Third Round - Mexico City: Sadistic Madness - Andre the Giant vs. Rob Van Dam

Discussion in 'The Mexico City Region' started by klunderbunker, May 12, 2010.

?

Who Wins This Matchup?

  1. Andre the Giant

  2. Rob Van Dam

Multiple votes are allowed.
Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. klunderbunker

    klunderbunker Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House

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    This is a Third Round match in the Mexico City Region.

    Rules: The idea here is simple. You can win by pinfall or submission, but your opponent MUST be bleeding before pins or submission will be counted. When I say bleed, I mean something significant, but that will be at the referee's discretion. In other words, a slight cut that a band-aid could fix will not count.

    Location: Arena Mexico, Mexico City, Mexico.

    [​IMG]

    Andre the Giant

    [​IMG]

    Vs.

    Rob Van Dam

    [​IMG]

    Voting is open for 4 days.
     
  2. IrishCanadian25

    IrishCanadian25 Going on 10 years with WrestleZone

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    I don't care if Andre comes TO the ring bleeding. RVD's not pinning him. If I may quote Peter MacNicol, "You are the the buzzing of flies to him!"

    Yes, RVD is more creative. But a creative chair shot by RVD vs a straight foreing object shot from a guy Andre's size and power, and RVD isn't getting up. Brock Lesnar dominated RVD when weapons weren't even allowed - now Andre can lock and load?

    Andre to advance. BIG.
     
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  3. Jack-Hammer

    Jack-Hammer YOU WILL RESPECT MY AUTHORITAH!!!!

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    RVD always has been a much more exciting, much more innovative wrestler than Andre the Giant. Truth is, he's just a better overall wrestler period, no question about it. But he's still getting his ass handed to him in this match.

    Andre's size and power in his prime would be almost impossible for RVD to overcome in a standard match, let alone in a match like this. If Andre the Giant really had ever decided to unload on someone, I wonder just how hard and fast he could swing a steel chair. RVD cutting Andre open is one thing, incapacitating him for a three count after cutting him open is another thing altogether. I'm voting for Andre here, although I won't be at all surprised if RVD moves on to the next round. I know plenty are going to vote for him simply because he's RVD.
     
  4. IrishCanadian25

    IrishCanadian25 Going on 10 years with WrestleZone

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    Sure. He's done a fine job appealing to the ADHD-masses of fans.

    LOADS of question about it. In fact, this statement is kinda ridiculous. Andre, one of the greatest drawing professional entertainers in history, vs. van Dam, a spot moneky who's never drawn dick? Do pointless acrobatics make van Dam a better wrestler than Andre?

    We agree somewhere.
     
  5. It's...Baylariat!

    It's...Baylariat! Team Finnley Baylor

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    This shouldn't be RVD in this match... but alas, it's due justice that Andre will thump RVD's head and ass together. Andre is a guy who can be ruthless at times. And if weapons are involved and you have to make your opponent bleed to pin him... well, RVD's just done either way here. NO Move in RVD's arsenal would put Andre down. Sure a chair shot could cut Andre open, but as what was said before... RVD's not pinning Andre. No way, no how. And to think, this could have been a lot more even if Stan Hansen were in this instead of the Whole F'n Bowl.

    Oh well.

    Andre in a murder.
     
  6. jmt225

    jmt225 Global Moderator

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    [YOUTUBE]mbZ7i-W46p4[/YOUTUBE]

    [YOUTUBE]BvOGEnRL0Rc[/YOUTUBE]​

    Okay, okay, okay... now, I know Bam Bam Bigelow isn't quite as big as Ander the Giant, but I'm posting this video regardless of that, just to show that RVD is scared of no man, and will go to any lengths he has to to win a match. This match here against Bam Bam Bigelow is proof of that.

