PG Rating Discussion

my theory: Vince McMahon doesn't have Paul Heyman or Vince Russo around to steal ideas from anymore (when they were in their prime), WWE can't creatively please the Attitude Era fan anymore, so they gave up and went in a different direction...that will make them more popular in the advertisment world, so it was an easy choice
 
Wrestling is cyclical. Everything that has happened will eventually happen again. You can't have an attitude era unless you had a PG era.

WWE is stripping it down so it can once again in a few years build itself back up.

Think of it as the Florida Marlins. After each world series win they dismantle the team and start over from scratch to build it back up to where it once was.
 
Rather than having 20 different crappy threads about the same exact topic but the most minuscule of variations, from now on, if you want to bitch and complain about the PG rating decision (or defend it against the bitching and complaining people), do it in here so we don't have to infect every single thread with the same old "omg pg rating sux we need the old ecw" crap.



And for the record, I don't mind the PG rating outside of the stupid humor that is geared towards idiots and children...namely Hornswoggle and Goldust...but they'd still be doing that garbage if it was TV-14 or MA or whatever anyway, because there are just some ******ed people on the writing staff.
 
I don't know if this deserves a topic on its own or not, but it fit in here nicely.

What is EVERY SHOW that is in prime time going for in the ratings? The Male/Female demographic between the ages of 18 and 49. Isn't that where most of the percentage comes from. So if thats your biggest audience, isn't that where you would start?

I'd be very interested in the share numbers of that demographic and see how they have gone down since the PG turn over. I would assume it continues to go down and down and down.

So, Vince is targeting kids with this new PG role, but yet is upset when the ratings keep going down. No wonder why. Jon and Kate Plus 8 is more entertaining now than RAW is. Vince is more worried about the almighty dollar, but if he can't keep his ratings up, he will lose his endorsements because WWE will start losing touch with its fans via ratings, and his time slots will be threatened.

What started this thread was Linda on the Conn. Education Board. They are both worried she will get blasted if the product isn't good enough for kids who are in school. So instead of changing the product for Linda, why don't you distance Linda from the product. I mean, wasn't the only reason she became CEO was when Vince had his legal trouble? Ok. She steps down as CEO, they place someone else there and boom, she is no longer apart of WWE and has no say in the matter. I know its not as easy as it sounds, but that would be the logical approach I would have taken.

The ratings will continue to struggle until Vince gets pissed and says "WE NEED A CHANGE". But, I don't think Vince feels threatened because TNA isn't up there in ratings. But as his number continues to drop, he will need to make a change as viewers will stop watching WWE and go to TNA, because they can feel entertained more so than WWE.

Whats the problem now? When is the last time we saw a turn by a major star? Matt Hardy at the Royal Rumble? Its been a while, and the characters are getting stale. Cena? Stale, but yet Vince won't change him because he is a top merchandise seller. Batista? Stale. Randy Orton? Stale.

I'm not saying that they have to turn, but a major character change. Cena would include a heel turn where he comes out and blasts the fans for not supporting him while he has supported them.

The problem now? What match on RAW could you have that you haven't seen in the main event.

Triple H - Orton? Seen it
Orton - Batista? Seen it
Orton - Cena? Seen it
Triple H - Cena? Seen it

They need to repackage the guys who aren't working, like Batista. Turn him heel against Triple H and Flair. Get away from the kid image, go back to what worked. Not the exact same image, because it would just grow stale. But the same theories and principles. The same concepts, and just switch them up.
 
a lot of what has been said is true. this is increasing advertising revenue which is huge, but i don't really care about how vince's wallet looks (fat or thin) i just want to enjoy a wrestling show and to think that we won't be able to enjoy wrestling without blood, cursing or tits and ass all over the place is absurd. did anyone watch toy story? i bet so and i bet most of those people enjoyed it because it was a compelling story and had a good script. im sure i'll get the argument about the animation but what it comes down to is that adults can enjoy entertainment without an r rating. im fairly certain that most of the lord of the rings films were rated pg and did rather well in the theaters i think. what i mean to say and the point im trying to make is that instead of lamenting the death of wwf/e attitude (which has been dead for years really) we should simply ask for compelling story lines, interesting characters and good dialogue. if we're not getting that it's not because the wrestlers can't say ass and the divas can't come out with hand print bikinis, but because wwe employs a creative department that is not creative.
 
