Does anybody see Undertaker losing at Breaking Point?

[S prince]

Undertaker vs CM Punk this sunday. Breaking Point. Submission Match.



The deadman just returned recently. I can't put my finger on how the match will finish and CM Punk just recently won the title again, so I might find it hard for him to drop it so soon, but hes up against the Undertaker. (in my honest opinion i think CM Punk will walk away champion still) but I just don't understand how CM Punk could beat Undertaker. He seems overmatched, overpowered, and Undertaker has the triangle chokehold whatever you wanna call it as a submission finisher. I see Taker losing either via DQ or some type of run in from someone else, not sure who?? I can't see a clean finish with Taker losing, just no way...

 

[OmegaDriver]

Yes I completely agree that CM Punk will walk out champion at BP. I don't see him dropping the title so soon, although, it is Punk, and we all know how the E loves to give him crappy little title reigns. SO it is very possible that they'll put the title on The Deadman and give Punk another meaningless title run. And putting the title on Punk was probably just a way to get the belt of Jeff and then transition it to Undertaker for possibly the last time? But hopefully, Punk will win by DQ or something, becuase I don't see Taker tapping out to the Anaconda Vice. Or any other submission for that matter.
Maybe a run in from someone like Matt Hardy though?
I mean Matt just randomly turned face for no apparent reason, and he's semi-fueding with Punk right now. And with the whole Punk/Taker program going, Matt really has nothing to do. So making it seem like his face turn was all fake, and running in to help Punk would be the perfect way to get him into the big picture. I think it's possiblity, I don't count anything out.

 

[Spaceman Spif]

I don't see him losing, but I don't see him winning the title either. He'll like wint he match due to a DQ. I really can't see creative having Taker tap out to Punk on a B PPV. It just won't happen. If Taker can beat Michaels at Mania, he won't tap to Punk at Breaking Point. Taker has only tapped once, and that to Angle, but the match was ruled a draw, so not sure if that really counts. So they won't have him tap to Punk. So they will have to do something that gets Punk DQ'ed or even have a no contest.

 

[It's...Baylariat!]

I see him losing. Because if he goes over, it kills the momentum that Punk has had. He worked hard to get it back from when Jeff beat him for the belt shortly after his MITB cash in. Punk's simply the best heel in the WWE right now and he doesn't need to lose, he needs to win. Same goes for Taker, only the opposite. He doesn't need to win, he needs to lose. Not convincingly, but Punk has to walk out the Champion. Taker looks better for chasing Punk, that way we don't have to worry about Punk never being able to beat Taker once the belt changes hands.

 

[The Mark of Zur-En-Arrh]

They haven't really thought this through tbh. I've stated this before, but i'll do it again.

CM Punk has only ever pinned one person in ANY of his title defenses and that was JBL. In all his defenses to Batista, he won due to some kind of DQ, and when he retained against Jeff it was by DQ.

If he can't get a pinfall victory on either Batista or Jeff Hardy in a title match, why would anyone believe that he can make the Deadman tap out? Especially when an Olympic Gold medalist is the only person to ever succesfully make Taker submit, and STILL didn't get the win at the end of the match.

There is no DQ's in submission matches either to my knowledge. Getting your opponent to tap is the only way to obtain victory in this match type, but WWE have fucked with the rules of their matches before. There never used to be ropebreaks in HIAC but in the last 2 there have been ropebreaks, so don't be surprised if suddenly DQ's are part of the rules now.

I imagine Punk will find some way to make Taker pass out like Mankind used to with the Mandible Claw, and that's how the match will end, otherwise we'll have a new World Heavyweight Champion in a fortnight's time. They were advertising #1 contender matches between Punk and Rey not too long ago for shows after this event, but you know how Vince likes to swerve stuff to confuse the smarks, so who knows?

 

[Jack-Hammer]

To be honest, I can see Taker losing at Breaking Point and it can be done in a way that won't take anything away from either guy if the WWE does it right. Taker is a legend and Punk NEEDS a feud with him to be considered a legitimate main eventer and champion, that's not going to happen if Taker goes over at BP.

Punk has a lot of momentum that he doesn't need to lose, and having the Undertaker tap will take something away from him in my opinion. A DQ loss is too predictable, though it will ultimately do the job I suppose. Locking Taker in a submission hold until he passes out and beating him cleanly also takes something away from him. Punk needs to go into the match with a lot of heat and needs to come out with it even more and, of course, the best way to do that is to cheat his ass off to win.

