Is the WWE Live Crowd Ruining WWE?

[shooter_mcgavin]

Ive been saying this for a while. Great, the Baltimore fans proved tonight that they remember Husky Harris. They're so smart. Let's give them a cookie! But this is nothing new. Cheering heels and booing the faces hurts the show every bit as much as ridiculously misplaced Goldberg chants. For some reason fans go to shows feeling like it's their job to steal the show or something. And the WWE encourages this crap. Here's the truth. The Wrestlemania crowd sucked. The English crowds sucked. People don't tune in to see idiot fans chant "Boring" while two guys are working their asses off. If the show isn't entertaining, don't go. It's as easy as that.

That's a bit condescending isn't it. And I would like to point out some things:

hurts the show every bit as much as ridiculously misplaced Goldberg chants

I have no problems with the crowd chanting Goldberg on Ryback or chanting Husky Harris on The Wyatt Family. If that's how the fans sees the superstar it's not like it's their fault for pointing out the obvious. The WWE just has to find a way to make the fans accept these repackaging. Why were guys like Ziggler or Sandow not getting chants of their older characters? Because fans accepted it. It's the WWE's job to do the same for Ryback and Wyatt Family.

People don't tune in to see idiot fans chant "Boring" while two guys are working their asses off. If the show isn't entertaining, don't go. It's as easy as that.

There's also nothing wrong with "Boring" chants as much there isn't a problem with "This is Awesome" chants. It's two ends of the spectrum, if a match or segment is entertaining the live crowd will react positively if it's boring they will act negatively. Like I said nothing wrong with that fans pay good money to see a show and I don't think it's their intention to anticipate a bad product.

But crowd reaction is part of the WWE product and superstars are made or destroyed because of the crowd. It's always been that way and just because we have more information on the internet now doesn't mean the fundamentals changed.

There's nothing wrong with voicing the fans displeasure on a product. It's the stars in the ring that is supposed to sway the crowd. Take the Regal/Benoit match in the Brian Pillman memorial event. The commentators of the match in the DVD said fans were chanting "boring" first but after a while the fans started to appreciate the match. It's all about working the crowd and if the first signs of fans changing "boring" in a match happens it's the wrestlers job to make it entertaining.

Cheering heels and booing the faces hurts the show
As for cheering for heels and booing faces, I am sorry but, once again it's part of the product. If the crowd enjoys the heels more maybe it's because they are more entertaining or they agree with the character he or she portrays.

If people are so mad that heels are cheered then these people should be made at Austin or Rock becoming the top faces of the Attitude Era. They were, initially, planned to have long runs as top heels especially Austin. In the earlier Austin DVD's people were saying (especially Michael Hayes I think) the plan was Austin to be the #1 heel but when crowd reaction was cheering for him they turned him into the top face instead. Hey guess what, It worked and made the WWE a lot of money.

CM Punk and Batista are examples who became top faces because the crowed cheered for them as heels and turning them was good business. So it's the fans fault the WWE made money with their face turns?

 

[The Butcher]

You're kind of missing the point, you are lumping all "chants against wrestlers" as the same and if we do one we must accept another one, but it's not the case.

The Goldberg chant, even if it was mocking Ryback doesn't do any harm to his character. He's still this monster destroyer machine that they are trying to portray. A lesser Goldberg perhaps but still is. Which is why I said if they chanted Skip Sheffield I would agree because THAT is malicious to the Ryback character. That's reminding him that he was this goofy cornfed meathead and he's trying to come back as this monster and they are not buying it.

The Husky Harris chant, is a malicious chant that is capable of destroying what the Bray Wyatt character stands for. That is suggesting that he was a failed overweight character who got p*ssy whipped by Punk and he is now trying to come back as this hillbilly preacher. THAT is absolutely destructive to his character and might result in the worst possible outcome which is what happened to Tensai.

Fun chants like what they did with Sheamus and Orton are fine, but malicious chants like Husky Harris are not. It destroys the character and hampers the chances of him getting over, which ironically the same fans complain about wrestlers not getting over.

"Malicious chants!?" Are you serious? A malicious chant would be "we-hope-you-die *clap* *clap* *clap**clap**clap*. Chanting "Husky Harris" is harmless, except to children like you who are apparently so delusional as to think that a chant can destroy a character.