a lot of what has been said is true. this is increasing advertising revenue which is huge, but i don't really care about how vince's wallet looks (fat or thin) i just want to enjoy a wrestling show and to think that we won't be able to enjoy wrestling without blood, cursing or tits and ass all over the place is absurd. did anyone watch toy story? i bet so and i bet most of those people enjoyed it because it was a compelling story and had a good script. im sure i'll get the argument about the animation but what it comes down to is that adults can enjoy entertainment without an r rating. im fairly certain that most of the lord of the rings films were rated pg and did rather well in the theaters i think. what i mean to say and the point im trying to make is that instead of lamenting the death of wwf/e attitude (which has been dead for years really) we should simply ask for compelling story lines, interesting characters and good dialogue. if we're not getting that it's not because the wrestlers can't say ass and the divas can't come out with hand print bikinis, but because wwe employs a creative department that is not creative.

But doesn't it go with the old saying "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". And to me, the product wasn't broke because you had guys who were able to be free in a sense. Now, they are acting more and more than they are being themselves.
 
But doesn't it go with the old saying "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". And to me, the product wasn't broke because you had guys who were able to be free in a sense. Now, they are acting more and more than they are being themselves.

sure, and i'm not saying don't let people be themselves. are you telling me you can't be yourself without cursing? that would be really sad because it's just silly.if all someone has to get them over is having a foul mouth then they shouldn't be given the microphone. believe me i have seen movies, television shows, and heard music that is captivating and interesting without a "mature" rating. my point is if thats what everyone wants rent some attitude era dvds and have fun. all i'm saying is that wwe has chosen this direction and if we are really fans of wrestling something as silly as they're going pg shouldn't cause such dissent. the point is if the show sucks its not the pg rating its the lack of creativity by wrestlers, vince, and everyone else who is a part of that.
 
a lot of what has been said is true. this is increasing advertising revenue which is huge, but i don't really care about how vince's wallet looks (fat or thin) i just want to enjoy a wrestling show and to think that we won't be able to enjoy wrestling without blood, cursing or tits and ass all over the place is absurd.

I think you and many others may find the concept "absurd", but I think you seriously underestimate the amount of people out there, that feel otherwise.

It doesn't matter how absurd you may think it is, that fans can't enjoy the product as much, without that stuff. The fact of the matter is that clearly, they don't. And contrary to what Vince thinks, as opinionated as fans are in this day and age, you aren't going to tell them what to think.

In other words, if you tell fans that they should still enjoy the wrestling product without blood, cursing, sex, etc ... they aren't going to listen to you. And the reason is that they have their own opinion of what constitutes a good product, that they find enjoyable. And they aren't going to have anyone tell them otherwise.


did anyone watch toy story? i bet so and i bet most of those people enjoyed it because it was a compelling story and had a good script.

Where as I am an adult that can sit down, watch, and enjoy PIXAR, I know that not every adult can sit down and watch PIXAR, and find it enjoyable.

Also, there is sadly zero comparison between the quality of PIXAR and WWE at the moment. As much as it pains me to say this, I would sit down and watch a PIXAR film any day over the WWE product of today. I simply find their storylines far more entertaining than anything I see on my screen coming from WWE today. And as I've touched based on, I think the reasoning behind that is Vince McMahon ditching the gimmicks in favor of personalities ... and ditching storylines, by making it all about "competing for titles and contenderships". That just doesn't work in a medium with pre-determined finishes.



im sure i'll get the argument about the animation but what it comes down to is that adults can enjoy entertainment without an r rating. im fairly certain that most of the lord of the rings films were rated pg and did rather well in the theaters i think. what i mean to say and the point im trying to make is that instead of lamenting the death of wwf/e attitude (which has been dead for years really) we should simply ask for compelling story lines, interesting characters and good dialogue. if we're not getting that it's not because the wrestlers can't say ass and the divas can't come out with hand print bikinis, but because wwe employs a creative department that is not creative.

