**Merged** All Thing Chris Jericho Thread

[The Future Rises]

I found this on Lordsofpain.net :

Former WWE star Chris Jericho was recently interviewed by Duane Doogan of the Wrestling Voice radio show. Jericho had some controversial comments regarding WWE talent stealing his moves & ideas and also responds to Vampiro recently calling him a liar. Here are some highlights of what Chris Jericho said about:

Wrestlers stealing his moves and gimmicks in WWE today and lashing out at CM Punk for doing so: "There seems to be a lack of respect for the forefathers who came in and did it first and it's not just [CM] Punk, it's a whole litany of guys from Miz to Cody Rhodes to Mason Ryan to Sin Cara to Kelly Kelly, everybody is stealing moves, looks, ideas. Brian Pillman once told me if you want to make it in wrestling you have to do something that nobody has done before and nobody is doing that and they are coming off as second rate copies of Chris Jericho, and that's maybe why these guys aren't striking and I watch it and think, 'Seriously, again?'

"A couple of years ago you had 'Miz 4, John Cena 0', where did that come from? Conspiracy Theory, where did that come from? Best in the World, where did that come from? Wearing suits, talking slow, using big words, using certain moves, you know Miz used the word "troglodyte" a few weeks ago and I'm like seriously? If there ever was a word associated with Chris Jericho that would be it. These guys have to start thinking of their own stuff and some times I see some of them and I'm like oh come on. It's not like it's influenced. At least give credit where credit is due."

To be honest I don't think Jericho is getting the fact that them "stealing" his ideas is supposed to be rather respectful than disrespectful and let's face it Y2J's done with his past gimmicks hell he said it himself if he's ever returning he's gonna have a new persona. So I think it's ok for guys like Mason Ryan to take from that gimmick and add it to their character. It might not be so creative but I don't see anything wrong with it. And I don't see how Kelly Kelly "stole" anything from him other than that Boston crab(Not the Walls of Jericho version) she did in that one submission match. As for The Miz he's been doing this whole suit talking slow thing even when Jericho was on TV. Hell he was doing it while he was allied with Y2J. You'd think Jericho at least talked to him about it if he feels it's so disrespectful.

What do you think of Chris Jericho's comments?

 

[SPR*VLN]

I dont believe Jericho feels disrespected, I just think he's just saying people need to reinvent themselves rather then gimmick jocking. Theres nothing wrong with taking qualities, but that isn't the case. Today wrestler don't just take qualities they take the entire gimmick. That's what he's addressing.

 

[theslop]

There are only so many moves and personas and ideas they can use. Can they try a little harder to come up with new ideas and so on? yeah. But I think jericho kind of complaining about it is a little too much. If I were in his shoes I would be honored and be like "hey thats pretty cool, hes trying to be me or like me, good luck kid" but thats just me.

 

[Poop Master Flex]

I understand where Jericho is coming from. I don't think he is so much upset about it as he is just stating a point that it gets boring to watch wrestlers who basically just rip off others in the past.

For example I don't like Jack Swagger one bit. He has a good look, is a great technical wrestler but to me it looks like he is ripping off Kurt Angle these days and as good as Swagger is, he is NO Kurt Angle. From the Ankle Lock to running up the ropes and suplexing his opponent he just comes off as a second rate Kurt Angle and he can be so much more.

Ziggler is in the same boat as more and more it seems like he is trying to be Mr. Perfect and once again he is NO Mr. Perfect. Ziggler is good in the ring and I just saw his interview from Monday, that is the first time Ziggler has shown me anything that felt he could be much more than another Mr. Perfect. The worst thing wrestlers can do is rip off others and in very few cases it can be done. Ric Flair ripped off Buddy Rogers but he added another depth to the nature boy character that made it work for him, same with Hogan ripping off Superstar Billy Graham, he took things from his character but mostly made the Hogan character his own. It's OK to take ideas from great superstars but carbon copies never work in the long run, maybe a few months here and there. Even Jericho ripped off other superstars, like his living legend gimmick was a rip off of Larry Zybysko which was a rip off of Bruno Sammartino, but they all took that idea and made it their own unlike Swagger who is a carbon copy of Kurt Angle.

To me its Jericho challenging these guys to be something different and try new things. If people didn't rip him off so blatantly I don't think he would even have said a word. There is a difference between using an old idea and ripping it off completely. If a fan has seen something a thousand times from 1 person why would they want to see the same thing from another?

