John Cena love him or hate him?

[bigbootydaddyV]

It's kind of ironic but I think a big part of the problem with Cena is the same thing he is complaining to the Rock about and it took Rock to bring him back as well... Let me explain, when Cena first started he was whatever, could've washed out just like Rocky Maivia, then he started doing the thuganomics gimmick but he came off as another white boy trying to be black and was just annoying as hell... but then somewhere along the line they let him be himself more and we got to see his rapping skills (he's not 2pac or Eminem but he can hold his own all things considered). Anyways, as he started rapping he started gaining a lot of fans. His raps were pretty damn funny and he owned whoever he got into the ring with and he had a tough guy attitude where he was having parking lot brawl matches etc. THAT version of Cena really caught on in my opinion and it's where the fans started to cheer for him, which for us fans in the case of Cena was the kiss of death... WWE decided to make him a face and slowly turn him into super cena and he was no longer rappin on opponents and ending it with different cuss words for the crowd to finish adn he lost all appeal to the grown male audience. So just like the Rock, Cena left us hanging, and it wasn't until a few weeks ago they both came back... I don't blame Cena for this, don't get me wrong, from a business standpoint it was brilliant because to the kiddies Cena is the current Hogan and Austin and hate it all you want there is no one on the roster who could take that spot right now. But as a grown male who enjoyed the freestyles on stephanie and brock lesnar and eddie guerrero it is frustrating as hell to see Super Cena and made me want to see him lose but I still appreciate his role in the WWE and would rather he be around then not.

 

[Terminal Sledgehammer]

Cena is a man I've laughed at some nights becuase he can be funny. But other nights I don't have a clue what was going threw his mind when he says stupid shit like "Holy Fudge and Mustard".
Reasons to hate:
Making the PG era an awful thing with the above quote, (by dumbing it down to a G rating)
The 5 knuckle shuffle
Super Cena taking a DDT on exposed concrete and still getting a win

Reasons to like:
Passonite about what he does, and it shows
Fanbase (though to some it is more of a reason to hate)
He can, and has, put people over
He is funny when he avoids the childish insults

Also I saw an interview of him on Gilette Drafted and the man, made people work during the interview. John Cena is a person I would shake hands with.

 

[darbare]

you guys know what I think one of the main reasons why ppl hate Cena so much, it just hit me....I believe it all boils down to jealousy....I myself was a huge Rock and Austin fan growing up...these were my heroes no bullshit...but when they retired, I still watched and as I got older Cena came along....Im like 20 right now, but I have seen all of what Cena has done thus far....I have seen alot of older guys in the audience want to boo Cena and bring him down because the kids have so much fun with him just like we used to....its almost like no "your Cena" isnt cool check out our Rock, or something along those lines....as a fan that got older I must admit those were good days growing up watching them, which leads me to believe that people are in some way bitter because they dont have those heroes anymore...I guess the only real way to rationalize this is to think of Cena retiring someday, and his kid fans now grow up, but then hate that next face of the company whoever it is someday...then people will be chanting they suck and wanting Cena to come back and give him an AA....I guess its kind of a cycle in a way...

 

[Attitude>>>PG]

I used to hate Cena! The only thing I use to talk about was John Cena. How much he sucks, he only has 5 moves, he can't wrestle, he doesn't derserve to beat people in a fake television show.

Then, I left. I left wrestling for a good year and a half. Took a well deserved break form lal the bitching and moaning over a guy winning a pre-determined match, or a prop.

Then I can back, and Cena is now unquestionally one of my favorite wrestler's today. He's wreslting, his showmanship, his commitment, his reaction's, his promo's. Their alway's so good.

Sure, his gimmick is hit or miss for some people, and I can see that, but how he handles himself in the ring, how he makes you feel his emotion's in the match, how the crowd can love him and hate him at the same time. It's just all the reason why I'm a huge Cena fan.

Sure, he does'nt do 15 moves and backflip's. But, neither did Triple H, Hulk Hogan, Stone Cold, The Rock, Shawn Michaels, Undertaker, Mick Foley, Bret Hart, Ric Flair. All of them are legend's. Cena is slowly moving into that category already. He's had some great matches with immensly lesser talented superstar's. Guy's Like Umaga, Bobby Lashley, Justin Gabriel, John Morrison, Great Khali probably had their best match with Cena.

Honestly, besides his gimmick (which I don't hate) what is there to hate about him?

What, his promo's are corny? Guess what, their not for you, their for the kid's, and the mark's. Maybe if some of you people have fun and you realize your watching a television show instead of yelling at the screen the whole time saying "this isn't funny!", you'll enjoy it more.


Yes, he win's alot. But, as being the top face, usually 9 times out of ten, you win your matches! If you don't believe me, go watch Stone Cold, or Hulk Hogan. And, the fact of the matter is, it is the John Cena show, he WWE books their programming like any television character - with a central character that the whole rest of that make-believe universe revolves around.

The 80's, Hogan's show. 90's Austin's show. Now, Cena's show. Cena win's most of his matches because he's a top face, he's the main character. He's not gonna lose all of his matches, that would'nt make sense. Simple as that. The sooner you realize that, the sooner you realize he can come back after a DDT on concrete, he does sell his moves, he can wrestle and carry people, he is deservingly so the top face, the better.