I, for one, and open to giving WWE a try with the rating. Although my biggest problem is that I have turned off all WWE programming not solely because of the PG Rating. Rather, because his storylines (what few he actually does anymore) are terribly bland, he ditched virtually all gimmicks and tries to market solely personalities, those personalities are awful and terribly uncreative, etc.

And the Creative Department is not to blame. Stephanie is not to blame, like I once thought. There is one person to blame and that is Vince McMahon, who needs his ass booted from the Creative Department once and for all, to actually give other people a chance. His vision for whatever this garbage he's been feeding us since around 2005/2006 has been horrendous.

Vince has an absolute stranglehold over the Creative team, and he dictates to them every single thing he wants on that screen, to the last detail. For someone who is Chairman of the Board of a company, he is entirely too involved in that process. The problem is that IF Vince McMahon and his vision are the problem, there's nothing much that can be done internally, if he isn't willing to listen to others. And clearly, Vince is not that type of person.

Like when he was going under when WCW was kicking his ass, the only way to force this man's hand is to hit him in his wallet. By doing so, his shareholders will mount pressure on him to fix things, or they will bolt.

I simply take great delight each and every week the ratings get smaller, and smaller, and smaller. Because that only proves a lot of our critiques of what he is dishing out to be valid, and proves him wrong.
 
sure, and i'm not saying don't let people be themselves. are you telling me you can't be yourself without cursing? that would be really sad because it's just silly.if all someone has to get them over is having a foul mouth then they shouldn't be given the microphone. believe me i have seen movies, television shows, and heard music that is captivating and interesting without a "mature" rating. my point is if thats what everyone wants rent some attitude era dvds and have fun. all i'm saying is that wwe has chosen this direction and if we are really fans of wrestling something as silly as they're going pg shouldn't cause such dissent. the point is if the show sucks its not the pg rating its the lack of creativity by wrestlers, vince, and everyone else who is a part of that.

Its not even the cursing, but creative has zero ideas to help the characters, so the characters come off as not themselves. They are not into the characters like they once were. Its like making a change but giving no assistance to help the characters and the people who play them.

So the real question is why are people resenting the PG movement? Because creative has become stale. Could the same thing be happening if they hadn't gone PG? Sure. But, they made the change and a lot of fans are pointing to that as the cause. The problem is, when you restrict what you can or can't do, you limit the ideas.

I do think a lot of the problem is the way they present the product on television. Commercials during matches? That means people can see its a big match, turn the channel for 5-7 minutes, turn back and catch the ending and not miss anything.
 
Its not even the cursing, but creative has zero ideas to help the characters, so the characters come off as not themselves. They are not into the characters like they once were. Its like making a change but giving no assistance to help the characters and the people who play them.

So the real question is why are people resenting the PG movement? Because creative has become stale. Could the same thing be happening if they hadn't gone PG? Sure. But, they made the change and a lot of fans are pointing to that as the cause. The problem is, when you restrict what you can or can't do, you limit the ideas.

I do think a lot of the problem is the way they present the product on television. Commercials during matches? That means people can see its a big match, turn the channel for 5-7 minutes, turn back and catch the ending and not miss anything.

that is exactly my point man, the problem is not the rating and thats what everyone needs to realise. Lord Sidious has a good point with the idea of not everyone is going to agree and not everyone is going to like things done a certain way, but what i'm trying to say is if the creative element is there it wont matter how the show is presented. the problem is not pg the problem is the product being stale.
 
In other words, if you tell fans that they should still enjoy the wrestling product without blood, cursing, sex, etc ... they aren't going to listen to you. And the reason is that they have their own opinion of what constitutes a good product, that they find enjoyable. And they aren't going to have anyone tell them otherwise.

i agree with this i don't want to tell anyone what to find enjoyable but i do think it's at the very least irrational to dislike something simply for the rating.

I, for one, and open to giving WWE a try with the rating. Although my biggest problem is that I have turned off all WWE programming not solely because of the PG Rating. Rather, because his storylines (what few he actually does anymore) are terribly bland, he ditched virtually all gimmicks and tries to market solely personalities, those personalities are awful and terribly uncreative, etc.

And the Creative Department is not to blame. Stephanie is not to blame, like I once thought. There is one person to blame and that is Vince McMahon, who needs his ass booted from the Creative Department once and for all, to actually give other people a chance. His vision for whatever this garbage he's been feeding us since around 2005/2006 has been horrendous.

