Batista Was Right

[warriorforever83]

I know batista is kind of a douche, but he is right, todays wrestlers are soft, and have no scare factor, where have all the heavyweights gone, superstars like the miz, and jomo, r truth, alberto, are all small compared to what alot of wrestlers used to be like, now i know there are exceptions to the rule, but look at when the rock came back, he towered over miz, the only thing they have right,right now is mark henry holding the title...thoughts??

 

[gazzatticus]

Its not just the size look at HBK hes not huge neither is Y2J i think it's more that matches just aren't as brutal as they once were the hell in a cell PPV should be scary and look painful but it isn't it looks tamed and held back and i'll bet the TLC this weekend is the same

 

[grantedisme]

Weren't people criticizing the 'E' a couple of months ago for only pushing roided up monsters? Also, I don't particularly remember most people being terribly fond of Batista in or out of the ring when he was with the company.

 

[The Hardcore Kid]

Batista can't stand to watch the current product because it's not based around him. He had no problem with PG when he was main eventing pay-per-views.

As far as the lack of big guys, the grass is always greener in the IWC, isn't it? 10-15 years ago it was "Vince never gives smaller guys a chance" and "I'm sick of all these big muscleheads, I want action and technical wrestling". Now we have absolutely amazing talents like Ziggler and Rhodes making it to the upper midcard, almost main eventers, and you're going to complain that we have no Monsters?

As much as Henry has improved and impressed me, give me a Ziggler match over a Henry match any day of the week.

tl;dr size doesn't mean anything, nor should it.

 

[bluejt16]

kane, big show, mark henry, hhh, kevin nash, cena, big zeke, mason ryan, brodus clay (where ever he may be!) these guys are all big and scary... just because some wrestlers are smaller it doesn't mean heavy weights are extinct...

smaller wrestlers produce better matches... just look at the likes of HBK, kurt angle, eddie guererro, Y2J... these guys have had some of the best matches in the history of the business and none of them are over 230lbs

 

[AttitudeChild]

You guys are missing the point. He's not saying these guys suck because they're too small, but because they aren't intimidating. People like Miz, Del Rio and Ziggler don't come across as tough guys. They come across as little whiny douche's that couldn't intimidate a little kid. No body is afraid of The Miz. No one is scared of Del Rio. No one fears Jack Swagger and that's what he was talking about.

 

[TheMainMan32]

Size doesn't matter? A sentiment spoken by fatties... and idiots. When are some people going to realize that your look does a lot for getting you over? People like to point out HBK and Y2J when arguing that your size doesn't matter. Go back and watch HBK and Y2J during their primes. HBK was 225 lbs of solid muscle. Go back and look at how big muscularly Y2J was when he was feuding with the Rock. Look at Eddie Guerrero, Kurt Angle, Tazz. All shorter men, but ALL of them were big for their height. Now look at Phil Brooks- flabby, no muscle tone. The Miz has some size but very little tone. Those guys don't look athletic, and it takes away from the believability of their moveset. Does that mean that these guys can't get over? Not at all, look at Phil. But if some of those guys had a better look, the task of drawing heat would be much easier.

For those of you that argue that it's not size, but the booking of those wrestlers that matter, you do know that Vince has booked certain wrestlers a certain way in the past because he didn't think that the audience would buy them being a tough guy, right? Christian comes to mind.

 

[nightmare]

Batista can't stand to watch the current product because it's not based around him. He had no problem with PG when he was main eventing pay-per-views.

As far as the lack of big guys, the grass is always greener in the IWC, isn't it? 10-15 years ago it was "Vince never gives smaller guys a chance" and "I'm sick of all these big muscleheads, I want action and technical wrestling". Now we have absolutely amazing talents like Ziggler and Rhodes making it to the upper midcard, almost main eventers, and you're going to complain that we have no Monsters?

As much as Henry has improved and impressed me, give me a Ziggler match over a Henry match any day of the week.

tl;dr size doesn't mean anything, nor should it.

This right here folks!

