Best 'Big Man' Wrestler of All Time.

[SSJPhenom]

Over a year ago, I posted a thread that asked if The Undertaker was the best big man wrestler of all time. I liked the responses that this thread got. It had great debates and great discussions about many different big man wrestlers of the past.

In the thread, I was told that I should create a new thread with a poll. A poll using some of the other big man wrestlers that we had discussed in the thread. To my knowledge, this hasn't been done yet. So I am going to do it now.

Who is the best 'BIG MAN' wrestler of all time?​

Criteria:
1. Must be 6'8" or taller.
2. Must be at or above 300lbs.
3. Must have wrestled the majority of their career has the bigger man.

*Who ever you pick must meet at least 2 of the above criteria*

For me, it's no mystery. I'm an Undertaker mark, so I'm going with The Phenom.

The Undertaker is 6'10" tall and he wrestled the majority of his career above the 300lb mark. His array of power moves, submission ability, striking ability, and even his high flying ability make him one of the most exciting wrestlers to watch in the ring. He also has the ability to tell a great story during a match. The crowd loves to see him compete and they are usually on the edge of their seats while he does so. So he knows how to play to a crowd. His mic speaking skills were never elite, however, his character never required him to say an awful lot. But, when he does speak, he isn't horrible at it. He's a 7 time Heavyweight Champion and has always been a main event level superstar since he debuted with the WWF/E.

Not only does he know how to play his character and put on a great wrestling match, he is also a huge draw for the WWE. To this day, 'Taker remains one of the most sought after superstars to see perform. I know of a lot of people that don't keep up with SmackDown at all when he's not on the program. I even know people that only watch WrestleMania to see his match. So he's very successful.

He's an obvious pick for best big man wrestler of all time, isn't he?

So, who do you pick?

 

[911 JP]

For me its kane. But to be specific the kane that was masked around 2002 to 2004, no matter what role he was given he played it and sold it, plus he is a good in ring performer. Kane also hasnt lost much of a step since then and has been in some memorable feuds. So as far as best big man of all time for me its kane.

 

[DangerousDave]

Sid Vicious was just that, vicious. The man was a psycho and always intense in the ring. He enjoyed hurting people as illustrated by his numerous stretcher jobs. I loved it when they would get the guy on the stretcher and Sid would knock the thing over. The best was when he got a jobber in the ring and took him to school.

 

[Theo Mays]

Undertaker is a pretty obvious as answer and he was the first guy that came to my mind. What he does in the ring for a guy his size and just how good he has remained is impressive. However I'm gonna go with Andre the Giant. While most people remember Andre as a worn down big man who struggled to move in the ring and was bodyslammed by Hulk Hogan. Andre at one point was a dominant force in professional wrestling. It was something different and he was a site to see. He could move in the ring and worked rather well with other superstars. He was undefeated for a majority of his career and it is a shame that many remember him as a shell of what he truly was.

 

[eljay7i]

My votes goes to Big Van Vader.. Especially during his WCW days when he was extremely dominant and won multiple Championships. The guy could do moonsaults, drop kicks etc that most guys his size could only dream of doing. I hated the latter part of his WWF run, because he was jobbing to often.

Honorouble mentions to Bam Bam Bigelow and Umaga

 

[6timehitta]

Historically, it Taker, no doubt about it. His Wrestlemania record says it all and not only that, he is the most respected wrestler in WWE, on top of being one of the top 5 most talented, But I was always a fan Dan Spivey..... Ok, ok, ok, ok lol, I have to go with Vader, The most agile big man ever!!!! Historically he's not looking in Taker's rearview mirror at all, but he is a great wrestling big man that IMHO he deserves to be in the HOF.

 

[Calderownz]

I'd go with a three-pronged situation.

1. The Undertaker. It's obvious. Great, big man. Quality worker. Hardly had horrible matches. Could work well with so many different types of wrestlers. The undefeated streak isn't just some bogus streak. He earned it by always being a pro and handling his business accordingly.

