Has WWE Blown It With Dolph Ziggler?

[karanbest4]

If there is one thing that the pro wrestling blogosphere can agree on these days it is that Dolph Ziggler is fantastic. Unfortunately all of his hard work will probably result in nothing and he can thank the WWEcreative team for that.

I was never a big Ziggler fan and used to tune when he first hit the scene a few years back. I never got him during his WWE world title run and quite frankly, never gave him a shot. But something has opened me up to this guy in recent weeks to the point where I am now convinced he may be the best worker on the roster and I am not the only one.


Follow the social media networks duringRAW or read any of the hundreds if not thousands of pro wrestling blogs online and you will find a groundswell of support for Ziggler in recent weeks. It slowly started last year but really peaked with this television series against Randy Orton. Now the man is hitting it out of the park weekly and everyone is noticing…well everyone except the people that matter, the WWE creative team.

In what has to be the most perplexing booking I have seen in a long time, it almost appears that the WWE brass are doing everything they can to stop his momentum. From booking him to lose four times in a row to CM Punk at the Royal Rumble to taking the pin in a Six-Pack Challenge, the WWE appear determined to end his momentum immediately and that just stinks.

Ziggler would be a top guy for life in another era. His amateur wrestling credentials are impeccable but guess what? You’d never even know he was a standout collegiate wrestler for one of the best programs in the country if you didn’t do a little investigative work online. Rarely are his credentials mentioned which is ironic because in any other era, they would be his calling card, and the man would be booked as one of the most serious threats in the company.

What Ziggler has that separates him from even some of the most legendary credentialed pioneers is that he has “it.” In the ring, Ziggler looks like a star, wrestles like a star, talks a star, walks like a star, and shockingly is not booked a star. Ziggler is booked as a doormat, a stepping stone, and what I would call a high-level jobber. For a guy this good, his booking is just downright criminal.

But what is most egregious of all is that the WWE has presented him consistently as this doormat. No matter how much better Ziggler gets, no matter how much support he gets outside of the WWE, and no matter how ready he is to be an elite WWE player, it’ll never work. See The Miz, Jack Swagger, Sheamus, and countless others over the last several years as prime examples of guys that the WWE tried to elevate to elite status that never caught on. The reason these guys and Ziggler won’t catch on is that nobody will ever take them seriously, thanks to their booking history. CM Punk even with his monster push is underperforming in some areas and that all goes back to his prior booking in my opinion.
As much as people like to complain about the WWE booking in recent years, thisis the biggest problem of all. Their lack of ability to develop stars into big time money players is hurting the company and will continue to harm them for years to come. Instead of molding and protecting young blue chippers like successful territories and promotions before them, they beat them down into jokes. By the time someone like Ziggler is ready to get the big push, the fans have seen him jobbed out for the last few years and refuse to take him seriously as a money player, thus hurting Ziggler’s ability to draw money at the box office. It happens all of the time and doesn’t appear to change.

Could Ziggler break this cycle? Anything is possible but it is a tough road. One thing Ziggler has over past failed attempts to promote is the ability to steal the show. Maybe with enough great matches, fans can forget the Dolph Ziggler that was pinned four times at the Rumble and beaten twice on RAW in the Six Pack Challenge?

I hope it happens and I am rooting for the guy but the reality is that the chances of Ziggler or anyone caught up in this booking cycle of parity has of climbing the ladder and staying there is not very good.

SOURCE : CLICK HERE

 

[Ryberg]

Nothing personal to the Ziggler fans but Dolph Ziggler blew it for Dolph Ziggler, not the WWE! WWE has given him every chance in the world to get over he just can't. You all think he has the "it" factor but obviously he doesn't!He's not good on the mic, and has never gotten over. He gets less reaction than Swagger.

 

[RubberDingyRapids]

World title run? hardly call it that.

The problem is he has got nothing to do now because RTWM has started and he is needed in the EC, so im sure after that he will go into a legitimate feud after that. the problem is that there is not enough top faces that he can feud with, all the top faces have got there feuds setting up for mania. now who is DZ going to face at mania?