I'd like to see Punk render Taker "unconscious" with a pair of brass knuckles or several good shots with a chair, after "accidentally", poking the ref in the eye. Not knocking him out, just keep him distracted for a few minutes. After Taker's out, Punk locks on the Anaconda Vice for a few minutes and when the ref comes back in the picture, he sees Taker in a submission hold. Now, for all he can assume, Taker's been in the hold for so long that he's passed out from the pain. He checks Taker's arm, it drops 3 times, Punk retains and gains credibility by having a victory over a legend and has done so by doing what a good heel does, namely cheat his ass off without getting caught. Taker loses, but he doesn't lose any credibility. Since he didn't tap, he doesn't lose credibility. And, in the mind of a lot of people, since he didn't tap then he didn't submit.

Putting him in a submission hold until he passes out does have its merit, but when Hart did it with Austin, Austin was also bleeding profusely from the head and they factored in blood loss into the equation. Doing it here won't work unless Vince eases up on the PG rule a little and let's Taker juice heavily.

 

[SSJPhenom]

'Taker will probably lose at Breaking Point. He will not tap, however. I see CM Punk doing something heelish like using a weapon knocking 'Taker out and then slapping on the Andaconda Vice and the ref will call the match because 'Taker will be unresponsive.

That is how it will go down and to be honest, even though I am a 'Taker fan, I hope CM Punk does steal a win from 'Taker. It will establish CM Punk as a credible heel champion and it will make their feud alot more interesting.

 

[RatedxOMG]

One other option is to have Undertaker choke him out and the match stops but CM Punk plays the i did not tap even if i passed out so the match should be no contest card.
For this to go over remotely well they would need to make CM Punk look credible before Undertaker applies the Hell's Gate.

 

[JBK2008]

It would be nothing short of a miracle at this point for Undertaker NOT to walk out of Breaking Point the World Heavyweight Champion. Hopefully CM Punk can do something this Friday night on SmackDown! Not that a don't want Undertaker to win. I just hate to see all the momentum Punk has gained be gone just like that. Maybe Punk has something up his sleeve. We'll see. I'm looking forward to see the Anaconda Vice be used again though.

 

[Shua]

It's pretty much a no-win situation. If Taker wins, Punk'll have another short title reign on his hands. If Punk wins, Taker's return will pretty much have been for nothing. The only possible outcome that would leave the door open for a rematch is a DQ....and, really, how many DQ endings have you seen in submission matches?

The E really screwed themselves over here. If, say, Taker had returned for a "warm-up" at BP (I understand Knox isn't doing much of anything these days), then it'd make his return worthwhile. Matt Hardy vs Punk could've been for the title at BP, just to close the chapter on the Hardy/Punk saga....lengthening Punk's reign in the process.

Then have the two meet at the next PPV, finish with a DQ(via Mike Knox), which'd hurt neither man's credibility, and extend Punk's reign another month. Culminate at Bragging Rights with Taker winnning the title.

But, alas, Punk's reign'll probably be at an end come Sunday.

 

[Miko]

I cant see Undertaker tapping out, I cant see Punk making him pass out with pain, it just wouldnt look right. Mainly because Punk just doesnt have that kind of credibility.

I reckon they'll work it so as Punk keeps the title, Undertaker has a good reason to be pissed off and they continue it for another PPV, where Punk also weasels his way out of it. Undertaker doesnt lose cleanly at all and certainly never through tapping out.

 

[TheBestThereEverWillBe]

When i first heard of this match, i thought that there is no way Punk retains...but now that i think about it, 1 more crap title run for Punk would be to epic on his career. Another reason, i saw somewhere on one of these sites somewhere they were advertising Punk and someone else in world title matches at some live events.

So i give this one to Punk. HOWEVER...Undertaker WILL NOT tap out. theres no way.

CM Punk (C) vs. The Undertaker
CM Punk retains via DQ

 

[Suneeboy]

They are trying to building all of the titles back up. IC, ECW, Tag, US, Diva's, Women, and the WWE and WHC are no exception. Cena and Undertaker are going to go over at Breaking Point because like Jericho said in a shoot interview...the WWE is in "Crisis Mode". If Punk goes over a RETURNING Taker it makes Taker look old and weak, and it makes the WHC look even weaker because Punk is not a credible champion I don't care what the hell the IWC says about him. They want mega stars who either sell merchandise or sell tickets to hold the titles right now so they can build the rest of the roster up by having them eventually go over. I will be surprised if Undertaker doesn't leave champion.