 

[BigPoppaPunk]

People stealing moves and ideas has occured in wrestling ever since it's inception. Show me one wrestler that didn't "borrow" one idea or move from someone else. Jericho himself has done moves he saw other guys use. I guess by his own admission that is uncreative and lazy. Heck, back during his fued with HBK, he admitted he stole HBK's look and some of his moves. If that doesn't show you how hypocritical that logic is, then nothing will. He needs to stop taking it so personally and realize it's paying tribute to him.


One point I do agree with him on is wrestlers should try to be more original and unique. Unfortunately, even the most original guys use moves that someone else has done. If he uses a DDT, I guess that's stealing from Jake Roberts. If he uses a piledriver, I guess he's stealing from Jerry Lawler or Terry Funk. My point here is that each move was originated by someone other than the current wrestler using it. It's really no reason to get all bent out of shape about. Apparently though, Jericho sees it as wrestling blasphemy to do what every wrestler does in one way or another.

I'm a huge Jericho fan, but I definately think he's going overboard in trying to advocate for this. As long as the guy is making wrestling more popular and earning a living, I don't see a major problem. Kinda seems like a double standard IMO.

 

[Rammsteinerteen]

I don't believe his words is true. If it is, than I realize how ignorant Chris Jericho is. Copying moves in Professional Wrestling is almost existent everywhere. I'm sure Chris Jericho did not create the boston crab, and his code breaker is not exactly original, as I see many people do knees to faces; like gregory helms. Not only that, but Chris Jericho's "slow-talk" and 'suit-wearing" gimmick is directly from Nick Bockwonkel. He said so in his Biography DVD. It's either this is not true, or he's more of a hypocrite than the fans he calls.

PS: I hope he's only joking about these complaints, because Jericho is one of my favorite wrestlers ever and he sounds like a total douche.

 

[JWGunslinger]

I understand where Jericho is coming from. I don't think he is so much upset about it as he is just stating a point that it gets boring to watch wrestlers who basically just rip off others in the past.

For example I don't like Jack Swagger one bit. He has a good look, is a great technical wrestler but to me it looks like he is ripping off Kurt Angle these days and as good as Swagger is, he is NO Kurt Angle. From the Ankle Lock to running up the ropes and suplexing his opponent he just comes off as a second rate Kurt Angle and he can be so much more.

Ziggler is in the same boat as more and more it seems like he is trying to be Mr. Perfect and once again he is NO Mr. Perfect. Ziggler is good in the ring and I just saw his interview from Monday, that is the first time Ziggler has shown me anything that felt he could be much more than another Mr. Perfect. The worst thing wrestlers can do is rip off others and in very few cases it can be done. Ric Flair ripped off Buddy Rogers but he added another depth to the nature boy character that made it work for him, same with Hogan ripping off Superstar Billy Graham, he took things from his character but mostly made the Hogan character his own. It's OK to take ideas from great superstars but carbon copies never work in the long run, maybe a few months here and there. Even Jericho ripped off other superstars, like his living legend gimmick was a rip off of Larry Zybysko which was a rip off of Bruno Sammartino, but they all took that idea and made it their own unlike Swagger who is a carbon copy of Kurt Angle.

To me its Jericho challenging these guys to be something different and try new things. If people didn't rip him off so blatantly I don't think he would even have said a word. There is a difference between using an old idea and ripping it off completely. If a fan has seen something a thousand times from 1 person why would they want to see the same thing from another?

Exellently put by deanerandterry, being a Jerichoholic I am very familiar with his mindset when it comes to wrestling and being original. The way that Jericho did all of his stuff when coming up with his gimmicks and mannerisms circulates around one word, "Original". He believes that creating your own character without taking too much from past stars is how you get an end result that's entertaining and fresh. Sure most wrestlers take some of what past stars have done but what I believe Jericho is trying to get across and what I believe as well is that if you take something that you should build off it and make something of your own.

One of my favorite things about Chris is his passion for the sport and how when it comes to a gimmick change or a tweak to his character he puts everything into it trying to come up with the best new wrestler he can and that is part of what makes him so great. If any younger rising superstars want to take something from Chris Jericho to add to his arsenal, they should aspire to be as committed to being original as him because in my opinion that is one of the main reasons he is the legend he is today.

 

[MaxPlastic]

Dude, he's just 'working...' He's continuing to keep is name rumbling around the Pro Wrestling world while he's off recharging so that you guys will be like "I knew he was coming back *snort* It was as plain as day on the Internet!"

 

[Davi323]

There is also a big difference between Chris Jericho and a lot of the guys he calls out. Jericho will freely give credit to Nick Bockwinkel and others that inspired him, just like Ric Flair will be the first to tell you that the true Nature Boy is named Buddy Rogers, not Ric Flair. It's all about what you take credit for, and what you don't.