There isnt anyone so i think he will win MITB at mania, and he will have a big feud after that. maybe a short program with Foley as well, but im hoping he ditches Vicky, turns face and cashes it in on a Heel and loses the match ( its got to happen soon )

 

[LoudClearVoice]

Part of it has been the timing. He was starting to get a push right around the time Jericho made his return. So, now, he's pushed off to the side to let the Jericho-Punk feud take place.

I really like Dolph Ziggler but honestly, I think the heel heat is getting is because of Vicki Guerrero. If he were to leave Vicki and try to be a heel on his own, I just don't see it. He's good in the ring but needs to get better on the mic. If he could get a little better on the mic, I see him getting over. If not, then he might end up stuck as a midcarder.

 

[Psykohurricane55]

Nothing against Dolph because, i think he'S a future main event talent and when they finally need somebody to step up to the plate, i'm sure he going to be the first one to step up but the fact is that his fan really do have a short memory. Dolph Ziggler was mostly put in the same position he was last year on Smackdown. They needed a good performer that would look credible in a throwaway match at the royal rumble and right now that's his spot.

That's not saying that he will never get to the top of the mountain and become a huge star because he got the star power, it'S just that now, being stuck with Vickie kinda make him look more like a mid card talent.

 

[James]

Hmm let me think. I love this logic that most of you people on the IWC have. Once upon a time you loved to say don't build the guy up too, but now you all are constantly saying so and so and so blew it and are finished. Can you all make up your mind for once? I for one think that it is not over for him, drew, swagger, miz, or Cody. The WWE is simply building them up and giving them more time. Look at how much time it took for Bret, Shawn, Austin, and Jericho to become the top guys? They were built over a period of time and they simply had it! They knew that they could be counted on.

Look at Brock Lesnar, look at Bobby Lashley. Where are they at now? WWE threw them right into the light and now they're gone and hell neither one of them were talented for that matter.

Stop making a thread every week just because a wrestler doesn't win the title or has lost to someone.

 

[Daniel]

What? The stupidity of some people never fails to astound me. If Kofi had been pinned, I have no doubt that this thread would be titled "How Is Kofi A Believable #1 Contender?!". If Miz was pinned, it would be called "Is The Miz the Next Mr. Kennedy?" (oh, wait...). You know when people talk about how the IWC takes things out of proportion? Well this is a prime example of that.

Ziggler just had a world title match at the Royal Rumble. After losing that match, he went on to have a good showing in the Royal Rumble match. The next night, he was announced as a contender for the WWE Championship at the Elimination Chamber. Last night, he lost a match and suddenly it'S "DOLPH ZIGGLER IS BEING BURIED".

Guess what? Wrestlers lose matches. That's part and parcel of being a wrestler. For a heel, it's especially common. It doesn't signify a burial, or even bad booking. It's just life.

 

[hbkmark]

Let's just slow things down. Our attention span is just way too short on Dolph Ziggler. He has built up respect with good matches and his mic skills have gone from being able to introduce himself and shake hands to a good solid cocky heel. He needs to take the next step in that regard and he will be a star.

Look at how long it took pretty much every superstar to go all the way. Have you seen the promos of "Stunning Steve Austin"? Do you remember the worse-than-generic promos of Shawn Michaels of The Rockers? Hunter Hearst Helmsley was blander than Michael McGillicutty.
There was this lame Rocky Maivia kid who even took a while!

These guys all found a niche and then exploded. We just seem to want a guy to debut and become huge in a month....then we get sick of having him "shoved down our throats" and we turn on him.

 

[dannyirons89]

I for one I dont understand why he was not givin the belt at rumble he is the best heel in the business today besides Chris Jericho and for those of you who say he has no mic skill look at the show where he tore Mick Foley apart it was one of the best heel promos ive herd in a long time i think he just need to get that push to the main event but everyone is to worried about getting Zach Ryder on tv (great in the ring but bad gimmick) for all the doubters just wait to see what #heel will do

 

[ilapierre]

Karanbest4, right off the bat you build a faulty foundation for your argument. You immediately assume that there is one thing the pro wrestling blogosphere can agree on and that is that Dolph Ziggler is fantastic. I don't agree. I would think it would be realistic to claim that a lot of fans don't think he's fantastic. It would be easier to argue that fans see him as average or not as bad or green as other guys WWE is trying to make us believe are stars like The Miz or Sheamus. But besides his 'look' Dolph Ziggler is far from fantastic.