    The fact of the matter is, when RVD wants to be, he can be a ruthless motherfucker, and that's exactly how he would be in this match, where anything goes. RVD would use chairs to cut the big bastard, and eventually he would be put down. And once he's put down, Frogslash and it's over. Best believe, if a leg drop can keep Andre down, then RVD's Frogslash, after repeatedly shots to the head with a chair, definitely would keep the big guy down as well.

    Plus, and I truly believe this, RVD is too fast and smart to ever let Andre take control of the match. Andre simply would not be able to get his hands on him.

    Besides the kayfabe argument, I respect Andre's contributions to the business, I really do, but I believe Rob Van Dam is one of the most charismatic, talented individuals to ever step foot in the ring. He has entertained me now for 13 years with his matches, interviews, and all around showmanship. There is no way I could vote for Andre, a guy with hardly any good matches to his name, against someone who's had a TON of great matches throughout his career, and someone who I've been a huge fan of for so long.
     
  7. Hulkamaniac

    Hulkamaniac Vote Hogan, Savage, Rocky and Thesz

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    Look, RVD probably makes Andre bleed first, but...there ain't no way in Hell he's pinning Andre. Andre in a landslide.
     
  8. Tenta

    Tenta The Shark Should've Worked in WCW

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    Typically, I am open to hearing debates on these matters. I open myself to other people's opinions, and generally respect them. And, I feel most important in this tournament, I understand that everybody here has a personal preference on why they've decided to vote, one way or the other. I would like to think that usually, I accept where that person is coming from, and respect their opinion. It's like I told Brain earlier in this tournament, in how people vote in this tournament. He happens to be picking purely from a kayfabe perspective, while I like to take drawing and ability to play a character into perspective. I have enforced this belief by telling those who I disagree with on a philosophical matter, "You happen to like strawberry, and I like vanilla. But we can agree we both like ice cream." If you don't understand metaphors, kindly go fuck yourself.

    However, in this case, I will only accept your rationale for voting RVD being that you like RVD more than you do Andre the Giant. That is the only reason I can understand somebody picking RVD over Andre in this round. I can't really argue that, after all, what will I say?

    "You're Wrong! You clearly like Andre more than your favorite wrestler in professional wrestling!"

    But I digress. Anyway, there is absolutely no way, in Hell, someone here can justify why RVD should go over Andre the Giant in this round. From a kayfabe perspective, a non-kayfabe perspective, or any other reason, there should be absolutely no justification for picking RVD over Andre the Giant. Perid.

    [YOUTUBE]C6YfJZ9hxLQ[/YOUTUBE]​

    I'll sum up what you should say if you're going to take that route of debate: RVD is a better aerial artist than Andre the Giant. That is it, and that's all. Otherwise, RVD is really not that much a better wrestler than Andre the Giant in his prime. At least, with the moves RVD plans on performing to Andre the Giant.

    Follow with me here. First, we're going to state the obvious, in that there is absolutely no way that RVD is lifting Andre in this match, at all. Only three people have ever done that to Andre to my knowledge. That would be Hogan, Canek, and Hansen. Nobody else in the history of professional wrestling was able to lift Andre the Giant. Thus, even if RVD is a better technician and suplex artist than Andre the Giant, which I'm not even that sure really, RVD can't even use them. Even worse, so much of RVD's offense is going to have to rely on getting Andre onto the ground. Rolling Thunder, the Five Star. Hell, even the Van Terminator requires Andre to be in a prone position for far longer than RVD could hope to get him. I suppose someone can argue that RVD can use his kicks, and that's valid. Problem is, for that to happen, RVD has to be relatively close to Andre, pretty much within reach. And there lies the contradiction; there's absolutely no way that RVD should want to get closer to Andre than he has to. He has to separate himself from the Giant, because if he doesn't, Andre is going to cold cock him, and RVD's head will be spinning faster than the wheels on a Ford Mustang. So all of your arguments that RVD can chop Andre down to size may be valid, but in doing so, you're giving RVD's only real chance to win this match.