 

[Iversen]

I'd imagine it's more the number of people taking his ideas that would be annoying him. There are loads at the moment who have taken parts of his character.

On the other hand I wouldn't be surprised if he was just building something up for when/if he decides to return. Getting people talking about it already makes it bigger when it happens.

 

[keehlnate]

If stealing a move is crime, then a lot of superstars now will be guilty of stealing the DDT of Jake Roberts

Jericho has a point. The WWE should come up with new ideas that hasn't been done before. Although I don't remember any of the new gimmicks actually came from him. As for stealing his moves, come on all wrestlers do that now. Kurt Angle is actually whining about the same issue too.

 

[BigPoppaPunk]

Dude, he's just 'working...' He's continuing to keep is name rumbling around the Pro Wrestling world while he's off recharging so that you guys will be like "I knew he was coming back *snort* It was as plain as day on the Internet!"

If that's the case, it does keep his name circulating around. However, it does so in a very negative way. I hope for his sake he was working us, cause if he was serious, he's got issues. Ppl in wrestling have been stealing ideas and moves for years. It's not magically gonna stop b/c Jericho hates it. Every wrestler is influenced by their idols in the industry, and when they steal it's to honor them. So taking it as a personal shot is unnecessary and makes him look ignorant to the ways of wrestling(which can't be true)

Jericho is one of the all time greats in wrestling, so I'd have to agree this is a work to keep him in the fans mind. Otherwise, it comes off as a bitter rant that is pointless.

 

[The Suplexer Perfecter]

Oh for god's sake. Jericho is joking. He's stolen moves himself. He got the Code breaker by watching Naromichi Marifuji in Ring of Honor.

He mentions on commentary for his match against Ultimo Dragon on his DVD "stealing moves" is not a big deal.

 

[MetalFace DOOM]

This might come off as bias(and it is) but... I'm a Jericho-aholic so um... Whether he is wrong or not, i will condone it. And i aint coming out of rehab no time soon, in fact.. never . Is Jericho wrong for what he is saying? maybe... Is Jericho right in what he is saying? perhaps but...

I will assume this is work and him toying with us. If i were sitting at a table with Jericho and he told me this to my face i would be like.."Well... You admire HBK, and wanted to be like him" I mean..All these wrestlers are trying to be themselves at the end of the day but they are human as well.. meaning they have and had Wrestlers that they looked up too and try to resemble somewhat.

I really dont think that Jack Swagger is trying to be the next Kurt Angle, its just that they have some similarities as far as gimmick and moves to an extent. Same thing with Dolph Ziggler.. He isnt trying to be a "Mr Perfect" They just come off as similar.

Sure with Dolph its like "I am perfection" as mention in his theme song and with Swagger its "I'm the all american american" but if they are trying to be a carbon copy of Mr Perfect and Kurt Angle.. Then that should be more so blame on Vince, The Creative etc.. Not them.

Fun Fact- I didn't care to spit opinion on the so called "Move Stealing" that Jericho mention, because everybody mostly does the same moves and most of these moves are generic and the same.

Fun Fact 2- Jericho, I are forever a Jericho-aholic and my addiction to you as a drug wont go away but... Your gimmick and style was similar to an HBK, and in the way you carried yourself. Some even say a "Ric Flair". And hurry up and bring your ass back to you can take on a wrestler that kinda resembles you.. CM PUNK

 

[WTK]

Pro-Wrestling is to old to not steal somebodies moves..... I hate when egotistical wrestlers start blabbering about someone stealing there moves, you gotta realize, Wrestling has been around for damn near a Century, its almost impossible now to not have a move somebody hasn't used in the past......

 

[Klown_Karnage]

There are no original moves left. None. Use a move in professional wresting, chances are someone used it before you did and someone else will use it after you did. There may be the occasional "new twist" but come down to it, it's the same move that's been used before and will be used again. Deal with it. That being said, I recognize that Jericho thinks that those who originated these moves should be given the recognition they deserve. By the same token, what is a wrestler supposed to do to give that recognition? Is a wrestler pulling off a "signature maneuver" supposed to stop at the end, grab a mic, and say "this move originated by so-and-so"?

Likewise, Jericho's gripe about recycled ideas is something he's guilty of himself, as is nearly everyone in the pro wrestling world today and generations ago. There are only so many story lines and only so many ways of presenting them. Everything gets recycled eventually. I suppose that it's all about delivery under those circumstances. Jericho delivered on his material excellently, among the best, but there were others who were better before and after him.

