Fourth Round: TLC - The Rock vs. John Cena

[Ferbian]

I never said any of that. Actually if you read my post again it says that I consider their success winning matches and titles to be about on par with each other.

My apologies Big Sexy, I may have overlooked that part, but yes indeed they are very equal.

I lumped all of this together because we can debate different guys primes all day long, but in no way is the competition that Cena has beaten better then what The Rock beat. If you want to say they're even, although I still disagree, I can at least get where you are coming from. However, to say Cena beat better competition is an outright lie.

That may very well be true, but John's competition is quite comparable to The Rock to say the least then, both have faced and excelled against great competition, and it's quite obvious that this is gonna be a tough match, which I just think John has the upper hand in.

I never disputed that. The fact remains that John Cena has never defeated anyone that is the Rock's caliber. The Rock is on another level that I don't believe Cena has reached yet. There are very few guys I would vote over Cena but the Rock is most certainly one of them. The Rock thrived in an era where the rules were constantly bent and he dished out and took punishment from guys like Austin, Foley, and Taker that were known for their toughness.

The highlighted part is the exact thing that made me argue the fact that John has thrived with hardcore matches as well, as I said, John can very well dish out, and receive punishment, just as well, if not more than The Rock, facing guys like Batista, JBL (who was quite nasty with those chairs to say the least) Edge, Randy Orton and, well I guess you could say Umaga due to their last man standing match, as well as a multitude of hard fought matches with guys like Triple H and Kurt Angle.

People tuned in to watch more then just Austin. Like I said Austin wasn't even around for the majority of one of the WWE's highest rating years. The Rock thrived in his role as the top guy in Austin's absence. As far as Austin getting the better reaction when they faced, with exception of Wrestlemania 17 Austin was always the face so of course he got the bigger reaction. At Mania 17 when they were both face the reaction was basically equal.

That's true, but that doesn't leave out the fact that people tuned in to watch Austin for the most of the 98's and 99's during his feud with McMahon, therefore you could consider that it was Austin who pulled the WWE, which has been disputed a lot around here as well, but I'm not gonna argue drawing power anymore, since we all know that's not gonna get anybody to win this, it's the gimmick rounds, not the regular rounds, where voting because of influence actually did something.

Again, we can argue primes all day I just look at those lists and to me the Rock's is superior. To each their own I guess.

Indeed, to each their own, but I'm not arguing that The Rock didn't face any hard opponents, that would be ridiculous, but I just consider the opponents Cena faced, to be just a little bit tougher.

Their isn't much knowledge involved. The match is pretty straight forward. And dominant isn't a word I would ever use in a sentence with Edge pertaining to anything.

Edge can be dominant and match controlling, remember his match with John Morrison in 2009? I would call that pretty controlling and dominating.

Sure it's straight forward, but don't everybody always scream and yell (on WWE shows, the in-ring characters) that yada yada yada I've experienced it, so I know how to deal with it blah blah blah, so I have got to have the advantage, blah blah end of promo.

Is that a serious statement? It's a hardcore match with a fucking ladder involved. The Rock isn't an idiot. He wouldn't really have to adapt at all, like I said the match is pretty straight forward.

I realize I may have considered it more serious than anything when I wrote it, but I guess, for the sake of being able to stand up for my argument, yes the match is very straight forward, but my comment to that has been pretty answered in previous paragraph.

The Rock just outclasses Cena here for the victory.

No, John Cena outsmarts The Rock in this one, leaving him, doing something, I'm not quite sure whether he crawls the ladder, pins him, or submits him, either way, John comes out on top.

 

[Big Sexy]

Edge can be dominant and match controlling, remember his match with John Morrison in 2009? I would call that pretty controlling and dominating.

I'm really glad Edge dominated a career mid carder he has a size advantage over. Cena beat an opportunist in his first TLC match. Now he is facing one of the biggest superstars in wrestling history.

