This is NOT Main Event Material.

[Hard Hit Prince]

We in the Internet Wrestling Community just love to use the term "future main-eventer" and "has all the tools in the world" and with that we have terms like "underrated" and "overrated" wrestlers. Anything that new and fresh is pretty much an excuse to create a thread to complain how much John Cena sucks ass and how this new thing should be the one to replace him.

Now let me take some things out of my chest, first and foremost John Cena is an elite superstar. He's probably in the Mt. Rushmore of Professional Wrestling. Being popular goes head to head with being talented and in professional wrestling, the true talent is making people care and Cena has done that more so than Steve Austin, Hulk Hogan or any of his predecessors.

Now, if history is any indication for you all, and it should be - NEVER did once a #1 guy got replaced while on the full-time roster. Nobody surpassed Bruno Sammartino, he just went away for some time, which led to Backlund carrying the load and to Hogan finally having his big break. Sammartino then returned, obviously not in his peek anymore as far as talent goes. Now, nobody ever surpassed Hulk Hogan. He just left in 1993, which led to the explosion of Bret Hart and Michaels to carry the load, until Austin finally came in and restored the true #1 spot for him. Nobody ever surpassed Austin, even though The Rock was close when Austin went away for some months, but as soon as Austin returned, he was once again the #1 guy bar none and then he retired for good. Kurt Angle, Lesnar and Triple H carried the load, until John Cena appeared and reclaimed the #1 spot again.

So in the whole history of the WWE, nobody ever surpassed the face of the company, while they were full-time performers. It may happen for some weeks, like with Warrior and Hogan. Rock and Austin. Punk and Cena, but ultimately the #1 always prevails.

My second point - some guys are just better not being the guy. Shawn Michaels, Chris Jericho, Edge... Those are three names that are not a part of the "big draws" in the history of wrestling, but all of them have Hall of Fame careers. Obviously someone, somewhere thought that they would be the ones to replace so and so, but that never happened and it was NOT a bad thing.

And now that I could take this out, I'll go to my actual point with this thread - WWE has a full roster right now with tremendous talents. Guys that go from Alberto Del Rio, Cesaro, Big E., Ziggler, Sandow, Rhodes, Barrett, Kingston, Ambrose and so on - guys that we all see have potential to be main event players, mostly because we're a bunch of fantastic guys and we love everybody.

But it's obviously that some of this guys won't reach the WWE World Heavyweight Championship spot, probably none of them will be the ones to fully replace John Cena since this process actually takes sometime. And as I stated, that is not a bad thing... So what I want to know is who are the guys that are currently entertaining you, but in any way shape or form, do you think that they should get more exposure or get a bigger push?

---''''''''''''''---​

I'll try to explain by exemplifying - to me Alberto Del Rio has been used to the best of his abilities in this mid-to-uppercard superstar and he has been entertaining me more so than his previous main event run for the world championship. He's a guy that I like to see in wrestling matches against pretty much any style in the WWE. He's a perfect foil to main event stars and a better one for people in the Intercontinental Championship division. He's been entertaining me as he is right now and more of him would probably make me turn against him. Other one is Jack Swagger - I'm a big fan of the original Real American, always have been and specially his in-ring work but his weaknesses such as bad promos are the ones that make me don't want to watch him anywhere higher than the midcard. He's great to have rivalries with people from Antonio Cesaro to Alberto Del Rio, but no way shape or form do I think he's good enough to feud with John Cena. To complete my top three, I'll end with Antonio Cesaro himself - as much as people like his in-ring style, the truth of the matter is that he'll thrive only in an environment where he's expected to wrestle more so than trying to sell a big money feud for a pay-per-view. He's a great midcarder and even though most see him with a lot of potential, in reality him main eventing a pay-per-view isn't what most would like to see, mainly because he is a bad actor and he is not capable of making a lot of people emotionally invested in a rivalry of his own.

Now your turn - who in the WWE entertains you and you're fine with the position he's in and don't think he should get pushed?

 

[Reflection]

What a coincidence, I have something to get off my chest too... The reason people care about John Cena more than anyone else (good or bad) is because he has been main eventing almost every pay per view for about a decade now, playing an inspirational character, he recently completed 400 wish grants, he has also been in movies, he earns more money and positive media attention for the WWE than anyone else etc. etc.
But all these accomplishments and popularity don't mean that we have to automatically start enjoying and loving his matches. 90% of his matches and about 70% of his promos are near-identical to one another- and that sucks ass. I know he is marketable and main event material- thats a different thing. But he is not enjoyable to watch, at least not in my taste, and certainly not so in comparison with the younger guys which many of us think "have all the tools" but the 'smarter' smart fans among us believe otherwise.
So when the "IWC" (which we are all a part of) uses words like "overrated" or "super cena" or "shoved down our throats", its not always unjustified.

Coming to your question... Yes, definitely. If I like someone, I'd want that person to move up the ladder. Similarly, if I'm losing interest in someone, I'd not mind seeing that person drop down a couple of steps. Nothing should stay in the same place for too long, or they become stagnant- like John Cena. Everything has to stay dynamic for progress to take place, whether its culture or ideology or economic policy or a pro wrestling character.

 

[Limitless]

First off Cena is lucky to be in his position and I do believe that if Brock would have stayed then Cena would not be so "Super". Also I actually would have watched more of WWE if he had stayed... but he didn't and we were left with a second best option... but forget about it (Wish I could!).

Antonio Cesaro - is a obvious choice as he has a good look and is highly entertaining in the ring. He is smaller than Cena and yet I find him more intimidating lol. He is just smooth in the ring, but he is getting older and I don't know how a face turn would work. He needs to step away from Jack and become his own guy and get in the ring with Daniel and Cena. However with one Title, this is a longshot.

Roman Reigns is the right choice as far as the future goes. He is Intimidating and has the look, and while his mic skills are yet to be established... he just has "IT". The guy will surpass Cena and will be the next face... just wait!

 

[Hard Hit Prince]

What a coincidence, I have something to get off my chest too... The reason people care about John Cena more than anyone else (good or bad) is because he has been main eventing almost every pay per view for about a decade now, playing an inspirational character, he recently completed 400 wish grants, he has also been in movies, he earns more money and positive media attention for the WWE than anyone else etc. etc.

I usually don't follow up smarky opinions, but this one is just plain ridiculous and I am 100% sure I'm right on this one. The logic that you are using is completely and utterly ******ed. Not saying that you are one yourself, but you are indeed pretty close to that and I'll tell you why: the logic behind wrestling is this one - whomever gets more people to talk is the one we'll put on the main event. It was never, and really NEVER the logic of: "I'll put someone in the main event to make them talk about it".