2. Mike Awesome. Wasn't your traditional big man. He was powerful and could work a big man's match, but he was also incredibly agile for such a big man. Had incredible matches with Tanaka that will go down in history as some of the much hardcore matches seen in the main events of major promotions on two continents. WCW doesn't tarnish his legacy, for me, they only tarnished any chances they had of succeeding.

3. Vader. Incredible smooth yet aggressive wrestler. Cool gimmick. Very agile for his size. He was a great champion for his size and played the heel role so well for a guy that could have just gotten by on his size.

 

[SarahGavins]

Undertaker. He has just been around for so long and deserves this honor. Played a great face and heel. Easily my favorite wrestler after The Rock stopped.

 

[JGlass]

I went with Andre the Giant. Sure, Vader and Bigelow were extremely impressive with their versatility in the ring, and it's hard to find a more quintessential big man than Taker, but Andre the Giant is the reason they were able to take the spotlight in wrestling.

Big men were always part of wrestling, but more than anything else they were just a freak show. Andre the Giant defied that stereotype. By the time he wrestled Hulk Hogan he was little more than a broken down monster, but in his prime he was an excellent wrestler, one of the best to ever lace up a pair of boots. In fact, he was one of the reasons the WWF became a huge success. Fans put up big money to go see the wrestling giant which enabled the WWF to become a wrestling super power.

While Taker definitely has done his part for making the WWF/E successful, he has Andre to thank for blazing the trail.

 

[Mr. Artistic guy]

What I look for in a big guy is someone who is as sturdy and immoval as the rest of the list but can combine that with some athleticism and be the ultimate fighter for someone of their height. So for me no Yokozuna, or Andre (at least after about 1980) was going to make my list. So the next thing I would say the guy has to be a complete package, talker and a wrestler. Therefore I would remove Bam Bam from the list.

I'm going to cut to it. For me I haven't seen a better big man than the version of The Big Show that debuted in WWF in 1999. Little taller than Kane of Undertaker, but with sufficiently enough bulk to look more intimidating than them with a less intimidating gimmick, and yet not so big than he didn't have trouble doing dropkicks etc. and even occasionally flying over the top rope. Undertaker is my favorite wrestler, but as a prospect for a big guy, I don't think a better combination of strength and speed, + mic ability, could be had than the one Paul Wight posessed at that time.

 

[Midgetmania619]

For me, it's no mystery. I'm an Undertaker mark, so I'm going with The Phenom.

I don't think it's a mystery that any body will choose him over some choices, granted some of them (such as Andre) do deserve votes, however if you compare the greater superstar, not just wrestler, Undertaker will be above all of them. He does moves that cruiser weights and technicians do. Kane might be the second best 'wrestler' there (Referring to the best Giant vs Giant match, Undertaker vs. Kane @ WrestleMania XIV).

I think if you had an early Western Mortician Undertaker in the 80's, with Andre, would Andre have come out looking the better 'big man' or would Undertaker have made himself a worthy giant?

 

[SorgFamily]

I went with the popular choice of 'Taker. Pair his success that's lined with achievements everybody knows about (WM streak, Hell in the Cell matches) with his unusually long career and you have one of the biggest stars in wrestling ever. Plus one thing that stand out for me is that this late into his career after numerous times when it's appeared his career is winding down he always comes back to win the title. And it's never a situation where it's like, "Oh god, not again", it's always, to me at least, "Alright, Undertaker again!".

 

[Hollywood Naitch]

I cannot see why anyone could vote for anyone else than The Undertaker.

Lets look at the facts

7 Time World Champion

More than anyone on that list, and has feuded with most of the greats in the business, especially in the modern era. Undertaker has been a main event attraction since the day he debuted.

The streak

Simply phenomenal, to be able to have the longetivity that Taker has, and this is something that will never be equalled in wrestling, and something that should remain until Undertaker retires

The greatest gimmick of all time

If this character debuted now, people would not buy into it, but they are still mesmerised by The Deadman. Mark Callaway has created the greatest gimmick of them all, and it has allowed us to see Hell In A Cell, Casket, Buried Alive and Last Ride Matches

The finishers

Not only is the Tombstone one of the most iconic moves of them all but Undertaker also has the Chokeslam (used by other big men), and the Last Ride...so 3 great finishing moves, plus his triangle choke

The most athletic big man of them all

Ok, so he doesnt do a moonsault like Vader, but who else in their mid 40s at nearly 7 foot tall can do a running dive over the top rope like Undertaker can...no one.
He is still incredibly athletic at his age, and can keep up with the best.

