How long until TNA is competition?

[Jobber Bob]

Dixie Carter stated it is "now or never for TNA" , well if thats true when
should

we start to see this drastic change to the product she is talking about.

personally i believe TNA has been on the right track for years, but obviously

many disagree or TNA would be getting ratings around 2.0 or 3.0 like

wwe has. so my question is when should we start seeing that major change

carter is talking about???

 

[amar1212]

when they have a large fan base, they should get out of Orlando, have better production sets and all that like raw, go HD, better storylines.......i would say about 10 more years..but who knows if wwe is still around..

 

[WWETNAWARS]

TNA will get better when they get decent talent in THE ROCK,DDP,GOLDBERGand SAVAGE
but not to waste talents money on that solely when they get bigger like WCW did they ll eventually move out of Orlando and head in a bigger arena ,they have better production and are already on HD but I see within 6 months -1 year thats when WCW got better within that time factor

 

[BChpln]

TNA will get better when they get decent talent in THE ROCK,DDP,GOLDBERGand SAVAGE
but not to waste talents money on that solely when they get bigger like WCW did they ll eventually move out of Orlando and head in a bigger arena ,they have better production and are already on HD but I see within 6 months -1 year thats when WCW got better within that time factor

no no no!

tna will not be bigger within the next year, or even 5 years. it will take quite a while for TNA to become a competitor with wwe. and really, if angle, booker t, STING (FUCKING STING, EVERYBODY FUCKING LOVES STING (me included)) cannot bring that to a competition with wwe, then what will tna do with hogan?
Hulk hogan will do what HHH would do if he ran wwe

keep himself in the spotlight so people "dont forget about his legacy"

he has all but ruined his wwe legacy by jumping ship, so really, tna will probably never be a competitor

and this is totally off topic, but why the hell cant anybody mention BENOIT!?!?!?!?!?

 

[The Australian Rage]

TNA will be competition when, or if, it moves to monday night.


It already has the star power. It has good ratings, good storylines (majority of the time) and great fanbase. It just needs the proper air time.

Put it on Mondays and we could see a new generation of Monday Night Wars

 

[SinCityBlitz]

TNA will be competition when, or if, it moves to monday night.


It already has the star power. It has good ratings, good storylines (majority of the time) and great fanbase. It just needs the proper air time.

Put it on Mondays and we could see a new generation of Monday Night Wars

It doesn't have good ratings. They really don't have the star power because if they did the ratings would be better. The fan base is not big enough yet. Moving to Monday night means nothing.

IMO TNA will never be competition. I think TNA will eventually fold. There's always the possibility of someone very rich buying them. But I think that is a very small chance. Unlike WCW, TNA is not able to call their own shots with the network.

Eventually when Hogan gets done bring in the Nasty Boys and Ed Leslie and has the young guys jobbing to them the fed will be ruined.

 

[PEP3]

My personal belief is that TNA -- and people here within the IWC -- need to stop pushing the company to be "competition" for WWE. Instead, they need to focus on their own product, developing it and molding new stars, making in-roads into the public consciousness. Instead of being so damn deadset on being "competition" for WWE -- meaning they are trying to be the same so that the fans choose them over WWE -- they should make their goal being a viable alternative. This means that fans of WWE would also tune into TNA because they are similar yet different, and that can (and should!) appeal to viewers.

 

[Trouble in Paradise]

My Opinion of this is that rome wasn't built in a day and neither should TNA. TNA needs to develop not everything can be like WCW and be great rivals with WWE. It might take years decades to become competition because WWE is so damn big really what person doesn't know of WWE even if the person hates it and thinks it is fake bullshit but saying that who doesn't know of Hulk but off the topic TNA can't rush beating WWE because WWE has killed many companies and TNA hasn't even beaten Smackdown and is par with ECW on ratings so I say TNA might never be competition but if I were to choose it may take longer than Dixie or a lot of people in the IWC think.

 

[The Gribbler]

My personal belief is that TNA -- and people here within the IWC -- need to stop pushing the company to be "competition" for WWE. Instead, they need to focus on their own product, developing it and molding new stars, making in-roads into the public consciousness. Instead of being so damn deadset on being "competition" for WWE -- meaning they are trying to be the same so that the fans choose them over WWE -- they should make their goal being a viable alternative. This means that fans of WWE would also tune into TNA because they are similar yet different, and that can (and should!) appeal to viewers.