Tensai flopped because it was a terrible character that didn't connect on any level. Matt Bloom always ends up a goofball in WWE. Chants didn't cause A-Train to become a Hip Hop Hippo. If people hadn't chanted "Albert" at Tensai he would've garnered no reaction at all.

I mean, read what you're saying. "Malicious..." get outta here with that nonsense. Are "what" chants malicious? They are designed to throw the performer off, so clearly they are. Is chanting "Cena sucks" malicious? Quit it with your stupid double standard.

 

[R.K.O]

"Malicious chants!?" Are you serious? A malicious chant would be "we-hope-you-die *clap* *clap* *clap**clap**clap*. Chanting "Husky Harris" is harmless, except to children like you who are apparently so delusional as to think that a chant can destroy a character.

Tensai flopped because it was a terrible character that didn't connect on any level. Matt Bloom always ends up a goofball in WWE. Chants didn't cause A-Train to become a Hip Hop Hippo. If people hadn't chanted "Albert" at Tensai he would've garnered no reaction at all.

I mean, read what you're saying. "Malicious..." get outta here with that nonsense. Are "what" chants malicious? They are designed to throw the performer off, so clearly they are. Is chanting "Cena sucks" malicious? Quit it with your stupid double standard.

Malicious to the character, if you want to be specific. "What" chants and "Cena sucks" chants have nothing to do with this.

Double standard, as if you don't have your own likes and dislikes. I bet you like Brad Maddox as GM huh?

 

[The Butcher]

Malicious to the character, if you want to be specific. "What" chants and "Cena sucks" chants have nothing to do with this.

Double standard, as if you don't have your own likes and dislikes. I bet you like Brad Maddox as GM huh?

So "Cena sucks" is not malicious to the character? Saying that John Cena sucks is by definition malicious to his character. If I said, "R.K.O. sucks," I would be making a malicious (harmful) statement about your character (who you are). Now double talk your way out of that.

And while we're at it, a double standard has nothing to do with likes and dislikes, professor. An example of a double standard would be claiming that calling a character by a former name is malicious, but saying a character sucks isn't malicious.

And Brad Maddox has been GM for all of four hours. I'll give him a chance, rather than make a knee jerk reaction and then try to talk my way around it when somebody calls me on it.

 

[R.K.O]

So "Cena sucks" is not malicious to the character? Saying that John Cena sucks is by definition malicious to his character. If I said, "R.K.O. sucks," I would be making a malicious (harmful) statement about your character (who you are). Now double talk your way out of that.

And while we're at it, a double standard has nothing to do with likes and dislikes, professor. An example of a double standard would be claiming that calling a character by a former name is malicious, but saying a character sucks isn't malicious.

And Brad Maddox has been GM for all of four hours. I'll give him a chance, rather than make a knee jerk reaction and then try to talk my way around it when somebody calls me on it.

"Cena sucks" occurred when he was already well established, it didn't hurt his character as he had already made it. Now from your standards "Rocky sucks" chant on the other hand is malicious because it ruined the Rocky Maivia character and he had to change it. Like I said before, you people are just lumping chants together instead of looking at them individually. But really who cares, we are talking about Bray Wyatt here.

Likes and dislikes creates bias and that leads to double standards. Which is why I find it ironic that some people tries to act all high and mighty like they are truly neutral.

I am only interested in Bray Wyatt here so if you are going to continue to talk about these non issues then I won't continue.

 

[Miz_America]

Live crowds do sometimes ruin wrestling. But live crowds also keep wrestling alive, so you just have to get over it. 99.5% of WWE crowds are terrible. Most dont know jack about wrestling, are too young, too old, too drunk or are just plain assholes. Ive never had a GREAT time being part of a WWE crowd. But I can name a dozen indy shows that being in the crowd made the experience so much better. I usually watch Raw on mute and just listen to music or something. Mainly because I CANT STAND the commentary, and also because the crowds are rubbish. WWE just doesnt have a good crowd atmosphere anymore. Too many different demographics that just dont see eye to eye on most wrestlers.

And why Im here, FUCK that crowd for chanting Husky Harris. Seriously, fuck them! Weeks of build up and the crowd just has to shit all over it. Cant believe it went down like that. Sucks, I really like what Brays done with the character. Hope to Christ those chants dont stick next week. Where is the show taping?

