Houston Region, Fourth Round: 3 Stages of Hell: (2) The Rock vs. (3) Randy Savage

Who Wins This Match

  • The Rock

  • Randy Savage


Results are only viewable after voting.
So basically what your saying is it doesnt matter if people interefered?So in a hypothetical situation when Zach Ryder versed Sheamus in that 11 second match for the WWE title,that if Randy Orton or Cena came down and beat the shit out of Sheamus and Zach Ryder pinned him and became the new WWE Champion,it doesnt matter how he won it just that he won it?

What part of he still won didn't you understand? If something like the hypothetical example you gave were to ever happen, then yeah it doesn't matter how he won the title because at the end of the day he would still be the WWE Champion, no? He may not seem credible because of the way he won it, but he is still the champion and you can't take it away from him.

Same thing with Rocky and many other wrestlers. There are matches which they've won because of interference but I'm not going to take those away from them unless it was a lot of interference like 10 guys just jumping them for example. Why? Because at the end of the day they still won the match, maybe not fair and square, but winning is what ultimately matters in pro wrestling match.
 
I never claimed it was hard to defeat some jobbers (which most of the people in the list weren't, I'll get to that later though), however when it's a whole bunch of them I'm sure it's a tough thing to accomplish. Also, there were some pretty big names in there too like Hogan, Flair, Sting, DDP and many others that weren't such big names.

A few big names doesn't make the feat impressive. It's a Royal Rumble match with more jobbers, it was supposed to be "brutal," when in fact it was a boring and long match. Savage's win just isn't that great in that match. You can argue that they weren't jobbers, but most of the guys I mentioned were jobbers at that point. I mean, how many times have we seen the main event caliber guy wreck through jobbers? Millions of times. That's what they're there to do, make Savage look good as he went over them. They barely got anything in on him, Savage just sold his "injury" and wasn't all that active for parts of the match.

I think you're misinterpreting things yet again. I never claimed Rocky didn't have any resiliency, which you seem to think I said. I did however say, that while both men are very resilient, I think (as in my opinion) that Savage was the more resilient of the two. So we can keep debating that, but at the end I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this particular point.

We'll probably have to, because I see Rock as the more resilient man, especially because of all the brutal beatings he took from Angle, Rikishi, Stone Cold, Undertaker, Kane, and Jericho. I mean, he ended up sprawled out so many times, but he never gave up.


Never said it wasn't.



I personally still don't see him hitting Elizabeth. Just because of the fact that she was never a wrestler or intervened in the ways that Stephanie did. And Chyna...she's just something else.

So, when Elizabeth rips off her clothing to distract the other wrestlers, that doesn't count? Or how she kept jumping into the Hogan-Savage match at WrestleMania V? Any of those things would be MORE than enough for Rock to hit her, but the point is fairly irrelevant.

I'll give you all of them except Hogan just because he was by that time way past his prime. But other than him, I still think the names that Savage faced were much bigger. They were all, if not most, better wrestlers and much more accomplished than the guys Rocky faced during his era.

Hogan, at that point, was still a huge star. He was getting cheers bigger than Rocky's. That contest was very competitive and don't forget, Hogan went on to win the WWF Undisputed Championship afterward. He was still a very dangerous competitor, one of many for The Rock.

Unfortunately we can't say how much success Randy could have had since he never faced the guys Rocky had to face, but the same could go for The Rock. Can we claim that he would be able to defeat guys like Ultimate Warrior, Hulk Hogan and Ric Flair during their respective primes? The world will never know.

True, it's all speculation from our side.

I'll admit it, I was exaggerating when I said they were crazier than Mankind himself, but they were still pretty damn crazy and were definitely not jobbers. Jobbers are meant to lose matches and make their opponents look good while doing so. So by that definition, neither man was a jobber because although they had their fair amount of losses, they still won plenty of matches. The best example of a jobber is the Brooklyn Brawler. That's a true jobber.

OK, a guy like Chavo Guerrero has won quite a few matches, but he's still a jobber. Those guys were never legitimate threats, they never advanced all that far out of the lower card. Although they weren't to the level of, say, a Brooklyn Brawler or a Leaping Lanny Poffo (THE OTHER BROTHER!), they were still jobbers.

You're right, it doesn't have to be an advantage but it can be. So I'm going with the latter since there isn't a huge weight difference between the two like there was with Hart and and Yoko. But like you said, if we go by your way of winning a cage match, the man that deals the more damage will probably be the winner at the end. So yet again, it's going to be something we'll just have to agree to disagree on since I personally think Savage would inflict more pain since he's more relentless and has more stamina so he can go on longer.

You're right. I sincerely believe Rock would dish out more punishment, the "I Quit" Match against Mankind is a big example of that... but we can't prove it.

Sorry to break the news to you but Savage wasn't stupid nor reckless. I think you misunderstood what I meant by consequences which would be something like getting stripped of a title. So I don't see how the consequences would hurt him and make him do a mistake, something we already went over. Also, how does him facing the consequences make him do more high risk maneuvers? He's not reckless nor stupid so I don't see what makes you think he would put himself at a position where he knows he could be in trouble.