Batista had a good run, but his attitude has made his memory sour for alot of us. He was ok with getting a paycheck during his time in the spotlight, yet now has a issue with the 'PG' product? He acts like he was around during the time of Austin\Rock etc. We all know if it wasnt for Evolution he would have most likely ended up as a heel jobber with maybe a limited shot at the title. Deacon Batista wasnt as good as he was in his own mind or wants us to beleive. He was Warrior 2.0 with less of a fan base. Same 'bodybuilder' look, same shitty attitude.

Sure he had some good matches, but in no way did he pay his dues like he criticizes others for. He cut his teeth as a bouncer\bodybuilder and spent some time in OVW. He had the look, thats why he got his foot in the door. Talk all you want about Miz but he went from a skinny kid on the Real World to starting at the absolute bottom in the WWE. He stuck around after cold shoulders and negative comments from the locker room and trained his ass off to be one of the best heels in the WWE today.

We dont have alot of bigger talent anymore. Who cares. The few that we have get the job done when needed. Kane is back to his old ways, Show is still doing his thing & Henry got the strap. I for one am glad the 'smaller' or average size talent is getting their time to shine. Guys like Miz, Ziggler, Barrett and company are the future of the WWE & who cares if they arent endorsed by 'The Great Batista'. They are plenty intimidating in their own way. We dont need a big scary guy to intimidate everyone when we have plenty of great talent to get the job done. Remember Taz? What about Angle? It proves that talent & intensity can beat out large & intimidating any day.

Go sit on the couch and cry Dave.

 

[a7xfan93]

This just goes to show that it's impossible to please the IWC. People complained about not having the smaller guys have a chance. Now that they have a chance, you all complain about that. I'm sure that if they start pushing the huge guys again, you will start bitching about that.

 

[The Hardcore Kid]

Size doesn't matter? A sentiment spoken by fatties... and idiots. When are some people going to realize that your look does a lot for getting you over? People like to point out HBK and Y2J when arguing that your size doesn't matter. Go back and watch HBK and Y2J during their primes. HBK was 225 lbs of solid muscle. Go back and look at how big muscularly Y2J was when he was feuding with the Rock. Look at Eddie Guerrero, Kurt Angle, Tazz. All shorter men, but ALL of them were big for their height. Now look at Phil Brooks- flabby, no muscle tone. The Miz has some size but very little tone. Those guys don't look athletic, and it takes away from the believability of their moveset. Does that mean that these guys can't get over? Not at all, look at Phil. But if some of those guys had a better look, the task of drawing heat would be much easier.

For those of you that argue that it's not size, but the booking of those wrestlers that matter, you do know that Vince has booked certain wrestlers a certain way in the past because he didn't think that the audience would buy them being a tough guy, right? Christian comes to mind.

Are you kidding me? Ziggler and Rhodes are smaller guys but they are in incredible shape. Rhodes looks like he's chiseled out of stone.

Also what does that have to do with your point? Your point was "size does matter" but then you just made a list of small guys who defied your logic, and gave excuses for them. Ergo, they got over despite their smaller stature.

Why does everyone have to be a "tough guy"? Was Macho Man a "tough guy"? Bret Hart? HBK? Jericho? Of course no one would buy Christian being a "tough guy" in the landscape of professional wrestling, but why does he have to be? The "tough guy" is just one of many wrestling archetypes, and not everyone has to fit into it. In fact, most people don't have to fit into it. That way, when you have someone like Henry or Kane or someone legitimately huge, it makes that much more of an impact.

 

[MikeyTheAwesome]

You guys are missing the point. He's not saying these guys suck because they're too small, but because they aren't intimidating. People like Miz, Del Rio and Ziggler don't come across as tough guys. They come across as little whiny douche's that couldn't intimidate a little kid. No body is afraid of The Miz. No one is scared of Del Rio. No one fears Jack Swagger and that's what he was talking about.