This is the one thing I agree and disagree with you about. Yes you're right Cena and his promos aren't for us older fans. They're for the the marks and kids. However that doesn't mean we have to settle for less. Like it or not Cena is held up to a different standerd by us older fans than the rest of the boys in the locker room because he is the top face of the company. He is following the attitude era which in itself isn't easy so I can't totally blame him. I still see it as if Cena and this PG era isn't good enough for you then quit watching and don't buy anything WWE. Believe me, over a period of time they'll get the message. Just look at The Rock returning. I'm pretty sure Vince appreciates Rocky helping out with Mania this year.

 

[The Mighty Tiger]

Regarding your point about Cena not having to overcome adversity; in terms of Austin, I definitely agree. Austin came up through the territory system and treaded water for much longer than he was on top.

In terms of the Rock, though; when did he have to overcome adversity? He came right from Canadian football into the WWF because of who his father & grandfather are. Also, although his initial push as Rocky Maivia was a failure, he was still being pushed as a big star right from the beginning. Cena certainly didn't have that advantage. Even after a classic against Kurt Angle (a match people on this board tend to conviniently forget when they gripe about Cena's in-ring abilities), Vince didn't really see anything in him. It took a good word from Jericho, and Steph liking his white rapper gimmick before he was given much of a shot.

I believe he was speaking from a keyfabe prospective but that part of his comment was still a liitle off base because John has had the deck stacked agaisnt him many of times when the subject is about how he is being booked.

Now you say Cena didn't have the advantage The Rock had which is true he isn't a 3rd gen superstar but when you look back on Cena's career he was being pushed well from the very start. He debuted in the company in 2002 by 2003 he faced Kurt Angle, Undertaker, & had a shot for WWE Title agaisnt Brock. In 2004 at Mania 20 he beat Big Show for the U.S. belt lost the belt then beat Booker T for it, lost the belt again went off & filmed a movie came back won the belt again then lost it just to win the WWE title at that years Mania. The rest is history but my point is stop making it sound good cause Cena really didn't have much adversity to overcome when he 1st joined the WWE.

 

[Sh0wst0pper]

[/p]

when John Cena debuted on SmackDown, I said this kid has got talent. Right then & there, Cena was officially my favorite WWE Superstar & still is. Now, I'm gonna get people bitching at me & saying that I'm only sticking up for Cena cuz I'm a huge Cena mark. Here's the thing though, I've met the guy a few times after WWE events (I.e. SmackDown, RAW, pay-per-views) & he is a stand up guy & an absolutely nice guy & really does deserve his main-event spot in the WWE & a place in the HOF at a later date. The thing is though, Super Cena didn't debut as saint as he turned face in 2003. It started in late 2008 after his feud with Chris Jericho over the World title. I personally like Cena as a face, but more of his 2005-2007 character. See, back before 2007, he was edgy & was still displaying good in-ring ability & great promos. Back then, he had a great feud with Edge & he wasn't this Super Cena, purple/orange wearing kiddie hero. And if you've watched his career from 2002, you know that Cena can wrestle, he's quite a good in-ring wrestler but he's kind of been made into this character who "Hulks up" every match & will throw some different moves around but mostly uses his trademark moves to end a match after coming back from nowhere. Cena needs to turn heel. This way, WWE Creative will let him actually put his in-ring ability to use & debut a new, edgy & un-stale character. He can do a lot in the ring, watch some of his UPW & OVW videos on YouTube as well, you'll see. I like Cena, he's my favorite WWE Superstar of all time but he's been boring me for the past 2 years really, something needs to change.

I'm in the same boat as you! I saw John Cena a good 3-4 years before he was signed to the WWE on a documentary that focused on Ultimate Pro Wrestling and a bunch of kids training to become professional wrestlers. Cena was one of them. I was about 16 or so at the time. I was immediately impressed because he was built like a brick shit house. I watched and re watched the segments where he went grocery shopping to see what he ate and his training sessions. I learned about his background. By the time he dropped "ruthless aggression" on Kurt Angle in his debut I was stoked to see him at the big show. I'm a board certified athletic trainer and like you, I was fortunate enough to meet him and hang out backstage before a RAW show. He was one of the coolest and most genuine people I've ever met. We talked like we'd known each other since childhood. Anyway, during that night I saw him interact with the other superstars and even the ring crew and he treated them all like family. I completely agree with you that he is a stand up guy and DEFINITELY does deserve his main-event spot in the WWE & a place in the Hall of Fame one day. The cool thing is whether he's being cheered or booed out of the building he's never changed the basis of his character and I'm sure during his early days he had pressure to react to the negative aspect of the crowds. I respect him for that. Cena haters boo him for always smiling, being "corny", and "having 3 moves" (since everyone else has a Chris Benoit 700-move set these days!) or some other lame bullshit excuse but there's no real justification for all the boos. I do however agree that there needs to be a tweak at this point. I loved when he first came to Raw and he used the FU and the STFU before this pussy ass PG Era ruined it all. As you said, is character was edgy and unstale and the fans loved it. I wouldn't mind seeing a heel turn mainly so he could tell the haters to fuck off. Anyway, long story short: I was a Cena fan, I am a Cena fan and face or heel I will be a Cena fan.[/quote][/quote]