I agree, much like Bischoff stated in his book, if you can't be better and don't want to be worse than your competition, then you have to be different, be an alternative.

Don't compete for the same fanbase, try to draw from a different one. And if TNA wants to draw like the WWE does then they cannot go toe to toe or the giant will knock them on their ass.

If they can be different then they can become big themselves.

Cannot agree with you more

Just My Opinion

 

[It's Damn Real!]

TNA becomes competition when two things happen:

1. They move to Monday nights and go head-up with the WWE

2. They develop a larger fan-base, and really break-out from Florida and the South-East.

At that point, it's a matter of consistency.

 

[hatehabsforever]

Personally, I don't believe that TNA will ever be true competition for WWE. Not ever. At most, they may mount a mild challenge for a short while like WCW did, but they'll never be able to sustain it, like WCW couldn't. And I don't even see this happening anyway, I don't see TNA as anything but a blip on the WWE's radar until it eventually folds.

I agree with PEP3. TNA needs to stop worrying about being "competition" for WWE and start focusing on its own product. They used to be seen as an alternative to WWE, a different product which was more wrestling oriented and less storyline driven, whereas now it's just a cheap, watered down version of WWE, with all of the same problems, many of the same people, and just a bargain bin version of the big time which will not appeal to WWE fans or TNA loyalists.

TNA needs to develop its own niche, and be content to be a second place organization with its own fan base, its own style, and its own roster. There's no shame in being in second place and still being a successful venture.

In pro football, the CFL makes no effort to compete with the NFL. It is extremely obvious that they could never do it, from a numbers standpoint, marketing, etc., But the CFL puts a product out there which is different, it's an alternative, and as such this league has survived, despite some lean times, with a devout fan base. The CFL has its own players with very little movement back and forth for the most part, and as a rule, any players who have moved from one to the other have not been very successful. It has its own rules, its own season, its own cities, and while it does not appeal to everyone (myself included), it is more successful now than it's been in years. If all of a sudden they decides to change their rules, change their season to go head to head with the NFL, tries to lure away NFL players to start a "Football War," it would be a laughable failure.

It's the same with TNA. Keep your own roster, and develop your own from within. Have your six sided ring, your smaller venues, your unique style, etc., and develop as an alternative to the WWE, not competition for it. Try to get fans to watch both products, rather than try to steal WWE fans away. No need to be competition for WWE, no need to try to resurrect the "Monday Night Wars." This way TNA may have some long term viability. Otherwise, a resurrection of the Wars will result in the same result, the emergence of the stronger product, and the death of the weaker one.

 

[Jetspete]

A previous poster said it best, TNA needs to worry about their own product first before thinking it is "competing" with WWE. Raw is a top rated cable show, and the standard wrestling audience isnt a vacuum of a million fans only interested in watching wrestling. Typically we are looking for sports, drama, good television etc. in the decade since the original monday night wars, we have what, hundreds of more cable channels? Plus ESPN has expanded so much so that there are live sporting events every night on both networks. College football goes five nights a week, and college basketball has expanded through greater regional coverage and more national games. TNA has a lot more to compete with than just WWE for the attention of casual fans.

 

[HBK-aholic]

For the time being, TNA need to focus on maintaining, and slowly increasing, the 1.0-1.3 rating they've had recently. They didn't start very long ago, so that alone is quite an achievement. They shouldn't be focusing on WWE just yet. Trying to run before you can walk is not a good idea. Competition only really comes when you have to choose between two things. At the moment no one has to make an active decision between WWE and TNA, we can still watch Raw one night and Impact the other, therefore people in this thread are correct in saying until TNA moves to Monday nights, it won't be competition, and that won't be for quite a few years.