That does not work. That does not make money. That definitely doesn't make money for 10 years non-stop. That definitely doesn't have probably over two dozens of great bouts with the different opponents.

So next time think like that: "John Cena isn't popular because he's always in the main event. John Cena is always in the main event because he is popular".

But all these accomplishments and popularity don't mean that we have to automatically start enjoying and loving his matches. 90% of his matches and about 70% of his promos are near-identical to one another- and that sucks ass. I know he is marketable and main event material- thats a different thing. But he is not enjoyable to watch, at least not in my taste, and certainly not so in comparison with the younger guys which many of us think "have all the tools" but the 'smarter' smart fans among us believe otherwise.

So when the "IWC" (which we are all a part of) uses words like "overrated" or "super cena" or "shoved down our throats", its not always unjustified.

With my point being perfectly made in the above quote/reply, I do have to say that if you are against WWE's formula of storytelling and against probably the best storyteller of them all, you are by extent against pretty much everyone. Sure, John Cena has been the same for the better part of 10 years, but that does not mean that he delivers any less than great matches, great promos and great stories and more important, less buys. Your personal taste is idiotic because you said so yourself - you go with the flow and whatever is cool that month, is cool for you to follow.

Coming to your question... Yes, definitely. If I like someone, I'd want that person to move up the ladder. Similarly, if I'm losing interest in someone, I'd not mind seeing that person drop down a couple of steps. Nothing should stay in the same place for too long, or they become stagnant- like John Cena. Everything has to stay dynamic for progress to take place, whether its culture or ideology or economic policy or a pro wrestling character.

Don't you find ironic that John Cena stagnancy has made him the #1 draw in the entire company for over a decade? If one can't beat the stagnancy of John Cena, than one must really be shit and nobody in WWE beats Cena as a draw, making them all really shit - which is not the case. Now, you should have read my post as nothing about it stated that things shouldn't move up and down, I only asked for people that currently are in their perfect spot and should not be moved up or down to the company be able to capitalize on their talents. I exemplified Alberto Del Rio, Jack Swagger and Cesaro has guys that should not be bigger nor smaller than what they really are at the moment, because given their talents, their position is perfect for each and everyone.

 

[Softcore Holly]

Just to try to steer this back on course

Axel - I think they found his niche so to speak, as a tag wrestler. Axel has always been solid in the ring, but by himself he really doesn't stand out enough. Keeping with someone more interesting lets him keep providing solid matches while not boring anyone.

Kofi - He's obviously not going anywhere near the main event outside of big matches like the EC, but he's still good for solid mid-card matches. That being said I would greatly welcome a gimmick change. He's been the happy agile non-Jamaican for way too long now, he's long overdue for something new even if it keeps him on the same spot.

Santino - There's not many men that can be funny in the business without being outright annoying, and Santino is hilarious. But of course I don't have much interest in seeing him wrestle, especially not in the higher card. I actually hope when he retires from in-ring duty they keep him around as a manager since he can still be entertaining that way while helping to get newer stars over.

 

[GeneralKarim]

As far as Cena goes, although he gets a lot of cred.Besides DB and CM Punk ( who WWE have had nothing to do with their popularity almost ), WWE has a hard time making people take other wrestler as seriously as they take Cena, not because Cena is the best wrestloo000r in the world, but because he gets shoved in every single feud possible and he is always the dude that has to feed on the new guys and bury them unintentionally because of shitty booking a.k.a Nexus.He's also the guy that WWE makes sure everybody cares about and you cannot deny that.If people like Bryan or CM Punk were put in EXACT spots that Cena was put in, like constantly being in the main event and being untouchable and he constantly has the last world in promos, every single time.

But all that considered, Cena is still deserving of his spot but he should put his foot down from time to time and say "Dude why is my match with Laurinitis in the main event and not CM Punk's" ^_^


As far as underutilized talent, talent that has a shot at being someone big, maybe not #1 but a main eventer ? Look no further than Dolph Ziggler.The man proved he has the goods on the mic and he has barely been given time to show it since he debuted, which to me is ******ed.He's good in the ring, a bit overrated as he does seem to have a problem with pacing a match.But that's not the thing that is keeping him down.A golden shovel is.

Another one is , Wade fucking Barret.The guy has showed the whole world he was capable of good things on the mic, I mean seriously a guy who barely came from NXT and is already 1v1-ing with John Cena on the mic like its nobody's business.He's is good in the ring, good enough.He definitely has the look.So what's holding him back?Fucking 1001 theme changes coupled with horrendous booking, just freaking awful disgusting booking.

Sandow as well .The dude can talk, can wrestle and put on a great main event match, a.k.a. his match with Cena. But fucking Darren Young squashes him?A dude who is only "relevant" because he said he was gay in an arranged interview?Good for him.

Only...if fucking only...guys like them would have gotten even HALF even freaking half of the half of Alberto Del Rio's push and given so much mic time like he has...they would've been in better positions and would've showed the world how it's done.Granted Barret got mic time but after Nexus he's been trapped in the black hole of irrelevancy.

Could go on for hours about stuff like this so I'm done.

 

[TheOneAndOnlyGOAT]

Nobody ever surpassed Austin, even though The Rock was close when Austin went away for some months, but as soon as Austin returned, he was once again the #1 guy bar none and then he retired for good.

Biggest load of crap I've ever read. What I hate more than an ignorant idiot is an ignorant idiot who tries to act smart and know what he's talking about.

Little boy, how about you watch this:

[YOUTUBE] watch?v=rr0yY3y91rg[/YOUTUBE]

The Rock says Stone Cold Steve Austin and his name gets boo'd.

[YOUTUBE]watch?v=bFjibRFbg-A[/YOUTUBE]

Look at the pop Rock gets at Survivor series 99 and look at all the crowd signs for the rock, Rock was voted most popular wrestler in 99 and biggest draw.

Dave Meltzer stated that Rock broke gates record set by Austin in 98, in 99 then went to break his own record in 00.


The Rock sold out arenas in Japan and other parts of Asia, something Austin never did.

Rock was in 3 of the 5 highest rated matches in wrestling history (on cable tv).

The Rock with Rock N Sock connection as a mid carder outdrew Austin in the main event, highest rated segment in wwe tv history.

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-4519988.html

Stone Cold was supposed to turn heel and put over Rock at WM2000 but Austin pusssied out for a surgery that he could've done at any time before.


THE ROCK was one of the biggest pop culture icons in the world. In 2000, he was everywhere and had more mainstream appeal than Austin ever did.

Rock led WWF to it's most successful financial year in 2000 in terms of ratings, ppv buyrates...