Second, he doesn't have just the creative team to thank for how bad he's being booked lately. He has Triple H and Stephanie. They have the final say with everything.

Third, you're trying to tell us that in a few weeks you've come to the conclusion that Dolph Ziggler is the best guy on the WWE roster. First off, that wouldn't take anybody that talented or entertaining. Another thing, social media networks and wrestling blogs are full of idiots. Blogging is essentially verbal diarrhea. People think one thing one minute and then change their mind the next. It's a he said, she said world and people obsessed with their social media tend to be extremely fickle. Another thing is that Ziggler losing to Punk is no big deal. How stupid would it be to have Ziggler out of the blue beat the WWE world champion? That's no way to build up anybody as credible.

Dolph Ziggler would be a 'top guy for life' in another era. Like which era? The Lou Thez era? The Bruno Sammartino era? The Hulk Hogan era? The Attitude Era? If you can't cut it in the crappiest of the crap PG era, then which era could you possibly excel in? Oh, I see where you're going. You think Ziggler would be a top guy for life in the wrestling eras that are to come. The way wrestling entertainment is going, "jobbers for life in most other eras' like Dolph ZIggler will be headlining wrestling events.

And who gives a shit about amateur wrestling credentials? Do most fans really watch wrestling to watch the wrestling? Maybe wrestling fans today but i know more old time wrestling fans who don't watch anymore who would like to see a balance of wrestling and entertainment instead of just bland wrestling. I know I'd prefer to watch a guy with the natural charisma of Scott Hall or Roddy Piper before i'd ever want to sit through a dreary Chris Benoit or Dean Malenko match.

I seriously think that Dolph Ziggler is the OP of this thread. I mean, c'mon, it'd be like if 15 years ago there was a thread about Jim Powers being a star in any other era. The only human alive who could have thought that would be that jobber for life Jim Powers himself. I could just see Jim Powers now preaching about how he is the one guy in wrestling who has 'it'. Don't get me wrong though, in reality Jim Powers had the look. He could have been booked as a mid card guy, he really had some things going looks wise. But the guy couldn't entertain and that's why he never amounted to anything. Imagine if wrestling was full of Jim Powers-like guys in the 1990s. The PG era would have existed 10 years before its time.

If you think the booking is bad, don't blame the team. Blame Triple H and Stephanie. The whole focus of WWE is to make Triple H as big as Hogan. Triple H and Stephanie run WWE the same way Vince and Hogan did 20 years ago. Triple H rarely gets beat, he puts himself in all the 'must see matches', he lets his buddies get the big pushes and brings in his old buddies for a crappy one match feud. Triple H does to WWE what Hogan did to WCW except what Hogan did for WCW was temporarily amazing and good for business. Nothing Triple H has done has been good for business. He and Stephanie squash every wrestler who has a chance. Ziggler, Miz, Morrison, Punk etc etc. I still don't believe these guys would amount to a whole lot anyway, but the main reason they don't is because WWE creative is essentially hijacked by the two biggest asswods in wrestling history. Whoever books anything in WWE has to do so keeping in mind that they could easily be out of a job if Triple H isn't portrayed as some sort of wrestling god. Sure Cena and Jericho and even Punk can somewhat outshine Triple H sometimes. But in the end Trips is always booked to pin them and outdo them on the mic.

If you feel so strongly about WWE ruining its future then i'd advise you to quit watching in protest. I quit watching regularly in 2003 and my non-wrestling obsessed life has been a lot more fun than waiting for WWE to give us some consistently awesome programming.

 

[George Steele's Barber]

WWE has gotten way more out of Ziggler than I would have ever imagined. I had his ceiling as Bob Holly about 6 months ago and he has surpassed that. His look is nothing special, especially for a heel. His mic skills have improved from dreadful but he still sounds like he is reading from a teleprompter. He has the nasally voice of a teenage nerd. Voice is huge in pro wrestling. Successful wrestlers sound like men with enormous "grapefruits". Hogan, Dibiase Sr., Perfect, Rude, SCSA, HBK, HHH, The Rock all had great voices for the business.
Ziggler's fine in the ring but that doesn't mean much, if you can't separate yourself in other ways you might as well be Evan Bourne.