    Which brings me to RVD's flippilty flip. Yes, RVD can float around Andre, and attack him from the top rope. As risky as that is, and believe me it is, if you've ever watched a Sting/Giant match, there is reason to believe that RVD can neutralize Andre's offense. However, that is assuming that RVd will hit every time. Often, RVD was caught in the air by the Big Show in their matches, and Kane has done similar to them. If either of these men can do that to RVD, so can Andre. The fact is, Andre isn't nearly as clumsy, in his prime, mind you, as people like to think. As a matter of fact, Andre is actually probably more nimble than both of these men, when they faced RVD.

    Which brings us to weapons. Again, if a wrestler can't swing a chair, they don't belong in this tournament. Yes, RVD was in ECW, and was "hardcore". But how much does that really matter? Big Show moved over to ECW, and he wasn't exactly a hardcore wrestler. Big Show adapted to his surroundings, and soon enough, became the most dominant champion ever in ECW. Well, aside from Mike Awesome and Taz, potentially. Still, if The Big Show can do it, why am I not to believe that Andre can't?

    Earlier I said Andre was as good a wrestler as RVD. Let me explain exactly what I mean here. Again, I will only concede that RVD is better with flying in the air. Even though I've pretty much stated that all of RVD's offense becomes null against Andre, let's just say that RVD can actually use his full arsenal of moves. It doesn't change the fact that RVd has a horribly low amount of ring psychology. RVD has absolutely no knowledge of being able to work as a hell, period. I believe that should be evident by how RVD was taken during the Alliance angle. In spite of being a heel on the team that was out for the destruction of the fucking company, RVD still usually got the biggest pops of the night. What did he do to try and get the fans to dislike him? Jack. Shit. He didn't do a damn thing to garner heel heat, which is what he was supposed to do, and become a true member of the Alliance. The only thing that made it even possible to dislike RVD in ECW was Bill Alfonso. The man deserves a medal, because he is the only man that can keep RVD a heel for longer than two weeks. Again, trying to act like a face during a time when you're the heel isn't cool, and it isn't good psychology. The only way to possibly describe it is absolutely moronic. Andre, on the other hand, knows how to work as both a heel and a face. He gets the rather simple idea of being able to make the fans both love and hate his guts. So yes, because of Andre's infinite amount of ring psychology, at least compared to the guy who just rolled up a bleezie before his match, he is actually the better wrestler. He works suplexes into his match, and has worked a submission every now and then. And even with that, he understands his role in professional wrestling. He understands that he's a Giant, so for him, it doesn't make sense to be a superb mat technician. It does, however, make sense to club a guy with his fist, and watch him go down, before putting all his weight on the guy. RVD may in fact know more moves, but he never puts any psychology into his character, or into what he's doing in the ring. Thus, yes, Andre tha Giant is a better wrestler than RVD. Point for him.

    From a kayfabe standpoint, RVD has a habit of always losing the big matches, when he actually reaches them. Yes, RVD beat Cena, but only after failing to unseat Triple H, Steve Austin, Kurt Angle, Taz, Rhyno, and plenty of other wrestlers on his way to becoming heavyweight champion. The one thing that stays consistent about RVD, aside from knowing he's getting a fine for rolling up every week, is that he chokes when the pressure is at its crescendo. RVD may have been the most over guy in the WWE, yet he never fully reached that main event scene until beating John Cena in an arena that completely catered to him, in a match that did similarly. Otherwise, whenever facing a "big name", RVD comes up more than short. Ask Triple H. Ask Stone Cold Steve Austin. Ask Kurt Angle. Ask the Undertaker. They all have multiple stories about embarassing RVD when the pressure was at its highest. Andre, on the other hand, went with two losses for fifteen years. two. In his prime, Harley Race, Jack Brisco, Nick Bockwinkel, and plenty other names have felt the wrath of Andre tha Giant. It took Inoki and El Canek, on their home turfs, to beat Andre the Giant. And quite frankly, RVD isn't up to snuff with either of those names. Andre is as big a name as the aforementioned people who have beaten oh High One, with the potential exception of Steve Austin. But I'll save that one for later. And how about this logic for Kayfabe? When RVD wrestles giants, he alawys comes up on the shorter end of the stick. Need some proof?

