Does anyone think Vince knew of Edge's career-ending injury BEFORE WM 27?

[President Evil]

I was watching Edge's last match against Alberto del Rio the other night, and then it how soon Edge learned about his career ending situation just a mere 12 hours later the following morning. Leading up to him making the announcement live on Raw that night. It started to click on my mind, how Vince has said in the past that as a promoter, its his responsibility to deliver what he has advertised. So it was on his shoulders to make sure that Edge vs del Rio match happened at Mania.

I'll tell you right now where Im going with this. Vince and a couple of doctors may have known about Edge's serious injury days if not a week before the event. If this match would have been at a less popular pay per view, or a Raw, Edge could have been pulled out of it, but knowing Vince's style, being at Mania, he just went with it and took the risk. The risk of Edge being just one move away from being paralyzed for life. Thats messed up. For fear of the scenario of pulling that match fans might demand a refund, whether its from those live in attendance, or ppv buyers.

Plus I remember that match taking place FIRST had so many fans buzzing that it was weird that a World title match would be the opening match. Its like they just wanted to get that match out of the way as soon as possible.

What do you guys think.

 

[Davi323]

I think it's a bit of a stretch. If they knew that Edge was going to be done, Del Rio would have gotten the victory. Not to mention, the obvious, if he had knowingly put Edge in that kind of situation, and something serious did happen, Edge's family would have had a hell of a fun day in court.

 

[The Brain]

Are you suggesting that Vince and the doctors knew but Edge himself did not? That is highly unlikely. Even if you think Vince would withhold this kind of information, which he wouldn't, do you really think a doctor wouldn't inform a patient about his condition? I think the doctor's responsibility is to take care of the patient. He wouldn't place a ppv match above somebody's health. If a doctor knew then Edge knew. Simple as that.

 

[SEMM]

If he did know about it before hand, which is always a possibility granted, why would Del Rio not have won the title?

He was certainly getting pushed hard enough and it's not like Edge's career would've been negatively affected by going out on a loss. Not to mention the steam Del Rio lost afterwards (or maybe that was just the move to RAW).

But no, I don't believe he knew about it beforehand.

 

[SD619]

I highly doubt that anyone(including Vince) knew of Edge's injury before WM 27. Edge himself said that he went to the doctors after the event and that's when he came to know of his injury. If Vince knew that Edge was injured, he would definitely have booked a Del Rio victory or some angle wheere Edge got beaten up after the match.

Atmost, Vince would have known that Edge was a bit sore and probably that was the reason for the match being quite short (for a WM title match).

 

[Peoples_Champ]

Del Rio is a professional in the ring and was trusted to take care of Edge's back. If you re-watch the match, the intensity and impact of some of the moves are less than what they should have been.

If Edge was absolutely too injured to wrestle, they would have had some kind of swerve - like Edge being found beat up in the backstage area and Christian defending the title on his behalf or something. That's how they got Dynamite Kid to drop the tag titles (he got hit with Jimmy Hart's megaphone during the walk-out and was carried out to the back).

You guys are idiots if you think Vince, Edge and Del Rio didn't know how badly hurt Edge's back was prior to the match.

 

[klunderbunker]

I think maybe to a degree, but probably not the severity of how bad it was. I remember hearing Edge say that he knew he was having problems coming into Mania, but there are multiple instances of guys working hurt for weeks before taking time off for the neck surgery. Benoit did it for like a month before KOTR 2001 and geez Austin was hurt for like two years before he took time off. This isn't a shocking development if it's true and if Edge, Del Rio, Vince and most importantly the doctors were ok with him competing, does it really matter?

 

[Mustang Sally]

....if he had knowingly put Edge in that kind of situation, and something serious did happen, Edge's family would have had a hell of a fun day in court.

I agree. Even if Vince did know beforehand the danger involved, Edge would have known it, too. If I were to guess how it went down, I'd say Vince discussed the whole thing with him and let the decision about performing in this match rest with Adam Copeland.