Sure it's straight forward, but don't everybody always scream and yell (on WWE shows, the in-ring characters) that yada yada yada I've experienced it, so I know how to deal with it blah blah blah, so I have got to have the advantage, blah blah end of promo.

That's more the announcers then anything. I really don't give a fuck what Michael Cole or Matt Striker thinks about a particular match up. The Rock has been in ladder matches and has been in hardcore matches. He has more then enough experience here.

Like I said before I like Cena, I just don't see anything about him that is better then The Rock. He may be equal in some things but there is nothing that stands out in his career that would entice me to vote him over someone like The Rock.

 

[Supernova]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVwsBjmFtl4

This is what happens to Cena. He doesn't do this, he wrestles in the PG Era. Don't even lie and say that John Cena would do this. The Rock is willing to whatever it takes to win, Cena is limited. John Cena is so inferior, it's ridiculous. For a pro wrestler to be as pathetic at working a crowd as him to be the top guy shows how weak of an era this is. Say what you want about The Rock "riding Austin's coat tails" (which isn't even true, as I've already shown he thrived in the year Austin was out), he got those reactions himself, and managed to make people care about his matches. Less people watch wrestling now and Cena is the main guy so you'd have to say people don't want to watch him.

 

[thepalaceprince]

This rock doesnt have experince in tlc matches argument is stupid! a tlc is a ladder match with weapons. The rock has been in hardcore matches and Im sure he can figures out how to climb a ladder so as far as Im concerned you can take that argument and shove it up your candy ass! Im going with the rock hes more talented then cena he can keep up with cena in terms of athleticism and strength. Plus the rock had mr mcmahon on his side for a good chunk of his career I think vince interferes and helps the people's champ pull out an electrifying victory. But the rock would win with or without vince's help because hes better then cena and has defeated better opponents then cena. Cena mite have beaten the overrated r superstar (see what I did there?) The rock beat hogan and stone cold. THE ROCK SAYS KNOW YOUR ROLE AND VOTE FOR THE PEOPLE'S CHAMP!

 

[Mr. Truth]

I went with Cena hear. He's got two edges over The Rock in my mind. One is his ability to "hulk up" if he's getting beaten on for a bit and can turn the tide in a match. Two is that the man is more clever and resourceful then The Rock. He'd bring out the duct tape and strap Rocky to a turnbuckle and then will climb the ladder. Absurd, yes. But he was able to beat Batista in a few weeks ago in this manner (I doubt it'd take Cena 10 seconds to climb the ladder). He might feel like he's disgraced his fans by using a "cheap" way to win, but Cena's a competitor and will do what he needs to do to pick up the W.

 

[Big Sexy]

He's got two edges over The Rock in my mind. One is his ability to "hulk up" if he's getting beaten on for a bit and can turn the tide in a match.

That's great and may be a valid point if the Rock hadn't already beaten someone who did that. In fact he beat the guy who invented that in Hulk Hogan. Yes Hogan was out of his prime but he was still a formidable opponent and it shows that the Rock can overcome someone getting a second wind.

Two is that the man is more clever and resourceful then The Rock. He'd bring out the duct tape and strap Rocky to a turnbuckle and then will climb the ladder. Absurd, yes. But he was able to beat Batista in a few weeks ago in this manner (I doubt it'd take Cena 10 seconds to climb the ladder). He might feel like he's disgraced his fans by using a "cheap" way to win, but Cena's a competitor and will do what he needs to do to pick up the W.

Cena does ONE resourceful thing against an opponent and now all the sudden he's "clever" and "resourceful?" I call bullshit. Besides The Rock has done similar things. Putting Mick Foley in handcuffs and beating him unconscious with a chair ring a bell? If we're talking about being resourceful that edge goes to The Rock.

 

[Mr. Truth]

That's great and may be a valid point if the Rock hadn't already beaten someone who did that. In fact he beat the guy who invented that in Hulk Hogan. Yes Hogan was out of his prime but he was still a formidable opponent and it shows that the Rock can overcome someone getting a second wind.