 

[yeerandee]

cena is not good in the ring. period. the "super" angle got old with hogan. weve seen it before and the only reason that cena is out there so much isnt because he is great on the mic. he is better than a lot of the other guys in the locker room . he is big because of the pg era and the kids making their parents buy the merchandise. he has no in ring ability. thats why his matches will never be anywhere near great in fact most are at best good. is he was back in the attiude era. he would have been kicked to the curb as a low mid card wrestler. but these days people watch to see him lose and hate on him or love him to seath and cry that the rock is saying the truth on tv. but nonetheless he is the biggest money maker on the wwe roster which helps the company. i hope that the rock somehow "accidently" costs cena the title either on purpose or by total accident. then we can see what cena really has. cuz any one can win over the crowd. but there are only a few that can win over the crowd in hate.

 

[Zangash]

To be quite honest, I can't stand the guy. He's nice in person and everything, but he's making my show less entertaining. The guy never, ever puts anyone over. Ever. Period. Exceptions- there are none. The guy is booked the same way... every... year...

Step 1: Cena goes for the title. Cena, through (This is an important step) no fault of his own, does not get the title.

Step 2: Repeat step 1, but instead of saying "for the title", say "rematch".

Step 3: Cena wins his 3rd rematch and is now WWE Champion

Step 4: Have (Insert random heel here) jump him and demand a title shot.

Step 5: Have him win said title shot, by somehow beating the odds.

Step 6: Have him win the rematch, again by beating the odds, except this time in a random gimmick match

Step 7: See step 6

Step 8: See step 7

Step 9: Have Cena lose his title to the heel from step 4, but make sure it involves him getting screwed.

Step 10: Have Cena get screwed in his rematch to lose.

Step 11: Insert him in random, meaningless feud until he can slide back into the title picture

Step 12: Decide he needs to have the title again. Make him quickly bury the guy he's feuding with now and have him start feuding with the champ.

Step 13: Somehow... Cena is headlining WrestleMania!

Step 14: Cena wins the WWE title at Wrestlemania.

Step 15: Start over at step 4.

Yawn. Diversity? Please?

 

[Kosugi19]

I Love Cena I think he is great to watch and Im 30. I think he has the prototype build and mic skills. I would however like to see him get rid of the Jorts he wrestles in.

I watched the Jericho Documentary and I was very surpised he seems to be a huge Cena fan. He said the Cena match at Wrestlemania with HBK made him want to comeback to the WWE. Jericho went on to say it was a phenominal match. I thought behind the scenes HBK and Cena got into because HBK hated the way Cena worked that match.

 

[EricRuthGames]

Stepping out of the overcrowded "Cena is over-rated" shadow, I will step into a much more personal "Cena is over-rated" eclipse.

I will, as briefly as possible, summarize why John Cena is one of the worst things to happen to the already floundering business that Titan Sports and the WWE has become in recent years.

1. His severely handicapped in-ring skills are accentuated by a lack well of performed offensive maneuvers. Most would limit this argument to his obvious over use of his “5-step match completion package.” However, when you step back and utilize a proper third person perspective on the status of his feuds and battles, you’ll find that nothing under his belt has been regaled as “legendary” or even “memorable.” Shawn Michaels had his Wrestlemania X ladder match with Razor Ramon. Hulk Hogan had his Wrestlemania III match with Andre the Giant. Rock had his Wrestlemania X8 match with Hulk Hogan. Bret Hart had his Wrestlemania XII iron man match with Shawn Michaels. I could go on and on, but at the end of this argument, the clear standing is that John Cena has left no mark on the industry akin to those imprinted on us by the aforementioned WWE legends. Cena has left no true legacy and no true 5-star match with which the community can point to in argument of his talents. After eight years, you’d assume he’s leave us something.

2. While he successfully panders to the youth at ring side in every night of his 7-year push, he disrespectfully ignores the other 60% of the fan base who tire of his stale antics. While this in of itself isn’t the worst thing John could do with his gimmick, the problem unfurls when you realize that he blatantly attempts to take the audience’s negative reactions and spin them positively on camera. It’s akin to hearing someone yell “I hate you” and improperly retort with a resounding “I love you too!” Not only is it disingenuous and saccharine, but it shows the fans that there is very little depth to a character designed solely to push merchandise and fill empty seats. There’s less love in his scripts than one would typically assume.

3. The most heart breaking of all the wrongs John has lactated on the WWE Universe from his Superman pecs is the extreme disrespect for the history of the business he currently represents. “How is that possible?” you ask? For years, armies of talented, skilled veterans have trickled through the locker room, attempting to get their hands on the coveted WWE World Heavyweight Championship. The title has been fought for, tirelessly, by Hulk Hogan, Andre The Giant, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Ric Flair, Steve Austin, The Rock, Chris Jericho, Owen Hart, Eddie Guerrero, Bruno Sammartino, Ricky Steamboat, Arn Anderson, Chris Benoit, Vader, Mick Foley, Undertaker, etc…….and John Cena, upon accumulating said trophy, took the 50+ year history of the company and reduced it to a marketable, kid-friendly, spinning pile of shit. Yes, through transforming the WWE title into a pop culturally dated automobile accessory, John Cena has spat in the face of everyone on the list of wrestlers brave enough to enter the business and extent their hands skyward, where their dreams lay waiting. John Cena. How dare you claim respect for those who came before you and those that paved the harsh road of the business while toting that blasphemous accessory you call a “title belt.” I am not only disappointed in your terrible outfits (which also shows a lack of respect, since you’re the only superstar to wear jean-shorts instead of traditional wrestling gear), but also what you have done to the history of a company that has given the world so much.