I'm glad for him that he has gotten some following from the IWC (he seems like a decent guy) but he really needs to find a way to separate himself with his character and personality if he is ever going to break through as a face or heel.

 

[bjarvis]

Ziggler really has done nothing wrong in the last few months.

He worked double duty, put on great matches, has now found an ability on the mic and worked World Title matches.

Ziggler will not win the World Title because the Road to WrestleMania begun at Survivor Series and Punk who is probably the #2 guy right now is confirmed for the WWE Title match, and Jericho is just too reliable to ignore.

Ziggler needs a big WrestleMania match. Personally I'm hoping he gets a match with Foley due to their argument a few weeks back starting up something, maybe kick starting with Vickie arguing with Foley and ordering Ziggler to go after him. But Ziggler will definitely hold ANOTHER World Title, most likely this year.

 

[LoudClearVoice]

....but im hoping he ditches Vicky, turns face and cashes it in on a Heel and loses the match ( its got to happen soon )

I think ditching Vicki at least at this point would be foolish. She is the one who draws virtually all the heel heat whenever there is a promo or interview involving or Dolph Ziggler or when he's introduced. If he ever gets over, I think they could consider getting rid of Vicki but right now as much as many people hate her, she's really helping DZ.

 

[Jack-Hammer]

I'm just not seeing how WWE or Ziggler has "blown it".

When Dolph Ziggler won the United States Championship, Ziggler started to develop himself as a character and an on-screen presence. Everyone knew that Ziggler had the in-ring ability, anyone who tries to say that the man can't work damn well inside the ring is either blind or borderline crazy, but Ziggler wasn't much of a character nor were his promo skills anything to crow about. Over the course of his run as US champ, WWE gave Ziggler some actual time on the microphone. He had some promo segments on Raw sometimes and it seemed pretty obvious that he'd made a good amount of progress. It continued further until the best thing that could have happened to Ziggler happened: he started getting good reactions from the crowd without any sort of real participation from Vickie Guerrero. It's gotten to the point in the past month or so that Ziggler has garnered very solid heat from the Raw crowds. His promo with Foley was the promo of his career thus far and it drew major heat from the fans in attendance.

Now, fast forward to just a bit after Ziggler drops the United States Championship to Zack Ryder. He faces Randy Orton & CM Punk in a series of great, competitive matches that help make him look like a star. On a couple of occassions, Ziggler manages to score some almost completely clean pinfall victories over both Orton & Punk. He then goes on to feud with CM Punk over the course of a month, maybe a little more, for the WWE Championship. Approximately 9 days go, Dolph Ziggler faced CM Punk on one of WWE's biggest ppvs of the year in a match for the WWE Championship. The following Monday on Raw, he's announced as one of the participants in the Raw Elimination Chamber match for the WWE Championship.

So let's see...Ziggler is someone that's improved his overall game by getting pretty good on the mic and presenting himself in a way that's finally getting him some great heat from the live crowds with or without Vickie Guerrero. He's spent the last few weeks of 2011 and all of 2012 thus far having matches against a couple of the top stars in the company, feuding with the WWE Champion for the title itself and has started to become a regular fixture on WWE ppvs over the course of the past several months.

So, based on all of this, you're suggesting that WWE has somehow dropped the ball with Ziggler? I don't see how that could be reasonably construed. I understand that some fans aren't going to be as high on Ziggler as others and some will flat out hate him, that's how it is with every wrestler. If anything, Dolph Ziggler has been an overall better pro wrestler in the past 3 or 4 months than he has during his entire time in WWE. Will Ziggler win the EC match? Probably not, but that doesn't mean that he's not going to be out of the title picture for too long. It's likely he'll have an opportunity to get right back into things at WM. While this is purely speculation on my part, I think Ziggler will be in the MITB match and has a good chance of winning it.

The WWE has taken its time with Dolph Ziggler and I see nothing wrong with that. They've been doing the same thing with Cody Rhodes and it's turned out great for him.