 

[Yawa]

Make no mistake, it would definitely benefit the "perception" of the product if the WWE stuck to a travel schedule that only saw televised events in the hot cities.

Perception though is not quality.

 

[#tamale]

You're kind of missing the point, you are lumping all "chants against wrestlers" as the same and if we do one we must accept another one, but it's not the case.

The Goldberg chant, even if it was mocking Ryback doesn't do any harm to his character. He's still this monster destroyer machine that they are trying to portray. A lesser Goldberg perhaps but still is. Which is why I said if they chanted Skip Sheffield I would agree because THAT is malicious to the Ryback character. That's reminding him that he was this goofy cornfed meathead and he's trying to come back as this monster and they are not buying it.

The Husky Harris chant, is a malicious chant that is capable of destroying what the Bray Wyatt character stands for. That is suggesting that he was a failed overweight character who got p*ssy whipped by Punk and he is now trying to come back as this hillbilly preacher. THAT is absolutely destructive to his character and might result in the worst possible outcome which is what happened to Tensai. If the fans chanted Isaac Yankem to Kane, do you think his character would still have worked? That's what the Husky Harris chants might do.

If people found it cute and funny when smarky chants were leveled at performers they don't particularly like, they have to endure those cute and funny chants when they are leveled at superstars they do like. It is annoying. People on here have stated it's annoying. Don't think it's malicious though and the Wyatt Family debut was still great.

It's just funny how people react when their superstar is the victim of these types of chants. That's how these crowds are, yet people have praised them in the past when they do it to other superstars. As I stated before, those Sami Zayn "Ole" threads are going to be hilarious when they come about.

Fun chants like what they did with Sheamus and Orton are fine.

So it was fun to chant "Fire Randy!" at Orton? Gotcha !

 

[toon126]

I'm glad this thread was made because I felt exactly the same as I was watching last night.

We've waited weeks for that debut, it was built up immensely, anyone who's see the Wyatt's on NXT would have been even more excited, and then the live crowd goes and chants "Husky Harris" during what was supposed to be a horrific attack on Kane.

It's almost like the crowd couldn't wait to chant and completely ignored them hitting a 'concherto' with the steps.

It is boring now, we get it, some of you in the crowd think of yourselves as 'smarks' and whatever, but the Albert chants were funny ONCE, the Goldberg chants are beyond dull now, the Husky Harris ones were just pathetic. Why don't they just chant "Isaac Yankem" at Kane then?!

To be honest the live crowds at a lot of shows do ruin a lot of events these days, they have such a big role to play, after all how well a superstar does is a great deal to do with them. Too often they spoil it though, whether it's their lack of enthusiasm or interest or noise, or like last night spoiling a segment with an absolutely pointless chant.

 

[ProWrestlingFan]

Where was this thread when they chanted "Albert" for Tensai and "Goldberg" for Ryback ?

IWC double standards like always.

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

Wow, the level of self-righteous entitlement some folks have is amazing.

I mean, seriously, the wrestlers not only owe you a great performance, but you think that the live crowd owes one to you as well. And if they don't deliver, then all of a sudden the crowd "doesn't deserve that debut" or doesn't deserve to have a Monday Night RAW (as has been suggested in other threads).

Give me a break.

For the record, I thought the debut was kind of weak and that had nothing to do with the crowd. The best part of it is that maybe, just maybe, this will lead to a Undertaker/Kane Vs. Wyatt Family match? Dare to dream?

 

[The Eighties]

People will find the live crowds reactions fun/annoying based purely off their preferences, but I think the main thing is that reaction is better than no reaction, it's when the crowd don't care about what you are doing at all that you have a problem, and while the Albert and Husky Harris chants were ultra smarky, there are other occasions where consistent "Against the grain" fan reactions have helped WWE tweak booking and get more out of talents, like the recent Del Rio/Ziggler double turn which has benefited both guys.

The Husky Harris chants last night took me by surprise as I didn't expect anyone to really remember him as unlike Albert he was not really featured as anything but a body in a big group. I know the IWC are all hot on the Wyatt's but what if WWE audiences across the US actually find the gimmick silly? Can Bray overcome the chants and get over in the coming weeks to the point we don't hear the chants again? All good tests for the booking and the performer.