The Rock was the one on magazine covers, video games, he was bar none WWF's top star.

He was the one that addressed the people in NY when WWF's stocks went public on wall street while Austin was in the back doing nothing.

When Austin returned to face rikishi, Rock was main eventing against Kurt angle at no mercy 2000 for the wwf title.

When Austin was the one facing angle at Summerslam, and rock was returning, Rock was the one that main evented.

The Rock was owning Austin at every live event in late 2001, he beat up Austin on raw before survivor series 2001 and on the ppv.

He was also scheduled to beat him at wrestlemania 18 but wwf was able to sign Hogan and they had Hogan face the biggest and top star at the time, The Rock.

Austin sure was #1 guy when him and Bradshaw were feuding with hall and xpac in 2002.

WWF wanted their "biggest star", their "face of the company" to lose to Brock Lesnar without any build up, right? Rock was clearly the face of wwe since 2000, WWE wanted Brock to beat the former top stars Hogan and Austin on raw and sd to finally face their current biggest guy, The Rock at Summerslam.


Grow up you dumb Cena fan.

 

[Hard Hit Prince]

Biggest load of crap I've ever read. What I hate more than an ignorant idiot is an ignorant idiot who tries to act smart and know what he's talking about.

Little boy, how about you watch this:

The Rock says Stone Cold Steve Austin and his name gets boo'd.

Look at the pop Rock gets at Survivor series 99 and look at all the crowd signs for the rock, Rock was voted most popular wrestler in 99 and biggest draw.

Dave Meltzer stated that Rock broke gates record set by Austin in 98, in 99 then went to break his own record in 00.


The Rock sold out arenas in Japan and other parts of Asia, something Austin never did.

Rock was in 3 of the 5 highest rated matches in wrestling history (on cable tv).

The Rock with Rock N Sock connection as a mid carder outdrew Austin in the main event, highest rated segment in wwe tv history.

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-4519988.html

Stone Cold was supposed to turn heel and put over Rock at WM2000 but Austin pusssied out for a surgery that he could've done at any time before.


THE ROCK was one of the biggest pop culture icons in the world. In 2000, he was everywhere and had more mainstream appeal than Austin ever did.

Rock led WWF to it's most successful financial year in 2000 in terms of ratings, ppv buyrates...

The Rock was the one on magazine covers, video games, he was bar none WWF's top star.

He was the one that addressed the people in NY when WWF's stocks went public on wall street while Austin was in the back doing nothing.

When Austin returned to face rikishi, Rock was main eventing against Kurt angle at no mercy 2000 for the wwf title.

When Austin was the one facing angle at Summerslam, and rock was returning, Rock was the one that main evented.

The Rock was owning Austin at every live event in late 2001, he beat up Austin on raw before survivor series 2001 and on the ppv.

He was also scheduled to beat him at wrestlemania 18 but wwf was able to sign Hogan and they had Hogan face the biggest and top star at the time, The Rock.

Austin sure was #1 guy when him and Bradshaw were feuding with hall and xpac in 2002.

WWF wanted their "biggest star", their "face of the company" to lose to Brock Lesnar without any build up, right? Rock was clearly the face of wwe since 2000, WWE wanted Brock to beat the former top stars Hogan and Austin on raw and sd to finally face their current biggest guy, The Rock at Summerslam.


Grow up you dumb Cena fan.

First off nobody is denying The Rock's drawing powers in here and I'll tell you how much crap you are listening to, when you're quoting David Meltzer's sources that are as usually, wrong.

Steve Austin was the main event of at least 10 of the 13 pay-per-views in 1999, in one of those he was not in the match, he was still the one to come up on top, in those pay-per-views attendance was usually bigger than 17.000 thousand people. When The Rock was headlining it with any other aside from Steve Austin, he would draw 13.000 to 15.000 in his best. The Rock grew in popularity in 1999, but in any way, shape or form was he the "biggest draw". Steve Austin seven/ten minute matches against The McMahons were bigger in the card than The Rock's matches most of the time. In 2000 Steve Austin was out until October and WWE had already run an angle with Rikishi by mid year, so it was hard to get away with it. And as stated being away from pretty much a year, it's hard to be considered the "biggest draw" of said year, while being at home. After the Rikishi angle, Austin was right back in the main event but the year is made up of 12 months and The Rock was clearly the biggest draw of that said year. Austin was still the #1 guy.

In 2001 Steve Austin was the main event of twelve pay-per-views, while The Rock was nowhere to be found right after WrestleMania. The Rock's return at SummerSlam got an attendance of 15.000 people where he main evented, which is pretty poor. Austin was an heel this year and usually big draws go for big babyfaces ence The Rock winning in 2001, because that was also ANOTHER CLEAR WIN for Austin, since he main evented pretty much everything. Here comes 2002 and that could be The Rock's year as far as bigger draw goes, but in all honesty I don't even know that. I'm basing everything on PPV placement, PPV main events and what not, because PPV's are the reflection of what television transpires. So yeah, obviously Stone Cold Steve Austin was the #1 guy in the company.

You are basing your opinion on selected shows that got a selected reaction. You are basing your opinion on the fact that The Rock probably headlined a house-show against Triple H and was the one to do the announcement of going public, since he would be last on the card. This does not prove by any stretch of the imagination that Steve Austin did ever lose his status as the #1 guy and it's quite possibly the most stupid thing to do to even doubt of Steve Austin's drawing power. Just look at this - Austin 3:16 shirt is the best selling t-shirt in the wrestling world, and one of highest selling 20 top tshirts of all time in any business. Even today Austin's shirt sell. While The Rock was a big big star in his own right, he was never bigger than Austin when Austin was around. He was better two or three times, but in general perspective and when the two were in the same card, Austin would be the one closing it. Do your research before you actually post stupid crap like that. Doubting Austin's overness is ridiculous even for guys like you. Don't call dumb to a guy that clearly knows a lot more than you. Austin was worth 200 million in income for WWF's in his heyday if we change it to the value that a guy could have today. That's the double of Cena's power and Cena is pretty fucking big.

With that said... go on. Try and prove me wrong again please.

 

[L@RISANO]

Interesting thread, here goes:

Dolph Ziggler: WWE built this guy and gave him a great cash-in moment with the MITB stuff, which got him over with the fans. Due to unfortunate injuries, he has dropped back down the card. However, unlike most others, I think his current position and how he is being used is good enough. At this point, the crowd still likes him, but most seem to have accepted his current position as it is. I think he should remain a popular mid-carder, and be used to elevate future top heels/faces, or even as a glorified jobber(as he was vs Del Rio last RAW). Don't see him in the Main Event scene anytime soon,tbh, better for him in the Mid-Card and Tag title scenes, with someone similar to him in status.