Good promo skills

The character doesnt allow Taker to really show what he can do, but look back when he was playing the Big Evil or American Bad Ass roles, he was brilliant on the mic.

Respect

It is well known how much respect Undertaker commands backstage. He doesnt take sick days unless absolutely neccesary, he works injured, he is by far the most respected veteran in the locker room, even Vince listens to him. In HBK's book, he says that when he asked for a new contract he said he expected to be paid the most out of anyone, escept Undertaker, because he deserved every penny he got.

Out of all the big men, bar maybe Andre, Undertaker is the most respected

Face or Heel?

While he has been a face most of his career, when he played the Big Evil character or when he ran the Ministry, Undertaker was a phenomenal heel. He can do it all.

So really, to me there is no comparing Undertaker to anyone else. He is the man

 

[IrishCanadian25]

We have had this thread a load of times in various incarnations. Thread starters have been certain to fashion their criteria in such a way where it becomes an Undertaker love-fest, and such is the case as what we have here.

I've described Big Van Vader as the greatest Superheavyweight (325+ lbs) of all time, and when we lower the criteria to include Undertaker, it becomes a dog fight. I personally think Vader is better, but Taker is a close 2nd. And I realize I'll lose the voting every time because a) Taker has been around it seems like forever, b) Taker has spent his whole career in WWF/E, and c) "hez teh deadmanz Undertaker rulez deh streak nevah broken!"

For the first several years of his career, The Undertaker was not much more than slow walking, eerie music, punches, an occassional kick, chokes, and a tombstone piledriver. It's amazing, because some of the same smarky fan boys who criticize John Cena (he only knowez fiv movez!) fan over The Undertaker, who for several years, actually only knew five moves! Punck, kick, chock, chokeslam, Tombstone.

On the flip side, lately, The Undertaker has become a one-trick pony, only really useful for one huge night each year with Wrestlemania. He spends a fair deal of the rest of the year on light schedules and laid up with injuries, because let's face it, he's injury prone. WWE does a great job building toward the streak match, and the streak match tends to be pretty good despite some awful competition some years. Furthermore, let's face it, YOURS TRULY could have a great match with Shawn Michaels.

So when you add it up, Undertaker has had about a decades worth of really great years, with bookends of slow no-selling at the outset and broken down one-night stands in recent years.

It sounds like I'm diminutizing The Undertaker, which I am, but only for the purposes of this thread. I like 'Taker and respect him, but the deadman love-fest needs a dose of reality.

Big Van Vader managed to do somethingthat so few others have ever done - he became relevant and dominant in both the US and Japan, which is nearly impossible to do in a career. He's defeated all-time greats (as as Undertaker) such as Antonio Inoki and Sting. He helped keep WCW relevant at a time when WWF had ALL the top talent and ALL the production budget. He re-defined how a big man wrestles, using brutal striking (long before the Undertaker went sort of MMA on us, Vader was using short martial arts style strikes), high flying moves that 230-pounders don't pull off, and tremendous speed and athleticisim, as well as endurance.

No I'm a Vader fan boy, but it's as much for objective reasons as it is for just thinking a guy is cool.

In the end, it's a close race. But since Vader beat the Undertaker IN the WWE, you have to give the vote to Vader.

 

[SSJPhenom]

I've been waiting for this.

We have had this thread a load of times in various incarnations. Thread starters have been certain to fashion their criteria in such a way where it becomes an Undertaker love-fest, and such is the case as what we have here.

And what's wrong with a 'Taker love fest? Actually, I was just reading over the one that I created a while back and got this idea. If you review that thread, it was actually you who suggested I do this.