Bottom line is I find Henry getting the stupid "What!?" chant and people chanting "You can't wrestle" at Cena ridiculous but I wouldn't want to silence the freedom of the crowd because that would hurt the times when the crowd responses actually benefit a wrestler, gotta take the bad with the good.

 

[MrMojoRisin]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees the blatant hypocrisy at work here. There are wrestling fans who simply refuse to realize that they can't have it all their way. When the live crowds chant what these people want them to chant, they eat it up and talk about how the crowd helped make the show. When the crowd chants something they dislike, they moan and talk about how the live crowd ruined the show.

We've got a perfect example right here in our midst, although I'll withhold the name:





It doesn't get anymore blatant than that. When he agrees with the live audience, it's WWE who is at fault. When he disagrees with the live audience, well then they are stupid. He's not alone. What he and others like him need to realize is that they're being childish. You can't have it both ways, folks. God forbid you take the good with the bad.

Live crowds can certainly annoy me. I think "what?" chants are beyond played out and am not shy about saying so. However, I've never let an audiences reaction or chants make or break a segment for me. When I talk about a show after it's over, I try to focus on the show, not the crowd. I wish others would give that a try, yet here we are, two weeks in a row, with threads about the crowd. Last week it was one about Raw only emanating from select cities because the crowd in Sioux City was too quiet. This week it's a thread about the fans "ruining WWE" because the crowd in Baltimore chanted a new character's old name.

Get over yourselves. Fans in attendance pay their money to have a good time. If that entails calling Bray Wyatt "Husky Harris," or chanting "boring," then those of us watching from home have to live with that. As of the time this is posted, there are no threads about the Wyatt Family's brilliant debut, but there's one 15 posts deep about the damn audience.

The live crowds aren't ruining anything. It's keyboard warriors who don't buy merch, stream pay-per-views, and act with righteous indignation at everything they don't like who are ruining things for themselves.

I figured you'd show up here... and really, you don't need to withhold my name. Have some more balls than that. I can stand by whatever I say.

The thing is, you're arguing two different things, and passing them off as the same.

It's one thing for fans to be vocal about not liking something they see in the ring. Why should they sit there and blindly cheer for whatever they're spoon fed by the WWE? They're not doing themselves, the performers, or the WWE any service when they do that.

Is that what happened last night?

No. The Wyatt's had a great debut. You even said it yourself. You heard the crowd give them a huge pop when they first came out. Everything about it had a perfectly creepy, intense feel. The crowd at large enjoyed it.

It happened to be what was probably just a handful of smarks who unfortunately were sitting within microphone range that had to hijack the segment with their "Husky Harris" chant. Do you think those smarks didn't like what they just saw, and were simply letting Windham Rotunda know he shit the bed on his debut? No. They just thought they were clever and funny and cared more about making the segment about them instead of the story in the ring.

I don't know about you... but I don't go to shows to watch the crowd. I don't buy PPV's to watch the crowd. I don't watch on TV to watch the crowd. I watch wrestling for the stories that the wrestlers are telling me, and I don't appreciate those stories getting hijacked by some idiot 'smart' fans who want everything to be about them instead.

Like I said before. Everyone has an old gimmick they've used at some point. What does it matter? Are the fans really being that smart when they let everyone know that they know a guys old ring name? Like my previous analogy... how do you think the Undertaker's debut would have gone if he had to deal with what guys have to deal with today when they debut a new gimmick? I'd put money on the fact that if that shit happened back in 1990... you'd be asking me "Undertaker who?" today.

You mentioned that this is all everyone is talking about instead of the debut? Don't you realize then how that group of fans affected the Wyatt's debut, and how fans in general are getting tired of these smark fans hijacking the shows they're at? It sucks, because that was a great debut. One of the better ones I've seen in quite a while, but unfortunately those guys in the crowd hit on what's obviously a sore spot for a lot of people, and that overshadowed everything.

So far I've read comments on this and another board. Seen many people give their opinions... and you've basically been the only one condoning what those fans did. What's that tell you? And please don't say that everyone else must be wrong but you... because that's just lame.