Kofi Kingston: Another guy who is good enough as a current babyface mid-carder. He is popular with the crowd in itself, due to his high-flying abilities and such. Rumoured to be being pushed again especially after beating Orton. However, like I said with Ziggler, it all applies to Kofi as well. Like them both as Superstars, but they are great where they are at this point.

Santino Marella: One of my absolute favourite characters currently, I love his segments and think he is the only one that can pull it off as he does. However, he can't be anything more a jobber, even though he came within a whisker of winning the World title in the EC a couple years ago.

There are a few others who are good as they are; Curtis Axel, Damien Sandow also.

 

[bryan vs cm punk wm30]

I think kofi is doing a good job in the mid card. He was supposed to be a main event heel plans changeafter bbeating Orton he was supposed to have a character change but NO

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Personally, there are a good number of wrestlers on the WWE roster that entertain me. The most obvious ones are Daniel Bryan, The Shield, The Wyatt Family, Cesaro, Jack Swagger, Big E, AJ Lee, The Usos, The New Age Outlaws and a few others. Others that I think could be used much better or deserve better include:

Wade Barrett - I've been a fan of Barrett since his days on NXT. He's good on the mic, has a good look, can frequently put on entertaining matches and has a legit toughness about him that I don't think WWE has done much at all to exploit.

Dolph Ziggler - Ziggler's someone that I think could have been a strong main event talent by now. He can go in the ring with the best of them, he's the best seller in the business, he's over with the fans and the guy can be damn entertaining on the mic. His brief backstage promo following his loss to Cesaro on Raw, it was shown on the WWE App a few weeks back, was the best work he's done on the mic. It was intense, passionate and it didn't feel the least bit scripted.

Kofi Kingston - I've said it lots of times in the past that I believe there's a lot of untapped potential in Kofi Kingston. He's got the goods in the ring, he puts on strong matches with damn near anybody, his athleticism is damn near inhuman and he's probably been the most consistent mid-card star in WWE for years. I honestly believe that with a character change and some genuine opportunity to get some time in on the mic, Kofi could be of much better use to WWE overall.

 

[Logisticalbooker86]

How about 3MB? Okay, maybe not Jinder Mahal, but Heath Slater and Drew Mcintyre deserve to be progressing up the card slightly. Notice, I did not say main-event, which is in line with the OP's wishes for this thread. I realize Drew Mcintyre was not getting over as a heel, but other than the fight with Tiffany, what did he do to get moved to permanent curtain jerker?

Drew had/still has the look. His entrance music used to be among the best in the business.

Heath Slater? I cannot really defend my choice here. I just think his obnoxiousness is a good way to draw heat in opening matches and may be a means of getting an absurd catch phrase over.

Cesaro is fantastic in the ring but he has not shown much personality. I'm not buying him as more than a flavor of the month guy until I see how he is booked after Elimination Chamber.

 

[L@RISANO]

Now your turn - who in the WWE entertains you and you're fine with the position he's in and don't think he should get pushed?

From what I understood, the OP was asking about guys who we think are entertaining and might be favourites, but yet, we are fine with their current position.

Many posters are doing the same old, who should get pushed posts, when that isn't the topic at all...

 

[Logisticalbooker86]

Isn't it the moderators job to determine whether a thread is going off-topic? Funny, your name isn't on the list... Fellow Roman Reigns fan so not trying to start anything, but if you were referring to me you should probably re-read my original post.

I used the word pushed by mistake, a thread has to branch out a little, otherwise there would be very little room for actual discussion. Still, I stand by the Three Man Band Baybay!

 

[L@RISANO]

Isn't it the moderators job to determine whether a thread is going off-topic? Funny, your name isn't on the list... Fellow Roman Reigns fan so not trying to start anything, but if you were referring to me you should probably re-read my original post.

I used the word pushed by mistake, a thread has to branch out a little, otherwise there would be very little room for actual discussion. Still, I stand by the Three Man Band Baybay!

Not trying to moderate.
Just, seeing some of the posts in the thread, it is clear it was somewhat mis-understood to mean "who do you enjoy that isn't being pushed right"...

I didn't name anyone, so I don't know why you would take it to mean you in any case...better to go through the entire thread and observe/read...

 

[supaman5279]

Cesaro..BTW you make a big case for Cena but you kind of piss on a lot of people past and present while leaving out a lot of details. To say John Cena has surpassed any superstar past or present is insane. You don't believe me, look at the ratings. Why else do they call up the part timers to make a big draw. RVD, Jericho, Undertaker, The Rock. Nobody on the roster is up to par, Cena included.

 

[Logisticalbooker86]

To be honest, I saw an opportunity to check if my posts were being read and I took it. Probably inappropriate and I apologize. First time somebody quoted me on the forum, yay! Hope I did not offend, or make a bad first impression.

There are a ton of mid-card guys who have been in the same spot for awhile. I'd say most of them are being used correctly but that is certainly a matter of opinion. I enjoy Fandango, because Summer Rae is fun to look at.

 

[jt1212]

What is NOT main event material is the Wyatt Family and Daniel Bryan. Between the Wyatt Family and Daniel Bryan being pushed down the viewers throats it is ruining professional wrestling. I have been watching WWE since I was five years old and I am now beginning to find it unbearable. I skip through on average about two and a half hours of Raw each week and only actually watch about a half hour of it. Triple H having more control over WWE is a VERY bad thing. He is ruining WWE. All he is doing creatively is pushing all of his buddies and the people he likes down our throats. The Wyatt Family is Triple H's main project and look at them. Pathetic. He is also very high on Daniel Bryan as well. Then of course his buddy Sheamus. Then he brings Batista back and shoves him down our throats. Then of course you have his buddies Ric Flair, Kevin Nash, HBK, the Outlaws. While plenty of huge talents in the locker room simply do not get pushed because they aren't Triple H's buddies.

First off the whole Daniel Bryan fad is ridiculous. The yes! chants are extremely annoying and ridiculous. It is just a far worse version of the what! chant that is for more annoying. Daniel Bryan is a midcard talent at best and that is where he belongs. Daniel Bryan is ruining the WWE. I doubt even one person will agree with this but everyone says Daniel Bryan works his ass off and deserves everything handed to him but he doesn't anymore than several other talents in the locker room that are better than him. The following guys all deserve to be in Daniel Bryan's position just as much, if not more than him; The Miz, Dolph Ziggler, Cody Rhodes, Jack Swagger, Antonio Cesaro, Randy Orton, CM Punk, Kane etc. A lot of these guys were even booed at the Rumble because of Daniel Bryan which is completely ridiculous. The fact that a guy like Randy Orton (who works his ass off and is consistently great in the ring) is being overshadowed by Daniel Bryan and probably not going to get to main event Wrestlemania because of it is unacceptable. Randy Orton deserves to main event Wrestlemania and Daniel Bryan will probably cost him that opportunity.

