Has the Rock's recent return exposed his shortcomings as a talker?

[Uncle Chester]

Before his long awaited comeback to the WWE The Rock was touted by many fans as a better promoist than any regular performer on the WWE roster. He was a posterboy for an era many fans consider to be significantly better than our current one and many fans hyped his talking skills to be far superior than anything that was the by-product of the PG-ERA, but I strongly feel as if his recent promos have seriously damaged his status as an unwordly talker.

The Rock's first promo back was tremendous and had us contemplating what we've been missing since he left the E' but each week his promo's lost that certain effect we felt on the first night. The cacthphrases became increasingly tedious and unnecessary, which had me questioning whether the Rock''s promo's contained enough substance and originality to keep them sufficiantly interesting.

After watching some youtube clips I notice a change in the Rock from 'calm' Rock to 'hyper' Rock and realize that 'hyper' Rock seems to rely much on catchphrases as oppossed to legitimate content and I truely believe this summation can be easily applied to the Rock in 2011. It seems as though the reason I've been distanced further and further from the belief of Rock's invincibility as a promoist.

Do you think the Rock's promo's rely too much on catchphrases raher than actual substance?

 

[Yrrab]

While I agree that after having not seen any promo from the Rock for several years had me in the same mindset, I think what's happened is that it's exposed Cena's mic skills for what they really are - amazing.

Whenever Rock goes into hyper mode, as you put it, that's when the catch phrases come out, sure. But he also comes up with some pretty amazing stuff on the fly. I'm also positive that the main reason that people tend to enjoy his promo's are due to the catch phrases and how riled up he gets during the promo before delivering them.

But I think the real story here is how incredible Cena has done at firing back. You have guys like Hogan who complained immediately that WWE was burying it's top star - I think the WWE knew Cena could handle it and that's why they went that route.

 

[Azane]

When you watch a Rock promo, you're waiting to hear the catchphrase, look how into it the crowd is. You can't tell me 40,000 people are say "IF YOU SMELL" right along with Rocky the second he pops it out, because they're bored.

Being limited to a non-wrestling role also limits how much he can say. The only major short comings that Rock has as of now, are "via satelite".

 

[Calderownz]

I think it's more a case of rust. But the fact of the matter is that his promo with that little Cena fan via satellite was very entertaining to me and didn't use many catchphrases.

He just isn't around enough to be used to going off the cuff. It's something that's hard to prepare for. Especially when you have set the bar for yourself so high. The bar for The Rock is so high that he would have a better time getting adjusted in the ring than on the mic. However, it was awful, by any means.

Yeah, he relies on catchphrases quite a bit. However, he never failed to get a decent point across and WWE always had the soundbites needed for the pre-match montages.

 

[hollowpoint]

The Rock, without a shadow of a doubt, is the best on the mic. He's an all time great on the mic. When you say you watched some YouTube clips, how many did you watch? There are a ton on there and all of them are Fn hilarious! The whole substances vs catchphrases is more of one in the same. You see, he incorporates his catch phrases into whoever he's talking about. That's what he's always done and that's what he did with Cena. You say he wasn't original, but he used terms like Fruity Pebbles, Homeless Power Ranger, he even mocked his "you can't see me" face wave. The Peek a boo line was hilarious. All were never heard before. The point is with the Rock, he talks smack about Superstars. That's what made him such a great on the mic.

 

[CarlSinclair]

I am sorry but I totally disagree with you.

Each of the Rock's promos were as entertaining as anything that has been on tv for years in the WWE. He had the crowd with him each time and he without doubt out popped Cena.

The only one that kind of bored me was the one with Kid Cena but that was mainly because it went on way too long.

As for Cena, he did better than usual I will admit, I even think he may have written SOME of his own stuff but his problem is always that the Fed has him spouting the normal shit about hustle loyality and respect and all the other crpa required for his kid fans to buy his fruity pebble power ranger t-shirts.

Cena has the capacity to be mega on the mic and get an ultimate reaction that could blow anyone away.. for example listen to the heat he had in his rap/promo on Taker back on Smackdown when Cena was a Heel.

That crowd wanted to murder him. It was in Chicago but still.

 

[Mr. Artistic guy]

The point is with the Rock, he talks smack about Superstars. That's what made him.. great on the mic.