Vince has an absolute stranglehold over the Creative team, and he dictates to them every single thing he wants on that screen, to the last detail. For someone who is Chairman of the Board of a company, he is entirely too involved in that process. The problem is that IF Vince McMahon and his vision are the problem, there's nothing much that can be done internally, if he isn't willing to listen to others. And clearly, Vince is not that type of person.

Like when he was going under when WCW was kicking his ass, the only way to force this man's hand is to hit him in his wallet. Bu doing so, his shareholders will mount pressure on him to fix things, or they will bolt.

I simply take great delight each and every week the ratings get smaller, and smaller, and smaller. Because that only proves a lot of our critiques of what he is dishing out to be valid, and proves him wrong.
i agree with you here as well ultimately vince has the final say in what goes on t.v. and his finger is clearly not on the pulse of the wrestling world anymore. whats interesting to me is that smack down is still pretty decent in my opinion i watch that show when i can and i generally enjoy it. but that must be because its the b show and vince focuses on raw so there is much more freedom on fridays. i guess who knows. the whole point is regardless of whether the show is pg, tv-ma or anywhere in between, until the overall product is improved no amount of blood, breasts or bad language will save the wwe
 
that is exactly my point man, the problem is not the rating and thats what everyone needs to realise. Lord Sidious has a good point with the idea of not everyone is going to agree and not everyone is going to like things done a certain way, but what i'm trying to say is if the creative element is there it wont matter how the show is presented. the problem is not pg the problem is the product being stale.

Like I've been saying, changing both at the same time is why fans point to the PG rating as the problem. There are no characters anymore outside of the top draw. You know what made TV so great from 1998 through 2002-2003? There was a midcard division that had great storylines. There was a reason to watch from 9pm until the show was over. Now? There isn't a reason because the mid card is stale.

Vince wants his show to be "pure". Well all he is doing is killing his show in the process because the fans are resisting the change.
 
I think that the WWE going PG is an EXTREMELY bad idea its is making the wrestlers have to tone down and wrestlers cant get over as heels as easily as they used to be able to. This is my first post so :) LOL funny side note if Vince Mcmahon really wanted to go child friendly he would make it cartoon and put it on disney just thought that was a funny thought i would share with u guys :boobies:
 
you know what I find hilarious?


all the people crying out for the attitude era, and in the same post, will complain about the lack of characters in the current WWE.


Make me wonder....did you ah, actually WATCH the attitude era? thats were the "no character, be yourself" thing was fucking BORN. thats what the entire atttitude era was fucking based on!
 
first off the pg rating has killed alot of heels, without it we will never see undertaker sacrifice someone or another austin flick off the crowd, which i was surprised they even showed for the hall of fame.

The damn orton /batista cage match was terrible and there was no blood which makes it less appealing and more of a farse then before. When someone bleeds, well it is only logic if you get hit in the head with a steel chair, right?

All i am saying is, is that you can only take away so much before people get to upset and leave and then it will b too late. Tna is not the top show because of creative aspects but they are violent and seem more real when it comes to argument. Scott Steiner can call you a son of a ***** where as cena will call you a dork. Come on all ready, i watched wrestling for its violence and boobs an language, to take that away is to take away the sole purpose of a true fan of any modern era.

The ratings are low and i am not surprised! :boobs:
 
The thing that shocks me the most is that they are keeping this up. I know that Linda has her position, but come on. They are pissing me more and more with this crap. They say that they want to make this family friendly. Hmm, Triple h running around beating the crap out of guys with a sledgehammer screams family friendly to me, and something that i would want my kids (if i had any) to see. Another thing, you have Randy Orton, going around looking like he broke Batista's arm. All of this on this weeks on raw this week. Yes kids when you lose you go beat the hell out of the person that beat you. Is that what you want to tell kids? Suuure... sounds great to me. It annoys me that they say that they will be family friendly, but they have this on there.