 

[Blade]

That's a tough call. None of us can predict where TNA is gonna go, the wrestling industry is gonna go, let alone that one company.
But if I had to predict, I'd say TNA have to act quickly. Right now WWE is losing viewers due to the lack of new faces, but they're fixing that now. Every week, new faces are becoming more and more familiar to the WWE audience and everyone likes at least one of the new people. Some people like Drew, some people like Sheamus, some people like the new Kofi. But TNA has an opportunity now to capitalise and help them become competition, but they need one breakout star or huge angle.
But no doubt TNA will do fuck all about it and will miss their window, because that's what TNA does. It's taken them 6 or 7 years to get 1.0's. So I think it'll be at good 8-10 years before they can even be considered near WWE's level. They have to be built up from nothing, they're not WCW.
And this is all assuming WWE ever makes the mistake of letting them become competition.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I don't think anyone can set up a solid timetable for when TNA will be able to stand toe to toe with the WWE. There are too many factors to be considered. Do I believe it'll happen within the next few years? Not really.

In order for TNA to be considered competition to the WWE, TNA is simply going to have to grow bigger than they are right now. Much bigger, as a matter of fact. TNA and WWE marks can debate as to which company is better, who has the better wrestling, better characters and so on and so forth but, from a business perspective, TNA has a long way to go right now. At the end of the day, it's all about the numbers that either company generates.

For one thing, TNA is going to have to draw substantially more than the 1.0-1.3 ratings that they've been doing for the past few years. TNA has to reach another plateau of numbers and has to be able to consistently draw numbers that keep them at that next level. A lot of the excitement some have about Hulk Hogan joining TNA is the hope that Hogan's name and involvement can help them reach that next level in tv ratings. Another thing TNA is going to have to do is to move their shows into large arenas and be able to sell them out, or at least come pretty close to it. TNA's biggest show of the hear, Bound for Glory, drew somewhere around 5,000 fans I believe and WWE house shows routinely draw more fans than that. When TNA does shows in which they might sell less than 1,000 tickets and their competition is selling 10,000, they can't be considered threats. However, I think the most telling thing regarding when/if TNA will be competition for the WWE would be if TNA were to put a show on Monday nights, thereby forcing wrestling fans that night to choose between the WWE and TNA. As of right now, TNA isn't able to do that. The one time that Raw went head to head with Impact ended up with Impact getting creamed, scoring only a 0.6 for the night.

TNA needs to keep their focus on growth and be seen as an alternative to the WWE, not necessarily a competitor. Dixie Carter can say all she wants about how she'd love to be able to go head to head with the WWE. That's all fine and good and I'm sure she means it, but her product isn't pulling anywhere near the numbers it's going to take for that to become a solid reality.

 

[image1986]

Tna wont be competition for wwe for a while because of several reasons. Tna booking under russo has been terrible. Champions and top stars are booked weak and become frustrated case in point A.J Styles, Samoa joe, booker T departure etc. Pay per view buyrates are at their lowest and impact rating dont even compete with WWE's version of ECW. Barely anyone even goes to the house shows. Even with great talent on the roster the backstage politics cause disarray

 

[ncpowell]

Never really been a HUGE TNA mark, but when I saw Bound for Glory 2009, I truly felt like TNA clicked. They had the right kind of matches, talent, everything. Even the arena. They had the perfect size arena, because it was packed. I thought that TNA maybe got a clue. They can't go to the Palace at Auburn Hills. Shit, WWE doesn't even go there. But, they can go to the huge pools for wrestling (Detroit, Chicago, Boston, Washington D.C., New York, Miami, Houston, Los Angeles, etc.) and go to these 5-7 thousand seat arenas and fill them out, perform in front of a better crowd and get the ball rolling.


A few weeks later, I hear that Hogan's back.


All that hope I honestly felt for TNA in turning their game around? Hell no. Not anymore. And now that we saw Dixie Carter and her little speech, I have a feeling that Dixie Carter has not a damn clue of what she has done. Maybe this time, they can get the Invasion storyline right haha.

 

[CKDaimen]

After the announcement of Hogan coming to TNA, even though he hasn't arrived yet, I have been looking at the ratings to see if there was any significant pick up in interest. The last I saw they got a 1.1. I know it's early, but this isn't the first time TNA has tried to do something big and got absolutely no change. (Let's not get into semantics....even if they got a little change, it wasn't enough of a change to call them mainstream or a threat to WWE) By big things I mean signing Kurt Angle, Sting, and in my opinion, creating the Main Event Mafia. So I've had a bad feeling lately that no matter what TNA does, they will not crack a 2.0 ever. So while watching Impact last night I tried to figure out why, and I did.