Exactly. Hogan was out of his prime. He was old and out of shape and needed some cash so he came back to wrestling. He wasn't the same guy he was, and his ability to "hulk up" while there, was nowhere near how it was in his prime.

Cena does ONE resourceful thing against an opponent and now all the sudden he's "clever" and "resourceful?" I call bullshit. Besides The Rock has done similar things. Putting Mick Foley in handcuffs and beating him unconscious with a chair ring a bell? If we're talking about being resourceful that edge goes to The Rock.

Batista is an animal. Foley is a glorified stuntman. Which is harder to beat? Which is harder to tie down? It's Batista by a long shot. Saying Rock needed to handcuff Foley to beat him shows that he needs as much help from foreign objects as he can get.

 

[Big Sexy]

Exactly. Hogan was out of his prime. He was old and out of shape and needed some cash so he came back to wrestling. He wasn't the same guy he was, and his ability to "hulk up" while there, was nowhere near how it was in his prime.

Hogan out of his prime was still beating big names and had a run, albeit a short one, as champion. Cena now is better then Hogan then but it still shows the Rock can overcome a guy getting a second wind.

Batista is an animal. Foley is a glorified stuntman. Which is harder to beat? Which is harder to tie down? It's Batista by a long shot. Saying Rock needed to handcuff Foley to beat him shows that he needs as much help from foreign objects as he can get.

In a normal match you may be right but it was an "I Quit" match. I'd say it's harder to beat 1999 Mankind in an "I Quit" match then it is to keep 2010 Batista down for 10 seconds. Like I said in earlier posts there is nothing that Cena has over The Rock that would lead me to believe he is better and could beat him here.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVwsBjmFtl4

This is what happens to Cena. He doesn't do this, he wrestles in the PG Era. Don't even lie and say that John Cena would do this. The Rock is willing to whatever it takes to win, Cena is limited. John Cena is so inferior, it's ridiculous. For a pro wrestler to be as pathetic at working a crowd as him to be the top guy shows how weak of an era this is. Say what you want about The Rock "riding Austin's coat tails" (which isn't even true, as I've already shown he thrived in the year Austin was out), he got those reactions himself, and managed to make people care about his matches. Less people watch wrestling now and Cena is the main guy so you'd have to say people don't want to watch him.

Batista and Orton never wrestled in the Attitude Era but they can get down and dirty if need be. Rock was good for one year and when Austin came back, he was pushed back to a distant second, maybe even third behind Angle. The Rock is a big match loser and Cena is a big match winner and he will win this match. Cena works the crowd better than anybody but you obviously don't realize it.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Hogan out of his prime was still beating big names and had a run, albeit a short one, as champion. Cena now is better then Hogan then but it still shows the Rock can overcome a guy getting a second wind.



In a normal match you may be right but it was an "I Quit" match. I'd say it's harder to beat 1999 Mankind in an "I Quit" match then it is to keep 2010 Batista down for 10 seconds. Like I said in earlier posts there is nothing that Cena has over The Rock that would lead me to believe he is better and could beat him here.

Hogan beat HHH and then lost to Undertaker, Angle, and Lesnar and basically became a main event jobber. Not exactly a ringing endorsement for The Great One

 

[TwistofRKO]

Did anybody read the rules? The Rock can win via pinfall, and seeing as Cena was owned by JBL in a Street fight the Rock would certainly be able to, at the very least, pin John Cena.

Of course the Rock's inexperience in the TLC match will doom him, right? Its not like Cena won his first TLC match. Oh wait, he did. I guess its possible to win in your first TLC match. And that was his only ladder match. The Rock has been in two. Both of which were against bloody-brawlers like Mick Foley and HHH. Experience? The Rock.

The Rock's ladder match record isn't brilliant? He's 1-1. How ******ed.