 

[H33LTurn]

Fans and bookers alike have such a twisted mindset on what makes a superstar. Back in the old days guys didnt need title runs or be in the main event to be relevant. Its like watching a Miami Heat game only because of Lebron James. You know if you get rid of all the people instead of the star player you cant have a fully functional team. The same thing goes for WWE. There are guys who need to be around just for the look, or just because they can wrestle. Or just because they have a unique fan base. Ziggler is just serving his purpose year round, whether its in the main event or the midcard division. It should be about the character, not the credentials. And if you're going to take a guy and shove him into the main event spot permanently you make sure hes at the age where he wont be spending one or two decades in the same spot. Punk (even though I hate him) is a great example. Hes 38 years old. Even though hes at the peak of his career, ideally hes only expected to work for two or three more years. Ziggler is 31. When you give a guy a main event build you cant take him off of it so easily. Cena can never go back to the US title division without looking utterly ridiculous. Ziggler has plenty of time to get to the main event. Do you really want to see 9 years of main event Ziggler after seeing how bad 6 years of Cena was?

 

[TakerDakSide]

Two answers: Yes & No.

Just allow me to explain:

As we all know Zigglers push came one he won the U.S. Championship 2011. After that he was pushed to contend for the WWE Title. Now, the tune is down a bit. Let's not count him out just yet.

The Negative side: The same thing happned to him 2010-2011. After he dropped the Intercontinental Title, he moved on to the WHC vs Edge. But just as it seemed like Ziggler was a top player they (WWE) dropped him again.

The issue was that Ziggler as moved Up & Down the card just twice. My estimate is that the WWE doesn't know what to do with him as of yet. Factors that pephaps contributed to that was Jericho, The Rock, Booker etc...If this type of thing (Up & down the card) keeps happening then I don't know whether Mr. Ziggler has a future or not in WWE. In this the WWE kind of blown it but at least they pushed him at all so this may lead to (if things go right) Zigger's first World title eventually.

 

[The 1-2-3 Killam]

I love fair-weather fans and their inability to stick to anything for more than a few weeks! Last month Dolph Ziggler was the hottest thing in wrestling, with a bright future and no limits on the horizon... This week, because he lost at the Rumble and got pinned (by Chris Jericho no less), WWE "blew its chance" with him. I will never understand how people can come to these snap conclusions week after week, but maybe that's because I've been a wrestling fan for long enough to remember the days when it took patience to develop a wrestler's career. I guess I can understand the shotgun mentality of being a fan in this generation, since the only way people get pushed these days is with a briefcase and a lackluster World title run...

Curt Hennig spent almost six years struggling in the under-card of AWA and WWF before debuting the "Mr. Perfect" gimmick and starting to rise in the WWF ranks in the late 80s. And that was AFTER all the training and work he did in the no-name promotions of the day... With a decent gimmick he took his character to new levels, even having a high-profile feud with Hulk Hogan over the WWF title - although he would never actually win World Championship gold. A few years ago he became a Hall of Famer, but it took him over a decade to hone his character and become truly "great" in the people's eyes.

Ric Flair also struggled for years in the AWA and NWA to develop himself. Overweight, with brown hair and no recognizable gimmick, it wasn't until a near-fatal plain crash and his miraculous recovery that he started to gain a following. A full decade after joining the AWA, he would finally enter into a program for a Heavyweight title, taking the "Nature Boy" gimmick to new levels of greatness.

Billy Gunn spent a few years in a mediocre tag team with his brother, before breaking out and forming the New Age Outlaws. And that was AFTER a terrible "Rockabilly" gimmick with the Honkey Tonk Man... A year after that the NAO joined up with Degeneration X and made history. As one of the all-time great tag teams, the Outlaws won gold and went down in the books. After that...Gunn was relegated to a mid-card talent with a few lackluster gimmicks and programs before making his way to TNA, and more of the same...

I bring up those three because they are Superstars most often compared to Dolph Ziggler. Hennig and Flair are greats, and perfect examples of hard work, dedication, and slow creative build paying off. You pay your dues, develop your following, and eventually -if you're good enough and have enough managerial support - you become great. I listed BIlly Gunn because he's a perfect example of a guy who got pushed in the Outlaws, but had no real longevity on top with the company. That's often what happens when creative selects a star, pushes him too far too fast, and then runs out of ideas because the gimmick they strapped him with could only support him for so long.