TNA will never stand a chance against the WWE because of the fans/presentation combination. Let me elaborate. TNA's presentation is that of a mainstream interior inside of a low rate exterior. This has been criticized plenty of times, about how they should either get rid of the six sided ring or they should move to bigger arenas. But that's not neccesarily true. I mean, think back to the original ECW. IF the original ECW had a steady long term deal on Spike TV, and had the creative freedom TNA has, and if ECW had the same rabid fans they had, NO MATTER HOW SMALL the arena, ECW would have got in WWE's ass. So it's not neccesarily the size of the impact zone, it's the fans. There is not enough enthusiasm and there is not enough noise from the fans. Now granted, this most likely would be fixed with a bigger arena, but I think ECW proved that it's possible to have huge electricity in a small building if the fans are passionate enough, and the TNA fans are not. How many attacks, swerves, great matches, entrances, etc. have we seen in TNA only to get a mediocre reception from the fans?

Here's my point. It doesn't matter that they got Hogan, it doesn't even matter how they use Hogan if the fans don't step it up BIG TIME....OR move to a bigger arena. Either or. Because if you tune in, and you're a casual and/or shallow fan, and you see the fans acting laid back and luke warm with the occasional "This is Awesome" or "TNA" chant, that won't be enough to bring them in. Picture WCW without HUGE heat for the nWo or huge pops for Goldberg and Sting. Or WWE without huge pops when Austin stunned McMahon. It wouldn't have mattered. The fans, like anything else made the nWo a big deal and therefore made WCW a big deal.The fans made Austin/McMahon epic through their reactions. But back to WCW...it wasn't made a competitor to WWE not just through word of mouth, but from how over the talent were IN THE ARENAS. And I think it's safe to say, that IN THE FORSEEABLE FUTURE....TNA will not have that.

My opinion.....move to bigger arenas and then hopefully in a couple years, maybe sooner, the fans will be rabid. But wrestling is a business where if the fans aren't hot, people will not feel the electricity. At the risk of beating my point to death....imagine Hogan coming out in the 80s to the reaction that AJ Styles or even Sting gets in TNA.....wouldn't have been as big a deal would it? Imagine the Hogan third man swerve happening in TNA.....how loud and stunned would the crowd really act? Imagine Austin giving McMahon the first ever stunner in the Impact Zone....a few "oohhs" would be heard, but you wouldn't feel history in the air. Bottom line, TNA's fan enthusiasm sucks. The reasons can be debated, but when you watch the program, all that matters is, they don't make the program better. AND WITHOUT FANS THAT MAKE THE PROGRAM BETTER, TNA WILL NEVER COMPETE AGAINST WWE (Even though I think TNA is better right now)

Discuss.

 

[BladeRunner]

"There is not enough enthusiasm and there is not enough noise from the fans."


I could say that about 50% of WWE's matches right now. Sometimes all I hear is crickets. When they were just in the UK that crowd was incredibly silent. But I could care less about the audience honestly.

And obviously adding new wrestlers does not make ratings go up that much. And that goes for all wrestling shows. WWE adds new wrestlers all the time and it doesn't effect ratings. Even with someone such as the rock showing up, it wouldn't be that huge of a leap in ratings many automatically assume would happen. So expecting TNA to grab huge ratings more than WWE simply because Hogan was on it was a ridiculous concept in the first place.

As I've said before, the audience does not make a wrestling show. Who cares about the audience, I mean seriously? They're yelling people with signs. Okay. Now back to the watching of the wrestling...

TNA earlier did go around to big arenas etc. But bigger arenas can only work if there's people willing to come to them. And every time TNA did that they didn't have enough people come, so they had to cut back on it a lot to cut costs. I'd like them to come around more tho, I live in a place with a big arena.