That also goes to a lot of the attitude era stars as well though. Rock, Austin, Jericho, HBK, Edge and Christian, X-pac, the Hardyz, JBL, Kurt Angle among many others didn't have that intimidating look that other guys like Albert (A-Train), Test, Big Show and Mark Henry had. And this is a guy that loves his Attitude Era stars. But I think what he is really trying to say is that the stars of today, no matter how big you are in size and popularity, wouldn't last in the business when it comes to doing what guys like Rock, Austin. I think Batista just can't see some of today's biggest WWE's stars working through brutal matches and doing everything what they did in the A.E..even though Batista wasn't apart of that era. To make it simple, his opinion is that today's WWE superstars can't hold a light to the stars from the 90's and early 2000's. Even HHH mentioned in a promo after the "walk out" incident, that guys years ago would take the beating and wouldn't be afraid of anything, whereas today's people are more afraid of what happens to them.

Not sure if I really agree with him 100%, but I kinda know where he is coming from

 

[WWEIsLife2]

Ok Big Dave and if Vince or HHH came to you and offered you spot to come back you would jump in a heartbeat. So because CM Punk,Daniel Bryan,ADR,Miz,Ziggler,Ryder,Cody Rhodes,Wade Barrett,etc aren't jacked up muscle heads that makes the Shows or Matches unwatchable? I don't recall you having a problem while you were there. Were HBK or Bret Hart tough guys? That didn't have to be. They let their Matches in the Ring do the talking for them.

 

[TheMainMan32]

Did you guys even read Batista's comments, or any of his past comments on the WWE's current product? Batista has said before that he would not like to come back to the WWE because the things that he learned from guys like Ric Flair, he can't use in the ring anymore because the product is PG. Add that comment to this latest one where he says that a lot of the guys that are on the current roster don't look like they would squash a grape in fruit fight. It's not that they don't look intimidating. It's that they don't look believable. No one, for one second, thinks that The Miz is a realistic threat to anyone. I like The Miz- he's entertaining sometimes. But no one in their right mind would think that John Cena wouldn't fold him up and throw him through the ceiling if they fought. That's why I think so many heels HAVE to be booked as cowardly- because creative honestly thinks that it would be too unbelievable if they didn't.

 

[nightmare]

As far as what he learned from Flair not being relevant anymore..... lame excuse. When has Flair ever been a monster? He made his career on being the smaller, cowardly heel. Flair is dangerous in the ring & has earned respect despite his size or looks. Only difference is now you cant blade yourself on t.v. every match. Blood dosent make for great matches.

Alot of talent in the current WWE could definately have held their own in the Attitude Era, yet are limited in what can be done due to the changing landscape of the WWE. These guys look tough & have proven it despite their smaller stature compared to Batista and other 'monsters'. Punk, Cena, Orton, Bryan, Sheamus, Barrett, Ziggler and a few others would have fit in great back in the day. Its a different time now but that dosent mean they cant hold their own in a battle. Dismissing them based on that claim is childish. Saying they arent intimidating or dont look like they could put up a fight is pure crap.


Cena and Orton have had some fantastic brutal matches against eachother. They have had a few great ones against the likes of Edge and Undertaker as well. TLC, HIAC, I Quit etc. Been there, proved that. Hell even Batista has had his ass handed to him by these 2. Punk made his indy career & fan base by having those type of battles. He is even trying to get some of that back in the WWE today.

Its all just more whining from Batista so he can still get his name out there.

 

[marklouis]

Well, it isn't about size. Look at guys like Savage, Hart, HBK, Jericho, Benoit, Angle, etc. Those guys were not big. They were well put-together & tough, but not big. But they were also believable. I mean, Benoit was always seen as one of the toughest guys in the business, & he wasn't big at all. I think Batista was talking about personality & character, & he makes a point. All of the current WWE heels are the same-arrogant, entitled guys who are more interested in doing talk shows & trending on twitter. Mark Henry is an exception, & he's gotten over better than at any point in his career. But it's not just about the talent (or lack of it). It's also about the way creative is using them. The entire company is dropping the ball in my opinion.

