Is CM Punk just not meant to be?? Should he be a Face or Heel?

[Alex]

So CM Punk is now fueding with a referee, this is a guy who three months ago was the world heavyweight champion, was the top heel on smackdown was getting constant heat because of his promos on being straight edge and had beaten the top face of Smackdown in Jeff Hardy. What happened, I mean there are guys (like Jericho) who can go between mid-card and main event but Punk looked like he was going to be main eventing for a while and now he's feuding with a ref??? thats a HUGE step down. So I was wondering whats next for Punk, does he go to the mid-card or does he climb his way back to the top of the main-event pile.

I hope he goes back to main eventing, he is great at that and its a shame he's not doing it now.

 

[stop-it-jamaican-me-crazy]

I guess you can say Jeff leaving is what hurt Punk. The main reason he was getting so much heat was because of him taunting Jeff about his drug use and how he's better than him for being straight edge. With Jeff being Smackdown's mega face at the time, that was obviously going to give Punk some serious heat. I hate to say it but Undertaker's return may have also killed his momentum. I though feuding with Taker was going to take Punk to mega heel status but unfortunately he lost some credibility.

 

["Cool Guy" Jensen]

I really don't see what all the complaining is about. C.M. Punk is still getting TV time and he isn't jobbing. Sure, he might not be main eventing now, but atleast we can all say he was main eventing and is a 3-time World Heavyweight Champion. I am very sure that this "feud" with Scott Armstrong will not hurt him at all. He could easily go back to the World Title scene when the fued with Scott Armstrong dies down. Don't be so quick to assume the worst of someone.

 

[Paradox]

Well, I for one have been a huge fan of Punk for a long time! I love watching him, because he is amazing at what he does. He was really coming into his own in wwe. Over the summer he became one of the biggest men in the company. He was easily the biggest heel in the company, especially after his feud with Hardy ended. Now I was fully expecting him to go over 'Taker in their feud, but he apparently he pissed some people of for the way he was dressed... least that's what I remember hearing. It's pretty amazing that you dress the wrong way and you get thrown down the ladder. Yes he was champ, but they new what they were getting when they signed him. They never did anything until his feud with 'Taker, and he said something. I can't help but think something was said there.

With that said, I think he's going to make it back, Vince knows that he is a great heel, who cuts great promos and works great matches. So I see him moving up back up once his feud with the ref is over.

 

[Southwind]

C.M. Punk is fine he isn't the best like some make him out to be but this is nothing different than what Orton is going through on Raw right now.

I think its interesting and dare I say fresh ? You never see ref vs. wrestler feuds in the WWE at least, so this has actually entertained me a bit.

He's getting exposure still and has won the world heavyweight title twice this year what more do you want ???

 

[Rich]

Punk sucks.

His matches suck, I was at the Smackdown taping in Sheffield, England last night, and during the dark match main event, the Casket match against Taker, Punk put almost no effort into the match whatsoever aside from a few punches when he and Taker were stood in the Casket.

 

[Ambiguous Turd]

Punk sucks.

His matches suck, I was at the Smackdown taping in Sheffield, England last night, and during the dark match main event, the Casket match against Taker, Punk put almost no effort into the match whatsoever aside from a few punches when he and Taker were stood in the Casket.

Yeah, the Dark Matches are usually pretty terrible because they just want to get the Hell out of there. I think that's a terrible attitude to take, and certainly am not justifying it by any means.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Punk is pretty average to me all across the board and I don't know if it's too early to say it or not, but I think he found his defining feud with Jeff Hardy. The greats like Stone Cold, The Rock, and Hogan had defining feuds but they had other feuds that were just as good. CM Punk has only been in the WWE for three years so he has plenty of time but with his character, it's going to be hard to find somebody that he can work with. Jeff Hardy was the perfect person for Punk to feud with because of Hardy's past and Punk's claims of being straightedge. Once Hardy left and the Undertaker came to challenge him, Punk's heel promos didn't have that same effectiveness.

I can see him feuding with Morrison as Punk can state that he lives a flamboyant lifestyle with the long hair and the rock star mentality or he can feud with R-Truth because of his criminal past. Either one I say would work and it gives him something better to do than beat up on referees.

 

[Blade]

Punk sucks.

His matches suck, I was at the Smackdown taping in Sheffield, England last night, and during the dark match main event, the Casket match against Taker, Punk put almost no effort into the match whatsoever aside from a few punches when he and Taker were stood in the Casket.

That's a very wise move on Punk's behalf. If he only works hard when he's on camera, then he's gonna add years to his career. It's what alot of Mexican wrestlers do. It's smart especially for Punk, who's straight edge and doesn't really have anything to take the edge off. What you may mistake for lazyness might just be planning.