If he's willing to do anything, even if it means losing the belt, then he'll certainly up the ante a little bit. He's definitely not known for being stupid or reckless but in a match like this, you have to pull out all the stops. If he doesn't take any risks, then he won't inflict enough punishment.

So Benoit got reckless and injured himself, two things Savage just doesn't do, and The Rock capitalized on Benoit's own stupidity. So since Savage and Benoit are two completely different type of wrestlers, tell me again how The Rock would capitalize on Savage's mistakes when he very rarely made any. He was known for perfecting his craft and paying a lot of attention to every little detail in a match, so mistakes happening were very unlikely.

Benoit went for a simple maneuver but he payed the consequences. I understand that Savage planned out his matches and wanted everything to be perfect, but The Rock is a damn good wrestler. When going against a guy like Rock, he wouldn't be able to execute his usual moves, he'd be pushed out of his comfort zone.
 
I have to go with Rock on this one. I love Savage, but with the type of match this is Rock has the advantage. None of these matches are a straight up wrestling match. If that were the case then I would give Savage the edge big time. However, the type of matches that we are looking at here calls for nothing more than brutality. In my eyes Savage isn't on the level of Rocky.

Savage has had some great matches, and I'll argue with anyone who doesn't believe that. However, this isn't a wrestling match. This is a fight, and nothing more than that. Something that I believe Rock has the advantage in. He has a history of cage matches, hell in the cell. Along with an Iron Man match, (The one with triple h that was just nasty.) proving he has the stamina to go the distance in this type of match.

So Rocky is my vote here.
 
I'll give it another shot and hope that 15 or so people read this post and have been convinced that Randy Savage should go over The Rock.

1. Randy Savage has beaten bigger and better men.

The “Macho Man” has beaten some of the all time greats including Hulk Hogan during his prime a couple of times in some MSG shows. He has also beaten guys like the Ultimate Warrior, Bret Hart, Sting, Ric Flair, a past his prime Bruno Sammartino, Dusty Rhodes, Chris Benoit, Arn Anderson, Jushin “Thunder” Liger and many other men that I won't bother to mention. Ultimately, my point is that Savage has defeated the best of the best during his time and most of them were during his and their prime. So I think he is more than capable of defeating The Rock when he has been able to defeat bigger and better wrestlers. I'm not saying it would be easy by any means but if anyone can defeat Rocky, it's Randy Savage.

2. Randy Savage is a very well decorated wrestler.

Randy Savage is a multiple time world champion and there has only been two men throughout his entire career that were able to take the title off of him. Those two men were Ric Flair and Hulk Hogan. I find it pretty impressive that from all of the wrestlers Savage wrestled during his time that only two were good enough to defeat him for his world titles. Aside, from being a multiple time world champion he also held the Intercontinental champion for over a year when it actually meant something. Furthermore, he is a King of the Ring winner and he also won the the first ever World War 3 match in WCW. You can say what you want about why he won the World War 3 match, but at the end of the day he still won and that's what ultimately matters in a wrestler match.

3. The feuds, the matches and the promos.

I don't think anyone can deny that Randy Savage is one of best wrestler ever. He had the ability to pull out classic matches out of just about anyone including The Ultimate Warrior. The man that mostly everyone considers a terrible worker and disgrace to wrestling was able to have a great match with the one and only Randy Savage. Aside from having the god given ability to have great matches with just about anyone, he could also cut an amazing promo on just about anything. Yes, Rocky is a great promo man and I'll never ever deny that. But if anyone could give him a run for his money on the mic it would definitely be the “Macho Man.”

Overall, Randy Savage has been involved in some of the best feuds ever and has won a few awards from PWI for the feud of the year with DDP and match of the year with Ricky Steamboat. But those two aren't the only ones he has feuded with and had great matches with. He also feuded with and had great matches with the likes of Ultimate Warrior, Ric Flair, and many other men. So not only could he give us, the wrestling fans, a great match night in and night out but he could also entertain us every time he took the microphone and cut a promo.

4. He held a World Title and was able to become a big superstar during Hulkamania.

As many of you probably know, throughout most of the time Hulk Hogan was in the WWE in the 80's and 90's, the focus was on him. Not many men were able to rise to the same level Hogan was in and dominate. Not many men were able to do that, except for Savage. Even with Hulkamania running wild throughout the WWE he still rose the ranks and eventually became a world champion and held the title for over a year. He was dominant and held his own during a time where it wasn't common for other babyfaces to become as big and beloved as he was. That, ladies and gentlemen, is an impressive feat in and of itself.

Like I said earlier, it definitely would not be a cake walk for Randy Savage to defeat Rocky but if anyone can do it's him. So with all of that in mind, I hope I was able to sway someone to Savage's side and hopefully it's not too late for him to get the win here.
 