Cena lost his last Tables match to an extremely inexperienced rookie, so how does he get points for that?

The Rock was of the greatest overall appeal in the Attitude Era, John Cena is the top dog in a pathetic time for wrestling. The Rock has won more bloody, weapon-infested matches against better hardcore wrestlers than Cena can even dream of. The Rock would be bigger now than Cena would have been in the Attitude Era. Cena never would have accomplished as much.

The Rock will be too tired to hit the Rock Bottom? Well hell, then Cena will be too tired to do the Attitude Adjustment. Great logic.

 

[Pepe Silvia]

This is a Tables, Ladders and Chairs match but with a twist. You can also win by pinfall or submission as well as capturing the object. This prevents the idiotic So and So can't climb so he loses here.

This makes climbing the ladder to retrieve the belt completely irrelevant. Because it will take more than 3 seconds to climb a fucking ladder and retrieve a belt, pinning is a more effective way to win the match. Therefore, the match basically a Hardcore match, so Cena's experience in a single TLC match (Where you could ONLY win by retrieving the belt) is a nonfactor.

Using the Cena supporter's flawed logic, Johnny's TLC experience will allow him to climb the ladder and retrieve the belt. Therefore, you are stating that HIS logic is inferior, as he doesn't realize he would only need to keep Rocky down for 3 seconds to pin him and win the match, and would try and keep him down for at least 5, if not 10 or more, to grab the strap. So, in your opinion, Cena is less intelligent than The Rock. Thanks for deciding who I'm voting for.

 

[Big Sexy]

Hogan beat HHH and then lost to Undertaker, Angle, and Lesnar and basically became a main event jobber. Not exactly a ringing endorsement for The Great One

Yes Hogan lost to Taker, Lesnar, and Angle. Two of those three guys have beaten Cena and Cena has never gotten a victory over them. Besides my point wasn't that the victory over Hogan was some impressive feat, it was that The Rock had beaten someone before with the ability to come back after being beaten on for the whole match aka Hulking up.

 

[Supernova]

Cena works the crowd better than anybody but you obviously don't realize it.

There's arguing your cause and there's just plain ignorance. The Rock could literally get the crowd to chant his name just by saying that they were. When Cena does that I'll eat my hat because it will never happen.

 

[Franchize1990]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVwsBjmFtl4

This is what happens to Cena. He doesn't do this, he wrestles in the PG Era. Don't even lie and say that John Cena would do this. The Rock is willing to whatever it takes to win, Cena is limited. John Cena is so inferior, it's ridiculous.

He doesn't do what exactly? Beat people with weapons to the point his opponent says "I Quit"? Something that The Rock didn't actually do in his two I Quit matches? JBL must've been forgotten huh? Cena does whatever it takes to win a match or else he wouldn't have been WWE Champion for over a year. And what exactly is Cena limited to? He's been in I Quit matches, Last Man Standing matches, Elimination Chambers, Iron Man matches, HIAC matches, and the match he is competing in against The Rock, a TLC match. Cena seldom comes out the loser in those matches. Also, in a match where chairs are involved, I don't trust The Rock with a chair because of this: [YOUTUBE]jIRm4nhrz0A[/YOUTUBE]

That will lead to a STF and The Rock will eventually tap out.

For a pro wrestler to be as pathetic at working a crowd as him to be the top guy shows how weak of an era this is. Say what you want about The Rock "riding Austin's coat tails" (which isn't even true, as I've already shown he thrived in the year Austin was out), he got those reactions himself, and managed to make people care about his matches.

Go watch the Cena/RDV match from ECW's One Night Stand from 2006 and tell me Cena can't work the crowd. He got the whole place reacting to whatever he did. Also, look at the 2008 Royal Rumble where he got a packed Madison Square Garden in New York City, one of the more populated Cena-hater cities, to cheer and go nuts for a few minutes.