    [​IMG]

    [YOUTUBE]BDu0w231VNU[/YOUTUBE]

    [YOUTUBE]3oDl3f2yGp8&feature=related[/YOUTUBE]​

    [​IMG]

    [YOUTUBE]sxz1KOZD89o[/YOUTUBE]

    [YOUTUBE]eYeoCV5K3QY&feature=related[/YOUTUBE]

    [​IMG]

    [YOUTUBE]GR62tTTtcGI[/YOUTUBE]

    [YOUTUBE]lY2gp3NVBOw&feature=related[/YOUTUBE]​
    '

    All of them hardcore matches. All of them RVD faced defeat. And Andre the Giant is twice the man that Kane and Big Show are. Taker and Andre are equal, but this was a point of weakness in Taker's career. And you really expect for RVD to beat Andre, after being soundly beat by these men.

    Non-kayfabe, it isn't even a question. All I should have to say is 93,000 at Wrestlemania III, and probably half of that was because Hogan was fighting Andre. I wonder if in all of RVD's two weeks in the main event, RVD himself has ever drawn 93,000 in his entire career. Simply put, Andre has done infinitely more for professional wrestling. Before Hogan, Andre was the guy to make wrestling mainstream.

    I'll happily understand if you like RVD better, I really will. It's all a preference thing, really. But if you're voting objectively, there's no way you can justify picking RVD. Jack Hammer tried it, and I'll just put that IC is tossing his salad. If you're voting for RVD, just admit you're only voting him because you like him more. Because there's no reason, kayfabe or otherwise, as to why you should vote RVD.
     
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  9. Hulkamaniac

    Hulkamaniac Vote Hogan, Savage, Rocky and Thesz

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    Tenta, didn't Warrior slam Andre? Just nitpicking, I agree with you (and I LOVE me some RVD.)
     
  10. jmt225

    jmt225 Global Moderator

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    If a fucking body slam and LEG DROP could beat the guy, then a Van Daminator and Frogslash would beat Andre. That is absolutely, 100% indisputable.

    When has Andre used a foreign object before in his career? Moreover, I bet he swings a fucking chair slow as shit. RVD would simply duck and then counter.

    False. Extremely false.

    RVD beat Lesnar at Vengeance by DQ, and also had the guy beat on Raw before Heyman stuck his big nose where it didn't belong. Actual proof:

    [YOUTUBE]HiGQSA-OOOI[/YOUTUBE]

    And as far as the King of Ring match... RVD was injured going into that match, so it doesn't count. The fact is, NO ONE gave Brock as tough of fight during his career than Rob Van Dam. So, way to hurt your argument IC by bringing this up in the first place.

    Yeah, every one who attended Wrestlemania 17 (close to 70,000) must have had ADHD, because they sure did go nuts when RVD's music hit and when he won the IC Title that night. :icon_rolleyes:

    Spot monkey who never drew dick? Wow, way to show that you have zero bias in this match, IC. Really smart of you.

    The fact is, WWE crowds would go insane for RVD, and you would see COUNTLESS signs and t-shirts in the crowd for the guy. There's absolutely no denying how big of a fanbase the guy had in WWE.

    Yeah, only a body slam and leg drop could defeat the unstoppable Andre the Giant. Makes sense. :icon_rolleyes:
     
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  11. Tenta

    Tenta The Shark Should've Worked in WCW

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    Warrior clotheslined Giant alot, but never lifted him, to my knowledge, I was debating this internally, but I looked it up, and no, Andre hasn't been lifted by Warrior.