But yeah, I could care less about the crowd as long as I enjoy the stories and the wrestling.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I wouldn't say never. Never say never when it comes to pro wrestling. I think that TNA can compete with the WWE, but it's not going to be anytime in the near future. There are too many issues with TNA right now that it's going to have to overcome.

As for the Impact audience, I dunno about that. TNA has a pretty loyal following overall but, the problem is that there just aren't enough of them. I was reading some info on another site today that told some figures from recent WWE and TNA shows. Some of the numbers were from the WWE's recent European tour and they were doing house shows that, in some cases, were pulling in 10-12,000 fans whereas the info for the TNA shows was between 450-500.

In terms of competition, TNA's problem isn't unenthusiastic fans, it's the fact that they just don't have the number of fans to make them a feesible threat. People can argue which company is better until they're blue in the face, that's all well and good, but TNA's problem is primarily a numbers problem.

 

[ianfromlondon]

move tna to a bigger location?

you are forgetting the only reason fans go to tna shows is because universal studios gives them away for free to people

AND

they are told to scream and shout and everything before hand at the show and are bribed to make nocies by people coming out and saying
'the people who make the most noise will be giving ........'

so moving to a bigger place wouldnt make any difference because people are getting free tickets,they prob wouldnt sell 20% of a arena

and the fans screaming they are getting bribed to scream and chant,so the bottom line is your do anything for free or bring bribed

 

[CKDaimen]

I know how petty it may sound, but trust me....the fans need to make noise for TNA to be a threat. Wrestling is not the same without noise. I keep bringing up ECW because they wrestled in bingo halls but they still made so many moments and entrances, etc. seem like a big deal. It's not ALWAYS about quantity of fans. The TNA Impact Fans are decent. I'm not saying they are pieces of crap....but they rarely go APESHIT. Without that, the viewer, especially the casual viewer...I'm not talking about you or me, or most people who take the time to post on a Wrestlezone message board, but to the CASUAL VIEWER...without that apeshit reaction to things and to entrances...it will never compete against the WWE IMO.

 

[Kanye South]

After the announcement of Hogan coming to TNA, even though he hasn't arrived yet, I have been looking at the ratings to see if there was any significant pick up in interest. The last I saw they got a 1.1. I know it's early, but this isn't the first time TNA has tried to do something big and got absolutely no change. (Let's not get into semantics....even if they got a little change, it wasn't enough of a change to call them mainstream or a threat to WWE) By big things I mean signing Kurt Angle, Sting, and in my opinion, creating the Main Event Mafia. So I've had a bad feeling lately that no matter what TNA does, they will not crack a 2.0 ever. So while watching Impact last night I tried to figure out why, and I did.

The reasons the ratings aren't high is because Hogan signing is old news now and people want to see him actually show up and do some shit. The first week that Hogan was with TNA, the rating was very high for TNA standards.

TNA will never stand a chance against the WWE because of the fans/presentation combination. Let me elaborate. TNA's presentation is that of a mainstream interior inside of a low rate exterior. This has been criticized plenty of times, about how they should either get rid of the six sided ring or they should move to bigger arenas.

The ring is okay. It makes TNA actually look unique and gives a different feel to the show. But things like similar and cheap sounding entrance music, dark lighting, and a smaller TitanTron are things that TNA needs to fix.

But that's not neccesarily true. I mean, think back to the original ECW. IF the original ECW had a steady long term deal on Spike TV, and had the creative freedom TNA has, and if ECW had the same rabid fans they had, NO MATTER HOW SMALL the arena, ECW would have got in WWE's ass. So it's not neccesarily the size of the impact zone, it's the fans. There is not enough enthusiasm and there is not enough noise from the fans.

It's a combination of the fans, the arena, and the impact zone. The fans, if I am correct, get in free while they're attending the Universal Studios theme park. That's apart of the agreement that TNA has with Universal for using their property. So legally, TNA can't charge the fans for attendance. And if you've ever been to a theme park, you know that after a couple of hours, you start looking for cheap entertainment, and when you see something free, you jump to it, just to occupy your time and give you something to do. So basically, over half of TNA's television taping audience is occupied by non-wrestling fans who know almost nothing about the product and most likely haven't seen anything before that night, and most likely won't go searching for more TNA after the night is over. So it's not the fans' fault.