In summary, John Cena has done more to hurt the industry than he has given to help. And while I have little doubt his heart is in the right place, it is clearly evident that he is in the wrong place. John, please go home.

 

[Attitude>>>PG]

Stepping out of the overcrowded "Cena is over-rated" shadow, I will step into a much more personal "Cena is over-rated" eclipse.

I will, as briefly as possible, summarize why John Cena is one of the worst things to happen to the already floundering business that Titan Sports and the WWE has become in recent years.

1. His severely handicapped in-ring skills are accentuated by a lack well of performed offensive maneuvers. Most would limit this argument to his obvious over use of his “5-step match completion package.” However, when you step back and utilize a proper third person perspective on the status of his feuds and battles, you’ll find that nothing under his belt has been regaled as “legendary” or even “memorable.” Shawn Michaels had his Wrestlemania X ladder match with Razor Ramon. Hulk Hogan had his Wrestlemania III match with Andre the Giant. Rock had his Wrestlemania X8 match with Hulk Hogan. Bret Hart had his Wrestlemania XII iron man match with Shawn Michaels. I could go on and on, but at the end of this argument, the clear standing is that John Cena has left no mark on the industry akin to those imprinted on us by the aforementioned WWE legends. Cena has left no true legacy and no true 5-star match with which the community can point to in argument of his talents. After eight years, you’d assume he’s leave us something.

Well to be fair Cena has had that 60 min match with Michaels on Raw a few years ago which was a classic. Although Shawn carried him that match he did at least put on a good performance.


2. While he successfully panders to the youth at ring side in every night of his 7-year push, he disrespectfully ignores the other 60% of the fan base who tire of his stale antics. While this in of itself isn’t the worst thing John could do with his gimmick, the problem unfurls when you realize that he blatantly attempts to take the audience’s negative reactions and spin them positively on camera. It’s akin to hearing someone yell “I hate you” and improperly retort with a resounding “I love you too!” Not only is it disingenuous and saccharine, but it shows the fans that there is very little depth to a character designed solely to push merchandise and fill empty seats. There’s less love in his scripts than one would typically assume.

As a Cena "hater" this isn't his fault. Blame Vince and the WWE creative team. Cena just does what he is told.


3. The most heart breaking of all the wrongs John has lactated on the WWE Universe from his Superman pecs is the extreme disrespect for the history of the business he currently represents. “How is that possible?” you ask? For years, armies of talented, skilled veterans have trickled through the locker room, attempting to get their hands on the coveted WWE World Heavyweight Championship. The title has been fought for, tirelessly, by Hulk Hogan, Andre The Giant, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Ric Flair, Steve Austin, The Rock, Chris Jericho, Owen Hart, Eddie Guerrero, Bruno Sammartino, Ricky Steamboat, Arn Anderson, Chris Benoit, Vader, Mick Foley, Undertaker, etc…….and John Cena, upon accumulating said trophy, took the 50+ year history of the company and reduced it to a marketable, kid-friendly, spinning pile of shit. Yes, through transforming the WWE title into a pop culturally dated automobile accessory, John Cena has spat in the face of everyone on the list of wrestlers brave enough to enter the business and extent their hands skyward, where their dreams lay waiting. John Cena. How dare you claim respect for those who came before you and those that paved the harsh road of the business while toting that blasphemous accessory you call a “title belt.” I am not only disappointed in your terrible outfits (which also shows a lack of respect, since you’re the only superstar to wear jean-shorts instead of traditional wrestling gear), but also what you have done to the history of a company that has given the world so much.

That's going a bit too far. Once again don't put this totally upon the shoulders of Cena. Blame Linda, WWE creative, and most of all Vince. That's why I can't even conjure up a reaction to Cena on television anymore. It's not his fault his character is a joke.


In summary, John Cena has done more to hurt the industry than he has given to help. And while I have little doubt his heart is in the right place, it is clearly evident that he is in the wrong place. John, please go home.

No John can stay. The PG era and the restrictions placed upon the talent needs to go.

 

[AnvilForever]

Let me respond to a couple of things.

1. His severely handicapped in-ring skills are accentuated by a lack well of performed offensive maneuvers. Most would limit this argument to his obvious over use of his “5-step match completion package.” However, when you step back and utilize a proper third person perspective on the status of his feuds and battles, you’ll find that nothing under his belt has been regaled as “legendary” or even “memorable.” Shawn Michaels had his Wrestlemania X ladder match with Razor Ramon. Hulk Hogan had his Wrestlemania III match with Andre the Giant. Rock had his Wrestlemania X8 match with Hulk Hogan. Bret Hart had his Wrestlemania XII iron man match with Shawn Michaels. I could go on and on, but at the end of this argument, the clear standing is that John Cena has left no mark on the industry akin to those imprinted on us by the aforementioned WWE legends. Cena has left no true legacy and no true 5-star match with which the community can point to in argument of his talents. After eight years, you’d assume he’s leave us something.