One other thing. You keep talking about the fans being able to have a good time because they spent their money. Why is it then, that they can't have a good time watching the stories that they are being told... and if it's because they're not being told good ones, then why are these people still spending their money to go to these shows? I know myself... when I pay money to go to a show, I'm not doing it to listen to some guy two rows in front of me with some inferiority complex tell everyone how smart he is. I don't need to spend money to hear that. I'm paying to watch the actual show.

 

[Blade]

I was loving the Wyatt family debut until that chant started. This is the type of fan that the internet breeds. The smarky douchebags who think they're clever and funny just because they chant a wrestler's former name. Indeed, if there's anyone on this site who was there last night, making the Husky Harris chants, please make yourself known so you can explain why.

Smarks, you're the ones ruining wrestling, not the young Cena fans that you complain about.

The problem is, younger fans are too quiet but the older, louder fans are douchebags, so it's difficult to find the right balance. Actually, that's not entirely true, the post-Wrestlemania crowd were really smarky, but they didn't start any stupid chants. Then again, that crowd was made up of a lot of people who flew in from out of the country for 'Mania. That's your solution, just take Raw out of America from now on...

 

[George Steele's Barber]

I missed Raw last night because I went to the ballet. I had been to this ballet last week as well but what can I say, "I'm a sucker for a good show". Anyway, the part of Persephone was being played by the dancer who last week played Fairy#4. When I saw this on the insert in the Playbill I knew how awesome I would be if I let the ballet troop know how awesome I am. So when Agnieska Palenstroya came out as the Persephone character I totally started a "Fairy #4! Fairy #4!" chant.

I was awesome, everyone started paying attention to how awesome I was until one old bag told me to stop. I told that bitch that if they didn't want me to chant Fairy #4 they needed to do a better job establishing her as Persephone and not to be so boring. I totally put her in her place for not letting me as awesome as I could. I told her I paid my hard earned welfare check to watch the show and so I can continue to be awesome. She told me she paid her hard earned money to watch the show as well. What a hypocrit!

 

[Mustang Sally]

Although it's a ridiculous thing to hope for, I wish the fans at ringside were getting into the act a bit more. Last night, I watched Seth Rollins, cracked into the barrier outside the ring, reeling in pain.....and surrounded by fans enjoying the whole thing: laughing, gesturing and trying their best to make physical contact with the guy. Some of them are actually holding out their hands to be slapped, as if he's going to pause in the middle of a match to accommodate them.....especially after nearly having his back broken.

Personally, if I were at ringside and a wrestler passed within two inches of me, I wouldn't feel compelled to touch him (unless it was Drew McIntyre, of course, in which case I'd launch myself through the air into his arms) and it always surprises me seeing how many fans feel privileged to make contact. It must be awful to be The Shield, coming down the aisle every week. I keep waiting for one of them to get annoyed and pull a Punk on one of the stupid fans.

But when seeming devastation is taking place outside the ring and the fans are too busy enjoying the act to pretend it is an act , I find myself wishing they were a little more into the storyline and drama. No, I don't expect this, but it'd be nice if it were so.

Oh, well. The fans pay their money to get in, so it's their call.

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

Thanks for missing the point entirely.

No, I got your point. It's stupid, quite frankly.

How do you know those guys aren't there having a fucking blast doing what they're doing while you are screaming at your TV back home about how they are ruining your absolutely free viewing experience?

How do you know they aren't completely into the character of Bray Wyatt while at the same time saying "Husky Harris"? Why do you automatically jump to the conclusion that it's all derogatory, and it's not simply fans having a good time? Oh, I'm sorry, you have to completely immerse yourself in the moment in order for it to work for you, and the live crowd is spoiling your pristine experience. Got it.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

It's not the live crowds as a whole, but it's generally the smarks in the audience. I get what you're saying as they can be awfully damn annoying.

For instance, I thought Mark Henry & Cena gave a solid promo segment last night and, of course, the smarks have to start with the "What?" bullshit. When The Wyatt Family debuted, they started with a "Husky Harris" chant. It bothered me when the live crowd on the Raw after WM started in on Orton & Sheamus and it bothered me last night. Unless you're a select handful of wrestlers, a lot of smarks simply aren't interested.

