ECW San Antonio, Round 1 Match 8: #23 Paul Orndorff vs. #42 Hakushi

[Shocky]

The following match takes place in the ECW Region Under Extreme Rules, from San Antonio, TX.

#23. "Mr. Wonderful" Paul Orndorff.

vs.

#42. Hakushi

​

 

[NSL]

In support of Vader, IC showed a match from SuperBrawl III. I decided to watch the whole show, and on that card, is a Hardcore match between Foley and Orndorff.

Easy win for Foley, right? No. Orndorff not only held his own, but pretty much kicked Cactus Jack's ass. He was a legitimate tough guy, and shouldn't have any problem with beating Hakushi.

 

[Gelgarin]

Well I think that for the first time since this began, I've actually learned something.

I knew of Hakushi, although not well. What I didn't know was that he was also Jinsei Shinzaki in Japan. How that passed me by I'm not sure, but it certainly merits some additional consideration before I vote.

I don't actually know Shinzaki all that well either. I know alot of the people I converse with hold him in very high regard, and see him as something of a missing link between Japanese 'pure wrestling' (I'm sick of looking up how to spell it) and lucha styles.

Normally I try to avoid attempting to pass wikipedia off as my own knowledge, but in this case I'll run with what it gives me, which is a tip off that Shinzaki worked in FMW. Frontier Martial-Arts Wrestling sounds like one of the Inoki influenced strong style promotions, but it's not.

It was the Japanese equivalent of ECW, and true to typical Japanese form, it was considerably more barbaric. We're not talking BIG JAPAN here (where all semblance of subtalty is thrown out in favour of electric scorpions) but it's safe to say that an ECW environment would be a home away from home for Hakushi.

Interestingly then, it should be noted that Shinzaki is by no means a garbage wrestler (at least, not in any footage I've ever seen). He was an athletic technician who just happened to thrive in a hardcore environment. His success in All Japan and Michinoku prove that he's got many strings to his bow.

So we've got a technically and athletically gifted athlete who's performed internationally and is fighting in a promotion that emphasises his skill set, against "Mr Wonderful". Now my chief recollection of Orndorff was of him cutting some truly appalling promos, at one of the first Royal Rumbles, but beyond that, I don't recall especially much that puts him over in this match. I'm not going to take one match with Cactus Jack when it's sitting opposite a career main evening in a Japanese hardcore promotion.

Like I said, I'm not an expert on either guy, so feel free to try and change my mind, but right now I think Hakushi should take this quite easily.

 

[NSL]

Well I think that for the first time since this began, I've actually learned something.

I knew of Hakushi, although not well. What I didn't know was that he was also Jinsei Shinzaki in Japan. How that passed me by I'm not sure, but it certainly merits some additional consideration before I vote.

I don't actually know Shinzaki all that well either. I know alot of the people I converse with hold him in very high regard, and see him as something of a missing link between Japanese 'pure wrestling' (I'm sick of looking up how to spell it) and lucha styles.

Normally I try to avoid attempting to pass wikipedia off as my own knowledge, but in this case I'll run with what it gives me, which is a tip off that Shinzaki worked in FMW. Frontier Martial-Arts Wrestling sounds like one of the Inoki influenced strong style promotions, but it's not.

It was the Japanese equivalent of ECW, and true to typical Japanese form, it was considerably more barbaric. We're not talking BIG JAPAN here (where all semblance of subtalty is thrown out in favour of electric scorpions) but it's safe to say that an ECW environment would be a home away from home for Hakushi.

Interestingly then, it should be noted that Shinzaki is by no means a garbage wrestler (at least, not in any footage I've ever seen). He was an athletic technician who just happened to thrive in a hardcore environment. His success in All Japan and Michinoku prove that he's got many strings to his bow.

So we've got a technically and athletically gifted athlete who's performed internationally and is fighting in a promotion that emphasises his skill set, against "Mr Wonderful". Now my chief recollection of Orndorff was of him cutting some truly appalling promos, at one of the first Royal Rumbles, but beyond that, I don't recall especially much that puts him over in this match. I'm not going to take one match with Cactus Jack when it's sitting opposite a career main evening in a Japanese hardcore promotion.

Like I said, I'm not an expert on either guy, so feel free to try and change my mind, but right now I think Hakushi should take this quite easily.