 

[wushady]

Batista likes to bitch about everything since he left, probably just to keep his name mentioned on wrestling sites. He's always bitching about how bad PG wrestling is but I can't remember his character or storylines every being edgy or non PG really. He may be right that guys like Miz aren't intimidating looking, but it's been a long time since really roided up intimidating looking guys dominated WWE. There's still a few left but for the most part WWE doesn't push them as much. Probably due to the bad press they have gotten due to steroids over the years. Also the drug testing for the most part has kept the roid monsters out of the company.

 

[LoudClearVoice]

Here's my two cents:

IN GENERAL, the bigger a guy is, the worse he is at actually wrestling. The WWE Universe is more sophisticated now and expects more from a guy than him simply looking intimidating. I think Vince to some extent realizes this and instead of having a roster chock full of roided out monsters, he's decided to develop some of the "smaller" or "average" size guys. These guys are typically better technical wrestlers. We still have some monsters on the roster because they will always be a part of wrestling but "intimidation" IMO has become much less important to the WWE fans.

Look at a guy like CM Punk. Does he look intimidating? Not at all. In fact, he looks like a nice guy. Look at the success he's having.

Does John Cena look intimidating? No not at all.

I get what Batista is saying, he's saying no one is intimidating but my point is, wrestling has evolved to a point where that really isn't necessary anymore.

 

[Best in the World 79]

First off, Batista is a complete fool. Mr. Perfect, Million Dollar Man, and Roddy Piper are three men who never won wwe heavyweight championships. All three men's left foot has/had more talent then batista does when he dreams of eating things with the word anabloic.

It's not the size of the guys, and it's not their skill set. It's very simple. It's because the people backstage have no idea what the fans want nor do they have an idea of what they want. They change raw scripts like hours befor the show numerously. They simply don't book good talent for the most part, to look like what they're trying to portray. Best thing for miz to do is act weird like he has been and just go on rampages kicking little guys like rey's ass. have him beat up on guys like that and win very dirty. just do insane shit to get like rick rude heat. del rio... they should go somewhere else with him. i don't really know because the guys promos are fucking terrible. he cannot use the microphone he's so damn boring. so that's a clusterfuck with that guy. As for rhodes and ziggler? they are slowly building these guys to carry the company in a few years. and they can. cody rhodes is the best character going as far as im concerned. great promos. great character. great ring work. his match at mania 27 stole the show imo.

Basically, just let these guys who wanted to be wrestlers, be wrestlers. let them develop themselves. get with vets like taker, kane, hhh, guys like that who have paved roads. the phenom. the big red machine. the game. heartbreak kid. best in the world.. . . . . . now you have what? the viper, best in the world, supercena. that's about it. mark henry is not credible nor will he ever be. biggest waste of time and a title reign. hes in khali category as far as i'm concerned

 

[aboynameddirt]

This is laughable. Batista is a joke. Guys like CM Punk, The Miz, Christian, and Dolph Ziggler have more talent for the business in all aspects than Batista could ever dream of having.

He not only shows his lack of talent for the business, but also his lack of knowledge for the business by saying "I can't do PG wrestling." Pro wrestling can be great and still be PG, different areas just must be focused on and accentuated.

Besides that, Batista acts like he has really made an impact in the wrestling world. What the hell does Batista have that is even all that noteworthy? He's your generic, stereotypical pro wrestler. In a year when he's flat on his ass and VKM tells him to bite it, I'm sure he will greatly regret his words.

 

[xoxo French Kiss xoxo]

Could be because the use of performance enhancement drugs are frowned upon these days. Or because being big doesn't make you a great wrestler.

Does anyone remember that Batista was complete shit at the beginning of his career... well for most of his time in the WWE? Not to mention he was injury prone because he was just a big muscular wrestler, with no actual athletic talent.

Batista isn't naturally big, he's a steroid freak.
Rock isn't naturally that big, yes he played football, yes he was bigger, but he's twice as big now as he was when he came back in April, which is 4times larger than he was when he left.
Cena isn't naturally that big, but he packs it on well and maintains it.
Triple H isn't naturally that big, he's probably the smallest he's been since 2000, but he's still over 250 pounds
Austin wasn't naturally that big, but he was still massive in his prime.