Anyway, I think that Punk might end up like this generations Kane. Great debut, in the main even for a couple of years, and despite being very over, he'll never get to stay in the main event simply because he's the same age as the current main eventers yet he's not as big a star. This is not like previous generations where the older superstars were in the main event and then passed the torch to the younger guys when their time is up. Guys like Orton and Cena have been in the main event since their mid 20's so they'll be there for a long while. Punk doesn't have any real connections either, so he might be staying in the upper midcard. Which is sad, he's still very over despite the angle with Jeff Hardy being over. He still gets great heat from the crowd and he can still work a good match.

 

[Rich]

I also hate CM Punk for being involved in Montreal Screwjob mark 2 at Bragging Rights.. I'm sorry but what the fuck?! The original Screwjob was 12 years ago for fuck sake! No one outside of Canada cares any more, and it's high time the Canucks got over it IMO.

 

[Blade]

I also hate CM Punk for being involved in Montreal Screwjob mark 2 at Bragging Rights.. I'm sorry but what the fuck?! The original Screwjob was 12 years ago for fuck sake! No one outside of Canada cares any more, and it's high time the Canucks got over it IMO.

That's hardly Punk's fault. You think Punk had any say in that at all? That's how he was booked, he accepted it cause that's his job. The only person you should be pissed off at for the Screwjob is Vince, or whoever came up with the idea for that ending. Even if Punk didn't like it, he couldn't say no or else they would've made him job to Taker that night. Delaying the inevitable, I know, but still.

 

[The Bar Room Drunk]

Im not a big fan of CM Punk but he is talented and should be in a good solid fued. Maybe go after a belt but not just fighting refs one week and being thrown into a random team the next. Maybe they should have give him and the Undertaker another match at SS to cerment their great fued.

 

[maar130]

I am fan of the guy and for me he is a very good performer, I think they are just trying to help him repack a little because lets face it, he is the youngest of smacdown main event scene, he is like 31 a with a lot ahead of him if allowed to. Since nothing is set on stone for Wrestlemania, maybe he will have a chance at winning the Rumble and then go after the WHC. If Taker is there with the belt probably Punk will go down and win it at Backlash, but that is just too way ahead in time.

 

[Vintage Nick]

I also hate CM Punk for being involved in Montreal Screwjob mark 2 at Bragging Rights.. I'm sorry but what the fuck?! The original Screwjob was 12 years ago for fuck sake! No one outside of Canada cares any more, and it's high time the Canucks got over it IMO.

So it's Punk's fault that booking/creative decided to take a jab at the Montreal Screwjob? In my opinion, it helped him get more over as a heel, though it's declined to where he's now feuding with a ref. And sorry to disappoint you, but the Canadians might NEVER get over it. Their national hero was shamed, disgraced and betrayed in his nation to a company he was signed with, but that argument is for another thread.

It's a shame that CM Punk is slowly slipping to the midcard. He's been pushed hard the past couple years: Feuding with Morrison for the ECW title and eventually winning it, winning MitB at WM24 and cashing it in on Edge to win the World Heavyweight Championship, winning the tag titles with Kofi, winning the IC title, winning MitB at WM25 and cashing it in on Jeff Hardy to make his turn to heel, and went through a great feud with Hardy and 'Taker. He's still young I believe and his career in WWE is still ahead of him if he stays healthy/out of trouble, so he might go back to the Main Event soon, but for now he's just stuck on the midcard.

 

[Coco]

The greats like Stone Cold, The Rock, and Hogan had defining feuds but they had other feuds that were just as good. CM Punk has only been in the WWE for three years so he has plenty of time but with his character, it's going to be hard to find somebody that he can work with. Jeff Hardy was the perfect person for Punk to feud with because of Hardy's past and Punk's claims of being straightedge. Once Hardy left and the Undertaker came to challenge him, Punk's heel promos didn't have that same effectiveness.

In what way did they not have the same effectiveness? He was still the cocky bastard we know him to be and he came off very well with the "smoke and mirrors" and "first man to make the Undertaker submit" stuff. The people booed plenty and Punk kept rolling along. I don't see what was wrong with those promos.

As for it being hard to find someone to feud with, people seem to forget that Punk isn't just stragith-edge. He's a cocky bastard who (sometimes falsely) believes he's more competitive than you and that he's better than you. His bravado is more important than his lifestyle.