I've described Big Van Vader as the greatest Superheavyweight (325+ lbs) of all time, and when we lower the criteria to include Undertaker, it becomes a dog fight. I personally think Vader is better, but Taker is a close 2nd. And I realize I'll lose the voting every time because a) Taker has been around it seems like forever, b) Taker has spent his whole career in WWF/E, and c) "hez teh deadmanz Undertaker rulez deh streak nevah broken!"

'Taker isn't a close 2nd. He stands alone at the top. BTW, when do I ever mention the streak and type like that?

For the first several years of his career, The Undertaker was not much more than slow walking, eerie music, punches, an occassional kick, chokes, and a tombstone piledriver. It's amazing, because some of the same smarky fan boys who criticize John Cena (he only knowez fiv movez!) fan over The Undertaker, who for several years, actually only knew five moves! Punck, kick, chock, chokeslam, Tombstone.

You conveniently forgot a few of his moves. He's always done the flying clothesline and he started using old school just a little while after he debuted. So he had 7 moves. But let's be real, his gimmick back then didn't require that he put on a wrestling clinic. Which is why nobody cared back then what Hogan or Warrior was doing in the ring. It was all about gimmick at that time and 'Taker sold his very well.

On the flip side, lately, The Undertaker has become a one-trick pony, only really useful for one huge night each year with Wrestlemania. He spends a fair deal of the rest of the year on light schedules and laid up with injuries, because let's face it, he's injury prone. WWE does a great job building toward the streak match, and the streak match tends to be pretty good despite some awful competition some years. Furthermore, let's face it, YOURS TRULY could have a great match with Shawn Michaels.

When you say lately, you have to be talking about '09 after Mania up till now. Before this period of time, 'Taker was very consistent in the ring. He had several great performances.

BTW, I'd pay to see your match with HBK. Just so you know.

So when you add it up, Undertaker has had about a decades worth of really great years, with bookends of slow no-selling at the outset and broken down one-night stands in recent years.

Why couldn't you mention the years in between his beginning and recent years? In between the times that you mentioned, he's been one of the best performers in the WWF/E. Nevermind the best big man in the WWF/E.

It sounds like I'm diminutizing The Undertaker, which I am, but only for the purposes of this thread. I like 'Taker and respect him, but the deadman love-fest needs a dose of reality.

It had a dose of reality. He's the best big man of all time and one of the absolute greatest of all time period.

Big Van Vader managed to do something that so few others have ever done - he became relevant and dominant in both the US and Japan, which is nearly impossible to do in a career. He's defeated all-time greats (as has Undertaker) such as Antonio Inoki and Sting. He helped keep WCW relevant at a time when WWF had ALL the top talent and ALL the production budget. He re-defined how a big man wrestles, using brutal striking (long before the Undertaker went sort of MMA on us, Vader was using short martial arts style strikes), high flying moves that 230-pounders don't pull off, and tremendous speed and athleticism, as well as endurance.

Now, I'm not going to knock Vader. He was, not just a great big man wrestler, but a great wrestler. If I made a list of my top 5, Vader would be number 2 behind 'Taker. Let's just be real, however. 'Taker has the strikes, the high flying moves, tremendous speed, athleticism, and endurance as well. But 'Taker also has great versatility. He can wrestle a slow technical/submission type match (Kurt Angle No Way Out '06) or a fast paced, balls to the wall, high impact match. There just isn't another big man like 'Taker.

Now I'm a Vader fan boy, but it's as much for objective reasons as it is for just thinking a guy is cool.

If we're being objective in this argument, then we'd have to discuss drawing ability and success and all of that stuff. 'Taker wins hands down in that race.

In the end, it's a close race. But since Vader beat the Undertaker IN the WWE, you have to give the vote to Vader.

So Vader won in a scripted contest, thus he must be better? I know you were being sarcastic here. I'm sorry. I can see the allure of Vader, but he just isn't as good as 'Taker.

 

[@smarkmouth]

Now, while I definitely go with the obvious choice of Undertaker, I'd like to send some respect to Paul Wight, but not as the Big Show. When I think of Paul Wight, I love thinking about his WCW days as The Giant. He had that surprise agility you don't expect from a man his size. While he wasn't performing Big Van Vadersaults, the man was pulling off missile dropkicks from the top rope.