As for the Wyatt Family, they are also being pushed down our throats and ruining the WWE. Bray Wyatt (Husky Harris) is an overrated piece of shit. He was bad enough as Husky Harris and is now even worse as Bray Wyatt. I cannot stand anything about him or the Wyatt Family. He is awful in the ring and his promos are awful. His promos are just unbearable. The whole gimmick is horrendous.

Honourable mentions for people that are ruining WWE are Sheamus, Batista, The Big Show, and Jerry Lawler.

Sheamus has always been a piece of shit from day 1 and the only reason he has the push he has is because he is Triple H's workout buddy. His promos are unbearable.

Batista has always been overrated and his return has been horrendous. He is another guy being pushed down our throats because of Triple H.

As for Big Show, he just needs to retire. Enough is enough. His character is awful. If he was a heel I could live with it. But I cannot stand him as a face. Especially when he comes out with that smile on his face waving to the crown. The guy is supposed to be a monstrous giant. He is also a horrible actor and horrible on the mic but you can just tell he thinks he is this great actor, which REALLY annoys me.

As for Jerry Lawler, he needs to retire as. His commentary is unbearable and horrendous. All he does is screw up and make stupid jokes and scream in a high pitched voice. Enough is enough. He has always been an overrated commentator but now it is just ridiculous. I cannot stand his commentary. The guy called Tamina Snuka, Tamina Snuker for fuck sakes. A comment he should have been fired over as he did it on live tv. It is insulting to the entire Snuka family. Lawler just needs to leave he is a washed up has been. There are plenty of more capable commentators that deserve to be on the Raw panel. Mainly Renee Young! But there is also William Regal, Byron Saxton, Josh Matthews, Alex Riley, Taylor (the NXT backstage announcer). Any of which would be better than Lawler.

I am curious to see if anyone agrees with me.

 

[LuckyLouie]

God, why do I only get pissed after reading forums...

But here is my take on all this.
Cena is not the top draw because of his wrestling, he isn't popular because he is a wrestler. JUST LIKE HOGAN THEY MARKET HIM LIKE CRAZY!

I was watching RAW the other day and they said he is the #1 guy at the make a wish foundation.

A couple of years ago they had many people doing PR work for the WWE. Like Hurricane handling kids, Kurt doing the milk adds, the Rock doing his own thing. But the last few years , Cena does most of the RP work. He is shown everywhere. Thats why people are sick of him. And thats why is he that over. My mother, who doesn't watch wrestling knows who The Rock and Cena are because they are marketed like gods.

Without the media and Cena being a great human being, he would not be the face of the company. He isnt the greatest wrestler, and I dont find his work entertaining. I respect Cena for being a awesome human being but other then that he is a highly over rated wrestler with a media empire behind him.

While Cena is risen to highs people like Christian are being called ugly on TV so that we all can think that and not cheer on for CC. Its all marketing and Cena is the star because of how appealing he is to ALL markets. As good as Big E or Ziggler, they are harder to market and are held down.

And really people, you guys are going to shit on Cesaro. One of the only reasons people watch RAW. All you fuckers are realy gonna shit on this man and call him not main even level because he isnt as good at selling as a established main even start?! Thats a load of crap, and give him time for gods sake. Its first first run and he is just getting started. After all the time of people saying he is boring, he showed every single person in the WWE. Now when he and Swagger come out, the only people who get better reaction then them is Triple H, Cena and Bryan. People are starting to love watching Cesaro wrestle. I can say that every time he goes out to the ring I end up sitting with a huge smile because of his in ring work.

It might take him some time to get to the main event level, but dont shit on the man before he even gets his start.

As for the future, think about a whole new start. It will start slowly, but more and more WWE regs will start to leave and be replaced by the Ziglers, Sandows, Big E, Rhodes, Shield, ( I can stand Wyatt, wrestling and gimmick. Just too much for me to be able to actually see him as a threat. Reminds me of a old angry druggy )

Dont hate on the guys in here right now. Triple H had a stupid gimmick before becoming Triple H. never in my life would I put a settler ( i think he was, maybe the guy from the first thankgiving ) in the main event. A gold medal is nice but doesnt get you main event. HBK proved he could scrap. Beniot was a gable, Jericho was a risk, Rocky mavia was not a great gimmick, Austin was into disco before being stone cold. All the guy today had a shitty gimmick before. Just ask Kane. So lets give all these guys the benefit of the doubt. If you can market a rapper John Cena as a hero to kids all over the world. Then you can market any right person to be a star. We had an amazing and diverse group of young guys coming in. And instead of being closed minded and hating on all of them for being being Cena or The Rock is insane.

 

[avi01]

I would argue that Austin was indeed being replaced in 2002 before he walked out. In terms of pecking order, he was in the 3rd/4th main event at Wrestlemania X8..far from the 2 main ones, 2 months later in his last PPV on 2002, he was in mid card. He was schedule to lose in a random match vs. a green Brock Lesnar on RAW and he walked out. At that point, it was pretty clear Austin was being replaced. Admittedly, that is one of the reason he walked out..right or wrong. When he came back in 2003, he was by no means the center of the company, I think in 2003 , it is difficult to actually point out 1 face of the company.

I do agree he was bigger than The Rock in the period of time it mattered. Still tho, I always wondered if Rock would not have eventually surpassed Austin had he not left for surgery in 1999, I was always under the impression Rock was gaining big momentum in late 1999 and Austin was losing a little bit of steam, specially with Vince Mcmahon gone from TV for a while.

2001 was most definitely Austin's year tho. Again, I would wonder what would have happened if Rock did not leave after Wrestlemania. But 2002 , Austin was clearly not considered the man anymore, he was behind The Rock , Triple H , Taker and Hogan in terms of placement in the card. WWE had a lot of alternatives to Austin back then but they don't for Cena today. Not that their cannot be but Cena fits WWE's current business model more that anyone else..and this is purely a marketing question.

For that reason, Cena will probably (unless injured) be the number 1 guy for many more years. That's also what differentiates him with other faces of the company...in comparison, he lacks in terms of actual wrestling (Tho I disagree he is bad) and entertainment aspects. Past number 1 guys did not divide the audience like Cena does. Not the whole audience connects to him like they did with Hogan, Austin or the Rock but Cena is sure as hell marketed right and fits what WWE want to project as image perfectly.