Here's the thing I get what they are trying to do. They want to get a new generation of wrestling fans. Well here's problem in the process they are losing more of fans of my generation and those before me. I started watching wrestling right before the attitude era started. Through the monday night wars. I was the same age that these kids were when I was growing up and watched Austin flip Vince off and then gave him a stunner. I watched the Undertaker and Shawn Michaels bloody each other in the First Hell in a cell. The funny thing is kids now are more exposed to this stuff then I was. You look on tv and you see all of that. Even more. They can go to movie, or watch that on the internet.

It is something that makes no sense at all. In a time were more kids are more and more exposed to this stuff WWE is cutting back say that they want to be family friendly. Yet shows a 60 man get punted in the head, and lets a man beat the hell out of people with a sledgehammer. Then call it family friendly, it's a load of crap and makes them look like hypocrites and makes me sick.
 
WCW was PG so what's the big deal? I think people are just looking at another reason to bitch about the WWE when they don't need to . Just watch the product that is reason enough to bitch at them.

The product didn't go South because of the rating, it went South the day Time Warner/AOL sold to Vince. Once there was no competition Vince didn't need to work as hard anymore and the show got lazy.
 
I find this hilarious! Vince pisses on the Federal Government, pisses on Brent Bosell III, pisses on every critic, and, in the end, his WIFE will ruin the company! LMFAO!

Seriously, I think the PG rating is the worst, the very, very worst move WWE has ever made. I was watching TNA last night, and it was refreshing to see 3/4 naked ladies, blood, violence and cussing. AAAH!

Some have voiced opinions about lawsuit happy garbage slime parents. Hey, if it says TV-MA or whatever, it is YOUR responsibility to make sure your kids don't watch it unsupervised, not Vince's. I think Raw watchers are basically the same watchers of Monday Night Football, and, therefor, won't want a PG rating.

The product sucks in PG. Absolutely. Unequivocally. It sucks. This is the worst move the WWE has made in years. I'd actually give anything to see Katy Vick again.

I don't believe Vince will allow this to continue indefinitely. The ratings WILL continue to drop. When he's pulling a 1.0, I wonder if he'll still take commands from his wife, or get a divorce and up the ratings.

Once again, the slime, the scum, the dirt, the trash, the garbage, the feces, and the morally bankrupt, low as a pedophile like politics is ruining something we all love. I would have suggesting writing to the WWE, or even starting a petitions to get rid of the PG sludge. I doubt it would do any good.

Maybe there is hope and Vince will tweak the PG to get to a place we all like. Right now we're in hell, and it looks like we'll be here for awhile. I'd be interested if anyone has started a petition, or if they want to try and start one.
 
I'm not too worried about the new PG rating, here's why. No serouis volience? What like a man punting a woman in the head? Or a guy attacking people with sledgehammers? I guess snapping a guys arm by repeatly hitting him with achair is out too? Vince(and the WWE in genrel) don't really seem to be following there own guidelines. They're taking out bra and panties matches?Oh no! Now I'll have to watch porn for sexual kicks(Or maybe get a girlfriend!) and just watch wrestling for erm well wrestling! The no blood thing is annoying but I can live with, maybe we can get back to more technical, story telling matches instead of spot feasts with OMG moments(and let's face it most OMG moments havebeen done to death). Changing the name of Cena's holds because they both had FU in them was pointless but didn't really hurt the product. So on the whole I don't think the changes will be as big as people imagine. Also preople must understand WWE is a business first and foremost and they are targeting the people most likely to buy mecherndaise. When Vince first started his expansion in the 80's it was to get rid of the guy in the front row only spending a few bucks and replace it with a family(who knew less about the product) who with ticket's,mechendiase, snacks and drinks could spend a couple of hundered. the family market is where the most money is, it's good business. For geniune fans though it sucks.
 
PLEASE STOP BITCHIN about WWE's PG rating! A programs content rating doesn't make or break that program. The PG rating isn't what's killing Raw, it's the "creative" direction that sucks. Does the PG rating have anything to do with fact that no one wants see the four WWE title match scheduled for Raw? No it doesn't! It's the people they chose to put into that match that's making nobody want to see it! I mean, not every one is bitchin about the PG rating, but a lot of people are. My guess is that it's the people who started watching during the Attitude era or the ones who grew up on ECW that are complaining. Honestly, I don't care the show is pg or not. As long as the material is good, I'm good. However, if they were aiming for a G rating, then I would say bitch away!
 