Even at that, I would suggest that Vince might even have tried to talk Edge out of it, but the performer made the call that he would wrestle. Remember, even though the neurologists had given him the "next match might be his last" edict, Edge knew well beforehand that he was asking for trouble by continuing to perform. As it was his own body, he might have known it even before he reported his problem to management, due to "my arms going numb during a match" event that he told us about.

Yes, Vince McMahon can be a vicious businessman, but I don't believe he'd fool around with a man's life like that. Even if a possible lawsuit scared him more than risking a life, it would amount to the same thing.

 

[The Brain]

I think maybe to a degree, but probably not the severity of how bad it was. I remember hearing Edge say that he knew he was having problems coming into Mania, but there are multiple instances of guys working hurt for weeks before taking time off for the neck surgery. Benoit did it for like a month before KOTR 2001 and geez Austin was hurt for like two years before he took time off. This isn't a shocking development if it's true and if Edge, Del Rio, Vince and most importantly the doctors were ok with him competing, does it really matter?

Also remember how a lot of people thought it was going to become a triple threat match with Chrstian being added? Christian was heavily involved in this angle and it's probably safe to say he was some kind of backup plan if Edge either couldn't go or needed someone to share the workload. Like you said, the doctors were ok with him competing. It's not like Vince was some kind of evil monster withholding information. Edge would have known the severity of the injury before Vince did anyway.

 

[VinnieSunshine]

They knew he was injured, but not to the severity that it was. Its partly why he beat ADR at Mania. He got checked out and thats when they found out that he would not be able to wrestle again.

BUT...do I think Vince knew about it and made Edge go wrestle anyway? No. Vince is shady but not to that extent. Besides, I dont think he would risk one of his guys getting permanently injured just to put on a show. Guys have wrestled through injury, but Edge's back couldn't take anymore and they all knew it in the end.

If Edge had gotten seriously injured in the opening match and he couldn't walk, that would've put a dark cloud over the whole night. The match probably went first so Edge could go right to the hospital and get it checked out as soon as the match ended.

 

[gameshowfreak]

I've watched that video on youtube so many times where edge announces his retirement and Edge implies he was working in a lot of pain and that WWE had him see doctors before and after Wrestlemania, and that they cleared him for mania, but after a re-evaluation the doctors told him that's it. If I'm right that speaks volumes for Del Rio carrying Edge through that match. But the thing that confuses me is why did they book Edge vs. Del Rio in a ladder match at extreme rules, knowing full well that Edge was hurting and he likely wouldn't be able to compete. (remember Christian had to win a battle royal to take Edge's spot).

It's widely believed Del Rio was supposed to win at Mania but it was changed so Edge could retire as WHC. and then he was supposed to win at extreme rules but they changed it so that Edge and Christian could have that moment (which would explain Christian's pointless 5-day reign as WHC)

 

[Xkimo]

I think it was all part of Edge's plan to retire "hot" and relevant. He had never defended a championship at Wrestlemania before, and although everyone knew about his injury, he decided to take one more risk and earn one more career achievement while going out with a bang. Defending your championship at Wrestlemania and announcing your retirement the next day is a pretty damn epic finish to a career, its another reason why Edge is a Hall of Famer only a year after retirement, just like HBK's career in all its glory.

 

[Cookie14]

I think Vince and Edge both knew about the seriousness of his condition before the match. I also believe that Edge would have wanted to wrestle the match so he could go out as champion, having won on the grandest stage of them all.
If you watch the match, there was no major bumps, in fact, there was almost nothing that was high impact. This is probably why the match was on first, people would remember the finish and Edge's subsequent retirement as opposed to the actual match.

 

[ThaSandman]

I think Vince and Edge both knew about the seriousness of his condition before the match. I also believe that Edge would have wanted to wrestle the match so he could go out as champion, having won on the grandest stage of them all.
If you watch the match, there was no major bumps, in fact, there was almost nothing that was high impact. This is probably why the match was on first, people would remember the finish and Edge's subsequent retirement as opposed to the actual match.