This. Y'know in Rock's day there really was none of this hoity toity emotional promo crap. What happened is with The Rock you lined them up and he knocked him down in spectacular fashion. You can call it an advancement or an evolution of the business, that these guys now all talk about their "mutual respects" and their "looked up to you". Rock never had to deal with this stuff, and so when Rock who, btw did anyone mention he was gone for seven years, came back wanting to talk smack and all John Cena wanted to do was be diplomatic, you can understand if he wasn't quite up to scratch on that part of his game. Hell he even tried delivering an emotional promo, his second one since coming back, and everybody was like "he sounds like a child crying over a toy" despite the fact it's how Cena talks half the time. I think he got cut a raw deal by a bunch of guys standing at the pulpit waiting to scream out that he isn't as good as we thought he was. And the sad thing is.... I think a lot of people wanted to do it because they know, when the whole thing is resolved, John Cena will still be here Rocky won't.

And I just want to address this other bit in particular. The promo before mania. The one where so many were claiming Cena "owned" The Rock. Now putting yourself in that position and bearing in mind that The Rock only had one line in which to respond to a 6 minute onslaught from Cena, what single line would you have made him say to counter-act everything that had come in opposition of him? Sorry but it did annoy me seeing so many people jump on the bandwagon without assessing the situation better.

I guess you could say if his short-fall as a speaker is anything it's that he hasn't mastered the ability to do these Jeff Jarrett promo's as I call them (named after Jarrett in TNA early 2010 if anyone else remembers. Every week it was "Sting how long have I known you, we go way back man. Man I've never seen you act like this Sting. Sting! OK I'm gonna use your real name. Steve. Steve come here and face me like a man. Come on Steve." But anyway. The difference is Rock is the best as doing what he does best, if that makes sense. Cena is good at a lot of stuff but he's not the best at anything.... except polarizing the audience.

Look people can say he's fallen from grace but for me I just look at it like this. Rock isn't really a fluid character, he is what he is, an smash-mouth but what he is is pure greatness. Unfortunately what he is wasn't prepared for a battle where John Cena wouldn't allow him to play to his strengths. That's how I see it. So yeah it seemed Cena was outplaying Rock a lot of the time, but not on a level playing field.

 

[SomeAreSet]

His promos aren't really worse than it was.The fans just set the bar too high and they built The Rock up to be God-like.That's what happens with fans who are so caught up with the Attitude-era hype.So it's not Rock's fault but the fans' faults for thinking that he would blow the roof off the arena every Monday.

I think his promos are terrific.The point of the promo is to get the fans pumped up and he does that to perfection.As for his catchphrases,well,if it ain't broke,don't fix it.The problem is that a large number of the fans are so adamant that the current superstars have such shitty promos and they expect The Rock to tear all of them new assholes.Turns out that hey,the current superstars are actually pretty damn good at doing promos,so it makes The Rock look less amazing.

 

[GameOver]

For me The Rock isn't as entertaining as he was b4 but that was a totally different era and different opponents and a mindset of do/say whatever you want. They can't do that now

Also stems down to Mic rust, a gimmick where he's whining and being a jerk. Pretty much playing the heelish role and he's angry. a shitty character to mic against too in Fruity Pebbles Cena

Cena pulled out 2 good promo's during the current fued, both were when he reverted to his Thuganomics persona. I'd hardly call that amazing. The rest of the time he's same o lame o

For no apparent reason breaking into yelling and always stating the obvious like people are morons and don't see it.

During the attitude era it was a calmer rock who'd been doing the role for several years and was comfortable infront of the live crowd and had been doing his 1 liners regularly
That's the difference.

Regardless he's still more entertaining and Austin's brief speaches are more entertaining then 90% of the woosie crap that's been shoved down our throats for the past 6yrs.

 

[Blue Beanie]

Rock in 2011 is way over-rated on the mic. His return promo was great, but every mic segment since has been the same thing. Sure he made a few jokes, but take out the repetitive catch phrases and audience call and response spots and Rock wouldn't have said much at all.

You can't say audience response makes someone great on the mic. Yeah people scream the catch phrases along with Rock, but that doesn't mean he's advancing the story, furthering the feud, getting a point across, or selling a rivalry.

To me it sounds like Rock is only talking to himself when he's on the mic. Cena completely outshined him when they were face to face before Mania. Cena was engaging in a heated conversation, asked Rock "Who the hell are you?" and Rock again recycled the same old thing from his big return. A few kid friendly curse words for attention grabbing slight shock value, catch phrases, silly insult, no real substance.

Eventually we finally got the big reason for Rock's anger; he just doesn't like Cena. But that came after Rock flooded Cena with some very kind words... I'm not buying Rock's reasoning, not impressed with his part of the ongoing verbal battle, but still excited for the match at Mania 28.

Rock's clearly better than most, but as far as mic skills in the WWE right now, Cena's better.

Kinda strange since Dwayne Johnson makes much better movies than John Cena. But in the ring is where Cena is at home, and I guess Rock's new more comfortable home is Hollywood.