    As for you, JMT, it's all well and good to use Bam Bam. But the problem is, Bam Bam are nothing alike. At all. If anything, Andre is like Show, Kane, and Taker. Did you miss my post in seeing what they did to him?
     
  12. Tenta

    Tenta The Shark Should've Worked in WCW

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    I'm sorry, but did you really just compare Hogan to RVD?

    Again, different realms of kayfabe power. RVD isn't an eighth of what Hogan is worth, kayfabe wise. So just take that back where it should be put; in the garbage.




    Did you miss my Big Show point? He moved over to ECW. Sure he had some matches, but he was never hardcore. He seemed to handle it pretty well, in my eyes.

    I'm sorry, are we dealing with a fictitious match, because RVD was hurt? The result is there, JMT. RVd got soundly beat, and there's no other way to put it. And in wrestling, whoever wins that last match wins the feud.


    Was this the same Wrestlemania 17 Hogan was at?

    You're referring to Wrestlemania 18. Against Regal. William Regal. Great point, JMT.


    I wouldn't. Just that Andre actually sold tickets. RVD may have had fans, but he never sold tickets. He was never the marquee man until WWE went to Hammerstein's Ballroom. Then, they went to a regular PPV with RVD as champion, and buy rates went all for dick.

    Again, many fans.... Doesn't sell tickets.


    Hogan > RVD. Just like Andre > RVD.
     
  13. jmt225

    jmt225 Global Moderator

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    No, I just read it... very respectable post. However, if anyone's like Andre the Giant, it's The Big Show. And RVD and the Big Show have met in the ring before, and RVD had the match won before outside interference. Check it out:

    [YOUTUBE]N-jWX2aaxtw[/YOUTUBE]​

    As far as Kane and 'Taker... first of all, neither are anything like Andre. But, even if they were, there are logical, good excuses why RVD lost those matches. Against Kane, RVD wasn't 100% there mentally. Kane had been one of his best friends for months, and by Summerslam RVD still wasn't over the fact how Kane betrayed him. Against Andre the Giant, RVD would totally be into the match and ready to show the World just how awesome he is.

    As far as 'Taker... RVD has pinned him before. You win some you lose some in this sport, but RVD has beaten the Undertaker, and he would beat Andre in this style of match. Simple as...
     
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  14. klunderbunker

    klunderbunker Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House

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    So because RVD beat Bam Bam in a tough match with assistance from Sabu, he can beat Andre? Let's see: why is this just wrong.

    1. Andre is smarter than Bigelow. Look at the end. Bigelow just holds the chair in front of his head so RVD can kick him. You really think Andre would be that stupid? Andre didn't need to do much thinking out there, but he hardly ever made stupid mistakes. Also, something tells me Sabu wouldn't be an issue for Andre. A light lunch maybe, but an issue? Not at all.

    2. Andre DOMINATED Bigelow.

    [youtube]45ZNsEjaZdM[/youtube]

    Starting at about 6:20, we get Andre vs. Bigelow. Bigelow I don't htink ever gets a single shot in on Andre. Not one. So RVD struggles against Bigelow and Andre dominates him. While that's not a fair comparison to make, it does kind of show a point: Bigelow at his best here, can't hold a candle to an old Andre.

    3. Do you really want to go with the slam and leg drop argument? Hogan in 1987 ruled the damn world. That match is the biggest in wrestling history and at that time, Satan would have gone down to those two moves. The Frog Splash and Van Daminator MIGHT get a two on Andre, and I can't emphasize the word might enough.

    4. Van Dam can fly a lot. This is true. However, if Andre gets his hands on him once, which he would, this is over. Andre would just punch his head in and then do whatever he wanted to end it. Go to about 3:18 of this.

    [youtube]jijzfOxkwmg[/youtube]

    I don't care who you are, you are dead if that hits. Andre in the old days could MOVE.