You hit the nail right on the head. I'm pretty sure it was even reported on this site that the original plan was for Del Rio to go over and win the belt due to Christian turning on Edge and costing him the match and the title. When they found out exactly how bad it was, I think they decided that someone like Edge who has actually been one of their top stars over the last few years deserves to go out on top in his final match especially at Mania.

 

[thebromm]

Whether or not they knew would not have effected the outcome. Del Rio was not ready to be champion and they knew it. Then he proved it in the fall as WWE Champion. I'm sure they knew beforehand. I guarentee Vince was advised of all possibillities as far as outcomes with both the match and Edge's health. It was Edge's call. Vince has this reputation as a ruthless businessman. Well deserved. What you need to remember is Vince is loyal to those that are loyal to him. Vince NEVER would have forced Edge into that match if Edge even had an ounce of doubt. I'm sure Vince probably did try and talk him out of it. Edge being the performer that he is, certainly insisted on going through with the Mania match. You honestly couldn't write a better script for a man going out. Winning at WrestleMania and retiring as World Champion.

 

[Vintage]

If Vince was cetain Edge was retiring, Edge would have did the J.O.B
You always win your debut match. Thats the unwritten rule.
You are supposed to pave the way on your way out by laying down for someone like how was done for you on the way in.

The plan was probably always for Edge to retain at Mania and drop it at the following PPV so ppl had a reason to buy it. Edge knew that would change if the office knew he was done and he kept that to himself for a night and told Del Rio to protect him as best he could. If Vince knew any differently he would have milked it for every dime it was worth. this match would have been last, edge stretchered out and got Del Rio the right kind of heat he desperately needed.

 

[A-KO]

First off, it wasn't the next again night that Edge retired after Wrestlemania 27, it was the week after that. WM27 was on the 3rd of April. Edge retired 11th April, not the 4th. If Edge was feeling the pain for a while then he would not have had as many matches as he used to have. If you look at how many times Edge actually wrestled in the few months leading up to his retirement, it was a lot less than the rest of the roster. So yes Vince knew of Edge being hurt, but whether he knew it was career-ending, I think Edge told him the week after WM27.

 

[AndThat'sTheBottomLine]

I think both Vince and Edge new how severe the injury was. I also believe that Vince left it up to Edge as to whether or not he'd continue until after mania. Edge wanted one more match at mania to defend and keep his title. I think the original intent was for delrio to win but after they found out how bad it was they decided to let him retire as champ which very few get to do so im sure it was a huge honor for him. Im not shocked that vince mightve known but he would never force a wrestler to compete if he might be permanently injuryed as a result hes not that heartless.

 

[FutureChamp328]

Going into Wrestlemania 27 the original plan was for Alberto to go over and then enter into a lengthy feud with Edge and Christian. When the news came out about Edge's injury the plans were changed so that he could retire as the champion purely out of respect for him. Even though the general rule of thumb is that the best way to go out is on your back it worked out really well because Edge and Christian got their Wrestlemania moment together, which must have meant a lot, and it gave both Alberto and Christian extra material to work with going into Extreme Rules.

 

[Ubiquitous]

Edge cleared this up during a radio interview, right near his hometown. He was helping to advertise edge appreciation day which they held on smackdown a few months back. He said he was well aware of what his injury COULD mean. Before Mania, all parties involved knew he was going in really hurt, but they hadn't yet said he couldn't wrestle. According to edge, Vince gave him the option not to wrestle, and he said that he told Vince he wanted to wrestle until the day he was told he couldn't. He never said if the outcome was changed due to the severity of the potential injury, however he said "it sure was awesome to retire as champion" or something to that affect.