 

[Derrtown]

I prefered Cenas promos to Rocks. Rocks schtick was getting annoying. Same thing over and over and over again and it was crap. Cena came out and actually had some variety and it helped that I loved how Rock was like "Im home and Ill never leave" and then doesnt show back up for 3 weeks and Cena called him out on it. It was awesome. Howed Rock reply? Same ole same ole stuff.

 

[LoudClearVoice]

Shortcomings as a talker?

I totally disagree. Go back and watch all The Rock's promo's since he became "The Rock."

These are some of the greatest promos in wrestling history. Yes, he uses catch phrases but so does everyone else. The key with the Rock is that he connects instantly with the fans and he also connects with the person he's talking to.


I've always felt the Rock was better on promos where he's talking to someone else or being interviewed. His solo promos are great but not near as good as his interactions.

Most of his stuff is non-scripted, which makes it even better. By non-scripted I mean, he doesn't write the promo and memorize it. He has a general idea of what he wants to say and he goes with the flow. That's why his promos at times are more like a conversation.

I will say he seemed a little rusty but give the man a break. He's been away from the ring for 7 years. Even after being away from the ring for 7 years, his mic skills are probably better than most if not the entire WWE roster.

 

[mster]

I thought the pre-wrestlemania face to face was great on the Rock's part. Cena looked really uncomgortable and went into his growing up, music and color and he just got real serious and had a hard time dealing with the all the Rocky and Cena sucks chants. Cena looked really out of place, anything but amazing

 

[Rockyfolifebo!!!]

OK, all people do up here is pick at every little thing. "Is the rock doing this" or "What about cena". Here's how I look at it:

Yes, the Rock has fallen off a little. But think of this as if you were a kid on summer break. It only last about two months, before you have to go back to boring ol' school. You dig what I'm sayin'? The Rock's time in WWE is limited; for all we know, we might see him maybe 2 more times before WM 28! Just enjoy what we're getting now (what appears to be his last run), before we have to go back to "boring ol' school"!

 

[ThegameHHH]

I just don't get all these posts trying to play down the Rock's promo skills............he is the best on the mic of all times.He has outshone everyone on the Mic and like some people have mentioned the only reason Cena's promos may sound better is because he is IN THE RING(by that I mean that most titantron promo's don't deliver all the emotion as compared to a live promo). When Rock was live(first night and wrestlemania) he blew the roof off the arenas and don't include the go-home show where the writers gave 99% of promo time to Cena. On Cena's behalf I can confidently say he has promo talent which is being bottled up due to PG restrictions and to maintain his kid-friendly persona but it is this setup with the Rock that is releasing all his potential.

And just to point out Rock's catchphrases and promo style has always been constant and got approval of kids and adults while Cena keeps changing to please different demographics(every raw the funny kid talk to please kids and on raws near the ppv some angry shouting in the camera saying he will DESTROY his opponent to please the adults).Even though cena is improving he is no where near Rock's level.

And one last thing I wish the IWC would lay of the Rock(even if he shows up once in a month live) he came back and has also guaranteed a wrestlemania match.........what more u want from the guy because everyone thought wrestlemania 27 would be the end of the Rock in Wwe.

 

[poppycock]

No I disagree. I am not even a fan of The Rock and never have been but he is brilliant on the mic and it's the catchphrases that make it all the more better. I think the big problem with some of his promo work since he came back is that he has had to adjust to the current PG Era in the WWE. Before he went away he had the freedom so say whatever he wanted he could rant about anything and swear and make crude jokes 'til he was blue in the face. Now he has to watch what he says and as sombody who was part of the most risque era in professional wrestling I guess that takes time to get used to.

 

[Ruddalin]

Couldn't agree more, as someone who'd never witnessed The Rock talking before I was pretty impressed with the energy of his first promo but in my eyes he's a one trick pony, since that one night he has been boring as f*ck on the mic, repeating his 25 different catchphrases all in order, and the fans are eating it up like crazy, I'm not sure as to why he's as over as he is, I'm personally hoping he gets overtaken by The Miz and Cena eventually, although it doesn't look like he will be at the rate things are going does it.

 

[hollowpoint]

Couldn't agree more, as someone who'd never witnessed The Rock talking before I was pretty impressed with the energy of his first promo but in my eyes he's a one trick pony, since that one night he has been boring as f*ck on the mic, repeating his 25 different catchphrases all in order, and the fans are eating it up like crazy, I'm not sure as to why he's as over as he is, I'm personally hoping he gets overtaken by The Miz and Cena eventually, although it doesn't look like he will be at the rate things are going does it.