Less people watch wrestling now and Cena is the main guy so you'd have to say people don't want to watch him.

More like more people don't want to watch wrestling anymore because the people they grew up with are gone and there's no other company that could bring back the Monday Night Wars like the WCW and the WWE did. Austin could come back and the ratings won't get back to the way they were during the wars.

 

[Dagger Dias]

Wow, what a dream match we have here. Cena may not be as popular as The Rock but he CAN win this match.... let's take a look at why he has the advantage, starting with their accomplishments.


The Rock
2 time WCW Champion (97 days total)
7 time WWE Champion (297 days total)
2 time Intercontinental Champion (339 days total)
5 time WWE Tag Team Champion (24 days total)


John Cena
2 time World Heavyweight Champion (105 days total)
7 time WWE Champion (919+ days total)
3 time United States Champion (221 days total)
2 time World Tag Team Champion (70 days total)


When looking at their title reigns.... The Rock's accomplishments are not as great as Cena's. They are about the same in terms of midcard and tag team title reigns.... but there is no contest in their world title status. The Rock has 9 world title reigns but only held them for 394 days. Cena has 9 world title reigns as well, with a total of 1025 days (and counting!) of holding a world title.

I'm well aware of the fact that The Rock is more popular than Cena. So what? We are supposed to be pretending this is a kayfabed match, not a contest of "Oh I'll vote for this guy just because he's cooler". No! It's not like that. Whether the attitude era fanboys will admit it or not, John Cena can defeat The Rock because not only has he accomplished more than The Rock; Cena's character refuses to give up.... even when facing a legend who the fans like more than him. The two would give a fantastic epic TLC match where either one of them has decent odds of winning, only for Cena to finally get a pin after hitting an Attitude Adjustment through a table. Cena wins!

 

[Miko]

I voted for The Rock in the end, sorry guys, some arguments here about Rock not having TLC experience are pretty bullshit. Rock's been in ladder matches before, and he's worked with both tables and chairs, so I reckon he could get his head around having *gasp* all three in the ring.

I like both guys, I really do, both are great talkers, both are great in ring performers, and both guys will willingly lay down for anyone that the company wants them too, no questions asked, for Rock see Angle, Lesnar, Goldberg, Austin (multiple times). For Cena see HHH (multiple times), HBK, Batista, Sheamus and more.

Both men are pretty much supermen at their best, Rocky taking shitloads of chair shots in a pretty much two on one match at WrestleMania before he went down, and Cena coming back after countless beatdowns. Cena's the top dog now, Rock was Austin's second, for a while, because, you know, Cena would totally have been the focal point during Austin's reign.

Besides after Austin got injured Rock took over, and WWE had their most successfull year ever apparently. A prime Rocky clean loss probably happens about as often as a prime Cena clean loss, about once in a blue moon. Besides, if you lot really cared about that then Hogan would be through to round 4 right now, so colour me unconvinced.

Entertainment wise Rock wins this, Rock is in the highest rated segment of all time, arguably the best mic worker ever, and probably more entertaining in ring, at least from my point of view, and is currently doing better in Hollywood than Hulk Hogan and even Steve Austin so he gets the vote there.

Both men have flaws, both have been beaten, fairly and unfairly, this would come down to the wire, and you could guarantee that whoever lost this match would win the rematch (because thats how things work in wrestling) so it'd be close, me, I think Rock would take it

 

[CH David]

Wow, what a dream match we have here. Cena may not be as popular as The Rock but he CAN win this match.... let's take a look at why he has the advantage, starting with their accomplishments.


The Rock
2 time WCW Champion (97 days total)
7 time WWE Champion (297 days total)
2 time Intercontinental Champion (339 days total)
5 time WWE Tag Team Champion (24 days total)


John Cena
2 time World Heavyweight Champion (105 days total)
7 time WWE Champion (919+ days total)
3 time United States Champion (221 days total)
2 time World Tag Team Champion (70 days total)


When looking at their title reigns.... The Rock's accomplishments are not as great as Cena's. They are about the same in terms of midcard and tag team title reigns.... but there is no contest in their world title status. The Rock has 9 world title reigns but only held them for 394 days. Cena has 9 world title reigns as well, with a total of 1025 days (and counting!) of holding a world title.