3. The most heart breaking of all the wrongs John has lactated on the WWE Universe from his Superman pecs is the extreme disrespect for the history of the business he currently represents. “How is that possible?” you ask? For years, armies of talented, skilled veterans have trickled through the locker room, attempting to get their hands on the coveted WWE World Heavyweight Championship. The title has been fought for, tirelessly, by Hulk Hogan, Andre The Giant, Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Ric Flair, Steve Austin, The Rock, Chris Jericho, Owen Hart, Eddie Guerrero, Bruno Sammartino, Ricky Steamboat, Arn Anderson, Chris Benoit, Vader, Mick Foley, Undertaker, etc…….and John Cena, upon accumulating said trophy, took the 50+ year history of the company and reduced it to a marketable, kid-friendly, spinning pile of shit. Yes, through transforming the WWE title into a pop culturally dated automobile accessory, John Cena has spat in the face of everyone on the list of wrestlers brave enough to enter the business and extent their hands skyward, where their dreams lay waiting. John Cena. How dare you claim respect for those who came before you and those that paved the harsh road of the business while toting that blasphemous accessory you call a “title belt.” I am not only disappointed in your terrible outfits (which also shows a lack of respect, since you’re the only superstar to wear jean-shorts instead of traditional wrestling gear), but also what you have done to the history of a company that has given the world so much.

1.) I think he has given us matches to remember. He had a great rivalry against Edge culminating with what is IMO the greatest singles TLC match ever. Plus he had the hour-long match on Raw, which was the Match of 2007. And there's his I Quit match with JBL, which is probably the most brutal match he has ever been in. Yes, he hasn't produced a Wrestlemania moment, but he's come up strong elsewhere.

3.) But the thing is that is what made Cena so big in the first place. Fans were making giant cardboard replicas of the US title when he brought in the spinner version, so it was only fitting he made the WWE title a spinner belt too. The belt clicked with a lot of people, and I think people liked Cena because he was "one of the guys." The SD after WM21, he came out in a cap, jean shorts, a Padres throwback shirt, his Cena medallion...and the WWE title. He went out and celebrated with the crowd, and he honestly looked like he could have been a part of that crowd. That night, Cena was...and I say this knowing I'm tempting flames...the People's Champ. It was that unconventional look and style of his that drew people.

The problem is that soon after winning the WWE title, he ditched the sports jerseys and started wearing shirt after shirt after shirt. His attire was no longer about being a part of the audience, it was about selling merchandise that the audience could wear so they could feel like a part of Cena's group, be it the Chain Gang or Cenation. Not only does the spinner belt not spin anymore, it is built around a persona that Cena doesn't have anymore, and it just doesn't look right on guys like Orton and HHH.

In short, I do agree with you that the spinner belt is obsolete and should have been switched back to the original design four years ago, but I completely understand why it was created in the first place.

 

[AttitudeChild]

I respect John Cena the person. The guy does a lot of good outside of the ring. But I do not respect John Cena the wrestler( or should I say Sports Entertainer ), what ever. John Cena the wrestler is a FUCKING JOKE. This is a guy that I truly believe dose not deserve what he has. In a sane world, a guy who is as bad as a performer as Cena would not be a 10x Champion. His matches consist of nothing but ugly punches and sloppy kicks until 5 Moves O' Doom time. He cuts some of the most bland promos EVER. I dare anybody to name ONE memorable Cena promo post rapper gimmick. You cannot. Now I'm not saying he's all bad. He can be sorta good sometime. But 'Face of the ENTIRE company' good? No.......Hell NO. The only reason why he is where he is is because Vince McMahon. He doesn't care if Cena is a good wrestler. He just needs a guy to use to represent his company and do interviews on Jimmy Fallon. So Vince goes and he shoves this so called 'Star' down our throats. Cena didn't get to where he is threw hard work and dedication, he got there because Vince just picked him up and put him there. And that's why so many of us do not respect him. He's nothing more than a sell out who is in a high position because of his backstage relationship with the boss. John Cena is THE DEFINITION of The Corporate Champion.

 

[EricRuthGames]

Attitude>>>PG

First off, I like your moniker. I can honestly say I agree whole-heartedly.

Secondly, in response to your first response, the fact that Shawn carried him through that bout is actually exactly what I was talking about. While I may not have made it crystal clear, my point remains intact. That match was only as decent as it was due to the talents of Mr. Hickenbottom and not the talents of Johnathan. No one remembers Cena for that match because we only remember Shawn for it.

Next, in response to your #2 point, while I actually agree with what you mentioned above, that too is the entire issue. I know that most of John's wordplay and actions are directly puppeteered by the Titan Sports committee of deuschery (sorry for the made up nomenclature), however, it still furthers the point that John's presence in the WWE is a cancer that is slowly disintegrating the foundations under the pillars of respect & history. In short, John simply "being there" is the diseased catalyst to these underlying issues.