Not to mention, he wasn't afraid of taking big moves as I think he may be now. Granted, he recently took a big slam from Ezekiel Jackson on Smackdown, but the last move like that he took might have been the powerslam from Bobby Lashley. Granted, WWE has fewer people that can pick up Big Show, but I'll never forget when Goldberg kicked out of the chokeslam and Jackhammered the big man.

 

[Pay Per Ghost]

'Taker has to be it, I mean I get the fact that he was very zombie-ish in his realy days but hell those kinda traits actually made the crowd love him. He as a heel for f*ck's sake but he kept getting more pops when that gong would hit and the E had no choice but to turn him face. As a boy of 7, the sight of a man coming to the ring in the dark and looking almost like a mythical creature was cool enough to mask his 'ring prowess'.

So I categorically disagree with IC here. Taker has evolved over the years, has stayed relevant and biggest of all , IS. A. DRAW.

P.S - HBK would whoop you in his 60's

 

[jacdnwarrior]

I like the guys on the list. Vader was remarkable in WCW, watered down in WWF, but clearly was very agile for a guy his size. He was a monster heel. Taker, Kane, Vicious, Bigelow all had great qualities. Nash I liked least, but he was good on the mike.

I went with Andre, because he helped fuel the greatest era in wrestling history, the Hulk Hogan era. They needed a villain who seemed unbeatable and he fit the mould. The other guys on the list didn't do that. They may be better on the mike or in the ring, worn more titles, but he was the first or one of the first big men to really help bring wrestling to that mainstream level.

 

[The Ace of Knaves]

The Phenom

Lets start off with his resume. The Undertakers abilities and level of greatness has no boundaries at all. Lets start with the fact that he started his first year in the WWF undefeated. Nobody else has accomplished such a feat and it is amazing. He won the royal rumble and is a multiple time world champion and has had pretty much every piece of gold you can think of.

The Undertaker for a long time now has been defying all odds each time he steps in the ring. Really, how many bigmen like him have that much and that high of a skill level? None. He is one of the most atheltic bigs ever and has a large amount of moves and tools in his arsenal to go to. He springboards over the top ropes as if he's rey or something and has so many moves such as powerbombs, neckbreakers, chokeslams, tombstones, legdrops, old school, hells gate, and the list can go on for days and days. Not only does he have the best gimmick ever (which I will get into later) but he has the skill and in ring smarts/ ability to match it.

The Undertaker for 20 years has been putting on megastar matches and just like michaels he actually steps up at wrestlemania as well. He is undefeated at wrestlemania and his matches have been more than spectacular. His match with HBK at the last two wrestlemanias were off the hook and the one with Kane, HHH, Flair, Batista and Edge were all classics as well. Nobody in WWE has been apart of more legendary matches and feuds than the deadman. The Undertaker has had legendary feuds/ matches with HHH, Kane, Austin for sure, HBK, and Batista. He got several awards for match of the year and feud of the year with those guys I listed. When you see him step into the ring everytime everyone always gets goosebumps and he just has the presence, essence and the aura of a legendary superstar. Much of that has to do with his legendary gimmick that will go down as the greatest of alltime but a lot of that will have to do with the great feuds and matches he has been apart of throughout his career.

His impact an presence on the company is almost unmatched. He revolutionized and took the hell in a cell match to a whole nother level. To levels no other superstar, not HHH, Y2J, HBK, Orton or anyone could possibly do inside a hell in a cell. He has participated in arguably the greatest hell in a cell match with Mankind that is still being replayed until this day. In fact majority of Takers past feuds, matches, and segments are being replayed constantly still to this day and that is when you know you're a superheavyweight legendary performer.

Between all the stars you named, Taker has a little bit of each one in him. He has performed many legendary 5 star matches such as Jericho and HBK, he has a versatile move set like them and as a bigman still has the athletic ability as Rey and a gimmick that is greater and than Edge and all of them. Taker isn't the best in one category between those guys but he does everything well.