 

[neildittmar]

Before Mania, all parties involved knew he was going in really hurt, but they hadn't yet said he couldn't wrestle. According to edge, Vince gave him the option not to wrestle, and he said that he told Vince he wanted to wrestle until the day he was told he couldn't. He never said if the outcome was changed due to the severity of the potential injury, however he said "it sure was awesome to retire as champion" or something to that affect.

That's quite interesting, thanks for sharing. A lot of it confirms feelings I've had about the situation stemming from right after last years Wrestlemania up to the present.

The argument that Edge, Vince, and other higher ups in WWE didn't know how hurt he was going into Mania is just silly. I'll even go a step further and say that all who were directly involved knew that Edge was taking a huge risk going into the match with Del Rio and there was a slight chance something tragic could've happened. Edge is a wrestler though and that's what wrestlers do until somebody tells them that they can't.

That said, I think it's important to realize that Edge's injury isn't something that "just occured" or was the result of one particular event. Edge's issues likely stem from continued, systematic abuse to his back and spine doing the things he did for so many years, particularly the craziness (read: TLC matches) he and Christian were involved in during the late 90's.

I'm also fully convinced that Edge keeping the WHC at Mania was a reward for a career well done rather than adhering to a pre-established storyline or respecting kayfabe. The track record shows that Vince is loyal to those who are loyal to him. Edge stuck around in WWF when he probably could've got some quick cash and a guaranteed contract in WCW. He also participated in those aforementioned TLC matches that undoubtedly helped turn the tide during the Monday Night Wars. After a "blink and you'd miss it" unfulfilled stint in WCW in the early 90's, Edge became a WWF guy and stayed a WWE guy up until the end of his career. He was also a very established, very successful performer. Put the two together and you have someone that Vince will probably bend over backwards for.

I certainly understand why Edge/Del Rio at Mania played out the way it did. Do I agree with the way things went though? Absolutely not. In my little universe kayfabe is king, tradition is established for a reason, and you always go out on your back. I believe both Del Rio and Christian could've got a massive rub if Edge had been dominated and thoroughly dismantled by Del Rio at Mania. Alberto was on a streak of sorts by putting guys on the shelf, and adding Edge to the list would've catapulted him into the stratosphere, especially if he was the one to have ended his career. Christian would've been the life-long friend who swore revenge against Del Rio for putting his "brother" on the shelf permanently. The story could've played out for many months, would've catapulted both guys, and Edge still would've made his final speech (mostly intact) and received his obligatory Hall of Fame induction with nothing being taken away from his career.

 

[ThisIsLCS]

I wont Pretend I Know VKM, But I dont think he would do something like that. As much as he wants to Deliver a Great Show, he Is a Business man. Doing something that wouldve endangered Edge's Life would be the LAST thing he would wanna do.

 

[PlayTheGameHHH]

Are you suggesting that Vince and the doctors knew but Edge himself did not? That is highly unlikely. Even if you think Vince would withhold this kind of information, which he wouldn't, do you really think a doctor wouldn't inform a patient about his condition? I think the doctor's responsibility is to take care of the patient. He wouldn't place a ppv match above somebody's health. If a doctor knew then Edge knew. Simple as that.

Vince continued the show after Hart fell to his death. Don't make him out to be some sort of angel, he would happily allow Edge to go out like that. However, it's VERY unlikely they knew before Edge. It's like you said if the doctor knew, Edge knew.

 

[justin71]

I noticed they were working fairly safe in that match so I'm merely assuming Edge knew that it was going to be his last match with the mindset of work safe be good enough without allot of too much high risk to cause further injury. I think that theory was plausible, but I'm thinking if he did indeed know that the injury was the case Christian would have made it a triple threat match for the one opportunity to work opposite his best friend.

 

[Defekt]

Other than your speculation there is nothing to suggest this is true.

Anyway, I really doubt it. Do you remember GAB 2006 and what a disaster that was because of elevated liver enzymes? If Vince was gonna trick talent into working when they weren't medically cleared he would have done it then.