Thirdly, we're just pouring over the issue again wherein John Cena's presence is the ultimate issue. Again, I'm not disqualifying the fact that John has minimal input on several of the key decisions to flounder the federation under the guise of his "Rap-Master" ineptitude, but at the end of the day, it is John's face on camera that builds toward a crescendo of hatred that many wrestling fans gladly convey towards the Television, and Internet.

I applaud your well though out responses as opposed to "John is teh W1N!", but realistically, you and I are on the same page most of the time. The only difference between you and I is that we find fault, and we see it in Cena, but we point our fingers in two different directions. You point yours towards the McMahons and their polo shirt round-up committee. I point mine towards John and him being there, thus allowing the problems to nest and eventually multiply. As I said before, when all is said and done, the problem is, at its foundation, very simple. John Cena is in the WWE.

 

[Attitude>>>PG]

EricRuthGames

I can't argue with you regarding the Cena and Michaels match. I just feel like he's not as bad as he's made to be regarding his ring skill. He's held back a great deal. Most of the locker room is as well. He is however just as responsible as the creative team for how he is presented.

Believe me you will never get a "John is teh w1n!" outta me. Lol. Like I said I don't even feel anything when I see him anymore. I'm numb to the product. That's why I stopped watching years ago and will stop watching once The Rock decides to leave. Yes I'm only watching because The Rock is back. Why? Because I'm being entertained again. I absolutely refuse to spend any of my time and money on an inferior product that isn't geared towards me in the first place. If Vince wants to target the younger crowd then go right on ahead. It's his company.

You're absolutely right about you and I finding fault yet see who is responsible differently. I take offense to Vincent forgetting who is responsible for his success. We the older fans are. If we didn't buy his product, tune in to his television programs, and guide the WWE to victory over his competitors we most likely won't even have wrestling on t.v. at all. WCW would have reigned victorious but with the AOL/Time Warner merger they would have dropped wrestling from syndication leaving us fans without anything.

Then when ECW returned a few years ago he could've left it as it was for us older fans to have. Yet he didn't see it as marketable. Had he had any creative vision he could have saw it as ECW for the older crowd, and WWE for the younger PG fans. I bet Cena and WWE wouldn't catch as much flack during his segments. The "Cena sucks" chants wouldn't be as bad as they are now given that we older/mature fans had something else to go to.

 

[tripleddd]

Really interesting reading everybodys replies on this topic i think its the Supercena bit that rankles beating everybody in front of him 1,2,3 I think its his feuds that don't work where perhaps hes challeging for a title and just when you think hes going to win a.n.other gets invovled and stops him - similar To when rock and austin were around. Also the single handed destruction of nexus just wasn't beleivable and i say look back when the nwo/dx/vkm were top heels - these guys were not taken out by one man.

 

[hollowpoint]

Im torn because I know of all the work that John Cena the person does for his foundations and the military so it's hard for me to differentiate between the actual real person and the persona we see on T.V. every week. So I for one do NOT hate Cena.

Now I understand what EVERYONE is saying about the whole SuperCena thing and how creative is handicapping the Superstars and it is all true. I think I look at it from a different perspective. Take a look at the Roster now vs back during the good ol' days. There was always great matches and you never knew what was going to happen because you believed either side could come away with the victory. It was STACKED back then and I know most of us really appreciated those days because it made for great TV and even better PPVs(when you get time, check out WM14-19). Now, you got Cena..and EVERYBODY else. The only Superstar that even comes close to being on the same level is Orton and now that he's a semi face, there is literally no one! So creative has to spend more time building characters than they do actual storylines and feuds because none of these guys have any credibility. If you take a look at this year's matches, some of the guys can't afford to lose because they aren't established enough yet. (ADR, Miz, The Corre, Sheamus,...even CM PUNK) The lack of upper level SuperStars is what I hate about it the most.

The good news is I am optimistic. With all the aforementioned talent, give them a couple of years and we will have some great programming once again. It will all come around like it always does....At least I hope it will.

 

[Mustang Sally]

Cena could of been as popular as The Rock or austin but he never had to struggle in the face of adversity like the other two

Reading that statement makes me think of Cena's program with Nexus last Summer. I don't know that any wrestler ever faced the adversity he did....and he handled it better than anyone could have imagined. There was no "SuperCena" involved, either. He faced up to the overwhelming odds every week, got beat down, and still kept coming back. Creative did a magnificent job with the program but it took a performer with the stage presence and charisma of John Cena to make it work. He could have come off as a sniveling wreck or as an unbeatable super-force......instead, he threaded the needle and managed to come across as a brave warrior with vulnerabilities and faults. If you think any performer could have done it; you'd be wrong.

He's faced tons of adversity in his other programs, too. Look at his work against guys like Batista and Orton. He not only had to overcome his opponent, he also had to conquer the portion of the audience who were yelling "Cena sucks!" while rooting for the heel to beat him.

Despite it all, Cena remains the #1 guy in WWE. Some people have an indefinable "something" that makes them a star. Guys like John Morrison and Jack Swagger would love to have it; they work so hard but can get only so far on their in-ring abilities. If they could figure out how Cena does it, they'd do it, too.