I really don't get what the big deal is with the PG rating. Is there really that much of a difference? I mean, the only thing I can pick out that isn't occuring anymore is the weekly bra and panties matches. Does anyone really miss those matches that much? The Divas still wear skimpy outfits to wrestle, there is still blood shed at times, and there is still violence. Not quite to crisis that some people are making this out to be.
 
I really don't get what the big deal is with the PG rating. Is there really that much of a difference? I mean, the only thing I can pick out that isn't occuring anymore is the weekly bra and panties matches. Does anyone really miss those matches that much? The Divas still wear skimpy outfits to wrestle, there is still blood shed at times, and there is still violence. Not quite to crisis that some people are making this out to be.

Honestly, I don't think it's a real "crisis." People just need something in the WWE to bitch about since the Attitude Era will never return and the PG rating is the only convenient thing that they can all agree upon.

Get over it, everyone. The product isn't THAT bad. Actually, I believe it's quite good.
 
There's two sides to this issue, though, and the facts are these:

1. During the TV-14 and even TV-MA late 90's and early 00's, Monday Night ratings could be expected to hover in the upper 5's and lower 6's for the most part. During the true height of Austin, DX, The Corporation, etc., the ratings touched 8.

2. During the current TV-PG era, the ratings have not gotten far into the 4's. And there's always blame to be assigned - Monday Night Football, NBA Playoffs, etc. But those things still went on in the late 90's.

3. People are quick to say that the problem isn't with the rating, but with the lack of interesting characters we had in the late 90's. Ok, but isn't that a bi-product of the restrictions placed on the creative team? Stone Cold and DX wouldn't happen today, not because the creative team couldn't do it, but because they wouldn't be allowed to.

So before we dismiss this PG Rating debate as "just stop bitching, the product is fine," I have to ask you - is that a little too easy?
 
There's two sides to this issue, though, and the facts are these:

1. During the TV-14 and even TV-MA late 90's and early 00's, Monday Night ratings could be expected to hover in the upper 5's and lower 6's for the most part. During the true height of Austin, DX, The Corporation, etc., the ratings touched 8.

2. During the current TV-PG era, the ratings have not gotten far into the 4's. And there's always blame to be assigned - Monday Night Football, NBA Playoffs, etc. But those things still went on in the late 90's.

3. People are quick to say that the problem isn't with the rating, but with the lack of interesting characters we had in the late 90's. Ok, but isn't that a bi-product of the restrictions placed on the creative team? Stone Cold and DX wouldn't happen today, not because the creative team couldn't do it, but because they wouldn't be allowed to.

So before we dismiss this PG Rating debate as "just stop bitching, the product is fine," I have to ask you - is that a little too easy?

It was a different time, different era, and different pop-culture back then. Television programming (no matter what show you watch) is based around its current trend of pop culture. In the late 90's, curses and swearing, along with lewd acts, sexuality, and detailed violence were ruling television and radio. Everyone on television and the radio was trying to push the boundaries of censorship. The WWE and WCW were WELL-KNOWN as flagships for pushing and crossing those boundaries. But, at the same time, what pleased the wrestling audience was pissing off and offending the rest of the world.

At first, it was entertaining. Many people tuned into WWE programming for the same reasons that radio fans listened to Howard Stern... they wanted to see what would happen next. But, just like any trend that's shoved down our throats for a lengthy period of time, it also started to become stale. Television changed. The WWE clobbered its competition. SO many factors became different. And once all the dust settled and the smoke cleared, the WWE finally came to their senses and realized that the only thing more important than keeping their current audience was to BUILD A NEW AUDIENCE.

Since the early 80's the WWE was streamlined towards the youth of the world. Hell, they're the only ones that could watch pro-wrestling and not say, "This is fake. I'm turning it off." The WWE couldn't build a younger audience with the product they were televising back then. They needed change... BIG change. Hence, the PG era.

Everyone, just because YOU don't like it doesn't mean you know what's best for the future of the company. I strongly believe that if the WWE kept straight and narrow with it's racy and lewd televisions programming from the Attitude Era, their company would be bankrupt within the next 10 years.
 

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