I was watching the Rise and Fall of WCW DVD and someone said in reference to the NWA getting a TV deal and who would be the world champion. They decided to give it to Ric Flair and the logic was, "You want your biggest star as champion". CM Punk is not a bigger star than Taker. He loses. He has at least 10 more years in his career so he'll get another shot. Right now, Taker needs to carry, no matter of fact The Undertaker MUST carry Smackdown. Give him the strap. Dumb move by creative if he doesn't get the title here. 'Nuff said.

 

[Klown_Karnage]

The way I see it, I think Punk is going to win the match through one form of screwjob or another. The only way I can see him doing so, however, is forfeiting the match, which might be an interesting angle. CM Punk, manufacturing a circumstance in which he cannot compete against the Dead Man might be a way to go...but of course, 'Taker isn't going to take that lying down. He'll come after Punk, and that might be how they decide to put 'Taker over in the PPV.

However, there's still a good chance Punk will lose just from what I saw of the Smackdown spoilers in which Punk is put over on the final Smackdown prior to the PPV. That's somewhat akin to a kiss of death for someone going into a PPV. If they truly get put over, you can pretty much bet that WWE is going to pull a switch.

 

[Trev]

Punk has worked too hard not to retain. He is at his best right now, and having Taker take the strap from him would be a huge mistake. However, Taker can't tap. The only wat I can see this ending is Punk running away and Taker chasing him down and catching him on the stage. There he can beat Punk down untill Kane enters and attacks Undertaker, throwing him off the stage. This way Taker can not continue so they would have to stop the match. This sets up for Taker/Kane at Hell in a Cell.

 

[jrocc4dub]

They are trying to building all of the titles back up. IC, ECW, Tag, US, Diva's, Women, and the WWE and WHC are no exception. Cena and Undertaker are going to go over at Breaking Point because like Jericho said in a shoot interview...the WWE is in "Crisis Mode". If Punk goes over a RETURNING Taker it makes Taker look old and weak, and it makes the WHC look even weaker because Punk is not a credible champion I don't care what the hell the IWC says about him. They want mega stars who either sell merchandise or sell tickets to hold the titles right now so they can build the rest of the roster up by having them eventually go over. I will be surprised if Undertaker doesn't leave champion.

I was watching the Rise and Fall of WCW DVD and someone said in reference to the NWA getting a TV deal and who would be the world champion. They decided to give it to Ric Flair and the logic was, "You want your biggest star as champion". CM Punk is not a bigger star than Taker. He loses. He has at least 10 more years in his career so he'll get another shot. Right now, Taker needs to carry, no matter of fact The Undertaker MUST carry Smackdown. Give him the strap. Dumb move by creative if he doesn't get the title here. 'Nuff said.

you hate punk don't you? i've seen you talk shit about him time and time again. takers a legend and shouldn't be made to look weak but, punk needs a semi long reign as champ. smackdown is fine without taker. it's by far the best of wwe programming and takers only been back for 2 weeks. punks gotta go over. it won't be clean and taker wont tap, but remember, they are in montreal. wwe loves bringing up the screwjob. watch it happen again sunday. that wcw logic of the biggest star needs the title is bullshit, that's whythe company went under and vince bought them out. jericho was talking about they need to make new stars. they're doing that with punk and it'd be stupid to have him lose the strap this soon. we all know you hate punk and think "he ain't that good". it's your opinion and youre entitled to it. i just don't agree with you and think youre a little to biased and don't see that punk is the future of wwe. it's a dumb move if punk loses to taker. no, if punk loses the strap to taker. taker is a legend and doesn't need the title. taker also seems to have no problem putting younger guys over. if he can put nathan jones and some of the other pieces of shit over he has, he can do the same for punk. wouldn't be surprised at all to see batista get involved in this and move to smackdown.

 

[obiwansidisi]

I don't know... I don't see Taker losing cleanly either, but again, the "Heel" Punk isn't my favorite. I don't dislike Punk, I dislike the way that Vince has been using him for a while now. I see Taker losing to help put him over. I see either the GTS being applied, where Taker gets KO'd, and therefore can't continue the match, or Batista or Hardy making a run-in and getting the match thrown out, or at least accidentally hitting Taker with something so that Punk can make him tap.