    Van Dam is good, but it takes something special to beat Andre. RVD doesn't have it no matter what.
     
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  15. Tenta

    Tenta The Shark Should've Worked in WCW

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    I'm sorry... Did you just post a loss from RVD to make a point?

    Again, I labeled Big Show in that realm, as well. And you're right, Show and Andre are similar. Except, you know, Show isn't half of what Andre is. That is an undisputed fact. The Big Show's gimmick, just to make himself relevant, was that he was Andre's son


    Eh? Excuses? Can I excuse Andre's loss to Hogan by saying Andre had a back injury that threatened his life, JMT?

    Look, a loss is a loss. I accept Andre's defeats, just like you have to accept RVD's, and not make any apologies for them. Doing so is backpedaling to the max.



    You're referring to a match in which the match was restarted because Taker's foot was on the rope. I fail to see how that's RVD pinning him, and winning the match
     
  16. Jack-Hammer

    Jack-Hammer YOU WILL RESPECT MY AUTHORITAH!!!!

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    How much money a wrestler draws doesn't mean dick to me in terms of being able to put on an enjoyable match. Hulk Hogan is among the greatest draw of them all and I personally found most of his best matches to be snoozefests. As for RVD being a spot monkey, I typically agree overall. I don't particularly care for spot monkeys or spot fests all that much myself. They can have their uses in the grand scheme of things I guess. But, I do enjoy watching RVD more than Andre, never said that I thought that RVD was one of the all time greats. A lot of Andre's matches consisted of him being so physically dominant that nobody could do much of anything with him. Back in the 60s and 70s, people were awed by the sheer size of the man and flocked to see him regardless of whether his matches were all that great or not.
     
  17. jmt225

    jmt225 Global Moderator

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    Yeah, not a fair comparison since RVD is twice the athlete and competitor Hogan has ever been in the ring. ;)

    But seriously, even Hogan loves RVD. This is proven by the fact that Hogan choose Rob Van Dam to be champion of the wrestling company he took over. So, obviously, Hogan is just as big of mark for RVD as I am.

    Not really, man. I know people like to look down at ECW as this garbage company that didn't mean jackshit, but Rob Van Dam was that company's version of Hulk Hogan, and the fans of that company did believe that RVD was better than everyone in the business, and could kick anybody's ass in the business with his legit kickboxing backgroud.

    First of all, I was writing that post up before I saw your post, so no... however you'll see above where I sort of address the Big Show.

    RVD was INJURED going into the match. Kayfabe, wrestling is just like a sport like football and basketball, and even the greats don't play up to expectation when they go into a game injured. That's a fact.

    Yeah, simple mistake, my bad. But the point IS a great one and shows that IC was full of shit in his ADHD fanbase nonsense.

    RVD single handily kept ECW alive. He was the only person people paid money to see for over a year. He was the single reason why on a Friday night ECW could pull over 1.0 ratings, when today TNA can't even do that. The fact is, when RVD got hurt and had to sit out, that's when ECW's business really started to hurt. ECW went under because RVD stopped wrestling. So, yes... RVD is technically a draw, since drawing means making money for your company and being able to make them reach and surpass their highest expectations.

    Bullshit. One Night Stand 2006 did perfectly acceptable buyrates and better than most WWE pay-per-views that year.

    Also, that's IC's bullshit argument, Tenta. Not yours.
     
  18. 48.7 is Approximately 49 Times Better Than You

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    Rob Van Dam can do a thousand things to make someone bleed, so that isn't a question in this match. The question is if RVD is quick-enough to stay away from Andre. (He beat the Big Show, who is quite a lot faster than Andre) I think that RVD could win the match by taking out Andre's leg. His kicks and creative use of weaponry could do the trick, and from there, it's pretty much a done-deal. If Andre can't stand, he can't win. Andre is a giant (no pun), and if he can keep RVD grounded (literally on his back) then this is his. But as soon as RVD works the knee, it's a whole new match. The bigger they are, the harder they fall, and Andre falls hardest.
     