I'm well aware of the fact that The Rock is more popular than Cena. So what? We are supposed to be pretending this is a kayfabed match, not a contest of "Oh I'll vote for this guy just because he's cooler". No! It's not like that. Whether the attitude era fanboys will admit it or not, John Cena can defeat The Rock because not only has he accomplished more than The Rock; Cena's character refuses to give up.... even when facing a legend who the fans like more than him. The two would give a fantastic epic TLC match where either one of them has decent odds of winning, only for Cena to finally get a pin after hitting an Attitude Adjustment through a table. Cena wins!

Dagger, I should expect better out of you. Their accomplishments have fuck all to do with this match. In any physical test, I guarantee you they are very even, and if there is an edge to either, it is only slightly. The Rock could go with anyone in the business, and would Layeth the Smacketh Down. Cena would come back, but I don't see him going over The Rock in his prime. If you also want to talk toughness, look at Wrestlemania 17. It took Austin like 17 chair shots to put him out? I don't remember the exact number if it isn't 17, but it was a lot. Cena has a tremendous amount of heart, but anyone that acts like the Rock doesn't is full of shit.

 

[Dagger Dias]

Dagger, I should expect better out of you. Their accomplishments have fuck all to do with this match.

It actually does when you think about it. I did that analysis because we are looking at a kayfabe'd match between Cena VS The Rock, assuming that both men are in their prime. A great way to do see who would win if both are assumed to be in their prime is to look at what they have done, whether that's title reigns or entire career records. I never said Cena would get the win easily. I expect a VERY close match between the two (as the poll results currently show).... with Cena just barely winning the match in the end. You might have misunderstood the purpose of my title reign analysis, but it did have a purpose when it comes to my argument that Cena can defeat The Rock.

Let's look at it this way. What would you consider Cena's prime? I'd say his year long world title reign from September 2006 until October 2007. He defeated everyone who stood in his way, it took a real-life injury for him to finally lose. If The Rock (in his prime, even) faced THAT version of Cena, then the odds would still be in Cena's favor. He would win after a very close but epic match between the icons of two different eras.

 

[Supernova]

No. The Rock would win if they faced each other in their primes at, say Wrestlemania because that's what the vast majority of fans would want, so if anything he'd be more likely to be booked to win. I'm sorry but that's how it is. Cena in his prime facing prime Rocky would get booed out of the building (and then the Cena fan boys would try and spin it and say the WWE WANTED their poster boy to get booed). Quite frankly if this happened The Rock would be booked to win.

 

[Ferbian]

I'm really glad Edge dominated a career mid carder he has a size advantage over. Cena beat an opportunist in his first TLC match. Now he is facing one of the biggest superstars in wrestling history.

That's very true, Edge may very well not have been the most dominant guy, and Cena is definitely facing one tough opponent, but it's nothing that John hasn't excelled against before, Triple H is one of the biggest superstars in wrestling history as well (if you choose to look at that, can't deny his impact on the business), who he as well defeated.

That's more the announcers then anything. I really don't give a fuck what Michael Cole or Matt Striker thinks about a particular match up. The Rock has been in ladder matches and has been in hardcore matches. He has more then enough experience here.

Sure I'm not saying he doesn't have enough, I'm just saying looking at his resume, he hasn't won an exact defined TLC match, something The Rock doesn't have, and no that doesn't mean I'm screaming "You unqualified sum bitch, be gone!" I'm just saying that John has somewhat of an edge there, even if it's by 0.00001% of a margin, it's an edge.