Are you serious?! I should've stopped reading after you said you've never witnessesd him talk. What 25 different catch phrases did he repeat? And since he did them in order could you provide the order? You need to YouTube some Rock promos or get the Rock DVD and THEN come on here and give your opinion. If you don't like the Rock then that's fine, but to say he is boring is a little crazy. Neither the Miz or Cena are nowhere near where he is NOW, much less where he used to be.

 

[Celtic rattlesnake]

i really dont understand anybody who says the rocks promos are boring or one dimensional. we all love the rock for the sort of promos he cuts, and if he wasnt using all his old catchphrases people would be asking why not? in my view hes the one of the best talkers in history. i also agree with earlier posts which suggest that rocks feud with Cena has showcased cenas quality on the mic. Cenas best attribute has always been his mic skillls and showing that he can hold his own against the rock will poosibly raise the level of respect more old school fans have for Cena.

 

[orton0384]

The op being only 17 is clearly a cena fan who is burned up about his loss due to the great ones interference. The op should know his damn role, and SHUT HIS DAMN MOUTH!

I kid. I digress however, i am not trying to discredit you but you grew up in a diff era. If you are 17 then you were 10 when the rock left in 2004. Which means you probably saw little to nothing of his greatest matches and PROMOS when you were 4 years old.

You would have to have been there week in and week out to fully appreciate his mic skills. Has he changed or lost a beat? Yeah. I heard a couple stammers. Yeah catchphrases were used a lot. But what did you want him to do? Roast the whole locker room for the sake if diff material each week? Burn every superstar?

Your boy john cena has the same M.O. as well. Its as stupid as anti cena fans bitching about 5 moves of doom. EVERY WRESTLER HAS 5 MOVES OF DOOM. EVERY WRESTLER USES CATCHPHRASES AND SING ALONGS TO GET OVER WITH THE LIVECROWD. They babble about who theyre feuding with. Throw out a "i never back down from a fight." Or a "check your monkey ass into the smackdown hotel." All the way to a " the champ is...(crowd and cena)HERE!" and a "and the millions(crowd and rock after them)and millions!"

Yes you may have an issue with rockys promos but they werent for you young man. They were for the older folk. They were for the LIVE crowd. Cena is a gr-eat worker and i defend him but i have been a fan of the rock since late 1996. Guess whose side i was on for this year and at 28? And before you get all huffy i support many non attitude era stars including cena. Im just throwing my opinion at the op.

 

[silrock316]

What a waste of a thread. The Rock was and still a beast on the mic and even with a little rust he captivates you. I listen to every word. I don't get that with Cena. What we have now is Cena Fanboys trying to convince themselves that Cena is better than Rock. I don't want to slight Cena bc his mic work is solid but its still not in Rocks league. So I don't think Rock is hurting himself. This thread is simply what you get when you have two eras interlocking. Next you will tell me Cenas mic skills are better than HHH and Austins? Gimmie a break. All hail Rock, all hail attitude era. Cena would be a hardcore player in the AE. Chasing the hardcore title.(Nmaybe not that bad but you get the point)

 

[TheKingHustla]

I think that this is a different Rock. In the "good ol days" The Rock would disrespect everyone! From his opponent, to the guy who interviews him, to the boom guy, the guy walking down the hall, the camera man and the camera man's boyfriend. Not, it seems like he has too much "respect" for Cena. I think the angle is off. The fact that he "doesn't like Cena" isn't carrying it like the young Rock would have.

The young Rock "respected" no one! He spit out his catchphrases but around them, he threw in fresh slaughtering insults. He also had the current track record of laying the smacketh down on guys. He hasn't really laid the smacketh down on anyone yet. So the aspect of him walking down the ring and beating someone up is erased. He used to have his 800 dollar shirts, and his high priced clothes, and stand at the entrance way, talk about sticking his expensive shoe up someone's ass and go to the ring and kick ass, or get his ass kicked, whatever one.

I think another thing that could be said is that he doesn't have that much material for Cena. You look at everyone the rock has promo'd against in his prime, scsa, hhh, y2j, undertaker, foley, big show, vince, rikishi, kurt angle on and on, he had tons of material to work with. With Cena, he goes back to his shirts. No matter what happens, he goes back to the shirts. Cena's character is so bland and ordinary and "positive" that I think it's hard for Rock to get ideas because Cena stands for the things that Rock can agree with. Hustle, Loyalty and Respect are things Rock can agree with. The fact that Cena shows passion for the WWE is something Rock can agree with. Cena and Rock are both faces. Two of the biggest faces in history, and Rock doesn't have the ammo for Cena because Cena's so "positive".