  19. Tenta

    Tenta The Shark Should've Worked in WCW

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    So Hogan loves RVD? This is the same guy who loves Abyss. This is the same guy that thought the Taskmaster would be a good arch rival.

    My point being, to paraphrase Mick Foley, "For every bit of a star in the ring Hogan was, Hogan simply doesn't understand what it takes to make a star outside the ring."

    And you really think I feel this way?

    Look, I love ECW, but it's simple; ECE isn't as relevant as the WWE, or WCW. Not that that's a knock on ECW, just the way history dictates thing. Yes, plenty of that was Paul's ineptitude in business, but there should be something said for the fact that ECW did only last seven years, give or take.

    Again, referring to counterculture fans who needed something different, because WCW and WWE were spewing out absolute shit. Doesn't make them right.



    So I can take away Andre's loss to Hogan?

    Yeah, RVD was over. There's no denying that.

    So it had nothing to do with Paul's horrible business? Or that the booking went to shit? Or the talent defects? That didn't play a role at all, JMT?

    Well, I wasn't referring to ONS. I'm more referring to the PPV afterwards
    in Vengeance, where RVD was facing Edge, and yet still, the numbers were down from last year. Again, it's all good that he brought fans in for a show I argue people would have watched anyway. But you have to retain the fans. RVD didn't.


    Doesn't make it untrue
     
  20. jmt225

    jmt225 Global Moderator

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    Did I say that? No, what I said was that match proves that RVD would go to any lengths possible to win a match, and it doesn't matter who he's up against.

    Yes, because he let Hogan punch him in the face repeatedly in their match. Why did he let Hogan do that, KB? Oh right, this is professional wrestling after all, where shit like that happens.

    If Sabu interfered in the match, then Andre really wouldn't stand a chance.

    Again, this has nothing to do with my argument. I only posted the match for the reasons I used above.

    Moreover, that was a YOUNG Bam Bam Bigelow. He was much improved by the time he faced Rob Van Dam, anyway.

    Oh that's bullshit KB and you know it. If you want to argue kayfabe, then you have to face the fact that the Van Daminator and Frogslash are MUCH more powerful, impactful moves then a fucking body slam and leg drop.

    Not really. I've seen RVD take a shit load of punishment throughout his career and still win a match. There's no reason for me or anyone else to believe that he wouldn't be able to handle a couple of headbutts from Andre the Giants.

    RVD wouldn't put himself in that position in the first place.

    Yes, because if you watch the match, Rob has Big Show beat, but the ref is down.

    Maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong, but the fact of the matter is, RVD will put up a fight against ANYBODY, and if he hits the Van Daminator and Frogsplash, it will put motherfuckers down for good, and that most definitely included Andre the Giant.

    That wasn't apart of the KAYFABE match, was it? Nope, it wasn't, so that "injury" doesn't matter. RVD wasn't injured in real life, but kayfabe wise. See the difference?

    No, sometimes a loss just isn't a loss, especially in professional wrestling.

    RVD still won the match, but it was start over. The fact is, the ref counted 1-2-3.

    Moreover, RVD has wins over Austin, The Rock, Angle, Jericho, Cena, Orton, HHH, etc.... so he has beaten the BEST OF THE BEST two eras have had to offer... why should I believe he couldn't beat the best of the best of the eras before him?
     