All of that aside, I do agree he's probably playing with us, just trying to grab a little cheap press with an outworn argument. The spotlight is no longer on him since he left the WWE and he wants some of it back. That's nothing new, either.

 

[Dalek Rising]

When I read Jericho's interview, one thing stood in my mind... he's coming back, and maybe soon. He's also gonna use this complaining in a storyline. Jericho knows that in wrestling, things are stolen or recycled all the time. He's said it before. I believe this is a work and that it might be part of a slow build back into the WWE.

 

[MisterRob]

I think Jericho is definitely playing people, because he knows the internet community loves this kind of thing and they'll eat it right up. And here we are! That being said, though, I really do think he does have a point and I feel the worst culprit of this is the Miz. When the Miz was turning into a singles star and getting his push he totally followed Jericho in the fact he changed his appearance, even changed his wrestling attire EXACTLY like Jericho. And now he cuts promos like Jericho, is doing angles like Jericho, I'm surprised the guy doesn't do the Lionsault.

So yes, I do think this is just a "work" mostly, but I still think wrestlers DO need to start finding some originality and trying to think outside the box and re-invent things. That's likely why there's so few real stars around in the WWE (or wrestling for that matter).

 

[bxbigshow]

I don't think Jericho is working anyone. I feel he's just trying to challenge the current talent to be a bit more original. I mean yeah, Miz vs. Cena 4-0 was a rip of Jericho vs. Goldberg, but I found it entertaining while kowing it was a rip.

I feel Miz is the only one who "stole" from Jericho and made it work for him. The Boston Crab is a Boston Crab, he Rick Martel was using it in the 80's. The springboard moonsault is no longer 'new' to consider it just Jericho's.

 

[RicoLen]

Funny, I could have sworn that The Miz & Jericho were friends IRL?

I find what he is saying curious from a number of different perspectives. I would just dismiss it as chatter myself.

On the other hand, it's kind of annoying that people that come up with these interviews and prompt wrestlers to say stuff like this never followup with any other good questions, like, "WTF are you talking about?"

 

[Depakote]

To me, this is less about stealing moves, gimmicks, and catch phrases. Its more about not being original, new, and creative. Jericho raises a good point with this quote, "Brian Pillman once told me if you want to make it in wrestling you have to do something that nobody has done before and nobody is doing that..."

This is where I have to agree with him. If you look at all the greats in the history of this business, they were doing stuff that nobody had done before them or they took an old idea and made it better, made it their own. I think thats really the point Jericho's trying to get across here. Majority of the young guys are mirroring the past without really learning from it and making it their own.

 

[xBANEx]

I'd say it's probably one of two ways.

1. Total "work" just incase he does come back.

Or 2. He's more-so annoyed that people are talking bits and pieces from his character in the same generation as him. He's used some ideas to tweak his character with from guys in previous generations, but not the same one. He's barely even been gone a year and people are already copying "him"

 

[XXJJ]

The whole stealing moves is stupid. Everything has been done before.

I do understand him talking about guys stealing his gimmick and ideas. Punks slogan is very similiar to Jericho's.

 

[Good Golly It's Ollie]

Law #1 of fictious creations: Nothing is original.

Jericho sounds a bit too Nash-like here, yet months ago he leapt on Nash for attacking WWE's youth movement. What happened to the guy who was always putting guys like Gabriel and Morrison over?

Besides, this is just how it's done. Both WWE and TNA are 'guilty', if it is indeed a crime, of re-hashing old stuff - storylines and gimmicks both. There are not enough moves for everyone to have a totally unique finisher. I'd also not be surprised that WWE is telling them to do that stuff. Mason Ryan in particular hasn't stolen anything - it's not his fault he was born resembling Dave Batista.

This sounds weirdly out of character, or perhaps conversely he's being kayfabe in-character. What's with Y2J? Come on Jericho, don't be one of those guys.

 

[Hawk]

I dont believe Jericho feels disrespected, I just think he's just saying people need to reinvent themselves rather then gimmick jocking. Theres nothing wrong with taking qualities, but that isn't the case. Today wrestler don't just take qualities they take the entire gimmick. That's what he's addressing.

I think a lot of that falls on creative and what they give to the wrestlers. How much freedom or influence do wrestlers have these days when they are supposed to recite scripted promos? As for clothing and overall gimmick, I think that again, falls on creative. Not saying wrestlers don't have individual influence and control over certain mannerism, but I think Jericho shouldn't be pointing out any frustrations at individual wrestlers.

He's starting to come across as a bitter.