 

[Super Crazy]

Spoiler: Undertaker/Punk Plans

The Wrestling Observer is reporting that the original WWE creative plans called for The Undertaker to defeat CM Punk this Sunday at Breaking Point and win the World Heavyweight Championship. It should be noted that these were the original plans for the event as of a few weeks ago and as always in WWE things could definitely change by the time the PPV rolls around.

The way I see things going down is that Undertaker will win the belt. They will give it to him due to the fact that this is his big return since Wrestlemania. I do not see Undertaker losing this match as they hype it up like they do every year he returns after Wrestlemania. They even over-hyped his " return to Smackdown " and all he did was appear in the last 10 minutes. Anyway, Undertaker w

 

[Paradox]

I really don't see 'Taker winning here. I really wouldn't make sense for him to win the title from Punk(who their trying to make a strong main event heel) three weeks after he won the title from Hardy. It really wouldn't be logical to put the belt on Punk only for him to lose it. I would allow him to have a longer run with the title. That is part of the reason I was frustrated with wwe when they gave Hardy the strap. Punk's first reign was a complete joke, he really didn't have a solid defense against anyone. (JBL? Really a big match there) before he was forced to relinquish it.

As many have said creative seems to be putting more of a focus on the belts at the moment. That's why I believe that 'Taker is there mainly to help elevate Punk to the next level as a heel. Which he's close to/]. His segment were he came out as Hardy was amazing. He received some serious heat for that. I see Punk some how holding on to the belt here. Not winning, but by some heelish move.

(Though on the main site, they said creatives original plans were for 'Taker to come back and win the belt from Punk. Something I pray doesn't happen.)

 

[666_The_Game_666]

Seeing Punk just got the title back 2 weeks ago i find him winning on Sunday but he wont make Taker tap hes probley get Disqualified or something and push his feud with Taker as the one feud to watch on Smackdown

 

[Mantaur Rodeo Clown]

They are trying to building all of the titles back up. IC, ECW, Tag, US, Diva's, Women, and the WWE and WHC are no exception. Cena and Undertaker are going to go over at Breaking Point because like Jericho said in a shoot interview...the WWE is in "Crisis Mode". If Punk goes over a RETURNING Taker it makes Taker look old and weak, and it makes the WHC look even weaker because Punk is not a credible champion I don't care what the hell the IWC says about him. They want mega stars who either sell merchandise or sell tickets to hold the titles right now so they can build the rest of the roster up by having them eventually go over. I will be surprised if Undertaker doesn't leave champion.

Jericho in a shoot interview? Well since you want to start shootin cowboy, here's a few facts for you.

• Having so many title changes throughout the year does NOT, I repeat NOT add anything to the title, and makes it look trivial, regardless of who wins it. Prestigious titles are characterised by solid reigns.

• The WWE is not in Crisis mode, no matter what that hypocrite Jericho says. They are in a "building new stars instead of relying on old faithful to carry the company forever" mode.

• A 'returning' Undertaker isn't really that new. At all. He did it in his prime, not only his twilight. Remember Summerslam 1994? Remember nearly every year in the 2000's? Remember when Kurt Angle, World Heavyweight Champion at the time beat a returning Undertaker at NWO 2006?

• Punk is a credible champion, as evidenced by the massive heat he gets fromthe crowd and the incredible promos and matches he has had. No matter what suneeboy says. Why does a veteran have to hold the title while new stars are built up? WHY?

I was watching the Rise and Fall of WCW DVD and someone said in reference to the NWA getting a TV deal and who would be the world champion. They decided to give it to Ric Flair and the logic was, "You want your biggest star as champion". CM Punk is not a bigger star than Taker. He loses. He has at least 10 more years in his career so he'll get another shot. Right now, Taker needs to carry, no matter of fact The Undertaker MUST carry Smackdown. Give him the strap. Dumb move by creative if he doesn't get the title here. 'Nuff said.

Excuse me Mr Suneeboy, but why the fuck does Taker need another title reign? What is he going to add to the title picture, besides detract from Punk. You said losing would make him look old and weak, well thats because HE IS old and weak. He doesnt need the win, because the WWE isn't getting their first TV deal, theyre building stars for the future. CM Punk has 'carried' Smackdown for most of the Summer. Dumb post by you, regardless of what creative does.