Meanwhile, Cena works hard at expanding his ring repertoire and gets better and better all the time. The worst thing fans can say about a wrestler is that he gets no reaction at all from the audience. Cena gets extreme positive reaction along with extreme negative feedback.

I read about a poll taken in the 1970's in which the readers were asked to name the sportscaster they hated most.....and who they loved the most. Howard Cosell won both sides of the poll. He got the most love and the most hate......and that's what John Cena gets as a wrestler.

That's the definition of a successful performer.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

I remember the peak of my Cena hate was when I found out he won the 2008 Royal Rumble. A year later, I came to realize that he is a great wrestler and performer. He gives it his all in and out of the ring and always willing to put somebody over which goes unnoticed because people equate losing to a guy and putting him over. He has had great matches and feuds and I don't see anyone on the horizon overthrowing him as the top guy in the company and that includes Orton.

 

[DeadmanFan]

1. His severely handicapped in-ring skills are accentuated by a lack well of performed offensive maneuvers. Most would limit this argument to his obvious over use of his “5-step match completion package.” However, when you step back and utilize a proper third person perspective on the status of his feuds and battles, you’ll find that nothing under his belt has been regaled as “legendary” or even “memorable.” Shawn Michaels had his Wrestlemania X ladder match with Razor Ramon. Hulk Hogan had his Wrestlemania III match with Andre the Giant. Rock had his Wrestlemania X8 match with Hulk Hogan. Bret Hart had his Wrestlemania XII iron man match with Shawn Michaels. I could go on and on, but at the end of this argument, the clear standing is that John Cena has left no mark on the industry akin to those imprinted on us by the aforementioned WWE legends. Cena has left no true legacy and no true 5-star match with which the community can point to in argument of his talents. After eight years, you’d assume he’s leave us something.

Yes, I will have to wholeheartedly agree with this. Cena has been THE main event guy for over five years now, ever since he beat JBL at Wrestlemania 21. He's headlined Wrestlemania every year in a row since then. Yet he still hasn't given us anything memorable the way that you would expect a guy like that to give.

Take this recent list of the top 25 matches in WWE history: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/644935-wwe-top-25-matches-of-all-time

Now of course any list is gonna be subjective and people will debate over what matches should or shouldn't be on it and where they should be placed in the countdown, but many of the matches on that list would be widely agreed upon that they should have a place in the top 25.

Cena was in one, only one of those matches. And it was that very match on RAW which Shawn Michaels carried, speaking more to the ring-skills of HBK rather than Cena.

How is it possible that the top face of the WWE for over half a decade is only in one of those matches that reflects more his opponent than him?

It's just further evidence that Cena really is overpushed and overvalued. One of my fields of study is economics, and in economic terms we would call this a "mania." Cena's value doesn't really reflect the fundamentals of him as a performer in the ring or on the mic, but the fact that Cena is somehow valued by many people, so more people value Cena and you build up a big asset bubble.

That's really the case with Cena. He's a bubble. He's been overpushed with marginal fundamentals at best (at least ever since he dropped the rap gimmick). Of course unlike an asset bubble he won't pop and cause a crash, but the bubble does leave us with some very stale programming.

The WWE "creative" team also gets blamed for this. Don't think I'm only directing this at Cena. But I do think that the "creative" team rides the Cena mania for what it's worth and proceeds in profit-taking, without a real incentive to change or reinvest in the "asset."

 

[whufc1994]

I agree with alot of you, I like John Cena the guy, seems like a genuine guy, very kind, charitable, not an asshole at all. However what he said about Rock (kayfabe) to the newspaper was uncalled for, none of his damn business at all. No idea why he decided to do it, maybe he was trying to provoke Rock to come back to WWE? But in general he seems like a nice guy and I got alot of respect for him because hes a hard worker, and has pushed the WWE alot - almost as much as Rock and Austin did back in the 90s.

As for John Cena the character, I do not like him, he is over rated, he only appeals to kids and he is annoying. And I'm damn relieved the Rock has come back to whoop his candyass.

LoL wut

There's no denying that Cena has pushed the company forward quite alot, because of him WWE has attracted a different audience, there are more kids watching - I don't like it at all, but I have to be honest and realistic, WWE have benefited from Cena.

But in my opinion I think WWE benefited most from having The Rock and Stone Cold Steve Austin on their roster, using their microphones and whooping ass in the ring.

 

[3/4 Facelock]

Cena hasn't had a Wrestlemania moment?!

WTF?

I know most of you were probably 11 when it happened but Cena made HHH TAP THE FUCK OUT at Wrestlemania 22. That's not a Wrestlemania Moment? Yes it is. It sure fucking is.

Here is the gist of it all. Cena is a great wrestler. He first showed it when he came thiiiiiis close to beating Kurt Angle on his debut with the WWE. Kurt Angle. That is who the WWE chose to match Cena with in his debut. Not a fucking jobber. An Olympic Gold Medalist.

He went an HOUR with Michaels. An HOUR. No, Michaels did not carry him for an entire HOUR. You don't put a suck wrestler in an hour long match. They carried eachother at different points in the match because that is what great wrestlers do when they face eachtoher in the ring.