And it's not just the announcers, I have heard multiple times of Chris Jericho ranting about how he's superior cause he's worked matches, as well as Triple H with his Elimination Chambers and Hell in a Cell matches.

Like I said before I like Cena, I just don't see anything about him that is better then The Rock. He may be equal in some things but there is nothing that stands out in his career that would entice me to vote him over someone like The Rock.

Very well, not telling you how you should vote, just saying that I think in a real match, John may very well come out the superior.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVwsBjmFtl4

This is what happens to Cena. He doesn't do this, he wrestles in the PG Era. Don't even lie and say that John Cena would do this. The Rock is willing to whatever it takes to win, Cena is limited. John Cena is so inferior, it's ridiculous. For a pro wrestler to be as pathetic at working a crowd as him to be the top guy shows how weak of an era this is. Say what you want about The Rock "riding Austin's coat tails" (which isn't even true, as I've already shown he thrived in the year Austin was out), he got those reactions himself, and managed to make people care about his matches. Less people watch wrestling now and Cena is the main guy so you'd have to say people don't want to watch him.

Look, I've said it before, I'll say it again, while I don't really know how you're voting, John Cena's ability to draw and keep a crowd watching, has absolutely nothing with the fact being that John would be able to be defeated, or actually defeat The Rock.

John is able to have a mean streak, just because his era doesn't allow it, doesn't mean he won't do it during a match where he's allowed to be brutalizing his opponents.

Somehow I'm guessing you haven't watched John's latest Last Man Standing match and the Iron man match he worked, cause those are prime examples of John being one tough son of a bitch who excels just fine during hardcore matches.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

No. The Rock would win if they faced each other in their primes at, say Wrestlemania because that's what the vast majority of fans would want, so if anything he'd be more likely to be booked to win. I'm sorry but that's how it is. Cena in his prime facing prime Rocky would get booed out of the building (and then the Cena fan boys would try and spin it and say the WWE WANTED their poster boy to get booed). Quite frankly if this happened The Rock would be booked to win.

I've been waiting for somebody to bring up this. The Rock has beaten The Sultan, Shamrock, Hogan, and Austin at WM. Cena has beaten Big Show, JBL, HHH, HBK, Edge, and Batista. I'll leave you to figure out which list is better. Cena has won 3 world titles and retained twice while Dwayne has lost 2 and failed to win 1. Simply put, Cena is better at winning big matches and the Rock isn't.

 

[Coco]

Awesome. CH David asked for an arugment and when I offer one, his dick shriveled up and he ducks me. If that's not him admitting I'm right, I don't know what is.

The Rock was of the greatest overall appeal in the Attitude Era, John Cena is the top dog in a pathetic time for wrestling.

It amazes me how many people can't fucking read.

Glasses on. Okay, dear?

During Cena's longest reign as champion, WWE reached new financial peaks.

You catch that?

So exactly what is pathetic about this era? People are clearly paying to see John Cena.

You go on to mention that Rock's beaten more hardcore wrestlers than Cena can imagine. Interesting notion, but false. Rock's beaten Foley, but everyone's had a turn on that ride.

Cena's also beaten Foley in a match with no rules. He's also won many an I Quit and Last Man Standing match against tough, tough men. He won a TLC against the master of that match. So Where is Cena's inability to beat tough men in tough matches?

Also, he's beaten Sabu. Hardcore enough for you?

No. The Rock would win if they faced each other in their primes at, say Wrestlemania because that's what the vast majority of fans would want, so if anything he'd be more likely to be booked to win. I'm sorry but that's how it is. Cena in his prime facing prime Rocky would get booed out of the building (and then the Cena fan boys would try and spin it and say the WWE WANTED their poster boy to get booed). Quite frankly if this happened The Rock would be booked to win.

That would make sense if Cena didn't have a STRONG winning record at Mania while getting booed.

He's defeat Triple H (a stronger Triple H than Rock beat), Shawn Michaels, Edge, Big Show (twice), Batista, and JBL at Mania. All while getting booed.