His greatness has never ran out either. Even in his final days (now) old man Taker is still putting on classics. How many guys hitting the end of their career who are broken down and injured can you ask to put on a classic legendary mainevent at wrestlemania and prevail? Not many, if any. Taker has done that. He has put on some good matches with Kane and a great one with Swagger even though he is older and more injured now. He is breaking down but it still hasn't tampered with the greatness and legendary status of Undertaker. Once. legendary, always legendary and indestructible.

He has put on match of the year, and feud of the year with multiple people. PWI ranked him #2 overall of the best wrestlers a few times and he has had the best gimmick since forever and has accolades for that as well. His resume speaks for itself and his legendary matches do as well. There aren't superstars in WWE where you can feel their presence when they come and expect a legendary performance. In my opinion The Undertaker is the greatest superstar out of everyone not named HHH in WWE and with the versatility, moveset in the ring, plus the legendary gimmick, status and performances he has had throughout his entire career, he is the best from that group.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Lets start off with his resume. The Undertakers abilities and level of greatness has no boundaries at all. Lets start with the fact that he started his first year in the WWF undefeated. Nobody else has accomplished such a feat and it is amazing. He won the royal rumble and is a multiple time world champion and has had pretty much every piece of gold you can think of.

This statement is false. He's never held the IC Title, European Title, U.S. Title, and I think there's more.

I love the fact that you're a 'Taker fan, I do. But it hurts the credibility of the argument if you make a statement that can be proven to be false.

 

[IrishCanadian25]

I've been waiting for this.

Ditto. Blind Undertaker fan though you may be, I like you.

And what's wrong with a 'Taker love fest?

It's been done to death. (pun intended.)

Actually, I was just reading over the one that I created a while back and got this idea. If you review that thread, it was actually you who suggested I do this.

I used to drink. A lot. CM Punk saved me. Besides the point.

BTW, when do I ever mention the streak and type like that?

In all fairness, I wasn't only responding to you, I was responding to the legion of pro-Undertaker smarks. You're a cut above them, methinks.

You conveniently forgot a few of his moves. He's always done the flying clothesline and he started using old school just a little while after he debuted. So he had 7 moves.

Ouch, you showed me.

Actually, it'd be 8 moves if you count no-selling. For a few years the guy took these moves from opponents and just no-sold them. Billy Gunn used to do that too and it cost him his job. Granted, it was part of Taker's gimmick (and a brilliant part of it) but selling is a fundamental part of pro wrestling and 'Taker didn't have to do it for his first few years.

But let's be real, his gimmick back then didn't require that he put on a wrestling clinic. Which is why nobody cared back then what Hogan or Warrior was doing in the ring. It was all about gimmick at that time and 'Taker sold his very well.

This is a great point. I'm not one of those fans who expect anyone who is any good to be like Bryan Danielson, rolling into odd submission holds. He got by with what fit his character - I just think we have to be careful to credit him for those years too much considering he really had to do very little. He never even had to play to the crowd, which is something guys like Hogan and Warrior had to do, and did masterfully.

When you say lately, you have to be talking about '09 after Mania up till now. Before this period of time, 'Taker was very consistent in the ring. He had several great performances.

Longer than that. He's had several years lately when he's spent long periods of time on the shelf. Shoulder issues, knee issues, bicep tears.

BTW, I'd pay to see your match with HBK. Just so you know.

Yes! I draw money!

Why couldn't you mention the years in between his beginning and recent years? In between the times that you mentioned, he's been one of the best performers in the WWF/E. Nevermind the best big man in the WWF/E.

Why did I need to? The multitude of guys riding his jockstrap were sure to do that for me.

Incidentally, are you referring to the same years that he was the #3 or #4 draw in the company? The years he was riding names like Austin, Rock, Angle, Michaels, Lesnar?

Now, I'm not going to knock Vader. He was, not just a great big man wrestler, but a great wrestler. If I made a list of my top 5, Vader would be number 2 behind 'Taker.

So your #1 is my #2, and your #2 is my #1. Do we both have Andre at #3, Bigelow at #4, and Wight at #5?