Dolph Ziggler spent two years training with OVW after a successful amateur career at both the high school and college levels. He worked with the awful Spirit Squad gimmick to get exposure, and returned after more training time in OVW to a moderate success in WWE's under-card. Since then he's held US and IC title gold and done an excellent job with all his reigns. His program with Edge was his first real main event level success, and regardless of the short title reign - which actually served a purpose despite most people's complaints - it proved he could hang with top players both on the mic and in the ring. But last year, after his feud with Edge, Ziggler struggled to find a place. He was drafted to Raw, changed his hair color, changed it back, and held the US title for no better reason than he had nothing else to do. But what that did was keep him relevant, allow him to continue working on his character, and grow into his own (with the help of VIckie Guerrero's enormous heel heat). After finally entering into a WWE title feud with CM Punk late in 2011, it appears as though Ziggler has finally "made it" to the top.

Ziggler wasn't going to win the title in 2011, and he wasn't going to win it at the Royal Rumble. We all KNEW that, so I'm not sure why there's so much doubt on his future because of these losses. Ziggler's time is not at this year's WrestleMania, and that is WWE's main focus right now, as it should be. I'm sure he'll have a solid match and come off it looking strong for the future, but this isn't the Mania he's going to "win it all". So that being said, what else could they possibly have done? Rock vs Cena will happen in the main event. CM Punk vs. Chris Jericho will happen for the WWE Championship. Triple H vs Undertaker will happen for the streak. Sheamus will challenge whoever is the World Champion. Randy Orton and Wade Barrett will likely end their feud. So what else is there?

Likely, Ziggler will be a part of the Money in the Bank match; he may win, he may lose. But please, for the love of god...stop freaking out. A couple losses and a lack of direction going into a PACKED WrestleMania is not the end of his career. The longer they stretch out his time in the upper-midcard the better for him in the long term. There is no reason to throw him overboard and start pointing fingers at creative for "dropping the ball" at this point. Punk, Jericho, Cena, and Kane are the primary focus of the Raw brand right now...Ziggler can't always be the most important. Your fair-weather attitude is both highly ignorant...and slightly hilarious. John Cena wasn't on Raw this week - you think maybe creative dropped the ball on his career?

 

[TheOneTheyCallOn]

Ziggler just had a world title match at the Royal Rumble. After losing that match, he went on to have a good showing in the Royal Rumble match. The next night, he was announced as a contender for the WWE Championship at the Elimination Chamber. Last night, he lost a match and suddenly it'S "DOLPH ZIGGLER IS BEING BURIED".

Guess what? Wrestlers lose matches. That's part and parcel of being a wrestler. For a heel, it's especially common. It doesn't signify a burial, or even bad booking. It's just life.

This right here pretty much sums up my feelings on this, but to elaborate on my part a bit more, no I do not think in any way shape or form that WWE has 'blown it' with Ziggler. Just because he hasn't won the belt yet really means nothing. As Sanka said, he competed for the title, a few times now, had a great run in the rumble and is maintaining himself pretty well in the title picture. I've noticed that with some people if a wrestler doesn't win the strap their first time out then it obviously will not happen, this is not the case, WWE could be testing him to see how he does in the main event before giving it to him (i wont count his last title victories). But considering that Ziggler has gone from a member of the spirit squad to what he is today is nothing short of impressive and I think he has a very bright future ahead of him.

 

[Ryberg]

WWE has gotten way more out of Ziggler than I would have ever imagined. I had his ceiling as Bob Holly about 6 months ago and he has surpassed that. His look is nothing special, especially for a heel. His mic skills have improved from dreadful but he still sounds like he is reading from a teleprompter. He has the nasally voice of a teenage nerd. Voice is huge in pro wrestling. Successful wrestlers sound like men with enormous "grapefruits". Hogan, Dibiase Sr., Perfect, Rude, SCSA, HBK, HHH, The Rock all had great voices for the business.
Ziggler's fine in the ring but that doesn't mean much, if you can't separate yourself in other ways you might as well be Evan Bourne.