To be where he is today, WWE took a risk with Cena and pushed him to the sky. I doubt they saw the return on investment right away. It is a risk to take, a risk they took with all the guys that became main eventer. I am not sure they are too prone to take risks these days, maybe I am wrong. At the end of the day, I am sure Vince would take a alternative to Cena if he could but alternatives are not ready made. They should be willing to take the risks and eventually succeed or fail. Should they try to replace Cena, the new guy will probably make them less money that Cena at start. But I understand they are a publicly traded company, it must be tough to take those risks when you have shareholders to answer and you have the Cena cow that can be milked for many more years and keep everyone that matters happy..

But it is unfair to compare with other eras, the business model that makes Cena a suitable face of the company is also quite a creative vacuum that don't necessarily allows potential main eventers to explore their full potential. This is not Cena's fault, this is not PG fault, this is not the IWC complaining, they obviously are a successful business with a not so good quality product. They are making the best out of a monopoly and surfing on success built years ago.

 

[Reflection]

So next time think like that: "John Cena isn't popular because he's always in the main event. John Cena is always in the main event because he is popular".

So you mean to say John Cena was more popular than / got more people to talk about him than... and I quote, "Steve Austin, Hulk Hogan or any of his predecessors" - that too BEFORE he was pushed to the main event? LOL, like someone else said above, this would definitely be among the biggest pile of crap I've ever read as well

With my point being perfectly made in the above quote/reply...

...That you are a jackass and your statistics are flawed...

I do have to say that if you are against WWE's formula of storytelling and against probably the best storyteller of them all, you are by extent against pretty much everyone. Sure, John Cena has been the same for the better part of 10 years, but that does not mean that he delivers any less than great matches, great promos and great stories and more important, less buys. Your personal taste is idiotic because you said so yourself - you go with the flow and whatever is cool that month, is cool for you to follow.

Not really. Majority of the wrestling critics and former wrestlers are against the "WWE way" of storytelling- if thats what you wanna call it. The best example would be the reaction to the Royal Rumble PPV. So again.. what you said was incorrect.
From the past 6-7 years, you won't be able to mention even five John Cena matches that can be considered truly "memorable" or something that stands out from the rest- not because of the stipulations or the titles on the line, but because of his performance. His matches are mostly mediocre, following the same routine. Stretching a match for over 20 minutes or doing a new move once in 6 months, don't make the match memorable or exciting.
John Cena is not the best storyteller either. Shawn Michaels and Undertaker told a better story, Triple-H and Undertaker told a better story, CM Punk and Undertaker told a better story, even Daniel Bryan against the suppressing authority has told a better story than anything Cena has done since his feud against Edge and Lita.
In addition to that, he's promos are not the best either. They are repetitive, just like his matches. His promos arealways one of the following- reciting what happened the previous week, loud declarations that he is back for the fans, stronger than ever, gonna win the title, maybe a childish insult, a smirk towards the boos, and thats it.
Maybe, but not as much as yours. Liking what is the trend of the time is not as bad as speaking against the flow, just to look cool, like a rebel or antithesis, and then backing it up poorly. If I like someone this month, it doesn't mean that I have to like that wrestler or character two years later as well. I will like someone as long as they are able to bring something fresh and intriguing to the table. Expecting otherwise beyond ridiculous.

Don't you find ironic that John Cena stagnancy has made him the #1 draw in the entire company for over a decade?

As I mentioned in my previous comment, its a result of a number of factors, including being booked as an inspirational character for almost 10 years straight, one that doesn't give up and fights till the end, and catering to an audience demographic that doesn't mind watching the same thing every week, as long as the good guy wins. John Cena is someone whom I consider responsible for the PG era- an era where quality of matches and storylines reached a new low. Pro wrestling is not nearly as popular, as can be seen by the ratings they get despite the lack of competition. The product sucks, and its number 1 guy sucks too. I'll go to the extent of saying that if John Cena wasn't in the main event for all these years, the product could have been much better. Compare the quality of everything during the true John Cena era (2007-2012) with the current era where others like Daniel Bryan, CM Punk and The Shield have risen to the main event (2013-14), and you'll get the answer.
No, actually I take that back... YOU will never get the answer; maybe someone with a mature and unclogged brain will. You will continue to think that John Cena is the best thing that has ever happened to wrestling and I won't try to change that. I'm just content with proving you incorrect.
The 'Smark' has spoken.

 

[zomigosh]

I think there's a difference between liking a wrestler for their skillset and ability and liking a wrestler for how well they play a role.

I absolutely love Antonio Cesaro, I want him to succeed and have "big fight feel" matches with guys like John Cena, Sheamus and Daniel Bryan. I like him not because of the role he's currently in, but rather for how great of a performer he is. I also like Santino Marella. Though he's also a great performer, I like him moreso for his comedic role in the lower/mid card and how well he plays it. It's good just being able to see him (sometimes) do funny stuff that cools me down from the rest of the show.

I don't see why I can't like Antonio Cesaro and want him to be a big wrestler, or anyone else for that matter. Sure, he might not be able to be one, but there's no reason for me to not want him to be one. The only thing stopping me from having this opinion is some arrogant guy over the internet trying to tell me my opinion is wrong by proving it with arbitrary opinionated patterns from older generations disguised as facts.

 

[enviousdominous]

John Cena is cared about in the same way that I care about another driver when they're on my ass on the freeway, and even though I switch lanes to get out of their way they switch lanes as well out of sheer stupidity and stay on my bumper. I care about John Cena in the same way that I care about a posse of twelve teenagers who, for whatever fucking reason, decided to pay good money to go see a serious film and make every kind of ungodly noise that teenagers make while I'm trying to enjoy a good movie. I care as deeply for John Cena as I care for a hive of wild hornets that for some reason has decided to make a nest in the ceiling of my kitchen only to be discovered in the dead of night when it crashes through. I am so deeply concerned with the welfare of John Cena in the same way that I'm empathetic toward my IT guys when they munch on Fritos while they're on the phone with me, and when their muffled words somehow become understood, I realize they have no fucking clue of what they're talking about as they "usually handle networking".

Do more people care about John Cena than Hulk Hogan? I don't fucking know, I don't think having a hundred more fans chanting "CENA SUCKS!" makes a big enough difference to give a shit about something like that. Hogan came around when Kayfabe and jingoism were in full swing, John is here because there's a lot of that "care" that people have for him I suppose.

I think that Dean Ambrose is where he needs to be. Now I'm a huge Dean Ambrose mark, have been ever since his CZW days. I see him being the guy who makes other guys look good enough to be World Champion. Basically what Jake The Snake and Earthquake were doing back in the day. I see him as the consummate heel who is always trying to cheat and be sneaky, only ever succeeding to free an up and comer of their mid-card belt so they can advance up the card. I enjoy the Hell out of his style and as long as he's used in any capacity, I'm happy.