Let's just be real, however. 'Taker has the strikes, the high flying moves, tremendous speed, athleticism, and endurance as well.

So he's AS GOOD as Vader, less 100 lbs and minus the selling. Got it.

But 'Taker also has great versatility. He can wrestle a slow technical/submission type match (Kurt Angle No Way Out '06) or a fast paced, balls to the wall, high impact match. There just isn't another big man like 'Taker.

I don't really think Taker wrestles the fast paces, high impact match. I think he does a nice job working with guys who do work that style of match (Michaels, Rock) while slowing the action down when he's on offense.

If we're being objective in this argument, then we'd have to discuss drawing ability and success and all of that stuff. 'Taker wins hands down in that race.

Taker has never been a top draw in the WWE. Many of his years as champion were a response to a lack of other prepared main eventers. His title reign up to and following Wrestlemania 13 is among the most forgettable title reigns in history. He's a guy whose best work occured with no titles and outside of the main event. Again, not a knock on the guy, but be careful calling him a 'draw.' He was fortunate enough to be a heel to the three biggest babyfaces in the history of pro wrestling in Hogan, Austin, and Rock.

So Vader won in a scripted contest, thus he must be better? I know you were being sarcastic here. I'm sorry. I can see the allure of Vader, but he just isn't as good as 'Taker.

I was being sarcastic. But despite your apparent respect for Vader, you may still be selling him short. That's ok, I'm used to it. And I really do like The Undertaker, I just feel the need to temper the fawning over him threads like this are bound to create.

 

[Mustang Sally]

As always, it depends on your definition of "best."

I'd say Undertaker is the best because he's the only one of the selected group that has technical wrestling skills. For many of the others, it's hit (or miss) your spots and call it a night. 'Taker can work a match and understands ring psychology more than the others combined. His repertoire is smooth and he can coax almost any opponent into a good match. That's such a rare quality for a big man that it's off the charts. Also, he sells for his opponent better than any of the others.

On the other hand, the most dangerous big man was Vader. You had the feeling he could really hurt someone, intentionally or not, and after we saw what happened to Foley's ear, it was truly an adventure whenever Vader entered the ring. His ability to move his bulk effectively always impressed me. Scary guy.

 

[SSJPhenom]

Ditto. Blind Undertaker fan though you may be, I like you.

You're pretty cool yourself.

It's been done to death. (pun intended.)

Doesn't 'Taker deserve that kind of respect and love?

I used to drink. A lot. CM Punk saved me. Besides the point.

Don't tell me you're straight edge.

In all fairness, I wasn't only responding to you, I was responding to the legion of pro-Undertaker smarks. You're a cut above them, methinks.

I have to agree. Some of them can't get their points across to save their life. However, I still love them because they're 'Taker fans.

Ouch, you showed me.

Actually, it'd be 8 moves if you count no-selling. For a few years the guy took these moves from opponents and just no-sold them. Billy Gunn used to do that too and it cost him his job. Granted, it was part of Taker's gimmick (and a brilliant part of it) but selling is a fundamental part of pro wrestling and 'Taker didn't have to do it for his first few years.

I agree that selling is a fundamental part of pro wrestling, however, like you yourself said, it was apart of his gimmick to be impossible to beat. So he didn't sell his opponents attacks. It scared the hell out of little kids. Besides, he sells his opponents attacks now and he's very good at it.

This is a great point. I'm not one of those fans who expect anyone who is any good to be like Bryan Danielson, rolling into odd submission holds. He got by with what fit his character - I just think we have to be careful to credit him for those years too much considering he really had to do very little. He never even had to play to the crowd, which is something guys like Hogan and Warrior had to do, and did masterfully.

Well yea, he didn't come out and pump his fists or put his hand to his ear for a crowd reaction, sure. But shouldn't we count all of the visuals and eerie stuff that he did playing to the crowd? I mean, coming out with it pitch black and raising the lights and kneeling in front of Paul Bearer and doing his pose and such. Isn't that playing to the crowd?

Longer than that. He's had several years lately when he's spent long periods of time on the shelf. Shoulder issues, knee issues, bicep tears.