I think The Rock would win the street fight and Savage the cage as each have a slight advantage in those matches. We then get to the ladder match, and this is where the decision needs to be made. Savage is probably faster than The Rock, but that is the only notable difference between the duo's attributes. It's a good job then that it is a difference that makes a difference in this matchup. Savage can utilise his speed to help him set up quick but devastating moves, as is common in ladder matches, and could also limb the ladder itself faster, which I think will grant him the win here.
 
A few big names doesn't make the feat impressive. It's a Royal Rumble match with more jobbers, it was supposed to be "brutal," when in fact it was a boring and long match. Savage's win just isn't that great in that match. You can argue that they weren't jobbers, but most of the guys I mentioned were jobbers at that point. I mean, how many times have we seen the main event caliber guy wreck through jobbers? Millions of times. That's what they're there to do, make Savage look good as he went over them. They barely got anything in on him, Savage just sold his "injury" and wasn't all that active for parts of the match.

But even if most of the guys were jobbers (if we were to go by your definition of a jobber) he still won the match because not only did he have to beat those “jobbers” but he also had to beat some other big names in order to win at the end.

So, when Elizabeth rips off her clothing to distract the other wrestlers, that doesn't count?

When the hell did that ever happen?

Or how she kept jumping into the Hogan-Savage match at WrestleMania V? Any of those things would be MORE than enough for Rock to hit her, but the point is fairly irrelevant.

I honestly don't ever remember her jumping into that match. I do remember here helping both men get up when the other one was down on the outside and Savage pushing her in front of Hogan, but other than that I don't remember her really jumping into the match. I may be wrong though, last time I saw that match was like 2009 or 2010.


Hogan, at that point, was still a huge star. He was getting cheers bigger than Rocky's. That contest was very competitive and don't forget, Hogan went on to win the WWF Undisputed Championship afterward. He was still a very dangerous competitor, one of many for The Rock.

Sure, he was still a huge star at that time but to say the Hogan of the early 2000's wasn't past his prime is just silly. By that time he was already in his late 40's or early 50's and just couldn't perform at the same lever the 80's and 90's Hogan could. The same Hogan Randy defeated during his prime.

If he's willing to do anything, even if it means losing the belt, then he'll certainly up the ante a little bit. He's definitely not known for being stupid or reckless but in a match like this, you have to pull out all the stops. If he doesn't take any risks, then he won't inflict enough punishment.

Please show me evidence of some point in time in which Savage “raised the ante” in a match so that he could get the win. Maybe then, I will believe you but for the time being no, he really wouldn't need to raise the ante because what he did was good enough to get big wins over big names. Also, he doesn't need to take extra “risks.” If what he did was enough to beat the names I've previously mentioned then those same moves would certainly be good enough to beat The Rock. Again, if he was able to get big wins over big names with the moves he already did then he could do them on the Rock and still pull out the win.

Benoit went for a simple maneuver but he payed the consequences. I understand that Savage planned out his matches and wanted everything to be perfect, but The Rock is a damn good wrestler. When going against a guy like Rock, he wouldn't be able to execute his usual moves, he'd be pushed out of his comfort zone.

But tell me Crock, what is so special about The Rock that wouldn't allow him to execute his “usual” moves? Sure, Randy might be somewhat out of his comfort zone but he'll still be able to execute all of those usual moves he has. If he was able to do it with the many other wrestlers that I won't even bother to mention yet again, then I don't see why he would all of a sudden have a problem with doing them against Rocky. It really makes no sense to me.
 
Street Fight -- The Rock would win. He is a sadistic man. Did you see what he did to Mankind at the Royal Rumble? Chances are he'd do it here to Randy Savage. The Rock would also put Randy Savage through an announce table or two.

Steel Cage -- Macho Man would win. The Rock would have taken a lot out Randy Savage during the Street Fight, but Macho Man is an animal inside a steel cage. The Rock would fight valiantly, but Randy Savage would drop a few elbow on him, including one from the top of the cage to win.

Ladder Match -- The Rock would win. By this point in the match, it would go to the better athlete. Randy Savage, in my estimation, wasn't as fit as The Rock and it would hurt him. Randy Savage would try to climb the ladder a few times, but The Rock would pull him down halfway. The Rock would slam him a few times with a chair, and if Macho Man hadn't bled out already, he'd hit him with a Rock Bottom.

Winner -- The Rock
 
AAAAAHHHHHHH!!! How am I supposed to make a decision on this one. The match type doesn't even help any. A Street Fight, a Cage Match, and a Ladder match? I guess... Matches that neither of these guys are really proficient in... I went with Randy Savage because of how much he innovated the high flying style back in the day. I think he'd easily win the Ladder match and pull off some great moves while doing so. The Street Fight is where I'd have the Rock win, which just leaves the Cage Match... Both these guys are in my Top 5, so it's pretty hard for me to make the call, but I gave it to Savage because I think he was always overshadowed by Hogan, while Rock was given plenty of time to shine as the best in the business (at least in terms of entertainment). Maybe it's pity for one of my favorites, but I just wanted him to win this one...
 

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