.

 

[BooCocky]

I hate Punk but in all honesty i agree with what Justin said.

 

[danaconda]

I think what really helped Raw out was the fact that they didn't make Vince's stage collapse the focal point of the show, granted it was mentioned, but somewhat limited and used as a starting point for JBL's "martial law".

 

[CDR]

What the heck does Martial Law mean? I have no clue. I think the reason everyone thought Raw was so good is because there was no million dollar giveaway crap that slowed down the whole show. Thank God they're done with that and can get back to the wrestling.

 

[ROHDude]

What the heck does Martial Law mean? I have no clue. I think the reason everyone thought Raw was so good is because there was no million dollar giveaway crap that slowed down the whole show. Thank God they're done with that and can get back to the wrestling.

Someone may have to correct me, but I believe Marshall Law is where anyone decides the law/rules. Kind of like the old western days. Or it'd be like going to prison and the inmates are running things.

IMO RAW was terrible, it was only saved by CM Punk winning the title. They spent the first 1 hour and 15 minutes talking, besides the Batista ass whooping and Punk's pin, other than that it was pretty boring. There was maybe like 20-25 minutes of actual wrestling. RAW sucked this week, but I was so amped that Punk became Champion that RAW was awesome this week.

 

[lamarre2012]

Martial Law is the suspension of ordinary everyday laws