A lot of the guys now are athlete, with backgrounds in real sports.

Batista was a weight lifter when Triple h discovered him at a weight lifting show. Weight Lifters are usually big guys, who power lift to get enormous. Swagger and Zigger both come from a background in amateur wrestling, Ziggler is shredded to all shit, if he was to bulk up to the size of say John Cena he would lose his speed.

Punk, Ziggler, Rhodes, the Miz, R-Truth, Ryder, are not small guys they all average over 6 feet in height, and 200 pounds. They might not be 6'4 300pound juice monsters like Batista was in his prime, but their still intimidatingly large guys. I doubt Batista would talk that shit to any of their faces, especially CM Punk.

Batista needs to sit at home and recover from his back surgery and keep his fucking jaws just before he ruins any chance he has in the future of returning to the WWE.

I bet Goldberg didn't think Chris Jericho would choke him out in a fight, but it happened.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

Note that in the beginning of his rant he says "I can't watch it anymore". Then he goes on a rant about why he can't watch it anymore. How does he know all these things about the product if he isn't watching it anymore? Either he still watches WWE (in which case thank you for your viewership) or he is just making things up based on past experience that he took part in and heresay.

I'm not saying he's right or wrong, I just tend not to put much stock in to the opinion of people who admit they don't or can't watch something. Especially someone who has saggy diapers that leak.

 

[XXJJ]

I think you need a balance. IMO thats why they moved Kane to the Raw roster. The current raw heels are very similiar. They are missing a dominant heel. If they are smart they build up Kane like they did Mark Henry. And have Cena put over Kane like Orton did to Henry.

But guys like Miz and Dolph Ziggler are very good playing their heel characters. You dont want every heel to be some dominant bad ass. You just need a mixture of both.

And Dolph is a well-built guy, and is 100 times better in ring than Batista. You can put him in the HBK/Bret Hart type of category.

 

[The Champ]

You guys are missing the point. He's not saying these guys suck because they're too small, but because they aren't intimidating. People like Miz, Del Rio and Ziggler don't come across as tough guys. They come across as little whiny douche's that couldn't intimidate a little kid. No body is afraid of The Miz. No one is scared of Del Rio. No one fears Jack Swagger and that's what he was talking about.

Why do people need to be afraid of someone for them to be good at what they do? I don't understand that. Sure, there is credibility and believability involved, but that comes more with winning matches than it does with simply having a body that looks like they could beat someone up. Also, you still have power characters such as John Cena, Kane, Big Show, Mark Henry, and Sheamus. Plus Orton is more than believable as the wackjob who can get anyone at any moment. I think Big Dave is overestimating the number of guys who were built like he was, even when he was around. Did people fear Edge during his heel run? Did they think he could kick someone like Undertaker's ass? Hell no. He cheated and used La Familia to get his way, and yes, that was happening before WWE went PG. Even further back, was Jericho believable as a kick-ass heel? No, he cheated all the fucking time when he was Undisputed Champion and beyond. You have the same thing nowadays with people like Miz, who actually does pick up a few clean wins once in a while and has been on somewhat of a roll lately.

 

[krazyd]

I see what youre saying and its true they arent intimidating, but they're not supposed to be. They aren't booked as big scary guys they're booked 'soft' and as crooked wrestlers that will sneak behind someones back/try to injure an opponent/cheat to win. They're heels and just because they aren't big doesn't mean they aren't effective. That is what this generation is about. Not the roid heads. They may be small but they are still incredibly strong and muscular. Size does matter in the WWE, but not if you have that 'IT' factor, they're looking for.

 

[Shakin' Abe]

Bla bla bla. I'm tired of hearing that no talent Batista complain and whine about the state of the wrestling world. He couldn't fill seats if his life depended on it and he knows it so he has to shoot down all the other talent that he couldn't hang in a match with. Steroids have eaten his brain.