So TNA's only option to fix this is to either relocate the Impact Zone or destroy that concept altogether.

Now granted, this most likely would be fixed with a bigger arena, but I think ECW proved that it's possible to have huge electricity in a small building if the fans are passionate enough, and the TNA fans are not. How many attacks, swerves, great matches, entrances, etc. have we seen in TNA only to get a mediocre reception from the fans?

Because of the free admission.

Here's my point. It doesn't matter that they got Hogan, it doesn't even matter how they use Hogan if the fans don't step it up BIG TIME....OR move to a bigger arena. Either or. Because if you tune in, and you're a casual and/or shallow fan, and you see the fans acting laid back and luke warm with the occasional "This is Awesome" or "TNA" chant, that won't be enough to bring them in.

Picture WCW without HUGE heat for the nWo or huge pops for Goldberg and Sting. Or WWE without huge pops when Austin stunned McMahon. It wouldn't have mattered. The fans, like anything else made the nWo a big deal and therefore made WCW a big deal.The fans made Austin/McMahon epic through their reactions. But back to WCW...it wasn't made a competitor to WWE not just through word of mouth, but from how over the talent were IN THE ARENAS. And I think it's safe to say, that IN THE FORSEEABLE FUTURE....TNA will not have that.

WWE charges a hefty price for their shows. Meaning that the people who pay that price are passionate fans of the show, or in today's case, their children are passionate fans of the show. TNA needs to end the deal with Universal if they want a better atmosphere. But until they get the funds to do that, they might as well use modern technology to edit in some cheers.

My opinion.....move to bigger arenas and then hopefully in a couple years, maybe sooner, the fans will be rabid. But wrestling is a business where if the fans aren't hot, people will not feel the electricity. At the risk of beating my point to death....imagine Hogan coming out in the 80s to the reaction that AJ Styles or even Sting gets in TNA.....wouldn't have been as big a deal would it? Imagine the Hogan third man swerve happening in TNA.....how loud and stunned would the crowd really act? Imagine Austin giving McMahon the first ever stunner in the Impact Zone....a few "oohhs" would be heard, but you wouldn't feel history in the air. Bottom line, TNA's fan enthusiasm sucks. The reasons can be debated, but when you watch the program, all that matters is, they don't make the program better. AND WITHOUT FANS THAT MAKE THE PROGRAM BETTER, TNA WILL NEVER COMPETE AGAINST WWE (Even though I think TNA is better right now)

I agree.

Discuss.

Done.

 

[johnbragg]

The often-apathetic Impact Zone crowds are a big problem, if you ask me. I don't know that it's the crowd's fault--maybe you can't expect people to be geeked out for an entire two-hour taping.

I would work on minimizing shots of the crowd as well as on how to get the crowd more active. Lose that ringside "Standing room only" section, first of all. When the fans are amped up, you can use shots of the bleachers and get the point across just as well.

Maybe take down the bleachers on one side of the ring and put in a wall of monitors. What you show on the monitors during is a different question--a huge TNA logo, shots of other camera angles, the commentators, replays, a mix of these, I'm not sure. OF course, once you have the wall of screens in, it's pretty easy to change up what's on the screens during a match.

As for getting the crowd more active, why not pipe in some starter chants? Maybe dub it onto the faces' entrance themes. Take AJ Styles music and add a track of a crowd chanting "A-J-Styles". This would cue the crowd to take up the chant. I think Joe is a face right now--get or record some audio of "Joe-Is-Gonna-Kill-You." Su-Per Mex. MO-Tor Ci-Ty Clap clap, clap clap clap.

Maybe just get creative with entrances. Screw face ramp/heel ramp. Have James STorm enter on one side on the Booze Cruiser, stand up, raise a fist and shout BEER! Roode steps through a curtain on the other side and shouts MONEY!! Go back and forth as they approach the ring.

 

[wrestlemaniac]

in my opinion, they need to get out of the impact zone, maybe an ny impact or have one here in houston. I was at the 08 victory road and the crowd was crazy. The atmosphere was great. Only a handful of kids theire an I unlickily was by one so I didn't start the F YOU JOE chant I wated to start during booker's match