Please understand that wrestling existed before 1995. It fucking sucks so bad that the majority of you are teens who never even seen a match back when Hogan and Warrior and Macho and Jake the Snake and Arn Anderson were in their prime and will never give it a shot. I really wish you could have seen wrestling before the Attitude Era so you would understand that the Attitude Era was a fluke in the timeline of pro wrestling.

Hate on Cena because he wears a purple shirt. Hate on him because he smiles when he comes out on stage. Hate on him when he tells a joke that no matter how funny, you won't laugh. Hate on him because you cannot seperate kayfabe from reality. But from what I have read on all these pages, not one person has a valid reason for actually hating the John Cena character. It's all superficial shit.

It's just petty mob mentality high school hate. And you know what? That's fine too. Nobody here can tell you how to watch wrestling. You want to watch it knowing it's live theater with stage combat, cool. You want to watch it like it's some sort of reality show, cool. You want to watch it like a hillbilly or a 7 year old and think they it's real and that they all live at the arenas and fight eachother at work, cool. You want to hate Cena because if your friends found out that you secretly like him they would make fun of you and you have no mind of your own, cool.

There is a big difference between being a great wrestling fan and disliking a character that is being portrayed vs being a fat sissy crybaby girl shitbag fan and having HATE for that person portraying the character for any non-personal reason. It's too bad that the mojority of you are in the latter category and only a select few are in the former.

Shame on you. Now...touch your index finger to your thumbs and put your arms up in the air. Doesn't that feel better? Of course it does. You're welcome.
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Previous Cena Thoughts: http://forums.wrestlezone.com/showthread.php?p=2221700#post2221700

 

[stasheroo]

I definitely wouldn't call myself a Cena fan, but I do very much respect the man and all that he does, both for charity and the business.

He truly loves children and being a role model and he loves the business and works tirelessly to support it. There is no denying that.

Where I have issues with him is largely due to things likely out of his control. The whole Super Cena act where he can never lose, and his overexposure each and every week. Even when he's 'fired' the show still has to revolve around him!

Cena's limited in-ring work level bothered me, but I give him credit for adding to his reportoire. I recently saw him add in the belly-to-belly suplex and a dropkick, kudos for mixing it up more, keep up the good work!

So I have my own love/hate on him.

Love some things, hate some others.

 

[DasGameCuz]

lol...lol.. from reading most of the "cena hate" post... you would really think this is real.. lol.. or that Cena writes the show.. "cena changed the wwe title" really? so that was 100% his call? So its he, who owns the company? "spat n the face of former stars" But not comment about the smoking skull belt that was made for Austin? lol.. get over ppl.. i mean really.. get over it... Like i said in a previous post, the same thing happend with the Rock... Cena haters just refuse to admit it... Rock was the hot heel.. turned face, and ppl still liked him.. Eventually he got stale... corny... Tho i was never a fan of "monkeys nipple or monkeys anus" that was never funny to me... but he would always win.. UNLESS... he got screwed.. Older males turned and began to boo.. but now that it happens to cena, he just needs to ..as one poster said.. "go home"? lol.. riiight.. that'll happen

 

[The Undeadman]

lol...lol.. from reading most of the "cena hate" post... you would really think this is real.. lol.. or that Cena writes the show.. "cena changed the wwe title" really? so that was 100% his call? So its he, who owns the company? "spat n the face of former stars" But not comment about the smoking skull belt that was made for Austin? lol.. get over ppl.. i mean really.. get over it... Like i said in a previous post, the same thing happend with the Rock... Cena haters just refuse to admit it... Rock was the hot heel.. turned face, and ppl still liked him.. Eventually he got stale... corny... Tho i was never a fan of "monkeys nipple or monkeys anus" that was never funny to me... but he would always win.. UNLESS... he got screwed.. Older males turned and began to boo.. but now that it happens to cena, he just needs to ..as one poster said.. "go home"? lol.. riiight.. that'll happen

LOL WHAT??????????????? Did Rock get booed by 70-80 percent of the crowd for 6 years straight,on 90% of the shows like Cena? And you really think that Cena is by far far far the most hated wrestler in the history of wrestling for no reason? Here's a news flash for you-IT'S BECAUSE HE FUCKIN SUCKS

Rock and Austin didn't need a corporate machine shoving him down
everyone's throat for years and years until the shit finally clogged the gullet to get over,
he did it with his talent. He didn't rely on fanbase made mostly out of 12 year olds and
lonely soccer moms, he needed to please a "bit" more demanding and unforgiving crowd. And he
didn't compete when american wrestling was on its lowest point in history,but when it was on
its highest,when everyone was pushing the limits to get on top and when actual talent was
needed to make it,and not just 23 layers of colorful cartoonish merchandise,relentlessbacking
of the corp,milking money out of the lesser minded,easy to please fans and face printed on
everything from T-shirts to TP in all the colors of a rainbow.
I,and many of my friends started watching wrestling again JUST BECAUSE we heard the Rock was
back.I myself stopped watching in about 2007 cause the shit really got unbearable. I tried
to sit through RAW on couple of occasions since then but it was horrible to the point when i
was ashamed of watching it. It turned into Sesame Street and Hannah Montana filled with grey
average Joe's in Speedos. Lackluster,boring,childish,mindnumbing,bland,steri le corporate
product made with a single purpose of effortlessly coasting while making buck.