I'm honestly torn when it comes to Daniel Bryan. I think he deserves to be a World Champion for longer than a day, but I'm not blinded by my adoration of him to see his potential in the same capacity as I described Dean Ambrose, except as a face instead of a heel. He could be the guy who has a good clean match with another popular face and shares some of his crowd appeal with them. Like Dean Ambrose, if Daniel Bryan is allowed to put on great matches on tv, I'm totally satisfied with his status.

 

[Hard Hit Prince]

So you mean to say John Cena was more popular than / got more people to talk about him than... and I quote, "Steve Austin, Hulk Hogan or any of his predecessors" - that too BEFORE he was pushed to the main event? LOL, like someone else said above, this would definitely be among the biggest pile of crap I've ever read as well

No. I said that John Cena is currently the most popular guy in the roster. He's one of the guys to be considered in the Mt. Rushmore as far as big draws go with the likes of Bruno, Hogan, Austin and to an extent The Rock. I've also said that WWE isn't pushing Cena.

It's not WWE that is making people buy into Cena's programs and t-shirts - they give him the outlet, they've been giving him the outlet and people TUNE IN! I may be the one here, but if I don't like something and specially in wrestling - I simply fast forward it or change for whatever other thing. However as much as this idiots here say: "Cena is as interesting as a white wall", the truth of the matter is that Cena is a drawing power. His main events at Mania reached the million mark internationally last year and while some of it was The Rock's own overness it always takes two to tango. Also, his segments are some of the most watched on the show and it does not matter what the hell he's doing.

Think like that - WWE gave the spotlight to Jack Swagger, gave a WrestleMania Main Event to The Miz, pushed Del Rio so bad for so many years and did any of those became "the guy"? They gave CM Punk everything in the world, including a 434 day title run - did he surpassed John Cena? No! People cared a lot more, and I'm talking casual fans here which is THE MAJORITY of wrestling fans in the WORLD, about the Laurinaitis vs. John Cena crap. It is what it is - Cena alone's worth 100 million in the WWE and that is all income. He alone is almost as valuable as was the WWE when they became a publicly traded company in 1999!!

...That you are a jackass and your statistics are flawed...

You have not proven me wrong. How can the "statistics be flawed" if you can't beat them? What a moron. Could somebody take the keyboard away from this fucking guy? You're everything that's wrong with wrestling today.

Not really. Majority of the wrestling critics and former wrestlers are against the "WWE way" of storytelling- if thats what you wanna call it. The best example would be the reaction to the Royal Rumble PPV. So again.. what you said was incorrect.

No they fucking aren't. What the fuck? I never once in my life read someone like that. I mean Meltzer may not be the most intelligent guy in the world, but he sure hell knows what WWE brings to the table.

From the past 6-7 years, you won't be able to mention even five John Cena matches that can be considered truly "memorable" or something that stands out from the rest- not because of the stipulations or the titles on the line, but because of his performance. His matches are mostly mediocre, following the same routine. Stretching a match for over 20 minutes or doing a new move once in 6 months, don't make the match memorable or exciting.

• Edge vs. John Cena - Backlash 2009 LMS - **** 1/2
• John Cena vs. Batista - Extreme Rules 2010 - Your critics gave it a ****1/4
• John Cena v. CM Punk - WWE MITB 2011. Remember your critics that "hate" WWE gave it five stars.
• John Cena v. Brock Lesnar - Extreme Rules 2012 - Most likely Lesnar's best match in his career. Also **** 1/2~
• John Cena vs. CM Punk - Monday Night Raw 2013 - **** 1/2
• John Cena v. Daniel Bryan - SummerSlam 2013 - Also **** 1/2 and it's arguably.

This is a list with only matches above **** stars in single's action! He has also had the **** rating with The Miz/Morrison. With Alberto Del Rio. With Dolph Ziggler. Other matches with CM Punk and Randy Orton. I'm pretty sure recently Cena had a SmackDown match with Seth Rollins that was absolutely awesome. It's way too many matches to be a coincidence or "the other ones" work. He was once able to pull out a 4 star match with Bobby Fn Lashley and who does that?

John Cena is not the best storyteller either. Shawn Michaels and Undertaker told a better story, Triple-H and Undertaker told a better story, CM Punk and Undertaker told a better story, even Daniel Bryan against the suppressing authority has told a better story than anything Cena has done since his feud against Edge and Lita.

Do you know what storytelling is? You're talking about content you idiot. How on earth is that Cena's fault that the creative team has the intelligence of a potato? And it's also your opinion. I though he was absolutely brilliant against Lesnar and Daniel Bryan most recently and when I say brilliant I mean it.

In addition to that, he's promos are not the best either. They are repetitive, just like his matches. His promos arealways one of the following- reciting what happened the previous week, loud declarations that he is back for the fans, stronger than ever, gonna win the title, maybe a childish insult, a smirk towards the boos, and thats it.

That's not Cena's fault, that's the content once again. And also, I'm pretty sure everyone does that. I remember once having to hear CM Punk, considered the best talker in the business, that he wanted to make snow angels. I've also had to endure CM Punk asking for respect and telling people how he was the best in the world. Everyone follows a routine for promos - usually Daniel Bryan goes out there and sarcastically compliment the Authority and goes on to ask questions to receive "YES" or "NO" answers and that's it for the "most over guy" in the company.

Maybe, but not as much as yours. Liking what is the trend of the time is not as bad as speaking against the flow, just to look cool, like a rebel or antithesis, and then backing it up poorly. If I like someone this month, it doesn't mean that I have to like that wrestler or character two years later as well. I will like someone as long as they are able to bring something fresh and intriguing to the table. Expecting otherwise beyond ridiculous.

No. I see through the "trends" because I usually don't like to come to internet and just plain piss on the WWE because they are not pushing a guy that most likely would get over exposed and would make me turn on him as fast as I started enjoying him. That is maturity and what being a smart fan should be all the time, not what you idiot are.

As I mentioned in my previous comment, its a result of a number of factors, including being booked as an inspirational character for almost 10 years straight, one that doesn't give up and fights till the end, and catering to an audience demographic that doesn't mind watching the same thing every week, as long as the good guy wins. John Cena is someone whom I consider responsible for the PG era- an era where quality of matches and storylines reached a new low. Pro wrestling is not nearly as popular, as can be seen by the ratings they get despite the lack of competition. The product sucks, and its number 1 guy sucks too. I'll go to the extent of saying that if John Cena wasn't in the main event for all these years, the product could have been much better. Compare the quality of everything during the true John Cena era (2007-2012) with the current era where others like Daniel Bryan, CM Punk and The Shield have risen to the main event (2013-14), and you'll get the answer.
No, actually I take that back... YOU will never get the answer; maybe someone with a mature and unclogged brain will. You will continue to think that John Cena is the best thing that has ever happened to wrestling and I won't try to change that. I'm just content with proving you incorrect.
The 'Smark' has spoken.