  21. Megadeth

    Megadeth AKA Asm92784

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    I voted for RVD, for the most part just because I like him better. Its extremely hard to compare Andre to any wrestler, especially those from a modern era. Andre was protected by Vince McMahon Senior, and was most of his career took place during an era where he could move from territory to territory, and thus always win and still be fresh and entertaining to watch. If Andre was around now, he would have a lot more losses than he did. Andre was a great worker and I do not mean to take anything away from him. From a non-kayfabe point, it would be extremely hard for anyone to take down a man of that size. So really I am voting pretty much solely on who I like better, and while I enjoy Andre, I am going to vote RVD. And just to give a kayfabe reason for it, although I know it is a weak argument, RVD was trained by the Sheik. The Sheik has a victory over Andre, so it could therefor be reasoned out that RVD could beat Andre. I am sure someone is going to tear that argument apart, and I dont really care, nor will I debate it, but to be honest, I would be more likely to buy a ticket to see RVD than Andre, so I am sticking with him.
     
  22. Little Jerry Lawler

    Little Jerry Lawler Sigmund Freud On Ritalin And Roids

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    Does the record books say that RVD won the match but the match was restarted? No it doesn't. It says that the Undertaker beat RVD to retain the title. You have to remind me when RVD beat HHH. I remember HHH beating RVD at Unforgiven 2002 and of course RVD had to take a high risk and crush the Game's throat in the Elimination Chamber. I also remember HHH beating RVD and Big Show to face Cena at Wrestlemania 22. Andre has had a better winning percentage against the best of the best than RVD has plain and simple.
     
  23. jmt225

    jmt225 Global Moderator

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    Did Hogan make those guys champion of his promotion? Nope, he sure didn't.

    And Foley does, eh?

    Fair enough, but again... the drawing shit is IC's argument; I don't think it really means all that much to you. Besides, I'm not saying RVD is a bigger draw than Andre; just letting people know that you cannot say he never drew anything.

    WWE fans loved RVD, though.

    No, because he lost fair and square, and there are no excuses why he lost other than Hogan was the better man that night. And no time after that did Andre prove that he could ever defeat Hogan.

    Sure it did, but RVD not being there hurt it just as much, if not more, than those things.

    That pay-per-view was built around DX returning, not Rob Van Dam having his first title defense. Bullshit argument, Tenta.

    And yet, you're blaming RVD for the buyrates of a show that was focused on wrestlers other than him?
     
  24. klunderbunker

    klunderbunker Welcome to My (And Not Sly's) House

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    Sure it does. RVD has never, ever, fought anyone with the size of Andre. Bigelow is a foot shorter and 100lbs lighter than Andre. HUGE difference.

    You really want to compare throwing punches to holding a chair in his hands and waiting for RVD to kick it into his head? Really? That's most amusing.

    You're smarter than this. Truly, you are.
    In other words, lighter and faster, making him more like RVD than his future fatter self. Also better pushed as he's in the final two men in the ring in a PPV.

    Not Hogan's. Not by a long shot.
    Was it against Andre or someone of his size and power? No? Didn't think so.

    As in the same Andre that knocked Haku to the ground with one of those headbutts? His head was HARD. That thing could knock out anybody.
    That's right he wouldn't. Andre would put him there.


    Why in the world are you making this comparison? Andre > Big Show. By a LOT.



    He'll definitely put up a fight, but the Van Daminator isn't going to put him down, and neither will the splash. Van Dam kicking him int he head is going to just annoy Andre.

    So Andre pinned Hogan on Feb 5 1988 then, meaning he beat him at the height of Hulkamania. Got it.

    So Andre pinned Hogan on Feb 5, 1988 then, meaning he beat him at the height of Hulkamania. Got it.

    He also pinned Warrior clean just by sitting on him. Also, other than Rock and Austin, none of those guys are in Andre's league or even close to it.
     
    It's...Baylariat! likes this.
  25. Muffin Top Merkley

    Muffin Top Merkley Be a man!

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    I like RVD, but I have to vote for Andre here.

    RVD would work Andre's legs, but I'm sure it would amount to the equivalent kicking down a tree.

    I have no reason to believe that RVD would be able to pin Andre past a one count.

    RVD, would make Andre bleed, but then Andre would instantly cause Van Dam to bleed and pin him quick and easily.
     

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