Punk can have great feuds with Shawn Michaels about Michaels' past, or the way he looks down on people could 'cause John Cena to adjust his attitude, and I'm sure he's got career spanning feuds with Edge and Morrison waiting for him. In time, people will see that Punk isn't just that straight-edge guy, just like John Cena isn't just that hip-hop guy, just like Taker isn't just that undead guy. There's more to him than that.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

In what way did they not have the same effectiveness? He was still the cocky bastard we know him to be and he came off very well with the "smoke and mirrors" and "first man to make the Undertaker submit" stuff. The people booed plenty and Punk kept rolling along. I don't see what was wrong with those promos.

As for it being hard to find someone to feud with, people seem to forget that Punk isn't just stragith-edge. He's a cocky bastard who (sometimes falsely) believes he's more competitive than you and that he's better than you. His bravado is more important than his lifestyle.

Punk can have great feuds with Shawn Michaels about Michaels' past, or the way he looks down on people could 'cause John Cena to adjust his attitude, and I'm sure he's got career spanning feuds with Edge and Morrison waiting for him. In time, people will see that Punk isn't just that straight-edge guy, just like John Cena isn't just that hip-hop guy, just like Taker isn't just that undead guy. There's more to him than that.

What I mean is that he honed in on Hardy's history with drug abuse and used that to fuel his heel turn with his own personna of being straightedge. Can he really have the same effect with his promos with the Undertaker? He can say that he's better than him but specificallly why is he better than him? With Hardy he can say that he doesn't use drugs and doesn't "live for the moment" but the Undertaker doesn't fall into any of those categories. I just think he needs to find the right person to feud with and the Undertaker simply just wasn't that. He can go after R-Truth and Morrison because they are similar to what Punk had in Hardy. I can see a HBK/Punk feud but most likely that would be a Wrestlemania match because I don't see Punk going to RAW or HBK going to Smackdown anytime soon. HBK's past doesn't get brought up very much but if HHH and MVP can talk about Hardy's past then Punk can certainly bring up Michaels' transgressions.

 

[Isaac Kaye]

I'm not sure feuding with the Taker did Punk any favours at all. He needed a much longer title reign to keep him in the ME picture and there was absolutely no way he was coming out on top against the dead man.

They also diluted the title picture at Bragging Rights with the Fatal Four Way (which was obviously planned to turn Batista heel) This helped Mysterio and Batista get back in, but did nothing for Punk whatsoever. All the emphasis was on Batista and Mysterio and this took so much heat away from Punk. Punk really needed another singles match against Taker (a close and impressive one) to keep him in the mix.

Now he's kinda in limbo. I don't think it's a big problem though because he's talented enough to slip back into the ME picture when the chance comes up again. He does need a solid midcard feud to keep him active though, and I hope this comes soon.

Punk is one of my favourite guys on tour and he's really grown on me in the last few months. His heel turn was executed perfectly and he looks really comfortable with his character.

 

[Bilawal]

He has to be at TLC ppv, I think Jehricho will win SS, but if taker wins it then Punk has to beat him at TLC. IMO Smackdown is lacking that spark as Undertaker (the World Champion) never wrestles or he will break his hip, and there isn't a dominant heel as Jehricho keeps jumping from Raw to Smackdown. CM Punk has to be in the main event at TLC. To be fair, house shows in the UK it was CM Punk vs Taker so I don't see why CM Punk shouldn't main event TLC.

 

[Toroc102]

Cm Punk still has room to come back, I feel like out of everyone on the whole roster he'll probably follow Y2J's path. He was obviously considered a midcard lifer in WcW and even in his first run with the WWE he was never taken too too seriously. He had a terrible first run as the champion imo, even though he was the first Undisputed champ and never quite made it back to the main event afterwards, along with having some low profile embarrassing feuds as well. However he has had a great second run with the company and is now seeing as a reliable top guy.

Heck, if Jerishow were to split up and Y2J somehow stayed in the tag scene, CM Punk would be given a great rub by partnering up with him and being on both brands. They would probably make up one of the best group promos in the entire organization and the WWE would be forced to push him credibly. Thier characters right now are very similar and I actually think CM Punk does a better job with it. His promo on tonights err yesterdays SD was one of the better promo's I've seen lately. While I'm on the subject of Jericho I'd like to say that he could stand to drop the plebian, tapeworm, similar words from his vocab. They don't ever really get a good pop, and I was watching a show once (non wrestling) that said it pretty well, why use a 1,000 dollar word when a 100 dollar one would suffice? He would probably be a lot better off just calling them morons/simpletons/parasites, instead of getting so specific, just felt like letting that out.

 

[Crush1]

Man I dont get what the hell is happening to CM Punk. From World Champion to jobbing to a ref and mid-carder. How the hell is this possible, this is destroying your own investment. For a billion dollar company how the hell is this possible? just because his dress code? or because he said something about Cena? Is Cena God or something? I dont get it and I really hope that they end this bullshit they're doing to Punk. I dont get it. Why build him up to destroy him down yourself? Vince is one crazy ass and he needs to get a fucking grip on his own talent. I guess now the other guy's now that 1 Cena is Vince's asskisser and 2 Never say something bad about Cena.. Its sad, it really is...