 

[jhed1380]

In a way I feel the WWE Universe is almost becoming the heel. I would be fascinated if WWE could utilize that maybe have the faces start to really go after the fans chanting and have the heels praise the fans for there chants. I don't know if there is a way to do it. Wrestlers have gotten repackaged before and will again it happens. The business likes the wrestler but not the character they go away for a while until they have something better. The Wyatt Family seems like a great gimmick I hope it doesn't get ruined.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

No, I got your point. It's stupid, quite frankly.

How do you know those guys aren't there having a fucking blast doing what they're doing while you are screaming at your TV back home about how they are ruining your absolutely free viewing experience?

I went to a party after the ballet last night. I was so busy with my model trains and David Hasselhoff tribute poetry lately that I didn't bring anything to the party but myself. There was this guy who kept throwing darts at me and then he threw acid on my cocker spaniel. I'm ok with it though because he brought a cheese plate and therefore spent more money than me.

How do you know they aren't completely into the character of Bray Wyatt while at the same time saying "Husky Harris"? Why do you automatically jump to the conclusion that it's all derogatory, and it's not simply fans having a good time? Oh, I'm sorry, you have to completely immerse yourself in the moment in order for it to work for you, and the live crowd is spoiling your pristine experience. Got it.

Not all of us can do our taxes while mastrubating and get a maximized return and release. Your multitasking skills shoudl be commended but I wish you would have sympathy for those less evolved.

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

I went to a party after the ballet last night. I was so busy with my model trains and David Hasselhoff tribute poetry lately that I didn't bring anything to the party but myself. There was this guy who kept throwing darts at me and then he threw acid on my cocker spaniel. I'm ok with it though because he brought a cheese plate and therefore spent more money than me.

Not all of us can do our taxes while mastrubating and get a maximized return and release. Your multitasking skills shoudl be commended but I wish you would have sympathy for those less evolved.

Dude, TurboTax makes it pretty damn easy to jerk off while getting a maximized return. I don't EVEN know what the fuck your problem is with that, but I'm really sorry about your dog. Of course, I question your entire opinion given that you are devoted to David Hasselhoff, btw, do you remember Hardcastle and McCormick...that was a great show!

 

[JoeyJoeJoe]

Honestly, what killed the debut for me: The friggin night light in the lamp.

It just looked stupid. They have fire shooting up from ringposts for Kane, but they have a little night light in the lantern for Bray Wyatt? And then he caps it off by "blowing out the night light".

Just one of those things that breaks the suspension of disbelief. Way more than any Husky Harris chant could've done.

 

[The Shining Wizard]

Wow. Are people really overreacting to this? This isn't the first time something like this has happened and it sure as hell won't be the last. Bray and WWE will ignore the chants and keep steady on the course that is The Wyatt Family. And in a few months, no one will care about about this because the fans will have gotten out of their systems.

At the end of the day, I recommend you just get over it. Because the "Husky Harris" chant didn't hinder this good debut. Not one bit.

 

[VencomHardcore]

I BLAME THE WWE !

I live in Baltimore and have been to every live event in the last 7 years. This Crowd is a SMARK CROWD filled with ROHbots, Smarks, Former Original ECW Fans and Indy fans. There is no way I would have chosen this city for debut a character that was being re-packaged.

I would have waited until AFTER MITB and done it in a predictable city like Harrisburg,PA, Pittsburgh,PA, Buffalo,NY, or at Mohegan Sun. You know how those cities are going to respond because the smark numbers are low enough not to hurt the experience.

There are some places you don't debut new re-packaged talent - Philly, NYC, Chicago, Baltimore and Boston. Anywhere you have indy promotions that are fairly popular or wrestlers that have worked that territory as an indy is going to create problems for re-packaging.

 

[shafe_41]

Honestly, what killed the debut for me: The friggin night light in the lamp.

It just looked stupid. They have fire shooting up from ringposts for Kane, but they have a little night light in the lantern for Bray Wyatt? And then he caps it off by "blowing out the night light".

Just one of those things that breaks the suspension of disbelief. Way more than any Husky Harris chant could've done.

You're serious? The lantern is an amazing accessory to their debut. It adds to the backwoods, deep south, creepy element they're supposed to carry with them. What'd you want them to do? Run to the ring with all the lights in the building on? Get the crappy Sin Cara lightining? Their debut was absolutely perfect. Couldn't have gone any better.