I'm glad for him that he has gotten some following from the IWC (he seems like a decent guy) but he really needs to find a way to separate himself with his character and personality if he is ever going to break through as a face or heel.

Well said and THANK YOU!!!!! Ziggler has skills,the skills to be a high talent jobber! They need them on every level of wrestling ladder. IWC is in love with the guy but in reality he's just a over-hyped modern day Iron Mike Sharpe. LOL actually their faces look very similar.

And people will say DB doesn't have mic skills! The guy has been in the WWE LESS THAN Ziggler and improved his skills fast and actually get a reaction now. Something Ziggler doesn't get without Vicki.

 

[sdaniel1977]

Ziggler is just another two bit heel to go along with the rest of the crop of two bit heels they have in the locker room. Every heel they've hired in the past 3-5 years namely Barrett,Swagger,ADR, Ziggler, and any other that falls in with them need to go back and watch tapes from the 80's. Look at the heels from then, mainly Flair and the Horsemen, Ric Rude, Ted Dibiase. Those guys were heels, this new breed is a sad comparative.

 

[TLK]

^ Same can be said for most of the faces, but that's another thread entirely.

I enjoy watching Ziggler's matches. I think he's a great worker and a hell of a seller. I'm worried about his charisma/mic skills/ability to get over without Vickie, though. It's a good sign that they've put him in some main event matches as of late, and that he's held his own against the current best.

 

[playmaker21]

Just another case of someone getting a shitty gimmick out of the gate (Spirit Squad) and fans never forgetting it. Ziggler is a good worker but does nothing on the mic. He has a great physique but terrible hair. His entire look and act is that of a mid-carder. I'd give him a hair cut, put him in $5,000 suits, and make him into a Gigolo character.

 

[Uncle Phatso]

Ziggler would be a top guy for life in another era. His amateur wrestling credentials are impeccable but guess what? You’d never even know he was a standout collegiate wrestler for one of the best programs in the country if you didn’t do a little investigative work online. Rarely are his credentials mentioned which is ironic because in any other era, they would be his calling card, and the man would be booked as one of the most serious threats in the company.

You must be doing the wrong investigative work online. Kent state isn't some monster wrestling team in the usa. Trust me, dude I live in Ohio. Osu, during Nick's time were better. Nick was about the only thing on the team that was really stellar. If you are however talking about St. Edwards, the longest ever streak of 13 ohio highschool Division one champs. You are correct, he along with Ufc fighter Grey maynard helped start that dynasty.


I just wanted to point this out to people.

 

[AwesomeRko]

This is typical IWC, the guy got pinned in a six man match featuring some of the most talented superstars in WWE atm. Punk and Y2J were never gonna get pinned, Kofi needs to look like a credible threat, Miz has already done his bit jobbing to Kofi to help him in that department so realistically we were down to either Ziggler or Truth for the pin and Truth got inured anyway so who knows what might have happened, it means nothing.

He did excellently in his fued with Punk and imo is the most improved superstar on the mic this year, he puts a lot of character into his promos is always well spoken and pulls of the cocky, jock persona to a tee. I fail to see how he 'needs' Vickie to get heat when recently and certainly during the Punk fued he carried around 90% of the mic work himself aided only by the awful 'excuse me', introduction from Vickie if anything hes at the stage now where shes holding im back. To complement this is in ring ability is amongst the best in the company, he consistently wrestles five star matches, has a great work ethic (2 matches in some recent PPV's anyone?) and is probably the best seller of moves in the company.

I don't think its a cae of Ziggler getting depushed its more just unfortunate for him that his championship momentum conincided with Y2J's return who was always going to fued with Punk over the title. (Him or Miz are a good shout the money in the bank at mania as well imo.)

Expect to see Ziggler back in the main event soon after Wrestlemania.

 

[Richard Blonoff]

Way too soon to call this.

He only started his main event push about a month or so ago. He had the wins over Punk on TV and lost on PPV. Fairly common to lose in your first shot at the strap these days, yeah he had a world title run but people dispute that as legit.

He is just having to take a back seat to Jericho right now. They gave him his push at the wrong time