YOU HAVE NOT PROVEN ANYONE INCORRECT! In fact you're pretty much shooting yourself in the foot with the 2013-2014 logic, that has been rather unsuccessful more so than previous years. I mean SmackDown can't get a 2 in the ratings weekly anymore. The PG-Era was also created thanks to the demise of Chris Benoit, you should know better.

Also the only reason he's being booked like that is because people TUNE IN to watch him. John Cena is like that because he's the biggest draw in the company and not because the company makes him be like that. Everyone has tried to step up and NOBODY could reach even close. Batista, Edge, Randy Orton, Chris Jericho, Jeff Hardy, Wade Barrett, The Miz, CM Punk, Alberto Del Rio all PG-Era guys that were given a shot and couldn't outdraw the most despised wrestler in the world that nobody wants to see (except for the fact that his segments are among the most watched in the show and we are counting US alone.

Now you should crawl back to where the fuck you came. You are one of the dumbest posters in here and you should just get away. Look at this, I'm not a John Cena mark, I'm a wrestling fan so I know my shit. I could also prove you how the PG Era has delivered very well to a point that the company became from a million dollar company into a billion dollar company over the course of 7 years. They've been breaking records in events since John Cena took over and this is not me defending the guy, it's giving credit where credit is due.

Now stop saying the company pushes Cena. If the company could create one guy, and I'm saying ONE guy that could outdraw Cena, he wouldn't be number one. However replacing the #1 guy in the WWE doesn't happen from day til night - Cena would need to take time off for a long period of time. People would have to start crapping for his segments and for his main event pay-per-views when compared to other stars and people would have to go silent whenever Cena passed the curtain - which doesn't happen ever!

The whole PR work you're talking about, believe me, I'm pretty sure Cena would rather be in the beach with Nikki Bella and her famous rack, however Cena #1 guy in the company and that means the most recognizable wrestler in the world and also the biggest draw in the company and ence he HAS to go to those things. See? I'm done with you. You are a mut and you should feel bad for yourself. What a fucking idiot.

 

[TheOneAndOnlyGOAT]

First off nobody is denying The Rock's drawing powers in here and I'll tell you how much crap you are listening to, when you're quoting David Meltzer's sources that are as usually, wrong.

Steve Austin was the main event of at least 10 of the 13 pay-per-views in 1999, in one of those he was not in the match, he was still the one to come up on top, in those pay-per-views attendance was usually bigger than 17.000 thousand people. When The Rock was headlining it with any other aside from Steve Austin, he would draw 13.000 to 15.000 in his best. The Rock grew in popularity in 1999, but in any way, shape or form was he the "biggest draw". Steve Austin seven/ten minute matches against The McMahons were bigger in the card than The Rock's matches most of the time. In 2000 Steve Austin was out until October and WWE had already run an angle with Rikishi by mid year, so it was hard to get away with it. And as stated being away from pretty much a year, it's hard to be considered the "biggest draw" of said year, while being at home. After the Rikishi angle, Austin was right back in the main event but the year is made up of 12 months and The Rock was clearly the biggest draw of that said year. Austin was still the #1 guy.

In 2001 Steve Austin was the main event of twelve pay-per-views, while The Rock was nowhere to be found right after WrestleMania. The Rock's return at SummerSlam got an attendance of 15.000 people where he main evented, which is pretty poor. Austin was an heel this year and usually big draws go for big babyfaces ence The Rock winning in 2001, because that was also ANOTHER CLEAR WIN for Austin, since he main evented pretty much everything. Here comes 2002 and that could be The Rock's year as far as bigger draw goes, but in all honesty I don't even know that. I'm basing everything on PPV placement, PPV main events and what not, because PPV's are the reflection of what television transpires. So yeah, obviously Stone Cold Steve Austin was the #1 guy in the company.

You are basing your opinion on selected shows that got a selected reaction. You are basing your opinion on the fact that The Rock probably headlined a house-show against Triple H and was the one to do the announcement of going public, since he would be last on the card. This does not prove by any stretch of the imagination that Steve Austin did ever lose his status as the #1 guy and it's quite possibly the most stupid thing to do to even doubt of Steve Austin's drawing power. Just look at this - Austin 3:16 shirt is the best selling t-shirt in the wrestling world, and one of highest selling 20 top tshirts of all time in any business. Even today Austin's shirt sell. While The Rock was a big big star in his own right, he was never bigger than Austin when Austin was around. He was better two or three times, but in general perspective and when the two were in the same card, Austin would be the one closing it. Do your research before you actually post stupid crap like that. Doubting Austin's overness is ridiculous even for guys like you. Don't call dumb to a guy that clearly knows a lot more than you. Austin was worth 200 million in income for WWF's in his heyday if we change it to the value that a guy could have today. That's the double of Cena's power and Cena is pretty fucking big.

With that said... go on. Try and prove me wrong again

I can give you 1000 proof as to why Rock is a bigger draw than Austin, but that's not what we're talking about, you said Rock was never the face of the company which is absolute BS!!

Rock was clearly the guy, THE FACE OF THE COMPANY from 2000, Jericho said it, Foley said it and even hunter said it.


Rocky main evented 13 PPVs in 2000 (of course any mid carder would've main evented the same).

You say you know more than me? I doubt it. You could tell me you've been watching wrestling since 80s and I wouldn't buy it.

Most of you kids don't know what you're talking about.

If you WERE a wrestling fan in the attitude era, you'd knew that at one point rock was an equal star as Austin and later a bigger star.

The reason why Austin main evented over Rock in 2001 was because he was WWF champ, THAT SIMPLE.


WWF wanted to keep Rock away from Austin because the plan was for Rock to finally beat Austin in a one on one match at Wrestlemania 18.

WWF signed Hogan for a match against Rock. In an interview with OTR, Hogan said WWF wanted him to face Rock not austin.

In 2002, WWE wanted Brock to beat Austin and Hogan on raw and sd to build up a match with the #1 guy of the company The Rock.

In late 2002, WWF knew Austin was coming back. They signed him and the biggest match planned for Wrestlemania 19 was The Rock vs Goldberg not Austin.


Rock was clearly the #1 guy and the face of the wwe, no point in arguing with a newbie hater.