 

[RatedRKJ]

C.M. Punk is a pretty good wrestler, he's not the best, but pretty solid. I will say that the "Screwjob Pt.2" really hurt his credibility as a Main Eventer (my opinion), but it's just a slump he is in right now. Punk feuding with a ref won't hurt him at all, if anything it will probably be the next step to solidifying his status as a truly major heel. A lot of people thought that HHH feuding with Eugene was going to be a step downward for him, but it actually helped his credibility as a heel. (Banging the bosses daughter doesn't hurt either).


So, no. This isn't a step downard, quite the opposite, this could be the thing that can help him out quite considerably.

 

[Dagger Dias]

CM Punk should be a face. In real life straight-edge is something that can be a good role model for kids. Isn't WWE trying to market towards the younger crowd now? Kids NEED a good role model who can show them that it's bad to drink, smoke, or do drugs. They need someone they can look up to who teaches them that it's cool to "just say no".

Honestly, the remarks that the faces (Jeff Hardy, R-Truth, Christian) have made towards Punk as being a loser for being straight-edge.... that's something a heel should be saying to a face, not the other way around.

I'm aware that some straight-edge people are very judgemental (kinda like Punk's heel character) BUT there are also GOOD straight-edge people out there, and their choices for saying no to the partying lifestyle does NOT make them a loser or a nerd.

Punk as a face would be far better in the long run in my opinion. He should not be a heel because the way the other characters are treating his character makes straight-edge look bad, when in reality it isn't.

Do you agree or disagree, and why?
_

 

[johnbragg]

Punk is good as a heel, great as a face. His time as a face will come again, don't worry.

Punk's destiny is a huge feud with John Cena, drawn not so much along heel-face lines as along generational lines, with Punk representing a little older, more serious (or self-serious) fanbase against the Cena Nation of star-struck girls and younger boys.

There is definitely some awkwardness to Punk as a heel, since his message is true and good for you. But even the best message can be carried into self-righteousness and intolerance, and he carries it well. Even as a heel, Punk has that core rabid fanbase that will love him through thick and thin, although not through rehab.

OT Thought: The biggest "new stars" in wrestling are CM Punk and Jeff Hardy. Both maintain their connection to their fanbase and their credibility because their onscreen characters are their real selves. Punk, on screen, can do anything to anybody and for anybody and his fans will still love the Straightedge Superstar. Jeff Hardy go on a rampage attacking every other face on the roster and his fans would make emo excuses about his angst and how no one understands him. (I'm not trying to insult fanbases right now, just to make sweeping generalized one sentence summaries.)

But their fanbases would not forgive real-life actions. If Punk were caught with steroids or drugs or alchohol his career would be over. Jeff Hardy's character has more leeway in what he could be caught doing, but if he got a normal haircut, a half-dozen suits from Sears and bought a car dealership, that would do it.

So are we seeing the mutant son of kayfabe?

 

[CH David]

Punk is a natural heel. Look at him in the Indys and you will see how good his promos and actions were. He was a face for just about all of his time in WWE previous to his feud with Jeff. Now I think I understand what your premise really is, that Punk's lifestyle should not be seen in a negative light, which I agree with. It should be seen as good that he is Straight Edge and what not. But the thing is, he got old at being the goody two shoes Straight Edge guy. We all saw it and said it needed to happen.

His feud with Jeff was the perfect opportunity for him to make the full transition as a heel, but he can't sustain it because there are no faces he can work off of like he could with Jeff. He was able to mock Jeff's real life problems. Then Jeff went off for his own endeavors. When Undertaker came back Punk lost steam because Taker isn't a druggie or an alcoholic, he is just a "supernatural being". This feud with his R-Truth could be a success as Punk could dig into his past.

So I get what you mean, the Straight Edge character should be seen as a good thing. But with Punk, he is a natural heel, and he does some damn good promos talking down on people. The gimmick should be face, if you look at it like you are, but the person being heel is what makes it work better.

 

[The Doctor]

I agree. Punk's heel shtick was fabulous when he was working with Hardy, and I feel that if WWE hadn't dropped the ball on Matt, he could have had a great feud with the other Hardy.

However, now he just seems like a boring broken record, saying the same things and insulting the crowd. It gets old. As of right now, I want to cheer for him. I want him to become a mega face and hopefully stay in the main event. Or at least I want him to adapt his heel persona to something more than "Drugs are bad OK guys I mean it jeez!"