Rock's record isn't all that great at Mania. Rock's record if you control it so that we're just counting matches he's cheered in is even worse.

Also, if we control post count to only include posts with sound logic, you clock in at a solid 0.

Point: Cena.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVwsBjmFtl4

This is what happens to Cena. He doesn't do this, he wrestles in the PG Era. Don't even lie and say that John Cena would do this. The Rock is willing to whatever it takes to win, Cena is limited. John Cena is so inferior, it's ridiculous. For a pro wrestler to be as pathetic at working a crowd as him to be the top guy shows how weak of an era this is. Say what you want about The Rock "riding Austin's coat tails" (which isn't even true, as I've already shown he thrived in the year Austin was out), he got those reactions himself, and managed to make people care about his matches. Less people watch wrestling now and Cena is the main guy so you'd have to say people don't want to watch him.

Rock took over immediately after Austin left and didn't have to build anything for himself. Cena did and took WWE to new financial peaks after Triple H killed business. Look it up. Undisputable fact. So Cena's much better than you say.

As for Cena being limited and not being able to do what Rock did in that video, bullshit. Cena damn near choked a man to death with broken ring ropes.

But continue to spew your stale, baseless lines regarding Cena and show how blind you really are.

Meanwhile, the rest of you should....

VOTE CENA.

Fucking hell. Is amateur hour over yet?

 

[Big Sexy]

I've been waiting for somebody to bring up this. The Rock has beaten The Sultan, Shamrock, Hogan, and Austin at WM. Cena has beaten Big Show, JBL, HHH, HBK, Edge, and Batista. I'll leave you to figure out which list is better. Cena has won 3 world titles and retained twice while Dwayne has lost 2 and failed to win 1. Simply put, Cena is better at winning big matches and the Rock isn't.

The Rock lost at Mania 15 because in one on one Mania main events the face always gets the win to send the fans home happy. The only time a heel wins the main event at Mania is when there is a massive betrayal and a lot of interference. At 16 and 17 The Rock lost due to that massive amounts of interference. Without that interference both are matches he most likely would have won.

If you want to talk about big match victories, kayfabe wise there was none bigger then the 2001 Survivor Series. If team WWF lost then they'd lose control of the entire company. There is no match bigger then that. Who was chosen to lead team WWF? The Rock. Who was the sole survivor and kayfabe wise saved the entire company? The Rock. You can throw all that big match bullshit to the side because Rocky has won plenty of big matches.

 

[Coco]

The Rock lost at Mania 15 because in one on one Mania main events the face always gets the win to send the fans home happy. The only time a heel wins the main event at Mania is when there is a massive betrayal and a lot of interference.

Find me massive betrayal or interference in Jericho's win this year and Orton's win in 2008.

And don't pretend those aren't main events.

At 16 and 17 The Rock lost due to that massive amounts of interference. Without that interference both are matches he most likely would have won.

Completely hypothetical. WM17, at the very least, was on even footing. Rock "likely would have won" is just you talking when there was no clear indication of that.

"RVD likely would have won at Vengeance 2002" is supported by the facts. You're just saying stuff in your example.

All the more amusing when you look at this:

If you want to talk about big match victories, kayfabe wise there was none bigger then the 2001 Survivor Series. If team WWF lost then they'd lose control of the entire company. There is no match bigger then that. Who was chosen to lead team WWF? The Rock. Who was the sole survivor and kayfabe wise saved the entire company? The Rock. You can throw all that big match bullshit to the side because Rocky has won plenty of big matches.

It's not like he won this match because of Angle BETRAYING Austin while INTERFERING. Oh, wait. That's exactly what it's like.

But it's Rock, so the logic you established earlier in this post about victories not mattering as much in the event of interference or betrayals doesn't count when Rock wins. Right? Right.

VOTE CENA

...because Big Sexy fails at using consistent logic.