So he's beat up and run down a little bit. Who isn't? Besides, he'll go to 20-0 and retire, I think.

Yes! I draw money!

I didn't say how much I'd pay.

Why did I need to? The multitude of guys riding his jockstrap were sure to do that for me.

Incidentally, are you referring to the same years that he was the #3 or #4 draw in the company? The years he was riding names like Austin, Rock, Angle, Michaels, Lesnar?

Sure, he's not really ever been the top draw for the company, however, he has always been a main draw for the company and that's over a 20 year period. He's the corner stone of the WWE. The last of the old guard.

So your #1 is my #2, and your #2 is my #1. Do we both have Andre at #3, Bigelow at #4, and Wight at #5?

Exactly. See? We just disagree on the first 2.

So he's AS GOOD as Vader, less 100 lbs and minus the selling. Got it.

No, he's better than Vader and he only no sold for about a year and a half.

I don't really think Taker wrestles the fast paces, high impact match. I think he does a nice job working with guys who do work that style of match (Michaels, Rock) while slowing the action down when he's on offense.

Well, yea he does slow the action down while he's on offense, however, he does a great job at keeping up with them while he's not on offense.

Taker has never been a top draw in the WWE. Many of his years as champion were a response to a lack of other prepared main eventers. His title reign up to and following Wrestlemania 13 is among the most forgettable title reigns in history. He's a guy whose best work occurred with no titles and outside of the main event. Again, not a knock on the guy, but be careful calling him a 'draw.' He was fortunate enough to be a heel to the three biggest babyfaces in the history of pro wrestling in Hogan, Austin, and Rock.

Right. Like I said earlier, he's never been THE TOP DRAW for the WWE, however, he's always been a MAIN DRAW for the WWE. He's someone that people still want to see and pay to see. Whether you like it or not, the man is a main draw for the company and has been for nearly 20 years.

I was being sarcastic. But despite your apparent respect for Vader, you may still be selling him short. That's ok, I'm used to it. And I really do like The Undertaker, I just feel the need to temper the fawning over him threads like this are bound to create.

I do respect Vader and I hate that you think that I'm selling him short a bit. I just can't help it. 'Taker is the be all end all to me in professional wrestling. He's been my favorite wrestler since I was 3. Sure, I'm a bit subjective when it comes to the Phenom, but he definitely has the credentials to back up a BEST EVER argument. Whether that be a best big man ever argument or a best of all time argument. 'Taker would definitely be on either list.

Look, you're not going to admit that 'Taker is better than Vader and I'm not going to admit that Vader is better than 'Taker. Honestly, if I sit here and say that 'Taker and Vader are at the top of the list and you say that Vader and 'Taker are at the top of the list, who can argue with that?

BTW, fawning never hurt anyone.

 

[Dyno Kid]

How nobody's mentioned Stan Hansen yet is beyond me ! He's far and away the best big man I've ever seen in my 30 plus years of watching wrestling !

Stan could do it all, he could brawl, mat wrestle, was technical when he needed to be, and could get a great match out of pretty much anyone !

Right behind Stan I'd list Terry Gordy and Bruiser Brody.

 

[mrbrownstone]

I think it has to be The Undertaker, with Andre in a very close second.

For a big guy The Undertakers resume is very impressive, sure he largely a gimmick wrestler but he is by far the best gimmick wrestler. I think his resume really speaks for it self, 7 world title wins, 18-0 at wrestlemania, the biggest show of them all, a royal rumble victory, the face of Smackdown.

I think the most impressive thing about Taker, to go along with all of that, is his agility in the ring for a man of his size. How many other people on that list would you see doing a suicide dive through the ropes? Or a top rope splash through an announce table? None of them, I can guarantee that.

I also love his adaptability in the ring, as I said he can use some great high flying spots which are very impressive for a man of his size. He can also be a great brawler, he has a great striking game hence the nickname "the best pure striker in the WWE" (Does that include Matt?), he can throw in some submission stuff i.e. Hells Gate all in addition to his powerhouse, intimidating style he usually employs.

With all of this going in his favour I fail to see how it couldn't be him really.