Another thing could be said about Cena holding his own. In the face to face promos, Cena has spoken truth. Cena is a Rock fan, and yes, he was "dickriding" Rocky in some of the face to faces, but at the bottom of it, the things he said put a hold on The Rock and had Rocky speechless. Rocky had no real comeback for them. It was something that i have never seen from Rock. Rock was punked. Cena got in the Rock's face the first time and told him if he wanted to fight, they could fight, and Rock did nothing (then Miz interupted), the last time they got in the ring, Cena took off his shirt and got in the Rock's face and told him to bring it, and that the people wanted to see them fight, everyone, including myself, wanted Rock to punch Cena in the chin like he would have back in 2000, but instead, he arranged a match... for mania a year away. He could have punch the crap outta Cena, they threw some punches, then announce the mania match.

It just seems like we got a Rock who, from rust, or age, or lack of prep, or whatever,is slightly off. But then again, what did we expect with him being out 7 years? on that standard, after 7 years, even a subpar Rock is great!

 

[Jack-Hammer]

Well, for some people, The Rock might not have quite as much shine to him as he once did and that's to be expected. For the posters here that were around during the Attitude Era, we were teenages when that stuff was going on. Everything that went on at that time seemed to be extremely cool and amazing for the simple fact that we'd never heard or seen stuff like that before in wrestling.

Here we are today, however, grown men and women. We've matured and our tastes have changed to some degree as well. I've said it before in a lot of posts that virtually nothing in the Attitude Era was as good as some have tried to make it out to be. Looking back on it, a lot of it was downright crap that seemed like good quality tv because most of us didn't really know any better.

The Rock has never been the kind of wrestler that generally has a "serious" promo style. The Rock's always been primarily more energetic and on the fly and yes he uses tons of catchphrases. For instance, you'll probably never see The Rock cut a promo like the one Triple H cut on The Undertaker this past Monday. Not to say that he couldn't, but it'd be a huge departure from what generally brought The Rock to the dance in terms of promo skills. It's always worked and it's working right now. The Rock is every bit as over right now as he possibly could be without being a 100% active wrestler on the roster.

At the same time, this is 2011 and a sad fact is that the internet has changed some fans for the worse. We all know that there's a good sized portion of internet fans that just aren't happy with anything no matter what it is. There's no such thing as a match, promo, feud or even wrestler good enough unless those factors meet with extremely unrealistic criteria in those fans minds. In other words, if things don't go EXACTLY as they think it should, they'll shit all over it. The fact that it's happening to The Rock at this point in time just solidifies that.

 

[RJJ]

WTF?!
Saying that rock is boring on the mic is like saying kurt angle can't wrestle. Now, regarding rock's promos post-return, did you actully think that the wwe would allow him just walk in, bury thier biggest star that they've been trying to build for 7yrs, and then take a leave? No. And I don't think he lost a step or anything, you see, this whole cena-rock fued is to put cena over, to pass him the torch, to mold him up, to make him look better than he really is, that's why rock didn't lay the smackdown verbally on cena. As far as the hyper rock(2001-this day) vs calm rock(1999-2000), I'll take calm rock anyday of the week, cause just like some poster said he respects NO ONE, he made fun of the undertaker and his 33lbs head, he made fun about triple h and his-aaaah 20 minutes-aaaaah boring segments-aaaaaah, not to mention he and mick foley did the highest rating promo(this is your life) on raw history.

ahhh those damn cena fans ......If you didn't witness him in his prime don't talk outta your ass.

 

[Lion's Sacrifice]

I don't think the Rock's lost a step, Damn his return promo was amazing. Everyone on this forum was having a blast listening to him talk. It was fantastic. I remember that everyone on here was saying just how great he was, and how no one could touch him on the mic. The next week Cena came out and destroyed the Rock. I think the biggest thing is people have forgotten just how Good Cena is on the mic. Who really has he had the chance to work with that is on his level? No one! Cena is right along side The Rock as it comes to mic skills. I think he showed that over the past couple of months. Remember that Cena did the same thing Rock use to do. He would trash talk everyone. Its just been so long since Cena's done that we forgot how good he actually is. This takes nothing away from how good Rocky is.

ahhh those damn cena fans ......If you didn't witness him in his prime don't talk outta your ass.

I witnessed him, and I've witnessed Cena, their equally as good, and can put on amazing promo's. Don't believe me, go watch some of Cena's old promo's where he'd tear anyone a new asshole. If you want the passionate one's go check out his promo from last year when he was "fired" both occasions he had the crowd in his hand, just like Rock did when he returned and years ago.