 

[dannymurphy12345]

I can see cm punk winning a bp not with a clean finish but not a totaly heel victory mabey a little outside interferience to take away the ref and then mabey a chair shot or somethink like that but i cant see undertaker winning a title this fast but you can never be sure what the wwe team will do

 

[King Patrick Star]

I could see CM Punk retaining at Breaking Point, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Taker captures number 7. It’s not the Granddaddy of the All, so anything is possible. If this were Mania, then no, Taker is not losing. An ending I see happening, if Punk were to indeed win here, would be for Taker to just lay motionless to the Anaconda Vice and the ref raising Taker’s hand 3 times and not respond. Then after the bell rings and Punk is celebrating, I could see Taker rising, vintage Taker, to show he’s not completely down. If Punk loses, oh well!!

 

[shafe_41]

I can see cm punk winning a bp not with a clean finish but not a totaly heel victory mabey a little outside interferience to take away the ref and then mabey a chair shot or somethink like that but i cant see undertaker winning a title this fast but you can never be sure what the wwe team will do

What does a chairshot have to do with anything? It's a submission match.

God.


Anywho... I'm not even going to sit and predict who will win because the WWE has pulled the wool over our eyes a lot in the past few months as far as title matches go. Who expected to see Ziggler win the IC Title at SSlam? This guy did. Who expected Orton to retain in his cage match against Batista? This guy did. Who never expected Jeff Hardy to win at... well whatever PPV comes before SSlam. I can't keep this effing things straight anymore. But the answer is me there too.

What SHOULD happen is the WWE needs to keep the ball rolling here with Punk. Think about the next PPV. Hell in a Cell. IF Taker is going to win, is he going to win in a silly submission match... or Hell in a Cell? I'm taking the Cell. Because how would that make Punk look if he loses the title... again... 3 weeks after he won it? Pretty horrible. At least tack another 3 weeks onto his title reign if you're going to have Taker go over at some point. Punk needs to build credibility somehow and if he can't do that over Taker, who else can he do it with? Mysterio is suspended. Note on Mysterio... I think Punk destroying Mysterio in a feud would be great for Punk. Mysterio needs a few GTS shots to the face. Plus with Edge out, that really doesn't leave anybody above Punk other than Jericho. But Jericho is super-heel (even though he gets cheers because he's reached legendary status), so Jericho and Punk won't be having a feud. The next in the pecking order is Morrison... but Punk would gain nothing over Morrison. And back to Punk/Taker... what looks better to build Punk as a good (future great) heel champion? To retain over Taker? Or to capture the title over Taker in a match that Taker pretty much has his stamp on in HIAC. If you look at Punk going over in either of these matches (or both), it's really a win/win situation for him. He'll either be the first man to make Taker submit. Or he'll beat Taker at his own game (essentially) in the Cell.

The thing we have to rememebr with Punk is this... just because he's had short reigns doesn't mean he's not destined for superstardom. Look at Orton's first win. It was huge. People mtfo for that. He lost it less than a month later. Punk's first reign wasn't great... but it was longer than a month. A couple short reigns isn't always a bad thing. You have to break a couple eggs to make cake. These short reigns are Punk's eggs. The cake will come with a nice long heel run as champion.

 

[RawIsRamsey]

Call me crazy, but I think Taker may put Punk over clean. J.R. has been putting over the fact that Taker has never submitted (which is BS, just ask Angle). Punk is going back to the Anaconda Vice (which J.R. completely no-sold...."what's CM Punk's vice?" dumbass). Taker has the Hell's Gate/Gogoplata which, if I recall, was "banned" for storyline purposes and was technically never reinstated. This only gives Taker the Dragon Sleeper (which is more a transition move these days as opposed to a finisher) and just choking a bitch (which would result in a DQ after 5 seconds). They seem to be legit serious about making CM Punk a main event star, especially with their lack of ME heels (even the one that's out, Edge, is coming back a babyface). Now would be the right time to strike. Punk's legitimacy as champion will depend on getting a win over a big name, and a clean win at that (the long lost art of "putting over"). They pseudo-buried their 2nd biggest name on Smackdown on his way out the door to put Punk over and give him the ME cred, but it was all to a recent ME-level guy (it hasn't even been a year since Jeff's first title reign...it has since Punk's). Having a perennial main eventer put him over is just what he needs to take that extra step to greatness.

However, should they go with the Gogoplata finish, they either need Punk to not tap and pass out, just to sell his toughness, or have Punk bring up Taker's use of a "banned move" (if they remember that) and gain the title back.

Now Hell In A Cell, on the other hand, is a whole other beast...we'll get to that next month...