I didn't know any of that extra stuff about Hakushi. I knew a lot of what he did in WWE, and just figured he was a glorified Raiden. Knowing that he has a hardcore background in Japan definitely changes things. I'll try to find some video on him, and if I can, and I'm impressed by his hardcore material, I'll change my vote.

 

[klunderbunker]

The problem I have with Orndorff is he never actually won anything. Name a single big match that he won. I can't think of any. Hakushi was at least cool looking so I'll go with him.

 

[Little Jerry Lawler]

Hakushi has wrestled in an ECW environment such as FMW. And while I think Orndoff can hold his own in the ring, Hakushi would be better suited to the surroundings and can pick up the win against him.

 

[Tastycles]

As well as fighting in FMW, I think he had a few fights in ECW, because there was a working partnership between the two companies for a little while. Maybe the only thing that hurts him is losing to Barry Horrowitz, but I think the fact e feuded with Bret Hat before that rescues him a bit.

Orndorff was a career loser, never winning when it counted. He may have done well at Super Brawl III, but he still ultimately lost to Cactus Jack, so it's not as if he is incredible in this arena. I think Hakushi has to go over him here.

 

[Shocky]

Jinsei Shinzaki, FTW. I love, love love Hakushi, and I love Shinzaki, I love the man in the ring with whatever he does. The guy is a beast in the ring. He put on great matches with Bret Hart, and had a pretty decent mini run in ECW with Sabu, RVD, and Hayabusa. The guy is fun as hell to watch in the ring, and he's not entirely dependent on hitting the big spots.

Orndorff may have had a couple decent matches, but he's a career nobody. He had a minifeud with Hogan because he had the right look and happened to know Hogan personally, that's about it. He had a good feud with Cactus Jack, but tha'ts Mick Foley we're talking about, and Mick Foley has made an entire career of making other people look good.

 

[Theo Mays]

I remember Hakushi when he rivaled with Bret Hart. And I seriously hated the guy, cause as a kid I was a huge Hart fan, and I still am to this day. But Hakushi hung in there with Hart and that says something. Orndorff, while he is a strong dude and could hold his own in the hardcore enviroment, I think would still fall short to Hakushi. It should be a good match, bloody as all hell, with Hakushi picking up the W when the dust settles.

 

[Cena's Little Helper]

Orndorff, in my opinion, is the most underrated performer of the 80s. He was in great shape, he was as strong as an ox, and he had the most impressively executed piledriver, ever. Furthermore, whoever said he wasn't a good mike worker, I have no clue what you're talking about; yeah, he had a pretty thick southern accent, but that's about it. He was a short-fused, explosively violent man who had a chip on his shoulder (look at how his feud with Hulk Hogan started or how he broke away from the Heenan Family). So, I'm going with Orndorff.

Also, if your name wasn't Hayabusa, then your stuff in FMW meant nothing.

 

[Big Sexy]

I don't care how many hardcore matches Hakushi has been in while in Japan. Who the fuck has this guy ever beaten. The man lost to Barry fucking Horowitz for God's sake. You can tell me all you want about how tough this guy is, but Orndorff is tougher. Paul Orndorff has beaten guys like Jake Roberts, JYD, and Roddy Piper. He was in the main event of the first Wrestlemania and was a legit tough guy. He's also the reason Vader left WCW because Orndorff kicked his ass backstage.

Maybe the only thing that hurts him is losing to Barry Horrowitz, but I think the fact e feuded with Bret Hat before that rescues him a bit.

It's not much of a feud when you lose every match. And if that's not the case then Orndorff had a couple feuds with Hulk Hogan. Hogan > Hart.

Orndorff was a career loser, never winning when it counted.

Orndorff has 2 WCW tag title reigns and a TV title reign. What has Hakushi ever won? That's right not shit.

Hakushi has wrestled in an ECW environment such as FMW. And while I think Orndoff can hold his own in the ring, Hakushi would be better suited to the surroundings and can pick up the win against him.

Once again it doesn't take a fucking genious to pick up weapons and hit people with them. Orndorff would do just fine.

The problem I have with Orndorff is he never actually won anything. Name a single big match that he won.

He's beaten Piper, Iron Sheik, JYD.

Hakushi was at least cool looking so I'll go with him.

Wow that's a great reason to vote for him.